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Hellmar	Posted - 2004.03.16 11:38:00 - [1] We are finalizing the testing of 1.10.1408 to go out tomorrow. This patch contains, among other things, the removal of role restrictions for online/offline toggling of modules in space. This is a small change for us, just removing the role check, but a possible huge change for the game, as you can now over-commit your powercore and for example toggle travel and combat setups while in space. Now the reason for role restricting this feature in the first place was because in the past there have been attribute stacking bugs with this feature. By rapidly toggling, it was possible to stack the effects of a particular module. These bugs should now have been ironed out but to be sure I request that you test this extra special now with 1408 on Chaos. The patch notes for 1408 are being prepared and should go live later today.
Titan AE	Posted - 2004.03.16 11:44:00 - [2] Edited by: Titan AE on 16/03/2004 11:46:40 Edited by: Titan AE on 16/03/2004 11:46:25 Heh, you got this up bright and early :P Q deleted.
UnIQu3	Posted - 2004.03.16 11:44:00 - [3] oh like that hellmar :)
Lurk	Posted - 2004.03.16 11:52:00 - [4] This should not be possible with mechanical modules like cargo expanders IMO.
Tyria Evenstar	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:13:00 - [5] Edited by: Tyria Evenstar on 16/03/2004 12:15:46 Hellmar, NO! Remember what happened when the last time patch day was on the same day as the CSM? The CSM was messed up, due to having to restart and people not being able to log in and join in the chat. Please reconsider this, and release it on Thursday, so we can have a guaranteed smooth-running CSM. -Tyria.
Hellmar	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:16:00 - [6] Man, again I forgot that. Well I think it's best to move the CSM time in general to a day that is less conflicting with patches. IÆll discuss this with kieron
Leitari	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:22:00 - [7] stickehhh? Here, Only the silent survive.
Tyria Evenstar	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:32:00 - [8] Well, as long as you make sure the CSM delegates are informed of any time/day changes, before the currently scheduled time on Wednesday, that'll be fine. -Tyria.
Tani Yih	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:48:00 - [9] How does one participate in the developer chat sessions as a normal idea providing player? Or out of general interest?
Taurar	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:50:00 - [10] Quote: Man, again I forgot that. Well I think it's best to move the CSM time in general to a day that is less conflicting with patches. IÆll discuss this with kieron sure thing, but dont forget to tell us first ;) Malachlite incognito
Twiagon	Posted - 2004.03.16 12:53:00 - [11] Quote: 1406 Removed shield hardener effect. It needs to be rewritten. I hope this is just the gfx effect when activated and not the actually benefit of having a shield hardener fitted??? Quote: 1408 Note: you need to change the build number to 1407 in boot.ini before applying the patch. By tomorrow, this will be auto in the patch yes? I am pretty sure not all the 7000+ players (or however many it is) play every day or even every week and certainly a lot of them don't come to the forums or would know where to look to happen on this little nugget....... Even if it is included in the news for the patch on the day.... err, you can't get ingame to see the news until after you have patched. Just a thought or two
Popov	Posted - 2004.03.16 13:23:00 - [12] The shield hardener effect removal is just the graphic effect "played" when in use not the funtionality of the module (although I'm sure they actually mean armour repair effect here as that was the one causing the uber lag not shield hardener) The boot.ini note is just for chaos patching, this will not be needed to patch your TQ up to 1408 I'm sure.
Majin Buu	Posted - 2004.03.16 13:35:00 - [13] are npc rats fixed? BoB KillBoard
Athule Snanm	Posted - 2004.03.16 13:45:00 - [14] Am I reading this correctly that, for example, someone can fit multiple MWD, quickly flip them online and zoom out of danger then flip them offline again? If so _______________________________ Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene!
drunkenmaster	Posted - 2004.03.16 13:53:00 - [15] Quote: Am I reading this correctly that, for example, someone can fit multiple MWD, quickly flip them online and zoom out of danger then flip them offline again? If so I doubt it will be a quick thing, Athule, that would suck the fun out of most encounters. Although, I'm just guessing, I would imagine (and hope) to see a 4-5 minute delay in turning an item offline, and turning items online would still be instant. Should put a stop to people turning off their guns, powering up their triple MWD sandwich, and jetting off before you've even targetted them. .
