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Attonasi
Dragons Of Redemption
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.06 23:56:00 -
[1]
I don't see any posts on lag so I am adding this one. Screw you if you think this is a dead horse because it obviously needs to be beaten some more. If you want people involved in the 0.0 community you have to deal with this. I have several friends that would play Eve the way it was meant to be played if you could have a decent 0.0 fleet fight.
I see whines and moans about a lot of crap here. But nothing is holding this game back than the complete inability to have a decent fleet fight. Nothing else is even close. We had 130 people in local in bwf 30 minutes ago and people couldn't load the grid for 10 minutes. I could, I got some kills, but 30-60 second module activation really sucks the fun out of it. I can not even imagine what it is like in delve.
The fight really went downhill when the fighters jumped in. We have had 200-300 people in local with little lag during a fleet fight, but as soon as the carriers/MOMs start popping drones the system we are in turns to ****. Please try looking at the assignment of fighters in particular.
Seriously, nothing else matters until this issue is fixed. Not even a skill queue which should be next...
I hate forums
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FireAnt
Caldari
Wings of the Storm
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:00:00 -
[2]
i agree, the only thing that matters to me in this game right now is fixing the lag. i dont care about new content, storylines, walking around in stations, eve tv, eve chat, gaming cards, mugs, tshirts or any of the other crap ccp tries to push on us. the only thing that matters is the lag!
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:03:00 -
[3]
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
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Voku
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:04:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Voku on 07/03/2008 00:04:29
Can't find one? Did you look past the first page? Because another whiner creates another one at least once a day.
We all deal with the lag, try moving somewhere less populated.
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:10:00 -
[5]
meh 1 minute module lag and 10 minute grid load? that sounds like a normal fleet fight to me. Come back when you spend multi hours loading grind only to find you've been podded.
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Attonasi
Dragons Of Redemption
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:12:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
67 of us vs. 98 of them. Massive blobs. I apologize on behalf of our massive alliance for making our gang counts confusingly large for you. 
If this is your "solution" then make more space so we can spread out more or make the current ******** and useless 0.0 systems nobody ever uses useful. Otherwise your solution is a ******** flame. 
I hate forums
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mrspiggy
Poast Muppets
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:15:00 -
[7]
Edited by: mrspiggy on 07/03/2008 00:15:32
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game
MMORPG
renamed to
Not Excessively Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game
NEMMORPG
for the benfit of your arguement to work ;)
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Attonasi
Dragons Of Redemption
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:15:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Voku
Edited by: Voku on 07/03/2008 00:04:29
Can't find one? Did you look past the first page? Because another whiner creates another one at least once a day.
We all deal with the lag, try moving somewhere less populated.
No I didn't look past the first page.
Thanks for your constructive input. You make these forums a better place.
I hate forums
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FireAnt
Caldari
Wings of the Storm
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:17:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Attonasi
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
67 of us vs. 98 of them. Massive blobs. I apologize on behalf of our massive alliance for making our gang counts confusingly large for you.
If this is your "solution" then make more space so we can spread out more or make the current ******** and useless 0.0 systems nobody ever uses useful. Otherwise your solution is a ******** flame.
dont listen to them, they do this to any thread about lag. only time most of the people spewing here face lag is in jita.
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Clinically
Gallente
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:20:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Go take down a large POS with 10 Rokh's then come back (some days later) and re-read your post.
________________
Originally by: Evil Thug
I wear pink panties.
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Kaar
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:23:00 -
[11]
So close no matter how far...
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:26:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Attonasi
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
67 of us vs. 98 of them. Massive blobs. I apologize on behalf of our massive alliance for making our gang counts confusingly large for you.
If this is your "solution" then make more space so we can spread out more or make the current ******** and useless 0.0 systems nobody ever uses useful. Otherwise your solution is a ******** flame.
I'm not sayin' you can avoid it in a 0.0 holding alliance. POS warfare necessitates blob combat, and **** needs to be done about that. But when you sign up for a 0.0 alliance, never is there a point where you're unaware that large scale combat will involve lag. You know that, I know that, everyone knows that. If you can't stand that, you don't join. There are no wide-spread misconception that 0.0 is a wonderland devoid of large fleets and the effects the fielding them. And yeah, 160-170 people pew-pew is still a massive battle. It's not composed of the largest fleets, but lag should be expected on that scale. And if it doesn't lag? Well, tight, you lucked out. Don't make that the expectation.
So, my issue in essence is how unnecessary this thread is.
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:28:00 -
[13]
Originally by: mrspiggy
Edited by: mrspiggy on 07/03/2008 00:15:32
Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game
MMORPG
renamed to
Not Excessively Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game
NEMMORPG
for the benfit of your arguement to work ;)
Oh, it's quite massive. You just can't have the masses all in the same location at once. That's pretty much a constant in any MMORPG. Really, with the sizes that Eve facilitates combined and the complexity of the game, the battles that it can handle are nothing short of miraculous already.
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:33:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Clinically
Go take down a large POS with 10 Rokh's then come back (some days later) and re-read your post.
I consciously choose not to get involved with PVP that will put me in a situation where I need to take down a POS simply because of the current mechanics of it. I tried that ****. I'm not going back. You choose to participate in an entity where it is unavoidable, and on that basis you really should not be surprised about the outcome.
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mishkof
Caldari
Shadows of Valor
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:50:00 -
[15]
Signed.
