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Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 15:56:00 - [1] I think missions are way to easy, especially after you learn them. Even then you don't need to learn them if you got a decent tank and dps. Stop catering to 2m battleship pilots whining they cant do lvl 4's please. Originally you(CCP) wanted groups to do these lvl 4's, instead you've made it so anyone can. For the poll just /sign if you agree there too easy..
Ty Hem Rage Academy oooh Shiny	Posted - 2007.09.17 16:08:00 - [2] Now they have L5 missions for groups. Better ask CCP to buff those.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 16:11:00 - [3] L5's are low-sec pirate bait. The rewards are a joke. And stay on topic !
Weeka Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.09.17 16:45:00 - [4] Originally by: Kailiani L5's are low-sec pirate bait. The rewards are a joke. And stay on topic ! What he said is actually on topic, as he suggested to buff those lvl 5 missions somehow. I'd suggest that the mechnism to do missions cooperative should be enhanced, ere we take a look at making them harder to do. The current system, not knowing who is being shot from what, and drones and spawns playing agro roulette, boils pretty much down to this : Doing missions with multiple players net in doing a mission with ships that could do them on there own, too .. it's just a tad faster doing two missions with two people than doing 1 mission each on his own, and maybe less boring. And people with low skillpoints doing lvl 4 missions is rather stupid.. they take forever, are still risky and I assume someone doing it with 2 mil sp will be rather poor soon.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 17:48:00 - [5] Edited by: Kailiani on 17/09/2007 17:50:31 Ok, your right the topic doesn't specify mission level, but I was talking about lvl 4's. And I'm on Angel extravaganze right now, in the 5th room. I'm only using 2 hardeners. 1 CN ballistic hardener, 1 CN explosive hardener, and 2 PDU for a tank... don't even need to mention the booster because I haven't used it yet. My shield dipped down to 37%(was already around 50%) on the 4th room. yaaawwwwwnnnn........ 5th room almost done and I've completed the mission w/o using a booster.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.09.17 18:35:00 - [6] Originally by: Kailiani Edited by: Kailiani on 17/09/2007 17:50:31 Ok, your right the topic doesn't specify mission level, but I was talking about lvl 4's. And I'm on Angel extravaganze right now, in the 5th room. I'm only using 2 hardeners. 1 CN ballistic hardener, 1 CN explosive hardener, and 2 PDU for a tank... don't even need to mention the booster because I haven't used it yet. My shield dipped down to 37%(was already around 50%) on the 4th room. yaaawwwwwnnnn........ 5th room almost done and I've completed the mission w/o using a booster. You're using faction hardeners on a shield tank and complaining that a primarily explosive dps mission is too easy? Can you say, "3p33n 5tr0k3"? Just stop posting. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets do not.
Yurii Chan	Posted - 2007.09.17 18:47:00 - [7] why dont you go do the 6th room? lets see that purty CN tank hold up to the dps there. tho i'd supposed you'd only come back to the forum whinning that lvl 4 missions are too hard? tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next?
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 19:05:00 - [8] Edited by: Kailiani on 17/09/2007 19:13:02 Edited by: Kailiani on 17/09/2007 19:09:20 Quote: You're using faction hardeners on a shield tank and complaining that a primarily explosive dps mission is too easy? Can you say, "3p33n 5tr0k3"? Just stop posting. In no way am I bragging or proud of this. I see no way it'd be difficult on a armor tank either. If you kill the battleships last, your fighting at most 8 ships at once, and they spawn 50+KM away and the BS's orbit at ~8km, which I presume is where there optimal is... so it's pathetically easy and slightly harder on a armor tanked for explosive. My 3p33n is growing to gigantic proportions, I'd better stop before it explodes ffs. Oh, and I did do the last room. Where I actually redocked to take off painters for tank before going in. Is this the biggest challenge? It was atleast chipping off some shield until I killed enuff of em. pffff... Quote: tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next? I enjoy it and hate it, depending who explodes. You think I only run missions? perhaps you should stay on topic.
