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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.11 23:51:00 -
[1]
If you can fire cruise missiles from a Krestel, I want to fit a tachyon laser to a Punisher.
But I'd rather see CCP balance the frigates.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Psychopath
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Posted - 2004.02.11 23:52:00 -
[2]
Very True 
A Corp 1 pirate I was meant to be, trim the sails and roam the sea |
BobGhengisKhan
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Posted - 2004.02.11 23:56:00 -
[3]
Against minmatar frigs, kestrels eat balls. I don't really fly anything else
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Baun
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Posted - 2004.02.12 00:52:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Baun on 12/02/2004 00:55:19
Given that only 1 cruise missle can fit in a Frigate launcher, i dont think its unfair at all. It is also very different then being able to mount a multi shot (and more powerful) large turret on a frigate. Furthemore, cruise missles are ammunition not powerful mountable weapons in and of themselves.
The only reason i found cruise missles on frigates at all questionable is that they can easily destroy other frigates. The simple solution is to make frigates faster, alot faster, such that they can avoid cruise missles a majority of the time.
The Enemy's Gate is Down
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dalman
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Posted - 2004.02.12 00:57:00 -
[5]
Edited by: dalman on 12/02/2004 01:03:57
 Quote:
Given that only 1 cruise missle can fit in a Frigate launcher, i dont think its unfair at all. It is also very different then being able to mount a multi shot (and more powerful) large turret on a frigate.
The only reason i found cruise missles on frigates at all questionable is that they can easily destroy other frigates. The simple solution is to make frigates faster, alot faster such that they can avoid cruise missles.
Why is that, when "all" frigates can run 1 MWD and 2 ABs forever, getting them to speeds higher than the speed of cruise missiles?
Cruise missiles on Kestrels (and other ships) are just used for ganking industrials, and by groups of kestrels to make hit and run gankings of cruisers.
Now, if "Bombers" would be able to fit launchers that can hold 1 cruise missile each, I wouldn't complain. But normal frigates? NO!
The CAREBEARS won again. As usual. CCP intend to fix a problem, but then a thousand carebears screams out loud and CCP don't go through with the fix
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Baun
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:01:00 -
[6]
true, i didnt really think about that. In that case, its already balanced.
The Enemy's Gate is Down
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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:16:00 -
[7]
Quote:
The CAREBEARS won again. As usual. CCP intend to fix a problem, but then a thousand carebears screams out loud and CCP don't go through with the fix
As usual.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Trevedian
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:22:00 -
[8]
Quote:
If you can fire cruise missiles from a Krestel, I want to fit a tachyon laser to a Punisher.
But I'd rather see CCP balance the frigates.
I'd like to pilot a Large Secure Cargo Container w/ some lasers and MWD's slapped on it, takes forever to kill those things... I'd be more uber than I already am 
Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
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Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:27:00 -
[9]
Okay, now I'm really confused. How can it be carebears who wanted frigates to be more dangerous? Carebears are anti-fighting.
_______
"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:35:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Skillz on 12/02/2004 01:38:40
No, a carebear is anti anything the play style he wants to use. That's even if the overall balance is flushed down a toilet. It has nothing to do with PvP or anything.
Example: Carebear wants to mine low grade ores with no risk at all in imperial space. CCP eventually realize that it's very inflation causing.
CCP wants to have a balance between ISK/RISK, the carebears raise their fists and stomp their feet, CCP just backs away. As usual.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Slithereen
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:45:00 -
[11]
I think CCP would eventually rebalance it this way, though they won't make any changes in the small launcher until Bombers are ready.
Small Launchers will lose the ability to fire cruise missiles.
This is replaced by the "small" Cruise Missile Launcher, which can only hold One Cruise Missiles, but not Heavy and Standard misiles.
This Launcher can only fit on Bombers, but not ordinary missile frigs. It will require Bomber skill to install and use.
This way only Bombers can use torps and cruise missiles, but not ordinary missile frigs. This will make Bombers important.
I don't speak for CCP. These are just my predictions. Let's see what happens.
_______________________________________________
"Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies,
"Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
"Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:52:00 -
[12]
An other example is that you can set bookmarks 20km behind a gate, or in an asteroid belt so you get insta jump, insta dock and insta hauling ores. Now CCP has been talking this and that about nerfing bookmarks, it's always the same story. Now thank you carebear pest for ruining the game on a long term basis.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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dalman
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:53:00 -
[13]
Quote:
Okay, now I'm really confused. How can it be carebears who wanted frigates to be more dangerous? Carebears are anti-fighting.