These Jita alts just dont get it I guess.
Making game mechanics that dont depend on blobbing is also acceptable. I am not asking CCP to be captain kirk. Just dont act like him if you arent.
I own a T2 BPO and Capital alt, therefor all of my views will be pro-Capital Alt/T2 BPO orientated. Please pick one of the following settings for your response.
[]hate me
[]troll me
[]smack me |
Gut Punch
The Graduates
Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:50:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Originally by: Clinically
Go take down a large POS with 10 Rokh's then come back (some days later) and re-read your post.
I consciously choose not to get involved with PVP that will put me in a situation where I need to take down a POS simply because of the current mechanics of it. I tried that ****. I'm not going back. You choose to participate in an entity where it is unavoidable, and on that basis you really should not be surprised about the outcome.
Then be quiet and go to the next thread. Go back to empire and mine some more or whatever you do. But the reality of EVE is that greater numbers have a significant influence on if you will win these engagements; right along with training, communications, and fittings. It is the only thing that compensates for SP differences between some of the major alliances.
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Brutally Clever Empire
--- |
Ghostwarden
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Posted - 2008.03.07 00:58:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Attonasi
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
67 of us vs. 98 of them. Massive blobs. I apologize on behalf of our massive alliance for making our gang counts confusingly large for you.
If this is your "solution" then make more space so we can spread out more or make the current ******** and useless 0.0 systems nobody ever uses useful. Otherwise your solution is a ******** flame.
Ok....lets examine your complaint here in comparison with some other MMO's Ive had experience with...
you had 165 players (not including thier drones which really cound as a seperate entity that the computer has to control)in a fleet combat with 200-300 in local....hmmm, in Everquest this would be impossible and its a sharded game...last time I checked there was 100 player cap for each grid.....and from what I've been told WOW, Middle Earth and most of the other MMO's are set up this way IF Im not completely mistaken.
Now, this is not intended as a flame but I dont think Im too far off the mark when I say that CCP is very interested in the problem and are doing their best to fix it. Your going to have to be patient just like the rest of us when it comes to lag.
Sorry dude.
Ghost
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Cipher7
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:01:00 -
[18]
Problem is not lag.
Problem is blob.
Find a way to make smaller fleets more advantageous, you solve the blob.
Have a stacking penalty to command bonuses, more ships you have in fleet, the less bonus each person gets.
"Portal storm" if a system has too many ships, portal storms occur, sending ships from the bigger side 2-3 jumps away.
Solve the blob, you solve the lag.
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Fader Bane
Black Knight Buccaneers
Daisho Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:03:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Originally by: Clinically
Go take down a large POS with 10 Rokh's then come back (some days later) and re-read your post.
I consciously choose not to get involved with PVP that will put me in a situation where I need to take down a POS simply because of the current mechanics of it. I tried that ****. I'm not going back. You choose to participate in an entity where it is unavoidable, and on that basis you really should not be surprised about the outcome.
yeah its a good thing CCP doesn't want to push more people into 0.0. oh wait...
________________________________________
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:07:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Cipher7
Problem is not lag.
Problem is blob.
Find a way to make smaller fleets more advantageous, you solve the blob.
Have a stacking penalty to command bonuses, more ships you have in fleet, the less bonus each person gets.
"Portal storm" if a system has too many ships, portal storms occur, sending ships from the bigger side 2-3 jumps away.
Solve the blob, you solve the lag.
Having smaller fleet fights means you need more FC's they are already a commodity that is stupid.
The more you break down your fleets the more intensive it is for your opponent to blob and kill each one separate because that's what its all about. This game is all about winning and the blob is the only tactic that works.
The blob will never ever go away in this game so long as it is anything remotely like it is now.
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Lindsay Fox
Disciples of Comus
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:13:00 -
[21]
Lag is definitely the most important problem in Eve right now, to the 10% of subscribers who live in 0.0
For the other 90% of paying customers, it means very little.
Thread fails due to extreme myopia.
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:17:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Gut Punch
Then be quiet and go to the next thread. Go back to empire and mine some more or whatever you do. But the reality of EVE is that greater numbers have a significant influence on if you will win these engagements; right along with training, communications, and fittings. It is the only thing that compensates for SP differences between some of the major alliances.
I've never disputed that. The mechanics of major 0.0 alliances are such that blobbing is not only encouraged, but an actual necessity. The thing to note, of course, is that Eve PVP is not constrained to your major 0.0 alliances. I perfectly enjoy the small gang, am rarely unable to find another one, and never have seen anyone comment after a battle: "Wow, great fight guys. But you know what'd have made it even greater? If we had a hundred times the number of ships that were present, with a 20 second module activation delay and a good portion of us unable to do anything effectively while we flailed about helpless in the lag we generated. Yes. That would be fun."
Those of us that can't stand lag, don't get involved with 0.0 POS warfare and sovereignty. Don't misconstrue the facts in such a way that you suggest it's absolutely necessary for yourself on a personal level to participate in a major alliance. Were that the case, yes, lag would be an issue that would require reworking the mechanics on a level to allow smaller entities to exist, or the impossible task of reworking the servers to handle entire alliances fighting each other. You're not forced into a 0.0 alliance, you join because you want to, fully aware of the lag associated with the fleets you will have to participate in. A full game experience is possible without one. If you're in one, it's because overall you:
a) enjoy the experience.
b) are completely ********.
c) operate outside the boundaries of logic and reasoning.
