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Amanda Eidolo	Posted - 2007.12.26 21:56:00 - [1] Edited by: Amanda Eidolo on 26/12/2007 21:56:58 Boost Amarr ships, I cannot win a fight with my Harbinger vs. Hurricane. My E-morale is very low because of this.
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:01:00 - [2] Not to be rude, but I think the problem probably lies in you rather than your ship. This isn't to say that the Harbinger couldn't use a bit of lovin', but the defeatist attitude is a bit =( On a side note, how do you fit your Harbinger? -Liang -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Amanda Eidolo	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:04:00 - [3] The matter isn't in my fitting, but the fact that my lasers hit Hurricanes top resistances and Hurricanes turret's hit my weakest resistances. This is overkill against Amarrian ship. I require a boost for my E-morale!
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:11:00 - [4] Originally by: Amanda Eidolo I require a boost for my E-morale! i can haz ur stuff? -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Storm Strike	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:14:00 - [5] Well hes got a point, they are rather similar ships and it does seem like hurricane does a bit better.
Akane Miyamoto Paisti	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:14:00 - [6] sniffs the air I smell fail. --------------- The Miyamotos, Chaper #1
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:16:00 - [7] Originally by: Storm Strike Well hes got a point, they are rather similar ships and it does seem like hurricane does a bit better. Every time I fight a Harbinger in my Cyclone, I die. I demand someone nerf the Harbinger because it picks on my lowest resist (EM at 0%) -Liang -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Kissapasi Kissapasi Corporation	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:16:00 - [8] THIS IS SO WRONG! I require DAMAGE BOOST to lasers NOW! 25% damage boost to lasers would bring amarr back from their super-nerfed status.
JamnOne Amarr	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:33:00 - [9] Edited by: JamnOne on 26/12/2007 22:34:54 Originally by: Amanda Eidolo The matter isn't in my fitting, but the fact that my lasers hit Hurricanes top resistances and Hurricanes turret's hit my weakest resistances. This is overkill against Amarrian ship. I require a boost for my E-morale! Please tell us, how was your ship fitted so we can look at it. Based on your comment you should have totally descimated his shields and struggled with his armor a little bit knowing that his shields have 0% resists against EM which is your primary damage source. When you do provide your fitting please include the drones you used. Edit Since you don't think it is your fitting, how are your skills? The Harbinger is strictly a gank ship if you have the proper skills. In case you are wondering, yes I am a Harbinger pilot have been for over 3 months and as my skills get better so does the damage I cause. ________________________ Originally by: CCP Prism X Hah! Vengeance is sweet!
Amanda Eidolo	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:44:00 - [10] I cannot provide the information you requested. My Harbinger is our fleet's flagship. I cannot just give my fitting for this use, if any of our enemies would see this information they would fit their ships against mine and overwhelm us. My E-morale is still very low. I require this boost for not my personal desires but for the feeling of all Amarrians!
JamnOne Amarr	Posted - 2007.12.26 22:57:00 - [11] Edited by: JamnOne on 26/12/2007 23:00:39 Originally by: Amanda Eidolo I cannot provide the information you requested. My Harbinger is our fleet's flagship. I cannot just give my fitting for this use, if any of our enemies would see this information they would fit their ships against mine and overwhelm us. My E-morale is still very low. I require this boost for not my personal desires but for the feeling of all Amarrians! If you are using a Harbinger for a fleet flagship then you have an issue. I would strongly recommend an Absolution or Damnation at a minimum. If you can not fly one of those skill wise, then use a Prophecy, it has the "Battlecruiser Skill Bonus: 10% reduction in Medium Energy Weapon capacitor use and 5% bonus to all armor resistances per level". It is made for tanking and has one launcher slot if you need to throw missiles on there to give you a different type of damage to use besides EM & Therm. As for the claim that you "require this boost for all Amarrians", I agree Amarr needs to be boosted but not for your argument. ________________________ Originally by: CCP Prism X Hah! Vengeance is sweet!
