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Caldari: Train Crow or Rokh?

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Chemical Castration	Posted - 2007.12.22 07:36:00 - [1] Edited by: Chemical Castration on 22/12/2007 07:39:04 Hey all, kinda new to the game, and I'm trying to decide where to go next. Honestly, the Drake is incredibly boring. And the Raven seems like a big Drake with an active tank instead of passive. So, I'm not going there. However, while in frigs, I enjoyed rails, and I enjoyed fast ships with missiles. For combat, I like small to medium gangs. So, the two options are right now: Crow - Decent for soloing, easy to train T2 missile skills compared to guns, fast, good for tackling/dps on small targets. Rokh - Good sniper even if you only have T1 guns (from what I've read) good tank, lots of damage, GREAT for gangs because you warp in @ 100km or so and start popping people. Either of these play styles honestly seem fun to me, and they'll both take about 20 days to get to the point of flying them somewhat efficiently. But whichever one I choose, I'll probably focus on a lot more in the future. Which one is more useful nowadays in small/med PvP gangs? (Not quite so much concerned with fleets, because AFAIK the Rokh is the easy choice for fleets) Thanks! Edit: A plus for training up to Rokh is I'm not a huge fan of missiles. So training up the skills for hybrids would open up easy training to Gallente battleships.
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.22 07:49:00 - [2] I'd train the Crow. I'm training it now. :p -Liang -- I give up (Make me say whatever you want!): Price Check: Liang Nuren
Radcjk Caldari Dark Star LTD Atrocitas	Posted - 2007.12.22 08:15:00 - [3] A basic sniper Rohk (and I mean basic,) is going to take less training time than a decent crow. A decent crow will need good missile skills, cap skills (even with inty boost a mwd isnt eternal), navigation skills, and the prerequisite T2 equipment. T1 missiles are fine for fitting issues as long as good named launchers are used, but otherwise you're going to want t2 or best named on it minimum. They tend to be 17-25 million isk learning expieriences otherwise. Any way theyre such opposite ships Id look at your preffered style of play and what best compliments your corporation and / or gang mates. For small and medium gangs Id personally go with the Crow. Small gangs tend to move quckly. BS with sniper set ups don't. Again, comes down to gang tactics. A second bonus to the Crow is that if you like small ships with rails its only a few other skills to the Harpy. Being a frig / cruiser man myself Id say crow from my own taste.
IHeartYou Synthetic Frontiers	Posted - 2007.12.22 18:10:00 - [4] IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship.
Roxanna Kell FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.12.22 18:23:00 - [5] Frig size in general are a good palce to start pvp, that and cruiser sized ships. Leave BS flying to those with a good rack of skills and skill points. It won't be long before you won't ahv emuch support and skills to train for a crow and you will be starting on a bigger vessel, And the support skills for previous ships will come in useful with the rest.
Lance Malorne	Posted - 2007.12.22 18:32:00 - [6] Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. I lol'd at this.
Syn G	Posted - 2007.12.23 01:09:00 - [7] Originally by: Lance Malorne Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. I lol'd at this. as did i. how do you get 150 - 200 dps on a crow? thats cruiser dps.
Resonancee Amarr DarkRavers.	Posted - 2007.12.23 01:11:00 - [8] Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. ROFL best post off the year. Originally by: IHeartYou Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps
Goshinko	Posted - 2007.12.23 01:18:00 - [9] Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. I lol'd heartily.
Goshinko	Posted - 2007.12.23 01:34:00 - [10] Edited by: Goshinko on 23/12/2007 01:35:12 For real, it IS possible to get 150 DPS out of a crow. If you fit three Caldari Navy BCUs, missile DPS rigs and Dread Guristas thorn rockets, with level 5 skills. ololol In all honesty, Crow did make a good anti-ceptor boat with the right fitting, since nobody actually expects you to actively engage. I wont share my setup, but let's just say a little tank and a domi web goes a long way.
Bager Gray	Posted - 2007.12.23 01:43:00 - [11] Originally by: Liang Nuren I'd train the Crow. I'm training it now. :p -Liang Liang said train crow so you train crow because Liang is awsome. Oh and the crow requires fewer skills, better for a new player.
