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Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
400
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Posted - 2012.03.12 01:17:00 -
[121] - Quote
Well... if what you are asking is why on an annual basis we've stagnated I would say the answer is "incarna".
If you are asking why we don't see explosive growth I would say because it takes a few months to figure out even the basics of wtf is going on in this game.
If, however, you are asking why we don't see say 3-400% annual growth (while achievable) I would say the answer is a two parter:
- EvE Gameplay has stagnated. In the early days of EvE, the devs were fearless. They introduced huge new mechanics that radically changed the landscape of the game. The addition of deadspace and conquerable stations in Exodus, Fully owned outposts a bit later, the introduction of T2, T3, Wormholes, warp-to-zero (it was a very big deal at the time) even faction warfare and caps. Some of these expansions were so dramatic in terms of gameplay they forced you to re-learn what you thought you knew about the game. Since wormholes were introduced not much has changed.
- BitterVets are the other problem imho. They complain about everything new or anything that might encourage them to adapt. If something doesn't fit precisely with how they want the game to play them they write a wailing wall of posts, and CCP, bless their hearts, does their best to accommodate them. While the protests last summer were justified imho, I fear it might prevent CCP from taking chances in the future. This coupled with the false perception that one must "catch up" in terms of SP in order to compete is a real turn-off to other MMO players and would-be capsuleers when they contemplate investing any ammount of time in a new universe.
Anyway... that's how I see it. Obviously, it wouldn't take much in relative terms to overcome some of these obstacles. ...and I'm just some random guy on the internet. I'm sure CCP has hired focus groups to look at this and they have probably included some similar points: and CCP more than anyone would likely want to see the playerbase grow, so they know what's up.
We will just have to see what they do. After Crucible, the ball is in CCPs court.
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Large Collidable Object
morons.
1203
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Posted - 2012.03.12 01:20:00 -
[122] - Quote
Chribba wrote:I grow older each day...
However, it does grow, at least in characters
CCP Diagoras: "Jan 2012: 97,892 characters created....And 16,744 characters deleted in Jan 2012."
So what? I never delete my trial-acc scouting alts - I just let them expire...
I assume most people do the same. morons- sting like a butterfly and-ápost like a bee. |
Docter Daniel Jackson
Hendrix Angels Fabricated Confabulations
18
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Posted - 2012.03.12 02:53:00 -
[123] - Quote
I would rather see a game like eve grow slowly and push CCP because they want to grow just that bit more, then have a game like WOW were it was at 12 million subs and Blizzard could not care about there game because they have too much money to give a ****...
Eve been the size it is, is great because the people become a big family and a lot of people know each other while if you play wow, your see some one once and never see them again in your life on wow.
Eve will grow and keep growing over time, but not like other mmo's, Eve as a game needs to grow before the sub numbers can grow as well. Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full. |
Ai Shun
348
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Posted - 2012.03.12 03:17:00 -
[124] - Quote
Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:I would rather see a game like eve grow slowly and push CCP because they want to grow just that bit more, then have a game like WOW were it was at 12 million subs and Blizzard could not care about there game because they have too much money to give a ****...
Eve been the size it is, is great because the people become a big family and a lot of people know each other while if you play wow, your see some one once and never see them again in your life on wow.
Eve will grow and keep growing over time, but not like other mmo's, Eve as a game needs to grow before the sub numbers can grow as well. Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full.
+1 |
Ettu Brute II
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
29
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Posted - 2012.03.12 03:33:00 -
[125] - Quote
Sicex wrote:Eve is cruel, people don't like that, people cry for something easier, we tell them to go play something easier.
Alternative version:
Eve is cruel; people kill players who can't fight back; people cry because killing defenceless players isn't easier; newbies go to find something more enjoyable. |
Ettu Brute II
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
29
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Posted - 2012.03.12 03:36:00 -
[126] - Quote
Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full. Eve is not a sandbox, which is hardly surprising as there is no such thing. |
Docter Daniel Jackson
Hendrix Angels Fabricated Confabulations
20
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Posted - 2012.03.12 03:47:00 -
[127] - Quote
Ettu Brute II wrote:Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full. Eve is not a sandbox, which is hardly surprising as there is no such thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oq2oxt7Nrxo
1:48 into the video is the meaning of a sandbox, but Google works too you know. :) |
Kale deCoste
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:22:00 -
[128] - Quote
So I was looking here...
http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility
And it shows that Eve has shed 66% of its playerbase since it peaked?
