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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Aramova Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.02 01:50:00 - [91] War Dec Empire Corp Empire Corp who can't match you joins alliance Whine on Eve-O forums ???? Profit! --
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.01.02 01:54:00 - [92] Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Now this is rather interesting. Dodging wars in this manner, or similar manners was declared an exploit by CCP before I even started the game. This was over two years ago. Two years! What is your excuse for ignoring this "loophole" for so long? It's not like it wasn't well known. Should we expect to see a fix before or after the next major graphics upgrade?
Kessiaan	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:36:00 - [93] Edited by: Kessiaan on 02/01/2008 02:44:14 Originally by: Wet Ferret Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Now this is rather interesting. Dodging wars in this manner, or similar manners was declared an exploit by CCP before I even started the game. This was over two years ago. Two years! What is your excuse for ignoring this "loophole" for so long? It's not like it wasn't well known. Should we expect to see a fix before or after the next major graphics upgrade? That's what I was saying earlier. The GMs come on the forum and say "Don't do it" but that doesn't stop anyone. Sure some CEOs might get a slap on the wrist but I'd be really surprised if any serious action (banning, corp dissolution and losing everyting in your corp hangers, etc) ever happens. If they don't want people to do something, especially in a game like Eve where the overwhelming majority of players have an 'anything-goes' mentality, the actual mechanics have to change. Personally if I was in charge, if a corp left an alliance, or dissolved, all members would remain wartargets for however long the wardec had left before it had to be renewed. Also if people who joined iMune actually stayed there and fought their wars out with their new pvp-oriented friends they might learn a few things and nobody would be complaining. Industrial corps that are part of alliances with strong pvp-oriented corps don't get decked for ****s and giggles. ----- My in Eve Profile My BattleClinic Page
Praxis1452 The Bastards	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:37:00 - [94] Originally by: Aramova War Dec Empire Corp Empire Corp who can't match you joins alliance Whine on Eve-O forums ???? Profit! ôHe who must expend his life to prolong life cannot enjoy it, and he who is still seeking for his life does not have it and can as little enjoy it.ö
Rectoress	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:40:00 - [95] I am really disappointed the GMs have bowed to this pressure against Imune. I understand the larger corps war dec transfer has its isk issues. Immune may have originally been setup to absorb Wardecs and rattle a few cages, but I think it could have a great dynamic in the game of helping the underdog, which I have not seen so far. The only help I have had is being called a noob and endured distastful flaming. What I have seen, are the only corps to be penalised are they PvP corps who don't actually PvP. What I mean by this is they wardec carebears, who have no intention of fighting. Is this game for solely PvP?, I think not. So high sec is a buffer ground for new players to learn the game and build their character. Also we have new players that want to pvp and start something new for themselves, they can't successfully fight older corps or alliances and are so pushed to practice on carebears or they are the corps that get the kicks out of wardec easy targets. So now what I can see by the forums are people mostly from these plebian PvP corps actually complaining they have to fight against corps in immune that also want to PvP. I also understand that pirate corps are there for piracy and theft, but the underhand tactics of wardeccing noob corps for easy kills, surely isnt a game mechanic either ccp? With this in mind I feel extremely sorry for your future custom. As well as a reduced playing experience you have built for new players there will be the problem of keeping them and the game turning into the name of its predecessor Elite. I mean with the introduction of GTC's after you preaching about isk farmers and people selling isk, has turn this game into a business for players. Business and pleasure don't mix. My conclusion to this is that the game mechanics makes gamers who joined a game for fun, being sucked into having to play longer or not at all. 'Well leave then', I hear you all say (obviously not ccp) you want my money. It is irrelevant what I do, but I am no doubt expressing views of players that haven't been in the game long and the feelings of your future noobs. The Dr
Johnathan Roark Caldari Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:51:00 - [96] This is not an exploit, I asked the GMs once a while back. Never used this method, never had the reason too. The entire war system needs a redesign. Its too cheap to declare wars. Corporation Management Improvement
Windjammer	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:52:00 - [97] Originally by: Jimer Lins Originally by: Windjammer Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support A great pity that ganking ships in Jita and other high sec places is not afforded the same attention. However, I think everyone was expecting a comment of this sort from a GM or other CCP representative. Ganking ships in Jita and other high sec areas is totally allowed, as long as you don't avoid the consequence (loss of your ship to CONCORD, loss of sec status). That's been status quo for years now. That's rather my point. It's a circumvention of the intent in game mechanics and it's been allowed to remain the status quo for years. It's so bad you've got this guy Tank CEO bragging about being able to do it in Jita with a group of -10 sec pirates. Assuming he's not blowing smoke up someone. Obviously they're not supposed to be able to be there much less do anything when they are. Yet no change is proposed to game mechanics, no announcement is made regarding the legality of the activity or consequences, no change to Concord or the faction police......in short nothing is done that I've been able to see.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.01.02 02:59:00 - [98] Originally by: Johnathan Roark This is not an exploit, I asked the GMs once a while back. Never used this method, never had the reason too. The entire war system needs a redesign. Its too cheap to declare wars. It was announced on the forums as a petitionable offense, by the devs themselves. Personally I think it should be allowed up until the day CCP decides to fix it. Perhaps if this was a recent problem I might feel otherwise. But they have let it go for a very long time!
