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Oh dear! Yet more global warming :(

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Malontra	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:17:00 - [31] Originally by: Death Kill Quote: Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... No. Global warming is a fact. Quote: There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. this is correct. But its 'most likaly' or 90%. That means only a person that doesnt think logical will say otherwise. Then its not a fact now is it. Hypothesis, Theory, or a known Fact which is it? It cant be a fact if its only 90%. At most it can only be a theory. But guess what else is a theory... gravity.
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:19:00 - [32] Originally by: Malontra Originally by: Death Kill Quote: Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... No. Global warming is a fact. Quote: There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. this is correct. But its 'most likaly' or 90%. That means only a person that doesnt think logical will say otherwise. Then its not a fact now is it. Hypothesis, Theory, or a known Fact which is it? It cant be a fact if its only 90%. At most it can only be a theory. But guess what else is a theory... gravity. nothing is 100% fact, theories are about concensous. On global warming we have one. It's happening. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Malontra	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:25:00 - [33] Originally by: Celeste Coeval Originally by: Malontra Originally by: Death Kill Quote: Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... No. Global warming is a fact. Quote: There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. this is correct. But its 'most likaly' or 90%. That means only a person that doesnt think logical will say otherwise. Then its not a fact now is it. Hypothesis, Theory, or a known Fact which is it? It cant be a fact if its only 90%. At most it can only be a theory. But guess what else is a theory... gravity. nothing is 100% fact, theories are about concensous. On global warming we have one. It's happening. Erm... there are infinite 100% facts... take some physics or calculus you'll learn some facts and their proofs. Theories are about proof. Theres no way to prove that global warming exists with 100% certainty, like theres no way to for us to understand gravity even close to 100% without finding the elusive 'graviton'
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:28:00 - [34] Originally by: Malontra Originally by: Celeste Coeval Originally by: Malontra Originally by: Death Kill Quote: Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... No. Global warming is a fact. Quote: There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. this is correct. But its 'most likaly' or 90%. That means only a person that doesnt think logical will say otherwise. Then its not a fact now is it. Hypothesis, Theory, or a known Fact which is it? It cant be a fact if its only 90%. At most it can only be a theory. But guess what else is a theory... gravity. nothing is 100% fact, theories are about concensous. On global warming we have one. It's happening. Erm... there are infinite 100% facts... take some physics or calculus you'll learn some facts and their proofs. Theories are about proof. Theres no way to prove that global warming exists with 100% certainty, like theres no way to for us to understand gravity even close to 100% without finding the elusive 'graviton' lol sure. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Anna Sofia Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:29:00 - [35] not neccessarily related, but it would be pretty cool to know how big the last factor of the drake equation really is :p
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:36:00 - [36] Quote: Researchers who have recently returned from the region found that an area of permafrost spanning a million square kilometres - the size of France and Germany combined - has started to melt for the first time since it formed 11,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age. Which means that this has happened (many times) before, and will happen MANY times after we are all long gone. It's called climate cycles people. Or are all the Mammoth farts to blame for the meltdown of the last ice age? This is the same socialist nonsense propaganda that pops up every 20 years or so. Before we were causing an ice age, then it was ozone, now we're warming the planet. Considering we've been measuring all that stuff to any real scientific degree for less than 50 years, I'm confident that we pitiful life forms will never truly have a long-term effect on this planet. To think otherwise is to have the ultimate Ego (or just a political agenda). Cripes, there have been mass extinction events every few million years. Guess what, we're many million overdue for the next one. Hopefully, the next event will take some doom-and-gloomers with it so that we can all get back to virtually destroying each other in a video game....
