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Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2007.10.07 00:16:00 - [1] Not that I live in these high player count systems, but this is how I see it. Level 4 agents in 0.9 systems like Jita and Rens is just asking for a hot (lag) spot. Minimal risk at maximum gain running level 4 missions. That means a lot of buying power, and where there is a lot of buying power there is a lot of trade. Where there is a lot of trade, there is a lot of people (=lag) Solution ? Move the agents (again) Level 1: 1.0 - 0.8 Level 2: 0.8 - 0.6 Level 3: 0.6 - 0.4 Level 4: 0.4 - 0.2 Level 5: 0.2 - 0.1(0.0) Then agents and the associated trade will be more distributed and there will be less of a tendancy to congregate in a few select locations. -- EVE Tools for cell phones and Windows/linux/Mac systems http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
Tek'a Rain Gallente Isis Technologies	Posted - 2007.10.07 00:32:00 - [2] clever.. Hiding a "Move all lvl 4 agents to let me kill more CNRs" post inside a "Golly, lets take care of that Jita problem!" post.
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2007.10.07 00:45:00 - [3] Originally by: Tek'a Rain clever.. Hiding a "Move all lvl 4 agents to let me kill more CNRs" post inside a "Golly, lets take care of that Jita problem!" post. I've never pirated since I played. Ask anyone, friend or foe that I have played with, or against in over 4 years. Slanderous comment against someone poting with a main. But what I say might also solve the "How do we get a larger part of the population in to low sec" question. If more "capable" people were in low sec, then pirates would have a harder time there, new communities would form to rot them out, and EVE would probably have a few more corporations, alliances and coalitions in low security systems ready to move into 0.0 as their next step. -- EVE Tools for cell phones and Windows/linux/Mac systems http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
Jacque DeCoure	Posted - 2007.10.07 00:47:00 - [4] Let's assume that the lag in Jita would go away if the Agents were moved. Seems reasonable to think atleast some of the lag would.... Why does the conclussion have to be that ALL lvl 4 agents would need to be moved to low-sec just to remove the lag in Jita? There are PLENTY of systems with lvl 4 agents that don't have any lag - so why not just move the Jita agents to some underused systems?
BobBarkerr	Posted - 2007.10.07 00:51:00 - [5] Edited by: BobBarkerr on 07/10/2007 00:52:13 Originally by: Jaabaa Not that I live in these high player count systems, but this is how I see it. Level 4 agents in 0.9 systems like Jita and Rens is just asking for a hot (lag) spot. Minimal risk at maximum gain running level 4 missions. That means a lot of buying power, and where there is a lot of buying power there is a lot of trade. Where there is a lot of trade, there is a lot of people (=lag) Solution ? Move the agents (again) Level 1: 1.0 - 0.8 Level 2: 0.8 - 0.6 Level 3: 0.6 - 0.4 Level 4: 0.4 - 0.2 Level 5: 0.2 - 0.1(0.0) Then agents and the associated trade will be more distributed and there will be less of a tendancy to congregate in a few select locations. i actually made this suggestion just a short while ago in another thread and think it is a good idea. In 00 you should have all agents. the higher you go up in sec status the lower the agents should be. I don't say this because i want to pop mission runners , I say this because it WOULD fix a majority of issues. Besides lvl 4 agents in high sec just seems wrong to me. If you have lvl 4 agents in high sec why not lvl 5 agents? That also brings up another can of worms about bringing cap ships into high sec etc. (We wont go their) edit.. Indeed as the prev poster suggested just remove all agents from jita and prevent any agents from sending a mish into said system. That way you are not dealing with the added mish people killing rats etc.
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2007.10.07 01:01:00 - [6] Edited by: Jaabaa on 07/10/2007 01:01:49 Originally by: Jacque DeCoure Let's assume that the lag in Jita would go away if the Agents were moved. Seems reasonable to think atleast some of the lag would.... Why does the conclussion have to be that ALL lvl 4 agents would need to be moved to low-sec just to remove the lag in Jita? There are PLENTY of systems with lvl 4 agents that don't have any lag - so why not just move the Jita agents to some underused systems? Good point, there are level 4 agents in R&D, Distribution, Marketing, etc. but why shouldn't their runners be in T2 blockade runners in low sec ? Just like the military/security/internal security runners have to be in a battleship(some other tank) to complete a mission ? And to boot, I guess that most of the other level 4 agents are of lower quality, or (more likely), too close to low sec to be profitable, i.e. there is RISK so less ISK. -- EVE Tools for cell phones and Windows/linux/Mac systems http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
Arana Tellen Gallente The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.10.07 01:09:00 - [7] People still mission in high sec? --------------------------------- Core 2 Duo E4300 1.8ghz @ 3ghz, 2GB Gskill DDR2 5400 @ 800mhh 4-4-4-12, Abit fatality mATX F-I90HD @ 334mhz, 8800GTS 320mb 2x250GB 7200.10s Raid 0, Vista 64 Home.