That's pretty bad. |
Spc One
The Chodak Void Alliance
14
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:26:00 -
[129] - Quote
Biggest mistake ccp made was removing sanctums from 0.0 systems. Sanctums payed for pvp ships but now almost everyone disabled their alts.
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Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1036
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:41:00 -
[130] - Quote
This is you not knowing how to read.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://vimeo.com/user9887127 Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Docter Daniel Jackson
Hendrix Angels Fabricated Confabulations
21
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:43:00 -
[131] - Quote
People been online, and people subbed are two different things mate... |
Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1038
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:54:00 -
[132] - Quote
Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:People been online, and people subbed are two different things mate...
Its worse than that - the graph shows more recent players to the left. We literally have 66% more players online, not less. ;-)
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://vimeo.com/user9887127 Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1225
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Posted - 2012.03.12 05:55:00 -
[133] - Quote
Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:People been online, and people subbed are two different things mate...
Very true, which seems to confuse many in this thread, however his problem is he doesn't realize which side the newest information is on. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
Amber Green Thorn
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
56
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Posted - 2012.03.12 06:11:00 -
[134] - Quote
If CCP gradually dumbed this game down then gradually their super-computer in London would choke up and die, simply because tons more people would stick around and play it. Can CCp afford to invest right now??
The mathematics .. (or math - dumb yankz):
CCP invests more into the hardware + Dumb this uber complex game down ( multiplied by spaceships) = Increased playerbase.
Equals more cold hard cash for them
Good on them!
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Ai Shun
349
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Posted - 2012.03.12 06:46:00 -
[135] - Quote
First question - do you know the most recent date is to the left of that graph? It is an obvious one, but it seems a few people do not realise that.
Second question, which points / periods are you selecting as your peak and as your current? And what time-frame are you placing on each one? Because when I look at the pure peak numbers it says:
Current Record: 63,170 Peak today: 50,322
Now there is no Alliance Tournament today. And the game is in a recovery mode. But I can't see how ~13,000 pilots is 66%.
So, can you please explain how you got to that strange looking number? |
Gantz Tleilax
Tleilax Foundation
48
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Posted - 2012.03.12 07:20:00 -
[136] - Quote
Whenever I'm down on Eve I try other MMOs. They are just so shallow and superficial, that I always come back to Eve. It's one game thats kept my interest the longest.
A recent example is I took two characters to 50 on SWTOR in 2 months. It started off fun, but I have no desire to log back on, it feels so pointless. It's not just SWTOR, I play every damn MMO (WOT, Fallen Earth, Conan, Tera, Aion, Black Prophecy, DCUO, Lotro, Rift, etc etc.) that comes out, hoping to one day move past Eve.
Eve, I can't ******* quit you! |
Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
21
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Posted - 2012.03.12 11:31:00 -
[137] - Quote
My opinion (opinions are all you're gonna get on this topic) is that its down to the long-standing difference of opinion between pvp players, and those not interested in pvp. You don't have to go far in these forums to find threads with these two sides.
There are those that play eve for the PVP. They love to see ships exploding, and more importantly, you crying about said ship exploding. They generally have been playing for a while, know what they are doing, and live in null or low-sec space. They're of the opinion that eve is a "pvp-only" game, and will enforce that opinion by blowing up your ship.
Then there are the players of high-sec, who play eve because they get enjoyment out of the game by doing all the boring stuff. Hauling stuff, buying high and selling low. Industrialists with their pretty spreadsheets, managing production lines and making stuff. Pve players, doing boring missions over and over and over. And miners, watching their pretty lasers hit rocks and getting free resources [Gasp!, insert standard "They're not free!" rant here]. These players have NO interest in PVP
I've been playing since 2005, and always have been of the opinion that these two groups should be able to co-exist in eve. Afterall, who cares what you get from eve, as long as you are playing, and therefore, paying. Empires there to allow people to be safe while they get to grips with eve's MASSIVE learning curve, and slowly facilitate their movement into low and nullsec space.
