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Ne0 MaTrIx The Kovert Kollection Krew	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:10:00 - [1] Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:25:23 Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:15:19 THIS IS NOT ABOUT REGULAR SUICIDE GANKING (Brutix, Raven Fleets etc etc) I have seen an ever-more-common, fleet of suicide gank kestrels in Jita (less than a day, 1day old...) It would appear the same set of people are using trial accounts, getting them to -2.0 then using new trial accounts. If they aren't trial accounts (some of you might say alts on the main account) I know for a fact trashing/recycling alts for suicide ganking is an exploit, so if its recycle alts why havn't these guys been punished? Any one else see this as an exploit? But I can't see any way to 'fix' it.. The punishment of suicide ganking is losing sec + losing your ship, but they're negating one of the punishments.. CCP could stop this and isk spammers by removing trial accounts ! :) [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) 0123456789987654321: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) bianhao01: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) 0wohao: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) yoylsaesr: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) QNMD00: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) 48488481: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:12 ] (notify) 10101212010: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:13 ] (notify) dianerche: You have foolishly engaged... [ 2008.02.28 06:01:13 ] (notify) 11XX11: You have foolishly engaged... ---
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:17:00 - [2] please think about what removing trial accounts would do.
Rawr Cristina Caldari Cult of Rawr	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:23:00 - [3] Just be thankful Kestrals can no longer launch Cruise missiles Fight Piracy - Encourage PvP in Lowsec!
Ne0 MaTrIx The Kovert Kollection Krew	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:28:00 - [4] Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:28:03 Originally by: MotherMoon please think about what removing trial accounts would do. No ISK spammed local... No ISK spammed trade channels... No trial account suiciders... Im not seeing your point? Sure it'd cut new customers by a %, but not entirely, if you're friend says a game is good enough you'll pay ú7 to test it out (or they can buy you a gtc ingame) + much more enjoyable experience for the 200,000 current players. ---
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:31:00 - [5] Originally by: Ne0 MaTrIx Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:28:03 Originally by: MotherMoon please think about what removing trial accounts would do. No ISK spammed local... No ISK spammed trade channels... No trial account suiciders... Im not seeing your point? Sure it'd cut new customers by a %, but not entirely, if you're friend says a game is good enough you'll pay ú7 to test it out (or they can buy you a gtc ingame) + much more enjoyable experience for the 200,000 current players. I wouldn't pay for a game to try it out. and I don't get ú9 an hour I get ú3.5 an hour
Hypothetical Axe Gang	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:33:00 - [6] IIRC, creating a new character for suiciding every time your sec drops too low IS considered an exploit by CCP, and technically you can't have a trial account if you already have a paid account. Try petitioning them, it's probably useless, since I'm not sure how CCP would enforce this, but they are breaking several rules.
Ne0 MaTrIx The Kovert Kollection Krew	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:34:00 - [7] Originally by: MotherMoon I wouldn't pay for a game to try it out. and I don't get ú9 an hour I get ú3.5 an hour Or do something silly and make trial accounts $2/ú1 - Stops mass use of them, but cheaps them cheap enough for genuine consumers ---
SkwisgaarSkwigelf C.R.M Productions Legion of Honor	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:39:00 - [8] horrible idea, I know I would never pay to run a 2 week trial account, and neither would anyone I know.
Zorlag Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:39:00 - [9] Hey, look at those names, looks like either the Chinese macrominers have turned sinister or someone else is running macro rings
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:42:00 - [10] Originally by: Ne0 MaTrIx Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:36:10 Originally by: MotherMoon I wouldn't pay for a game to try it out. and I don't get ú9 an hour I get ú3.5 an hour Don't understand why you're talking about your wages.. But how about do something silly and make trial accounts $2/ú1 - Stops mass use of them, but cheaps them cheap enough for genuine consumers what do you mean why am I talking about my wages? I'm talking about minimum wage for half of the eve playerbase. the way you would do it then eve would take a credit card to get a trail account, so why not just do that? no cash at all.