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:41:00 - [37] Originally by: Talianas Unger Quote: Researchers who have recently returned from the region found that an area of permafrost spanning a million square kilometres - the size of France and Germany combined - has started to melt for the first time since it formed 11,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age. Which means that this has happened (many times) before, and will happen MANY times after we are all long gone. It's called climate cycles people. Or are all the Mammoth farts to blame for the meltdown of the last ice age? This is the same socialist nonsense propaganda that pops up every 20 years or so. Before we were causing an ice age, then it was ozone, now we're warming the planet. Considering we've been measuring all that stuff to any real scientific degree for less than 50 years, I'm confident that we pitiful life forms will never truly have a long-term effect on this planet. To think otherwise is to have the ultimate Ego (or just a political agenda). Cripes, there have been mass extinction events every few million years. Guess what, we're many million overdue for the next one. Hopefully, the next event will take some doom-and-gloomers with it so that we can all get back to virtually destroying each other in a video game.... people like you make me sad. The ozone problem is still around and it took huge effort by companies around the world to bring down the damage being done to the ozone layer. We pitiful lifeforms can cause mass extinction, and we are doing. If animals could not outcompete each other for resources nothing would evolve ever. Also the mass extinction is what the doom and gloomers are on about...but wait i forget the ignorant will survive what they fail to see...o wait...what? "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:44:00 - [38] Originally by: DarkMatter There could have been hurricanes 10X worse than that 90,000 years ago, but no one was here to catalog that now were they? Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. Let's not get into ridiculous eco frenezy, you're right. By exagerating what's really happening some ecologists only hurt the credibility of their more reasonables workmates. However, a few things can't be argued: - The water temperature on surface is rising. This mean that the zones where the water is warm enough to cause a convection effect on the air, are widening. As the water temperature increase, the convection effect is also more powerfull. In short, the would-be cyclones not only get energy faster, but they also get it longer, and the cold-water zones where they lose some of their energy before hitting landscapes are also smaller. - The polar cap is melting. As a direct result, it's albedo is decreasing, which in turn accelerate it's warming (less light reflected = more light absorbed). We can all argue ourselves blue to know how much artificial or natural the global warming is, but what is certain is that it is at least in part artificial, that it'll get worse, and that without our pollution, some of those who died in recents cyclones would be alive right now... ------------------------------------------ What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs.
DarkMatter Sintered Sanity	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:46:00 - [39] Quote: Also the mass extinction is what the doom and gloomers are on about... Exactly, which is what he is saying we are not causing... And I agree... My Current Project
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:46:00 - [40] Originally by: Celeste Coeval people like you make me sad. The ozone problem is still around and it took huge effort by companies around the world to bring down the damage being done to the ozone layer. We pitiful lifeforms can cause mass extinction, and we are doing. If animals could not outcompete each other for resources nothing would evolve ever. Also the mass extinction is what the doom and gloomers are on about...but wait i forget the ignorant will survive what they fail to see...o wait...what? People like me...you mean scientists? Those with an actual engineering degree in the field that know what they're talking about? Yeah, it sucks when people in the know blow up your political machinations, huh?
