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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 11:42:00 -
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This isn't the first post related to plex prices, nor dare I say will it be the last rather than the usual blah blah about cashing in I would like to address the potential game breaking issue attached to the increasing plex forecast.
Imagine the very possible 1bill per plex scenario where the estimated two thirds of players whom pay by plex can no longer afford plexes from their monthly grin, now add the fact that for -ú22:00you can buy your self 2 billion isk from an etc miners think why bother mining, inflation driven by too few subscribers producing base matierials and a new breed of buy your self rich players mean that Joe shmoe who buys eve for the first time quits after a week because he can buy his first t1 frigit....
End result mass loss of player base mass inflation and no new influx of fresh players.....
Possible fix CCP cap plex prices before its to late... |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:02:00 -
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Still you can pay for 2 plexes and get yourself a bill from your paper round if one were so inclined.... |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 13:38:00 -
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I think I perhaps failed to convay my point, I'm speaking mainly about the vast majority of subscribers who pay for there account via acquiring in game plexes via self generated isk.
These are your incursion runners, mission runners and miners "people who grind" people who can't pay for the subscription with real money for what ever reason.
The Csm recently discussed incursion vanguards being re balanced but would the decrease in cash made from them affect the possibility of large scale alliances manipulating plex prices with sinister and dark intentions.
They also mentioned a vast number of eve players who soely pay for their time in new Eden with plexes.
I think you could cap the plex because a plex in its self as a commodity operates outside of normal commodity parameters, it doesn't build anything nor can it make you fight better.
Yet it is a necessity for some and a commodity for others an isk sink but at the same time it is an isk generator.
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 15:10:00 -
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So erm yea.... Lots of people unsubscribing for a while is concidered a good thing if it's only untill plex prices drop to normal parameters.... Then it starts over again....
Not really dealing with the issue is it Derath it's more like the burry your head and accept it crap politicians have fed the world for years...
Remove the issue so the masses can play the game without being incursion slaves or mass wealth gain through plex exploitation and you have your self an even keel.....
If the price was at a more achievable level through standard professions like mining you would see mineral prices lower and a more stable eve economy not the credit crunchh esq rollercoaster we are headed towards. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 16:21:00 -
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Ok Yogi Bear But what's to say plexes have to be limited...
Plexes are entitlement clearly they enable people to play the game with in game funds if they wernt then you wouldn't be able to renew your subscription with them....."this item extends your game time by 30 days when activated" not "this item extends your game time for 30 days you cheap punk your not entitled to say you play eve if anyone asks"
Unfortunetly the facts remain a F*** load of people play via plex and suggesting they should go away untill they can afford it is ludicrous...
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 16:29:00 -
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Right at the begining I remember saying "possible fix"
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 16:51:00 -
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Thankyou for yet another economics for dummies lesson.
There are players in this game whom can afford to pay high prices for plexes due to high isk income lots of people at the moment due to incursions and the 150+ million an hour you can make from that if they rebalance vanguard sites people won't be able to afford the high prices and demand along with the price go down infact probably significantly and sharply due to people buying plexes for real money to cash in I belive this sums it up.
The above describes a "bubble burst" scenario and can only happen when the demand falls,
I.E players dropping accounts because they can't pay for the game which affects the game in general.
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 17:04:00 -
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What about more plex variants ie 15 day versions or 7 day versions that are inherently cheaper and could act as middle ground when the **** hits the fan and help regulate prices via more mobile plex competition. Or even 50/50 plexes wher 15days is isk 15 days real cash.... |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 17:32:00 -
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Derath you need to look up the word possible because it was a possible soloution......Although you have now enlightened me and I now see your point capping them is probably a bad idea sure yea your right..
PLAYERS LEAVING THE GAME DUE TO NOT BEING ABLE TO AFFORD PLEXES IS STILL A BAD THING GIVEN THE AMMOUNT OF PEOPLE WHO USE THEM FOR GAME TIME THOUGH!
do you think everyone will come back after they have had the break from the game or do you think they will find some other mmo?
