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Tinka Toy
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:06:00 -
[1]
Anyone can fire up Evemon, click Heavy Assault Ship skill and make a plan. But what I'd like to know is what additional skills are used to make that HAC really work well. What secondary skills are "required" before undocking with that HAC and looking for a fight? Specifically the Minmatar HACs.
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Polkageist
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:16:00 -
[2]
t2 medium guns and everything else you gonna fit t2, and some rigging skills.
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Trevor Warps
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:17:00 -
[3]
Also good navigation skills, capacitor skills, fitting skills ...
And a good setup !
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Ostracised
Caldari
Sturmgrenadier Inc
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:23:00 -
[4]
Its the little things that make a difference. Some stuff like Navigation skills, Acceleration Control, Evasive Maneuvering, High Speed or Afterburner depending on what you fit.
Make sure if you go with turrets that you have T2 and stuff like Surgical Strike, Rapid Firing, etc are at level 4.
Benefits of a HAC.
Good resists, Lower Sig Radius, Faster(compared to BCs and BSs), but the problems are DPS. So you need the little skills to help supplement this and the Navigation skills to make sure you stay fast and nimble.
Biggest Mistake of a HAC.
Thinking T2 Cruiser means you pwn all. Refer to previous benefits. You are smaller, less overall HPs, etc, so if you aren't careful you can melt very quickly.
Flying a HAC well really does require more skills than the other appropriate ships(BCs and BSs) but once you do get your skills there you will be rewarded with a versatile ship that can dish out some serious pain.
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Rialtor
Amarr
Yarrrateers
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:25:00 -
[5]
This is more a skills question than a ship question. I don't really fly Minmatar HACs, nor ever fitted one. But if you're talking about the Vagabond, people basically use the lows for a speed tank & dmg mods, and use the mids for a shield tank/EW.
If you're going for a nano setup, you want good navigation skills, high speed maneuvering, acceleration, and evasive maneuvering in particular.
It's a cruiser class gunship so you need good medium projectile skills autocannon IIs. You'll want Weapon Upgrades V, and a decent level of Advanced Weapons Upgrades.
Astronautics Rigging to lower your weight, and Projectile rigging to increase your falloff.
And of course good shield skills, not so much for active tanking but passive. So you want big buffers, and good compensation skills.
If you invest in a vagabond you may want to think about faction gear as well. But that's probably the basic jist of it.
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Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world... Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has. |
Removal Tool
Vogon Deconstruction Fleet
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Posted - 2008.01.03 19:32:00 -
[6]
Since you specify Minmatar HACs, make sure your gunnery skills are toppped. Not just T2 guns, but the myriad of other gunnery skills. Otherwise, you won't be giving the HAC a fair shot.
Another note: If you are dedicated to a ship type, make sure you train that ship skill to level 5. Think of it like a Black Belt in Karate. A Black Belt does not mean you are a master. It means that you are fully functional in the decipline. So with Minmatar HACs, that extra damage from HAC level 5 could make the difference between winning and losing a battle. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.01.03 20:14:00 -
[7]
i loved my zealot. its a shame knowing the deimos gets a 5th turret and a 50m3 drone bay 
but for what i do, i would rather buy an abaddon, *cough*its insurable*cough*
anyways as they said, drone skills, weapon skills, enr skills, mech skills, nav skills. hac level 4,
i would go mainly cap skills 5/5, nav skills at 4 minimum, guns tech 2, support skills at 3, get to 4 sometime. be able to use everything tech 2 (fit might use some t1 or faction, for easier fitting or reduced penalties)
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Tinka Toy
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Posted - 2008.01.03 20:34:00 -
[8]
Thanks for the replies everyone. Think I might work on getting my weapon skills and support skills up to 4/5 and in the meantime use a mix of Cruisers and Assault Frigs before going to the more expensive Vaga/Huginn.
Another question I have is in regards to fleet ops. A lot of my PvP will be in roaming gangs/gate camps. Would it be better to just load up a Hurricane with decent equipment then use a HAC in those cases?
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Fenderson
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.01.03 20:45:00 -
[9]
 Originally by: Tinka Toy
Thanks for the replies everyone. Think I might work on getting my weapon skills and support skills up to 4/5 and in the meantime use a mix of Cruisers and Assault Frigs before going to the more expensive Vaga/Huginn.
Another question I have is in regards to fleet ops. A lot of my PvP will be in roaming gangs/gate camps. Would it be better to just load up a Hurricane with decent equipment then use a HAC in those cases?
roaming and camping are totally different activities requiring different setups. for roaming you definitely want the increased mobility of a HAC. for camping, you can probably do just as well with a t2 fit hurricane. damage is about the same, the only downfall of hurricane vs HAC for camping is the lack of falloff bonus.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Oh dear, how about we all calm down a bit instead?
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KD.Fluffy
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.01.03 20:57:00 -
[10]
Quote:
Flying a HAC well really does require more skills than the other appropriate ships(BCs and BSs) but once you do get your skills there you will be rewarded with a versatile ship that can dish out some serious pain.
Im sorry but thats simply not true. Flying any ship 'well' requires the same skills all around bar a space ship command skill. BS are extremely skill intensive to be effective in. Im not sure where you got the idea that you can get by in pvp in a battleship with sub par skills.
