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Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.24 09:44:00 -
[1]
if my mining laser gets 200m3 ore every 3 minutes, and my target asteroid has 630m3 ore... it will take me 12 minutes to harvest the asteroid, even though it should only be about 9 minutes and 30 seconds. 9 minutes to get the 600 ore and another 3 for that 30m3 ore.
i know that i can shut off my lasers and such, but i dont always have enough time to, i do other things while i mine. i highly reccommend that CCP makes the lasers automatically shut off when the asteroid is depleted instead of going full cycles. an easy way to do this is make mining lasers similar to combat.
like, my mining laser eats 10m3 ore every 5 seconds and puts that ore in my cargo bay. very simple solution, and i believe it will make mining much more effeciant.
i just got my hulk recently and realized how much time is wasted on an empty asteroid. please fix.
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Thenoran
Caldari Frontier Economics Fallout Project
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Posted - 2007.11.24 13:36:00 -
[2]
It would mean putting ores in cans a real pain as the ore is constantly flowing in your cargohold so you'd have to sit by it and watch it for the whole duration while looking at your lasers doing all the work.
I like that they go in one minute cycles, that way I can do other stuff while my ship does all the work, instead of having to look at asteroids and orange beams 24/7.
Your solution would give more work then it saves really...
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Helen Hunts
Gallente Red Dragon Mining inc
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Posted - 2007.11.24 19:05:00 -
[3]
Mining lasers/strips only calculate ore harvested at the end of the cycle or at deactivation in order to save computation time on the server. Automatically cutting off a laser when a roid is empty would require a few extra calculations with a single miner in a belt. If several miners target the same roid....things get *interesting* as calculations go through the roof for a SINGLE ROCK.
I mine plenty. If I can't be bothered to use the survey scanner, I'll just have to live with the wasted time. _______________________________
Mine da rocks, make more ships. Pop da rats, make more rigs. Sell da gear, make more money.
Any Questions? |
Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.25 02:18:00 -
[4]
why would you have to constantly watch your cargo? it would fill at the same rate that it already does. youd still get (example) 200m3 every 3 minutes.
i seriously doubt that making lasers shut off on an empty roid will do that much harm.
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Gnord
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Posted - 2007.11.25 07:06:00 -
[5]
I have to say:
/SIGNED /SIGNED /OMG SIGNED!!!
Right now a Rokh will SIGNIFICANTLY outmine a retriever for this very reason: It cycles faster in smaller chunks. If you don't believe me, try it. Any ship with 8 miner 2's will VASTLY outmine a retriever.
And alpha wolfgang, you're entirely right. Your cargohold would not fill up any faster, it would just come in more often in smaller chunks.
There's a minor reason why I think it would be.... tricky.
Big ores. There would be a lot of roundoff error (ie every 5 seconds you round down instead of every 5 minutes - that's a lot of rounding down)
If I am mining (bistot I think? 32 m3) if my laser pulls 63 m3 every tick, then I'm only gonna be mining at 51% of my ability. That would **** people off more than a bit of wasted time wasted every FEW cycles.
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Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.25 17:54:00 -
[6]
i need you to explain more about what you mean. im not quite sure what your talking about.
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Deep Spacenine
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Posted - 2007.11.25 18:53:00 -
[7]
/signed
DS9
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Gnord
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Posted - 2007.11.26 00:55:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Gnord on 26/11/2007 01:05:33 Alpha wg: which part was unclear?
I believe you mean roundoff: I explained it pretty well....
Right now, I mine 1700 m3 every 3 minutes. bistot is 16m3.
1700/16 = 106.25 (rounded down) so I'm going to pull 106 bistot every 3 minutes.
let's modify that so I am pulling every ten seconds instead of every 3 minutes.
I will get 94 m3 every 10 seconds. 94/16 = 5.875 (rounded down) so I'm going to bull 5 units of bistot every 10 seconds.
5 bistot * 6 times a second * 3 minutes = 90 bistot.
So, by pulling every 10 seconds, and rounding down every 10 seconds instead of rounding down every 3 minutes, I am getting 16 less bistot.
That means just by changing the cycle times, I am getting a 15% penalty that is entirely caused by roundoff error.
Was that your question?
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Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.27 08:09:00 -
[9]
but what if they just modify ur laser so it doesnt change the total amount?