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 19:04:00 -
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"PLEX is one of the biggest subscription methods in EVE"
That is a quote from the csm meeting minuets and the topic was started by ccp.
The fact is people can walk away if they cant pay via isk or cash.... the problem is its a question potentially thousands of people will have to ask them selves in the up and coming Plexment Day,
Concequeses of a mass player Subscription break are potentially Game ending what if 10k people said i cant be arsed working so hard for my plex all the time its booring and because my mortgage has gone up i cant afford to play eve so i guess ill have to stop playing eve alltogether....
Thats my point thats the problem with unchecked plex inflation.
Capitalisum is inherently flawed because it requires constant growth and Inflation to Work, the only difference in eve is that people can and will walk away if they choose to. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 19:35:00 -
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Derath I dont know why your atacking me on a personal level but I urge you to stop I agreed with you buddy.....let it go....
Be constructive or find someone els to troll I wont reply directly to you from now on unless what you have to say is on constructive and progressive discussion level although the bumping of this thread you have provided is apriciated.
Diomedes Calypso thankyou and clearly you have a grasp on what im getting at...
I totally agree with what you are saying Large scale opperations sitting on potentially trillions of isk a year have can literally play god with average people whom just want to log on do there thing log off,
Goons have threatened that they will be starting a new trype of market manipulation which would be bigger than the gallente ice gank they recently orchastrated could the former pre curse the latter? is there plan just to break the game by starting some sort of plex based war on ccp? if so what will ccp do to stop them and how will they prevent such assaults from happening in the future?? |
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Posted - 2012.01.26 19:48:00 -
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"These people sound pretty tragic, I think we might be better off without them.
10k less PLEX consumers would lower PLEX price, and if we have to exchange 10k potential spacefriends for a lower PLEX price these sad little people sound like the ones to go."
Really Ten thousand active people leaving the game ill say it again ten thousand active people leaving the game would make the rest of us all better off???
who do u shoot ,what if they all leave from say a Eu timezone where the Recesion is hitting people hard ten thousand active people leaving a specific timezone would kill it done over caput.
Ten thousand leaving alltogether never to return tenthousand spread between 2 timezones would be terrible aswell entire alliances would fold base line matierials where the sheer mass of competition keep the price low would sky rocket...
Eve is the sum of its parts and we are all connected back through the whole from newb to Ceo of Ive got a very big alliance.
At this point in time ccp is making good money because people are buying etc codes hand over fist to cash in...... two months down the line there missing a very big chunk of there player base and in the middle of a Player related spiral of decline once it starts its very hard to stop such a spiral from hitting the ground without some sort of intervention or "Win them Back sceme tipped in the players favour" |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 19:57:00 -
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OllieNorth wrote:As someone who always pays for gametime, I don't really see the issue. Nobody has a right to play for free. Any other MMO makes you pay no matter what, this one gives you an option. I like that.
I also like that I can legally buy ISK if my incompetent ass goes afk in a Level 4 with my pimped mission boat. Regulating PLEX prices would be stupid for CCP. If they limit the value of their product, they will sell less of it.
Also, I have doubt about how many of these PLEX-only players are actually distinct individuals. Rather, I imagine a large percentage are alts. As such, them desubbing doesn't really affect gameplay very much as the human can only play so many accounts at one time. Many are just sitting there ticking along and training. I doubt there would be a huge decrease in the number of actual humans playing the game.
TL;DR Quit whining and find enough cash to pay, or get better so you can buy your PLEX.
3 accounts payed for by -ú sir so nope im not a disgruntled I cant pay for my account person......
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 20:03:00 -
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Derath Ellecon wrote:Specctor wrote:"PLEX is one of the biggest subscription methods in EVE"
That is a quote from the csm meeting minuets and the topic was started by ccp.
The fact is people can walk away if they cant pay via isk or cash.... the problem is its a question potentially thousands of people will have to ask them selves in the up and coming Plexment Day,
Concequeses of a mass player Subscription break are potentially Game ending what if 10k people said i cant be arsed working so hard for my plex all the time its booring and because my mortgage has gone up i cant afford to play eve so i guess ill have to stop playing eve alltogether....