Boost The Eagle! |
KD.Fluffy
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.01.03 20:59:00 -
[11]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Quote:
Flying a HAC well really does require more skills than the other appropriate ships(BCs and BSs) but once you do get your skills there you will be rewarded with a versatile ship that can dish out some serious pain.
Im sorry but thats simply not true. Flying any ship 'well' requires the same skills all around bar a space ship command skill. BS are extremely skill intensive to be effective in. Im not sure where you got the idea that you can get by in pvp in a battleship with sub par skills.
Quote:
Another question I have is in regards to fleet ops. A lot of my PvP will be in roaming gangs/gate camps. Would it be better to just load up a Hurricane with decent equipment then use a HAC in those cases?
A sniping muninn can help keep tacklers away from the main group very effectively. Much better then a cane.
Boost The Eagle! |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.01.03 21:06:00 -
[12]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Quote:
Flying a HAC well really does require more skills than the other appropriate ships(BCs and BSs) but once you do get your skills there you will be rewarded with a versatile ship that can dish out some serious pain.
Im sorry but thats simply not true. Flying any ship 'well' requires the same skills all around bar a space ship command skill. BS are extremely skill intensive to be effective in. Im not sure where you got the idea that you can get by in pvp in a battleship with sub par skills.
so then is a 2 week nub better off in a drake or a t2 fitted t1 frig?
if i train bs 3 and large turret 3, with hac 4 and medium weapon 4 am i better off in a hac or a bs, with say everything else t2, reps/hardeners/scram?
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2008.01.03 21:06:00 -
[13]
HAC 4, T2 weaponry.
Good Engineering, Electronics, navigation skills.
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Crane needs more grid
249km locking? |
Ostracised
Caldari
Sturmgrenadier Inc
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Posted - 2008.01.03 21:34:00 -
[14]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Quote:
Flying a HAC well really does require more skills than the other appropriate ships(BCs and BSs) but once you do get your skills there you will be rewarded with a versatile ship that can dish out some serious pain.
Im sorry but thats simply not true. Flying any ship 'well' requires the same skills all around bar a space ship command skill. BS are extremely skill intensive to be effective in. Im not sure where you got the idea that you can get by in pvp in a battleship with sub par skills.
My point was the Battlecruiser and Battleship have a lot more leeway for errors. We have all been that newb that didn't have enough info and flew our Ferox into Triple Lord Admiral Spawns only to watch it melt away(many moons ago of course).
And, yes PvE and PvP are quite different but one is fully insurable and can do good damage even as a newb(BS/BC) while the other takes more skills and more importantly more pilot skill.
The race also matters as Eagles/Cerbs or Drakes/Ravens are somewhat linear in their approach where Minmatar and Gallente require more finesse and hand eye coordination for clicking targets, etc. MWD management, angle, drones, cap issues b/c of turrets etc.
I mean lets compare a Drake to a Cerb. Which can be flown with fewer skills and still be effective both ouput and cost wise?
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KD.Fluffy
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.01.04 00:59:00 -
[15]
Quote:
My point was the Battlecruiser and Battleship have a lot more leeway for errors. We have all been that newb that didn't have enough info and flew our Ferox into Triple Lord Admiral Spawns only to watch it melt away(many moons ago of course).
And, yes PvE and PvP are quite different but one is fully insurable and can do good damage even as a newb(BS/BC) while the other takes more skills and more importantly more pilot skill.
The race also matters as Eagles/Cerbs or Drakes/Ravens are somewhat linear in their approach where Minmatar and Gallente require more finesse and hand eye coordination for clicking targets, etc. MWD management, angle, drones, cap issues b/c of turrets etc.
I mean lets compare a Drake to a Cerb. Which can be flown with fewer skills and still be effective both ouput and cost wise?
In pve a battleship can be lower sp then a hac, but who pves in a hac anyways. When It comes to pvp though, a battleship requires huge sp. Quite possibly more then a HAC. tier 2 battle cruisers are very newb friendly, but battleships really are far from it.
Boost The Eagle! |
Laura Baretta
Minmatar
Cult of the Skulls
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Posted - 2008.01.04 01:19:00 -
[16]
Of course, because Battle ship armament skills are higher lvl than the medium ones you need for Cruisers. But I think HaCs are a good stepping stone in the direction of all other PvP ships like Command ships and even BS, because when you want to fly those you will need to have your complimentary skills like engineering, gunnery, electronics and navigation as well as drones to the top too. Everything else would be a waste of money and not using those ships to the full potential (wich will get you killed)
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KD.Fluffy
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.01.04 01:51:00 -
[17]
Quote:
Of course, because Battle ship armament skills are higher lvl than the medium ones you need for Cruisers. But I think HaCs are a good stepping stone in the direction of all other PvP ships like Command ships and even BS, because when you want to fly those you will need to have your complimentary skills like engineering, gunnery, electronics and navigation as well as drones to the top too. Everything else would be a waste of money and not using those ships to the full potential (wich will get you killed)
yeah sounds bout right. You need high skills to get good use out of any ship.
Boost The Eagle! |
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