I think now tho that this mechanic is broken. High-sec players don't have any incentive to natually move-on in the game, as those players that have already made the transition make it difficult for those that haven't. Suicide ganking is pretty standard now, and what incentive is there for newer players to make the leap into more dangerous space if they're already getting pwned in supposed safe space?
I've always been of the opinion that empire should be safe for those players that want to do the boring stuff, and have no interest in pvp. If thats what they get from eve, then good for them. Its certainly not what i enjoy, but each to their own. Its those players that enjoy pvp, and with their "pvp-only" game opinion, that feel justified in forcing pvp on those that don't want or enjoy it. And people that can't get what they enjoy from eve just unsub. Thats what's ultimately harming the continued growth of eve.
But voicing such opinions on these forums are likely to get the pvp-side of the formula bashing you.
Personally, i don't see why they are so passionate about attacking those that can't and don't want to fight back. Don't they get enough pvp from null-sec space? Or is it that the players there shoot back? |
baltec1
781
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Posted - 2012.03.12 11:40:00 -
[138] - Quote
Xen Solarus wrote:Personally, i don't see why they are so passionate about attacking those that can't and don't want to fight back. Don't they get enough pvp from null-sec space? Or is it that the players there shoot back?
It pays well to shoot them. |
Nomad I
University of Caille Gallente Federation
51
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Posted - 2012.03.12 11:52:00 -
[139] - Quote
This can't be true. There is no real PVP alternative to EVE. |
Pheusia
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
5
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Posted - 2012.03.12 11:54:00 -
[140] - Quote
Ettu Brute II wrote:Sicex wrote:Eve is cruel, people don't like that, people cry for something easier, we tell them to go play something easier.
Alternative version: Eve is cruel; people kill players who can't be bothered to learn how fight back; people cry because killing defenceless players isn't easier; newbies go to find something more enjoyable.
fyp |
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Idont Getitatall
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.03.12 12:14:00 -
[141] - Quote
Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:I would rather see a game like eve grow slowly and push CCP because they want to grow just that bit more, then have a game like WOW were it was at 12 million subs and Blizzard could not care about there game because they have too much money to give a ****...
Eve been the size it is, is great because the people become a big family and a lot of people know each other while if you play wow, your see some one once and never see them again in your life on wow.
Eve will grow and keep growing over time, but not like other mmo's, Eve as a game needs to grow before the sub numbers can grow as well. Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full.
Actually in terms of seeing a player twice is more common in wow, as you are only playing with a little fraction of the players, even if it has 12 million subs one is actually playing with 5.000-15.000 players per server unlike in EVE with only 1 server.
Thats one of the great things about eve - one massive universe, so if you want to meet or play with more people then eve is actually bigger than wow :) |
JitaPriceChecker2
State War Academy Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2012.03.12 12:25:00 -
[142] - Quote
Keep in mind server inst sharded so it is actually the bigger player base then one you would meet in WOW.
Also CCP has neglected EVE for quite some time and it backfired on them.
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Docter Daniel Jackson
Hendrix Angels Fabricated Confabulations
23
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Posted - 2012.03.12 12:27:00 -
[143] - Quote
Idont Getitatall wrote:Docter Daniel Jackson wrote:I would rather see a game like eve grow slowly and push CCP because they want to grow just that bit more, then have a game like WOW were it was at 12 million subs and Blizzard could not care about there game because they have too much money to give a ****...
Eve been the size it is, is great because the people become a big family and a lot of people know each other while if you play wow, your see some one once and never see them again in your life on wow.
Eve will grow and keep growing over time, but not like other mmo's, Eve as a game needs to grow before the sub numbers can grow as well. Eve is a sandbox and some times that sandbox can get full. Actually in terms of seeing a player twice is more common in wow, as you are only playing with a little fraction of the players, even if it has 12 million subs one is actually playing with 5.000-15.000 players per server unlike in EVE with only 1 server. Thats one of the great things about eve - one massive universe, so if you want to meet or play with more people then eve is actually bigger than wow :)
You have a point, but I'm more talking about LFR and LFD system which is about putting angry kids together to try have a ***** fight about dps lol.