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 21:48:00 - [41] Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: DarkMatter There could have been hurricanes 10X worse than that 90,000 years ago, but no one was here to catalog that now were they? Global warming is a theory, just like the Big Bang... There is insufficient data to call global warming a 100% truth. Let's not get into ridiculous eco frenezy, you're right. By exagerating what's really happening some ecologists only hurt the credibility of their more reasonables workmates. However, a few things can't be argued: - The water temperature on surface is rising. This mean that the zones where the water is warm enough to cause a convection effect on the air, are widening. As the water temperature increase, the convection effect is also more powerfull. In short, the would-be cyclones not only get energy faster, but they also get it longer, and the cold-water zones where they lose some of their energy before hitting landscapes are also smaller. - The polar cap is melting. As a direct result, it's albedo is decreasing, which in turn accelerate it's warming (less light reflected = more light absorbed). We can all argue ourselves blue to know how much artificial or natural the global warming is, but what is certain is that it is at least in part artificial, that it'll get worse, and that without our pollution, some of those who died in recents cyclones would be alive right now... What we need is a good dose of global bird flu. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Micheal Dietrich Cynical Cartel	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:00:00 - [42] Originally by: rhumbline Hurricanes or tropical revolving storms are fine by me, they only appear in the band between 10 degrees north and south or so. I live way above that..so no worries. Ok im being facetious a bit. Must admit to noticing that weather in the north sea has generally had larger periods of really,really bad weather than 17 years ago. True it's a personal view, but winters up there aren't much fun, and they seem to be longer, and more violent. Article isnt of use in this topic, but check the piccy in the top right hand corner http://ioc.unesco.org/gpsbulletin/GPS1&2/Vol1article.htm I'm just the opposite of you. I've lived in my area my whole life and I remember waking up to snowy christmas's like 18 years ago. Then it would snow and the snow would stick for a few days and now if it does snow we're lucky to have it for a few hours. Likewise in the summer time we've been seeing less and less rain each year which not only increases our chances for wildfires (which have been in every direction of my house within 50miles this year) but that's less water for our surrounding farmlands and this year some of the newer farmlands kinda got screwed due to water shortage. Not to mention we used to hit mid 90's about 15 years ago and now in the middle of summer we're seeing triple digits more and more. My little valley is starting to turn into the desert that surrounds it. ___________________________ Never Forget, Never Forgive
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:20:00 - [43] Originally by: Talianas Unger Originally by: Celeste Coeval people like you make me sad. The ozone problem is still around and it took huge effort by companies around the world to bring down the damage being done to the ozone layer. We pitiful lifeforms can cause mass extinction, and we are doing. If animals could not outcompete each other for resources nothing would evolve ever. Also the mass extinction is what the doom and gloomers are on about...but wait i forget the ignorant will survive what they fail to see...o wait...what? People like me...you mean scientists? Those with an actual engineering degree in the field that know what they're talking about? Yeah, it sucks when people in the know blow up your political machinations, huh? Then as a scientist show me some evidence and counter my point. Your response is on the whole asking me to place faith in your degree and your opinion without demstrating to me that you are correct. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:33:00 - [44] What I find really amusing is that people think that humanity has even the smallest understanding of our planets weather beyond ~200 years ago. Someone google up the average temperature in Los Angeles around this time of the year back in 553 AD. PLZ!
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:39:00 - [45] Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 17/09/2007 22:38:55 Originally by: Derovius Vaden What I find really amusing is that people think that humanity has even the smallest understanding of our planets weather beyond ~200 years ago. Someone google up the average temperature in Los Angeles around this time of the year back in 553 AD. PLZ! its written into the geology and ice...not to mention the ecosystem. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:43:00 - [46] Originally by: Celeste Coeval Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 17/09/2007 22:38:55 Originally by: Derovius Vaden What I find really amusing is that people think that humanity has even the smallest understanding of our planets weather beyond ~200 years ago. Someone google up the average temperature in Los Angeles around this time of the year back in 553 AD. PLZ! its written into the geology and ice...not to mention the ecosystem. Is it? Last I heard they did best guesses on rain fall and glacial movements through strata. As for ecosystem, same thing. Hell, a few hundred thousand years ago, the planet was covered with an ice sheet. This global warming thing is bigger than we thought, eh?
