EVE Search - Removal of bought ISK

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Removal of bought ISK

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Shevar Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.08.27 08:54:00 - [1] It seems like CCP is currently active in removing ISK from players gained through illegal activities. In theory this seems all fine and dandy. But if a player gains isk illegally (either through exploits or buying it online or what ever) and buys stuff from someone else can that other person have his money removed without getting the items back he sold? Example 1: I sell batteships, someone who bought/exploited his way up to wealthdom buys one of my ships. When the GM finds out the buyer has been naughty and wants to remove the illegal isk from game will I get the battleship I sold to that guy back? Even if for example that BS got blown up in some gatecamp? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=583100 Example 2: I sell GTC's someone with an illegimate isk supply buys from me, do I get the GTC returned? Even if that person would have used it? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=582942 (i know he wasn't smart using the non-secure method, but i'm mainly interested in what the responce would be if the secure method would have been followed completely). --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.08.27 08:56:00 - [2] You can end up with noticeable negative wallet balance. It's possible to get also banned for buying isk, altho I have not heard that happen to anyone I know. I personally would ban all isk buyers. Permanently. If crime does not pay ppl usually dont do it, eh ?
Estoika Chonda Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.27 08:59:00 - [3] GM's take back your money but didn't return the BS to you?? It's good if the GM's only take the illegal money from the "cheater", but if you sold a BS, you didn't do any illegal :S --------------------------------------------------
Fujiko MaXjolt	Posted - 2007.08.27 09:12:00 - [4] GM's will punish the wrong-doer only, and will not care if he winds up in the red by any amount - he DID break the EULA afterall....
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2007.08.27 09:42:00 - [5] Originally by: Fujiko MaXjolt GM's will punish the wrong-doer only, and will not care if he winds up in the red by any amount - he DID break the EULA afterall.... please re-read the OP SKUNK Originally by: Jeximo I also like how your cat only managed to hit the enter button when he/she jumped on your keyboard.
Shevar Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.08.27 09:44:00 - [6] Originally by: Carniflex You can end up with noticeable negative wallet balance. It's possible to get also banned for buying isk, altho I have not heard that happen to anyone I know. I personally would ban all isk buyers. Permanently. If crime does not pay ppl usually dont do it, eh ? I would agree with you that all isk buyers and sellers should be banned, but my question is how is the isk trail exactly handled? What happens if an isk buyer (or someone who found a way to duplicate isk in infinite ammounts) would buy a tempest of me and gave it to his buddy? Would his buddy loose the tempest he received? Would the seller of the tempest get the tempest back etc? And before you ask no this hasn't happened to me, but the 2 threads I linked do make me very curious as to how it is exactly handled. --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
AuroraStar RennTech SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:26:00 - [7] Edited by: AuroraStar on 27/08/2007 10:27:21 http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=437 Quote: To conclude what I hope is an inspiring and enlightening GM blog, I would like to add that the penalty for buying ISK is (at the minimum) the removal of all ISK bought, no matter if it is still in the wallet or not. Players that buy ISK and spend it on cool stuff will end up with a negative wallet balance and in some cases cannot get out of debt. Should answer somewhat.
Shevar Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:33:00 - [8] Originally by: AuroraStar Edited by: AuroraStar on 27/08/2007 10:27:21 http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=437 Quote: To conclude what I hope is an inspiring and enlightening GM blog, I would like to add that the penalty for buying ISK is (at the minimum) the removal of all ISK bought, no matter if it is still in the wallet or not. Players that buy ISK and spend it on cool stuff will end up with a negative wallet balance and in some cases cannot get out of debt. Should answer somewhat. Well this would actually awnser my question, but at the same time what's odd is that the 2 examples in the OP basicly state 2 diffrent people on 2 diffrent cases which strangely at nearly the same time post about loosing ISK to GM action because someone with bought isk bought some items from them. And that CCP reversed the sale (from what i've read without reinstating the items of the people posting). --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
Adonis 4174	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:34:00 - [9] The first post linked has no context. The second explains the perils of selling GTC outside the secure transfer mechanism implemented by CCP. ----- J-I-T-A It's a four letter word.