Benny Hill Caldari Deceased Inc	Posted - 2007.09.17 19:13:00 - [9] Originally by: Kailiani L5's are low-sec pirate bait. The rewards are a joke. And stay on topic ! CCP ignoring gate guns and making scanning to 30 seconds and allowing anything to go through a gate has made low sec bait.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God	Posted - 2007.09.17 19:15:00 - [10] Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 17/09/2007 19:15:10 If you read the dev blogs you will see how missions are changing in Trinity.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 19:28:00 - [11] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 17/09/2007 19:15:10 If you read the dev blogs you will see how missions are changing in Trinity. Ill take a look, thanks. Nice sig btw
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.09.17 20:21:00 - [12] Lev 4 missions are fine on average. Granted there is some yawnfests out there, but angel vaganza is fine. It is not hard if you know what you are doing and are properly fitted, but it is challenging for low sp and/or turret pilots. You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens. If you are after challenge then you might try some other battleships or even HAC for level 4 missions. Or try lev 5 if you only after entertainment and not isk, altho if you would ask me I would suggest looking for other ways than PvE for entertainment
Pavachek Secundus Secundus Salvage	Posted - 2007.09.17 20:40:00 - [13] Originally by: Carniflex You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens... QFT I thought that all Ravens came with upgraded pods that play elevator music and dispense warm milk to make your missioning experience as comfortable and painless as possible. Carniflex is absolutely correct - your choice of ship is at the root of your problem.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 20:43:00 - [14] Originally by: Carniflex Lev 4 missions are fine on average. Granted there is some yawnfests out there, but angel vaganza is fine. It is not hard if you know what you are doing and are properly fitted, but it is challenging for low sp and/or turret pilots. You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens. If you are after challenge then you might try some other battleships or even HAC for level 4 missions. Or try lev 5 if you only after entertainment and not isk, altho if you would ask me I would suggest looking for other ways than PvE for entertainment The problem is my 'faction' tank was only 2 CN hardeners(no better then T2 in resists...), and 2 T2 pdu, thats it. I beat the entire mission with that as a tank. Unless your dumb enough to keep attacking BS's first it won't be difficult for a low SP player... In massive attack I resort to a drake with 4 T2 BCU's, an afterburner.. and just burn through it with 90% shields.
Yurii Chan	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:09:00 - [15] Edited by: Yurii Chan on 17/09/2007 21:11:04 Originally by: Kailiani Oh, and I did do the last room. Where I actually redocked to take off painters for tank before going in. Is this the biggest challenge? It was atleast chipping off some shield until I killed enuff of em. pffff... Quote: tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next? I enjoy it and hate it, depending who explodes. You think I only run missions? perhaps you should stay on topic. tell you what, since you have such uber skills and pwn missions so hard that it makes them seem easy, try doing the missions in a cruiser. if that still proves to be too easy for your taste then run it in a bloody noobship. if its a challenge you're after, stop asking for handouts and make it challenging for yourself. if its more isk you're wanting then. . . NO Lvl 4 are as they are, like it or find something else
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:19:00 - [16] Originally by: Yurii Chan Lvl 4 are as they are, like it or find something else Not really, CCP changes them every once in a while, perhaps even every patch. If you haven't noticed the changes you can, for example, yawn while killing the ships in Recon 1/3.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Pavachek Secundus Originally by: Carniflex You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens... QFT I thought that all Ravens came with upgraded pods that play elevator music and dispense warm milk to make your missioning experience as comfortable and painless as possible. Carniflex is absolutely correct - your choice of ship is at the root of your problem. Isn't that what I said? ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets do not.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:38:00 - [18] Originally by: Yurii Chan Edited by: Yurii Chan on 17/09/2007 21:11:04 Originally by: Kailiani Oh, and I did do the last room. Where I actually redocked to take off painters for tank before going in. Is this the biggest challenge? It was atleast chipping off some shield until I killed enuff of em. pffff... Quote: tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next? I enjoy it and hate it, depending who explodes. You think I only run missions? perhaps you should stay on topic. tell you what, since you have such uber skills and pwn missions so hard that it makes them seem easy, try doing the missions in a cruiser. if that still proves to be too easy for your taste then run it in a bloody noobship. if its a challenge you're after, stop asking for handouts and make it challenging for yourself. if its more isk you're wanting then. . . NO Lvl 4 are as they are, like it or find something else Lol, the only reason I'd get more isk would be because there wouldn't be a 10000 noobs collecting the same loot as me. Lvl 4's should be impossible to solo in the first place regardless of faction equipment, instead even a few mill sp player can do most of them. I'm asking for handouts because I want harder missions? Hahahha.