Harisdrop	Posted - 2004.03.16 14:04:00 - [16] Do you know how major this is. It means that stations are about to become a taxable place for docking. Where standings of thukker will finally come to bear on you. It means that docking and repackaging will cost soon. YEAH. The owning your own station will be the most profitable. Where Alliances will be able to run free in 0.0 Most might not get this and think short term but hey. -------------------------- Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies
Arthur Guinness	Posted - 2004.03.16 14:18:00 - [17] having the csm on irc might be an idea :)
MicroFrag	Posted - 2004.03.16 14:50:00 - [18] I wish the fitting bug was fixed too... i.e. when you switch ships and some modules are always switched off plus when you try to switch them on, you run out of CPU if it was a tight setup... relogging fixes that... my assumption is that if you switch ships, the weapon upgrade skill is not being applied correctly. I also think the modules are not being active because it first tries to activate the modules and then applies the bonus for Engineering skill... pretty annoying to have to relog each time my agent asks for a kill mission and I have to switch to my apoc...
Zagum Darkfin	Posted - 2004.03.16 15:04:00 - [19] Please do not do this. Switching modules off and on while in flight will basically mean: 1. You do not need high skills to run all your modules. 2. Every Ship will have a MWD 3. Newb characters with minimal skills will be just as effective pilots as seasoned vets in regards to skills. 4. Scorpions will be more over powered with its 8 med slots. Who would need to train to Engineering 5 and Electronics 5?? No one would. If travel time is what you want to reduce, how about installing jump drives like you mentioned almost a YEAR AGO. Titans anyone? Do not do this.
Tsual	Posted - 2004.03.16 15:08:00 - [20] Edited by: Tsual on 16/03/2004 15:08:54 Too late they already opened pandoras box, as you might want to call it. -------------------------------------- Tsual - Miner from faith, frigat junky for life. Ritual of the Qua'nadhar.
ManniXXX	Posted - 2004.03.16 15:31:00 - [21] I have to agree i don't like the idea of this, it seems to open up too many ship setups whilst in space and really dramatically boosting the upper hand that bships have already got. The shield hardener effect, it was fine b4 the last patch why does it suddenly need rewritten?
Tyrrax Thorrk	Posted - 2004.03.16 15:52:00 - [22] Modules toggleable on off ?? WHAT A HORRIBLE CHANGE ;( Why don't you go on and make sentries have 800 au range too ? Oh and maybe we can have sec rating never go up ! Yeah that'd rock. Go CCP ! http://eve.klaki.net/
dalman	Posted - 2004.03.16 15:54:00 - [23] Quote: Please do not do this. Switching modules off and on while in flight will basically mean: 1. You do not need high skills to run all your modules. 2. Every Ship will have a MWD 3. Newb characters with minimal skills will be just as effective pilots as seasoned vets in regards to skills. 4. Scorpions will be more over powered with its 8 med slots. Do not do this. I don't see ANYTHING in your points. An offline module is a wasted slot. And why the hell wouldn't people need high skills to fit good setups? lol. M.I.A. since 2004-07-30
Leekar	Posted - 2004.03.16 16:00:00 - [24] Is the lagg when using more than one armor reparier fixed in this patch. 'Cuase the whole area just becomes a slide-show if you try to do that now.
Cirle	Posted - 2004.03.16 16:27:00 - [25] Quote: An offline module is a wasted slot. Indeed. I would expect that the one of the initial effects of the changes will be to give less specialised setups (ie mission runners) a little more flexibility, for example when running around fast with mwd then shunting them off at the target for the duration of a fight, then shunting them back on to return home. What I would be very surprised to see would be any of the more specialised setups switching in a couple of modules for use 'just in case'. Offhand I can think of very few which have so much benefit but such high requirements that you would want to ever toggle between them, but I am sure if there are some they will be discovered. Cirle
Majin Buu	Posted - 2004.03.16 16:27:00 - [26] Quote: Please do not do this. Switching modules off and on while in flight will basically mean: 1. You do not need high skills to run all your modules. 2. Every Ship will have a MWD 3. Newb characters with minimal skills will be just as effective pilots as seasoned vets in regards to skills. 4. Scorpions will be more over powered with its 8 med slots. Who would need to train to Engineering 5 and Electronics 5?? No one would. If travel time is what you want to reduce, how about installing jump drives like you mentioned almost a YEAR AGO. Titans anyone? Do not do this. Quote: 1409 You can only put a module online in space if you have 95% of your cap charged, toggling a module to online will wipe your capacitor down to 33% full. i think that puts everything to ease BoB KillBoard
Reah	Posted - 2004.03.16 16:46:00 - [27] so does this mean turning on/off modules, or actuall re FITTING in space? im getting confused here
Nexz	Posted - 2004.03.16 16:59:00 - [28] I think this is a very cool addition. Finally i can put both combat and speed setups on my ships ^^ _____________________________________________ I am Millennium
Vitari	Posted - 2004.03.16 17:05:00 - [29] I think this is just turning them on/off not refitting. So it is not that much a deal.