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear.
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Kunming
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Posted - 2004.02.12 01:58:00 -
[14]
Quote:
Edited by: Baun on 12/02/2004 00:55:19
Given that only 1 missle can fit in a Frigate launcher, i dont think its unfair at all. It is also very different then being able to mount a multi shot (and more powerful) large turret on a frigate. Furthemore, missles are ammunition not powerful mountable weapons in and of themselves.
The only reason i found missles on frigates at all questionable is that they can easily destroy other frigates. The simple solution is to make frigates faster, alot faster, such that they can avoid missles a majority of the.
Yeah I like the idea of fast frigates. They should be able to evade large missiles like cruise and torps, but they should also add some anti frig missile which is as fast as the fastest frigate, but does far less damage!
Intercepting since BETA |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 02:08:00 -
[15]
A battleship and a frig are supposed to be like and elephant and a mosquito. They shoulden't be able to do anything to each other, under normal circumstances.
A frigate is supposed to be the work horse for a strike force, easy to replace and does the most of the job.
Today the battleship is the frigate. Nerf battleships but then the stuff strutter carebears would stomp their feet and raise their fists.
Please note that Carebears don't represent any majority, not even a significant minority. They are however very good at running their mouths so CCP thinks they 'have to listen'.
Social manipulation at an advanced level.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Kunming
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Posted - 2004.02.12 02:27:00 -
[16]
BSs were supposed to be the heavy duty ships that bombard stations, but it came out that the game had to be released before it was finished so all ship balance is messed up!
Btw don't blame CCP for the early release, it was their investors that wanted to see some cold hard cash after 5 years of development!!!
Intercepting since BETA |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 02:28:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Skillz on 12/02/2004 02:30:52
CCP does not serve it's end of getting cold hard $$$ by doing this.
Reason is very simple, not many people try to PvP in a frigate with their main char, so the first experience of PvP is that they go in their cruiser or worse, battleship and then it's, hahahahah, you died and then they think, well how nice, good bye.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Baun
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Posted - 2004.02.12 03:13:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Baun on 12/02/2004 03:26:42
Quote:
Quote:
Okay, now I'm really confused. How can it be carebears who wanted frigates to be more dangerous? Carebears are anti-fighting.
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
Ya or for making overconfident pirates in cruisers look very stupid. Just ask Insane Angel.
My main question about this is; if frigates cannot fire cruise missles what threat are they to cruisers? How many frigates armed with standard (or named w/e) frigate weapons would it take to actually take down a decently equipped cruiser? Furthermore, how long would it take?
As I can see it, it would take something like a griffin locking it down, and probably 2 (maybe more)normally equipped frigates to do the job before running out of cap. If this is the case then what are the current frigates for? Fighting other frigates? Fighting Bombers?
If the former is the case then frigates are essentially useless in PVP, as frigates on both sides are only effective for engaging each other, in which case they are inconsequential in non frigate only fights. If the latter is the case then normal frigates will not be utilized at all as interceptors and gunships will be infinitely more useful for engaging and destroying bombers. Hence, only frigates in incredibly large numbers (perhaps other than bombers) will ever be a factor in fleet combat in which case all of this talk of integrated fleets being more effective is pure nonsense.
The Enemy's Gate is Down
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Jebidus Skari
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Posted - 2004.02.12 03:29:00 -
[19]
Quote:
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
economical 
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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 03:29:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Skillz on 12/02/2004 03:56:07
Of course you'd have to nerf the cruiser as well so the question would be, what can a cruiser do to very fast frigates apart from get their cannons to bear on target when their tracking speed allows it, at med ranged distances.
But then you'd have to NERF bookmarking and MWDs, woulden't you?
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.02.12 03:56:00 -
[21]
"My main question about this is; if frigates cannot fire cruise missles what threat are they to cruisers? How many frigates armed with standard (or named w/e) frigate weapons would it take to actually take down a decently equipped cruiser? Furthermore, how long would it take?"
To answer your questions: considerable, 3-4, about 3-5 minutes.