Yurii Chan	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:53:00 - [19] Originally by: Kailiani Originally by: Yurii Chan Edited by: Yurii Chan on 17/09/2007 21:11:04 Originally by: Kailiani Oh, and I did do the last room. Where I actually redocked to take off painters for tank before going in. Is this the biggest challenge? It was atleast chipping off some shield until I killed enuff of em. pffff... Quote: tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next? I enjoy it and hate it, depending who explodes. You think I only run missions? perhaps you should stay on topic. tell you what, since you have such uber skills and pwn missions so hard that it makes them seem easy, try doing the missions in a cruiser. if that still proves to be too easy for your taste then run it in a bloody noobship. if its a challenge you're after, stop asking for handouts and make it challenging for yourself. if its more isk you're wanting then. . . NO Lvl 4 are as they are, like it or find something else Lol, the only reason I'd get more isk would be because there wouldn't be a 10000 noobs collecting the same loot as me. Lvl 4's should be impossible to solo in the first place regardless of faction equipment, instead even a few mill sp player can do most of them. I'm asking for handouts because I want harder missions? Hahahha. handouts are handouts even those that may seem illogical to some. the means to make missions harder are there, you're just too lazy to think outside the box or find it easy to whine on the forums. as for missions having been changed earlier this year, big deal. they were no harder before. only difference really is that now the respawns might aggro something else.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:03:00 - [20] L1 are the "right amount" of hard generally. Same thing for most of the L2s and L3, actually. L4s might have been first intended for groups, but that idea was scrapped before L4 missions even came out, and now we do have group missions, in L5s. Out of all <= L4 missions however, there are a couple of missions that DO stand out as "way too much" for the average. I'm speaking mainly of "The Blockade" and "Worlds Collide", and to a lesser degree the "against enemy empire" missions (midst of deadspace, enemies abound). Heck, a L1 WC is a death sentence to any genuine new pilot that FIRST encounters it, and if he's very unlucky, it might be one of the earliest. The L4 EA1/5 (or if pilot survives it, EA 5/5) is pretty much the same thing, a death sentence. There's also the issues with "the extravaganzas", which might take a bit too long, but they're neither easy nor hard. Most of the L4s could stand to be harder, but then again, so do some of the L3s. If anything, I'd bump EA/Midst into the L5 category, and L1-L3 WC/Blockade one level higher, L2-L4. Then, I'd slightly increase the enemies in most others, and slighty decrease in extravaganzas. Last but not least, I'd finally fix the freaking BROKEN REWARD BALANCING SYSTEM WHENEVER GANG COMPLETION IS INVOLVED, BY SIMPLY MULTIPLYING THE COMPLETION TIME WITH (GANGMEMBERS^1.1) or something like that, because it's destroying the balance otherwise. ___ But the whole "missions too easy" and stuff debate might be moot. We ARE getting shedloads of mission changes and new missions in a month or two. _ [CNVTF] is recruiting \| Char creation guide \| Stack-nerfing explained
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:06:00 - [21] And I hope you ARE aware of the fact you can run L5s in highsec. _ [CNVTF] is recruiting \| Char creation guide \| Stack-nerfing explained
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:12:00 - [22] Originally by: Yurii Chan Originally by: Kailiani Originally by: Yurii Chan Edited by: Yurii Chan on 17/09/2007 21:11:04 Originally by: Kailiani Oh, and I did do the last room. Where I actually redocked to take off painters for tank before going in. Is this the biggest challenge? It was atleast chipping off some shield until I killed enuff of em. pffff... Quote: tell you what, if they're too easy for you, try something else. I hear that pvp is hard, perhaps you should try that next? I enjoy it and hate it, depending who explodes. You think I only run missions? perhaps you should stay on topic. tell you what, since you have such uber skills and pwn missions so hard that it makes them seem easy, try doing the missions in a cruiser. if that still proves to be too easy for your taste then run it in a bloody noobship. if its a challenge you're after, stop asking for handouts and make it challenging for yourself. if its more isk you're wanting then. . . NO Lvl 4 are as they are, like it or find something else Lol, the only reason I'd get more isk would be because there wouldn't be a 10000 noobs collecting the same loot as me. Lvl 4's should be impossible to solo in the first place regardless of faction equipment, instead even a few mill sp player can do most of them. I'm asking for handouts because I want harder missions? Hahahha. handouts are handouts even those that may seem illogical to some. the means to make missions harder are there, you're just too lazy to think outside the box or find it easy to whine on the forums. as for missions having been changed earlier this year, big deal. they were no harder before. only difference really is that now the respawns might aggro something else. I'm sure CCP wanted us to find out ways to make the missions harder for ourselves, like flying cruisers.. I just want missions harder so people gang up to do them, which will only cut profits if I don't think its worth risking soloing, so again how am I asking for handouts. I just think you like how you can beat them yourself quick and easy, you don't want your already gotten handout taken from you thats it.