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.03.16 17:17:00 - [30] Errrr, the toggleable module thing is really only going to be useful for MWD's surely? Can't think of many other modules which are required for travelling that you don't really need in a fight. Having said that, if your cap drops to 33% after "toggling" your MWD on, I doubt you could activate it at all........ LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Ertai Vodalion	Posted - 2004.03.16 17:29:00 - [31] curious how this will influence new modules like cloaking devices ....
Scorpyn	Posted - 2004.03.16 17:49:00 - [32] Please don't release the patch tomorrow. I tried the patch, and after I did I couldn't even start eve at all.
Baun	Posted - 2004.03.16 18:14:00 - [33] I assume the module still has to be fitted, however, in order to be toggled on. In this case the change isnt really that big of a deal. It just formalizes the MWD mechanics already in game (the ability to activate it if its deactivated), whilst invalidating it for use in running away (if there is a time delay) and validating it for use in travel. The Enemy's Gate is Down
Imperishable	Posted - 2004.03.16 18:18:00 - [34] why is everyone talking about MWD stuff? it's not gonna work with offline modules, because: Quote: You can only put a module online in space if you have 95% of your cap charged, toggling a module to online will wipe your capacitor down to 33% full.
Ishkur	Posted - 2004.03.16 18:24:00 - [35] Edited by: Ishkur on 16/03/2004 18:27:00 Maybe this will make cap boosters more powerful in combat? Sure is good for people with lots of med slots... growl Edit: The note doesn't mention toggling offline... Will that take energy too? For example: Equip MWD, fly up to target, toggle off. What happens then?
Benton	Posted - 2004.03.16 19:06:00 - [36] Agree with Zagum Darkfin. Let me add a remark about the current 0.0 and 1.0 situation. Look at the map, press ships destroyed in last 24 hours and guess what? 0.0 systems almost empty compared to above 0.5 sys. Now aint that the opposite thought of having empires and security forces? Wrote them a mail, got the map to back it up. Mmm, going the wrong direction. Now this.
Hippey	Posted - 2004.03.16 19:15:00 - [37] Quote: 1409 You can only put a module online in space if you have 95% of your cap charged, toggling a module to online will wipe your capacitor down to 33% full. Hmmm. Well this is a 1409 change and Hellmar wants to go live with 1408. So I sure hope as hell that the plan is to include 1409 in the TQ release as well so this little gem can go in as well. ------------------------------------------- If you kill them, they will die! Sport the war, war support The sport is war, total war When victory's really a massacre. The final swing is not a drill It's how many people I can kill!