So, as you lot willingly signed up for the ride but constantly complain about its features, my question to you in regard to your experience and how you portray it is: Are you lying, stupid, or deranged?
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Attonasi
Dragons Of Redemption
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:38:00 -
[23]
I understand a lot of you people play this game in empire and have fun fighting within a framework that limits participation and involvement. Thats nice.
There are a lot more of us that play outside those constraints. What makes Eve better than WoW is that the content of 0.0 play is player driven. Security, Politics, Economies, War are all player driven with only rules tweaks by CCP. For small group combat/cooperative play WoW is better than Eve in every possible way. CCP needs to recognize why Eve is better and make that game style possible.
Is it going to be easy? No. What I am saying is that we don't really need spiffy new graphics or tech 2 nanopaste or whatever other sillyness they are thinking of adding.
There is nothing worth adding to this game until you fix the lag. That is all.
I hate forums
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Faife
Blackrain Solutions
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:46:00 -
[24]
Can I have your stuff?
alternative unconstructive insult:
Try Low Sec, noob.
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Karyuudo Tydraad
Caldari
Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:48:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Attonasi
There is nothing worth adding to this game until you fix the lag. That is all.
But therein lies the issue. Reworking POS mechanics to accommodate small gangs is one thing, but you can't rework the servers in such a way that no matter how many ships you field lag won't be an issue. You can't upgrade the server indefinitely. Also, I'm sure CCP's staff is organized in such a way that different portions can be working on various projects without influencing efficiency noticeably. In other words, ceasing to develop other portions of the game would in no way increase the speed at which the server can be upgraded.
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Rickroller
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:48:00 -
[26]
Originally by: FireAnt
dont listen to them, they do this to any thread about lag. only time most of the people spewing here face lag is in jita.
LOL!! This is the right answer.  |
Githtakai
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:53:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Lindsay Fox
Lag is definitely the most important problem in Eve right now, to the 10% of subscribers who live in 0.0
For the other 90% of paying customers, it means very little.
Thread fails due to extreme myopia.
Well, I'm part of the 90% in high sec but only because after years of living in 0.0 I left in disgust when all the fleet actions turned to slideshows where skill and equipment were irrelevant.
Nothing is harder as a leader of a corp than getting your troops to show up and face death knowing that they will probably have no input that effects the outcome of the battle or their own survival.
Fix the lag (by CPU or by game mechanics) and you'll see 0.0 flooded with people and fights.
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saadi
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:55:00 -
[28]
wat happend dint your nano ship get away in time 
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Qarth
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Posted - 2008.03.07 01:55:00 -
[29]
Get out of your blob. Problem solved.
You blobing Alliances are the reason lag is as bad as it is. Doesn't take rocket science to figure out that if you don't blob you don't get lag.
200-300 in system in a fleet fight. Yeah you got what you came for, Lag. Drop down to around 30 a side and you'll have more fun.
You signed up for blob warfare, live with it.
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Ringo Jeicha
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Posted - 2008.03.07 02:03:00 -
[30]
Can I have your stuff?
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Orgos Khenn
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.03.07 02:12:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Lindsay Fox
Thread fails due to blob.
Fixed.
----
One day...one day General will be worth reading.
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Peekaboo Iseeyou
Trollops Are Really Terrifying
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Posted - 2008.03.07 02:29:00 -
[32]
So close, no matter how far
Couldn't be much more from the heart
Forever trusting who we are
So close, no matter how far
Couldn't be much more from the heart
Forever trusting who we are
and nothing else matters
Never opened myself this way
Life is ours, we live it our way
All these words I don't just say
and nothing else matters
Trust I seek and I find in you
Every day for us something new
Open mind for a different view
and nothing else matters
never cared for what they do
never cared for what they know
but I know
So close, no matter how far
Couldn't be much more from the heart
Forever trusting who we are
and nothing else matters
OMG METALLICA AGREES WITH YOU!
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Gangus
Minmatar
Matari BackBone
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Posted - 2008.03.07 02:35:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Peekaboo Iseeyou
random metallica lyrics[/b]
i was going to ask you to explain, but now i'm going to ask you not to.
Gangus
Never mess with a guy in an ugly ship. He's bitter and has nothing to lose. |
giles666
Antares Fleet Yards
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 03:14:00 -
[34]
The problem with people sprouting their "don't blob" rhetoric is that, with current game mechanics you HAVE to blob to achieve anything.
With POS warfare the way it is you need a big gang to take down even a moderately defended one. With capital ships in the picture you need to bring even more ships to kill them.
You can't take down a mothership or a titan with 30 ships, and there is no way that the other alliance is going to sit by and let you kill it when it can send 100 ships in support.
Same with defending you space. If someone comes and attacks me then I am going to throw every active pilot in the alliance into the defence.
What really ****s me is that there is a really simple solution to this. Change the F***ing game mechanics CCP. Make it far better off to field a few capitals with small support fleets.
Make it so I need to simultaneously attack 6 systems to take an outpost. Add line of sight to the game so the blob become a tactical no-no. Add sensor interference if you have more than 20 ships close together.
IT ISN'T HARD, JUST STOP SITTING ON YOUR HANDS AND DO SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It took me a few minutes to think of the above ideas and they would take a whole couple of hours to implement.
