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Gaia Thorn
Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:15:00 -
[1]
Wondering with the dmg bonuses and the new torp thingy isnt the dps of the golem gonna be insane ?
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:30:00 -
[2]
Yes. -----
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
iiOs
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:31:00 -
[3]
Edited by: iiOs on 23/10/2007 17:30:52 nm
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Aleranie
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:32:00 -
[4]
It will be 8 launcher of dps to raven ~7.9ish. It does not inherit the raven's rate-of-fire bonus.
Very similar damage wise, just better at hitting small targets.
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goodby4u
Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:35:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Aleranie It will be 8 launcher of dps to raven ~7.9ish. It does not inherit the raven's rate-of-fire bonus.
Very similar damage wise, just better at hitting small targets.
Yeah but it ends up hitting alot more then the raven with rage torps. __________________________________________ Yes it is great being amarr. I am minmatar,fly amarr,use gellente drones and am in caldari space. |
Deva Blackfire
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: goodby4u
Originally by: Aleranie It will be 8 launcher of dps to raven ~7.9ish. It does not inherit the raven's rate-of-fire bonus.
Very similar damage wise, just better at hitting small targets.
Yeah but it ends up hitting alot more then the raven with rage torps.
Rage what? Ever heard of faction missiles? :S
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Mattadore
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:38:00 -
[7]
Yes.
It's a T2 battleship, it should be.
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goodby4u
Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:43:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: goodby4u
Originally by: Aleranie It will be 8 launcher of dps to raven ~7.9ish. It does not inherit the raven's rate-of-fire bonus.
Very similar damage wise, just better at hitting small targets.
Yeah but it ends up hitting alot more then the raven with rage torps.
Rage what? Ever heard of faction missiles? :S
Yeah but quite expensive,most likely it will be used for ratting(thats what ccp says its role would be)so mo money. __________________________________________ Yes it is great being amarr. I am minmatar,fly amarr,use gellente drones and am in caldari space. |
Gypsio III
Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:49:00 -
[9]
Good luck getting a viable torp fit on the Golem with its completely gimped powergrid. E.g. (and yes I know this is an high-end fit but it's not absurd)
Golem PG at Eng V: 8125
4x Siege II: 6617 large smartie: 1000 heavy nos: 2000 heavy neut: 2000 MWD named: 1250 Cap booster named: 1750 XLSB II: 550
Sum: 15167 Fitting mods required: 4 RCU II and 1 ACR rig. Nice.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:53:00 -
[10]
It does identical damage to a normal Raven at L5 BS each (6/0.75=4*2), but for half ammo use (and more imporatant, cheaper fiting, since you only have to buy 4 expensive launchers instead of 6). That, combined with the fact you have 3 spare highslots, and a 40km double-speed tractor beam range and a HUGE cargohold makes it the ideal mission-running ship, killing and looting/salvaging at the same time (no more "come back with salvager" need). The explosion radius bonus means it can make up to DOUBLE damage against smaller ships with Cruise missiles even without a target painter, and WITH one (esp. with the omfg bonus), it means a Cruise Golem will be insanely effective at dealing with just about any missions. Ok, sure, you won't be using Torps on it (since they will get a nerfed range of maybe just 30km if nothing changes from what we see on SiSi) unless you use Javelins (meh) or fit missile velocity rigs (you will probably have CCCs on, but you might be able to spare one, no idea), and you HAVE to get a painter then... luckily, you do get an extra mid compared to Raven, so it's ok. Even comparing to a CNR, the mere fact you get the shield boost amount bonus (yikes) and the increased resists (hehe) will make it the prefered ship (not even speaking of the 3-launchers-saved and tractor bonuses even).
In conclusion, yeah, this is the new dream missionrunning ship. _
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:59:00 -
[11]
WTS cnr!
