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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2007.12.10 08:08:00 - [31] The op has a point, gate camping is a pretty lame mechanic which takes all the complexity of Eve and reduces it to 'wack a mole' in space. The ability of Black Ops BS to 'dodge' gate camps goes some way to alleviating this problem, but its not a total solution. 'Abandoned' stargates, found through exploration might give a few more options but really Eve needs reasons to fight away from gates and into space proper. C. Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Dehumanisation - griefers are cool and if you are not a griefer, you do not belong here.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.12.10 08:48:00 - [32] Originally by: Mar vel what kind of chance does 1-2 ships (any 1-2 ships) have against a 12-man gank squad in BS and CS's with Logistics support? Answer: No chance at all. You mean 12 players working together can beat 2 players working together? Game is obviously horribly broken. - DesuSigs
SnakeByte86	Posted - 2007.12.10 09:30:00 - [33] Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: Mar vel what kind of chance does 1-2 ships (any 1-2 ships) have against a 12-man gank squad in BS and CS's with Logistics support? Answer: No chance at all. You mean 12 players working together can beat 2 players working together? Game is obviously horribly broken. If the sentry guns are not supposed to stop camping of the gate, then wtf are they even in the game for? For most pirates, they may as well not exist, because they do pathetic damage.
Gabriel Karade Nulli-Secundus	Posted - 2007.12.10 09:35:00 - [34] Originally by: Mar vel I don't have to go to 0.0 for combat anymore- hell, that's dangerous. So I'll just round up a dozen of my buddies and sit in a circle-jerk @ a gate in a .4 system and WTFPWN everything in sight - without any foreseeable consequence (except those pesky kill rights, which are useless) I mean, WTF - can't you folks think up a way to push this kind of combat into 0.0? -I'd at least like the opportunity to GET TO 0.0 - now I can't even get out of .5 reaosnably well. This is idiotic, crusty old game mechanics. CCP: If you can apply balance to everything in sight - why is this conveniently overlooked? Jerks. click 'map'... 57,999 kills in the last hour "Oh noes a blob! I'd had better go around it..." ---------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Erotic Irony 0bsession	Posted - 2007.12.10 09:36:00 - [35] Originally by: Cailais The op has a point, gate camping is a pretty lame mechanic which takes all the complexity of Eve and reduces it to 'wack a mole' in space. The ability of Black Ops BS to 'dodge' gate camps goes some way to alleviating this problem, but its not a total solution. 'Abandoned' stargates, found through exploration might give a few more options but really Eve needs reasons to fight away from gates and into space proper. C. yes this point has been debated to death, it really has less to do with the fundamental game design of Eve in that almost all of its content is based on beacons and poi with huge gulfs of nothing in between, the gates just exacerbate and remind us how empty the space is on the other hand CCP may just argue they want an easy way to force interaction and to an extent they're right--gate camps exist but only about half of the 0.0 chokepoints are regularly camped and even among those, they are noobs with stealth bombers and things--easily breakable by even a few coordinated people ___ Eve Players are not very smart. Support Killmail Overhaul
Rellik B00n Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.12.10 11:17:00 - [36] outstanding private pile! so suggestions ranging from "get rids of gates" to "just do something." Brilliant. So this means that those of us that want nothing whatsoever to do with the boring-grindfest-posyawn-40jumpsfornothing-epeenwaving-ness that 0.0 warfare generally is will be left with: (1) stations. to fight at? its bad enough watching war targets sit docked for hours (how dare they not just suicide themselves on my guns) nevermind taking out one of the only other places you can catch people. I have a tip for the OP, look for the BIG RED BLOB on the ships killed in the last hour map. Failing that call some of your mighty alliance back to help you out. Failing that wait until you can get out. Failing that use one of the several game mechanics that will allow you to bypass said camps (since they arent even using bubbles!) Failing that just fail. remix:never fades 07 (2) - gall002
Otto Matic	Posted - 2007.12.10 11:28:00 - [37] honk if you don't have an Amamake loss mail with Snigg on it ...
