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Black 5
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:23:00 -
[1]
Battleships are ruining Eve.
First off batttleships shouldnt be able to mine they are called Battleships for a reason...You want a crazy miner?? Ask CCP to make you an industrial ship specific for minning.
CCP has made the battleship the "do it all ship". And because of that its taken away all purpose for using any other ships for anything.
Secondly Battleships are way to easy to aquire. Every noob can buy one after playing for a month. Seeing a battlleship should be like "wow a battleships!, thats one mean beast" But quite frankly they're more common than frigates and its pathetic.
this would bring frigates and cruiser into the game and bring more pvp because ppl wont be so affraid to lose such an expensive ship. So it will prevent the formation of more carebears.
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Kiana'tre
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:27:00 -
[2]
Tell them to take out the sentries and i promise we will get rid of alot of them.
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DeGrand
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:32:00 -
[3]
umm
 Quote:
Secondly Battleships are way to easy to aquire. Every noob can buy one after playing for a month.
this would bring frigates and cruiser into the game and bring more pvp because ppl wont be so affraid to lose such an expensive ship.
Make up your mind please..are they easy to get or expensive?
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:33:00 -
[4]
I have to admit that I was more than surprised to see the battleship's cargo capacity. I personally believe it should have less cargo space than a cruiser since a cruiser is intended as an all round ship and the battleship is meant to be, let's face it, an efficient ship designed for battle and nothing else.
I wouldn't mind, but there ARE industrial ships and mining cans and cargo containers and all sorts of things that can be used to mine better - you shouldn't be in a battleship just because you can be, just like you don't fly everywhere in an industial ship.
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Mandros Aslay
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:43:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Mandros Aslay on 06/03/2004 18:51:17
Edited by: Mandros Aslay on 06/03/2004 18:49:17
Edited by: Mandros Aslay on 06/03/2004 18:44:00
I worry more about the lose of implants and skill points than a battleship..
Lost me a skorp and saved to get a raven .....Got it now. What ship do i use most ?
MY KESTREL.
Why ? speed , can shoot cruise and has a low sig for targeting.
I also test what I can get away with in terms of missons. I get the Caracal if life is hard and if the buggers are being annoying , then the Raven.
Some ships just arent worth the effort. Osprey anyone ...not in my opinion.
But yes Battleships shouldnt have miner ability.
Battleships are for Battle. If you want to kill 2k pirates in a BS then fine but make it cost. Dont allow small and medium weapons to be attached. Large only and expensive charges.
Make the cost of the kill matter ....
BTW dont assume everyone gets battleship in the first month. I worked long and hard for my first ships. I have all Caldari ships now (except the Skorp ) and have worked hard for these......In my day working towards a Indy was a journey and so on .... I hope it still is... there is not enouh content besides the financial drive towards a goal. I have mined, missioned and manufactured, I will NOT pirate , and am a weedy pvp (was better before the Tachs got nerfed (Radio L  ))
Where was I ??? 
Said enuf , didnt follow the subject of the thread probably.
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Nosnibor
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:04:00 -
[6]
This is a very good thread people and I totally agree with you Black 5 - not that that means much
e.g. I set up my small ship to do mining in a system that has loads of say scordite one day and the next.... the belts rapped by battleships we small guys not standing a chance, a little frustrating to say the least
Nos
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Roger Welco
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:11:00 -
[7]
I totaly agree. And have said before that BS should never be able to mine. What is needed is a expansion on the industrial that includes mining ships... and yes they should be expensive, to buy, to train to use and have limited defence ablity. After all youare investing in a money making machine.
Yes i have a several BS and never mined in any of them. and to me honest i to use my kestral 90% of the time, i find cruisers etc to slow..... 
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Fuujin
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:15:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Fuujin on 06/03/2004 19:15:59
"Battleship" is just a way of categorizing the ships. They have turret slots thus they can equip mining lasers. Why should the title of a ship in the game limit what a person uses it for? If it works then do it.
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The sword has to be more than a simple weapon; it has to be an answer to life's questions
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Mamer
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:20:00 -
[9]
I consider myself an average player(not sure exactly what average is) but I dont spend my life on here, I have work and a gf who dosent know of EVE. How can you say someone can afford a bs in a month? I wish. I started back in August and have struggled for everything I have accomplished. Even when I got a Armageddon, it took me 2 months of so to pay off to the owner. I still have it to this day. Now, 8 month later, I am just now getting a Apoc bp copy, and It will prob be another month before I have all the minerals, mosly zyd and mega before I can even build it. I think someone like me this game is very good in terms of risk/reward ect. I think timewise this game is fitting to me finally getting into a Apoc. I feel after all my work and time that I kinda deserve to enjoy something nice. Your right if you say "if you lose it your screwed" yes, so I'll figure out some insurance and just pick any fights carefully if I can. Im happy with how things are and I see no reason to change much.