CCP Prism X	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:42:00 - [10] Generic Noob buys 1 Trillion ISK. Example 1: Because Generic Noob has no idea about the real value of ISK he buys one of your BSs for half a trillion ISK. You get half a trillion ISK. GMs are alerted to Generic Noobs bad habits. One trillion ISK are removed from Generic Noobs wallet. Net result: You sold one BS and gained half a trillion ISK. Generic Noob now has a wallet balance of -half a trillion ISK and needs to work up his half a trillion ISK before he can do anything as there is almost always some fee involved in EvE. He also has a BS which he bought on credit. Example 2: You sell 5 years worth of GTC to generic noob for a trillion ISK (because he's got no clue). Generic Noob commits to 5 years of playing EvE. GMs remove 1 trillion ISK from his wallet. Generic Noob spends 1 year of those five getting back up to 0 balance. Now I've never been a GM so I dont know the full details. But in general this is how ISK buyers are dealth with. The sellers are of course banned as well but we all know that's rather futile. The real problem isn't the supply of ISK but the demand for buying virtual currency with hard cash.. AKA sloth mixed with ignorance. ~ Prism X Relocating your character to a cozy, giant secure container since 2006.

Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:55:00 - [11] From some post in the past, the only risk you have is that the GM, seeing the isk buyer paying you some outlandish sum for an item, will think you are part of a laundering scheme and will take the isk from you. Usually you can clear that through petition. There was a thread some time ago where a player was asking suggestions as he had got 2 billions selling some common item. He suspected it a isk selling operation were he accidentally had sold the item agreed upon between the isk seller and his client, so he immediatly petitioned and kept the isk available. After some check CCP determined that is was a isk selling operation, so took away the isk and replaced the sold item, thanking the player for his collaboration. So it is possible you will have to give back the isk you get from some isk buyer, but then you will get back what you sold.
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.08.27 10:55:00 - [12] Originally by: CCP Prism X The real problem isn't the supply of ISK but the demand for buying virtual currency with hard cash.. AKA sloth mixed with ignorance. Yes, that's exactly the problem. But's it's aslo pretty evident that just removing the isk isn't enough to discourage the potential isk-buyer. Just teh scale of isk-farming is mind-boggling. You have hundreds (thousands?) of high-sec macro-miners, the macro-mission runners, and probably somehere between 500 and 2000 farming ravens in out-of-the-way 0.0 systems, killing npcs 23/7. Not to mention account hacking and the like...Yet taking out the farmers is almost futile. You can ban accounts by the hundreds, they cn take another trial and be in a torp-raven within 2 weeks. How about a harder penalty for those who buy isks? Like, for example, removal of 1 million skill points for 100 millions isks bought, or temporary/permanent bans? ------------------------------------------ What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs.
Drenad	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:05:00 - [13] Edited by: Drenad on 27/08/2007 11:07:57 Originally by: Shevar Edited by: Shevar on 27/08/2007 10:12:59 It seems like CCP is currently active in removing ISK from players gained through illegal activities. In theory this seems all fine and dandy. But if a player gains isk illegally (either through exploits or buying it online or what ever) and buys stuff from someone else can that other person have his money removed without getting the items back he sold? Example 1: I sell batteships, someone who bought/exploited his way up to wealthdom buys one of my ships. When the GM finds out the buyer has been naughty and wants to remove the illegal isk from game will I get the battleship I sold to that guy back? Even if for example that BS got blown up in some gatecamp? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=583100 Example 2: I sell GTC's someone with an illegimate isk supply buys from me, do I get the GTC returned? Even if that person would have used it? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=582942 (i know he wasn't smart using the non-secure method, but i'm mainly interested in what the responce would be if the secure method would have been followed completely). On your example 2 the gtc seller did use the secure method, thats the point in his post and the money was removed from his account? even it should have been removed from the buyers account who had bought isk by illeagal means.
ApaKaka Lone Starr Corporation	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:06:00 - [14] case 1. I think that guy simply got 100 mil 'free' from a friend as a donation. The donator had bought it illegally, and as such, it was removed. case 2. Well, this is really sad, because the gtc-seller loses real money. Fine - we could sell GTC only to people we know and trust 100%.. but seriously, I know like three people who use GTCs, and I don't trust any of them 100%. I don't trust anyone in this game 100%. There should be some kind of guarantee that you won't lose money when selling GTCs.
Darwinia Minmatar	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:10:00 - [15] On your second example, the GTC seller sold a GTC using the CCP developed SECURE method for the current (at the time) average price. In this situation, the where and how ISK was obtained to buy said time card is irrelevant, the GM should have not removed the ISK from the seller in the first place. ------------------------ I don't believe in sigs.
Destiny Calling Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:18:00 - [16] I sold something, and the chap I sold it too, bought it with ISK gained agianst the EULA. His account was banned, and the ISK he paid me was removed from my wallet, with out notice or communication. Also the item I sold him was not returned to me. I filed a petition within three days I had my ISK back. There process appers to be, ban said offenders, remove offending ISK, then investigate. All in all it works out well for the non guilty, just we are required to afford them a little patience. Destiny
Shevar Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Darwinia On your second example, the GTC seller sold a GTC using the CCP developed SECURE method for the current (at the time) average price. In this situation, the where and how ISK was obtained to buy said time card is irrelevant, the GM should have not removed the ISK from the seller in the first place. I updated the OP, but at the time of writing he hadn't made the following post (although this post has been edited out again): Quote: I bought a time code. I sell time code secure through eve. All goes well. Later guy gets caught from buying isk (read eves response) Assume all of his purchases are taken back. Time code i sold him is in the purchase list. Thus taking the isk from me. Hence the situation was rather unclear since his post wasn't really all that well written to start with. --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
torN Deception GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.27 11:47:00 - [18] Edited by: torN Deception on 27/08/2007 11:46:48 Originally by: CCP Prism X The real problem isn't the supply of ISK but the demand for buying virtual currency with hard cash.. AKA sloth mixed with ignorance. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=480961

