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How's this for Eve's "Trust Nobody" rule?

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Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:43:00 - [1] Let me paint a little picture for you. Some time ago, a long-time friend of mine from well before I started playing Eve, decided to quit the game. An ex-corpmate and friend of his, offered to keep his account going and training his character, on the condition that he could use the character (at the time, nearly Command Ship ready) untill my friend wanted to return to the game, which he then would return the character to it's original owner. My friend accepting, thinking he could trust him. In recent weeks however, my friend wanted to come back to Eve. He got in touch with his friend that was watching the character and asked for it back. I'm sure you know what happens next. He refuses to give back the character. My friend threatens to petition, and he still doesn't get the character back. So he sends the petition in with all the relevant information possible to prove his case. Seeing as the GM's game him the account back, obviously he was in the right, and had proved his case true. However, the thief, knowing that he was being petitoned, immediatly transferred the character to a seperate account of his. So my friend has the ACCOUNT back, but the GM's refused to give him the CHARACTER. My friend also contacted the thief's CEO. I don't remember this part exactly, but seeing as the thief and his stolen character are still in the same corp as before, their CEO did nothing about it. Seriously, what kind of CEO could condone this? I'm all for scamming and the like, but this is beyond the plain, ordinary scam. Now it's time to name names. I hate doing this, but it's all I can do. The thief is "einhander0004", and the character stolen, "bringme2life". The corporation harboring these two, Ganja Labs of the Hydra Alliance. I'm sure a lot of you are laughing at my friend for actually trusting someone in this game, and if you are, laugh away. I know that posting this will have little relevance in the grand scheme of things. I merely wish to place this in the light of the community, and hope that it'll discourage someone else from making my friends mistake. How the GM's could not return the character is pathetic. Further more, how Ganja Labs could continue to keep an untrustworthy person as Einhander in their corp is beyond me. He stole years of my friends work on that character, whats to stop him from doing it again? Maybe not a character, but the corp hangars, or whatever else may be handy. Some of the original owner of bringme2life's real friends were actually starting a fund to buy him a new character (with ISK. put those ban sticks away). However, he found out our little scheme, and though he's asking us not to trouble ourselves, we're still gonna do it whether he likes it or not, heh. But this post isn't asking for donations of any kind. Like I said, I simply hope to keep someone else from making the same mistake. I've said what needs to be said. Flame on. ~GH
d1v1n1ty	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:46:00 - [2] Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA?
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:48:00 - [3] Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? Yes, it is. I'm not going to pretend to deny that. Regardless of EULA violations though, I think it's a rather low thing to steal years of work from a friend like that. Really goes to show, "Trust Nobody."
Nyphur Pillowsoft Total Comfort	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:48:00 - [4] Lending someone your account is a bannable offence. Accepting a loan of an account is also a bannable offence. Both of the people involved in this issue should have their accounts closed. Feel free to petition the issue. If the GM is no help, ask for a senior gm. If the senior gm is no help, contact internal affairs and tell them you think the GMs aren't doing their jobs properly. If they don't help you by that stage, you've exhausted all of your options and there's no more you can do. Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened.
ViolenTUK Gallente Vindicated Exiles 3asy Company	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:50:00 - [5] The character should be given back to the owner and the transfer fee refunded. I think that the original owner of the account has suffered enough. www.eve-players.com
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:50:00 - [6] Originally by: Nyphur Lending someone your account is a bannable offence. Accepting a loan of an account is also a bannable offence. Both of the people involved in this issue should have their accounts closed. Feel free to petition the issue. If the GM is no help, ask for a senior gm. If the senior gm is no help, contact internal affairs and tell them you think the GMs aren't doing their jobs properly. If they don't help you by that stage, you've exhausted all of your options and there's no more you can do. My friend did petition him. The GM's gave him the actual account back, but Ein had transferred the character to a third account, which the GM's did nothing about. I don't think he escalated it though, but it's a little late I think.
Surfin's PlunderBunny Minmatar Sicarri Covenant	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:52:00 - [7] Originally by: Liz Kali Tic Toc Tic Toc , time is ticking Originally by: TheDagda click For the love of the jovians stops necroing
syphurous Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:53:00 - [8] Both need to be banned, sharing accounts is against the EULA. ___ Too Many Anchored Cans
Nyphur Pillowsoft Total Comfort	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:54:00 - [9] Originally by: Golden Helmet My friend did petition him. The GM's gave him the actual account back, but Ein had transferred the character to a third account, which the GM's did nothing about. I don't think he escalated it though, but it's a little late I think. It's never too late. File a new petition, reference the old one and request senior GM escalation. Be prepared for a formal warning or temporary ban for account sharing, which you might get. However, you're very likely to get the character back. The other thing I meant to say is that I know this isn't your character but a friends and you're telling what you know of the story but don't assume any detail of it is true. I've had friends intentionally spin lies to me about a GM decision that I know for a fact wasn't true because I'd petitioned the same issue. It's disheartening but it happens. Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened.
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 01:56:00 - [10] 1. By violating the EUlA your friend was cheating and got what he deserved for doing so 2. Your friend needs to pick his (RL) friends better if getting ahead in a game is more important to them than a friendship is.
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:00:00 - [11] Originally by: Nyphur It's never too late. File a new petition, reference the old one and request senior GM escalation. Be prepared for a formal warning or temporary ban for account sharing, which you might get. However, you're very likely to get the character back. The other thing I meant to say is that I know this isn't your character but a friends and you're telling what you know of the story but don't assume any detail of it is true. I've had friends intentionally spin lies to me about a GM decision that I know for a fact wasn't true because I'd petitioned the same issue. It's disheartening but it happens. I do realize that friends can distort the truth, if not out-right lie. I can only speak for the side of the story that I know and the facts I've been given. I'd love to see a statement from Ein, Ganja Labs, or Hydra Alliance here in this thread and hear their side of the story. Originally by: Julien Mornier 2. Your friend needs to pick his (RL) friends better if getting ahead in a game is more important to them than a friendship is. They weren't RL friends, but they had been playing Eve together for some time both as corpmates and simply chatting as friends after bringme2life left Ganja. They also played some other games together too I think, but I'm not 100% certain there. But regardless of all this, they were friends at least in-game, and it's certainly low that Ein did what he did.
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:02:00 - [12] Edited by: Julien Mornier on 13/09/2007 02:03:50 Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Julien Mornier 2. Your friend needs to pick his (RL) friends better if getting ahead in a game is more important to them than a friendship is. They weren't RL friends, but they had been playing Eve together for some time both as corpmates and simply chatting as friends after bringme2life left Ganja. They also played some other games together too I think, but I'm not 100% certain there. But regardless of all this, they were friends at least in-game, and it's certainly low that Ein did what he did. #edit: My regrets on using the RL tag. Friends are friends. Too often we forget that those that we interact with in the game are real people and not more complex NPCs provided for our amusement. The other player s are real, and so are the relationships
Hanfred Kaderin	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:15:00 - [13] Originally by: Julien Mornier Edited by: Julien Mornier on 13/09/2007 02:07:24 Edited by: Julien Mornier on 13/09/2007 02:03:50 Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Julien Mornier 2. Your friend needs to pick his (RL) friends better if getting ahead in a game is more important to them than a friendship is. They weren't RL friends, but they had been playing Eve together for some time both as corpmates and simply chatting as friends after bringme2life left Ganja. They also played some other games together too I think, but I'm not 100% certain there. But regardless of all this, they were friends at least in-game, and it's certainly low that Ein did what he did. #edit: My regrets on using the RL tag. Friends are friends. Too often we forget that those that we interact with in the game are real people and not more complex NPCs provided for our amusement. The other player s are real, and so are the relationships ##edit: And, yes it was low. If you ever need a reminder of what scumbags most people are, play an mmo....or if you need a reminder of what great people some others are do the same.
Krazy Jake The Hieros Confederacy	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:25:00 - [14] Originally by: Golden Helmet I merely wish to place this in the light of the community, and hope that it'll discourage someone else from making my friends mistake. Well thanks, though I doubt any of us here are that friggin dumb, and if any are, they don't deserve the account and should promptly turn all assets over to me. "If someone angers you, try walking a mile in their shoes. If your still angry, who cares. Your a mile away and you have their shoes."
Dash Laserwing	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:32:00 - [15] EINHANDER IS A PIMP! The old owner of Bringme2life is a god damn moron, woo woo. go cry about it ladies.
Vaal Erit	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:45:00 - [16] 1. ACCOUNT USERNAMES AND PASSWORDS a. EVE Online account usernames must contain at least four alphanumeric characters, may not contain spaces or unconventional characters and must not be vulgar, obscene, ethnically, racially or sexually offensive or otherwise inappropriate. b. EVE Online account passwords must contain at least four alphanumerical characters and may not contain spaces or non-standard characters. c. EVE Online subscribers are responsible for protecting the confidentiality of their account information. Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account. Therefore, account holders are strongly urged not to share accounts or account information with others. d. A subscriber who suspects an unauthorized person may have obtained access to his password should change it immediately by accessing his account profile. e. Usernames cannot be changed; however, subscribers are urged to change account passwords at regular intervals as a precautionary measure. Read part c especially EULA: "You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Joint or shared ownership or use of an Account by more than one user is prohibited. " "A transfer or attempted transfer of a character is entirely at the risk of the parties to such transaction. CCP is not liable to any person (whether transferor, transferee or otherwise) for any acts, omissions, statements, representations, defaults or liabilities of the parties in connection with such a transaction. " EULA offense can be banned but that's pretty serious, it sounds like the original owner got ownership back but not the characters. There must have been some argument and threats made by your friend or else the other guy would not have known to transfer the character asap. Your friend sounds pretty screwed to be honest. Even though it is just a game, sharing personal details should not be trusted to a guy you met on the internet. Think about it like this, you could call someone dimwitted if they said this to you, "So I met this dude on a chat room on a game website and gave him my bank account to make sure it was ok and only buy a can of coke and I wake up 2 months later and he empties my account!" The more I read the original post I think whinefest instead of legitimate problem. Keep friends and business separate and for the love of baby kittens don't share your account info, fairly no-brainer stuff that your friend should take as a life-lesson.