Problem solved.
Roids for breakfast, lunch and dinner. |
Charles Kuralt
Paladin Imperium
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 03:41:00 -
[35]
There have been many threads about this, but the point remains valid.
And this whole "don't blob then" argument is so outside of the reality of this game I'm forced to wonder what those saying it are playing. Eve has player controlled space. Players will form alliances to hold on to space. Larger ones will eat smaller ones. Larger and larger fleets will engage in combat.
It's not only the current lag that is a problem. It's the fact that EvE is expanding. And not everybody wants to be with the small gang of rifters forever. I'll go so far as too say most would like one of the big shiney carriers they've read about. So Capitol blobs will certainly be growing. Yet in the face of this lag continues to get worse and there is no solution on the horizon.
I agree with the op that nothing else really matters. Not new features. Not Ambulation. CCP must address this problem. It's stupid to keep adding features to a game that obviously isn't working now.
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Ariel Dawn
Beets and Gravy Syndicate
The InterBus Initiative
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Posted - 2008.03.07 05:00:00 -
[36]
The problem is NOT the blobs or the players.
The problem is CCP's game design encouraging and requiring blobs (to take down poses, super-capitals) without providing the appropriate server stability and framework.
It is NOT the players fault in anyway whatsoever.
100% of the blame is on the design, servers, and CCP.
That said, they of course are doing their best to fix the situation.
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Gut Punch
The Graduates
Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2008.03.07 05:34:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Ariel Dawn
That said, they of course are doing their best to fix the situation.
If you believe that, I've got a bridge to sell you. You can't be working to fix blobs and then continue with the current POS mechanics.
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Brutally Clever Empire
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Lord Artemis
Dark Seraph
Order of the Black Cross
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Posted - 2008.03.07 06:00:00 -
[38]
Until blob tactics(bringing more is better) are not advantageous, your never going to fix the problem by reducing lag, only postpone it.
CCP makes XXX pilots in system lag free, Alliance A will bring XXX+1 Alliance B will bring XXX+2, repeat. :-)
Make blob tactics a worthless option.
_____________________________
Public Health Advisory - Say NO to OOC! |
Culdees
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Posted - 2008.03.07 08:11:00 -
[39]
just for fun-
possibly shielded torps or similar like wing commander. only caps ships can carry them and they can be shot down with a fast enough unit. maybe 10 hits to kill another cap ship or more for pos (very slow rate of fire).
pos shields must be destroyed first, but cap ship not.
flags on the pos to warn of cap ship fleet engagement. everyone selected gets mailed ingame and out. if the shield is large enough, there would be enough time for the corp/alliance to react. pos should have permanent cyno field, and a full set of jumpclones for its defenders.
opens up a lot of different ways to attack, and not always with numbers.
another way of dealing with blobs would be to have massive splash damage from ships being destroyed. ie a cap ship blowing up would wipe out battleships and lower within a small radius around it.
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Ralara
Caldari
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 08:21:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Half the time you can't help it - if you're taking down an enemy POS, which has a billionmillion hit points, you NEED that many people to do it.
CCP put these game mechanics in, not us.
--
Ralara / Ralarina |
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Agil TradeAlt
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Posted - 2008.03.07 08:54:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Agil TradeAlt on 07/03/2008 08:55:22
Edited by: Agil TradeAlt on 07/03/2008 08:54:19
100 vs 100 is usually fine.
100 vs 700 is laggy. Duh!
So insted of 700 vs 100, both sides should keep equal numbers and leave the rest in reserve. I.E keep 600 back and let the 100 v 100 battle happen. If you loose, send in next 100 and so on. That was the battle is pretty lag free, but usually the bigger blob in a fight has crapper and cheap ships (which is why they need to outnumber by so much in the first place). Yeah I know this has been posted about dozens of times before, but players, tell your allaince leaders to apply brains!
For example, not that long ago we read about 800 vs titan and 3 hours later the titan was still winning. System lagged so much from this 800 vs 1 (as thousands more were trying ot jump in) that the node eventually crashed. Most of the ships that fought the titan was stuff like frigs and other crap that would die in titan smartbomb range.
Did people use a couple of dreadnaughts, a Anti-Capital ship that CCP designed for this purpose? Heck no, just cheapist fit riters and the like so people lagged like hell. A small gang of 2-3 dreads can kill a titan that is locked down, but that would involve people spending isk. So insted, people bring 800+ cheap disposable t1 ships which dont work.
Originally by: CCP kieron
ISK buying is a major contributor to the inflation in EVE's economy.
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Mikal Drey
ORIGIN SYSTEMS
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 09:56:00 -
[42]
hey hey
****** off with the lag To Be VERY ******* HONEST !!!
That so called fight was totally runied by the lag. The grid failed to load, modules wouldnt activate, drones wouldnt launch, couldnt lock. Just plain *******s from CCP.
There was a big circle jerk session when they released the Yarrdware and a back patting session when need for speed was launched. But day after day its just crap.
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Zombie Network
GoonFleet
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Posted - 2008.03.07 10:25:00 -
[43]
I have friends I have tried to get into Eve, they are interested in the PvP and political element of the game, but when I tell them about the lag and the boring grind that is POS warfare they just don't want to know any more.
The game mechanics require blobbing, blobbing causes lag. CCP either need to change the game mechanics or fix lag, however they don't appear to be working particularly hard on either because being able to walk around appears to be far more important to them.
