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S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.09 23:47:00 -
[1]
Guys
This one is probably older than the stars themselves.
I was asked tonight if I would "help out" in a level 4 mission in saisio; 3 jumps from my home base at Gekutami (well inside empire) by some guy called kalinnin or something from Perkone corp - funny how I didn't actually catch his name as I was half busy doing a trade run when the call came in.
So I got back to base unloaded my trade gear and set off in my trusty CNR trying to do this guy a favour and get him through his level 4 mission - Damsel In Distress. So, he invites me to his fleet and warps me off to the level 4 mission.
The only thing is it wasn't damsel in distress that was waiting for me when I emerged out of warp. I found myself greeted by 3 other ships all in yellow squares in the middle of nowehere all showing signs of EW.
There's something just not right here I thought. Any way my faction fitted ship had everything activated shield hardener & damage control wise so what the hell I thought, I took the decision to immediately log out. I thought with resists at virtually 90% for everything apart from EM (70%) I would survive more than a few volleys from anything these guys could lob at me whilst the trusty count down timer ticked away.
Immediately after I had logged, I activated my Second account grabbed a corp mate and headed off in the direction of where I had logged out with my other character.
So I logged back in to find my ship unscathed and 100% intact. Partly the reason I immediately logged out and did not put up a fight was that I was in a fleet with a guy I was supposed to be "Helping out" and didn't want agression initiated against or to and knowing I was in a fleet, I half suspected the 3 guys right in front of me would instantly join our fleet as it were making me fair game.
Not tonight Josephene.
Anyway on relogging nobody about and not a scratch on me.
I suspect that had I NOT immediately logged the 3 ships right in front would have initiated aggro right away having immediately joined the fleet. I would have been a target without a doubt and doubtless it would have been 4 vs 1.
Believe me I have been in worse before. But this is the first time I have been caught in this particular way.
The scam here relies on being in a fleet and agression being allowed. Clearly this is a scam and all should be aware.
Obviously protection is afforded by concorde in high sec but whilst in a fleet with "Mates" you don't have that protection.
Quitting the fleet would have been an option, but in the split second I decided to avoid the confrontation alltogether half suspecting that my "Fleet" status would immediately lapse.
Just a heads up for anyone that recieves a call for "Help" out of the blue.
I will be taking precuations in future which is a pitty because I actually like helping people out.
Anyway it's dog eat dog out there so just be aware that all might not be exactly as it seems.....
Regards
S1d
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.02.10 00:03:00 -
[2]
we call that a lofty
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Kahega Amielden
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Posted - 2008.02.10 00:24:00 -
[3]
why can't you just leave the fleet? Do they still have permission to attack you after you leave for some reason?
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S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.10 00:36:00 -
[4]
Good question.
What happens if they had joined the fleet? commenced agression against me AND then I'd quit the fleet? Would I have then come back under Concorde's protection once again? Would Concorde have stepped in? In theory yes, but I had "permitted" the initial agression by virtue of being in the fleet and so would Concorde have differentiated in such circumstances?
Tricky one if you ask me.
Wasn't worth risking and in the split second I had to ponder it, I thought logging gave the best possible outcome.
What would you have done?
Bet if you asked that question to ten people you'd get 10 different answers.
Sneaky trick anyway and grats to them for coming up with it.
I bet it yields a result more often than not.
Regards
S1d
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Shiner BockBeer
Go Go Gadget ForumPostingAlt
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Posted - 2008.02.10 00:50:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Shiner BockBeer on 10/02/2008 00:50:28 You've almost got the scam right, but you're just a little off.
The three ships waiting for you were in their own fleet and they are in a corp that declared war on the player who asked you for help. Since you're in a fleet with the original player, they get the right to shoot you because of the war. They would not join the fleet you were in.
Leaving the fleet doesn't stop their right to kill you if they fire before you leave the fleet. Logging before they shoot you is the only thing you could have done.
Lofty29 used to do this regularly and made a lot of money blowing up nicely fitted CNRs just like yours.
In the future don't forget to read the warning that pops up on a gang invite that says "Really join warring gang?"
Support Pregnant Ambulation! |
Wind Ictiva
Delta Kappa Gamma
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Posted - 2008.02.10 01:02:00 -
[6]
you can not shoot at people in your fleet unless they are in your corporation.
you can shoot at people in a fleet with at least one war target in.
if this was a lofty scam, the guy who asked for help was not in a npc corp or there were more than just the two of you in the gang and that third person was in a war decced player corp.
Originally by: Admiral Love
Hmm creating a thread like this is perhaps a little like sitting naked with bleeding balls in a pool of piranhas. I Won't do it again - most of you guys are pretty nasty. |
S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.10 01:03:00 -
[7]
Thanks Shiner
The mechanics of the scam rely on the "fleet" link - that's the key, and the fact that I logged immediately on coming out of warp was probably what saved my skin and my 2bn+ fitted CNR. There was every chance they would have walked off with my XL Gist SB, incredible.
Only question is, what is a guy at war with another corp doing sending other people to his enemy unless he's in collaboration with them in a false war for exactly these purposes.
