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Karlemgne The Black Fleet	Posted - 2007.11.13 21:52:00 - [31] Edited by: Karlemgne on 13/11/2007 21:52:34 Originally by: John Blackthorn For those of us that didn't play the game what change did they make to the Jedi? Essentially when SWG launched nobody could "make" a Jedi out of the box. The Jedi was a class that you "unlocked" by unlocking "force sensitivity." These Jedi's were very rare at first, and once you became a Jedi you were in a rather difficult position. While the class was very powerful, if you died, you suffered perma-death of the character. You were also very vulnerable to pvp, much more so than everyone else who could "flag" their character. The NGE, which again was mandated by Lucas arts and not SOE's brainchild, changed the game completely. The game became twitch instead of the more classic MMO playstyle and Jedi became a class that you could make on character creation. That also meant that you no longer suffered perma-death etc. Lots and lots of people *****ed about this, as usual blamed the company without putting any thought in it (which really isn't fair when you are talking about a Star Wars license,)and "left the game." Now people say that SWG was killed by the NGE. In reality subs were already down when the NGE went live, and while many players left SWG, many new players came to the game. SWG has slightly (very slightly I might add) less players than when the NGE went live. So yes, EVE is a bigger game now, but that's not based on SWG shrinkage. Its instead based on EVE's growth. That shouldn't be a shocker either because EVE is one of the best games ever made, flat out. -Karlemgne
Turin Caldari Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.13 21:59:00 - [32] This is my take on CCP's upcoming patch. _________________________________
Optique Sixth Degree Communications	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:04:00 - [33] Originally by: Turin This is my take on CCP's upcoming patch. Yeah. We get it. You don't like the patch. Clever. /yawn
Karlemgne The Black Fleet	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:04:00 - [34] Originally by: Kharadran Sullath Originally by: Karlemgne Edited by: Karlemgne on 13/11/2007 20:20:18 Originally by: Lord Bleu stuff more stuff and... For the most part I feel that CCP wins in a side-by-side comparison with SOE. However, one thing that would never happen at SOE is intentional developer cheating on the in-game server(s). Any developer caught doing this would be immediately fired. CCP has a different take on this. I think SOE's (in this case) is better. Screw forgiveness eh? Forgiveness is all well and good, but you are dealing with an issue that effects the perception of your company, and people's perception of their own power in a game. When people (especially on a single server game such as eve) see that developers not only play the game, but have also been caught cheating to give themselves an advantage, the paying players feel slighted. Failing to do anything other than making the developer rename his character only adds to the impression that those associated with CCP can cheat and face no other serious consequence other than having to apologize in a dev-blog. The obvious fallout effects your bottom line, gets you bad press in industry publications/websites, and generally gives a game a dirty feel. Thus the company I work for (nameless) prevents all of this by having a zero tolerance policy. If you use a GM client or dev tools in any way to aid your player character your fired. Even if nobody finds out about it. In fact, EVEN if you let slip that you work for said nameless company on your play character, your fired. In my opinion, that's the way it should be. Even the semblance of impropriety should be avoided at all costs. A MMO company should never have a corporate culture where it appears there are only minor penalties for those who make the game when they cheat. -K
Jenny Spitfire Caldari	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:05:00 - [35] Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 13/11/2007 22:06:12 Originally by: Karlemgne ... Well said. The bottom line is SWG did not die and its current playerbase is proof that the game is fun to play post-NGE. EDIT: o.O you work for Blizzard? --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Kali is for KArebearLIng. I 100% agree with Avon. Female EVE gamers? Mail Zajo or visit WGOE.Public in-game.
Optique Sixth Degree Communications	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:07:00 - [36] Originally by: Karlemgne ...the paying players feel slighted... You probably shouldn't speak for all the paying players, as you might find that many, if not the majority don't share your opinion as to the importance of the events that took place.