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.26 23:02:00 - [12] Edited by: Dristra on 26/12/2007 23:03:57 Originally by: Amanda Eidolo I cannot provide the information you requested. My Harbinger is our fleet's flagship. I cannot just give my fitting for this use, if any of our enemies would see this information they would fit their ships against mine and overwhelm us. My E-morale is still very low. I require this boost for not my personal desires but for the feeling of all Amarrians! You just failed at this thread, and your are posting with a bloody alt... Poor liar you are. Edit: and harby is actually one of the better amarr ships, so don't whine about that boat, whine about maller, propecy, or apoc. It's great being Amarr isn't it. Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr!
Amanda Eidolo	Posted - 2007.12.26 23:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Dristra Edited by: Dristra on 26/12/2007 23:03:57 You just failed at this thread, and your are posting with a bloody alt... Poor liar you are. Edit: and harby is actually one of the better amarr ships, so don't whine about that boat, whine about maller, propecy, or apoc. I am very sorry to announce that this is not an alt. It is my main character, my only one. And why aren't I supposed to whine about harbinger? I myself find nothing wrong with Maller or Prophecy, neither Apocalypse. But Harbinger is what I find disturbing while fighting against another battlecruiser class ships that are properly fitted. My E-morale is being crushed...
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.26 23:17:00 - [14] Originally by: Amanda Eidolo Originally by: Dristra Edited by: Dristra on 26/12/2007 23:03:57 You just failed at this thread, and your are posting with a bloody alt... Poor liar you are. Edit: and harby is actually one of the better amarr ships, so don't whine about that boat, whine about maller, propecy, or apoc. I am very sorry to announce that this is not an alt. It is my main character, my only one. And why aren't I supposed to whine about harbinger? I myself find nothing wrong with Maller or Prophecy, neither Apocalypse. But Harbinger is what I find disturbing while fighting against another battlecruiser class ships that are properly fitted. My E-morale is being crushed... If you find no faults at those ships go away, you don't know whats wrong with amarr, and only lose becasue your skills suxxxor. btw, if this is your main, where are your corp tags? It's great being Amarr isn't it. Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr!
Jonny JoJo Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.12.26 23:27:00 - [15] Originally by: Amanda Eidolo Edited by: Amanda Eidolo on 26/12/2007 21:56:58 Boost Amarr ships, I cannot win a fight with my Harbinger vs. Hurricane. My E-morale is very low because of this. Not even I am going to answer this one! Refresh to see next Real Life CCP sig(16 total)
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.26 23:30:00 - [16] Originally by: Jonny JoJo Originally by: Amanda Eidolo Edited by: Amanda Eidolo on 26/12/2007 21:56:58 Boost Amarr ships, I cannot win a fight with my Harbinger vs. Hurricane. My E-morale is very low because of this. Not even I am going to answer this one! <3 -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Shardrael Caldari AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.12.27 01:14:00 - [17] @op you clearly fail the empire and you need to gtfo right quick.