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:49:00 - [17] Originally by: Vaal Erit There must have been some argument and threats made by your friend or else the other guy would not have known to transfer the character asap. My friend did contact Ein before he petitioned to get his char back. When he refused to hand it over, my friend then threatened to petition, and still didn't get it back. Thats when the character transfer happened.
Trinity Bella	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:49:00 - [18] Einhander for Prez.
RedLion Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.13 02:59:00 - [19] I never share any acc's with anyone I can not beat up IRL. I don't have any IRL friends playing eve though.. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 03:16:00 - [20] Edited by: Julien Mornier on 13/09/2007 03:17:02 Originally by: RedLion I never share any acc's with anyone I can not beat up IRL. I don't have any IRL friends playing eve though.. #edit: Deleted
Darriuss	Posted - 2007.09.13 03:19:00 - [21] i think the problem is in the character transfer rules. anyone can transfer a character with any credit card which opens the process up to scams, hacks, whtever other conspiricy theory we can think of. i can't understand why you don't need the original key to transfer the character. that way a scammer or hacker or whtever can't steal characters. sure it protects you against losing your acct, but wht good is your acct without any characters on it? i am pleading with CCP to make character transfers more secure. make the original key or original credit card number necessary for a transfer, then generate a transfer key that is attached to that character that needs to be used to transfer the character again. i quit for a couple of years, when i came back i was missing 2 characters, i look at my acct history and 2 different credit cards were used to transfer 2 different characters while i wasn't playing. nothing can be done becasue they can't prove that i didn't authorise the transfer. however if the original key was needed, or the original credit card number to transfer the characters, it probably wouldn't have happened.
Dash Drayson Caldari Ganja Labs	Posted - 2007.09.13 03:49:00 - [22] My name is dash drayson, my corp is ganja labs. And I can saw in public that anyone who expects someone else to pay for their account for 5 months and then give it back for free is dumb. Thanks Helmet for telling half the story, thats only fair. 0.o Einhander is the king of pimps. KEEP ON PIMPIN EIN!
Merrick Solipsus Modern Amusement	Posted - 2007.09.13 03:51:00 - [23] The moral of the story is: If youre going to steal an account, slip CCP 20$ (or whatever the transfer fee is) so you dont get in trouble.
Twilight Interloper Caldari Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.09.13 04:04:00 - [24] I was trusted with 69million isk the other day, which is a huge amount for me. It never occured to me to break the trust. ISK is virtual, trust isn't. My opinion on people who betray a bond of trust is...well, they are simply lacking in qualities that make a good person, and nothing they gain from breaking trust can ever make up for that lacking.
Saint Lazarus Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.13 04:43:00 - [25] All I can say is W T F to teh GM's for not insta banning both =s Sharing teh account is a banable offence im not surprised he didnt help im surprised no one was punished. Just cause guy got cheated out shouldnt mean he gets special treatment from teh rules teh rest of us follow :P ------------------------------
Callthetruth Caldari Drunken Ratbags Inc	Posted - 2007.09.13 04:48:00 - [26] Read the EULA
Irob Urore Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2007.09.13 04:51:00 - [27] thats human nature for you, hope this is a lesson for others. the only people i trust in the game are the ones i know in real life, its pretty hard to stooge someone when you see them almost everyday.
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:07:00 - [28] Originally by: Irob Urore thats human nature for you, hope this is a lesson for others. the only people i trust in the game are the ones i know in real life, its pretty hard to stooge someone when you see them almost everyday. Actually it's much easier because they are more trusting.
Irob Urore Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:18:00 - [29] Originally by: Julien Mornier Actually it's much easier because they are more trusting. well there we have it, trust nobody live in a shell and die lonely.
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:23:00 - [30] Edited by: Julien Mornier on 13/09/2007 05:24:26 Originally by: Irob Urore Originally by: Julien Mornier Actually it's much easier because they are more trusting. well there we have it, trust nobody live in a shell and die lonely. Depends on your values and the trust that you have in your own judgement. Online or offline the relationships, risks, and value judgements are the same.
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:24:00 - [31] Originally by: Golden Helmet Some time ago.. a friend of mine... decided to quit the game. Okay, he quit. Quote: ...However, the thief... Good wording there.. So, someone gives you a car. You get the pink slip, you put money into the car, wash it, wax it, etc. Then they show up and want it back in that great condition.. Quote: Ganja Labs Owns. ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Kuolematon Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:26:00 - [32] Originally by: Golden Helmet My friend did contact Ein before he petitioned to get his char back. When he refused to hand it over, my friend then threatened to petition, and still didn't get it back. Thats when the character transfer happened. Ein was a very wise person. My hats off to him! He got "free" character. I would have done same. It's very wise to transfer character out of someones account because you never know what will happen. Good job Ein! I was sworn absolute love by Pepperami
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:28:00 - [33] Oh and.. Ooops.. Quote: c. EVE Online subscribers are responsible for protecting the confidentiality of their account information. Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account. Therefore, account holders are strongly urged not to share accounts or account information with others. Quote: Ganja Labs R Teh Dev1L!!!1!!!one!! ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Ardent Rellik Gallente MURAKAMI INDUSTRIES	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:31:00 - [34] Or it could also be: (It is an example) 1) 2004, A friend says he is quitting the game, and never coming back. (Never Says Never). 2) 2004, He says I will give you the account, you can do with as you like (EULA Violation - Yes) 3) 2007, A friend has returned to EVE, after the other guy has spent, 3 years training the character and paying the fees. 4) 2007, A "friend" says: You know, it has been 3 years, new stuff is coming to EVE, but I changed my mind, I want my character and account back... Ooops! 5) You say: Dude! I was paying for the account for 3 years, and I trained up the character! What up, you said you never coming back?! 6) A "friend" says, well, you know, I do not remember, and is my account and my character, even if you paid for it for 3 years, you are SOL. Lesson: 1) Sharing an account is an EULA violation. 2) If you are violating an EULA, you better not do it for 3 years. What he should have done: 1) Transfer the character to his own account in 2004. This would have been end of story. Best of luck, to those best of "friends."
Julius Romanus Bloodmoney Incorporated	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:49:00 - [35] Handle it IRL. People in skimasks happen sometimes.
The RepoMan Caldari Red Horizon Inc Red Horizon	Posted - 2007.09.13 05:55:00 - [36] I think you miss the point here... If you get burned because you trusted someoneone and they proved to be untrustworthy, it's 'crap, I suck at knowing how to trust' not 'trust no-one'. I mean, if you dont like ice cream it's not 'dont eat ice cream' it's 'I dont like ice cream'. People are far too complacent nowadays when it comes to friends in and out of game, if you think you have hundreds of friends you're freakin clueless, you probably have hundreds of buddies but a true friend is a rare occurance and everlasting. I'm sure most of you know this but just havent come to terms with it, I mean, would you trust any of your 'friends' to not rat you out if you were wanted by the police for like 50 million? Doubt it, know who your friends are. Anyways, moral of the story is if I trust you, you've earned it and I will never get burned, I've done this many a time in my life, and will continue to, but only because I know who to trust, most people just dont know.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:26:00 - [37] Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? Yes, it is. I'm not going to pretend to deny that. Regardless of EULA violations though, I think it's a rather low thing to steal years of work from a friend like that. Really goes to show, "Trust Nobody." It is a bannable violation but generally, I think, worth a temporary ban. The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. About the new corporation it is not exactly a question of in game trustworthiness. They can have multiple reasons to keep the character and not wanting a unknow player even for the 24 hours needed to kick it out.
Julien Mornier	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:28:00 - [38] Originally by: Julius Romanus Handle it IRL. People in skimasks happen sometimes. Yeah, that doesn't work out so well in the real world despite your fantasies.
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:35:00 - [39] Originally by: Venkul Mul The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. And how will you arrange that... See, it just gets too complicated. There should be no tolerance for idiocy. The guy was DUMB and gave someone (a "friend") his password to the account. End of story. ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:37:00 - [40] Originally by: Darriuss i think the problem is in the character transfer rules. anyone can transfer a character with any credit card which opens the process up to scams, hacks, whtever other conspiricy theory we can think of. i can't understand why you don't need the original key to transfer the character. that way a scammer or hacker or whtever can't steal characters. sure it protects you against losing your acct, but wht good is your acct without any characters on it? i am pleading with CCP to make character transfers more secure. make the original key or original credit card number necessary for a transfer, then generate a transfer key that is attached to that character that needs to be used to transfer the character again. i quit for a couple of years, when i came back i was missing 2 characters, i look at my acct history and 2 different credit cards were used to transfer 2 different characters while i wasn't playing. nothing can be done becasue they can't prove that i didn't authorise the transfer. however if the original key was needed, or the original credit card number to transfer the characters, it probably wouldn't have happened. Credit card number change with time. Mine was changed by the bank during a security upgrade. If your idea was used I could have serious problem in the future for something totally outside my control.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:42:00 - [41] Originally by: Dash Drayson My name is dash drayson, my corp is ganja labs. And I can saw in public that anyone who expects someone else to pay for their account for 5 months and then give it back for free is dumb. Thanks Helmet for telling half the story, thats only fair. 0.o Einhander is the king of pimps. KEEP ON PIMPIN EIN! If that was the original deal, yes. You only ad a right to get a refound for the game time remaining on the account. You had the use of a extra trained character against the cost of paying the game time. Originally you thought it was a good deal, as you accepted it.