Kirren D'marr	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:19:00 - [37] Originally by: Karlemgne Edited by: Karlemgne on 13/11/2007 21:52:34 Originally by: John Blackthorn For those of us that didn't play the game what change did they make to the Jedi? Essentially when SWG launched nobody could "make" a Jedi out of the box. The Jedi was a class that you "unlocked" by unlocking "force sensitivity." These Jedi's were very rare at first, and once you became a Jedi you were in a rather difficult position. While the class was very powerful, if you died, you suffered perma-death of the character. You were also very vulnerable to pvp, much more so than everyone else who could "flag" their character. The NGE, which again was mandated by Lucas arts and not SOE's brainchild, changed the game completely. The game became twitch instead of the more classic MMO playstyle and Jedi became a class that you could make on character creation. That also meant that you no longer suffered perma-death etc. Lots and lots of people *****ed about this, as usual blamed the company without putting any thought in it (which really isn't fair when you are talking about a Star Wars license,)and "left the game." Now people say that SWG was killed by the NGE. In reality subs were already down when the NGE went live, and while many players left SWG, many new players came to the game. SWG has slightly (very slightly I might add) less players than when the NGE went live. So yes, EVE is a bigger game now, but that's not based on SWG shrinkage. Its instead based on EVE's growth. That shouldn't be a shocker either because EVE is one of the best games ever made, flat out. -Karlemgne Some good points on the history of the NGE, but regarding SWG's subscription levels, remember these facts: - From the beginning, SWG was a bug-laden unfinished product. Players were constantly begging SOE to fix gamebreaking bugs, and SOE continued to promise fixes but generally failed to deliver. The same can be said of unfinished, promised, and never seen content. Over the course of the year prior to the NGE there was a steady decline in subscriptions as players became fed up with SOE's excuses as to why things weren't getting fixed. - Six months before the NGE came out was the Combat Upgrade (CU), an attepmt at "rebalancing" the game that introduced more bugs and problems than it solved, which in turn aided in the decline of the playerbase. - It is difficult to say what SWG's subscription numbers truly were prior to the NGE as SOE continually refused to make such numbers public. Any numbers on this matter are estimates at best. So, was the NGE the sole cause of the "downfall" of SWG? No, of course not, but I think for many it was the proverbial straw on the camel's back. Personally, I think the fact that a game with a license for a franchise that has had one of the largest fan-followings in history, across generations and beyond national borders, has fewer subscriptions than a game that is a completely new concept, with nothing to build on except its own merits and relies heavily on word of mouth for advertising, speaks volumes to how badly mishandled the whole SWG fiasco really was.
Tarminic Forsaken Resistance	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:20:00 - [38] Originally by: Turin http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d2/turin122/mcwardec.jpg This is my take on CCP's upcoming patch. You should change "playerbase" to "carrier pilots" really. The only thing I fly that's nerfed in the upcoming patch is the myrmidon, and I don't blame them. ---------------- Tarminic - 29 Million SP in ~~pink~~ Forum Warfare
Turin Caldari Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:22:00 - [39] Originally by: Optique Originally by: Turin This is my take on CCP's upcoming patch. Yeah. We get it. You don't like the patch. Clever. /yawn Cant you just take a pic and laugh at it for its humnors sake? fricken hell man. No wonder this game is going to the tubes. _________________________________
Matrixcvd Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:28:00 - [40] Originally by: Barbaro55a Well said. I don't fly carriers, never plan to (but i'm sure that CCP are still doing what they think is best for the game. /Signs thread. no crap, and thats why you and the ccp nerfbat morons think they know whats best for the mechanics. its ******** and so are the people that support it

Turin Caldari Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:31:00 - [41] Originally by: Matrixcvd Originally by: Barbaro55a Well said. I don't fly carriers, never plan to (but i'm sure that CCP are still doing what they think is best for the game. /Signs thread. no crap, and thats why you and the ccp nerfbat morons think they know whats best for the mechanics. its ******** and so are the people that support it So by that logic, everyone shoudl always 100% support everything CCP does? _________________________________
Optique Sixth Degree Communications	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:37:00 - [42] Originally by: Turin Cant you just take a pic and laugh at it for its humnors sake? fricken hell man. No wonder this game is going to the tubes. 1. Post something funny, and I'll be the first to laugh. 2. The game isn't going down the tubes. If anything, the community could use a adjusting wedgie.