CCP Prism X	Posted - 2007.08.27 12:06:00 - [19] Hot dang, I love my Goons. Post reserved for a counter-argument once argument is proposed to link my quote to posted link. ~ Prism X Relocating your character to a cozy, giant secure container since 2006.

Shevar Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.08.27 12:09:00 - [20] Originally by: CCP Prism X Hot dang, I love my Goons. Post reserved for a counter-argument once argument is proposed to link my quote to posted link. Zomg this clearly shows favoritism towards the Goons coalition!!!11!!oneone Everyone to the spam mobiles! --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
Aramendel Amarr Coreli Corporation Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.08.27 13:07:00 - [21] Originally by: CCP Prism X Generic Noob buys 1 Trillion ISK. Example 1: Because Generic Noob has no idea about the real value of ISK he buys one of your BSs for half a trillion ISK. You get half a trillion ISK. GMs are alerted to Generic Noobs bad habits. One trillion ISK are removed from Generic Noobs wallet. Net result: You sold one BS and gained half a trillion ISK. Generic Noob now has a wallet balance of -half a trillion ISK and needs to work up his half a trillion ISK before he can do anything as there is almost always some fee involved in EvE. He also has a BS which he bought on credit. Example 2: You sell 5 years worth of GTC to generic noob for a trillion ISK (because he's got no clue). Generic Noob commits to 5 years of playing EvE. GMs remove 1 trillion ISK from his wallet. Generic Noob spends 1 year of those five getting back up to 0 balance. Now I've never been a GM so I dont know the full details. But in general this is how ISK buyers are dealth with. The sellers are of course banned as well but we all know that's rather futile. The real problem isn't the supply of ISK but the demand for buying virtual currency with hard cash.. AKA sloth mixed with ignorance. Exept that in both cases randomnoob will simply delete or not use the char with the 1 trillion debt. Restarting is in those cases a better and far easier option, especially if random noob is in fact a noob and as result not very old. So realistically the 1 trillion does not get removed from the economy because the debt will in most cases never be paid off.