Stuart Price Caldari Havoc Inc Blood Blind	Posted - 2007.12.23 07:29:00 - [12] Been flying Caldari ships since I started playing in early '04, so here's my tuppence: Crow: Always useful unless you're at gates/stations in lowsec and a naughty pirate. Very good tackler, easier to fly than other ships in its class due to missiles not caring about your own speed or transversal. Can just run if you have a crapload of command ships/bs's dropped on your head. Sadly it's made of paper so if you DO start to take hits it means you're probably about to ride the podmaster express. It's also not such a useful dogfighter unless you pack a web yourself and trust your gank & tank to beat the other guy. It is also (and this is a crucial point) FAR quicker to train up the skills required to be effective. Rokh: Don't snipe in it unless you love activities like collecting things in jars, watching paint dry or the thrill of a rare locomotive. You want blasters! Specifically you want t2 blasters, a crapload of damage mods and an injected tank. You will be extremely killy in a Blokh. Other battleships will hide at the other end of the playground due to your incredible unfair ability to deal 800dps out to 18km with faction AM ammo or about 600dps out to 32km with Null. They will sulk at your strong tank (until you run out of cap charges and die) and cry when you unleash the ECM drones. As part of a gang (for Caldari are the 'getting on with others' race) you will become a damage ***** and start gloating over the amount of kills you're top damage on. Sometimes even 'geddon pilots will hurl abuse at you after you outdps them on something (if this happens, tell them to fit some actual gank of their ships, tank-obsessed cowards!). A Raven (even post-Trinity) can't hold a candle to a properly fitted gank-Rokh imho. Sadly, you need a metric crapload of skills before this becomes viable and/or funny, including near perfect gunnery. Ultimately, get a Crow and annoy people with it while you train for a Rokh. Then complete the Caldari Triumverate of LOL by training for a Falcon. With scan probes. "I got soul but I'm not a soldier"
Stuart Price Caldari Havoc Inc Blood Blind	Posted - 2007.12.23 07:34:00 - [13] Originally by: Goshinko Edited by: Goshinko on 23/12/2007 02:26:43 For real, it IS possible to get 150 DPS out of a crow. If you fit three Caldari Navy BCUs, missile DPS rigs and Dread Guristas thorn rockets, with level 5 skills. ololol In all honesty, Crow did make a good anti-ceptor boat with the right fitting, since nobody actually expects you to actively engage. I wont share my setup, but let's just say a little tank and a domi web goes a long way. Edit: I was wrong! You can get 194 DPS out of a crow! 3* Rocket Launcher IIs (Dread Guristas thorn rockets), Neutron blaster II (dread guristas antimatter) Gistii, domi webifier, domi scrambler 3* Caldari navy BCUs Warhead calefaction catalyst I Bay loading accelerator I 'Snapshot' ZMN2000 implant Or, just buy a Crusader and fit it for 15-20m and get like 200 DPS out of it, or a Taranis and gank-fit it for 270 DPS. I just have to say, that's expensive for a ship that'll last 3 seconds. "I got soul but I'm not a soldier"
Squatdog DROW Org Brotherhood of the Spider	Posted - 2007.12.23 08:25:00 - [14] hey watch you mouf call Drake boring!1 I'm in the same boat myself; I could by a Raven right now, but want something expendable I can PVP and ruin other people's enjoyment of the game with. My trusty Drake can easily solo multiple 1.25m BS spawns in 0.0, which provides most of my income.
Wayward Hooligan Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.12.23 08:27:00 - [15] Neither, train into a Falcon. That thing is a HUGE help in small gang combat. Its a big force multipier and with cloak you do a lot of fun stuff. Not much for solo but in a gang it owns. . .. WELP! .. .
6Bagheera9 Slacker Industries Cult of War	Posted - 2007.12.23 08:31:00 - [16] Wow there is a lot of BS in these thread, and not kind you fly if you know what I mean. Rather than drafting a carefully constructed argument discussing the pro and cons of both ships, I'm going to just tell you to get a crow and leave you to take my word on it.