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0	Posted - 2007.10.07 01:10:00 - [8] Originally by: Arana Tellen People still mission in high sec? You'd be amazed howmuch of the total Eve ISK income is generated just from highsec lvl 4 missions. I've run them for quite awhile and tbh, all lvl 4 agents should be moved to lowsec. Paradox V2.0 is recruiting!
Arana Tellen Gallente The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.10.07 01:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Arana Tellen People still mission in high sec? You'd be amazed howmuch of the total Eve ISK income is generated just from highsec lvl 4 missions. I've run them for quite awhile and tbh, all lvl 4 agents should be moved to lowsec. But the level IV agents in low sec are a lot higher quality, its 5000LP vs 9000LP with one level III social skill for the 9000 and two at level 3 for the 5000 --------------------------------- Core 2 Duo E4300 1.8ghz @ 3ghz, 2GB Gskill DDR2 5400 @ 800mhh 4-4-4-12, Abit fatality mATX F-I90HD @ 334mhz, 8800GTS 320mb 2x250GB 7200.10s Raid 0, Vista 64 Home.
SgtDeaux	Posted - 2007.10.07 02:37:00 - [10] OH yes please I will be able too triple my prices overnight suddenly I will go from a one week waiting list too a one month waiting list with high sec huggers begging for my standings Yes CCP lets get this one rolling yesterday!!!

Serenity Steele Dynamic Data Distribution Ministry of Information	Posted - 2007.10.07 02:42:00 - [11] There are level 4 agents in 0.9 sec? That's outrageous. No risk = No reward. That's the true spirit of EvE. Eve Strategic Maps - Outpost Alert - Sovereign Systems - Alliance Rank
Tek'a Rain Gallente Isis Technologies	Posted - 2007.10.07 03:42:00 - [12] Originally by: Jaabaa Originally by: Tek'a Rain clever.. Hiding a "Move all lvl 4 agents to let me kill more CNRs" post inside a "Golly, lets take care of that Jita problem!" post. I've never pirated since I played. Ask anyone, friend or foe that I have played with, or against in over 4 years. Slanderous comment against someone poting with a main. The "me" was, I suppose, a general Me of folks who want missions moved (like pirates responding in this thread already) And I resent the comment that I might be "poting" with something other then a main. More to the point.. the "capable" people, the ones who you want to live in lowsec.. they dont want to be there. They are either in empire, where low risk and middling rewards are the order, or they are in double-o and enjoying what can Still be low risk and high reward. The massive risk potential and crippling lack of tools to create safety, along with only mildly greater rewards then hisec means all the "capable" people skip lowsec. Lowsec is not a wasteland for lack of capable pilots, its a wasteland because its nearly worthless. Breaking the playstyle of missionrunners for a slim, Slim chance to make it worthwhile will not fix anything.
hellsknights Hells Angels Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.07 06:47:00 - [13] This is a great idea, i vote yes..... recruitment thread Join channel Hells Angels Inc
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0	Posted - 2007.10.07 08:04:00 - [14] Originally by: Arana Tellen Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Arana Tellen People still mission in high sec? You'd be amazed howmuch of the total Eve ISK income is generated just from highsec lvl 4 missions. I've run them for quite awhile and tbh, all lvl 4 agents should be moved to lowsec. But the level IV agents in low sec are a lot higher quality, its 5000LP vs 9000LP with one level III social skill for the 9000 and two at level 3 for the 5000 Still those 'crappy' L4 empire agents will generate enough ISK to sustain an eve career on - which is bad. Those who run those agents dont care for the slightly better rewards in lowsec/0.0, they like the complete security that highsec gives them and aren't giving that up easily. Paradox V2.0 is recruiting!