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Roxanna Kell
FinFleet
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.03.07 10:28:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Roxanna Kell on 07/03/2008 10:29:20
Hey Guys, LAG is not myth. Weather you are in Blobs, or not.
EVE should Handle 150 vs 150 lag less by now, But it can't. Blobs have been growing faster than CCP can deal with right now, Their incompetence has not been justified, so we still haven't got a clue of whats stopping another upgrade, or whatever else can be done. All the comunity need to know is what CCP is going to do about it, A dev blog, a thread. Anything to make it feel that our voice is being heard.
The silence is rather annoying tbh, and undeserved.
Quote:
You are what you are, fool
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Hungo
Minmatar
Nightfallz
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Posted - 2008.03.07 10:31:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Attonasi
I don't see any posts on lag so I am adding this one. Screw you if you think this is a dead horse because it obviously needs to be beaten some more. If you want people involved in the 0.0 community you have to deal with this. I have several friends that would play Eve the way it was meant to be played if you could have a decent 0.0 fleet fight.
I see whines and moans about a lot of crap here. But nothing is holding this game back than the complete inability to have a decent fleet fight. Nothing else is even close. We had 130 people in local in bwf 30 minutes ago and people couldn't load the grid for 10 minutes. I could, I got some kills, but 30-60 second module activation really sucks the fun out of it. I can not even imagine what it is like in delve.
The fight really went downhill when the fighters jumped in. We have had 200-300 people in local with little lag during a fleet fight, but as soon as the carriers/MOMs start popping drones the system we are in turns to ****. Please try looking at the assignment of fighters in particular.
Seriously, nothing else matters until this issue is fixed. Not even a skill queue which should be next...
They will never be able to fix the lag and ill tell you why. I run, programme and service servers all day everyday.
One server CANNOT run what CCP is trying to do. And this is why your so clled *omg 400k subs* is infact 40 odd thousand people worldwide with lots of accounts. The server simply cannot handle that kind of input and CCp dont give two ****s about anyone but themselves.
get used to it, ccp are *****s, period
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Sha Dar
eXceed Inc.
eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 10:48:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Sha Dar on 07/03/2008 10:50:34
Sarcasm
Dude, you really need to get in step with the CCP priority list before posting a request like that.
1. Use eve as a testbed for other games by introducing walking in stations then use the players a guinea pigs to iron out the inevitable bugs.
2. Introduce yet another level of fluff with so-called factional warfare instead of sorting out the interminable grind of POS warfare.
3. Pretty up the GFX some more to distract people from the crappy pvp experience.
4. Yet to be decided but we can come up with more distractions easily
/Sarcasm
Seriously, it "used" to be possible to have fleet fights a LOT bigger than this without even close to the lag that people experience nowadays, and that was BEFORE the multiple drone nerfs, sorry, "improvements", hell, just download some of the older eve videos to see it in action as it used to be.
-
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Nasta443
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Posted - 2008.03.07 10:57:00 -
[47]
I remember, with a bit of sadness in my mind, the days not so long ago where cyno jammers, station services and company came in with the hope in hand that it would lead to smaller gang pos warfare.
Eventually it ended up as it naturally would. Sigh.
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Tsu'ko
Valley Forge
STELLAR LEGION
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Posted - 2008.03.07 11:14:00 -
[48]
They are adding filters / tabs to the overview, so we don't have to show all the drones / wrecks / can's etc that show on screen anymore, maybe the drones will not need to be calculated as much as they are now then?
Think this may reduce client lag(your cpu lag) and server lag.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
The Amarr are the tanking and ganking floating rods of gold.
Amarr simply sit there and charge their lasers, secure in their knowledge that God is on their side.
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ThroatWarbler Mangrove
Caldari
Right of Passage
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Posted - 2008.03.07 11:38:00 -
[49]
The lag argument is a red-herring and insurmountable via throwing hardware or net-code at the issue. People will just field more and more ships to take up any new slack.
The problem here, as most people have pointed out, is a simple case of tactical application. The side with the largest force usually wins. The "few stood against many" thing is usually reserved for the movies. Therefore, the simplest, and the most powerful, military tactic is to bring more people into battle.
There needs to be an adjustment to encourage FCs to field a smaller force. Examples listed (that may have been already, sorry I haven't read the entire thread)
1) Reducing maximum gang size. Large forces would have to be split into multiple fleets, making them hard to manage.
2) Dividing command ship bonuses by the number of ships in a fleet. Command ship bonuses would be stacked to prevent large fleets fielding more of them to get around the problem.
3) Increase the lock time of members of large fleets (spin it as "magnetic interference from ships in your gang" or something). This doesn't have to be linear so that, over a certain number, lock times could increase dramatically.
The aim of the game is to ensure that increasing numbers over a certain amount results in a law of diminishing returns, and excessive numbers is actually a detriment. Unfortunately, such adjustments will radically affect game mechanics over a large number of areas, and they run contrary to military common sense. This is probably why they haven't been implemented yet.
Just my uninformed 2 cents  |
Agil TradeAlt
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Posted - 2008.03.07 11:49:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Agil TradeAlt on 07/03/2008 11:50:50
Originally by: ThroatWarbler Mangrove
The problem here, as most people have pointed out, is a simple case of tactical application. The side with the largest force usually wins. The "few stood against many" thing is usually reserved for the movies. Therefore, the simplest, and the most powerful, military tactic is to bring more people into battle.