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.12.10 11:33:00 - [38] Originally by: SnakeByte86 Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: Mar vel what kind of chance does 1-2 ships (any 1-2 ships) have against a 12-man gank squad in BS and CS's with Logistics support? Answer: No chance at all. You mean 12 players working together can beat 2 players working together? Game is obviously horribly broken. If the sentry guns are not supposed to stop camping of the gate, then wtf are they even in the game for? For most pirates, they may as well not exist, because they do pathetic damage. What did I say about sentry guns or camping? That's right, nothing. - DesuSigs
Wu Jiun	Posted - 2007.12.10 11:40:00 - [39] Originally by: SnakeByte86 If the sentry guns are not supposed to stop camping of the gate, then wtf are they even in the game for? If sentry guns are to stop piracy then why is there lowsec at all? Belt piracy can be fun but once you are in a well organized pirate gang it gets boring pretty soon as mostly nubs rat in lowsec belts. The real fights are always at the gate. Originally by: SnakeByte86 For most pirates, they may as well not exist, because they do pathetic damage. Thats bull****. It keeps frigates and interceptors from gatecamping which is next to bubbles one reason why lowsec camps are much easier to pass than 0.0 ones. Why should it keep several bcs and bss from camping? Thats just laughable. What are you supposed to bring to a camp? 3 carriers? Well one thing is sure then you'll go on whining anyway so why bother?
Sebastian Thor	Posted - 2007.12.10 12:13:00 - [40] Hello! How are you? I am well. I like playing Eve. With all the space ships and lasers, it is fun! The rifter is my favourite ship! Maybe CCP could make it more powerful by maybe giving it 4 more high slots and a 5% resist to gate camps per level! Yay! I like flying my rifter into Lowsec Space. This is a fun place where all the big spaceships I kill with my rifter give me lots of money. Thankyou CONCORD! And then, I can load up an industrial with all the loot from the dead ships (silly billy rats!) and fly it to Jita and make more money! Thankyou players! Then one day, as I was flying my ship back to my 0.3 system, it exploded! It diddn't take me long to realise, some bad pirate had killed me! OH NOES! And so i had to buy another ship. I was going to write a strongly worded letter of complaint to CCP, but after some contemplation, I realised that, AT NO POINT EVER IS IT STATED THAT PVP IS OPTIONAL. AT NO POINT EVER IS IT STATED THAT YOU ARE 100% SAFE IN ANY GIVEN PLACE (IN SPACE). It is up to you to overcome these problems. If I want to fly an industrial ship into lowsec, there are only certain times of certain days I can do it - times I've figured out through playing the game. There are COUNTLESS threads in these forums about gatecamps and how to avoid them. And guess what? None of them are a 100% garuntees! I'm looking forward to when I've got mining barges trained up, so when I feel like it I can sit in a highsec system and suck asteroids to death in no time and make money off it. And I still might get killed! YES! Thats Right! Even in High Sec Space! Even if I didn't say anything to the person shooting me! THEY SIT AT THE GATES FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN TO KILL YOU AND EVERYONE ELSE! Be like everyone else and discover a way around it! Or join an anti-pirate corp! Or build yourself a titan and kill them all! Or join them! Maybe you need to discover the joys of gatecamping for yourself! But please realise, gate camping is just something that those players are choosing to do at that time. It's not an exploit, it's not griefing, it's not "crusty" or "Old". Eve really is Everyone Versus Everyone. This is how they (the campers) are going up against you (yourself) at that particular time. If it makes you feel better, they probably don't hate you in real life! It's only a game! And think how much you will feel you have achieved when you do get to 0.0! If the concept of never really being safe and no garuntees doesn't sit well with you, then perhaps you need to seek entertainment elsewhere. To CCP - Please please please never ever confine this kind of combat to 0.0 BUT that stuff I said about Rifters would be cool. Eh? Eh?

Ironnight Caldari x13	Posted - 2007.12.10 12:14:00 - [41] Originally by: Mar vel I don't have to go to 0.0 for combat anymore- hell, that's dangerous. So I'll just round up a dozen of my buddies and sit in a circle-jerk @ a gate in a .4 system and WTFPWN everything in sight - without any foreseeable consequence (except those pesky kill rights, which are useless) I mean, WTF - can't you folks think up a way to push this kind of combat into 0.0? -I'd at least like the opportunity to GET TO 0.0 - now I can't even get out of .5 reaosnably well. This is idiotic, crusty old game mechanics. CCP: If you can apply balance to everything in sight - why is this conveniently overlooked? Jerks. If its the pipe out to your 0.0 space, then I guess it would be your alliance that have to clear them, not CCP. 0.0 combat isnt that great anyway, you find someone and they hug a POS until they get four to one numbers, then they start smacking until they have five to one, then they attack, yeah that is much cooler than sitting on a gate in lowsec.
Arkan Omali The Wild Hunt Pure.	Posted - 2007.12.10 12:17:00 - [42] it's up to every individual to comeup with how they want to play. That is ccp's hole idea with eve, a gigant sandbox. So if ya wana gank in 0.4 go ahead. if ya wana gank in 0.0 be prepaired to run and if you are having so much probs with getting into gate camps, i got one word for you. SCOUT. make an trail acc or an alt char on exisitng acc and scout ahead with it, if he gets blown up, well no big deal. scout scout scout....