Esmenet Gallente	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:00:00 - [99] Originally by: Windjammer That's rather my point. It's a circumvention of the intent in game mechanics and it's been allowed to remain the status quo for years. It's so bad you've got this guy Tank CEO bragging about being able to do it in Jita with a group of -10 sec pirates. Assuming he's not blowing smoke up someone. Obviously they're not supposed to be able to be there much less do anything when they are. Yet no change is proposed to game mechanics, no announcement is made regarding the legality of the activity or consequences, no change to Concord or the faction police......in short nothing is done that I've been able to see. Sorry but you dont understand the game mechanics at all. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
Caldreean Dawnwalkers	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:02:00 - [100] I don't really care one way or another about this issue. If anything, props to IMUNE for the good idea. What I do care about is, how many other rules can I get warned/banned for that only appear in random threads like this? Sorry, but I don't follow Dev posts, and I refuse to have to read every one so I can keep current with the rules. If something is broke, fix it, don't declare it an exploit. Not very professional of GM Nova /shrug
Galsia Yovinda Gallente Dec Me Please	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:06:00 - [101] So how long does a corporation have to stay in an alliance for it not to be an exploit? 12 hours, 1 day, 2 days?
Kelron Queldine Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:11:00 - [102] Originally by: Galsia Yovinda So how long does a corporation have to stay in an alliance for it not to be an exploit? 12 hours, 1 day, 2 days? My opinion would be at least a week, as that's the length of the war paid for before the corp joins the alliance. But that would be something that needs clarification by CCP. --------------------------- Vanilla Crazy Cake!
Ashley Sky Mesopotamia iMune Empire	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:20:00 - [103] Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Until you actually provide clarification we will continue. Perhaps you should clear things up with your team and provide an official statement... Here's what we were told... Thank you for your bugreport - ID:45773 Title: Wardec Immunity Mechanic for Player Corps The problem you have described as an intended game feature, and not a bug. Your bugreport has been closed. The BugHunter Team Report ID: 45773 Title: Wardec Immunity Mechanic for Player Corps Description: Corps with unwanted wars can join a dummy alliance for a brief moment, once they leave alliance the war becomes retracted with the corp. All that¦s needed is a one man dummy alliance with a sole purpose of absorbing wars from empire corporations. To reproduce what I¦m saying, see the reproductions steps below. Reproduction Steps: War is declared on Corp "A" Corp "A" joins alliance //24 hours waiting War propagates from Corp A into alliance Corp A leaves alliance War goes into retracted mode with Corp A //This lasts for 24 hours Corp A is now war free and has an unfair advantage of being immune to war. Execute these steps within one minute of receiving the initial war declaration mail, and a war with Corp A will only last one minute //We checked this and it is NOT possible to do this all within one minute. You have a 24h timer for joining the alliance and you have another 24h of war after leaving the alliance, till the war runs off. The method of shortening the war to 24h is apparently within current game mechanics and not a bug. - BH Lenider
Cambarus The Baros Syndicate	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:43:00 - [104] Edited by: Cambarus on 02/01/2008 03:44:20 I do believe what the BugHunter said was that it was not a bug, doesn't mean it's not an exploit and doesn't mean it's not against the rules. When a senior GM comes on to the forums and says, very clearly, that it's cheating, then it'd probably be in your best interest to stop. I mean really, blatantly stating on the forums that you're going to ignore the ruling of a GM can't be a good idea... Edit: Oh and "This is cheating, plain and simple." seems pretty clear to me. What possible clarification were you hopeing for?