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:43:00 - [47] Originally by: Celeste Coeval Then as a scientist show me some evidence and counter my point. Your response is on the whole asking me to place faith in your degree and your opinion without demstrating to me that you are correct. Probably 90+% of temperature readings are taken within cities. Cities which have grown exponetially within the last 50 years (and certainly within the last 100). Cities are subject to what is widely known as a "heat island" effect. As cities grow, this effect becomes more and more pronounced. Consequently, temperature "trends" at the surface are inherently flawed, yet this is the type of data used almost exclusively to "prove" manmade global warming. Satellite trends do not substantiate a rapid heat-up (or hardly any heatup at all, for that matter). When faced with this data, global warming proponents poo-poo it, or "adjust" the data. I have yet to see one scrap of research to take this heat-island effect seriously into account. At best, scientists "estimate" it's effect. In other words, they guess, since this effect has only been noted within the last few decades. Next, the ozone layer. One, we are supposing we have fixed it because it has changed size, puportedly in our favor this time. The ozone layer itself was only just being researched in the 60's and 70's I believe. There is no definitive historical basis to say we affected it one way or the other, only more theories. In fact, I would argue that an increase in global temperature will in fact help this "issue" as well. Warmer waters and higher temperatures leads to more storms. Lightning is the KEY producer of ozone for this planet. As a result of more storms, more ozone will be produced. Next, warmer climates is exposing land that has not been farmable in recorded human history ("permafrost" regions). Explain to me why more farmable land, increased rain, and increased CO2 is a bad thing since all three encourage rapid plant growth and food production, in a world that is struggling to feed it's 6.5 billion people. Incidenatlly, most data I have seen indicates a global increase in fauna and flora, despite our best efforts (ex. the brazilian rain forest) to the contrary. Hmmm, could it be all that rain and CO2?? Nahhhhhh. I eagerly await your own scientific analysis....
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:48:00 - [48] Originally by: Talianas Unger Originally by: Celeste Coeval Then as a scientist show me some evidence and counter my point. Your response is on the whole asking me to place faith in your degree and your opinion without demstrating to me that you are correct. Probably 90+% of temperature readings are taken within cities. Cities which have grown exponetially within the last 50 years (and certainly within the last 100). Cities are subject to what is widely known as a "heat island" effect. As cities grow, this effect becomes more and more pronounced. Consequently, temperature "trends" at the surface are inherently flawed, yet this is the type of data used almost exclusively to "prove" manmade global warming. Satellite trends do not substantiate a rapid heat-up (or hardly any heatup at all, for that matter). When faced with this data, global warming proponents poo-poo it, or "adjust" the data. I have yet to see one scrap of research to take this heat-island effect seriously into account. At best, scientists "estimate" it's effect. In other words, they guess, since this effect has only been noted within the last few decades. Next, the ozone layer. One, we are supposing we have fixed it because it has changed size, puportedly in our favor this time. The ozone layer itself was only just being researched in the 60's and 70's I believe. There is no definitive historical basis to say we affected it one way or the other, only more theories. In fact, I would argue that an increase in global temperature will in fact help this "issue" as well. Warmer waters and higher temperatures leads to more storms. Lightning is the KEY producer of ozone for this planet. As a result of more storms, more ozone will be produced. Next, warmer climates is exposing land that has not been farmable in recorded human history ("permafrost" regions). Explain to me why more farmable land, increased rain, and increased CO2 is a bad thing since all three encourage rapid plant growth and food production, in a world that is struggling to feed it's 6.5 billion people. Incidenatlly, most data I have seen indicates a global increase in fauna and flora, despite our best efforts (ex. the brazilian rain forest) to the contrary. Hmmm, could it be all that rain and CO2?? Nahhhhhh. I eagerly await your own scientific analysis.... People are fear mongers, and continuously forget the fact that humanity is but a speck on the ass of the universe, moreover our planet, and the notion that would do something to imbalance such a massive system is foolish. The Earth is not some delicate flower that needs to be talked to, its a ******* shake and bake oven. Something shakes and something bakes.
Surfin's PlunderBunny Minmatar Sicarri Covenant	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:52:00 - [49] haha, just wait till the poles flip... wish I could see into the future and see how people blame that on us too. And it was pretty cold last night, where's my global warming? Originally by: Liz Kali Tic Toc Tic Toc , time is ticking Originally by: TheDagda click For the love of the jovians stops necroing
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:54:00 - [50] Quote: People are fear mongers, and continuously forget the fact that humanity is but a speck on the ass of the universe, moreover our planet, and the notion that would do something to imbalance such a massive system is foolish. The Earth is not some delicate flower that needs to be talked to, its a ******* shake and bake oven. Something shakes and something bakes. I just saw yet another show last night on the Earth, it's orgins and it's histories. I can't even begin to tell you how many times in this planet's past that ALL life has been a breath away from extinction on this planet. Whether due to a global ice age (as in, no exposed land or water at ALL, just ice) or worldwide desertification. Many scientists have claimed that this period is the most stable climate period in eons. Personally I think everyone is just frickin spoiled. If this planet acted like it has in the past, we'd be begging for only the occasional drought, hurricane, or massive volcanic eruption.