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.27 02:28:00 - [18] Harbinger is almost a good ship... Almost. Amarr Laser Cat
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.12.27 03:00:00 - [19] Its 4 AM and i just came out of the pub and i still realise this is a joke thread. C'mon, E-morale...super secret fleet setup. Claiming the maller is better. _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Amanda Eidolo Cult of the Spinning Meat	Posted - 2007.12.27 03:56:00 - [20] This is not a joke! I am serious about this! I simply can't see any possibility for me to win with a Harbinger against Hurricane, I've compared the best fits they can have, and only chance for me is to see a NanoHurricane with Light Ion Blasters coming up against me. Even though I must admit I do not have the best fit available for my skills I still have a proper fit so I should have a chance against Hurricane. Still these resistances are absurdly ridiculous. I request for boost to Amarr resistances. Not for weapons like Kissapasi earlier said, even though with the simulation I ran through my head 25% more damage would make the battle more even. It would only depend on the amount of wrecking hits. Or simply there is the easy choice which would not work if you attack first with a Harbinger. ECM drones... gosh that's like a capacitor booster for E-Morale. An utterly most ridiculous fit I would like to try would consist of: 6x Focused Medium Pulse Laser II with Conflagration M Medium Plasma Smartbomb II ECCM Stasis Webifier II Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II 2x 1600mm Rolled Tungsten Plates Damage Control II 2x EANM II Reactor Control Unit II Drones: Medium ECM Drones Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Pump II
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2007.12.27 04:03:00 - [21] Originally by: Amanda Eidolo Edited by: Amanda Eidolo on 26/12/2007 21:56:58 Boost Amarr ships, I cannot win a fight with my Harbinger vs. Hurricane. My E-morale is very low because of this. A Harbinger is a ship, not a race.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.27 05:48:00 - [22] Originally by: Liang Nuren Not to be rude, but I think the problem probably lies in you rather than your ship. This isn't to say that the Harbinger couldn't use a bit of lovin', but the defeatist attitude is a bit =( On a side note, how do you fit your Harbinger? -Liang Cmon Liang, you know as well as I do that a hurricane outperforms a harbinger in every way. --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.27 05:50:00 - [23] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Liang Nuren Not to be rude, but I think the problem probably lies in you rather than your ship. This isn't to say that the Harbinger couldn't use a bit of lovin', but the defeatist attitude is a bit =( On a side note, how do you fit your Harbinger? -Liang Cmon Liang, you know as well as I do that a hurricane outperforms a harbinger in every way. It doesn't though. We've been through this. -Liang -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.27 05:53:00 - [24] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Liang Nuren Not to be rude, but I think the problem probably lies in you rather than your ship. This isn't to say that the Harbinger couldn't use a bit of lovin', but the defeatist attitude is a bit =( On a side note, how do you fit your Harbinger? -Liang Cmon Liang, you know as well as I do that a hurricane outperforms a harbinger in every way. It doesn't though. We've been through this. -Liang I know we've been through this and the result was that harbinger really doesnt outperform a hurricane. Hurricane tanks better, plates better, cap stables better, dps's better, chooses dmg type better, is faster. Its too bad you dont fly a harb mate, id let you fly a harb against my minmatar friend in a hurricane, hed destroy you and anyone else in a harb. --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.27 05:56:00 - [25] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer I know we've been through this and the result was that harbinger really doesnt outperform a hurricane. Hurricane tanks better, plates better, cap stables better, dps's better, chooses dmg type better, is faster. Its too bad you dont fly a harb mate, id let you fly a harb against my minmatar friend in a hurricane, hed destroy you and anyone else in a harb. A Hurricane will not kill a Drake at all. A Harbinger will. Just because a Hurricane will kill a Harby doesn't make the Hurricane better at everything (or even more things). Again, I'll agree that the Harby needs some loving, but I think it's in the CPU department instead of the damage or tank department. -Liang -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.27 06:26:00 - [26] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Lyria Skydancer I know we've been through this and the result was that harbinger really doesnt outperform a hurricane. Hurricane tanks better, plates better, cap stables better, dps's better, chooses dmg type better, is faster. Its too bad you dont fly a harb mate, id let you fly a harb against my minmatar friend in a hurricane, hed destroy you and anyone else in a harb. A Hurricane will not kill a Drake at all. A Harbinger will. Just because a Hurricane will kill a Harby doesn't make the Hurricane better at everything (or even more things). Again, I'll agree that the Harby needs some loving, but I think it's in the CPU department instead of the damage or tank department. -Liang Harb doesnt even have a real edge while shooting at shield tanks either. I still dont understand how you can say that little little difference when facing a drake shield tank is making up for worse tanking, worse cap, worse pg, worse plating-ability, worse damage type selection, worse dps? Harbinger needs more tank, minmatar ships should never outtank an amarr ship by this amount. Its broken and you know it. --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
port22 Gallente The IMorral MAjority	Posted - 2007.12.27 06:35:00 - [27] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Lyria Skydancer I know we've been through this and the result was that harbinger really doesnt outperform a hurricane. Hurricane tanks better, plates better, cap stables better, dps's better, chooses dmg type better, is faster. Its too bad you dont fly a harb mate, id let you fly a harb against my minmatar friend in a hurricane, hed destroy you and anyone else in a harb. A Hurricane will not kill a Drake at all. A Harbinger will. Just because a Hurricane will kill a Harby doesn't make the Hurricane better at everything (or even more things). Again, I'll agree that the Harby needs some loving, but I think it's in the CPU department instead of the damage or tank department. -Liang Harb doesnt even have a real edge while shooting at shield tanks either. I still dont understand how you can say that little little difference when facing a drake shield tank is making up for worse tanking, worse cap, worse pg, worse plating-ability, worse damage type selection, worse dps? Harbinger needs more tank, minmatar ships should never outtank an amarr ship by this amount. Its broken and you know it. After reading your previous posts about the EOS, I dont normally agree with you Lyria. However on this case I completely agree 100% with the above. Originally by: Darklin Eldaris Destiny is without honor. They talk **, they station jockey, and they are epic fail. Originally by:** Confessor Destiny seemed to be really focused on the isk farm.