Cori4n Caldari principle of motion	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:48:00 - [105] Originally by: Cambarus Edit: Oh and "This is cheating, plain and simple." seems pretty clear to me. What possible clarification were you hopeing for? Dunno, I for one was hoping for a response along the lines of, "What the hell???"
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2008.01.02 03:53:00 - [106] All that keeps running through my mind is when CCP specifically asks why 37% of all characters with more than 2m skill points are in NPC corps, they get 6 pages of threads saying: "Wardecs". Now Nova turns around and proclaims that shifting the wardec to someone else is an "exploit", even though this has been around forever. Makes me wonder exactly how many players CCP wants in NPC Corps Originally by: Audri Fisher On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear
Ashley Sky Mesopotamia iMune Empire	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:12:00 - [107] Edited by: Ashley Sky on 02/01/2008 04:13:11 It looks like this was the official statement, since it was posted last. :) Originally by: GM Nova What the hell??? But seriously, I'm not ignoring what the GM said. I just think they should post clarification of what exactly is cheating, so I can avoid it. For example, the statement above... Quote: they then joined imune empire aliance, then imediately left, 24 hours later we are left not being able to shoot them without redecking them again. i consider this cheating, and using a loophole that ccp should address. What does that mean exactly? Does it mean they have to remain in our alliance for 1 day, or 1 week? Where are the lines drawn between what you tell us we can do and what the game mechanics allow? Please tell us so we don't break any of your magical rules.
Dianeces Minmatar Repo Industries R.E.P.O.	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:22:00 - [108] Originally by: GM Nova What the hell??? lolwut?
Ki An Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:27:00 - [109] Originally by: Dianeces Originally by: GM Nova What the hell??? lolwut? It's because of her sig showing twice in the same post, Di. Anyone trying to see that as a sign that the GM wasn't being sincere is reaching.
Dianeces Minmatar Repo Industries	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:31:00 - [110] Edited by: Dianeces on 02/01/2008 04:31:49 Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Dianeces Originally by: GM Nova What the hell??? lolwut? It's because of her sig showing twice in the same post, Di. Anyone trying to see that as a sign that the GM wasn't being sincere is reaching. ITT I fail, c/d? Fake Edit: Oh, God. Kill the alliance ticker.
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:34:00 - [111] Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Dianeces Originally by: GM Nova What the hell??? lolwut? It's because of her sig showing twice in the same post, Di. Anyone trying to see that as a sign that the GM wasn't being sincere is reaching. Then maybe something good will actually come of this whole thing and thread: They will fix the stupid forums Originally by: Audri Fisher On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:44:00 - [112] Edited by: Jaabaa on 02/01/2008 04:44:53 Originally by: Ashley Sky Until you actually provide clarification we will continue. Perhaps you should clear things up with your team and provide an official statement... CCP Game Master > Every Bug Hunter I think you should consider what a "Senior Game Master" said publicly and on record, to be just about as official as it gets. So, just for you, an official statement by one of CCP's Senior Game Masters: Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support -- EVE Mobile Skill Planner V2 http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:52:00 - [113] Originally by: Jaabaa Edited by: Jaabaa on 02/01/2008 04:44:53 Originally by: Ashley Sky Until you actually provide clarification we will continue. Perhaps you should clear things up with your team and provide an official statement... CCP Game Master > Every Bug Hunter I think you should consider what a "Senior Game Master" said publicly and on record, to be just about as official as it gets. So, just for you, an official statement by one of CCP's Senior Game Masters: Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support The way that is written, it doesn't say weather corps transfering wars to iMune alliance is cheating, or the joining and leaving within an hour is cheating. So... can corps still join iMune and stay for a week, or can this mechanic not be used at all period. I'd say Ashley Sky is right, it isn't very clear as to what will be allowed and what will not. ____________________ Hi. I'm not an alt :)
Ralek Talen Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:55:00 - [114] Originally by: GM Nova What the hell???