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:54:00 - [51] Originally by: Surfin's PlunderBunny haha, just wait till the poles flip... wish I could see into the future and see how people blame that on us too. And it was pretty cold last night, where's my global warming? Emo people don't get global warming, because warming is too happy. You get nothing.
Thanos Draicon	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:56:00 - [52] Originally by: Talianas Unger Originally by: Celeste Coeval Then as a scientist show me some evidence and counter my point. Your response is on the whole asking me to place faith in your degree and your opinion without demstrating to me that you are correct. Probably 90+% of temperature readings are taken within cities. Cities which have grown exponetially within the last 50 years (and certainly within the last 100). Cities are subject to what is widely known as a "heat island" effect. As cities grow, this effect becomes more and more pronounced. Consequently, temperature "trends" at the surface are inherently flawed, yet this is the type of data used almost exclusively to "prove" manmade global warming. Satellite trends do not substantiate a rapid heat-up (or hardly any heatup at all, for that matter). When faced with this data, global warming proponents poo-poo it, or "adjust" the data. Do you honestly believe that legitimate scientistes would know this and take this into account in their studies? This also does not take into account how the temperatures of Siberia have increased by 3 degree Celsius in the past 40 years. Also, provide sources for your claims regarding satellite-based observations. Quote: I have yet to see one scrap of research to take this heat-island effect seriously into account. At best, scientists "estimate" it's effect. In other words, they guess, since this effect has only been noted within the last few decades. Can you explain to me how a "heat island" caused by a city is capable of influencing temperatures of the currents in the Atlantic ocean? Quote: Next, warmer climates is exposing land that has not been farmable in recorded human history ("permafrost" regions). Explain to me why more farmable land, increased rain, and increased CO2 is a bad thing since all three encourage rapid plant growth and food production, in a world that is struggling to feed it's 6.5 billion people. So do you believe that the increased habitability of certain areas makes up for the regions that will suffer from more hostile weather patterns and droughts/crop extinctions as a result. Quote: Incidenatlly, most data I have seen indicates a global increase in fauna and flora, despite our best efforts (ex. the brazilian rain forest) to the contrary. Hmmm, could it be all that rain and CO2?? Nahhhhhh. I eagerly await your own scientific analysis.... I would also like you to cite your sources on that one.
Thanos Draicon	Posted - 2007.09.17 22:57:00 - [53] Edited by: Thanos Draicon on 17/09/2007 22:56:52 Double post, whoops.
Celeste Coeval The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:01:00 - [54] Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 17/09/2007 23:02:00 I'm done banging my head against a brick wall. The trojans were warned what was inside the horse. Lets see what happens then shall we? All the data and anecdotal evidence i have seen states that ALL of the earths support systems are in decline. Your heat island effect can also be contribute to warming as urbanization not only creates heat island but er...it expands into natural carbon sinks...being forests and the like. "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor." -Albert Einstein A blog of truth (not mine)
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:05:00 - [55] Originally by: Celeste Coeval Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 17/09/2007 23:02:00 I'm done banging my head against a brick wall. The trojans were warned what was inside the horse. Lets see what happens then shall we? All the data and anecdotal evidence i have seen states that ALL of the earths support systems are in decline. Your heat island effect can also be contribute to warming as urbanization not only creates heat island but er...it expands into natural carbon sinks...being forests and the like. Quiet 132, and wash my dishes.