Ipos	Posted - 2007.12.23 11:08:00 - [17] Training for a Crow myself, got tired of the speed ships floating around and the setup I have got in mind makes perfect against thoose. - A Rokh is a very dif. boat, works well as a sniper and decently as a blaster boat but tbh I don't see the need of a blaster rokh anymore now that torps got buffed.
Rib0 Regression.	Posted - 2007.12.23 13:07:00 - [18] Originally by: Stuart Price Been flying Caldari ships since I started playing in early '04, so here's my tuppence: Crow: Always useful unless you're at gates/stations in lowsec and a naughty pirate. Very good tackler, easier to fly than other ships in its class due to missiles not caring about your own speed or transversal. Can just run if you have a crapload of command ships/bs's dropped on your head. Sadly it's made of paper so if you DO start to take hits it means you're probably about to ride the podmaster express. It's also not such a useful dogfighter unless you pack a web yourself and trust your gank & tank to beat the other guy. It is also (and this is a crucial point) FAR quicker to train up the skills required to be effective. Rokh: Don't snipe in it unless you love activities like collecting things in jars, watching paint dry or the thrill of a rare locomotive. You want blasters! Specifically you want t2 blasters, a crapload of damage mods and an injected tank. You will be extremely killy in a Blokh. Other battleships will hide at the other end of the playground due to your incredible unfair ability to deal 800dps out to 18km with faction AM ammo or about 600dps out to 32km with Null. They will sulk at your strong tank (until you run out of cap charges and die) and cry when you unleash the ECM drones. As part of a gang (for Caldari are the 'getting on with others' race) you will become a damage ***** and start gloating over the amount of kills you're top damage on. Sometimes even 'geddon pilots will hurl abuse at you after you outdps them on something (if this happens, tell them to fit some actual gank of their ships, tank-obsessed cowards!). A Raven (even post-Trinity) can't hold a candle to a properly fitted gank-Rokh imho. Sadly, you need a metric crapload of skills before this becomes viable and/or funny, including near perfect gunnery. Ultimately, get a Crow and annoy people with it while you train for a Rokh. Then complete the Caldari Triumverate of LOL by training for a Falcon. With scan probes. this
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2007.12.23 14:38:00 - [19] crow, goes 6km/s rather easily, forget missile skills, just get a point on the guy, as far as i am concerned the crow doesn't have any high slots, sure i put some launchers up there, but meh, they wont decide any fights. unless i want to go solo belt pirating and try to catch some caracels/frigs rokh i wouldn't feel comfortable flying without A LOT of skills, and to 5 at that. namely most the Engineering skills, a good 5mil sp in gunnery, about 1 mil sp in drones. and bs 4, and then a bunch of other sp sprinkled around.
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.12.23 15:15:00 - [20] Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. moderated - removed to facilitate search query
Chemical Castration	Posted - 2007.12.23 15:44:00 - [21] Lot of argument here for Crow. :D Thanks for the information guys.
Dors Venabily	Posted - 2007.12.23 17:09:00 - [22] Edited by: Dors Venabily on 23/12/2007 17:10:02 Originally by: Lance Malorne Originally by: IHeartYou IMO, Rokhs get extremely boring, sniping isn't as much fun as it sounds...and blaster Rokhs just suck. However, Crows seem to suit me best because it's just so much fun to toy with your target, then own them with your 150-200dps. Also, I've been messing around with other set ups on the Crow (Rocket/plate)...just overall a more fun ship. I lol'd at this. /qft
Cpt Cosmic	Posted - 2007.12.23 17:27:00 - [23] actually rokh is a very good blaster boat and still better then the raven even if torps are buffed now. To do full damage the target has to be BS sized and target painted and your dmg will be big crap against cruiser sized targets where a rokh will hit when the target is webbed. Rokh sports good dps @ranges of 19km with antimatter and 30km with null what means it doesnt have to come close like the megathron or hyperion. this makes it very good @bs gangs. the rokhs buffer tank is also better then the one of the raven/mega. only downside is it needs mids for tank (same like the raven) = few/no ewar mods but this should be rly no problem in a gang but it can fit its lows with a rack of mag stabs and still tank very well.

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