Thrus Caldari United Tactical Operations and Manufacturing Sempiternus	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:12:00 - [23] You may be right with the idea of them being easy in a raven. espicaly AE as I have done that solo (not last room) in a named setup and around 2 mil sp. the raven realy is a bit of i win in missions but to cure that they have to make changes that will likely make it even worse at PvP. some do them in drone boats and that also makes them easy but CCP focuses on the balance on the PvP aspect as it is what will cause more people to yell then a PvE imbalance. CCP may have originaly wanted L4 to be a group event but, to be honest originaly there were not L5 missions. also they are chosing to strenghten the rats and cut down on quanity in missions in the name of speed. and as we run more missions we learn the best way to tank them, the real trick would be to setup one tank and ammo setup and never change it throughout missions. as long as we refit for each one we will always have the advantage.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:15:00 - [24] Originally by: Akita T And I hope you ARE aware of the fact you can run L5s in highsec. You gotta wait 4 hours each time you get a lowsec one though... but thats borderline exploit.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:27:00 - [25] If all people in the gang have access to the agent (and they usually do), with 5 members you get 10 tries, then you have to wait 4 hours. Out of 10 mission offers, you got to find at least one or two to fill the four hours _ [CNVTF] is recruiting \| Char creation guide \| Stack-nerfing explained
Callthetruth Caldari Drunken Ratbags Inc	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:42:00 - [26] more randomness is the biggie
Hephaesteus Gallente	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:43:00 - [27] Originally by: Carniflex but it is challenging for low sp and/or turret pilots. It's only a challenge to low sp pilots, with a Mega and 425 T2 rails it's fairly easy as well.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:10:00 - [28] Edited by: Qui Shon on 17/09/2007 23:14:27 Originally by: Akita T Out of all <= L4 missions however, there are a couple of missions that DO stand out as "way too much" for the average. And that's how it should be. There should be missions inteded for solo BS's that do present at least something of a challenge to the best pilots. The same goes for lower levels and their corresponding ship classes. That means it's "too much" for the average, until they get above average. The only thing I agree with you on is Lvl 1 WC. Moving it to Lvl 2 could be a good idea. The rest are easy enough, and many could imo be made a little tougher. I consider myself average for mish Domi now, at best, and I haven't had much trouble in Lvl4's for a while. I'm also most certainly not "stroking" any "p33ns" here as my "stupid move" report below will show. Originally by: Qui's stupid move report I took on my share of "before I was ready for them" missions. Losses include my first T1 Drake to a Blood BS group in Lvl 3 10/10 mish (I know you don't have to destroy them, but c'mon, it's like killing Drizzt in Baldurs Gate 1 or going up the hill in the first mutant mission in Fallout Tactics. Since you know it is possible it has to be done, no excuses.) Lost my second Drake, now with rigs and DG res amps, on it's maiden voyage the next day to the same BS group, though this time I fell asleep approaching them, since I had decided to try it out after a lenghty bar night. Several Arbys on both ships, the DG amps and an uninsured Drake hurt something fierce at the time, but that's the way it's supposed to be, harsh for the stoopid/careless. My first two armor tanking Myrms on the same day to Lvl3's, because I had no cap skills nor armor skills. Then another two shield Myrms when I couldn't wait for armor and Domi skills to try my hand at level 4's. One to Serpentis room in WC after drones shot the spy ship and I got full aggro, the other to some Guristas mission when I intentionally got full aggro but mistakenly thought I had turned on my Invul. EA 5/5 ate my first T1 Domi, and some mission with a Gallente Navy Mega got my second T1 Domi. I've yet to loose a T2 Domi, though. knocks on wood I did foolish things and didn't have skills and as a result I lost ships. That's how it's supposed to be. I'm still at Large Hybrids 3, BS 3, Sentry 4, yet I can solo every L4 I've come across, with the reservation that I haven't soloed EA 5/5 yet. I switched to Minnie/Gal so it won't be the same, if they even give out that mission. I think there should be (highsec) missions I can not solo, at present skill levels. This seems not to be the case. Originally by: Akita But the whole "missions too easy" and stuff debate might be moot. We ARE getting shedloads of mission changes and new missions in a month or two. Let's hope so. I'll keep my fingers crossed they realize and agree with what someone said on this board: Higher difficulty means increased risk of death, not increased time spent getting bored with wave after wave of weak dps but strong tank npc's.