Agor Dirdonen	Posted - 2007.12.10 12:20:00 - [43] If you're complaining about a gatecamp in a 0.4 system where the attackers have the sentries against them, good luck trying to reach 0.0 where you have bubbles, no sentries and usually even more people on the gate.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.10 13:29:00 - [44] Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: Mar vel what kind of chance does 1-2 ships (any 1-2 ships) have against a 12-man gank squad in BS and CS's with Logistics support? Answer: No chance at all. You mean 12 players working together can beat 2 players working together? Game is obviously horribly broken. Personally I'm hoping to learn what alteration of the game mechanics that would help the two people wouldn't help the 12. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
dimiz	Posted - 2007.12.10 13:59:00 - [45] Of course it is possible to avoid them sometimes, but not always. Doing missions in 0.4 for example is almost impossible, I don't know why ccp even bothered with those agents. Gate camps hurt the game and close off a big part of it to a majority of players. That is not PVP - PVP means player versus player, not player facing certain death at no risk to the attacker. Make those sentry guns hurt, I mean hurt. A few years ago low-sec was exactly that - lower security, you could go through those systems, stay there, sometimes you would get attacked. Today, they are much worse than 0.0.
Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Cult of War	Posted - 2007.12.10 14:04:00 - [46] Someone of S****dly complaining that he got pirated. I know that S****dly mostly operated in 0.0, but anyway, I find it kind of strange and amusing.
Kaar Art of War	Posted - 2007.12.10 14:05:00 - [47] Originally by: Plaetean Do you have any idea how ridiculous you look considering the history of your corp? --- ---
Lazuran Gallente Time And ISK Sink Corporation	Posted - 2007.12.10 14:07:00 - [48] Edited by: Lazuran on 10/12/2007 14:10:41 Edited by: Lazuran on 10/12/2007 14:08:12 Originally by: Arkan Omali it's up to every individual to comeup with how they want to play. That is ccp's hole idea with eve, a gigant sandbox. That's only half the story. CCP make the game mechanics and the OP finds parts of those questionable. Game mechanics limit the ways in which invidivuals can choose how to play. Stargates as they work now, lead to gate camps as a logical consequence, so just like people need to use gates in EVE, they also need to handle gate camps. It's not particularly hard to escape from gate camps (so I don't really understand the OP), but gate camping is the worst PVP (most boring, least challenging, dull, stupid) in EVE and since it is easily 50% (measured by time spent) of the PVP action in EVE, perhaps it should be made less attractive somehow. With Trinity, it just got buffed, unfortunately. Suggested lowsec gate camp nerf: add an indicator of some sort (beacon?) to the other side of a camped gate, that shows how many seconds ago the sentries fired. Some sort of traffic lights ;-P "...been designed for one purpose and one purpose only. Imagine a handful of repair drones pouring from the carebear's mouth. Now imagine they have um, nothing." -Unknown Hel redesigner (2007)
Rellik B00n Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.12.10 15:28:00 - [49] waaaaaaait a minute, this was a joke right? remix:never fades 07 (2) - gall002
Natalia Survenka	Posted - 2007.12.10 15:29:00 - [50] I thought the only mechanic is piracy? And even that's broken afaik.

Call'Da Poleece	Posted - 2007.12.10 15:45:00 - [51] Yup, low sec gate camps is a no brainer, shooting fish in a barrel and as has been mentioned, a well set up cruiser can tank for enough time to get a kill... A good way of stopping it would be to up damage of guns, or even introduce a skill/mod that makes you appear much much more than 15km from the gate (50 ... 100 ... 150??)
JeanPaul Sartre 26th of July Movement	Posted - 2007.12.10 16:28:00 - [52] I want to apply to Pandemic Legion. I have 820k skillpoints (planning on more soon) I have executioners and time in equal measures. (cant fit a cloak yet! sorry) I haven't ever met anyone from RISE, but if hating them is a condition I'm sure I can adapt. Oh! and low sec gate camps don't annoy me too much. Whaddya say? -- Quote: If a victory is told in detail, one can no longer distinguish it from a defeat.