Fuazzole	Posted - 2007.10.07 08:58:00 - [15] war dec the care bears, it's not pirating, it's protesting
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.10.07 10:34:00 - [16] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 07/10/2007 10:35:18 Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Arana Tellen Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Arana Tellen People still mission in high sec? You'd be amazed howmuch of the total Eve ISK income is generated just from highsec lvl 4 missions. I've run them for quite awhile and tbh, all lvl 4 agents should be moved to lowsec. But the level IV agents in low sec are a lot higher quality, its 5000LP vs 9000LP with one level III social skill for the 9000 and two at level 3 for the 5000 Still those 'crappy' L4 empire agents will generate enough ISK to sustain an eve career on - which is bad. Those who run those agents dont care for the slightly better rewards in lowsec/0.0, they like the complete security that highsec gives them and aren't giving that up easily. Also, L4 in highsec with multibillion faction ship = MUCH more fun than with a cheap setup in lowsec. And earns just slightly less, if less at all. (And yes, some people DO have fun running missions, and it does NOT make them subhumans ) And really, I am fairly certain that not agent runners are the main problem in Jita, it is the dozens of suicide gankers bumping everyone outside 4_4... There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.10.07 10:51:00 - [17] yes and no. YES, Moving agents further apart, don't stick multiple hi qual agents into the same system or even within 2 jumps from each other, thats just stoopid and asking for huge blobs and lag in said systems. NO, moving hi qual agents to low sec will do nothing, the missionrunners will just simply move to a lesser qual or level agent rather then beeing forced into low sec. CCP should stop their silly attempts to force people to do anything, they want this game to be a sandbox? then stop it with all the attemps to get people into low sec, it has never worked nor will it ever work, if u think it can u are just kidding urselves. One way, add more hi sec systems, add more L4 agents and spread them out a bit. U can flame me all u want, yell 'omg missionrunning sux, carebears are whimps, bla bla bla' but this is just how it is, I didn't make it to be like this, if u don't like mission runners or carebears, theres no need to be confronted with them anyways, just stay in low/0.0 sec, there are a lot of people who feel the same there so u can shoot each other happily and do what u like most CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:05:00 - [18] Originally by: 000Hunter000 yes and no. YES, Moving agents further apart, don't stick multiple hi qual agents into the same system or even within 2 jumps from each other, thats just stoopid and asking for huge blobs and lag in said systems. NO, moving hi qual agents to low sec will do nothing, the missionrunners will just simply move to a lesser qual or level agent rather then beeing forced into low sec. CCP should stop their silly attempts to force people to do anything, they want this game to be a sandbox? then stop it with all the attemps to get people into low sec, it has never worked nor will it ever work, if u think it can u are just kidding urselves. One way, add more hi sec systems, add more L4 agents and spread them out a bit. U can flame me all u want, yell 'omg missionrunning sux, carebears are whimps, bla bla bla' but this is just how it is, I didn't make it to be like this, if u don't like mission runners or carebears, theres no need to be confronted with them anyways, just stay in low/0.0 sec, there are a lot of people who feel the same there so u can shoot each other happily and do what u like most You're confusing what you want with what you are entitled to. A lot of hi-sec systems with level 4 agents are almost empty. People congregate on a +18 agent and ignore a +14 agent 3 jumps away in an almost empty system. I run level 4s to get my ISK, and truthfully I feel kinda bad about it: the fact is they really don't belong in hi-sec, any more than BS belt rats or Arkanor asteroids do. L4 mission running is just about the most lucrative way to get your ISK. In theory 0.0 belt ratting should be better, but in practice you can run L4s with no interruption or pause, you don't have to share the rats, the risk is almost nil, and you get the mission pay and LP (= guaranteed faction items) as a nice bonus every 10-45 mins. That is blatantly imbalanced. Moving L4 missions isn't "forcing" you to play any particular way - it's just limiting the rewards you can get without taking risks, just like miners, ratters and explorers. You can still do missions in hi-sec, it's just that you shouldn't get anything better than cruiser rats if you do. If you want to mine for Megacyte and Zydrine, you have to go to 0.0 If you want officer spawns, you have to go to 0.0 If you want missions crammed with BS rats, you should at least have to go to lo-sec (and really, that's a concession - no dictors, no mobile bubbles, lots of NPC stations. Easy life... And I say this as someone who still has L4 Guardian Angels standings from missioning in Curse.) How come we get dozens of BS rats in missions in a 0.8 system, but only weak frigates in the belts? It doesn't make sense. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Ethaet Gallente	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:07:00 - [19] Because this thread is a blatant 'CCPPlz make peopel go to lwosec1!11' whine. - TQ has encountered a database issue, we are sitting around wondering why it has crashed this time, waiting for 500,000 petitions and watching the forums fill up.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:12:00 - [20] Originally by: Ethaet Because this thread is a blatant 'CCPPlz make peopel go to lwosec1!11' whine. You fail at logic. Is restricting high-end ores "forcing" miners to go to 0.0? Is limiting BS belt rats to 0.0 "forcing" ratters out of hi-sec? Giving people a reason to go to lo-sec isn't "forcing" anyone to do so - unless you're ready to concede that filling hi-sec with agents that let you make more ISK than ratting or mining in 0.0 is "forcing" people into hi-sec. OMG CCP STOP FORCING PEOPLE INTO HI-SEC!!!111ELEVEN The only thing that it's "forcing" you to do is to work a little hard and play a little more attentively in order to exploit your huge ISK-fountain. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.