Xen Gin The Dragoons X-PACT	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:09:00 - [56] Edited by: Xen Gin on 17/09/2007 23:10:18 Originally by: Malontra Erm... there are infinite 100% facts... take some physics or calculus you'll learn some facts and their proofs. Theories are about proof. Theres no way to prove that global warming exists with 100% certainty, like theres no way to for us to understand gravity even close to 100% without finding the elusive 'graviton' LOL, You shouldn't even be putting an opinion forward in this thread, if its as wrong as what you typed above.
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:12:00 - [57] Originally by: Thanos Draicon Do you honestly believe that legitimate scientistes would know this and take this into account in their studies? This also does not take into account how the temperatures of Siberia have increased by 3 degree Celsius in the past 40 years. Also, provide sources for your claims regarding satellite-based observations. Most scientists today work by grant money. Do you honestly believe some if not many will "discover" whatever their funders want them to find? If not, you're incredibly naive. Second, I don't believe I said that NO areas were warmer. Some are, some aren't. I never even stated that I didn't think the climate was warming. My beef is with the "manmade" crapola, which mainly uses weather stations on the surface and in cities. In terms of sources, do a Google friend. It's widely available and I'm not Dewey Decimal. Quote: Can you explain to me how a "heat island" caused by a city is capable of influencing temperatures of the currents in the Atlantic ocean? Don't believe I ever said it could. I said city surface temperature readings are a farce. Currents change constantly chief. They aren't even the same from when our ancestors started exploring the world in ships 200 years ago. To think that they'll flow in the same manner forever is to have a complete lack of knowledge in how weather and climate work. No offense. Quote: So do you believe that the increased habitability of certain areas makes up for the regions that will suffer from more hostile weather patterns and droughts/crop extinctions as a result? LOL, I love this argument. I really do. "More hostile weather patterns". To whom? The morons in New Orleans that live below Sea Level bordering the ocean and a lake? The millions whom have moved to the coast in the past 100 years (ex. the Netherlands, also under Sea Level)? Don't blame nature for the stupidy of mankind chief. Nature has ALWAYS been violent and unpredictable. It is man's arrogance that has made him think otherwise. I line in Arizona. It used to be 300 feet underwater as part of a prehisoric ocean. Now it's a desert. The Grand Canyon used to be a *** in the earth. Now it's a mile deep. To think weather, climate and nature isn't going to change is ignorance of the highest order. My gosh, things are changing in MY lifetime! How unfair. Well boo-fricking hoo. Adapt or die like the dinosaurs. Quote:** I would also like you to cite your sources on that one. Again, any of the stuff I mention is readily available via a two minute search. I took the time to hunt it down and enlighten myself. The problem is, most people aren't, and would rather suck at the teat of government and "the learned" instead. Look it up.
Derovius Vaden	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:12:00 - [58] Originally by: Malontra Erm... there are infinite 100% facts... take some physics or calculus you'll learn some facts and their proofs. Theories are about proof. Theres no way to prove that global warming exists with 100% certainty, like theres no way to for us to understand gravity even close to 100% without finding the elusive 'graviton' Mathematical proofs? 100% facts? You need to take a philosphy course buddy.
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:15:00 - [59] Quote: The Grand Canyon used to be a ***** in the earth. Now it's a mile deep. Ahahahahahaaa!! They filterd out c-r-a-c-k! Too funny. Man, that made my day. C-r-a-c-k, c-r-a-c-k, C-R-A-C-K!!
Talianas Unger Minmatar Brotherhood of Mithra Black Sheep Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.17 23:17:00 - [60] Originally by: Celeste Coeval Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 17/09/2007 23:02:00 I'm done banging my head against a brick wall. The trojans were warned what was inside the horse. Lets see what happens then shall we? All the data and anecdotal evidence i have seen states that ALL of the earths support systems are in decline. Your heat island effect can also be contribute to warming as urbanization not only creates heat island but er...it expands into natural carbon sinks...being forests and the like. In other words...ya got nuttin.

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