Vaal Erit	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:44:00 - [42] Edited by: Vaal Erit on 13/09/2007 06:44:37 Originally by: The RepoMan I mean, if you dont like ice cream it's not 'dont eat ice cream' it's 'I dont like ice cream' QFT Wait no, Quoted for wtf, QFWTF!
Vuxacha Eve Defence Force Praesidium Libertatis	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:46:00 - [43] Should be mutally assured destruction, otherwise GMs will be involved in this kind of bickering all the time. Ban the account which had the disputed character, and ban the account which stole it. Yes, I said stole. If the other guy wanted a 3 year character, he could've made a new account or rolled an alt. Instead, he built on an existing character. That was dumb. Doesn't matter if the original owner said "never coming back". Either you transfer the character off then, or you let it go. As it is, this is a bought account. Bought with subscription money, but bought none the less. Doesn't the account transfer page say that an account cannot be bought? Either enforce your damned Eula or get out of the way.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:48:00 - [44] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. And how will you arrange that... See, it just gets too complicated. There should be no tolerance for idiocy. The guy was DUMB and gave someone (a "friend") his password to the account. End of story. Buy GTC, do secure transfer of GTC. End of story. If as he stated he has paid for 5 month of game and used it the original owner could have added some extra GTC as a compensation.
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:52:00 - [45] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. And how will you arrange that... See, it just gets too complicated. There should be no tolerance for idiocy. The guy was DUMB and gave someone (a "friend") his password to the account. End of story. Buy GTC, do secure transfer of GTC. End of story. If as he stated he has paid for 5 month of game and used it the original owner could have added some extra GTC as a compensation. And what about the ISK he has transfered to the other character in order to buy skills, ships, etc?? What about the PLAYTIME he put into that character?? .... Just quit while you're behind. If that were to happen for everyone who STUPIDLY gave someone else their password.. gahh give me a break. ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:54:00 - [46] Originally by: Vuxacha As it is, this is a bought account. Bought with subscription money, but bought none the less. Doesn't the account transfer page say that an account cannot be bought? Either enforce your damned Eula or get out of the way. Sorry but that logic doesn't work. It is not a bought character. That's like saying an ice cream sandwich someone gave you was bought because you put it in your mouth and bit off a piece. ..Ya I said ice cream *****es! ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Dash Drayson Caldari Ganja Labs	Posted - 2007.09.13 06:57:00 - [47] Wow im glad you all think you get an opinion here... How about unless your a GM, you dont get to say what SHOULD happen or whats GOING to happen. ok? I think you should all get banned, and my skillpoints raised to 100 mil. pleaz kthx!!!oneeleven1 Let the flaming of Golden Nooblet commence though. Im so happy some dumbass has decieded to try to disgrace my awesome corp. Im just hoping his corp has the balls enough to actually hold space instead of empirate. High sec is for noobs!
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:00:00 - [48] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. And how will you arrange that... See, it just gets too complicated. There should be no tolerance for idiocy. The guy was DUMB and gave someone (a "friend") his password to the account. End of story. Buy GTC, do secure transfer of GTC. End of story. If as he stated he has paid for 5 month of game and used it the original owner could have added some extra GTC as a compensation. And what about the ISK he has transfered to the other character in order to buy skills, ships, etc?? What about the PLAYTIME he put into that character?? .... Just quit while you're behind. If that were to happen for everyone who STUPIDLY gave someone else their password.. gahh give me a break. If you think the character was mine you are missing the mark by a whide margin. I have just looked the character in game. Born 10/9/2005. So the player had a 19 months old character to use for 5 months. If he wasn't capable of getting enough isk to pay for GTC or the character was very bad trained or he wasn't interested in making isk. I dubt the player had to use any isk from is other account. A little point: if the transfer was done in concomitance with the petition it should be esaily reversed. It is not something that happened months ago.
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:16:00 - [49] Originally by: Venkul Mul I have just looked the character in game. Born 10/9/2005. So the player had a 19 months old character to use for 5 months. If he wasn't capable of getting enough isk to pay for GTC or the character was very bad trained or he wasn't interested in making isk. I dubt the player had to use any isk from is other account. Ummm I only play one character at a time. One player makes the isk, the other fights... Which means, I transfer isk to the other character. Happens all the time Quote: A little point: if the transfer was done in concomitance with the petition it should be esaily reversed. It is not something that happened months ago. conc-om-i-tance... interesting choice of a... word? No, yep, not a word. Sorry lost me on that one. ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Bizz Lizz	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:25:00 - [50] Violated the EULA and trusted the wrong person. Don't know what to say, except probably unfair and a hard lesson. I haven't given my account details to anyone so far, because of the eula and the risk that you described and the risk that the information leaks from a friend by mistake, keyloggers and such. But I know a few persons in EVE though that, who I could definitely trust that much, because I know them for 2 years already and they have proved to be trustworthy. They offered me to use their tech-2 ships, donnated me stuff to pvp, when i was low on isk, cared about my pos by by themselves, when I was suddenly in hospital ... we store private stuff in directors hangars and offer eachother to take something, if in need. I don't even know, what's there in the cans, just know, if I put it there, it stays there or someone tells me that he has taken someone. After some time, you know, who you can trust like those who care about the corp and their mates, and you also know people, who are maybe nice funny guys, but you won't give them responsibility for something important.
Kathistos	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:30:00 - [51] Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:34:25 Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:31:53 Originally by: Venkul Mul If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. Lol, what a joke... no coment on this one. Let's make it simple: Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account.Enought said. Einhander - 1 bringme2life - 0
Jinx Barker GFB Scientific	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:32:00 - [52] Basically, this works out as follows: The guys quits EVE, and violates EULA and gives his account to his buddy. The buddy as **er that he is, trained that character for five months, and paid $75.00 US for the subscription, he gained about 1.5 Mill/Sp Month, 7.5 Mill SP during that time. Now, the original owner who supposedly quit, is coming back, and wants the character/account back with all the additional bells and whistles. Not bad. So, what does the buddy do? He transfers a character to a different account? Wow, like that can not be traced, and he does so just as the whole brouhaha started? Well, this is obviously an attempt at evasion, despite the fact that the guy who quit is dead wrong, and is an ****** for doing what he is doing, I would have just let him have it, and avoided the ban-stick that is inevitably coming. Let me put it this way, they are both wrong. The original guy is an ****** for trying to rip off his buddy's five months worth of work on the character. And, the buddy is wrong, because he is an idiot for trusting that this will not come back to bite him in the arse, and should have transfered the character five months ago. After this thread, I predict: BOTH ACCOUNTS AND CHARACTERS WILL BE PERMABANNED, THIS WAS BROUGHT INTO A PUBLIC EYE AND AS SUCH WILL RESULT IN GM'S MAKING IT A POINT TO BAN BOTH OF THEM FOR EULA VIOLATION. CONGRATULATIONS!** It should have been all solved privately and between the two, with some sort of a compromise. Now, it is too late however, I suggest you guys start saving some money for the new eve subscription. Since it is not long till you both are gone.
Kathistos	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:37:00 - [53]
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:50:00 - [54] Originally by: Dash Drayson Im just hoping his corp has the balls enough to actually hold space instead of empirate. High sec is for noobs! Seeing as you seem to be so incredibly narrowminded and oblivious to the fact that some people, myself included, don't like hassling with territory, the POS management, standings, and defense crap that comes with it, and would much rather spend their time simply shooting stuff than managing that crap, I'm simply going to drop to your level for a moment and say: you're a moron. Now, if you'd like to continue attempting to flame me, be my guest. Wanna dec my corp? Please do, I can use a little bit of padding for my killboard.