Lark	Posted - 2004.03.16 19:29:00 - [38] This is going to make missions fairly easy. I generally know when I am going to fight. I have an mwd at the moment, the opportunity cost of this is an empty high energy slot. CCP just gave me an extra gun. Whether this is good or bad is a different story/
BH Hurricane	Posted - 2004.03.16 19:33:00 - [39] Quote: Is the lagg when using more than one armor reparier fixed in this patch. 'Cuase the whole area just becomes a slide-show if you try to do that now. Please test it out. We have reason to believe so. But need verification by many sources. __________ Hurricane Bug Hunter Lead
BH Hurricane	Posted - 2004.03.16 19:35:00 - [40] Quote: Please don't release the patch tomorrow. I tried the patch, and after I did I couldn't even start eve at all. Agreed. Patch 1410 should fix that. Let us know if it does not. __________ Hurricane Bug Hunter Lead
kieron	Posted - 2004.03.16 21:37:00 - [41] Quote: Well, as long as you make sure the CSM delegates are informed of any time/day changes, before the currently scheduled time on Wednesday, that'll be fine. -Tyria. If there are any changes to the time or day of the CSM, the delegates will be informed of the changes beforehand. As it currently stands, the patch will not go into effect tomorrow, and will not impact the CSM in any manner. kieron Community Manager, EVE Online
Scorpyn	Posted - 2004.03.16 21:44:00 - [42] Edited by: Scorpyn on 16/03/2004 21:49:03 Quote: Quote: Please don't release the patch tomorrow. I tried the patch, and after I did I couldn't even start eve at all. Agreed. Patch 1410 should fix that. Let us know if it does not. This time, I get to the logon screen at least. The server is full at the moment though, so I can't do any further testing - and I have to sleep now too Edit : I retried logging on, and it worked until I pressed esc (which was after about 5-10 seconds of logon time or so). Sorry I can't send a bug report right now, but I really need sleep...
Tyria Evenstar	Posted - 2004.03.16 21:56:00 - [43] Quote: If there are any changes to the time or day of the CSM, the delegates will be informed of the changes beforehand. As it currently stands, the patch will not go into effect tomorrow, and will not impact the CSM in any manner. Then all is well. -Tyria.
Athule Snanm	Posted - 2004.03.16 22:35:00 - [44] Quote: Edited by: Ishkur on 16/03/2004 18:27:00 Maybe this will make cap boosters more powerful in combat? Sure is good for people with lots of med slots... growl Edit: The note doesn't mention toggling offline... Will that take energy too? For example: Equip MWD, fly up to target, toggle off. What happens then? I remain very concerned about this feature - and as you point out it will be severely skewed to those with lots of mid slots. It basically un-nerfs the MWD for those whilst leaving everyone else with a higher percentage of the critical mid slots wasted. Personally if it has to come in I'd say the cap penalty should be 100%, along with the shields, whenever a module is activated or deactivated. _______________________________ Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene!
sSense Thade	Posted - 2004.03.16 22:36:00 - [45] Load your indy up full with all low slots fitted with cargo expanders... ...Get in space, swap everything for overdrives/mwds... What is gonna happen to the now excess cargo?
Celt Eireson	Posted - 2004.03.16 22:42:00 - [46] Nothing I think, from what little I've read the changes don't let you change modules that are fitted, just whether they are marked as active or not. So you can't swap modules.
Majin Buu	Posted - 2004.03.16 22:59:00 - [47] omg U CANNOT CHANGE MODUALS INSPACE. The changes in the next patch only allow u to toggle moduals on/off THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN FITTED IN A STATION! BoB KillBoard
Cirle	Posted - 2004.03.16 23:09:00 - [48] Quote: Having said that, if your cap drops to 33% after "toggling" your MWD on, I doubt you could activate it at all........ Yes, you could, but whether you could activate it twice would depend on whether it is 33% of the original, or 33% of the final (reduced) level. The question is; could you bring 2 mwd online and fire them each once, as one mwd by itself is useless for escaping for cruisers and battleships. Of course, we have to hope there are no nasty little bugs in there where it just sets the cap to 33% rather than reducing only if > 33%, as that would lead to an interesting problem :) (no, I do not really believe anyone would code that, but stranger things have happened in the world) Cirle
Spanker	Posted - 2004.03.16 23:39:00 - [49] Quote: omg U CANNOT CHANGE MODUALS INSPACE. The changes in the next patch only allow u to toggle moduals on/off THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN FITTED IN A STATION! woah... down boy, down
Spanker	Posted - 2004.03.16 23:49:00 - [50] Quote: Load your indy up full with all low slots fitted with cargo expanders... ...Get in space, swap everything for overdrives/mwds... What is gonna happen to the now excess cargo? I gather, and as Majin so kindly pointed out lol, refitting actual modules won't be possible. But you have a point though, what happens to your cargo when you shut down your cargo expanders? Or won't they be on/off-switchable?