As for wanting to be able to mount tachyon laser on Punisher because you can fire cruise missiles from standard launcher... cruise missiles fired from standard launcher do damage comparable to dual heavy beam rather than tachyon. Fit pair of medium pulse lasers on Executioner rather than Punisher, throw in a damage mod... and each of your turrets will come just 10-15% short of matching the same dual heavy beam. Without the significant cost of the cruise missiles... so hardly something to complain about, i think?
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Vel Kyri
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Posted - 2004.02.12 07:27:00 -
[22]
I liked what someone said above - mosquito and elephant...
i would be happy with that.
problem is, in eve we have elephants that can not only fly - but are more just as agile as the mosquito...
errmmm... problem.
the problem is STILL speed and or tracking.
heavy weapons are (usually) supposed to be long range hard hitting weapons - at the ranges they are meant to be shooting they are killer - but in short range (less than 10k) they should have such crappy tracking that they can hit something going at about 1k/sec... at all.
i was very suprised when a battleship got a volley of wrecking shots with 1400mm projs on my kestrel going at 1.2k/sec at about 1k away flying past it...
if i am just sitting there i dont mind getting hammered - even if travelling at 15-30k away, but at 1k..
-----
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dalman
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Posted - 2004.02.12 07:53:00 -
[23]
The probability of scoring a wrecking hit is independent from range and tracking...
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Imperishable
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:00:00 -
[24]
I'm all for making frigates stronger, not weaker. Battleships got only 1 real disadvantage (after all modules applied) - they cost much more than a frigate. Money is not that hard to make these days, if you know what you are doing, so almost all veteran players fly battleships. Why would they fly a frigate? sure, they may be useful in fleet battles, but EVE doesn't handle those very well, I bet most fights occur between 2-4 people. Frigates should be more powerful. Elite frigates should be less expensive.
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:22:00 -
[25]
With the addition of the frigate MWD, getting hit by a missile means lag or just not paying attention.
I know a Rifter can orbit outside webifying range while inside warp scrambling range at speeds faster than a cruise missile. I've seen frigate pilots that know their ship fly head on into a storm of incoming missiles and not get hit.
And I'm positive the removal of cruise missiles from frigates will remove a significant portion of their ability to threaten larger ships. Saving industrials isn't worth that. A frigate pilot is at more risk than a battleship pilot. And both frigates and battleships are certain death for an industrial.
What next? Nerf all ships so only shuttles can destroy industrials?
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:25:00 -
[26]
Quote:
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear.
Lol, i think you are struggling here Dalman. I normally respect your arguments and find them sound most of the time, but what are you talking about here?
If kestrel with cruises can only kill industrials why should it be nerfed?
Can't a solo incursus pulverise an industrial in roughly the same time?
Missiles, it's the easiest weapon type to counter, if one actually bothers to loadout properly and knows how to fly.
The only thing carebear related with kestrels are the poeple who fly them, cause most of them believe kessies are the most damaging frigates which is not the case.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:27:00 -
[27]
I think large guns should basically have NO chance of hitting a frgiate. This would give the frigate a serious battlefield role.
Also, frigates MUST be able to use cruise missiles. This is essential - unless CCP intend eve to become a Battleship convention game.
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:32:00 -
[28]
Quote:
Quote:
Okay, now I'm really confused. How can it be carebears who wanted frigates to be more dangerous? Carebears are anti-fighting.
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear.
A industrial is ALWAYS its base price!
I can fit up hmb and modules, fill its hull with megacyte and make it 200mil for all i can. But a bestower will always be base price of 500k.
Sure its strange that frigates can fit cruise missles, but its 'JUST' the range and damage they need to count in pvp. CCP and many players wanted that frigates mean more in pvp and that cannot be done with medium lasers and projectile guns only. CCP and many players said: 5-6 frigates should be able to take out a battleship if teamwork is played well, and they succeed.
Some frigate pilots take on cruisers, because that speed and damage output together make them able to team up and be able to beat a cruiser if played well. Giving them only mini lasers that do 20dmg max will cause the cruiser pilot logged off before the shield dropped to half hp.
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Dreez
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Posted - 2004.02.12 08:36:00 -
[29]
Kestrels suck.., imo.
'Trying to argue logically with Evol is like trying to teach a pig to dance. It only makes you look foolish and really annoys the pig ' - Duke Droklar [OC]
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Alynthir
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Posted - 2004.02.12 09:21:00 -
[30]
Rifters are awesome. I like them much more than Kestrels.