All I can say. Free built in boost amp, probably better than t1 bs cap, you lose rigslot but fit t2 ccc and you can easily field 3x bcu decent tank setup that don't need changing(em hard, 2x dg invul, XL booster, boost amp, 2x whatever)
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Subruz
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:06:00 -
[12]
How would a boost amp affect that bonus, would it take the bonus into account? Sorry, I haven't really figured out EVE's stacking yet.
- It does indeed look like a ratters dream but doesn't have a place in PvP imo.
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Wideen
Eon Project
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:10:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Wideen on 23/10/2007 18:15:14 are the bonuses revealed or am I missing something?
edit: nvrmind I found it
Originally by: F'nog Your math intrigues me, and I wish to subscribe to its newsletter.
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Maraq
Caldari Radikus Industries
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:18:00 -
[14]
with the 50% range on missiles I think it'll be useful with torps as well.
And with the tank bonuses it'll have no issue with any rat.
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Kruel
Blunt Force Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:19:00 -
[15]
But how many missiles are gonna get shot down before they impact the NPCs? I'm thinking a CNR would be better for this reason alone.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:25:00 -
[16]
Whoops, sorry, belay that comment... the bonus is explosion VELOCITY not explosion RADIUS. Hmm... it makes torps better, not Cruises.
Might even be feasable to use a Large Shield Booster II with torps and one or two missile velocity rigs (and a missile velocity implant), and a Golem might still be a feasable torpedo mission platform. _
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TradeUnion first
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:40:00 -
[17]
Edited by: TradeUnion first on 23/10/2007 18:41:33 Akita T, I enjoy reading your posts but this time I strongly disagree with you :).
Compared to CNR, the Golem is inferior. First, the CNR has more base dmg because of its rof bonus. Second, the CNR has THREE rig slots instead of two. Third, if you use cruise missiles and the NPC has defenders for each missile lost you get double penalty with Golem. Fourth, forget about mission running with torps - even with Javelin, rigs and implant the range is too low. Fifth, the skills to learn for Golem are much more than those for CNR and the price of the two ships will be similar (or the Golem will be more expensive for a long time).
The only good thing with the Golem is its better tank. But I don't need better tank than the tank I already have on the CNR and even if I need better, there is a simple (but expensive) answer - Gist x-large booster.
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lofty29
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:43:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kruel But how many missiles are gonna get shot down before they impact the NPCs? I'm thinking a CNR would be better for this reason alone.
Only guristas wtfspam defenders, so gtfo from Motsu! ---
Latest Video : FAT- Camp |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:48:00 -
[19]
Buy you do need a better tank for L5 missions and above, and the upcoming factional warfare
Besides, you could feasably T2-fit a Golem, and get back 300++ mil platinum payout WHEN it pops (since FW is supposedly lowsec and pvp oriented, to a degree), but only get back 100 mil when the CNR pops. The long-term pricetag on both's purchase is very likely to be similar. So, you either go in with a plain vanilla Raven (best bang for your buck) or with a Golem, but leave the CNR home for backup income via L4s.
The other noteworthy feature of the Golem (and personally THE most noteworthy feature, for me at least) is the larger cargohold and the double tractorbeam effectiveness. _
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Oprahh
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:12:00 -
[20]
Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like you could fit a decent tank, a painter or two, AND a webber and scrambler. Is that right?
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:25:00 -
[21]
Originally by: lofty29
Originally by: Kruel But how many missiles are gonna get shot down before they impact the NPCs? I'm thinking a CNR would be better for this reason alone.
Only guristas wtfspam defenders, so gtfo from Motsu!
Dunno about wtfspam, but other rats use enough defenders to take out cruises.
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Benn Helmsman
Caldari Dark Prophecy Inc.
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:49:00 -
[22]
Golem is a cruise missile ship, dealing the same damage as the raven and tanks a little more. Seems like not worth bothering. I would always prefer a CNR to run missions because of more damage.
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Carniflex
Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:51:00 -
[23]
For serious missionwhoring (ie hi sec, faction fitted) CNR will be somewhat better. Would torps be viable for level 4 missions Golem would come out more or less ok but currently ... well ... it's not entirely useless ship, but it sure is not missionrunners wet dream either.