Dash Laserwing	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:54:00 - [55] Edited by: Dash Laserwing on 13/09/2007 07:55:10
Dash Drayson Caldari Ganja Labs	Posted - 2007.09.13 07:56:00 - [56] Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Dash Drayson Im just hoping his corp has the balls enough to actually hold space instead of empirate. High sec is for noobs! Seeing as you seem to be so incredibly narrowminded and oblivious to the fact that some people, myself included, don't like hassling with territory, the POS management, standings, and defense crap that comes with it, and would much rather spend their time simply shooting stuff than managing that crap, I'm simply going to drop to your level for a moment and say: you're a moron. Now, if you'd like to continue attempting to flame me, be my guest. Wanna dec my corp? Please do, I can use a little bit of padding for my killboard. I dont have to flame you, you already pointed our your an empire noob. And why would I wardec you? its not like my characters can even go into empire... but then again, I can always pvp your butt all over the forums, yarrrrrrrr
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 08:00:00 - [57] Originally by: Dash Laserwing Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Dash Drayson Im just hoping his corp has the balls enough to actually hold space instead of empirate. High sec is for noobs! Seeing as you seem to be so incredibly narrowminded and oblivious to the fact that some people, myself included, don't like hassling with territory, the POS management, standings, and defense crap that comes with it, and would much rather spend their time simply shooting stuff than managing that crap, I'm simply going to drop to your level for a moment and say: you're a moron. Now, if you'd like to continue attempting to flame me, be my guest. Wanna dec my corp? Please do, I can use a little bit of padding for my killboard. I dont have to flame you, you already pointed our your an empire noob. And why would I wardec you? its not like my characters can even go into empire... but then again, I can always pvp your butt all over the forums, yarrrrrrrr Who ever said I limit myself to empire? I rather enjoy running around 0.0 smashing things to bits. Territory and the other things that naturally come with it however, suck to the utmost extreme. As for forum PvP, my original comment of "be my guest" still stands. However, my participation in events will have to be delayed until tomorrow. Theres this little thing called "Sleep", and considering it's 1 AM, it's about time for sleep. So I bid to you and the other trolls, goodnight, and please fill this thread with much fun things so I have plenty to read upon waking up
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.13 08:03:00 - [58] Edited by: Sokratesz on 13/09/2007 08:03:55 Being an internet tough guy by screwing over other people leaves you at just that, being an internet tough guy. Break of trust is lame, period. If anything, all three accounts (the owner, the thief and the 3rd party) should be banned. If the GMs want to be nice, only the latter two. If they want to be really nice, they give him the character back, then ban the latter two.
Sm0kE Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 08:12:00 - [59] Originally by: Golden Helmet Who ever said I limit myself to empire? I rather enjoy running around 0.0 smashing things to bits. Umm, the killboard says that. .5 for the win? What were you smashing to bits in 0.0 there Trojan Man? Ohhhhh you mean the red X's!!! Gotcha. ------------------------------------------------ Anyone got a good compression tool for EVE sigs?
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.13 08:12:00 - [60] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Golden Helmet ...rather spend their time simply shooting stuff than managing that crap... Now, if you'd like to continue attempting to flame me, be my guest. Wanna dec my corp? Please do, I can use a little bit of padding for my killboard. Ummmmmm Golden Helmet Dash Ohh.. Uhho.. Uhhhh ya, sorry Trojan Man I think you're in trouble. Let the killboard padding commence! You do realize that I've been in this corp less than a WEEK, right? Here is my personal killboard, for your convenience. NOW I'm going to sleep. Stupid last minute things I forgot to check, grr.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:08:00 - [61] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul I have just looked the character in game. Born 10/9/2005. So the player had a 19 months old character to use for 5 months. If he wasn't capable of getting enough isk to pay for GTC or the character was very bad trained or he wasn't interested in making isk. I dubt the player had to use any isk from is other account. Ummm I only play one character at a time. One player makes the isk, the other fights... Which means, I transfer isk to the other character. Happens all the time Quote: A little point: if the transfer was done in concomitance with the petition it should be esaily reversed. It is not something that happened months ago. conc-om-i-tance... interesting choice of a... word? No, yep, not a word. Sorry lost me on that one. At the same time - as I am not a english native probably I was traslating it wrong. [shrug] Edit: concomitance A noun 1 concomitance occurrence or existence together or in connection with one another WordReference.com english dictionary Main Entry: con+com+i+tance Pronunciation: k&n-'kS-m&-t&n(t)s, kSn- Function: noun : ACCOMPANIMENT; especially : a conjunction that is regular and is marked by correlative variation of accompanying elements Merriam-Webster At least some kind of character generate isk even when the player isn't not actively running them (through R&D agents, building things, ecc.) or help the isk production of the main character (support during missions for example). Quote: Ummm I only play one character at a time. One player makes the isk, the other fights... Which means, I transfer isk to the other character. Happens all the time Exactly my point the player had a extra account to generate isk to transfer to his original main or he had the use of a PvP character with more than 18 months of character growth. I dubt he would have payd the account if he had no return from it. Some form of compensation for the RL cash spent on the character could have been a good idea, but the ownership of the character hadn't changed.
dor amwar Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:12:00 - [62] if they can't agree on who owns em, ban em both. people won't do this in the future if they know what can happen and saves ccp the work sorting through it.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:13:00 - [63] Originally by: Kathistos Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:34:25 Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:31:53 Originally by: Venkul Mul If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. Lol, what a joke... no coment on this one. Let's make it simple: Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account.Enought said. Einhander - 1 bringme2life - 0 Fun, but you are arguing exactly in favor of the original owner. Till the day the character was moved to another account he was responsable for anything that the character did. Any (furter) violation of the Eula vould have got that account banned and possibily the original owner permabanned from the game, not the current user. If the character was used to launder isk the problems would have reflected on the original owner.
Cornucopian Gallente Dutch Omega United Freemen Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:16:00 - [64] Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? CCP condones: -hackers -macro'ers -Isk Sellers et al. they arent doing anything about it. you really think they'll bother about someone sharing an account? ----------------------------------------------- "post with your main. delete your alt, you sad little exploiting metagamer." Originally by: Royaldo complete win by Cornucopian!
Vuxacha Eve Defence Force Praesidium Libertatis	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:18:00 - [65] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Vuxacha As it is, this is a bought account. Bought with subscription money, but bought none the less. Doesn't the account transfer page say that an account cannot be bought? Either enforce your damned Eula or get out of the way. Sorry but that logic doesn't work. It is not a bought character. That's like saying an ice cream sandwich someone gave you was bought because you put it in your mouth and bit off a piece. ..Ya I said ice cream *****es! It is bought. What justification is there to say that the recipient owns the character? Accounts cannot be transferred. Therefore, it is permanently the property of the original holder. The new holder can claim ownership on the fact that he has paid subscription but then we return to what I said above. You say the friend gave you an icecream sandwich. But that friend says he asked you to hold it and you ate it. You see the problem? This is why you should both have your accounts banned, no warning. It'll teach you not to waste GMs time by breaking EULA terms that are common throughout most MMOs. Your lucky your friend was stupid enough to threaten you first. Had it been me, there would have been a request, followed by a password change. You'd better hope the GMs don't decide that a character sale so conveniently close to a petition about the character is a sign that you're guilty.
RedLion Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:23:00 - [66] Well all the nublets wannabe pros here that says "ban both". ask yourself: Will CCP ban 2 accounts losing maybe up to (with average maybe 1 alt account each stopped subscribing) $600 a year? I don't think so atleast. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:28:00 - [67] Originally by: RedLion Well all the nublets wannabe pros here that says "ban both". ask yourself: Will CCP ban 2 accounts losing maybe up to (with average maybe 1 alt account each stopped subscribing) $600 a year? I don't think so atleast. On a playerbase of 200k? they just dont care dude
Cadela Fria Amarr Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.13 09:41:00 - [68] Originally by: Cornucopian Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? CCP condones: -hackers -macro'ers -Isk Sellers et al. they arent doing anything about it. you really think they'll bother about someone sharing an account? Thats a plain big fat lie right there. CCP does not condone any of those, period. Knowledge is a priviledge, not a right
Cpt Branko The Bloody Red	Posted - 2007.09.13 10:06:00 - [69] Originally by: Golden Helmet They weren't RL friends, but they had been playing Eve together for some time both as corpmates and simply chatting as friends after bringme2life left Ganja. They also played some other games together too I think, but I'm not 100% certain there. But regardless of all this, they were friends at least in-game, and it's certainly low that Ein did what he did. This is the problem, trusting a person you don't know IRL with your account. Still a low thing to do, but meh. Unless you don't know where to find him, don't give him your log-in details
ry ry StateCorp The State	Posted - 2007.09.13 10:23:00 - [70] stealing the character was low, but not as monumentally stupid as giving the account away to some random. send me your credit card details, and i'll make sure the character is returned to you.
Usarua	Posted - 2007.09.13 10:44:00 - [71] Originally by: Vaal Erit 1. ACCOUNT USERNAMES AND PASSWORDS a. EVE Online account usernames must contain at least four alphanumeric characters, may not contain spaces or unconventional characters and must not be vulgar, obscene, ethnically, racially or sexually offensive or otherwise inappropriate. b. EVE Online account passwords must contain at least four alphanumerical characters and may not contain spaces or non-standard characters. c. EVE Online subscribers are responsible for protecting the confidentiality of their account information. Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account. Therefore, account holders are strongly urged not to share accounts or account information with others. d. A subscriber who suspects an unauthorized person may have obtained access to his password should change it immediately by accessing his account profile. e. Usernames cannot be changed; however, subscribers are urged to change account passwords at regular intervals as a precautionary measure. Read part c especially EULA: "You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Joint or shared ownership or use of an Account by more than one user is prohibited. " "A transfer or attempted transfer of a character is entirely at the risk of the parties to such transaction. CCP is not liable to any person (whether transferor, transferee or otherwise) for any acts, omissions, statements, representations, defaults or liabilities of the parties in connection with such a transaction. " EULA offense can be banned but that's pretty serious, it sounds like the original owner got ownership back but not the characters. There must have been some argument and threats made by your friend or else the other guy would not have known to transfer the character asap. Your friend sounds pretty screwed to be honest. Even though it is just a game, sharing personal details should not be trusted to a guy you met on the internet. Think about it like this, you could call someone dimwitted if they said this to you, "So I met this dude on a chat room on a game website and gave him my bank account to make sure it was ok and only buy a can of coke and I wake up 2 months later and he empties my account!" The more I read the original post I think whinefest instead of legitimate problem. Keep friends and business separate and for the love of baby kittens don't share your account info, fairly no-brainer stuff that your friend should take as a life-lesson. part C of CCPs words kind of conflicts with the EULA doesnt it. its like watching WoW corporate trying to cover themself while (insert community caring comp here) trying to allow players some latitude.