As for the cruise missile thing, I've alwasy thought of frigates using cruise missiles like the WWII PT Boats of the U.S. Navy. I think it's great that cruiser pilots cannot dismiss a ship simply because "he's just in a frigate".
_____
CLS Civil Affairs Bureau
"Permanent = Today's Plan."
Training: Noob Instructor Level 5  |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.02.12 09:33:00 -
[31]
A Kestrel with heavies can still warp-scramble and kill an industrial pretty quickly.
Of course, it increases the time it takes and means you can't kill an indy while a BS is still locking you but thats what Rifters are for.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Ska Kalazar
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Posted - 2004.02.12 09:57:00 -
[32]
I fail to see what your argument is? A lone Kestrel with cruise missiles is no threat to anyone apart from other frigates and industrials. You cannot kill a lone cruiser. You have to get within 20km to warp scramble and if your stupid enough to get within that range then a few hits from something like a 250mm hybrid or a beam laser will wipe you out pretty quickly. You can drive off a cruiser... heck I've even driven off Battleships but you can't kill them by yourself... so I fail to see why you are so ****ed about Kestrels armed with cruise missiles?
Now if you have 3-4 guys in assorted frigates (as we do in Merc Frigates) against one cruiser then its a whole new ball game. We will take apart a cruiser in a few minutes using the "wet noodle" technique. Now that is right and proper in my opinion. We use superior teamwork and organisation to overcome foes with far greater resources than we could ever dream to have. In my opinion there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Teamwork is what the game is all about.. wether you mine in a group, save for a BP or gank people in low sec space... its all about teamwork.
Regards
Ska
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.02.12 10:05:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Joshua Calvert on 12/02/2004 10:08:41
Quote:
You cannot kill a lone cruiser.
Yes you can.
I've killed a BB in HED-GP with a kestrel and I know that one other member of Everlasting Vendetta acheived the same.
The BB pilot was a bit of n00b though - only had heavy missiles and his 250mm railgun didn't hit me once.
Edit: And 5 minutes before my one and only podding, 4 EV kestrels took care of a Caracal and a Blackbird even though there were 2 Scorpions there with them.
We all got out alive but when we tried to make a run for the gate, Woetra popped me and my podgoo.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Ska Kalazar
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Posted - 2004.02.12 10:22:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Ska Kalazar on 12/02/2004 10:25:11
Yeah well I'm not talking about noob's asleep at the wheel... I'm talking about a half decent cruiser and BS pilots. Of course if you have some sap that doesn't warp away hell you can kill anyone.
Regards
Ska
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Chai N'Dorr
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Posted - 2004.02.12 10:36:00 -
[35]
Quote:
|dalman:|
The CAREBEARS won again. As usual. CCP intend to fix a problem, but then a thousand carebears screams out loud and CCP don't go through with the fix
Funny, and here I was thinking that the GRIEFERS won again... expendable ship which takes only a bit of training to use with Cruise missiles.
Sounds like GRIEFER tactics to me.
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SwitchBl4d3
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Posted - 2004.02.12 10:41:00 -
[36]
Quote:
A battleship and a frig are supposed to be like and elephant and a mosquito. They shoulden't be able to do anything to each other, under normal circumstances.
A frigate is supposed to be the work horse for a strike force, easy to replace and does the most of the job.
Today the battleship is the frigate. Nerf battleships but then the stuff strutter carebears would stomp their feet and raise their fists.
Please note that Carebears don't represent any majority, not even a significant minority. They are however very good at running their mouths so CCP thinks they 'have to listen'.
Social manipulation at an advanced level.
hmm /me looks at the new splash design on opening EVE and see's 3 slashers attacking 1 apoc. I think they want them to be more destructive so that it forces more people into them
"Teh lord of Nonni"
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.02.12 10:46:00 -
[37]
Just like a modern day Fighter jet can carry enough munitions to destroy an entire City, so a Frigate in EVE should be able to carry sufficient munitions to destroy a Battleship (or even damage a station, imo).
Cruise missiles fit the bill. Frigates must be able to use them.
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Schani Kratnorr
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Posted - 2004.02.12 11:06:00 -
[38]
Quote:
Just like a modern day Fighter jet can carry enough munitions to destroy an entire City, so a Frigate in EVE should be able to carry sufficient munitions to destroy a Battleship (or even damage a station, imo).