GM Nova Game Masters	Posted - 2007.08.27 13:16:00 - [22] Originally by: Aramendel Originally by: CCP Prism X Generic Noob buys 1 Trillion ISK. Example 1: Because Generic Noob has no idea about the real value of ISK he buys one of your BSs for half a trillion ISK. You get half a trillion ISK. GMs are alerted to Generic Noobs bad habits. One trillion ISK are removed from Generic Noobs wallet. Net result: You sold one BS and gained half a trillion ISK. Generic Noob now has a wallet balance of -half a trillion ISK and needs to work up his half a trillion ISK before he can do anything as there is almost always some fee involved in EvE. He also has a BS which he bought on credit. Example 2: You sell 5 years worth of GTC to generic noob for a trillion ISK (because he's got no clue). Generic Noob commits to 5 years of playing EvE. GMs remove 1 trillion ISK from his wallet. Generic Noob spends 1 year of those five getting back up to 0 balance. Now I've never been a GM so I dont know the full details. But in general this is how ISK buyers are dealth with. The sellers are of course banned as well but we all know that's rather futile. The real problem isn't the supply of ISK but the demand for buying virtual currency with hard cash.. AKA sloth mixed with ignorance. Exept that in both cases randomnoob will simply delete or not use the char with the 1 trillion debt. Restarting is in those cases a better and far easier option, especially if random noob is in fact a noob and as result not very old. So realistically the 1 trillion does not get removed from the economy because the debt will in most cases never be paid off. That is not entirely accurate because the random noob will never hold on to the ISK. The owner will try to get the trillion to his main character and that is the character which will suffer. Also, how plausible is it that anyone would sell a battleship for half a trillion?


CCP Prism X	Posted - 2007.08.27 13:27:00 - [23] Ofcourse 'Generic Noob' is a term for 'some idiot' rather than a new player and the trillion is just some imagined number to show an extreme example. But you're right, I need to refrain from generic terms and be specific.. otherwise I'm misunderstood. ~ Prism X Relocating your character to a cozy, giant secure container since 2006.

Joey Judas Gallente Ramraiders	Posted - 2007.08.27 14:03:00 - [24] I think most people are afraid of having their GTC sold ISK removed from their wallets, I know reading this thread is making me think twice before selling a GTC again....
Hellspawn01 Amarr Falcon Advanced Industries	Posted - 2007.08.27 14:44:00 - [25] Theres one thing that most ppl dont think about: Where do you think is the money going that the GTC seller spent for the GTC? It doesnt go to some ISK farming company, no. It goes to CCP (with a split to the GTC company perhaps, not sure about that part). So actualy the GTC seller is buying from CCP which is not a bad move Imo. Consider this part. Ship lovers click here
Denebola Rises Regalis Industria Scientia Entreprendre Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.27 14:59:00 - [26] Well, actually, I am thinking of starting to sell GTC, but only to people I know in game: e.g., my corp members - and then as a service to them, rather than as a way to acquire isk. I have TAXES for that!
Ampoliros Shadow Company FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.08.27 15:00:00 - [27] Edited by: Ampoliros on 27/08/2007 15:01:09 Edited by: Ampoliros on 27/08/2007 15:00:31 There was definitely one case on the forums a few weeks ago where someone sold (or more correctly, had someone buy) a torpedo for 6 billion isk - the GMs removed the money and gave him back his torpedo. I can't link the thread as the 'official' search is a bit wonky and EVEsearch isn't working...but its there. Anyway, glad to see the devs are out mingling with the general populace ------------------------------------ My statements are not those of my corp or of my alliance, nor anyone else. [Insert witty comment here]
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.27 15:01:00 - [28] Originally by: Ampoliros Edited by: Ampoliros on 27/08/2007 15:00:31 There was definitely one case on the forums a few weeks ago where someone sold (or more correctly, had someone buy) a torpedo for 6 billion isk - the GMs removed the money and gave him back his torpedo. I can't link the thread as the 'official' search is a bit wonky and EVEsearch isn't working...but its there. Anyway, glad to see the devs are out mingling with the little people special case, they guy reported it Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve-Forums: Quote: Smacking my own alt in a nerf-thread while drunk, he was irritating a Hauler full of tech II n00bs, Oops.
voogru Gallente Massive Damage	Posted - 2007.08.27 15:12:00 - [29] Quote: Example 2: I sell GTC's someone with an illegimate isk supply buys from me, do I get the GTC returned? Even if that person would have used it? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=582942. If you sell a GTC insecurely, you can be screwed. This can be prevented! DO NOT SELL GTCS INSECURLY. I'm dangerous! Watch out!
Sharon Lynn	Posted - 2007.08.27 15:46:00 - [30] Originally by: CCP Prism X Generic Noob now has a wallet balance of -half a trillion ISK and needs to work up his half a trillion ISK before he can do anything as there is almost always some fee involved in EvE. Couldn't he just delete that character and start with a new character?

Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.