I guess I've answered my own question.
Very clever.
Regards
S1d
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S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.10 01:28:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Wind Ictiva you can not shoot at people in your fleet unless they are in your corporation.
you can shoot at people in a fleet with at least one war target in.
if this was a lofty scam, the guy who asked for help was not in a npc corp or there were more than just the two of you in the gang and that third person was in a war decced player corp.
Good point Wind also.
The guy that invited me to the gang was in Perkone so that's NPC is it not?
I didn't think you could declare war on NPC corps??
If that's the case then surely the two corp scenario falls away and the intention of the 3 stooges WAS to join the same gang as the guy that invited me??
Shiner - you're probably right in terms of once they open fire they can continue unnabated regardless of whether you quit fleet status.
Funny how in this game every now and again I come up against some real out of the box thinking and this reignites my passion for Eve
Regards
S1d
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Avery Fatwallet
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Posted - 2008.02.10 01:57:00 -
[9]
npc corp player invites you. you warp to him.
meanwhile another character gets invited in the same fleet. this alt is at war with the waiting gankfleet, which turns you into a target, while youre in warp. you also never get a "join a warring gang?" popup this way.
thats why i personally think it borders on exploiting.
meh.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.02.10 01:59:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Avery Fatwallet npc corp player invites you. you warp to him.
meanwhile another character gets invited in the same fleet. this alt is at war with the waiting gankfleet, which turns you into a target, while youre in warp. you also never get a "join a warring gang?" popup this way.
thats why i personally think it borders on exploiting.
meh.
So does loggin to avoid consequences.. shame the OP didnt loose his ship.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.02.10 02:02:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sorted So does loggin to avoid consequences.. shame the OP didnt loose his ship.
I guess turnabout is not fair play in your book.
To Shar -verb: 1 - To say what you mean. 2 - To say what it means. 3 - To say something mean.
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Ursula LeGuinn
Versus Gloria Omnis
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Posted - 2008.02.10 02:58:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sorted So does loggin to avoid consequences.. shame the OP didnt loose his ship.
God forbid someone uses a cheap metagame tactic to avoid another cheap metagame tactic, neither of which are considered exploits.
Can't say it bothers me in the least that the OP fought fire with fire. ________________
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Bryg Philomena
Green Lantern Corps
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Posted - 2008.02.10 02:58:00 -
[13]
Im working on getting them outta my home system... The involved players are: Sir Toadalot Kinalder Inmundicia Methicone
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Am I reading this correctly? You claim you have a bug that undresses female avatars???
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techzer0
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.02.10 03:02:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ursula LeGuinn
Originally by: Sorted So does loggin to avoid consequences.. shame the OP didnt loose his ship.
God forbid someone uses a cheap metagame tactic to avoid another cheap metagame tactic, neither of which are considered exploits.
Can't say it bothers me in the least that the OP fought fire with fire.
lol... yeah
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Originally by: Praxis1452 you win eve
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Dr Paithos
Minmatar Republic Deep Space Institute
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Posted - 2008.02.10 03:42:00 -
[15]
you did the right thing
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Fedor Emilianenko
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Posted - 2008.02.10 03:47:00 -
[16]
op your a fool for even taking up that offer, your about 17 years late with this info, my driving instructor told me about the lofty scam in 1987, get with the times pal, i wish u had lost ur ship then this post wouldn't be so smug
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Considered
Caldari Second Fleet of Homogeneous Clarity
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Posted - 2008.02.10 03:53:00 -
[17]
I had this done once, in jita, left fleet the second I saw 6 of em with sensor boosters on in a SS.
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Firkragg
PREDATORS OF DESTRUCTION
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Posted - 2008.02.10 05:19:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Fedor Emilianenko op your a fool for even taking up that offer, your about 17 years late with this info, my driving instructor told me about the lofty scam in 1987, get with the times pal, i wish u had lost ur ship then this post wouldn't be so smug
I got told at the BBQ :)
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S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.10 11:15:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Fedor Emilianenko op your a fool for even taking up that offer, your about 17 years late with this info, my driving instructor told me about the lofty scam in 1987, get with the times pal, i wish u had lost ur ship then this post wouldn't be so smug
You must have missed the bit where I said this scam is probably "older than the stars"
No but seriously (jokes aside) I've known about the "Fleet" scam for a long time, but the whole point of my post - not to be forgotten - is to warn other unsuspecting players of a) the scam (whatever the guise) and b) the way out.
Regards
S1d
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Slave 775
Ministry of Punishment Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.10 11:46:00 -
[20]
Originally by: S1d Vicious
Stuff about boldly logging
Nice job on failing eve:
Joining strangers ( didn't your mom told you not to go with strangers) Logging your ship to save it (Thats true failure) coming to the eve-o forums to tell everyone about it
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S1d Vicious
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Posted - 2008.02.10 12:13:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Slave 775
Originally by: S1d Vicious
Stuff about boldly logging
Nice job on failing eve:
Joining strangers ( didn't your mom told you not to go with strangers) Logging your ship to save it (Thats true failure) coming to the eve-o forums to tell everyone about it
No let's get it right, coming to the forums to tell everyone about it isn't "failure" it just p*sses YOU and YOUR band of merry men off to the extent that just possibly, others having now read this, might be alert and wary to your scam.