Cruise missiles fit the bill. Frigates must be able to use them.
There you said it, I agree - discussion is over, fairness won out in the end.
The problem with argueing this is that it's like argueing which chess peice is the best. Surely if you pit a Queen versus a single peasent the queen would win if they both started at opposite ends of the board, but if the peasent had the qeen cornered, and brought one of it's fellow peasent then the queen would go down (no phun intended... seriously).
Everyone is seeing ship balancing issues from their own perspective, they fail to realize that a battleship is vulnerable to certain combinations of fittings on certain ships. If all you battleship pilots out there are scared of frigates, then bring escorts to protect you - like any real life navy does.
The potential of a Kestrel with it's 4 standard launchers is to deliver massive damage using cruise missiles.
The downside to this is that it has to reload often during combat, it has to avoid enemy fire, it has to get close, but not too close.
The kestrel itself might not cost a lot to make but if/when you go down with it and you have say 20 cruise missiles with you, you also loose those - and that's another load of rare minerals lost.
Like chess, EVE has many playing peices, all of which have different strenghts and weaknesses. A commander that balances out the vulnerabilities of one ship, by taking advantage of the strengths of another, is more likely to win than one who doesn't...
--
"I am an expert in not caring. The trick is to stop giving a rat's ass about anyone else and start thinking about what YOU want, what YOU diserve, what the world ows YOU!" - Bender |
Kaylon Syi
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Posted - 2004.02.12 11:25:00 -
[39]
Nerf Cruise Missiles on Frigates might as well take the whole ship class out and start the rookies out in lvl 1 Cruisers.
You only get 4 cruise max per volley on tech 1 frigates and you have to reload every 10 seconds. There is no auto-reload... you manually have to do this... that is not only 10 seconds out the your time but the trouble it takes to right click... reload... all the while the opponent's lock is nearing completion.
Lets not even start on Drones being a counter to frigates.
All in all its pretty balance as it stands. If someone wants to go cry home cause a kestrel "seems" to do as much damage a Scorpion, Typhoon or Caracal hten i think thats more carebear than any other example. Why... because it only seems that way but there are more variables to combat than damage and I expect that you know that because its your name.
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Snaad Gnabbsvindel
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Posted - 2004.02.12 15:52:00 -
[40]
Actually Ive just started to pvp with a friend in frigs and theyre great fun. Ironically our first target was a c.o.w Typhoon which we managed to while he warped in on the gate in to orvolle in pf. Me and my friend Admiral iceblock attacked attacked him in a griffin(noobie me) and a punisher(Iceblock). I jammed him and Admiral engaged close by to scramble.
The Typhoon pilot didsnt seem to have any smartbomb fitted cause we held him there for a while until he fled to the gate wgile we called for help in local. If wed had some heavy fire support like a caracal I think we might have toasted him.
I was sure we were going to die when attacking it.
I havent pvped much but I understand the Typhoon pilot had equipped poorly. It still seems to me that frigates attacking with superior numbers and pherhaps a cruiser for firepower is a threat to any bs.
The Irrational is never wrong!! |
s0cks
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Posted - 2004.02.12 16:10:00 -
[41]
LOL
Never thought Skillz would whine like a carebear.
Oh no! My Battleship might be in danger from a Kestrel! Nerf nerf nerf!
Settle down skillz, it alright.
/me strokes skillz better
xx
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Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.02.12 16:30:00 -
[42]
Quote:
Skillz, Frigates Fire cruise missiles in RL
nah, they fire Torpedos, Cruise Missiles is actully long range!!! So i would like to see Frigs using SLOW Torps instead of Cruise! any1 ever played Battlefield 1942, Battle of Phillpines? there u can see small boats using Torps, not Cruise... And Cruise missiles should not be able to be fitted on a Frig and Cruise missiles should start slow, but accelerate fast after 10-20km...
Ships in EVE is just basicly "Weapon Platforms", the ones that can fitt the most weapons, WINS!!! in RL, anything counts, in EVE, just the Guns!!
"We brake for nobody"
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Maud Dib
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Posted - 2004.02.12 17:22:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Maud Dib on 12/02/2004 17:30:00
Quote:
Quote:
Okay, now I'm really confused. How can it be carebears who wanted frigates to be more dangerous? Carebears are anti-fighting.