ProphetGuru	Posted - 2004.03.16 23:52:00 - [51] I wanna know what happens when you DE activate the module. Your cap/shield levels should remain at current levels, with only a recharge boost, but I can see, given.... um history.. caps and shields popping up 25% with a toggle. Evolution..... Just when you thought you were winning.
Achec	Posted - 2004.03.17 01:53:00 - [52] Quote: omg U CANNOT CHANGE MODUALS INSPACE. The changes in the next patch only allow u to toggle moduals on/off THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN FITTED IN A STATION! You should know by now that most people only read 1/2 of whatever is written. (so in that honour: G Fu Yo Se)
Doppleganger	Posted - 2004.03.17 04:44:00 - [53] Edited by: Doppleganger on 17/03/2004 04:46:03 Quote: Quote: Load your indy up full with all low slots fitted with cargo expanders... ...Get in space, swap everything for overdrives/mwds... What is gonna happen to the now excess cargo? I gather, and as Majin so kindly pointed out lol, refitting actual modules won't be possible. But you have a point though, what happens to your cargo when you shut down your cargo expanders? Or won't they be on/off-switchable? Simple toggling expanders online and offline does nothing now .... why would it change? You put and expander on your ship it doesnt matter if its toggled online or offline it doesnt use any power or cpu and once its on it doesnt matter what state is on/off you still have the gained cargo space and loss of speed. An Expander is a change to your ship's structure so it has no on/off state just a fitted or not fitted state that can only be done in station. Same with overdrives and nanofibers. :edit: a 'quote' got misplaced
severed	Posted - 2004.03.17 08:24:00 - [54] Edited by: severed on 17/03/2004 08:25:47 Quote: Yes, you could, but whether you could activate it twice would depend on whether it is 33% of the original, or 33% of the final (reduced) level. The question is; could you bring 2 mwd online and fire them each once, as one mwd by itself is useless for escaping for cruisers and battleships. You could not bring 2 MWDs online, cap must be charged to 95% to turn a module on, after turning on first one, cap drops to 33% ___________________________________________________________ All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy.
drunkenmaster	Posted - 2004.03.17 09:55:00 - [55] cargo expanders are not affected by online/offline status. It is a hull modification. You can turn off your TV, but you can't turn off the wall. unless you got some freaky hi-tech wall, but, by having one, you volutarily retire from this conversion. .
Sumica	Posted - 2004.03.17 10:38:00 - [56] Good example. Seems to me it's just a way to fit more powerfull systems on smaller ships but the second I see a frig sporten a 1400 is the day I quit. Your not stupid just misinformed Ö
Megagame	Posted - 2004.03.17 11:21:00 - [57] I dont think that even whit tech5 powercore upgrads or supermega elite frigets it coudt take a 1400mm on it and use it :) Now I become death, the destroyer of worlds
FileCop AI	Posted - 2004.03.17 11:42:00 - [58] Quote: Quote: Having said that, if your cap drops to 33% after "toggling" your MWD on, I doubt you could activate it at all........ Yes, you could, but whether you could activate it twice would depend on whether it is 33% of the original, or 33% of the final (reduced) level. The question is; could you bring 2 mwd online and fire them each once, as one mwd by itself is useless for escaping for cruisers and battleships. Of course, we have to hope there are no nasty little bugs in there where it just sets the cap to 33% rather than reducing only if > 33%, as that would lead to an interesting problem :) (no, I do not really believe anyone would code that, but stranger things have happened in the world) Cirle You guys don't get this. You can only toggle online/offline if your cap is at minimum 95%. After toggling 1 mwd online you have 33% cap left - now you have to wait a while depending on your cap recharge, until you again have 95% cap. Then turn on your second mwd - 33% cap. Now wait a while again and boost up your 2 mwd. You're out of cap and can't toggle them the second time (unless you wait hella long before turning 2 mwd on. Now - no matter what - you're dead before you're done. So NO - this is not a way of escaping battle. FileCop AI of MASS Co-CEO
cashman	Posted - 2004.03.17 11:56:00 - [59] So no update today after all? ____________________________________ »»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»
Spanker	Posted - 2004.03.17 12:02:00 - [60] Quote: I wanna know what happens when you DE activate the module. Your cap/shield levels should remain at current levels, with only a recharge boost, but I can see, given.... um history.. caps and shields popping up 25% with a toggle. Yup, can I MWD up to a guy in my blaster megathron and suddenly go tank on his ass?