Yurii Chan	Posted - 2007.09.18 00:30:00 - [29] Originally by: Kailiani rabble rabble. . . I'm sure CCP wanted us to find out ways to make the missions harder for ourselves, like flying cruisers..Rolling Eyes. . . no, but im sure they intended to make a game so that they have a bunch of whiners ***** and moan about things being too easy/too hard rather than use their god given brains to make their own experience. eve is a sandbox, use it as best you can or gtfo of the sand and let someone else get dirty. and fyi, if ccp ever decided to make missions harder i'd simply buy more faction/officer gear or find other past time for the slow pvp days.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.18 01:00:00 - [30] Quote: and fyi, if ccp ever decided to make missions harder i'd simply buy more faction/officer gear or find other past time for the slow pvp days. Just what I thought, you don't want your easy solo mode handout to be taken away. You might have to get find some friends to gang up with.
Aurran Beasts of Burden YouWhat	Posted - 2007.09.18 01:10:00 - [31] Originally by: Carniflex Lev 4 missions are fine on average. Granted there is some yawnfests out there, but angel vaganza is fine. It is not hard if you know what you are doing and are properly fitted, but it is challenging for low sp and/or turret pilots. You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens. If you are after challenge then you might try some other battleships or even HAC for level 4 missions. Or try lev 5 if you only after entertainment and not isk, altho if you would ask me I would suggest looking for other ways than PvE for entertainment QFT. You are asking CCP to make missions harder when you do them in a faction fitted Raven, the BS that does them the best? You want a challenge, try running them in a HAC like he says. If CCP make missions HARD for the Raven they'll be unplayable or close to it for other ships, especially Amarr since they need tons of cap to run their tank and guns.
Kailiani Fracked Up beyond All Recognition	Posted - 2007.09.18 02:51:00 - [32] Edited by: Kailiani on 18/09/2007 02:54:21 Originally by: Aurran Originally by: Carniflex Lev 4 missions are fine on average. Granted there is some yawnfests out there, but angel vaganza is fine. It is not hard if you know what you are doing and are properly fitted, but it is challenging for low sp and/or turret pilots. You see, not all people do missions in faction tanked ravens. If you are after challenge then you might try some other battleships or even HAC for level 4 missions. Or try lev 5 if you only after entertainment and not isk, altho if you would ask me I would suggest looking for other ways than PvE for entertainment QFT. You are asking CCP to make missions harder when you do them in a faction fitted Raven, the BS that does them the best? You want a challenge, try running them in a HAC like he says. If CCP make missions HARD for the Raven they'll be unplayable or close to it for other ships, especially Amarr since they need tons of cap to run their tank and guns. Get rid of drone aggro and webbers. It hardly affects raven but is a big disavantage for turret and drone users. And give amarr high percentage of sansha/drone/blood(and fix bloodraider nos) missions. Anything to balance it out.. then make the missions harder overall. Amarr are borked period on cap usage, so moot point. Also its not like you cant train caldari... like we gotta train gallente to solo pvp... lol
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.09.18 06:28:00 - [33] Originally by: Kailiani Also its not like you cant train caldari... like we gotta train gallente to solo pvp... lol Then why stop there. I run them in pair of faction fitted CNR's. Not for challenge but for isk. Let's make em all hard enough so I'm still able to do them 'for challenge' and ... you know it's not like you can't buy CNR and train second (or third) account so no need to let them be soloed in only single raven under 30 mil SP. Right ? Fortunately PvE enviroment is not designed for for my personal entertainment but for empire population to have income other than mining yourself into comatose. 'Challenge' factor is quite ok for them. You can lose ships if you do foolish things, even faction fitted CNR's can die in some lev 4 missions if you don't have clue what you are doing. PS. Solo PvP is myth. If you really really want to tho there is few caldary ships that work out ok in that section also. If you pick your fights with brains not some other bodyparts You might not be as effective in some situations than other races, but you can get the job done. Same as Raven vs other ships in missions.