This used to be the case. Nowadays its fleets with around 80% ineffective ships(including shuttles, noobships etc) trying to out blob the opponant, since if both sides lag out, its a coin toss who wins. Such ineffective fleets would die normally without lag and rely upon lag and the "Coin toss" to win.
For example, if 700 vs 100 happens, and 95% of people lag out, then thats 40 people able to fight. Now comes the coin toss. If those 40 people are almost entirely within the 700 blobers, then they win scot free due to lag tactics since the other side has not loaded.
This is how people use massive blobs of useless ships to beat high quality ships. Insted of fighting with simaler number of equally high quality ships, they just spam with dozens of crap hoping to play the coin toss game, since higher numbers of crap would lose vs lower numbers of good fitted ships.
Originally by: CCP kieron
ISK buying is a major contributor to the inflation in EVE's economy.
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Uraga Kurofune
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Posted - 2008.03.07 12:02:00 -
[51]
I would like to see real fleet fights. Not that 300 vs 300 nonsense, but real 10000 vs 10000 fleet fights. That would be awesome.
Not that it will happen anytime soon but one can dream...
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Lazuran
Gallente
Time And ISK Sink Corporation
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Posted - 2008.03.07 12:13:00 -
[52]
The lag isn't getting fixed. CCP is using mushroom tactics and not even bothering to buy new hardware to compensate for their inability to fix the code. Instead they spend 7-8m US$ on advertising to bring more players to EVE.
We might just as well all go back to Empire and run missions, which is what this game is apparently about.
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Surreptitious
Privateers
Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 13:00:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Ghostwarden
Originally by: Attonasi
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
67 of us vs. 98 of them. Massive blobs. I apologize on behalf of our massive alliance for making our gang counts confusingly large for you.
If this is your "solution" then make more space so we can spread out more or make the current ******** and useless 0.0 systems nobody ever uses useful. Otherwise your solution is a ******** flame.
Ok....lets examine your complaint here in comparison with some other MMO's Ive had experience with...
you had 165 players (not including thier drones which really cound as a seperate entity that the computer has to control)in a fleet combat with 200-300 in local....hmmm, in Everquest this would be impossible and its a sharded game...last time I checked there was 100 player cap for each grid.....and from what I've been told WOW, Middle Earth and most of the other MMO's are set up this way IF Im not completely mistaken.
Now, this is not intended as a flame but I dont think Im too far off the mark when I say that CCP is very interested in the problem and are doing their best to fix it. Your going to have to be patient just like the rest of us when it comes to lag.
Sorry dude.
Ghost
Thats not how WOW works. I am routinely in fights much larger than the "100 cap" you reference. And not only do the animations and graphics render well and timely but there is literally no lag. I push a button in the middle of the crowd and within 1 second the action takes place. Why cant EVE do that or even come close. With EVE you push a button and maybe, maybe 1-2 minutes later it works.
And you say CCP is very interested in fixing the problem then I would argue they either have incredibly inept people working on it or are just flat out lying. I personally have been waiting almost 4 years now for it to get better. The scary part is it has only gotten worse.
Syrup
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Ki An
Gallente
Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.03.07 13:11:00 -
[54]
The way I see it is that you have a choice of how to play this game. If you chose the mega-blob-alliance route then you have to expect being lagged out. If you don't want that, chose another way to play the game. Small gang pvp is entirelly possible in Eve, and it's seldome ruined by lag.
I can see CCP's problem with this "fix the lag ffs" argument. I mena, take a look at Jita. It became a huge trade hub. Lots of people went there. It started to lag. People whined. CCP threw hardware at it. More people came. It lagged again. People whined more. CCP threw more hardware at it. More people came... etc ad infinitum.
Fixing the blob by fixing game mechanics seem to be the only way, but that's going to have serious repercussions on other aspects of the game. As such, it's going to take a looooong time to fix as CCP has to make a lot of predictions and changes elsewhere to make it work.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Lazuran
Gallente
Time And ISK Sink Corporation
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Posted - 2008.03.07 13:41:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Ki An
I can see CCP's problem with this "fix the lag ffs" argument. I mena, take a look at Jita. It became a huge trade hub. Lots of people went there. It started to lag. People whined. CCP threw hardware at it. More people came. It lagged again. People whined more. CCP threw more hardware at it. More people came... etc ad infinitum.
This is because lag has been an obstacle in the game for so long and when it improves, people actually begin to play the game the way the game design allows and mandates it.
Botched trade hubs like Jita are a logical consequence of all of these together:
- no globally visible market offers
- WTZ
- now way to obtain a purchased item without going to the market hub
So if the Jita blobbing is a problem, there are easy ways to counter this (Interbus). It just has to be done and CCP is notoriously lazy about implementing serious anti-blob measures, while they are surprisingly fast at implementing bugs and features that cause more lag (gang mechanics etc.).
One thing is certain though: don't confuse the technical reasons for lag and the reasons that lie in the game's design with the players' behaviour. People play the game like they can/want to and if you allow a certain kind of gameplay, it's stupid to complain if it causes lag (unless you want to argue that the intention of the players is to cause lag!). It is a really poor excuse for fanbois and CCP alike to say that lag won't be fixed because people are playing the game. Damn customers, eh?