Usarua	Posted - 2007.09.13 10:49:00 - [72] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1hIg243s6g look its the guys friend!
Princess Jodi Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.09.13 14:10:00 - [73] CCP openly encourages scumbucket behavior in the game. I agree with other posters that there is account-sharing voilations on both sides. But wanting CCP to give your friend something back that he was scammed out of? No Way. CCP WANTS lowlife scammers in the game - in fact developed a whole mechanism that allows thefts to take place. For example, what is the difference between what happened to your freind an the recent theft from Bob by a guy who they had known for years? Nothing... they're part of the game.
Cadela Fria Amarr Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.13 14:18:00 - [74] Originally by: Princess Jodi CCP openly encourages scumbucket behavior in the game. I agree with other posters that there is account-sharing voilations on both sides. But wanting CCP to give your friend something back that he was scammed out of? No Way. CCP WANTS lowlife scammers in the game - in fact developed a whole mechanism that allows thefts to take place. For example, what is the difference between what happened to your freind an the recent theft from Bob by a guy who they had known for years? Nothing... they're part of the game. Why are you trying to blame CCP for mistakes and crimes done by players? The OP's friend was responsible for his account. He used it irresponsibly and thus the result. Your account is sacred and should only be used by 1 person..you. Nobody else, just you... The BoB thing is different because running an alliance and corp that size REQUIRE more people with access to stuff. Your account doesn't. Simple as that. Knowledge is a priviledge, not a right
Princess Jodi Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.09.13 14:25:00 - [75] Actually, I referred to the Bob incident to highlight the Trust issue, not the game mechanics. To me its simple: The OP's friend trusted someone. That was the entire mistake. Never trust anyone. Hell, I've known of married couples that had a falling out and the wife deleted/recycled all the husband's characters! I treat my Eve account just like my bank account: NO ONE knows the passwords, and they are not written down or saved anywhere. I never 'lend' people expensive stuff, I don't log on anyone else's accounts.
Billy Sastard Amarr Life. Universe. Everything. Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 14:29:00 - [76] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Kathistos Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:34:25 Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:31:53 Originally by: Venkul Mul If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. Lol, what a joke... no coment on this one. Let's make it simple: Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account.Enought said. Einhander - 1 bringme2life - 0 Fun, but you are arguing exactly in favor of the original owner. Till the day the character was moved to another account he was responsable for anything that the character did. Any (furter) violation of the Eula vould have got that account banned and possibily the original owner permabanned from the game, not the current user. If the character was used to launder isk the problems would have reflected on the original owner. You misunderstand the bolded-underlined text. What that means is, in short, CCP will do buggerall about anything that happens to the account while it is in the hand of the person you gave your information to. Get it? It is not the responsibility of CCP to return the character, as it was the original players fault for giving his account info out. THAT is what the EULA states. -=^=-
Bklyn 1	Posted - 2007.09.13 15:30:00 - [77] Regardless of the EULA and technicalities. The fact remains that if they had an agreement and one person broke the agreement, that person (assuming he doesn't get banned due to the technicalities) is in the wrong. Such is the internet, where people hide in the anonymity to do things they would never do in real life. I believe people's true selves come out in just such a situation.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 17:51:00 - [78] Originally by: Billy Sastard Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Kathistos Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:34:25 Edited by: Kathistos on 13/09/2007 07:31:53 Originally by: Venkul Mul If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. Lol, what a joke... no coment on this one. Let's make it simple: Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account.Enought said. Einhander - 1 bringme2life - 0 Fun, but you are arguing exactly in favor of the original owner. Till the day the character was moved to another account he was responsable for anything that the character did. Any (furter) violation of the Eula vould have got that account banned and possibily the original owner permabanned from the game, not the current user. If the character was used to launder isk the problems would have reflected on the original owner. You misunderstand the bolded-underlined text. What that means is, in short, CCP will do buggerall about anything that happens to the account while it is in the hand of the person you gave your information to. Get it? It is not the responsibility of CCP to return the character, as it was the original players fault for giving his account info out. THAT is what the EULA states. I understood perfectly what you mean, but as I pointed out, ironically it is a reason in favor of the original owner too, as he is responsable for all the action of his account, even if done by the other player. As an example, if I hack you account and menace someon of RL harm, buy isk for RL cash, sell isk for cash and essentially go around violating the EULA, the one to get banned is your account, not mine. You need to prove the account has been hacked to get clear. It you had given me the password you will not get cleared and receive a temporary or permanent ban. As the transfer was done at the same time or immediatly before the petition it can be reversed as in the istant the petition was done the account was disputed. If the transfer had ben done month before the player had no ground for requiring the return.
wictro	Posted - 2007.09.13 18:55:00 - [79] Ban both accounts. the one that has the char in question at that moment. and the original owner too. And whats that with "he trained and paid for the char for 5 months, he needs love!" bull. He got a free 2005 char and used it. It ain't like he was nurturing a sick fuken puppy. And yes, i consider the "thief" as the ****a, but orginal owner should not give his acco-info either. boo to this whole thing!
Zeke Novak Outlaws N Angels	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:03:00 - [80] I think your friend has stumbled upon one of the reasons account sharing is against the rules. Sucks, but the GM's should probably have just told him tough ****, if not banned both accounts. I can't say I support that part of the EULA, but it's there, and you assume risk in disregarding it. -- Reality.sys corrupt. Reboot Universe? (y/n/q)
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:21:00 - [81] If you willingly give your account and pass to someone, consider the account and everything on it theirs forever. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets do not.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:23:00 - [82] Originally by: dor amwar if they can't agree on who owns em, ban em both. people won't do this in the future if they know what can happen and saves ccp the work sorting through it. They will too this, and they'll deserve everything they get. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets do not.
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:32:00 - [83] When i quit eve my char quits with me, my char = me in a way, when i quit eve forever my char will die. The idea to hand over my char to someone else.. NEVER! So no, i'm not laughing at ur friend but he learned a valuable lesson, trust is hard gained and easily lost. CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
Saphros Minmatar Lone Gunmen	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:39:00 - [84] Edited by: Saphros on 13/09/2007 20:40:17 Quote: The thief is "einhander0004", and the character stolen, "bringme2life". HavenÆt bothered reading the whole thread, but with names like that IÆd say ban them both for their names alone! On a more serious note; itÆs sad that EVE have attracted so many jerks, it used to be a game full of dedicated and ambitious people. But thatÆs what you get when you give in to whiners and makes playing easier and easier. Guess it's all about profit in the end... arenÆt human behaviour grand!
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:44:00 - [85] Originally by: 000Hunter000 When i quit eve my char quits with me, my char = me in a way, when i quit eve forever my char will die. The idea to hand over my char to someone else.. NEVER! So no, i'm not laughing at ur friend but he learned a valuable lesson, trust is hard gained and easily lost. Right. I could give avay my stuff if I am sure I will not return, but not my "face". Look at Jenny Spitfire and her posts. After the character was sold she is another person. For me a character after being traded should lose all the backhstory and name, keeping only race and date of birth. Especially the character should automatically lose all rights in whatever corporation he was part of.
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:44:00 - [86] firstly why are you all posting here makeing a mountain out of a mole hill??? secondly : c. EVE Online subscribers are responsible for protecting the confidentiality of their account information. Any authorized use of a subscriberÆs account by another individual is the responsibility of the account holder. The subscriber is responsible for the behavior of others who are permitted to use his or her account. Therefore, account holders are strongly urged not to share accounts or account information with others. did you even read that you know what that says that says that if you give someone YOUR PASSWORD and they do something you don't like you you petition it CCP WILL *NOT* DO ANYTHING BECAUSE IT IS *YOUR* FAULT AND YOUR RESPONSIBILITY!!!!!! did you understand that at all people.... apparently not so i'll give you a related example for anyone who has trouble undstanding the above text.... : you buy a vagabond ... aobut 85 mil... t2 doesn't insure well at all... no insurance... you lose the ship and petition ccp to give you your money back because you made a mistake and went afk and someone came and killed you at a gate... is ccp going to give you your money back that you spent on that ship NO!!!!! WHAT YOU DO WITH YOUR STUFF IS YOUR OWN RESPONSIBILITY!!! i'm sorry but if you don't understand that then you don't need to be play a complicated game as eve. about the i transfered my char when i was threatened to be petitioned... : the owner of the account bringme2life quits and offers me his character, his credit card doesn't work, i don't have one, so i just use the account instead, a few months later it was brought to my attention that useing his account like that is bannable offence, opps i didn't know that i'm sure no one reads and remembers the EULA of everysingle MMO that they play, so then i went and got a credit card that i can actaully use on their website and made a new account and tranfered the character LIKE THE ORIGINAL DEAL I HAD MADE WITH THE PREVIOUS OWNER OF THE CHARACTER. then a few days later i recieve an eve mail that says return my character or i will peteition it i say no this is my chacter now not his. PERIOD! now stop wasteing your time sympathizing for a guy who gave his character to me and now he wants a do-over... absolutely not i was punished for the account shareing offence guys it did not go unpunished.... here is the eve system mail i got from ccp "2007.08.02 09:33 You are hereby warned to cease any and all forms of account sharing. Any further such activity on your account can and will lead to a permanent ban from EVE Online." for those that don't understand i got a warning from ccp that says if i ever log into someone elses account again my account will be perma banned there that is everything... satisfied??? now stop wasteing time on the forums and go do somehting on eve and PEW PEW have some fun... that's what the game is for, not to sit around on forums and flame everyone and flame me for useing a chacter that was given to me.... sheesh
Rikeka Amarr Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.09.13 20:54:00 - [87] Bann them all. +-+-+-+-+ Booya! It¦s red! Run from the red!