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Mongo Peck
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:23:00 -
[10]
Cargo space is fine ... after all a Battleship needs to hold ammo etc etc ..
I do fully agree that battleships "should not" be able to fit mining lasers ....
Mongo speaks !!
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Nosnibor
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:25:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Nosnibor on 06/03/2004 19:27:48
I disagree with you Fuujin, it is not just a way to categorise them, they are called what they are called for a reason - study the spec, that's a clue, otherwise they might as well call them Small ships, Medium ships and Large ships!
I think a BS should have drone hold and ammo hold and a very small cargo hold. Problem solved for the ammo issue.
Nos
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Fuujin
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:32:00 -
[12]
I understand that. But like i say, it has turret slots........thus if need be im going to stick a mining laser on there since its clearly more efficient than my thorax.
I can understand where you're comming from though. If they had a diffrent slot altogether for mining lasers then it would make sense but at this point a turret slot is a turret slot, wether its a mining turret or a fighting turret. I just find it dumb that people say "we'll u should mine in one just because it's called a battleship"
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The sword has to be more than a simple weapon; it has to be an answer to life's questions
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Cabadrin
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Posted - 2004.03.06 19:36:00 -
[13]
I've been saying it for months Black 5, screw the bships, cruisers should be the most used.
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Coalition Kill Board |
Nathan Reynolds
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Posted - 2004.03.06 20:04:00 -
[14]
Only thing i got to say to this is: STFU !!!
I do NOT care if YOU dont like to see Bships mining or if you think they are to easy to get.
I for example do not own a bship yet, as many others like me. If Bships get more expensive WE will be the screwed ones.
Maybee YOU would not care (since you already own a stack of em...) but WE will.
So unless every single player in eve gets striped bar his Bs's AND BS BP's/BPC's you cant simply make em more expensive without thinking about US.
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Pacman
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Posted - 2004.03.06 20:35:00 -
[15]
y dont people stop complaining bout the game and just enjoy it for what it is....i think CCP did a wonderful job of making the game the way it is, sure there are a few things i would like to see changed, but i dont go complaining on the forums when something doesnt go my way....its almost arrogent of u to think that the game should be made to do what u like and what u want it to do.....a word of advice is to just play the game, enjoy it and stop *****ing |
IZON
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Posted - 2004.03.06 20:42:00 -
[16]
This this is an old argument one that has never been addressed by the devs. But I agree, having battleships with the ability to mine became a problem when people realised how fast a roid belt could be stripped with a fleet of them.
Remove the ability to mine for BS's and up the mining turrets on 'lvl 5' industrials.
"...master! there's a guy in the south village called IZON, he is a Ninja!" |
Mirimon
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Posted - 2004.03.06 21:26:00 -
[17]
The only good point, that I agree with, that really should have been like this the whole time is Battleship not being able to equip mining lasers. This is one of the most annoying things, IMO, that seems really screwed up, and needs to be fixed. It's REALLY simple...have MINING TURRET hardpoints, and new mining ship...not that hard.
"Then I guess I have no choice...but to kill you all." |
Tank CEO
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Posted - 2004.03.06 21:37:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Tell them to take out the sentries and i promise we will get rid of alot of them.
hahaha YEA.
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syndic4te
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Posted - 2004.03.06 22:13:00 -
[19]
hey tank ur in moo, i though joo was fe
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2004.03.06 22:19:00 -
[20]
The only issue I have with battleships is the fact they can be unbelievable mining vessels. One solution I've seen on the boards several times before was to make Miners and Deep Core Mining Lasers operate only on a dedicated turret mount type, one that battleships and other vessels clearly dedicated for combat should not have.
You read the information on ships and you see how they're talked about as being new combat class ships for a particular race or wahtever, yet those same ships are often use almost exclusively for things they're not "intended" for. Might be nice if that could be fixed somehow.
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
K'roth Manatir
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Posted - 2004.03.06 22:50:00 -
[21]
I totally agree, there are still too many battleships in eve. I think part of the reson they're so prevelant is the way the skill tree works. it just makes alot more sence to train up for battleship asap rather than spending time training your skills to make frigates and cruisers more powerful.
Battleships are everywhere so much so that its hard to do any PvP in a frig or cruiser as you're almost guaranteed to meet a bunch of battleships as your foe.
As there are so many battleship the game has been balanced now in such a way as to make it even harder for frigs and cruisers. NPC hunting is now really hard in anything under a BS. If you want to hunt convoys you cant now due to the long range guns. Piracy in frigs would also be really hard as everyone is in a battleship.
Oh and of course lots of battleships = big risk in fighting = boring blob wars.