Captain Blart Hideous Mutant Freekz	Posted - 2007.12.10 17:48:00 - [53] Eve Online PvP = Zerg Online, where all the lamers ( understand 90% of the pvp population ) can enjoy their little gate camp at 20 vs 1 (hell we dont want to loose those expensive T2 ships unecesseraly, do we ? ) and can keep thinking : "OMG, we re so l33t !!!!" "hey, let's crush a fly with a sledgehammer" , talk about challenges
Razin The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:07:00 - [54] The whole system of gated travel is flawed from the get go. Choke points leave very limited and extremely inflexible balancing options. Gate sentries is a case in point: make them weak to allow piracy and they stop making sense as an empires' response to outlaws, make them as powerful as they should be and they completely eliminate lowsec gate piracy (bad). There is no viable 'in-between' option. The only long term solution is to phase out gates and get every ship retrofitted with a 'simple' jumpdrive that limits jumping along the current gate routes but allows jumping from multiple locations within a solar system. An open game mechanic like that offers a multitude of balancing options and would consequently result in a tactically rich combat game. ...
Stakhanov Metafarmers	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:42:00 - [55] Originally by: Narciss Sevar roles removed You did the right thing sir 7
BuffB Amarr 13 apostle's	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:44:00 - [56] As a member of the apparently "evil pirate" community, i have to agree that gate camping and station camping are not PvP in the true sense of the word. They are believe it or not....PIRACY!!!! Thats why its called piracy. Its a no good way of earning a living at others expense, whether that be through looting or ransoming (which yes we do and yes we always honour those that pay) If you got ganked, then all i have to say is ADAPT, dont come on here whining about something else in the hope that CCP wave the nerfbat because you lost a BS or something at a gate camp...BOO HOO!!! Get over it and get on with playing the game. Perhaps if you spent more time playing the game and less time whining on the forums you would have worked out how to evade a gate camp and not created another pointless whining thread. Sorry to all other contructive post's for rant but fed up of whining cry baby's who try and ruin our game because they lost something
Adunh Slavy Ammatar Trade Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:47:00 - [57] Originally by: Razin The only long term solution is to phase out gates and get every ship retrofitted with a 'simple' jumpdrive that limits jumping along the current gate routes but allows jumping from multiple locations within a solar system. An open game mechanic like that offers a multitude of balancing options and would consequently result in a tactically rich combat game. Although gates are good for forcing players into the same place, they leave very few options for varied game play. It would be more fun, for both hunter and hunted if there were some actual hunting involved. Sitting at a gate for hours on end, or sending an alt in a shuttle first or pressing F10 are not terribly interesting. Eve needs to shift focus from static camping to mobile combat. Is it really that much fun to sit at a gate, when instead we could have roving gangs attempting to out maneuver one another in a deadly game of hide and seek? Imagine if you will mechanics that make it simpler to gain entry into a solar system, but make it harder to get out, but with out having to rely on artificial choke points to dumbly force players into the same locations. Eve can be and should be so much more than camping online. -AS The Real Space Initiative - V5 (Forum Link)
Razin The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:49:00 - [58] Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Razin The only long term solution is to phase out gates and get every ship retrofitted with a 'simple' jumpdrive that limits jumping along the current gate routes but allows jumping from multiple locations within a solar system. An open game mechanic like that offers a multitude of balancing options and would consequently result in a tactically rich combat game. Although gates are good for forcing players into the same place, they leave very few options for varied game play. It would be more fun, for both hunter and hunted if there were some actual hunting involved. Sitting at a gate for hours on end, or sending an alt in a shuttle first or pressing F10 are not terribly interesting. Eve needs to shift focus from static camping to mobile combat. Is it really that much fun to sit at a gate, when instead we could have roving gangs attempting to out maneuver one another in a deadly game of hide and seek? Imagine if you will mechanics that make it simpler to gain entry into a solar system, but make it harder to get out, but with out having to rely on artificial choke points to dumbly force players into the same locations. Eve can be and should be so much more than camping online. Yeah, that's basically the way I envision it. Activation of the jumpdrive makes the ship light up like a cyno beacon throughout the whole solar system making it a 'warpable-to' target. ...
Rosa Rosette	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:57:00 - [59] Originally by: Mar vel I don't have to go to 0.0 for combat anymore- hell, that's dangerous. So I'll just round up a dozen of my buddies and sit in a circle-jerk @ a gate in a .4 system and WTFPWN everything in sight - without any foreseeable consequence (except those pesky kill rights, which are useless) I mean, WTF - can't you folks think up a way to push this kind of combat into 0.0? -I'd at least like the opportunity to GET TO 0.0 - now I can't even get out of .5 reaosnably well. This is idiotic, crusty old game mechanics. CCP: If you can apply balance to everything in sight - why is this conveniently overlooked? Jerks. you must be sniggs new corp jester
Hannobaal Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:24:00 - [60] How did this person even become a member of Snigg in the first place? In-game it says he has been a member for more than 4 months, and the character has been around since summer of 2003. I suspect someone bought a character here.



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