Planktal Kenshao Industries	Posted - 2008.02.28 06:47:00 - [11] Edited by: Planktal on 28/02/2008 06:47:28 an MMO lives or dies on the number of new players that come in to replace the ones that leave. no trials = no EVE, period! Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard. Whiners
Myros Glimmbrand Ganja Co	Posted - 2008.02.28 07:12:00 - [12] Could it be people taking the advice that someone posted ... paraphrasing: the only way to get CCP to do anything about it is for everyone to start doing it. Not condoning it, just struck me as being possible thats whats happening ;p Myros CEO Ganja Co
Dramaan	Posted - 2008.02.28 07:30:00 - [13] Edited by: Dramaan on 28/02/2008 07:32:40 If people suicide every time they kill some one it who'd be no players left in eve. So you see there are no suicide problem in eve.
Bellator Militaris Caldari Black Knight Buccaneers Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.28 08:26:00 - [14] At times Eve can be a ruthless, cold-blooded, heartless game. But that's what makes it fun.
Kcrow Caldari Hematite Rose Bionic Dawn	Posted - 2008.02.28 08:33:00 - [15] Don't go to Jita. /Fixed . We do what we must because we can for the good of all of us, except for the ones who are dead but there's no sense crying over every mistake you just keep on trying until you run out of cake
Bellator Militaris Caldari Black Knight Buccaneers Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.28 08:35:00 - [16] At times Eve can be a ruthless, cold-blooded, heartless game. But that's what makes it fun.
Pedro Snachez	Posted - 2008.02.28 08:51:00 - [17] While I think suicide ganking using trial accounts is an exploit (or at the very least outside of game mechanics), removing trial accounts wouldn't be a positive step. I for one don't know if I would have started Eve without the trial. But I've been thinking about the problem (and I do believe it is a problem), and what if you made actions resulting in a Concording actually impossible in High-sec for trial accounts. As in, you start a trial account for ganking and you fire at a Hulk/Badger/whatever. You get a message saying this is a criminal action and is not allowed in High Sec. That's it. No shot fired. This would have multiple positive outcomes: A) The actual new player sees his error and learns what is a concordable offense without the frustration of losing his ship. B) It makes ganking viable, but only from those willing to put in the time and effort to keep their sec status up. C) The ban on high-sec aggression does not apply to low-sec, allowing new pilots intent on piracy to try it out, but in low sec where it more appropriately belongs. As far as this problem is concerned, this struck me as the most effective way to deal with the problem of trial account abuse.
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.28 08:59:00 - [18] rather than making people pay for a trial or scrapping it all together why not make people sign up with a credit/debit card? Allow them to pay with GTC's after the first month. If in that time the account spams isk, ect then the credit/debit card can be blocked. No more isk spammers, suicidal trial gankers and other assorted scum.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Deadly Addiction Un-Natural Selection	Posted - 2008.02.28 09:44:00 - [19] prevent npc corp pilots from being able to shoot people in highsec
gfldex Kabelkopp	Posted - 2008.02.28 10:10:00 - [20] Originally by: Marcus TheMartin prevent npc corp pilots from being able to shoot people in highsec Creating a corp is cheap and getting all those alts in would take not more then a few minutes. You need sleep. I really hope you need sleep. -- There are countless games in the world. There are at least as many ppl that dont like one or more rules of said games. That never stopped smart game designers from creating good games.
Fanjita	Posted - 2008.02.28 10:19:00 - [21] Originally by: MotherMoon please think about what removing trial accounts would do. Help relieve lag? yay great idea /signed
Fanjita	Posted - 2008.02.28 10:20:00 - [22] Originally by: MotherMoon Originally by: Ne0 MaTrIx Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:36:10 Originally by: MotherMoon I wouldn't pay for a game to try it out. and I don't get ú9 an hour I get ú3.5 an hour Don't understand why you're talking about your wages.. But how about do something silly and make trial accounts $2/ú1 - Stops mass use of them, but cheaps them cheap enough for genuine consumers what do you mean why am I talking about my wages? I'm talking about minimum wage for half of the eve playerbase. the way you would do it then eve would take a credit card to get a trail account, so why not just do that? no cash at all. I'd report your employer minimum wahe is ú4.50/hr
Granmethedon III R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.02.28 11:42:00 - [23] Originally by: Fanjita Originally by: MotherMoon Originally by: Ne0 MaTrIx Edited by: Ne0 MaTrIx on 28/02/2008 06:36:10 Originally by: MotherMoon I wouldn't pay for a game to try it out. and I don't get ú9 an hour I get ú3.5 an hour Don't understand why you're talking about your wages.. But how about do something silly and make trial accounts $2/ú1 - Stops mass use of them, but cheaps them cheap enough for genuine consumers what do you mean why am I talking about my wages? I'm talking about minimum wage for half of the eve playerbase. the way you would do it then eve would take a credit card to get a trail account, so why not just do that? no cash at all. I'd report your employer minimum wahe is ú4.50/hr In the UK. And only if you're over a certain age. Lot of people who play Eve that match neither of those criteria....