Durania	Posted - 2004.03.17 13:12:00 - [61] Quote: Quote: I wanna know what happens when you DE activate the module. Your cap/shield levels should remain at current levels, with only a recharge boost, but I can see, given.... um history.. caps and shields popping up 25% with a toggle. Yup, can I MWD up to a guy in my blaster megathron and suddenly go tank on his ass? As it stands on chaos the reduction in cap/shields is there the moment the mwd is brought on line, taking the mwd off line produces a potential increase in shield/cap which you can then boost to with recharge/boosters. I really don't like thinking how many missions I've done over time, or how long they've taken on average.
Boei	Posted - 2004.03.17 13:31:00 - [62] If u guys want to reduce travel time, i got an idea for u. Make it possible 2 autopilot with the bookmarks u have in people&places. If u bookmarked your way, your traveltime is fastly reduced!!!
Jazzatola	Posted - 2004.03.17 13:32:00 - [63] Quote: The note doesn't mention toggling offline... Will that take energy too? For example: Equip MWD, fly up to target, toggle off. What happens then? But why would you switch a module off if not to activate another? The only situation I can think of is to free up resources used by the module. This seems like a tactic more than anything. If you need more energy for your ship for some purpose you should be able to disable modules at will to achieve it. I think this is a fair exchange that shouldn't be penalised.
Aitrus	Posted - 2004.03.18 06:06:00 - [64] Quote: Quote: The note doesn't mention toggling offline... Will that take energy too? For example: Equip MWD, fly up to target, toggle off. What happens then? But why would you switch a module off if not to activate another? The only situation I can think of is to free up resources used by the module. This seems like a tactic more than anything. If you need more energy for your ship for some purpose you should be able to disable modules at will to achieve it. I think this is a fair exchange that shouldn't be penalised. Simple. MWD's drop your max cap and max shields by 25%. SOOO.... You MWD up to your enemy, disable the MWD, and get an instant boost to your max shield and cap. Thats why someone would switch it off without activating another module.
Scorpyn	Posted - 2004.03.18 08:07:00 - [65] Quote: Simple. MWD's drop your max cap and max shields by 25%. SOOO.... You MWD up to your enemy, disable the MWD, and get an instant boost to your max shield and cap. Thats why someone would switch it off without activating another module. I believe that they'd still have to go through the recharge time though...
Drutort	Posted - 2004.03.18 08:36:00 - [66] Quote: Quote: Simple. MWD's drop your max cap and max shields by 25%. SOOO.... You MWD up to your enemy, disable the MWD, and get an instant boost to your max shield and cap. Thats why someone would switch it off without activating another module. I believe that they'd still have to go through the recharge time though... exactly why would you get instant cap/sheilds? it would give you a max but your cap/sheilds would be at the current out of yoru max so if mwd has 3k with mwd on and you turn off mwd and you get then like 4k max but you still have 3k out of 4k and for the person who said they can use blasters i think it might work but the thing is you will have to recharge your sheilds cap and you will still be stuck at the same values that you turned off your mwd... sure you could boost more and more cap will recharge but you only free up max value... so the best thing would be to use cap bat cells or whatever, when you turn off mwd pump some E and turn on your sheild booster but then again who is going to do this that much? since you could do it now and its not in the fab support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo my MoBlog
Christa Larne	Posted - 2004.03.18 09:13:00 - [67] There seems to be a lot of opinion (on both sides) as to what this will do to the gameplay, but stop for a moment and consider the realism aspect. I'm not a BS level player as yet and when flying cruisers I often find that in one fit-out or another I end up with a slot free somewhere on the ship because I dont have all the CPU / Power required to fit something else of use. In 'realistic' terms I would do exactly what is proposed, I would fit an extra module that I could 'swap' with another one as and when needed. I think the cap usage issues proposed should stop people taking serious advantage of this as a tactic - so long as when you toggle an MWD offline the shield & cap do not jump up to full at their new level - but as regards strategy who says it is unrealistic for me to take my MWD offline and re-route the power to shields and cap when I see an incoming threat. I would still need a shield & cap booster to take serious advantage. Sure it will change gameplay a bit, but is that a bad thing?