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.27 06:48:00 - [28] Edited by: Liang Nuren on 27/12/2007 06:49:40 Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Harb doesnt even have a real edge while shooting at shield tanks either. Yes it does, and it's a significant advantage too. Quote: I still dont understand how you can say that little little difference when facing a drake shield tank is making up for worse tanking, worse cap, worse pg, worse plating-ability, worse damage type selection, worse dps? Harbinger needs more tank, minmatar ships should never outtank an amarr ship by this amount. Its broken and you know it. Now that's just flat out misrepresenting the truth. FACT: The Hurricane and Harbinger have roughly equivalent tanks when active tanking FACT: The Harbinger outplates the Hurricane (it has more base armor). FACT: The Harbinger is MUCH better against shield tanks than the Hurricane. FACT: The Harbinger gets more "oomph" out of a damage mod than the Hurricane. FACT: The Harbinger gets more cap than the Hurricane (And also uses it faster) FACT: The Harbinger (generally) deals more Thermal than EM damage. FACT: The Harbinger has more PG than the Hurricane Of course, we can also say: FACT: The Harbinger is CPU gimped. With the extra CPU, it would be able to have a much higher variety of viable fittings. FACT: EM damage is not pwnsauce - but nor is it complete crap either. Like it or not, the Harbinger IS a better tank than the Hurricane if both are setup for tanking (and is wholesale better at plate tanking). You don't have to stretch the truth for me to say that the Harbinger needs some lubbin'z. I freely admit it. -Liang -- Gain Forum Fame Now! Want To Trade Liang Nuren For Your Character! Post in the thread or send me an Evemail. ^_
Kain De'Stroi Epic.	Posted - 2007.12.27 09:31:00 - [29] trust Liang when he says the Harby is better, he knows -------- Boost Amarr and I will conquer the Universe - you been warned
Queen Hopy Your Friendly Booster Company	Posted - 2007.12.27 09:50:00 - [30] Harbinger is a very nice ship. They are pretty much evenly matched with a hurricane.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.27 10:00:00 - [31] Edited by: Goumindong on 27/12/2007 10:06:34 Originally by: Liang Nuren The Harbinger The harbinger doesnt have that much of an advantage against shield tanks. EMP and Phased Plasma do significant enough damage to shield tanks as it is[and still punch through armor well enough]. If the target has a EM hardener on, or is t2 caldari, the Hurricane is wholesale better. This combines with the fact that the two ships, when plated, give the Hurricane a significant advantage in dps pretty much any way you cut it. The Hurricane does have less EHP than the Harbinger though. Against a drake fitting LSE, LSE, inv, inv, dc with a plated harbinger and a plated drake each with 2 damage mods, and thermal drones with HMLs and d180s on the cane with 5 hobgoblins[though a harb is more likely to fit ex drones due to its high shield dps and low armor dps]. The Cane does 605 dps with RF EMP M + CN Themal Missiles The Harb does 620 dps with AN MF M The drake has 74,998 EHP against the Cane, and 68,267 against the Harb. Now RF EMP M is 2.6% better than PP and much better on armor, so a smart choice cane which gambles on an EM hard will do a tad bit worse. But the Harbs advantage against the un-em hardened drake is about 12.5%. Clearly a stunningly huge advantage. Not that it wont make a difference, but its not something to leap to the heavens about. The more damage mods each fits the better the Cane does, if the drake fits an EM hard or EM rig, the phased plasma cane is going to utterly destroy the harb. The one real thing that the harb has going for it over the cane is its extra 1000 armor and 1000 structure in exchange for 1000 shield. edit: A PP fitted cane is only 17% behind the harbinger against that tank. But way ahead against an EM hardened tank. edit 2: The less LSEs fitted[hard to fit a lot with an MWD iirc] lower this advantage significantly.