Pudnucker Siseide Commercial Concern	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:32:00 - [21] Too brutal. Time for change! Laggy mission hubs blow. Suggestions: 1) Limit the number of missions an agent will give out per hour, with the number increasing as the security level drops? 2) Put agents inside some kind of ship and have them randomly warp around a system every 10 minutes. Cat & mouse for money? 3) Ape Privateer and install some sort of "console" you can browse through to see what public mission contracts are available - but make the player have to do something more than just undock and Warp To. Bring the Escalation, and the Mission together. Mission noir.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:35:00 - [22] Originally by: Fuazzole war dec the care bears, it's not pirating, it's protesting QFT. I definitely like this idea (the moving of agents). But hey, what do I know? I just want to make things splode.
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:41:00 - [23] Originally by: Tek'a Rain Originally by: Jaabaa Originally by: Tek'a Rain clever.. Hiding a "Move all lvl 4 agents to let me kill more CNRs" post inside a "Golly, lets take care of that Jita problem!" post. I've never pirated since I played. Ask anyone, friend or foe that I have played with, or against in over 4 years. Slanderous comment against someone poting with a main. The "me" was, I suppose, a general Me of folks who want missions moved (like pirates responding in this thread already) And I resent the comment that I might be "poting" with something other then a main. It was a typo, the word should have been "posting". The comment was actually about what you said about me, and me posting with my main. Allow me to rephrase it so you can understand it: Slanderous comment against ~~someone poting~~ me posting with my main. -- EVE Tools for cell phones and Windows/linux/Mac systems http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:51:00 - [24] Originally by: Malcanis A lot of hi-sec systems with level 4 agents are almost empty. People congregate on a +18 agent and ignore a +14 agent 3 jumps away in an almost empty system. Also a very good point. I wouldn't be surprised if people are staying with a lower quality agent (+10) in a high sec rather than using a better quality (+18) one because it might be in low sec. Level 4 agents in high security systems are just not right on the "Risk vs. Reward" scale. -- EVE Tools for cell phones and Windows/linux/Mac systems http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
I SoStoned	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:55:00 - [25] Originally by: Fuazzole war dec the care bears, it's not pirating, it's protesting Uhm? How? They're all in nuub/NPC corps and can't be wardecced thankyouverymuchCCP. :/ There is way too much safety for cowards in highsec.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:58:00 - [26] Originally by: I SoStoned There is way too much safety for cowards in highsec. Yeah, but that's obviously fair, right? Right? NERF PIRATS PLSX
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.10.07 11:59:00 - [27] For people who claim to dislike missions and hi sec stuff some of u know a lot about it hm? CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2007.10.07 12:01:00 - [28] Originally by: 000Hunter000 For people who claim to dislike missions and hi sec stuff some of u know a lot about it hm? Damn, you've got me. I'm actually secretly in posession of every single ISK farmer there is, they're all my alts. But then, you'd know that too, right? Cause you're my alt as well.
Susan Acid	Posted - 2007.10.07 12:14:00 - [29] Worst idea ever. Hi sec is way more popular than lo sec and always will be. CCP want more paying customers and if it wasn't for the ability to make good Isk in lo sec there would be less subscribers. To us this is just a game.To CCP it's a business.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2007.10.07 12:16:00 - [30] Originally by: Susan Acid Worst idea ever. Hi sec is way more popular than lo sec and always will be. CCP want more paying customers and if it wasn't for the ability to make good Isk in lo sec there would be less subscribers. To us this is just a game.To CCP it's a business. They made money before the mass exodus from lowsec, don't see why they'd lose money if more people went into it. People don't play EVE to have a userfriendly game, they play EVE because it's unlike all the other teddybear MMOGs out there.



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