Hillbilly bobby	Posted - 2004.03.18 10:57:00 - [68] anyone know if this patch is gonna go ahead today or not?
Caeneus	Posted - 2004.03.18 11:34:00 - [69] Can someone explain the changes to the missle skills. It says that you need: lvl3 light missles for heavy missles (which I don't have) Lvl3 Heavy missles for torpedos (which I don't have) And obviously all the above for torpedos. I already have torpedos, will I still be able to use them? Or do I have to waste pointless time training missles I will never use? Can't think of anything witty to put here.
Zinjan	Posted - 2004.03.18 11:35:00 - [70] Could we get an update on time of release?
Pantheon Lea	Posted - 2004.03.18 11:39:00 - [71] Edited by: Pantheon Lea on 18/03/2004 11:41:18 Quote: Could we get an update on time of release? Seems to be today Patch Notes is here. Pantheon Lea (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination.
Cineas	Posted - 2004.03.18 11:50:00 - [72] Just tried to update my client to the 1411 patch I downloaded from this site and got a checksum error, among other various messages. What gives?
Pantheon Lea	Posted - 2004.03.18 12:07:00 - [73] Edited by: Pantheon Lea on 18/03/2004 12:08:34 Quote: Just tried to update my client to the 1411 patch I downloaded from this site and got a checksum error, among other various messages. I just upgraded mine, no problems, so you might want to download again. Pantheon Lea (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination.
Cineas	Posted - 2004.03.18 12:17:00 - [74] Cheers, will try it again.
Caleb Fog	Posted - 2004.03.18 12:20:00 - [75] Hi! hmm.. can someone pinpoint where to download the update ? nOOB., Caleb
Christa Larne	Posted - 2004.03.18 12:30:00 - [76] Were the changes to missile skills advised in advance??? I could have been training up my standard and heavy missile skill over the past few days. Instead I am going to lose my ability to use both Heavy Missiles and Torpedoes with no apparent warning. I can really see me taking on lvl3 agent kill missions against 85k rats with Defenders and Light Missiles! Okay, so maybe these changes were needed (I always did think it a bit silly that I didn't have to train past lvl1) but we should have been warned about it!
Ruffles	Posted - 2004.03.18 12:39:00 - [77] Quote: Were the changes to missile skills advised in advance??? I could have been training up my standard and heavy missile skill over the past few days. Instead I am going to lose my ability to use both Heavy Missiles and Torpedoes with no apparent warning. I can really see me taking on lvl3 agent kill missions against 85k rats with Defenders and Light Missiles! Sorry I have to agree. It is a reckless to remove somethingÆs functional nature without warning people in advance. This will affect a lot of people for at least the next few days, mostly minmatar and caldari granted, but its still a careless change. It will increase petitions and support for the next few days if you aren't giving people sufficient warning. You know as well as I people will log in and do what they always have done, start a new mission, go out into a belt hunting. Only to come time to fire/reload and get errors saying they can't use those weapons. At the very least think of your support staff folks that will get the brunt of this change.
Calide	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:10:00 - [78] All i can say is that im looking hopefully on this patch. Im without corp, never found the right one. i dont want to say all i tried are bad, but ..we didnt fit together anyhow, whoevers fault it was. So since i do all alone, this patch might give me the chance to mine something better then always and ever kernite, and have a chance to play without corp and have some good success in higher systems tough.
Cineas	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:16:00 - [79] No we were not notified, I didn't even know it was on the cards. I think Tank CEo started a thread about torpedo requirements within the last week. Maybe they thought they would go ahead with it and change it. Caleb the patch can be found on the main eve-online page under downloads. Got the patch installed, I has to reinstall eve because some of the files were corrupt, the patch couldn't find the correct file.
Ruffles	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:24:00 - [80] The change is fine, I understand why they want to do it. Its the manner its being implemented that is normal. Just changed without notice to the playerbase. Warn people 2 or 3 days in advance and this would never have the potential it now has to affect the player base and the support staff/resources. If people were warned it its happening in 3 days you can likely avoid 95% of cases, assuming some people won't be playing due to working way, holidays, etc.