For what purpose do you use Kestrels with cruise missiles?
Answer: Killing industrials.
If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear.
Dalman two of our guys killed two blackbirds with two kestrels 2 vs 2. Now thats not ganking or carebear. Personally I hate frigs and don't fly them.
I'm not sure why the indignation over Kestrels killing helpless Indys. I mean do the Indy pilots feel better over getting ganked by battleships?
Now a discussion of balance is something else entirely. Though I have noticed that one man balancing is another mans nerfing. Most of the time it comes down to, I don't like it so it has to go mentality.
PS Once you get that damn nerf bat swinging you might not like where it hits next. If it really is a problem then why not just make Indy's tougher?
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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 18:41:00 -
[44]
Hey sUcks, it's about a larger issue and that's why CCP does not balance stuff as they say they will do but don't because of carebear whining.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:00:00 -
[45]
Edited by: j0sephine on 12/02/2004 19:01:15
"If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear."
... Is that why pilots of EV were using frigates to gank CA indies loaded with arkonor, and bragging about it all over these very forums... not that long ago?
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:12:00 -
[46]
The real issue here is the ineffectiveness of rockets and light missiles in combat.
Rockets have almost no effective range, thus are useless -- light missiles aren't much better.
Smaller missiles should be faster than bigger missiles, rockets fastest, torpedo slowest.
The only thing that keeps frigates somewhat effective in PvP, is cruise missiles, this of course makes turret based frigates less desirable.
Hopefully this will get sorted out and all frigates will have a ROLE to play in PvP.
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:12:00 -
[47]
Looks at Dalman, eagerly awaiting to hear the reply to this....
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.02.12 19:18:00 -
[48]
Quote:
Edited by: j0sephine on 12/02/2004 19:01:15
"If you can't risk using a cruiser worth 1.5M when you're killing helpless industrials worth 30M, what are you then?
Answer: A carebear. Be it a carebear-pirate, carebear-griefer or a carebear in the military of an alliance. It's still a carebear."
... Is that why pilots of EV were using frigates to gank CA indies loaded with arkonor, and bragging about it all over these very forums... not that long ago?
I want to see dalman answer this too 
Not all of used Kestrels though - Andrew Jade, Claveman, and MadCybord used Rifters and were as successful as the Kestrel pilots.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Marabeth
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Posted - 2004.02.13 00:03:00 -
[49]
Quote:
Looks at Dalman, eagerly awaiting to hear the reply to this....
OMG my poorly set up Battleship which I forgot to add drones to was bullied by Frigates (the counter to which is drones, cruisers, light weapons or frigates).
Nerf frigates, not dumb people in battleships who don't have light weapons, frigate support, cruiser support, or drones.... 
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Slithereen
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Posted - 2004.02.13 01:19:00 -
[50]
Quote:
Rifters are awesome. I like them much more than Kestrels.
Seems to me that's what CCP thinks too. If Bombers remain unchanged from the specs given out in EVE-DB, many of the Bombers in all races are going to be Rifter hull based, although I do think the ones for Amarr will be changed to using Inquisitor hulls, given the special Amarr Navy Captain and Sarum Navy Captain Inquisitor hulls already out with NPCs.
Quote:
As for the cruise missile thing, I've alwasy thought of frigates using cruise missiles like the WWII PT Boats of the U.S. Navy. I think it's great that cruiser pilots cannot dismiss a ship simply because "he's just in a frigate".
Many modern frigates use the designation FFG or Guided Missile Frigate, use antiship missiles that are in effect small cruise missiles. These missiles like the Harpoon and the Exocet, skim very low over the water, making them very hard to hit or intercept.
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"Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies,
"Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
"Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
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Azure Skyclad
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Posted - 2004.02.13 01:35:00 -
[51]
Did they change the way agility of ships/missiles workd recently too? Not so long ago, anything bigger than a heavy ,issile used to just loop and circle my Rifter quite ineffectively. It was either a bug or the difficulty a large and relatively slow missile has hitting a small, agile target. THe latter made sense and i thought "Nice one CCP" Not recently though. Now cruises and torps are pretty damn accurate.
You can jink by (OMG!) manually changing the direction of your ship with an MWD running but i liked the older way. Bug or not.
La Maison de tous Les Plaisirs
Star Fraction
http://www.voodoorockers.co.uk/ |
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