Tarminic Forsaken Resistance	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:40:00 - [43] Originally by: Turin Originally by: Optique Originally by: Turin This is my take on CCP's upcoming patch. Yeah. We get it. You don't like the patch. Clever. /yawn Cant you just take a pic and laugh at it for its humnors sake? fricken hell man. No wonder this game is going to the tubes. After how much the forums have been clogged with ranty carrier nerf whines, I imagine a lot of people are really, really tired of hearin about it, I'm among them. That is pretty entertaining though. ---------------- Tarminic - 29 Million SP in ~~pink~~ Forum Warfare
NeoShocker Caldari Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:44:00 - [44] I don't see the logic of comparing CCP and SoE at all. Its just wrong in many levels. Sure we got test server, but why can't people accept the fact that CCP is trying to improve game play? Just one example. Sure I don't fly a carrier, but I fly dictors. TBH, they're a little overpowered from what they can do. People are whining and complaining too much because they just "don't like it" or "dictors will be too weak now" excuse. Just adapt, play, and have faith in CCP. ----------------------------------- Peace through power!
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:46:00 - [45] Originally by: Karlemgne Edited by: Karlemgne on 13/11/2007 21:52:34 Originally by: John Blackthorn For those of us that didn't play the game what change did they make to the Jedi? Essentially when SWG launched nobody could "make" a Jedi out of the box. The Jedi was a class that you "unlocked" by unlocking "force sensitivity." These Jedi's were very rare at first, and once you became a Jedi you were in a rather difficult position. While the class was very powerful, if you died, you suffered perma-death of the character. You were also very vulnerable to pvp, much more so than everyone else who could "flag" their character. The NGE, which again was mandated by Lucas arts and not SOE's brainchild, changed the game completely. The game became twitch instead of the more classic MMO playstyle and Jedi became a class that you could make on character creation. That also meant that you no longer suffered perma-death etc. Lots and lots of people *****ed about this, as usual blamed the company without putting any thought in it (which really isn't fair when you are talking about a Star Wars license,)and "left the game." Now people say that SWG was killed by the NGE. In reality subs were already down when the NGE went live, and while many players left SWG, many new players came to the game. SWG has slightly (very slightly I might add) less players than when the NGE went live. So yes, EVE is a bigger game now, but that's not based on SWG shrinkage. Its instead based on EVE's growth. That shouldn't be a shocker either because EVE is one of the best games ever made, flat out. -Karlemgne Perma-dath where removed fairly early in the process. Even before CU1 (the 1st combat upgrade). Its one of the things SOE did which where right and applauded by most people. Sarah McTeef: You all should really try and stay on topic. Which when I last checked, was my grocery list
Matrixcvd Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:46:00 - [46] Originally by: Turin Originally by: Matrixcvd Originally by: Barbaro55a Well said. I don't fly carriers, never plan to (but i'm sure that CCP are still doing what they think is best for the game. /Signs thread. no crap, and thats why you and the ccp nerfbat morons think they know whats best for the mechanics. its ******** and so are the people that support it So by that logic, everyone shoudl always 100% support everything CCP does? turin, no, i hate everything ccp is doing, hate the changes, i dont fly carriers but know their importance. I don't fly drone ships but know how fun they are for gallente, i am a caldari char and don't care about speed tanks, i fit for fleet combat and love dealing with all the problems that get involved. I want to make sure that small/med alliances can negotiate the barriers of 0.0, and sell and operate qual mods out there... All of these idiots on these forums that applaud the carrier changes are useless and should have no impact into how the rest of the eve community plays. They neither engage in large scale logistics, love the fact that people out in 0.0 complain because they take no part of it, and basically would rub salt in the wounds of everyone that can kill them on a daily basis. They want "fairness" by altering game design because they wouldnt last a heartbeat where we do. I applaud your post, have had wonderful times fighting you and your establishment and have great respect for your pilots I am tired of the crybabies in empire, i hate the people who whine about getting ganked, and if this game turns into a diper fest then i will leave, (no you can't have my stuff) and alot of people who crave the hardcore combat will leave as well. if there is no sacrifice there is no victory. We feed off our anger in defeat to drive us to achieve victory. It hurts to lose a ship, thats what makes this game the most amazing experience i could ever have. When you spend weeks of your time building up the resources to fit your ship and someone comes and spanks you silly, you shouldn't turn around and cry for a nerf, you go out and do what is necessary to kill the guy. The game is turning into watching nun's screwin a football if CCP really would have its way at this point.