Robert Fi'ania'Tharius	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:26:00 - [81] Quote: Previously, it was possible to load an unassembled module on a ship. Now, is a ship has an unassembled module fitted to it, the module will be moved into the cargo hold. If there is insufficient space in the cargo hold and the ship is in space, the module will be jettisoned. Otherwise, the module will be destroyed. This is a bug fix. ok I'm confused at this.... Scenario 1: I'm in station with a fully loaded cargo hold. given what was stated in the patch notes, I decide to install my newly aquired miner 2, but alas I forget to unpack it, Being that I'm not in space when I attempt to affix it to my ship, it is now ( Quote: Otherwise, the module will be destroyed. ) so I lose my miner 2 since cargo is full. Confusion: First: Why would it not simply drop to the floor. If it does, where else would one be that is "otherwise eg. not in space" where this would be an occurance Second: How does one even attempt to fit a module to ones ship IN space for there to even be code involving jettisoning a packaged module into space when trying to fit it to a ship? Comments on On/Offline toggle: I see so many complaints, but this is a good idea. As I see it first of all NO ONE will EVER TOGGLE during battle, or even NEAR an enemy, it would be death surely. Scenario: In my newbified frigate, I have a random scanner installed, yet, at the same time I like to use mutliple AB's (no mwd skill yet) but the scanner reduces the use to but one AB, where as I could use two..now if I have no use for this scanner, in a safe area, I will turn it off, and turn on my AB's so I can now travel quicker. or Perhaps the same loadout, I have a hvy power req' weapon on my ship, which will not work when either the ab's or the scanner is online, before warping into the kill zone, I'm going to turn my weapons on...now unfortunatley I am reduced to not using my AB's and if I wish to, I assuredly cannot do so during battle as it'll reduce my capacitor to a dysfunctional level and I'll end up waiting for recharge before anything I've toggled to becomes useful... k just my thoughts... Robert Fi' **Axiom Technologies Incorporated - [Axi] on your stock ticker** _______ Justice for the Intaki People
Cineas	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:37:00 - [82] Agreed Ruffles, a little pre emptice warning would have been nice. But I can understand the devs must be pretty busy, and the missle treatment might have been a last minute addition. Ps can we have splash damage back please?
Harisdrop	Posted - 2004.03.18 13:47:00 - [83] Edited by: Harisdrop on 18/03/2004 13:53:19 Forgive me but are players suppose to be stupid by default and need a warning for everything! Here should be below every character before clicking character. "As you venture out into space things will happen that are unexplained. Take risks, do things uncommon and unkown outcomes may result." -------------------------- Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies
ElricUK	Posted - 2004.03.18 14:18:00 - [84] Quote: Added level 3,4 and 5 public scenarios. Whats that?
Ruffles	Posted - 2004.03.18 14:59:00 - [85] Edited by: Ruffles on 18/03/2004 15:00:12 Quote: Forgive me but are players suppose to be stupid by default and need a warning for everything! Here should be below every character before clicking character. Actually its not so much that, its you HAVE to assume they are as a software company. If you don't you are not covering potential support consequences. If you don't, your support calls may go up to the point you can't handle it, and your customer is unimpressed by your level of support. Simple avoidance tactics work, like covering your own ar$e as its called. If you have warned someone, then you can politely point out to them they were informed when they start yelled at you for functionality X not working. Hell they may have taken steps to ensure users with the current skills can keep them, we will see. If they didn't you can bet that support petitions/emails whatever will go up, and that is something that could have been avoided if you are taking away functionaility. I would dare say it will be a commonly answered question in the help channel. If you are making things easier to use, its a different matter, as those that weren't able to use them before now benefit, like the in the case of large armour repairers. The point is with a little forethought the potential increase in support could have been minimized, it will never be avoided, but you can dampen it Harisdrop.
Cineas	Posted - 2004.03.18 15:34:00 - [86] Harisdrop your post is called a troll post, a completely pointless post made to **** people off. Guess what didn't work you just look like a muppet. You can still use your torps or cruise missles for the moment it would seem, but can't train them any higher. By the way devs, well done with the change to the agents in stations, it now shows the agents quality. A good idea. Also when you reactivate a fitted offline MWD it automtically gives one boost, a nice touch that will be sure to improve frigate combat. It gives meaning to escape and evade now About that beepy noise when you come out of warp...

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