Also people on a lot of wow servers spend more time trolling trade chat then playing the game... I would know I troll them on a day to day thing to keep my self from been bored lol. |
Terminal Insanity
Convex Enterprises Unprovoked Aggression
259
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Posted - 2012.03.12 14:28:00 -
[144] - Quote
Most new players get suckered into joining small corps that dont really do anything. They have a bad/boring experience there and eventually quit.
A lot of players want to "get in on the ground floor" which is admirable but it leads to lots and lots of boredom usually.
I've run a highsec corp and i know my corp's lack of activity was the direct reason for at least 2 people quitting. Since then, i've closed my corp and recommend to newbies to join only large alliances.
I recommend increasing Corp/Alliance creation fees to discourage small corps that almost never survive. Or place a limit on how often a player can create a corporation AND require standings to create a corp. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
The I and F Taxation Trust
320
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Posted - 2012.03.12 14:35:00 -
[145] - Quote
Xen Solarus wrote:(...
Then there are the players of high-sec, who play eve because they get enjoyment out of the game by doing all the boring stuff. (...)
Until we grow bored and leave the game as there is no endgame for hisec, no endgame for soloers, and no endgame for people with a life
Then of course, if a player got a life, or don't feel like making new friends who can stab his back for free, or think that losing his means to have fun is not fun at all, then such player should not be playing EVE... and they aren't, actually. They are leaving the game almost as fast as new players subscribe, thus EVE doesn't grows. EVE residents: 5% Wormholes; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 6: 100% non-Highsec residents.
EVE demographics vs CSM demographics, nothing to worry about...-á |
Bootleg Jack
Potters Field
22
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Posted - 2012.03.12 14:36:00 -
[146] - Quote
Hans Hoff wrote:I started playing EvE just over 3 years ago. There always seems to be the same amount of players at the same time of day, which is slightly over 50K at around 22:00 down to 20K at around 09:00. This has not changed in all this time, so I'm wondering What's up? Could it be that players get frustrated about the limitations and leave, or basically the game lacks something to keep enough people interested? Theories?
In EVE new players are not future end gamers, they are a commodity that is consumed |
Terminal Insanity
Convex Enterprises Unprovoked Aggression
259
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Posted - 2012.03.12 14:38:00 -
[147] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Until we grow bored and leave the game as there is no endgame for hisec, no endgame for soloers, and no endgame for people with a life
There is no endgame for -anyone-anywhere-. Its a Sandbox. Did you have an End-game when you were playing in the sand box as a kid?
You build your castles, dig your tunnels, roll marbles around your empire and if the other kid had flashy Tonka trucks, you'd go over there and stomp his castle down |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5432
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Posted - 2012.03.12 14:39:00 -
[148] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Until we grow bored and leave the game as there is no endgame for hisec, no endgame for soloers, and no endgame for people with a life GǪbut that's largely because EVE has no endgame beyond what you define for yourself. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University Ivy League
745
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Posted - 2012.03.12 16:09:00 -
[149] - Quote
Xen Solarus wrote: Then there are the players of high-sec, who play eve because they get enjoyment out of the game by doing all the boring stuff.
What you find fun in the sandbox is not what others find fun in the sandbox.
But the main reason that people stopped moving out to null-sec is:
- Not understanding how to survive out there, or earn ISK. - Not wanting to play 23x7 (which is mostly a myth). - Null-sec and w-space income potential has not kept up with other areas of the game. - Not everyone wants to play the blob vs blob game. - It all feels "settled".
CCP needs to look at the game balance again. Add more minerals (in total) to the ABC ores to make them better, revisit the income potentials in null-sec and w-space, add more things to the exploration drop tables in null-space / w-space, etc.
Or add more territory. The last territory expansion was the drone regions in 2007 and the w-space regions in 2009 or so. There's been no new territory added to the map since then. Blow the map out, add a dozen new null-sec regions around the edges of the map, which would make it less likely that you can get from one side of the map to another quickly. Triple the number of w-space systems. Encourage a new land-rush. |
highonpop
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
24
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Posted - 2012.03.12 16:14:00 -
[150] - Quote
OP
Eve online is the ONLY mmo game that has GROWN in its number of active players since its release, and continues to grow
you don;t read much do you? |
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