Turin Caldari Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:50:00 - [47] Originally by: Optique Edited by: Optique on 13/11/2007 22:38:51 Originally by: Turin Cant you just take a pic and laugh at it for its humnors sake? fricken hell man. No wonder this game is going to the tubes. 1. Post something funny, and I'll be the first to laugh. 2. The game isn't going down the tubes. If anything, the community of whiners and naysayers could use an adjustment wedgie. LAW. Your a joke, and its making me laugh. HA HA HA HA HA HA! (P.S. If you really didnt find it funny, why bother to post at all? I mean honestly. What a waste of your time. Cant you think of something better to do than troll? Get out of your mothers basement IMO. ) _________________________________
Evenfall Phoenix The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.11.13 22:59:00 - [48] I completely agree with you Lord Bleu. The NGE ruined SWG, which was such a wonderful and expansive gaming experience. And I also agree that at times it seems like CCP is not doing the smart thing when it comes to changing the game, but I also think that CCP is striving not to make the same mistake that SOE did. Let us hope they always keep in mind SOE and one of the greatest screw ups in MMO history.
Riley Craven Caldari Sunshine Carebear Crew	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:13:00 - [49] Edited by: Riley Craven on 13/11/2007 23:16:31 To Tarminic... Your fanboyism of Eve is rather obvious. You've protected CCP at just about every turn. The simple truth of the matter is you are wrong and for one simple reason. CCP doesnt care about the player base... the proof of this is rather easy to see in every single patch CCP releases. Content is ALWAYS introduced HEAVILY pre nerfed. Instead of actually THINKING about changes and there affects they start messing with things in the game... que the whinners to tell them how fracking stupid they are being so that they pull the changes before they go live. IF (and thats a REAL big IF) CCP actually CARED about their players they would spend time actually considering changes they make to the game instead of saying stupid crap (and I quote) "carriers != hauler" while in the same breath saying that they want MoMs to handle logistics duties (they are a tier 2 carrier) and nerfing their hauling abilities as well. Now that might be very specific, but the point of all of this is that if things were done right in the FIRST place people wouldnt have to get so fracking ticked off about so many nerfs coming into the game. CCP is a company that address symptoms of a problem and not the problem itself. They always have and always will. While I admit freely I never played SWG, I can clearly make the comparision that Trinity = NGE. The only information I need to have is how many people are ****ed off about these changes to come to that conclusion. Whines may always have been an issue in regards to patches, but this patch in particular has brought them out of the wood works so much so that even you can not craft an arguement to dispute that claim.