Sorry but we know who's really failed
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General Coochie
The Bastards
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Posted - 2008.02.10 12:32:00 -
[22]
Edited by: General Coochie on 10/02/2008 12:34:05
Originally by: Slave 775
Originally by: S1d Vicious
Stuff about boldly logging
Nice job on failing eve:
Joining strangers ( didn't your mom told you not to go with strangers) Logging your ship to save it (Thats true failure) coming to the eve-o forums to tell everyone about it
How bout.
* Puts more value in helping ppl then he puts at risking his EvE isk * Used a cheap tactic to avoid an even more cheap tactic * Again likes to help ppl. Someone probably learned something from reading this thread.
He is a winner to me.
Only one who failed here are the scammers.
The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie) |
Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.02.10 16:01:00 -
[23]
Originally by: S1d Vicious
Originally by: Slave 775
Originally by: S1d Vicious
Stuff about boldly logging
Nice job on failing eve:
Joining strangers ( didn't your mom told you not to go with strangers) Logging your ship to save it (Thats true failure) coming to the eve-o forums to tell everyone about it
No let's get it right, coming to the forums to tell everyone about it isn't "failure" it just p*sses YOU and YOUR band of merry men off to the extent that just possibly, others having now read this, might be alert and wary to your scam.
Sorry but we know who's really failed
Slave pulling a lofty?
lolsnyarrsnstuff
SKUNK
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Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.02.10 16:04:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ursula LeGuinn
Originally by: Sorted So does loggin to avoid consequences.. shame the OP didnt loose his ship.
God forbid someone uses a cheap metagame tactic to avoid another cheap metagame tactic, neither of which are considered exploits.
And that, is the whole problem with eve, and why it will die a firey death, to be populated by ten zillion 'non race denominated' isk farmers, where a trillion isk will cost you 1 dollar.
SKUNK
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Schani Kratnorr
Internal Revenue Service
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Posted - 2008.02.10 16:11:00 -
[25]
If we can ignore the flames, the lesson here seems to be:
Always read the popup warnings.
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lolzor
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Posted - 2008.02.10 17:16:00 -
[26]
Edited by: lolzor on 10/02/2008 17:17:24
Originally by: Schani Kratnorr If we can ignore the flames, the lesson here seems to be:
Always read the popup warnings.
If they had pulled a true lofty there would be no popup warning, alt who is at war with the people who are pulling off the scam, joins the gang after the victim does.
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O' GingerOne
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Posted - 2008.02.10 17:56:00 -
[27]
Edited by: O'' GingerOne on 10/02/2008 17:56:45
Originally by: Shiner BockBeer Edited by: Shiner BockBeer on 10/02/2008 00:50:28 You've almost got the scam right, but you're just a little off.
The three ships waiting for you were in their own fleet and they are in a corp that declared war on the player who asked you for help. Since you're in a fleet with the original player, they get the right to shoot you because of the war. They would not join the fleet you were in.
Leaving the fleet doesn't stop their right to kill you if they fire before you leave the fleet. Logging before they shoot you is the only thing you could have done.
Lofty29 used to do this regularly and made a lot of money blowing up nicely fitted CNRs just like yours.
In the future don't forget to read the warning that pops up on a gang invite that says "Really join warring gang?"
The OP had its a million times closer than you my friend.
After reading this thread ive come to realise your all stupid. The only person in here that i can still show to respect too is the guy that got away. Well done, your in a small minority
As for bryg, you seem to be part of the growing community in eve that thinks they know everything and for some reason, are due more than others. If you want to call somewhere your "home-system" maybe you should do somthing to earn it, rather than just being a mouthy nobody.
/Alt.
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Slave 775
Ministry of Punishment Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.10 18:04:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Le Skunk
Slave pulling a lofty?
lolsnyarrsnstuff
SKUNK
I would never use it, its just totally lame. But logofski is the king of the hill.
Someone doing a logofski needs to be kicked in the ass in every possible way.
The Lofty Scam is another stupid "game mechanic" who needs to be fixed by CCP, but yet remains in the game for more than a year.
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Bryg Philomena
Green Lantern Corps
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Posted - 2008.02.10 18:29:00 -
[29]
Originally by: O' GingerOne As for bryg, you seem to be part of the growing community in eve that thinks they know everything and for some reason, are due more than others. If you want to call somewhere your "home-system" maybe you should do somthing to earn it, rather than just being a mouthy nobody.
/Alt.
Who are you again? Anyhow, I have their SS, and a vote in on the dec. Will be fun. And just because I don't advertise the lofty, doesn't mean I am a nobody.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Am I reading this correctly? You claim you have a bug that undresses female avatars???
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Lakut
Caldari Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.12 03:34:00 -
[30]
To the OP:
Same scam attempt happened to me recently.
Funny thing to do: Leave fleet before getting aggro and watch the ensuing concordokkening. Can give nice lewts.
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