Thats my point thats the problem with unchecked plex inflation.
Capitalisum is inherently flawed because it requires constant growth and Inflation to Work, the only difference in eve is that people can and will walk away if they choose to. This whole argument is flawed. Everyone pays for EVE. If you pay for your gametime with a PLEX, someone else shelled out $15 for you. If anything, the players who can only afford to play EVE via PLEX actually COST CCP potential revenue. When someone buy's a GTC and coverts to PLEX, CCP makes say $30. now if those PLEX sit in game and never get redeemed for gametime. OR if they get blown up. That is FREE MONEY for CCP. (sort of). Basically CCP got $30 which was used for extra internet pixels. Now if someone comes along and uses that PLEX to extend their gametime, CCP now lost a potential $15 that the user otherwise would have spent to extend their gametime. So if you have a player who only plays via PLEX, and would quit otherwise, CCP isn't technically losing money from them quitting. CCP doesn't make any money from people who redeem PLEX. They make money from people who buy GTC and turn them into PLEX.
"It must be stated that contrary to public perception, it is in CCPGÇÖs interest to have the PLEX prices low (as opposed to high) because of the number of users using that subscription method. There is no guarantee that those users will switch over to other methods could they not afford PLEX with ISK. Nor is it in CCPGÇÖs interest that users have to grind more in order to maintain their subscription method should the price of PLEX go up GÇô using more of their time in the game to pay for PLEX and not to enrich the EVE environment.
CCP is therefore closely monitoring both the PLEX trade and the economy in general, very closely."
The bottom of page 9 of the csm minuets Sir.
I like the part about enriching the enviroment which is perhaps another problem ccp is adressing alltogether f less people had to grind the more they would pvp or perhaps settle in new areas of space and start there own eve chapter, rather than the obvious work for plex slavery which is currently insuing. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 20:15:00 -
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Ofcourse i understand !!!
I buy 2 caracalls from you which means 1 guy whom mined that ore gets a percentage of my isk and yours also the guy whos buying the minerals and shipping them from that guy who mined them in the first place makes a cut who inturn makes a cut from you when you buy something els hes buying and selling for a marginal profit on the market....behind all this there is a Goon member whom has secretly bought all of the rest of the caricalls and will keep on buying them untill we all pay well over the odds for carricals and have to go fly gaylente instead....
See crystal clear understanding their sir.... |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 21:17:00 -
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Well after I agreed with plex capping being a bad soloution I suggested a couple of more possibilities, but what would your answer be to plex inflation how would you controll plex inflation or protect the player base from plex manipulation? |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.26 23:10:00 -
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Burry your head and hope the problem disappears..... |
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Posted - 2012.01.27 07:37:00 -
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Is not really an argument is it more of a generalisation of what the general view is.
I don't really understand why people were so adverse to discussing this it seems alot of people disagree for the sake of it on here. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.27 07:44:00 -
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Final idea what about making plex a Sort of hot potato give them and expiry date or give plexes a maximum number per account type figure say x plexes can be bought and stored per account max. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.27 09:11:00 -
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Zealot? Respect? Ha! Your right though thread lost I thought this was market discussion not speak and be jumped on |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.27 16:47:00 -
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Derath Ellecon wrote:Specctor wrote:Final idea what about making plex a Sort of hot potato give them and expiry date or give plexes a maximum number per account type figure say x plexes can be bought and stored per account max. Now this wouldn't be bad idea. I don't know if you could really retroactively add an expiration date. But in general this would certainly help the issue. And it isn't too far fetched. When I sell my clients pre-paid blocks of consulting hours they have to use them within 12 months.