Tarminic Forsaken Resistance	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:17:00 - [50] Originally by: Riley Craven To Tarminic... Your fanboyism of Eve is rather obvious. You've protected CCP at just about every turn. The simple truth of the matter is you are wrong and for one simple reason. CCP doesnt care about the player base... the proof of this is rather easy to see in every single patch CCP releases. Content is ALWAYS introduced HEAVILY pre nerfed. Instead of actually THINKING about changes and there affects they start messing with things in the game... que the whinners to tell them how fracking stupid they are being so that they pull the changes before they go live. IF (and thats a REAL big IF) CCP actually CARED about their players they would spend time actually considering changes they make to the game instead of saying stupid crap (and I quote) "carriers != hauler" while in the same breath saying that they want MoMs to handle logistics duties (they are a tier 2 carrier) and nerfing their hauling abilities as well. Now that might be very specific, but the point of all of this is that if things were done right in the FIRST place people wouldnt have to get so fracking ticked off about so many nerfs coming into the game. CCP is a company that address symptoms of a problem. They always have and always will. While I admit freely I never played SWG, I can clearly make the comparision that Trinity = NGE. The only information I need to have is how many people are ****ed off about these changes to come to that conclusion. Whines may always have been an issue in regards to patches, but this patch in particular has brought them out of the wood works so much so that even you can not craft an arguement to dispute that claim. In that case, I suppose that we'll have to agree to disagree. ---------------- Tarminic - 29 Million SP in ~~pink~~ Forum Warfare

Clorthos Gallente Tau Ceti Global Production Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:26:00 - [51] Originally by: Davlin Lotze The issue here isnt JUST that carriers are being nerfed. They are pretty much going insane with nerfs this next patch. I doubt any patch in all of EVE will contain as many nerfs as the next patch. They are doing everything they can to dummy down the game so that the avg 3-4 month old player is on par with the avg 3-4 year players. This is wrong IMO. Its the same thing SOE did, and it destroyed their game. I think you are 100% correct. But that doesn't seem to warrant much these days. Out of game balancing will result in such a huge change in player net worths in terms of some supercap pilots, that one is left to wonder whether all SOE nerfs combined could ever approach 1/10th of the impact of these pending changes? I was forced to quit because the changes basically destroyed around 55 bil in wealth I had tied up in supercaps. I own two motherships that are now more or less useless. As a sidenote: to the MC guy, there are even people in your very own alliance who will swear up and down that changes in value of some of these supercaps are not the results of the nerfs but some strange natural process of declining prices that would have happened anyway. With such confusion and outright misunderstanding of simple economics, Eve just became distasteful to the point that I couldn't muster the will to login for any reason. It's supposed to be entertainment, not punishment. 110% correct I spent 2 years skilling up capital and eos pilots to have all of them get a fist in the ****er 3 of 4 account I own are useless so I canceld them all. Canceling my subscriptions is the only way for CCcP to get the point that what they have done is ruin the game as it was sold to me. I spent too much RL monies in subscription fees to be treated like a second class citizen and just "take it". It is all about making the game friendlier to noobs and prevent them from getting uber ganked in low sec or "gasp" thier very first trip to 0.0. What they are going to end up doing is killing off everyone who was sold in the old version of the vision and cannot wrap thier heads around the new version of the vision. This will be no better than bnet, halo3 rooms, wow in under a year. Lots of newer players older ones recycle to more new players or move on to something more substantial. Your (ccp) needs to make the game more sellable to newer players is fine but your proposed carrier changes and your drone changes have negated everything I have been working on for enjoyment so good days sirs. btw my stuff is already gone do not ask you pitiful vultures.
Karlemgne The Black Fleet	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:30:00 - [52] Originally by: Hikari Nakamuru Originally by: Lord Bleu Edited by: Lord Bleu on 13/11/2007 16:00:10Anyway After spending a year glued to the PC grinding on stupid monsters and doing other pointless tasks I achieved my goal of being a Jedi. One month later SOE announced NGE and they made an enemy of me and thousands of more players by wiping out the hard investment literally overnight.. Even now I refuse to play a SOE game, and I never will, nor will any of my kids snip Or am I wrong? You're wrong. The NGE was forced upon SOE devs by management from Lucas Arts. In fact, many of the people that worked on SWG after the NGE went into affect kept trying to change some things back to the way things were before, but Lucas Arts would not let them. So to re-cap, don't blame SOE for the NGE. Blame the source, Lucas Arts. You are exactly 100% correct. Everyone listen to her. -Karl
Karlemgne The Black Fleet	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:33:00 - [53] Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Originally by: Reto Originally by: John Blackthorn For those of us that didn't play the game what change did they make to the Jedi? theres a wiki article about it aswell. just wiki NGE or SOE or Starwars Galaxies. in short: they eliminated the hard work of a load of players overnight by simply allowing everyone to become a jedi, the strongest and most hard to achieve profession in swg. it was very like giving every novize player the option to start as a titan pilot form the beginning of their eve experience. SOE degraded SWG to a game for 12-year-olds without any direction or complexity thus mutating it into a dumb and uninteresting soulless moneymaking merchandise. Exactly!! I wont get into to deep explanation of it, but 2 years of hard consentrated work getting jedi where overnight turned into a starting profession.. Its not good. Its not the way of treating customers. Not to mention they removed lots of the skills, effects from it, and lot of other things giving the profession the soul it once had! Alpha class aint bad if it had consequenses, and so had Jedi, but people whined and whined - mostly brainless and clueless kids - and we then saw the result from it: SWG now just a shadow of what it once was. Drum roll Again, the NGE was mandated by Lucas Arts. SOE didn't have a choice (you do know that Lucas Arts actually owns SWG right?) If SOE had refused, Lucas Arts would have revoked their license, and SWG would have died right there. SOE, in the end, did there best (and are still doing it) to keep that game going. If you don't like the NGE stop blaming SOE for it, because it wasn't their choice. -Karlemgne