Law Enforcer	Posted - 2007.09.18 11:04:00 - [34] how about just making current level 5's level 6's and turn level 5 missions into very hard versions of level 4 missions with greatly bumped up LP as a reward.
Sendraks Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.18 12:14:00 - [35] Hmmm, whining about missions being too easy in a CNR. Well that is a new and refreshing revelation. Also new out this day. Water is wet. Fire burns. Yellow snow may not consist entirely of water. You know, level 3 missions are too easy when I do them in an Astarte. OMGZ CCP! Make level 3 missions harder please!!!
Ghan Tylous The Graduates Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.09.18 12:29:00 - [36] level 4 missions are fine. Do level 5 missions if you need a challenge --- It have always fallen to a few to sacrifice for the good of many Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.09.18 13:35:00 - [37] Originally by: Ghan Tylous level 4 missions are fine. Do level 5 missions if you need a challenge Then offer them in highsec, since I for the moment don't plan on doing missions in groups of 8 or more, the suggested method for getting highsec lvl 5's from lowsec agents without 4 hour delays between mission offers.
Sendraks Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.18 13:51:00 - [38] If missions are too easy, your options really are as follows. 1) Start doing level 5s. 2) Try to make the missions more challenging for yourself by flying something other than your current fiting and vessel. The challenge of level 4 missions to players new to them is about right. Certainly they are at the point of being learnable and after a reasonable curve, it is realistic to expect that you'll have mastered them. At which point either you wait for a new challenge or find ways to learn from existing challenges. I would welcome some more level 4 missions to learn, but the fine tuning here needs to be very careful. There is a practical limit to what any solo vessel can do in a mission before it requires a group approach (not unwelcome, but doesn't solve the problem for the solo runner). Otherwise it is basically a case of learning how the mission works and once you've learned it the mission is no longer a challenge.
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.09.18 13:52:00 - [39] Originally by: Qui Shon Originally by: Ghan Tylous level 4 missions are fine. Do level 5 missions if you need a challenge Then offer them in highsec, since I for the moment don't plan on doing missions in groups of 8 or more, the suggested method for getting highsec lvl 5's from lowsec agents without 4 hour delays between mission offers. Then get yourself enough alts with proper standings. Not THAT hard with shared rewards and lev 5 mish needing only corp (or agent personal) standings to use.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.09.18 15:52:00 - [40] Edited by: Qui Shon on 18/09/2007 15:52:46 Originally by: Carniflex Then get yourself enough alts with proper standings. Not THAT hard with shared rewards and lev 5 mish needing only corp (or agent personal) standings to use. You raised the level of sillyness quite out of proportion to my post, you know. My point is simply that each and every persistant universe game should have a wide and balanced spectrum of difficulty in pve available. Looking at this thread, it seems that we now make a jump from AE, EA, WC (which can be soloed without much difficulty by a skillwise mediocre pve Domi pilot (BS 3, Guns 3, Sentries 4, remember?), without faction gear or T2 weapons) to group lowsec missioning or 8 member gangs / alts for highsec L5. That seems like quite a jump in difficulty to me, I'd like to have something in between. Why is that so wrong?
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.09.18 15:59:00 - [41] Edited by: Qui Shon on 18/09/2007 16:00:18 Originally by: Sendraks I would welcome some more level 4 missions to learn, but the fine tuning here needs to be very careful. There is a practical limit to what any solo vessel can do in a mission before it requires a group approach (not unwelcome, but doesn't solve the problem for the solo runner). Otherwise it is basically a case of learning how the mission works and once you've learned it the mission is no longer a challenge. Just make a few tougher missions and make their occurrence rare, or even so that you won't get it twice in the same 4 hours. Newbies, average solo runners and isk prostitutes can decline it and those who want to risk it have that option. Everybody wins, no solo runner problem.

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