Jaabaa Minmatar Dental Drilling Corporation	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:56:00 - [115] Originally by: techzer0 The way that is written, it doesn't say weather corps transfering wars to iMune alliance is cheating, or the joining and leaving within an hour is cheating. So... can corps still join iMune and stay for a week, or can this mechanic not be used at all period. I'd say Ashley Sky is right, it isn't very clear as to what will be allowed and what will not. I'd say that the alliance executor CEO and the corp trying to dodge the war dec will both get warnings. One for accepting it, the other for applying. GM Nova used the plural for a reason you know: Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support -- EVE Mobile Skill Planner V2 http://evemsp.sourceforge.net/
Ki An Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.01.02 04:58:00 - [116] Originally by: techzer0 The way that is written, it doesn't say weather corps transfering wars to iMune alliance is cheating, or the joining and leaving within an hour is cheating. So... can corps still join iMune and stay for a week, or can this mechanic not be used at all period. I'd say Ashley Sky is right, it isn't very clear as to what will be allowed and what will not. Well, until CCP actually gets the coding done to change this, I'd say we have to use our common sense. Joining and instantly leaving an alliance to escape a war dec is cheating, so don't do it. Don't try to beat the system by thinking "what if we join for a day maybe it'll be ok". Petitions about corps pulling stunts like this will be raining down on the GMs, so go easy on them.
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2008.01.02 05:08:00 - [117] Originally by: Ashley Sky Originally by: GM Nova This is cheating, plain and simple. CEOs exploiting this loophole will receive a warning from now on. GM Nova Senior Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Until you actually provide clarification we will continue. Perhaps you should clear things up with your team and provide an official statement... Here's what we were told... Thank you for your bugreport - ID:45773 Title: Wardec Immunity Mechanic for Player Corps The problem you have described as an intended game feature, and not a bug. Your bugreport has been closed. The BugHunter Team Report ID: 45773 Title: Wardec Immunity Mechanic for Player Corps Description: Corps with unwanted wars can join a dummy alliance for a brief moment, once they leave alliance the war becomes retracted with the corp. All that¦s needed is a one man dummy alliance with a sole purpose of absorbing wars from empire corporations. To reproduce what I¦m saying, see the reproductions steps below. Reproduction Steps: War is declared on Corp "A" Corp "A" joins alliance //24 hours waiting War propagates from Corp A into alliance Corp A leaves alliance War goes into retracted mode with Corp A //This lasts for 24 hours Corp A is now war free and has an unfair advantage of being immune to war. Execute these steps within one minute of receiving the initial war declaration mail, and a war with Corp A will only last one minute //We checked this and it is NOT possible to do this all within one minute. You have a 24h timer for joining the alliance and you have another 24h of war after leaving the alliance, till the war runs off. The method of shortening the war to 24h is apparently within current game mechanics and not a bug. - BH Lenider I feel sorry for you buggers. At least though CCP kneecapped you right at the beginning, not after you had spent an age building something up. There is no space for anything new in EVE... get your mining lasers out ladies.. its the future! CRUEL CCP... OUT DAMN SPOT! SKUNK
Norma Cenza	Posted - 2008.01.02 05:28:00 - [118] Just wait for a senior GM to start banning people. iMune should just be disbanded and their stuff given away in jita
Ashley Sky Mesopotamia iMune Empire	Posted - 2008.01.02 05:40:00 - [119] Originally by: Jaabaa I think you should consider what a "Senior Game Master" said publicly and on record, to be just about as official as it gets. That's a good point, I have to concede and say that you're right. They went and changed the rules on us with a very ambiguous response to a forum, rather than doing appropriate customer service. I would like to see... 1. An official statement telling us what is right and what isn't with alliances, and perhaps an update to their alliance and war mailing documentation. 2. A code fix. Right now, here is what you get when you declare war on someone, in regards to alliance (concord mail) Quote: If you are at war with a corporation that joins an alliance then the war will change from being against the corporation to being against the alliance. If you are at war with an alliance and a corporation leaves that alliance then you will still be at war with the alliance but also temporarily at war with the corporation that left. The war against the corporation that leaves an alliance lasts 24 hours during this period you can attack them until the war expires. Should you wish to resume hostilities against such a corporation then you need to declare war again. I have petitioned to see if we can get a proper resolution to this matter.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God	Posted - 2008.01.02 06:29:00 - [120] Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 02/01/2008 06:29:36 CCP still thinks that Login Traps are not exploits - but this is cheating?

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