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.13 21:00:00 - [88] Originally by: Rikeka Bann them all. this is a rediculas post.... this is just a whole bunch of people yelling "bann them all" because they are bad at eve lost all their ships and have nothing better to do... unbelieveable
Krimzin Kane Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 21:15:00 - [89] Originally by: Golden Helmet My friend also contacted the thief's CEO. I don't remember this part exactly, but seeing as the thief and his stolen character are still in the same corp as before, their CEO did nothing about it. Seriously, what kind of CEO could condone this? I'm all for scamming and the like, but this is beyond the plain, ordinary scam. ~GH I'm da CEO in da OP. Look dude, it's a game. Ein is all chill and groovy to play with. I don't know what he does behind closed doors, I don't know how he treats his mother, I don't know what he likes to do to his dog, and frankly I don't care. Don't drag me into this mess, dude. Your friend gave up a character and Ein was stupid and didn't transfer it sooner. Nuff said. Puff puff pass. by: Minigin
Krimzin Kane Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.13 21:17:00 - [90] Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Golden Helmet ...rather spend their time simply shooting stuff than managing that crap... Now, if you'd like to continue attempting to flame me, be my guest. Wanna dec my corp? Please do, I can use a little bit of padding for my killboard. Ummmmmm Golden Helmet Dash Ohh.. Uhho.. Uhhhh ya, sorry Trojan Man I think you're in trouble. Let the killboard padding commence! You do realize that I've been in this corp less than a WEEK, right? Here is my personal killboard, for your convenience. NOW I'm going to sleep. Stupid last minute things I forgot to check, grr. lol u got trolled, son tbqh imho kthxbai by: Minigin
Aaron	Posted - 2007.09.13 21:25:00 - [91] It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night.
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.13 21:47:00 - [92] Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud
Usarua	Posted - 2007.09.14 00:20:00 - [93] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Rikeka Bann them all. this is a rediculas post.... this is just a whole bunch of people yelling "bann them all" because they are bad at eve lost all their ships and have nothing better to do... unbelieveable you go girl!
Aaron	Posted - 2007.09.14 00:32:00 - [94] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud no i dont flame everything for no reason, the OP said it was given to you with the understanding that youre to give it back if your "friend" returns forget the EULA and the GM's for a while. at no point did you request payment for your time spent on the character, nor were u prepared to negotiate something for the character, all i can see you saying is the account belongs to you. for this reason im flaming you. sometimes you cant always follow rules, u go with whats in your heart. if you aggreed to just looking after the character while your "friend" is away, then you should do the right thing and give it back. but yes the op has reinfoced my view of most people in RL and in eve, DONT TRUST THEM!!!!
nova strikin Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.14 01:18:00 - [95] i gave sum 1 my credit card information over the introwebs, and they took mee stuffs , why would they take mee monies when i trusted them ober the introwebs what do you expect to happen even if he did "loan" the character to him?????? if he did loan the account info then it is natural selection. sounds like a dumb dumb. a more plausable story...... " gosh i hates getting pwned every day and hate eve ..... i quit !!!!!! you seem nice... since i will no longer be playing this game you can HAVE this account " the term indian giver comes to mind . no offense to indians . it is a figure of speach
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.14 01:32:00 - [96] Originally by: Aaron Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud no i dont flame everything for no reason, the OP said it was given to you with the understanding that youre to give it back if your "friend" returns forget the EULA and the GM's for a while. at no point did you request payment for your time spent on the character, nor were u prepared to negotiate something for the character, all i can see you saying is the account belongs to you. for this reason im flaming you. sometimes you cant always follow rules, u go with whats in your heart. if you aggreed to just looking after the character while your "friend" is away, then you should do the right thing and give it back. but yes the op has reinfoced my view of most people in RL and in eve, DONT TRUST THEM!!!! correction the account does not belong to me it be longs to the person who originaly paid for it, but the chacter bringmel2life now bleongs to me and both of those things follow the rules of the EULA perfectly so please stop wasteing your time flameing me when you don't even know what your talking about
Atama Cardel GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.09.14 01:38:00 - [97] Quote: Hydra Alliance lol Hydra
Aaron	Posted - 2007.09.14 10:54:00 - [98] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud no i dont flame everything for no reason, the OP said it was given to you with the understanding that youre to give it back if your "friend" returns forget the EULA and the GM's for a while. at no point did you request payment for your time spent on the character, nor were u prepared to negotiate something for the character, all i can see you saying is the account belongs to you. for this reason im flaming you. sometimes you cant always follow rules, u go with whats in your heart. if you aggreed to just looking after the character while your "friend" is away, then you should do the right thing and give it back. but yes the op has reinfoced my view of most people in RL and in eve, DONT TRUST THEM!!!! correction the account does not belong to me it be longs to the person who originaly paid for it, but the chacter bringmel2life now bleongs to me and both of those things follow the rules of the EULA perfectly so please stop wasteing your time flameing me when you don't even know what your talking about I know exactly what im talking about, i meant to say character not account. its quite simple really, you made a verbal aggrement with your "friend" to put back his character if he retuns, you did not honor this aggreement, so therefore your attitude sucks, end of story.
Devious Dexter Gallente Red Light Enterprises Eastern Star Federation	Posted - 2007.09.14 12:00:00 - [99] Golden Helmet is a badass.
Honest Azaru	Posted - 2007.09.14 14:26:00 - [100] Originally by: Sm0kE Originally by: Venkul Mul The character switch should be reversed by a GM or senior GM as it was not done by the original owner. If the temporary user has paid some game time and he he has some of that remaning the original owner should have brought some GTC to compensate him. And how will you arrange that... See, it just gets too complicated. There should be no tolerance for idiocy. The guy was DUMB and gave someone (a "friend") his password to the account. End of story. The guy got an account to play with, why should be get paid for the time he played on it? Everyone whining about paying this thief (and he is a thief) back for the time he payed for needs to STFU. The thief isn't owed a dime.
Splagada Minmatar Tides of Silence Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.14 15:32:00 - [101] Edited by: Splagada on 14/09/2007 15:32:45 tag ------ Proud Janitor of Tides of Silence
DOC PIC	Posted - 2007.09.14 16:14:00 - [102] LOL GLAD I DONT HAVE FRIENDS AND YES I DO LIVE INA CAVE UNDER A BRIDGE..
cioran wyborowa	Posted - 2007.09.14 21:37:00 - [103] Edited by: cioran wyborowa on 14/09/2007 21:37:30 If your stupid enough to trust someone you cant asskick in real life then well, this happens... You don't even provide a timeline. If someone gave me their character, ****** off for a year which I paid for, whoes character is it really? Im sure this so called "thief" invested plenty into this char including time, account fees and probably ships/skills. Who knows what was said between these two characters on the initial transfer? Plenty of people remember things differently depending on their situation/perspective.
dor amwar Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.14 22:08:00 - [104] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud no i dont flame everything for no reason, the OP said it was given to you with the understanding that youre to give it back if your "friend" returns forget the EULA and the GM's for a while. at no point did you request payment for your time spent on the character, nor were u prepared to negotiate something for the character, all i can see you saying is the account belongs to you. for this reason im flaming you. sometimes you cant always follow rules, u go with whats in your heart. if you aggreed to just looking after the character while your "friend" is away, then you should do the right thing and give it back. but yes the op has reinfoced my view of most people in RL and in eve, DONT TRUST THEM!!!! correction the account does not belong to me it be longs to the person who originaly paid for it, but the chacter bringmel2life now bleongs to me and both of those things follow the rules of the EULA perfectly so please stop wasteing your time flameing me when you don't even know what your talking about characters belong to an account. the account is the container and therefor the char belongs to the the account. by your own admission you transfered a char from an account that did not belong to you. you stole from it. (funny that happened as soon as you found the owner wanted access to his account again.) 2 wrongs; he gave you access to his account, EULA violation; you used and stole from another's account, EULA violation. both accounts should be banned.
lin ta	Posted - 2007.09.14 22:24:00 - [105] Originally by: einhander0004 "2007.08.02 09:33 You are hereby warned to cease any and all forms of account sharing. Any further such activity on your account can and will lead to a permanent ban from EVE Online." for those that don't understand i got a warning from ccp that says if i ever log into someone elses account again my account will be perma banned again, you were told by ccp that if you enter somebody else's account you will be permaband. you then logged into the account to transfer a char after you had been warned. should be banned for that alone.