As far as looting/salvaging statement goes. Dunno - I dont see it very effective in that role. Perhaps if you just fit tractors and skip the salvaging part altho most level 4 missions drop loot in the ballpark of 1000 m3 (up to 3k in some) so you would have relatively small room left for ammo/cap charges (and due to ship bonuses you would use relatively low amount of those).
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Ishina Fel
Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:52:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Ishina Fel on 23/10/2007 19:55:15
Originally by: Oprahh Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like you could fit a decent tank, a painter or two, AND a webber and scrambler. Is that right?
Web Scram Painter XL booster II boost amp EM hardener II Invul field II
resists: 66.75% kinetic 58.00% thermal 66.00% EM (estimated) 72% explosive
Looks okay-ish to me - add in a DCU II for some more resists. Of course you'll cap out quite fast, but you'll be tanking a lot of DPS until then. Maybe you can use a large shield booster II for more cap stability in exchange for less burst HP.
For missions, you can even drop the scram and web and fit a very tough tank.
Buff room for large link addresses in sigs plz :( |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.10.23 20:28:00 -
[25]
Carniflex : Cruise FoF + perma-running LARGE shield booster with bonus repair (you really didn't need an XL before for L4s anyway most of the time) + 3 tractor/salvagers == free wrecks, and you just tractor all, collect interesting loot, salvage all, leave junk behind (or keep a jetcan tractored with junk, so you just need to pick up ONE item per room).
Sure, CNRs are still better at running speed, but the Golem has the "convenience/cheapness" factors going for it. Cheapness, as in no need for faction gear, and half ammo costs. Convenience, as in don't bother with the killing, just focus on loot/salvage.
_
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Carniflex
Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:16:00 -
[26]
But but but ... most of my isk comes from bounties/LP.
Then again I'm one of of those who usually does not salvage nor loot but just hit missions for bounties and LP. Overall yeh - that ship has it's uses - just for dedicated mission***** it's not that sweet as I hoped it to be. For your average missionrunner who loots or salvages in same ship he runs missions it's quite considerable investment. isk/h wise however (assuming missionrunner has some brains and gets reasonable LP/isk conversion) it either breaks even with CNR or is slightly behind. Mission loot is rather crap in general and just one salvager does not quite cut it.
Against opponents who do not spam defenders added isk/h from loot might rise it to same level as CNR, but thats somewhat speculative -- depends on your opponents as some loot melts into more minerals than other.
It will be good for PvP and 0.0 ratting
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:56:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Carniflex
It will be good for PvP and 0.0 ratting
agreed. cnr still will be a must for highsec lvl 4's:)
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l'ga Rathorn
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:02:00 -
[28]
One thing that *might* interest the dual account mission runners among us is those extra 4 high slots could be used for energy transfers.
At energy emission systems level 4 a large transfer II uses 292.8 cap every 5 seconds and transfers 351.
4 of these in those high slots on each of the Golems nets a +46.56 cap per second result.
Frankly, that'll more than make up for the 2 rigs vs 3 argument.
Personally I'd consider switching out some cap mods for more "useful" mods like... - webbie - eccm (for guristas) - MORE painters! etc...
Of course, it's not ideal vs guristas as jammed = buggered when relying on a second buddy.
Then again, 4x transfers IS overkill and I'm sure someone can find a more useful idea.
Thing is, this doesn't just apply to PVE either. The idea of these ship classes roaming around repping other gang mates is possibly scary...
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Kullenbrak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:02:00 -
[29]
Ironical, Golems vulnerability for jamming and defender missiles (Guristas favorite playing toys) will make the Caldari maruder suck badly for mission running in Caldari space.
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Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:08:00 -
[30]
I am somewhat amused how the people touting the CNR somehow ignore the 3 extra utility hi-slots on the Golem. Or were you intending to just leave those empty? Personally, I'm scared to death of the Golem. It's gonna make hunting mission runners alot harder.
Taxman IV: Rogue Agent
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