Aerin Cloudfayr Extreme Addiction Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.12.27 10:51:00 - [32] man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u *******s :P
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.27 11:21:00 - [33] Originally by: Aerin Cloudfayr man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u *******s :P Because you typicially dont if you bother to put keep the ammo in your guns topped off.
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.12.27 11:45:00 - [34] Originally by: Kissapasi THIS IS SO WRONG! I require DAMAGE BOOST to lasers NOW! 25% damage boost to lasers would bring amarr back from their super-nerfed status. stop laffing , i remember when small faction beam lasers had 7.5 dam mod as a base. - At last the Gallente can finally lay claim to saying... "my DICtor" is bigger than yours.
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr Do Or Die And Live Or Try The Kano Organisation	Posted - 2007.12.27 12:00:00 - [35] Originally by: Aerin Cloudfayr man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u *******s :P Only happens in PvE, never in PvP. Might happen in fleet fights, but not in small gang skirmish.
Aerin Cloudfayr Extreme Addiction Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.12.27 13:56:00 - [36] Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes Originally by: Aerin Cloudfayr man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u *******s :P Only happens in PvE, never in PvP. Might happen in fleet fights, but not in small gang skirmish. or when you're whittling down a drake's passive tank lol - but yes, was talking PVE there :P
Helldrek Demonstar Section Five	Posted - 2007.12.27 14:05:00 - [37] Harbinger is perfectly fine. Amarr is quite skill intensive, deal with it --- Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
The Djego Minmatar FORTES FORTUNA ADIUVAT CORP. Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2007.12.27 14:07:00 - [38] There is allready a place for all the fix/boost Amarr and why needs: look here To finish it with an epic ending: click ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.28 04:01:00 - [39] Originally by: The Djego There is allready a place for all the fix/boost Amarr and why needs: look here To finish it with an epic ending: click Yeah and the points made in that thread are so crushing that its amazing how ccp hasnt read and understood them. There are so many ships that are broken that its not funny. CCP sucks. --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.28 04:02:00 - [40] Originally by: Helldrek Demonstar Harbinger is perfectly fine. Amarr is quite skill intensive, deal with it You have no clue about the issues or you dont see them (wich is like not being able to spot an elephant standing on your breakfast table), deal with it --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
Cpt Branko The Bloody Red	Posted - 2007.12.28 04:14:00 - [41] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 28/12/2007 04:15:35 Originally by: Aerin Cloudfayr man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u ******s :P After spending the last three hours POS shooting in a Cyclone, I'd take reloadless weapons on it right now Anyway, yeah, Harbringer needs a bit of love, but it is one of the better Amarr ships, and it's not that* horrible. If it faces a plated Hurricane in a plated config, yeah, it might run into trouble (but not by a huge margin); however, against certain popular Hurricane fits it'll do great. Rifters!