CCP seem aware of the problem tho judging by the recent dev chat. I hope they can find a way to balance it soon.
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Horatio Starkiller
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Posted - 2004.03.06 23:24:00 -
[22]
Totally agree there should be a dedicated miner with similar capacity to an indy with a few more hi-slots for more mining laser's. In real life would u take a mining vessel that could hold nothing?
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Nathan Zachary
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Posted - 2004.03.07 23:10:00 -
[23]
Why are always the ppl who already HAVE their Bships AND already made millions with em complaining about em?
You cant change that without think about all the new players that want to earn some isk too in a reasonable amount of time.
and a indy with 2 mining lasers or something along that does not realy compare to an appoc or mega doign it for moths now....
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KIAInkZ
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Posted - 2004.03.07 23:20:00 -
[24]
what's mining?
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Forums/Killboard - http://www.kia-corp.co.uk |
Mongo Peck
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Posted - 2004.03.07 23:24:00 -
[25]
KIAInkZ .......... whats pvp .... 
Mongo speaks !!
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Nemesis I
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Posted - 2004.03.07 23:26:00 -
[26]
Cruisers and Frigates, aswell as Battleships are a fighter class ships. So if the battleship cant have them, neither by the same logic, can the small fighter class ships.
Only solution to your argument, is to make a new ship class for mining - which probably becuase its purpose built for mining, would be huge have just as many mining turrets as a battleship and cause the same arguments.
Ive found plenty of belts to mine in and out of empire space - just takes a bit of work!
Just play the game...
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KIAInkZ
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Posted - 2004.03.07 23:39:00 -
[27]
Quote:
KIAInkZ .......... whats pvp ....
not sure, but i've been advised not to ask you :P
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Forums/Killboard - http://www.kia-corp.co.uk |
Lord JoeBlack
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Posted - 2004.03.08 00:09:00 -
[28]
As far as the problem that Battleships are too easily aquired... The problem is the game moves at such a phenominally slow pace that by the time something new comes out, 80% of all players have the wealth and resources accumulated to aquire whatever they want. This decreases there potential value making them affordable even to new players. And even tho a n00b cant use it worth a damn cause they have just enough skills to fly it, and nothing more. They dont risk loosing much because they can insure it for the time it takes to train up a good skill set with one payment. And they have everything to gain by turning it into a huge mining/npc hunting platform. Then, on top of it all... They have nothing but time (until "soon") to use that battleship to aquire wealth to wait for the next best thing. So the problem is the players are developing faster than the game. Castor was an attempt to slow things down a bit, and release a few temporary solutions to tide people over.. This is one of the main reasons just about 90% of the experienced players I know either left the game or joined a PVP corp like m0o or Evol. Its not battleships that ruin the game... Its a combination of broken game mechanics and lack of content.
P.S. Dont get me wrong.. I love the game. It has huge potential. Just right now I'm completely bored with everything the game has to offer. The only way to move forward is to gain wealth and resorces for an unknown item that will be released at an unknown time. And game mechanics prevent any sense of real power or influence. The most you can do is make people run away and dock/log. Then when you go away they come right back. So I'm waiting patiently until the game has something to offer again. Paying a subscription fee for a game I dont even play anymore in the hopes I can play it later.
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Jayad
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Posted - 2004.03.08 00:22:00 -
[29]
im so worried CCP think the inclusion of T2 Frigs is enough to ballance things.
As mentioned, we need game changing dynamics, extra hardpoint types and more combat mechanics to acurately portray combat of Large/Small vessels.
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Voss Matsu
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Posted - 2004.03.08 00:39:00 -
[30]
Ok, if Battleships weren't designed to mine, what do you make of this:
MOA: Quote:
The Moa-class is almost exclusively used by the Caldari Navy, and only factions or persons in very good standing with the Caldari State can acquire one. The Moa was designed as an all-out combat ship, and its heavy armament allows the Moa to tackle almost anything that floats in space.
THORAX: Quote:
The Thorax-class cruisers are the latest combat ships commissioned by the Federation. In the few times it has seen action since its christening, it has performed admirably. The hordes of combat drones it carries allow it to strike against unwary opponents far away and to easily fight many opponents at the same time.
Most probably the 2 most favored cruiser class ships ingame, and nothing about mining in their description. The moa was designed as an all out combat ship, and the thorax is the latest combat vessel of the Federation. So how dare people use them for mining right?
People have different proffessions in game. Miners paid just as much for their battleships, therefore they are entitled to gain from them, just as combat pilots are. The beauty of eve is that one can outfit their ship to suit their needs. The old "battleships should be used for battle" is getting old people.
A BS is the only option to extend mining abilities from a cruiser class ship, so until industrial mining ships are introduced, stripping BS's of their mining abilities is ridiculous.
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