Davlin Lotze STK Scientific Black-Out	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:34:00 - [54] There will always be those who applaud CCP for "redistributing wealth" like this. Robin Hood was very popular with the masses. I understand that element although I do think it is bad for any MMO that values a "meritocracy" philosophy. I guess the existance of "communist" corps in Eve should have been a warning against those who might be concerned over having their wealth sacked by the masses. That we(those who believe in a meritocracy) overlooked the apparent success of "communist" elements in successful corps like Evol and RKK is our fault. Had I known CCP's proclivities in terms of embracing a failed IRL philosophy like communism in their virtual world, I might not have stayed around so long, accumulated so much wealth, only to lose it to out of game machinations.
Karlemgne The Black Fleet	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:36:00 - [55] Originally by: Clorthos Originally by: Davlin Lotze The issue here isnt JUST that carriers are being nerfed. They are pretty much going insane with nerfs this next patch. I doubt any patch in all of EVE will contain as many nerfs as the next patch. They are doing everything they can to dummy down the game so that the avg 3-4 month old player is on par with the avg 3-4 year players. This is wrong IMO. Its the same thing SOE did, and it destroyed their game. I think you are 100% correct. But that doesn't seem to warrant much these days. Out of game balancing will result in such a huge change in player net worths in terms of some supercap pilots, that one is left to wonder whether all SOE nerfs combined could ever approach 1/10th of the impact of these pending changes? I was forced to quit because the changes basically destroyed around 55 bil in wealth I had tied up in supercaps. I own two motherships that are now more or less useless. As a sidenote: to the MC guy, there are even people in your very own alliance who will swear up and down that changes in value of some of these supercaps are not the results of the nerfs but some strange natural process of declining prices that would have happened anyway. With such confusion and outright misunderstanding of simple economics, Eve just became distasteful to the point that I couldn't muster the will to login for any reason. It's supposed to be entertainment, not punishment. 110% correct I spent 2 years skilling up capital and eos pilots to have all of them get a fist in the ****er 3 of 4 account I own are useless so I canceld them all. Canceling my subscriptions is the only way for CCcP to get the point that what they have done is ruin the game as it was sold to me. I spent too much RL monies in subscription fees to be treated like a second class citizen and just "take it". It is all about making the game friendlier to noobs and prevent them from getting uber ganked in low sec or "gasp" thier very first trip to 0.0. What they are going to end up doing is killing off everyone who was sold in the old version of the vision and cannot wrap thier heads around the new version of the vision. This will be no better than bnet, halo3 rooms, wow in under a year. Lots of newer players older ones recycle to more new players or move on to something more substantial. Your (ccp) needs to make the game more sellable to newer players is fine but your proposed carrier changes and your drone changes have negated everything I have been working on for enjoyment so good days sirs. btw my stuff is already gone do not ask you pitiful vultures. BS you can skill up a capital pilot in less than a year. Please don't say stuff like "I spent two years skilling up a capital pilot!" What you really me is that it took you 4 months to train up to capital ships, and you've been playing the game 2 years. On top of that you don't like game balancing, you prefer to fly around your wtfpownmobile in a way it was never intended. How dare CCP try to make their ship into what it was intended to be in the first place. -Karl
Kavol Valarius Amarr Unity of Honor	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:37:00 - [56] I know LA forced it upon SOE, doesn't make me hate them any less. Mr Lucas has forgotten his art. About pleasing people with the things he creates. It's all about the money now. You can see that plainly enough with the Star Wars prequels, designed from the ground up purely for a new generation of Star Wars fans. Not made for the current fans. Everything is going the way of dumbing down and appeasing gaming kids with ADD. Oh dear, I feel old now. I'm only 27. -----
Kirren D'marr	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:40:00 - [57] Edited by: Kirren D''marr on 13/11/2007 23:41:10 Originally by: Riley Craven ... While I admit freely I never played SWG, I can clearly make the comparision that Trinity = NGE. The only information I need to have is how many people are ****ed off about these changes to come to that conclusion. Whines may always have been an issue in regards to patches, but this patch in particular has brought them out of the wood works so much so that even you can not craft an arguement to dispute that claim. And in that, you and everyone else who makes the same analogy prove that you know nothing about the NGE. It was not a change to a game, it was a replacement of one game with another. Stop the hyperbole! I'm not saying I'm crazy about all the changes in EVE myself, but people are really taking things drastically out of proportion if they think Trinity or any other update is remotely like the NGE in scope and change. Anyone who makes that comparison is just proving their own ignorance. If you want to say the changes are bad, fine; but when you make a comparison so blatantly out of scale, you only serve to undermine your arguement by making yourself appear the fool.