How annoying it must be when you design and sell a service and then your customers actually try to use it. :-/
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Sha4d13
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Posted - 2008.03.07 13:50:00 -
[56]
The whineage in this thread is immense- and is leading to some deeply illogical thinking. The ideas that
(1) CCP dont want to fix the lag
or
(2) they should forego all profit and bankrupt the company to build the worlds biggest computer to fix it...
Are both ridiculous.
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Doc Fury
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Posted - 2008.03.07 13:52:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Sha Dar
Edited by: Sha Dar on 07/03/2008 10:50:34
Sarcasm
Dude, you really need to get in step with the CCP priority list before posting a request like that.
1. Use eve as a testbed for other games by introducing walking in stations then use the subscribers players as guinea pigs to iron out the inevitable bugs.
2. Introduce yet another level of fluff with so-called factional warfare instead of sorting out the interminable grind of POS warfare.
3. Pretty up the GFX some more to distract people from the crappy pvp experience.
4. Yet to be decided but we can come up with more distractions easily
/Sarcasm
When I was a software engineer we used to call this "putting lipstick on the pig" and we usually had to do it right before the money people or new clients came round for a look-see. #1 is sadly 100% spot-on.
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Brainless Bimbo
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:04:00 -
[58]
Lol, All you do in eve is dependent on your onboard ship pooters, if you load enough crap in any program its going to lag, but it can be seen as part of the role play, more targets actually means that your ships battle computer stacks have to work harder tracking all the objects, as they are all running code written by the eve equilevent of MS its a given that they will fall over when overwhelemed by data that it can't process fast enough.
So Lag can be considered a game feature until our ships internal systems and subsystems are built to higher standards, stay out of the blob your ship systems was not made to handle it.
There lag explained by blaming the ship builders and their subsequent pilots not reading the manuals on the limits of the onboard computing capacity.
... continued overleaf |
Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:13:00 -
[59]
Area effects are something that's been used by other games to spread people out, perhaps that was one of the reasons for implementing doomsday weapons.
One thing that might could be done is to implement a T2 BS class that has a special ability or two designed to work well against blobs. It seems like the marauders are mission ships and the black ops ships are for small scale messing around... a T2 BS designed for straight-up big fights might fit in well.
They have talked a good bit about how they're working to deal with the lag so I don't think it's something they're ignoring. More like something they're just finding challenging I'd imagine.
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BhallSpawn
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:14:00 -
[60]
I agree completely with the OP
walking in stations, planet combat, new shader model 3 grahpics, faction warfare, new missions, more content....
take all of that away and FIX THE LAG.
It's obvious CCP is more interested in profits than working on the lag issue.
they put themselves in steam.
trying to get more subscribers for a game that already can't handle the 30k that play at one time now.
It's pretty sad to say the least.
Once jumpgate evolution hits the market.. if its any good, and if you can actually fight in a fleet with little lag. your gonna see people join that game in droves.
Eve with fleet battles with little lag would be a glorious thing.
But shiney new grahpics and more and more features is what sells.
fixing bugs and making the game stable isn't an advertising slogan.
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Mihailo Great
GoonFleet
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:14:00 -
[61]
Temporarily remove fighters form the game. They are broken. Period.
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Salliene
Gallente
RennTech
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:20:00 -
[62]
Multiplayer games coming out TODAY can't handle 100+ players all fighting in a small area, I don't know why people are still expecting EVE to be able to handle it without major client/server/infrastructure upgrades.
IMO it *IS* a dead horse until the game gets rebuilt from the very first line of code to the very last.
Theres a reason why COD4 and Halo 3 have limited numbers of player per map, and it's not balance. It's so that you don't get a crappy lagfest like you do in a major fleet battle in EVE.
Even Blizzard doesn't have the hubris to try and squeeze 100+ players into a single dungeon and expect it to work.
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Viglen
Taurus Inc
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:46:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Surreptitious
Thats not how WOW works. I am routinely in fights much larger than the "100 cap" you reference. And not only do the animations and graphics render well and timely but there is literally no lag. I push a button in the middle of the crowd and within 1 second the action takes place. Why cant EVE do that or even come close. With EVE you push a button and maybe, maybe 1-2 minutes later it works.
And you say CCP is very interested in fixing the problem then I would argue they either have incredibly inept people working on it or are just flat out lying. I personally have been waiting almost 4 years now for it to get better. The scary part is it has only gotten worse.
Syrup
I had to read this a few times to get it, and then I did something I haven't done in years, I pressed quote!
first of all, Eve didn't have such crippling lag before capitals were introduced, or at least in my experience plus what I've heard from players I know.
Second, you sound like a dedicated "WOW" player which leads me to think that you've played "WOW" since day one!
Were you by any chance forced to buy a new computer when you started playing "WOW"?
If so, then your old comp was probably the Laggy part when u played EVE 4 years ago!
And EVE evolved into capital warfare while you played "WOW", am I right?
EVE can't be compared to other MMO's because of how fundamentally different it is from other games! (one cluster)
I have only recently noticed the horrid lag thad people are talking about, Jita isn't worth mentioning since it's our market "capital"!
This lag that I'm referring to has been happening in Verge Vendor, Red vs Blue, and a fight in cist before that.
Capital fleet fights is something that I'm not familiar with because I was in 0.0 just as they were entering the game and were a rare sight, which only strengthens my opinion on Capitals and the fleet around them being a major lag fest.