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Weirdbob
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Posted - 2007.11.27 10:36:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Weirdbob on 27/11/2007 10:36:36
Originally by: Alpha Wolfgang but what if they just modify ur laser so it doesnt change the total amount?
what if they just made it so you could just turn on 'mine' and leave, then come back rich.... if you shut off the laser part way through the cycle you still get the same m3 per second, and if you use a survey scanner you can waste little to no time mining empty roids, its simple but a pain in the ass but thats a price you pay for efficiency. leave mining the way it is, or change it so i make more isk doing it but no one else does
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Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.27 12:38:00 -
[11]
or, they can make the lasers work like weapons. so keeping track of current ore amounts and time estimations can be even more precise.
i do LOTS of mining, and i simply request updated mining.
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Typheonic
Gallente Astrum Contract Services Group
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Posted - 2007.11.27 14:31:00 -
[12]
Greetings,
Being a long time miner I can understand Alpha Wolfgang's point. An idea I saw in another thread might be more appropriate than some of the suggestions here. It would be helpful if asteroids had a health/remaining ore bar in the UI once you had them targeted just like every NPC and player ship you might target. Instead of 3 bars just one would be needed for amount of ore remaining. Perhaps tie it to having a survey scanner mounted as a passive function of the module. This at least would make the process of anticipating a short strip miner cycle a little more intuitive. It means you still have to manually stop the cycle, but you don't have to argue with the rather clunky survey scanner UI.
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Maxpie
Cross Roads
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Posted - 2007.11.27 14:57:00 -
[13]
why not just improve the survey scanner. just show which rocks are being targeted by which lasers. maybe even add a timer.
He put... creatures... in our bodies... to control our minds. He made us... say lies... do things. |
Typheonic
Gallente Astrum Contract Services Group
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Posted - 2007.11.27 16:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Maxpie why not just improve the survey scanner. just show which rocks are being targeted by which lasers. maybe even add a timer.
Well I am a fan of not reinventing the wheel and of removing unneeded complexity. The survey scanner seems to be interesting in design, but still poorly implemented. Why should a miner have to have a separate window open with remaining ore volumes when it can easily be displayed as a health bar under the targeted rock? Combat pilots don't need an extra module and display window to tell if a target's shield has failed or if a target is about to run out of hit points. It also seems like a module that is more appropriate to place on a scout looking for good asteroid belts or a combat vessel pressed into mining duties. The ability to tell the volume of mineable ore in a target asteroid should be built into purpose built mining ships.
The cycle timer is something that could be useful on any module with a cycle time. In many other games involving cycle times some graphical prompt regarding how long is left for a cycle or how long is left before the cycle can be started again is a norm. So yes that should definitely be added.
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Laice
Caldari The Greater Good Novus Aevum
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Posted - 2007.11.27 16:20:00 -
[15]
/signed BUT
i'm concerned that adding if this occured every 5 seconds the databases will have a panic attack. Think about it, every time a new item is created it must be added to the database and a 5 second cycle time would mean that the number of database writes would be up 12 fold. If the servers could cope with it go for it :) I have a really nice signature. It doesnt exceed the 24000 byte limit, or the height restrictions - Laice |
Dr Cedric
Caldari The Nietzian Way Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.27 19:06:00 -
[16]
I think the problem w/ a 'health bar' for the asteroids ore, is that some roids have a huge amount of ore, and others don't. Let me explain better
If i mine Veld, it has (sometimes) up to 200k units of Veldspar....thats its 100% mark. Other roids have less...for example Bistot. A bistot roid might only have 1-2k units in it. Having a health bar would give no objective info on how much you're mining, you'd just have to wait a few cycles to see how much your mining laser is 'hurting' the roid.
A better idea is to have the survey scanner put an amount under the health bar. YOu scan it (and similar to a passive targeter) the roid pops up ready to be mined w/ a health bar, and remaining/total display for ore units. That would be a good change i think.
Dr Cedric
Dipolmatic Liason; Industrial Logistics Technician - The Nietzian Way
-My opinions and ideas do not necessarily represent those of my corporation or alliance- |
Alpha Wolfgang
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Posted - 2007.11.27 23:48:00 -
[17]
good point about the lag with so many ore units.
making a health bar just seems best.
and a roid with 999 m3 will have the same correlation as a roid with 2000m3... the only difference is the 999 will pop faster. and it pops at a correct time instead of on the 3 minute intervals.
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