Lochmar Fiendhiem Caldari International Multi-Player Consortium Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:42:00 - [58] the carrier nerf does affect the solo carrier pilot or the small alliance using a carrier as a staging point. However when your facing down 60 or 70 carriers, its completely different. the nerf is more of a way to balance out warping 60 carriers onto a grid/pos/gate/etc and lagging everything all to hell. Originally by: Halkin bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
Riley Craven Caldari Sunshine Carebear Crew	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:46:00 - [59] Originally by: Kirren D'marr Edited by: Kirren D''marr on 13/11/2007 23:41:10 Originally by: Riley Craven ... While I admit freely I never played SWG, I can clearly make the comparision that Trinity = NGE. The only information I need to have is how many people are **ed off about these changes to come to that conclusion. Whines may always have been an issue in regards to patches, but this patch in particular has brought them out of the wood works so much so that even you can not craft an arguement to dispute that claim. And in that, you and everyone else who makes the same analogy prove that you know nothing about the NGE. It was not a change to a game, it was a replacement of one game with another. Stop the hyperbole! I'm not saying I'm crazy about all the changes in EVE myself, but people are really taking things drastically out of proportion if they think Trinity or any other update is remotely like the NGE in scope and change. Anyone who makes that comparison is just proving their own ignorance. If you want to say the changes are bad, fine; but when you make a comparison so blatantly out of scale, you only serve to undermine your arguement by making yourself appear the fool. You clearly missed the point of what I was saying. My arguement, it doesnt matter what changes were/are made to either game. It doesnt matter what changed, how it changed, or who changed it. The only thing that matters in my Arguement was that anyone can equate Trinity with NGE simply because of the levels of people it ed off. You can say anything you want and it will still be a fact that BOTH patches **ed ALOT of people off. Reading before posting = win.
Turin Caldari Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.13 23:48:00 - [60] Edited by: Turin on 13/11/2007 23:53:46 Originally by: Karlemgne BS you can skill up a capital pilot in less than a year. Please don't say stuff like "I spent two years skilling up a capital pilot!" What you really mean is that it took you 4 months to train up to capital ships, and you've been playing the game 2 years. On top of that you don't like game balancing, you prefer to fly around your wtfpownmobile in a way it was never intended. How dare CCP try to make their ship into what it was intended to be in the first place. -Karl You obiously dont know what your talking about. Anyone who calls a carrier a solo wtfpwnmobile, I just laugh at and write off a someone who has no understanding of carriers, their weakness's, and how simple it is to kill one. I could show you how to kill a fully officer fit carrier with two ships for less than 10 mil isk. Thats balance to you? Thats a wtfpwnmobile? Again. anyone who use's the term "wtfpwnmobile" and "carrier" in the same sentance, are dilluded, and are just spewing the crap from the devblog. You dont really know what your talking about, and it completley invalidates any point you might try and make afterwards. _________________________________



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