Kerfira University of Caille	Posted - 2008.02.28 11:51:00 - [24] Maybe just prevent trial accounts from shooting first at other players in empire? Sure, it'd prevent trial players from 'exploring the profession of suicide ganker', but tbh no completely new player does that.... Maybe also prevent alt recycling altogether..... Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Z3r0n THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:05:00 - [25] Dropping trial account completley would suck because I think 95% of the people that start an MMORPG are gonna want to test it.... I personally never even touch a game that I have to pay for before getting to test it. Thats why I never even took a sideways glance at Linage 2. If you think I'll pay 45$ for a game that may well suck donkey you-know-whats then you need to get your mental health checked out. Even if I only had to pay 1$ I still wouldn't test it - free trials have to remain free. A solution for all the trial account problems (massive ISK-selling spam everywhere you look, macro haulers and now suiciding) would be to simply give every subscriber a buddy key for their friends. Initially you'd get 3 buddy keys when you activate your account and every time one of these trial accounts is updated to a paying account, the person that provided the trial gets a new key sent to them. If any of the 3 trial keys are used for anything evil (such as spam) then the person that provided the key gets all their trial keys (and future trial keys) deleted and gets added to a watch-list because it's likley they support ISK sellers. That way there are still free trials available for "real" newbs and the person that gives out the trial keys also has some responsibility (so people don't just post their trials on the forums or something). They could post the keys once but would then be excluded from any future buddy- or trial programs because they gave their buddy pass to a spammer. If CCP notices that this change is killing the number of new players then they could always make two levels of trial accounts: the above mentioned trial accounts (3 per subscriber) which have the same restrictions as today and a "public" trial (infinite number available on homepage) but they would be heavily nerfed, couldn't chat outside of the "trial help chat", can't send mails, can't fly anything other then noob ships, can't commit criminal acts etc. Then the spammers will run out of trials really quickly but legitimate trials would still be possible. Currently Training: ePeen Compensation Rank (19)
Rawr Cristina Caldari Cult of Rawr	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:06:00 - [26] Edited by: Rawr Cristina on 28/02/2008 12:06:41 Originally by: Granmethedon III Quote: I'd report your employer minimum wahe is ú4.50/hr In the UK. And only if you're over a certain age. Lot of people who play Eve that match neither of those criteria.... Thought it was ú5.50/hr to anyone over 18? Fight Piracy - Encourage PvP in Lowsec!
Lil'Red Ridin'Hood Snake Assault	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:06:00 - [27] Just do what countless other MMOs do: Only allow character deletion after it is x days/weeks old. Won't stop the dedicated trasher/recreator, but it will slow them down. Or, at the very least, make them pay for having more accounts to keep up with it.
Shintai Gallente Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:12:00 - [28] We simply just need the insurance on Concord kills removed. Highsec ganking is like PvP where you wait for the target and you choose without the target can preapre against you. And with no or a very small cost for a very high reward. The trial accounts also needs to be nerfed. But thats mainly due to all the spammers and other things. Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Jeff K	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:14:00 - [29] Originally by: Shintai We simply just need the insurance on Concord kills removed. Highsec ganking is like PvP where you wait for the target and you choose without the target can preapre against you. And with no or a very small cost for a very high reward. The trial accounts also needs to be nerfed. But thats mainly due to all the spammers and other things. oh god, you fail so badly
Burnharder	Posted - 2008.02.28 12:16:00 - [30] Lets see now, I don't get a trial account on Team Fortress or Half-Life 2 to try it out and they are considerably more expensive. If Eve heads to steam and sets the first month at a low enough fee, getting rid of trials would work. It wouldn't stop alt-recycling though, even though it's an exploit, it still happens a lot.

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