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.14 22:27:00 - [106] Originally by: Devious Dexter Golden Helmet is a badass. Thank you for showing me exactly why not to fit two CCC's to my Crusader sigh
SilverCut Caldari Ganja Labs	Posted - 2007.09.14 22:48:00 - [107] I like the way the OP used the term "decided to QUIT the game" because this follows the other side of the story where he was GIVEN the char because his friend was leaving eve. From my understanding (tho 3rd party imput really is meaningless) there was no break of trust as there were no terms for return. Which really ask the question how can you steal something you are given? Your friend wasn't foolish for sharing his account info or GIVING his char to a friend BUT he was foolish for thinking he can just trun around after such a length of time and demand his char back. The GM's havn't taken sides the EULA states the orignal owner is always the owner (so he gets the account back) it also states that he is responsible for any consequences that happens should he give his account details to someone els (which he did and so is not the responsibility of GM's to put right for him).
Aaron	Posted - 2007.09.14 23:43:00 - [108] the OP clearly states there was a condition where if he comes back he wants his account and character back, I dont like the way the thief is quoting all this EULA nonsense, so your saying that the verbal agreement you had with your "friend" meant nothing? CCP should do the right thing and return the character to its rightful owner, If a friend of mine asked me to keep an eye on his character id have done it and returned it to him if he asked for it back. Does that make me stupid?
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.15 01:50:00 - [109] Originally by: lin ta Originally by: einhander0004 "2007.08.02 09:33 You are hereby warned to cease any and all forms of account sharing. Any further such activity on your account can and will lead to a permanent ban from EVE Online." for those that don't understand i got a warning from ccp that says if i ever log into someone elses account again my account will be perma banned again, you were told by ccp that if you enter somebody else's account you will be permaband. you then logged into the account to transfer a char after you had been warned. should be banned for that alone. wrong again, this thread is loaded with noobs and the mentally ******** that WAS the punishment i got for logging into his account after everything was said and done
einhander0004	Posted - 2007.09.15 01:55:00 - [110] Originally by: Aaron the OP clearly states there was a condition where if he comes back he wants his account and character back, I dont like the way the thief is quoting all this EULA nonsense, so your saying that the verbal agreement you had with your "friend" meant nothing? CCP should do the right thing and return the character to its rightful owner, If a friend of mine asked me to keep an eye on his character id have done it and returned it to him if he asked for it back. Does that make me stupid? dude i don't care what you think you don't have to believe me at all you don't have to believe anything but here are the facts quoted from the my account screen on the eve-online site when you login: "Account Ownership: The original owner of an account is firstly, the owner of the boxed CD key, and in case of online purchase the original creator of an account. Accounts can not change ownership. If you have received an account second hand, the original owner can still claim ownership of this account. Note that accounts transferred before May 18th 2004 are exempt from this rule, as account transfers were allowed before that time. Characters can be transfered through the Character Transfer service, to another valid account. This is the only valid procedure to attain ownership of an character. Passwords are the responsibility of the account owner. If a shared password leads to abuse of the account, it is the responsibility of the account owner and customer support cannot reimburse the loss." that says that the account is his but they *CANNOT* do anything about the chacter now go away this is pointless ccp's own rules says that's not gunna happen and ive already recieved a punishment for account shareing so this is all over you can go away now... bye bye
Vitrael Warriors of the Einherjar Fimbulwinter	Posted - 2007.09.15 01:58:00 - [111] This is a long topic considering it was just the story of some guy dumb enough to give someone else his account and expect to ever play his character again. -------------------- The day of the nos boat is over. The day of the frig is upon us!
Janet Marshall Caldari	Posted - 2007.09.15 02:02:00 - [112] Hey, I always knew Ganja has nice down to earth guys. But the way sm0ke and Dash are talking today i really think they have changed. I mean jesus has Hydra changed you that much youve turned into flame baiting *******s? Now back to topic. I dont think the orginal owner has any real claims unless he is prepared to fork over some cash (EULA VIOLATION \o/) so i gusse he could make an offer with isk. But to be perfectly fair the accounts should be at least temporary banned for the EULA violations.
Grawshellar	Posted - 2007.09.15 02:10:00 - [113] PROTIP: If you are sharing an account, steal the character and receive a warning, plus the character! **Assuming the information we've received from BOTH sides so far is correct.
Dessa DesPlains	Posted - 2007.09.15 03:05:00 - [114] Never trust anyone further than you can throw a cheesecake underwater.
Golden Helmet Caldari The Diabolic Abstraction	Posted - 2007.09.15 04:56:00 - [115] Originally by: Janet Marshall Hey, I always knew Ganja has nice down to earth guys. But the way sm0ke and Dash are talking today i really think they have changed. I mean jesus has Hydra changed you that much youve turned into flame baiting *****s? Think their forums posts are bad? You should see the ** Dash and Minigin convoed me with shortly after I made this thread
Viktor Fyretracker Caldari Worms Corp	Posted - 2007.09.15 05:03:00 - [116] personal rule, never share an account with someone whos house you cant drive to and whup their ass and or burn their car.
Amarria Black Clan Anthraxx	Posted - 2007.09.15 05:10:00 - [117] Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker personal rule, never share an account with someone whos house you cant drive to and whup their ass and or burn their car. Exactly. Hell, all of my corp's directors are within driving distance of each other, so that if any one were to scam, the others could do the ol' sack-full-of-oranges routine.
Jason Marshall Hammer Of Light Division of Eden	Posted - 2007.09.15 05:20:00 - [118] Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: Janet Marshall Hey, I always knew Ganja has nice down to earth guys. But the way sm0ke and Dash are talking today i really think they have changed. I mean jesus has Hydra changed you that much youve turned into flame baiting *****s? Think their forums posts are bad? You should see the ** Dash and Minigin convoed me with shortly after I made this thread Yea i used to have some respect for them. they are generally nice guys when i flew with them, very competent pilots has well. Gusse some of there newer members and alliance has had an effect on them. Oh well, i gusse more people in new eden i feel no guilt for shooting. Tacky Lensflares in sigs ftw
Lord Zoran Caldari House of Tempers	Posted - 2007.09.15 11:02:00 - [119] Edited by: Lord Zoran on 15/09/2007 11:02:14 tbh i think the character should just be transferred back as the account didnt actually belong to the person who done the transfer at that time, anyway anyone who goes on about the eula being broken are kinda going off the subject because the main point is that this does really show that you cant trust anyone or many people in eve which tbh is kinda sad lz --------------------------------------------- no sig for you !!!
Gallente McNuggets	Posted - 2007.09.15 12:05:00 - [120] You gave someone else your login details. End of story.
Gallente McNuggets	Posted - 2007.09.15 12:28:00 - [121] Originally by: Bklyn 1 Regardless of the EULA and technicalities. The fact remains that if they had an agreement and one person broke the agreement, that person (assuming he doesn't get banned due to the technicalities) is in the wrong. Such is the internet, where people hide in the anonymity to do things they would never do in real life. I believe people's true selves come out in just such a situation. The fact also remains that although it involves an Eve Account, the issue itself lies outside the bounds of the game since it's to do with giving away of account details - a real life agreement between two real people. Therefore it should not be on this forum. If anything, it's a civil breach of contract. =P
Aaron	Posted - 2007.09.15 14:06:00 - [122] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron the OP clearly states there was a condition where if he comes back he wants his account and character back, I dont like the way the thief is quoting all this EULA nonsense, so your saying that the verbal agreement you had with your "friend" meant nothing? CCP should do the right thing and return the character to its rightful owner, If a friend of mine asked me to keep an eye on his character id have done it and returned it to him if he asked for it back. Does that make me stupid? dude i don't care what you think you don't have to believe me at all you don't have to believe anything but here are the facts quoted from the my account screen on the eve-online site when you login: "Account Ownership: The original owner of an account is firstly, the owner of the boxed CD key, and in case of online purchase the original creator of an account. Accounts can not change ownership. If you have received an account second hand, the original owner can still claim ownership of this account. Note that accounts transferred before May 18th 2004 are exempt from this rule, as account transfers were allowed before that time. Characters can be transfered through the Character Transfer service, to another valid account. This is the only valid procedure to attain ownership of an character. Passwords are the responsibility of the account owner. If a shared password leads to abuse of the account, it is the responsibility of the account owner and customer support cannot reimburse the loss." that says that the account is his but they *CANNOT* do anything about the chacter now go away this is pointless ccp's own rules says that's not gunna happen and ive already recieved a punishment for account shareing so this is all over you can go away now... bye bye carry on kidding yourself, I feel compelled to atempt to arbitrate this issue, as the arbiter i think that the rightful account owner should pay ú150 GBP to the thief to get his character back, show us your heart is not completely made of stone. Are you prepared to do this? or is there any agreement we can come to?
Scott Ryder	Posted - 2007.09.15 14:21:00 - [123] Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud First of all einhander, you sound like a kid. But im guessing you arent. If ive gotten it right, you guys was rl friends? If i was your friend i would punch you in the face or break your ribbs or something.. just saying you deserve a serius beating :)
Snackerlfang	Posted - 2007.09.15 15:49:00 - [124] ban both characters imo. Losing a real friend over a game is a damn shame. Obviously both kids who haven't learnt the true lessons of life yet. Material gain is nothing to lose friends or family over, just isn't worth it. By hitting both characters (not the accounts) with a ban stick it will send a clear message that the EULA is enforced by the moderators and no excuses are felt. That is what I would do, if in this situation.
nova strikin Ganja Labs Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.15 20:06:00 - [125] god this has turned into a flame fest..... just because the op says something doesn't make it so. the only ppl who know are ein and bmtl. sorry but bmtl if you wanted to come back to eve you should have been smart and not given ur info to some 1 you met on the internet. why does every 1 think these guys are friends irl? if i was going to loan some 1 money to some 1 i met on the internet i would not give them all the vitals on a credit card . that is just STUPID. if you wanted to loan the acount YOU should have been SMART, and figured out a better way. but all you have is he said shes said agreement , which is worth the paper its written on.