You could Perhaps say this item will be invalid after one month to ensure plexes are no longer hoarded and throttled although perhaps a baseline compensatory figure could be granted just incase you have one go pop on you.. Like a set figure well below market value |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.01.30 22:11:00 -
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To be fair after reading this thread through again and after a good laugh about how much of a **** I am on ts3 with my corp.. I would like to make an apology to the citizens of new eden for my doom crying last week, my anti psycotic drugs have now reached me after the royal mail made a mixup with my parcel.
Its not really my fault they dont teach economics as a standard gcse subject in Wales, I guess we were all just born to be farmers and what use would a grasp on how markets work when your milking gutrude at 4 am on a cold november night???
I would like to thank all the posters for there replies to this thread and thankyou for taking the time out to scourn me like a ginger stepchild........ |
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Posted - 2012.01.31 15:51:00 -
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Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putain wrote:I'm always impressed by how so many people know so little about so many topics.
Wow would you like to join my pub quiz team? |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.03 13:03:00 -
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A faucet is a tap by the way (American-English translation) |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.08 12:56:00 -
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Lord Jita wrote:Was this recorded in a wind tunnel ? What is that constant whooshing sound? and 2nd, the guest's mic is so low you can barely hear him and the hosts mic is so loud in comparison when I cranked the sound to hear Hex talk and you cut in, I almost pooped my pants. third, spending the first crucial minutes of your show (where people are going to decide whether to keep listening or turn it off) reading off a bunch of prices (that anyone can see in-game anyway) is a good way to lose audience. instead of that, use the time to discuss any interesting market movements/fluctuations and possible causes etc would be way more interesting.
The troll is strong with this one....
I found the discussion both informative and arousing, I'd also like to wave my fist in triumph towards the bigwigs who gave me such a hard time earlier in this post.
The gentlemen who made this fine production were clearly more versed and informed in the ways of the market, but in a more raw and unrefined way my post was pointed in the same direction.
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.24 10:04:00 -
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Would you say that with the power of two rearing it's ugly head at around a time when plex prices could start to come back down, means that perhaps ccp are trying to keep plex prices up as an isk sink untill theyfix incursions??
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.24 10:42:00 -
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I see but it could still funnel isk away from an incursion runner into say a dude who's bought a time code to replace his carrie, or in a more general sense away from a safe stockpile into a high risk asset. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.24 10:50:00 -
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So perhaps not an isk sink directly but more an isk saniflow hahaha
Isk saniflow tm you heard it here first.
Also Wales are going to smash England in the rugby this Saturday \o/ |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.24 11:26:00 -
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So you didn't like the isk saniflow then :( |
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Posted - 2012.02.24 12:06:00 -
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I agree fags are well expensive now but coke is cheaper (soft drink not white powder) |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.02.24 12:07:00 -
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Beans from aldi 8 pence 12% increase from last year |
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Posted - 2012.02.24 21:32:00 -
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I've run out of bubbles for my pipe and I've worn out the elbows on my smoking jacket. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.03.17 08:56:00 -
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Kobalos what kind of absolute **** head would even begin writing a post like that?
Did you just think hmmm I'm going to get a boner trying to kick a man for not earning enough to pay for his hobby?
If you had bothered to read the thread you would have noticed perhaps that I have mentioned I'm comfortable irl and in game, I'm not Rockefeller but job car, house,garage hotwater, colour tv and matching his and hers Shellsuits all sorted.
There are alot of people whom are struggleing in real life though and that is never ever something that should be used as a weapon shame on you.
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Specctor
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Posted - 2012.03.17 09:04:00 -
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Infact Kobalos you haven't read any of this thread at all your so way off the mark your clearly just an angry cape wearing moron, go jump of your mountain of superiority I think you shall find the fall will far from kill you. |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.03.18 10:02:00 -
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I think this thread can die now, the trolls are starting to breed.
Please lock |
Specctor
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Posted - 2012.03.21 10:34:00 -
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Specctor wrote:What about more plex variants ie 15 day versions or 7 day versions that are inherently cheaper and could act as middle ground when the **** hits the fan and help regulate prices via more mobile plex competition. Or even 50/50 plexes wher 15days is isk 15 days real cash....
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