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising	Posted - 2007.12.28 04:24:00 - [42] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 28/12/2007 04:15:35 Originally by: Aerin Cloudfayr man why does nobody thank their lucky stars that they don't have to reload in the middle of an engagement? Some would call it mildly annoying, quite frankly, I'll take lasers over any other gun purely cus of this. and don;t whine about cap usage, get ur skills up u ******s :P After spending the last three hours POS shooting in a Cyclone, I'd take reloadless weapons on it right now Anyway, yeah, Harbringer needs a bit of love, but it is one of the better Amarr ships, and it's not that* horrible. If it faces a plated Hurricane in a plated config, yeah, it might run into trouble (but not by a huge margin); however, against certain popular Hurricane fits it'll do great. Im hoping that people and ccp realise that most of us amarr players arent sitting in pos warfare 24/7... --------------------------------------------- [Video]The Inquisition I - Swift Justice
Wu Jiun	Posted - 2007.12.28 05:26:00 - [43] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Im hoping that people and ccp realise that most of us amarr players arent sitting in pos warfare 24/7... Yeah, but dude lazors have a built in dmg mod!!!111 And you can switch crystals in 1 microsecond i tell you! And huge cap sooo huge cap...
Setana Manoro Gallente Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.28 06:44:00 - [44] Originally by: Amanda Eidolo Edited by: Amanda Eidolo on 26/12/2007 21:56:58 Boost Amarr ships, I cannot win a fight with my Harbinger vs. Hurricane. My E-morale is very low because of this. Must be something wrong at your end, a Harbinger should mop the floor with your average Hurricane. PS : Harbinger is one of the few Amarr ships that do not have issues, and are very good at what they do, and that is ganking, not tanking. Rifter is not X-Wing CCP. Trinity model kinda sucks.
Setana Manoro Gallente Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.28 06:47:00 - [45] Edited by: Setana Manoro on 28/12/2007 06:48:51 Originally by: Goumindong Edited by: Goumindong on 27/12/2007 10:06:34 Originally by: Liang Nuren The Harbinger The harbinger doesnt have that much of an advantage against shield tanks. EMP and Phased Plasma do significant enough damage to shield tanks as it is[and still punch through armor well enough]. If the target has a EM hardener on, or is t2 caldari, the Hurricane is wholesale better. This combines with the fact that the two ships, when plated, give the Hurricane a significant advantage in dps pretty much any way you cut it. The Hurricane does have less EHP than the Harbinger though. Against a drake fitting LSE, LSE, inv, inv, dc with a plated harbinger and a plated drake each with 2 damage mods, and thermal drones with HMLs and d180s on the cane with 5 hobgoblins[though a harb is more likely to fit ex drones due to its high shield dps and low armor dps]. The Cane does 605 dps with RF EMP M + CN Themal Missiles The Harb does 620 dps with AN MF M The drake has 74,998 EHP against the Cane, and 68,267 against the Harb. Now RF EMP M is 2.6% better than PP and much better on armor, so a smart choice cane which gambles on an EM hard will do a tad bit worse. But the Harbs advantage against the un-em hardened drake is about 12.5%. Clearly a stunningly huge advantage. Not that it wont make a difference, but its not something to leap to the heavens about. The more damage mods each fits the better the Cane does, if the drake fits an EM hard or EM rig, the phased plasma cane is going to utterly destroy the harb. The one real thing that the harb has going for it over the cane is its extra 1000 armor and 1000 structure in exchange for 1000 shield. edit: A PP fitted cane is only 17% behind the harbinger against that tank. But way ahead against an EM hardened tank. edit 2: The less LSEs fitted[hard to fit a lot with an MWD iirc] lower this advantage significantly. Hurricane shines if armor tanked with active armor tank - you know ... capless guns. Harbinger as a ganker relies on lots of damage, very fast and for that usually a passive armor setup with a plate is better - and the 3 damage mods off-c. How can you compare them with similar fittings. Hurricane with short range guns has 5-10km effective range with Barrage M, Harbinger has 22-25km with Scorch M. They do not compare that easily, though the Cane does a very nice plated setup too. PS: What Cpt. Branko said is pretty much spot on. Rifter is not X-Wing CCP. Trinity model kinda sucks.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.28 06:52:00 - [46] Originally by: Setana Manoro Hurricane shines if armor tanked with active armor tank - you know ... capless guns. Harbinger as a ganker relies on lots of damage, very fast and for that usually a passive armor setup with a plate is better - and the 3 damage mods off-c. No it doesnt, the only BC that really shines in an acitve tanked setup is the Myrmidon.

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