W1ck3d 8uZz Amarr	Posted - 2007.09.15 20:11:00 - [126] Golden that's no picture, tiss a comic book :D
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.15 20:16:00 - [127] Have you people ever heard of email? Do you really need to drag your crap through the forums leaving a trail of stinking filth? Answer: No. Quit being drama *****s. All of you involved.
C601	Posted - 2007.09.16 04:44:00 - [128] Originally by: Rikeka Bann them all. ^^^
Wizie Minmatar e X i l e FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.16 04:50:00 - [129] Anyone else see the pictures on 4chan of the kid who was chopped up after stealing something in the MMO tibia? Guy sawed off his legs and left the kid at the door of his house. ----------------- Sig removed by some noob
Agent Li Caldari Galactic Defence Consortium	Posted - 2007.09.16 06:01:00 - [130] Originally by: Golden Helmet Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? Yes, it is. I'm not going to pretend to deny that. Regardless of EULA violations though, I think it's a rather low thing to steal years of work from a friend like that. Really goes to show, "Trust Nobody." If I were the GMs, I would vaporize both accounts, and permaban both of them for EULA violations. How's that? ------------------ "Don't be afraid to take advantage of your enemy's weaknesses. Becasuse winning is everything after all."
Akile	Posted - 2007.09.16 06:31:00 - [131] Quote: # You may not transfer any characters whose attributes are, in whole or in part, developed, or which own items, objects or currency obtained or acquired, in violation of the EULA. EULA Section 3, #3. So did he break the EULA? EULA Section 2, B Quote: You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the password of anyone else. EULA Section 2, B Quote: You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else. So he violated the EULA twice by logging into the game and the website, just by accessing the account. So so far the character transfer should be void, and undone. Just to go into it a little bit more... EULA Section 3 Quote: You are not permitted to transfer your account to another person. EULA Section 3, 1 Quote: You may not offer to transfer characters except your own, or act as a "broker" or intermediary (for compensation or otherwise) for anyone wishing to transfer or obtain characters. From the account managment page: Quote: # The original owner of an account is firstly, the owner of the boxed CD key, and in case of online purchase the original creator of an account. # Accounts can not change ownership. If you have received an account second hand, the original owner can still claim ownership of this account. Meaning, the second party, never had ownership of the account. Considering that the ownership can NEVER change. From the EULA you cannot transfer a character from an account you don't have ownership over. So the EULA states the character transfer is void, and should be undone. However, it doesn't matter how much you escalate this. The GM's DO NOT CARE AND WILL NOT EVER UNDO THE CHARACTER TRANSFER. How do I know this? I lost my main the same way two years ago. Put all the clauses in my petition stating that the character transfer should be undone, and what did I get? "We will now close this here petition as solved and further mails on the subject will be closed without reply." Do yourself a favor and never trust anyone, especially CCP.
trimdonite	Posted - 2007.09.16 09:02:00 - [132] Edited by: trimdonite on 16/09/2007 09:05:50 Edited by: trimdonite on 16/09/2007 09:03:43 is it me, or is the average age of the eve player getting lower? Seriously, reading through this, some of these guys seem like a bunch of primary school kids. Personally i think the character should be transferred back then both players handed a ban. Yes its one persons fault for handing the account details over but its the other persons stupid fault for paying for it so he can't use that excuse. But anyway, i know a few friends login details, not that i have used their accounts, we've just logged in on the same pc and i know their pass. Does this now mean i can go in, steal all their goods, then steal their characters, makes billions of isk selling them, all without fear of ccp intervention?
kimish	Posted - 2007.09.16 09:18:00 - [133] Originally by: d1v1n1ty Sharing an account though...isn't that a violation of the EULA? yes it is, and it clearly states that ccp do NOT help with anything about the account if you freely have given your account name/pass out. besides i understand the guy 100% because in eve, you can¦t replace a charecter, you will need to use the excat same amount of time to get it back up to it¦s ss sp again, SP that you have PAYID rl cash and time to get. the whole part with him even making the deal, knowing that it is a ******* deal for the poor guy that would then do him a clean out favour (unless he pay for the intire game time while the loner plays). _____ _____ "When the moderators are gone, the trolls dances on the table."
Buyerr	Posted - 2007.09.16 09:23:00 - [134] Originally by: Scott Ryder Originally by: einhander0004 Originally by: Aaron It sounds like the gm that dealt with this case is trying to make an example of your mate, Your friend made a pettition stating his case, the GM knew full well it was the character he was after, but he put back the account without the character, I think the GM should be flamed for rubbing salt into the wound, the GM should have just explained that your mate he cant get back the character and recommended it be raised with a senior GM, I can just imagine your mates heart sinking when he goes to open his reclaimed account and finds the character not there. Fair enough, the EULA does state clearly not to share any account, but come on its hardly a criminal offence asking your mate to keep your character going while you take a break. As for the character theif, your attitude sucks, and i dont know how u sleep at night. omg let me explain... again so you can understand READ IT THIS TIME DUDE : the character was GIVEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!! it was NOT stolen get that thru your head ... and the GM was following the rules fyi EULA sates that it's his responsibility and so he will not get his char back... BUT the EULA also sates that you cannot give an account away so the account it always his but the character, under the rules of EULA is now MINE BECAUSE HE GAVE TO ME AND I DON"T WANT TO GIVE IT BACK!!! so you understand now? no because you probly just go to every thread and post "bann them all" or "ban him" or something like that just going around sencelessly flameing everything for no reason.. play the game for cryin out loud First of all einhander, you sound like a kid. But im guessing you arent. If ive gotten it right, you guys was rl friends? If i was your friend i would punch you in the face or break your ribbs or something.. just saying you deserve a serius beating :) hehe yer, that is another thing, RL freinds DO NOT ** each others over.. i would freaking beat the out of the so called RL freind if he was so illoyal to try to ** me over holding his hand over some "eula" made by some game, over the normal logic of rl.
kimish	Posted - 2007.09.16 09:25:00 - [135] Originally by: Snackerlfang ban both characters imo. Losing a real friend over a game is a damn shame. Obviously both kids who haven't learnt the true lessons of life yet. Material gain is nothing to lose friends or family over, just isn't worth it. By hitting both characters (not the accounts) with a ban stick it will send a clear message that the EULA is enforced by the moderators and no excuses are felt. That is what I would do, if in this situation. actually agree to this, since it is a eula break that is banneble (either if he steals his account, or if he is lend the account). so ban both char and account,. _____ _____ "When the moderators are gone, the trolls dances on the table."
Buyerr	Posted - 2007.09.16 09:30:00 - [136] Originally by: Akile Quote: # You may not transfer any characters whose attributes are, in whole or in part, developed, or which own items, objects or currency obtained or acquired, in violation of the EULA. EULA Section 3, #3. So did he break the EULA? EULA Section 2, B Quote: You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the password of anyone else. EULA Section 2, B Quote: You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else. So he violated the EULA twice by logging into the game and the website, just by accessing the account. So so far the character transfer should be void, and undone. Just to go into it a little bit more... EULA Section 3 Quote: You are not permitted to transfer your account to another person. EULA Section 3, 1 Quote: You may not offer to transfer characters except your own, or act as a "broker" or intermediary (for compensation or otherwise) for anyone wishing to transfer or obtain characters. From the account managment page: Quote: # The original owner of an account is firstly, the owner of the boxed CD key, and in case of online purchase the original creator of an account. # Accounts can not change ownership. If you have received an account second hand, the original owner can still claim ownership of this account. Meaning, the second party, never had ownership of the account. Considering that the ownership can NEVER change. From the EULA you cannot transfer a character from an account you don't have ownership over. So the EULA states the character transfer is void, and should be undone. However, it doesn't matter how much you escalate this. The GM's DO NOT CARE AND WILL NOT EVER UNDO THE CHARACTER TRANSFER. How do I know this? I lost my main the same way two years ago. Put all the clauses in my petition stating that the character transfer should be undone, and what did I get? "We will now close this here petition as solved and further mails on the subject will be closed without reply." Do yourself a favor and never trust anyone, especially CCP. sad but true, ccp arn¦t following the rules THEY made. Originally by: trimdonite Edited by: trimdonite on 16/09/2007 09:05:50 Edited by: trimdonite on 16/09/2007 09:03:43 is it me, or is the average age of the eve player getting lower? Seriously, reading through this, some of these guys seem like a bunch of primary school kids. Personally i think the character should be transferred back then both players handed a ban. Yes its one persons fault for handing the account details over but its the other persons stupid fault for paying for it so he can't use that excuse. But anyway, i know a few friends login details, not that i have used their accounts, we've just logged in on the same pc and i know their pass. Does this now mean i can go in, steal all their goods, then steal their characters, makes billions of isk selling them, all without fear of ccp intervention? have been going down hills the last 1-2 years.. sadly. but this is not a age problem, but is because of the lag of consequence for your bad behaviour. no consequnce=ASSWIPES doing stupid ****.

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Good job Ein!