Resources have probably been taken from areas within the game that aren't straining the servers, then Verge becomes a gank fest for a number of party's and ppl like me feel the lag, and I'm talking about the same lag that you are complaining about.
bahh i could go on and on, but I'll just be patient as ever and ride it out until IBM and CCP have put together they'r supercomputer :)
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consider telos
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 14:54:00 -
[64]
Even when ccp do get their super computer up and running I still don't think it'll be a magic fix for the lag. I think ccp need to take a look at the gameplay mechanics. Mainly the pos mechanics. That's the only time when you get stupid lag. Pos warfare is boring and lag intensive. The sovereignty system made it even worse.
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Matrixcvd
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 16:34:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Matrixcvd on 07/03/2008 16:34:44
Originally by: Salliene
Multiplayer games coming out TODAY can't handle 100+ players all fighting in a small area, I don't know why people are still expecting EVE to be able to handle it without major client/server/infrastructure upgrades.
IMO it *IS* a dead horse until the game gets rebuilt from the very first line of code to the very last.
Theres a reason why COD4 and Halo 3 have limited numbers of player per map, and it's not balance. It's so that you don't get a crappy lagfest like you do in a major fleet battle in EVE.
Even Blizzard doesn't have the hubris to try and squeeze 100+ players into a single dungeon and expect it to work.
the problem here is that it use to be fine, 100 people in a system worked great, fun fights yada yda yada, 200 people, no problem. After RMR, we started to get quite a bit more lag, after REV, we got desynch and with the POS changes got more lag, after trinity we got craptastic effects, desynch huge lag, TQ hits 40k and there is no going back to when things were better.
Dev's, thru mismanagement, have imposed game mechancis changes that have exasperated technical capability of the server and then been quite rude about acknoweldging player loses due to the combination of shorted sighted game design, and lack of motivation to upgrade equipment.
thats the problem
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AleRiperKilt
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Posted - 2008.03.07 16:46:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already.
I don't mean this as a flame but CCP could start by trying Oracle. I mean, WTF?, Microsoft SQL?
Also I would love to take whack at their database queries, I bet I can squeeze some performance out of that code.
---
1. Mine Ice in T1 Barge
2. Get suicide ganked by goons
3. ????
4. PROFIT! |
Kerdrak
3B Legio IX
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 16:57:00 -
[67]
CCP have to fix only one problem:
1. Game mechanics on 0.0 warfare.
2. Game performance.
It's so hard?
________________________________________
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Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp
INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.03.07 17:10:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Kerdrak
CCP have to fix only one problem:
1. Game mechanics on 0.0 warfare.
2. Game performance.
It's so hard?
QFT TBQFH.
Originally by: CCP Oveur
...every forum whine feels like a baby pony is getting killed
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.03.07 17:31:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Lindsay Fox
Lag is definitely the most important problem in Eve right now, to the 10% of subscribers who live in 0.0
For the other 90% of paying customers, it means very little.
Thread fails due to extreme myopia.
what % of the 90 wants to go to 0.0 but doesnt want to deal with the crazy lag fest we call fleet fights?
also how many people whine about jita/other highsec lag?
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Thorek Ironbrow
Ironbrow Industries Co.
Soldiers of the Forgotten Abyss
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Posted - 2008.03.07 17:34:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Quote for truth.
_____________________________
"So what do you need, besides a miracle?"
"Guns... Lots of guns" |
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Surreptitious
Privateers
Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 17:47:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Viglen
Originally by: Surreptitious
Thats not,,,
Syrup
first of all, Eve didn't have such crippling lag before capitals were introduced, or at least in my experience plus what I've heard from players I know.
Second, you sound like a dedicated "WOW" player which leads me to think that you've played "WOW" since day one!
Were you by any chance forced to buy a new computer when you started playing "WOW"?
If so, then your old comp was probably the Laggy part when u played EVE 4 years ago!
And EVE evolved into capital warfare while you played "WOW", am I right?
EVE can't be compared to other MMO's because of how fundamentally different it is from other games! (one cluster)
I have only recently noticed the horrid lag thad people are talking about, Jita isn't worth mentioning since it's our market "capital"!
This lag that I'm referring to has been happening in Verge Vendor, Red vs Blue, and a fight in cist before that.
Capital fleet fights is something that I'm not familiar with because I was in 0.0 just as they were entering the game and were a rare sight, which only strengthens my opinion on Capitals and the fleet around them being a major lag fest.
Resources have probably been taken from areas within the game that aren't straining the servers, then Verge becomes a gank fest for a number of party's and ppl like me feel the lag, and I'm talking about the same lag that you are complaining about.
bahh i could go on and on, but I'll just be patient as ever and ride it out until IBM and CCP have put together they'r supercomputer :)
I would agree 4-5 years ago EVE did not have nearly as bad lag. It did seem to start getting "bad" around the time caps came in but i dont know if thats coincedence or not.
I havent played wow since day 1. EVE about 4-5 years, WOW 2-3 with only 2 level 70s. In the begining it was EVE over WOW maybe 10 hour to 1. Over the years as lag got worse and game play less fun that ratio has essentially flipped. Not to mention all of my RL buddies left EVE completely for WOW.
4 years ago my PC situation was fine and I would argue EVE both then and now is more demanding on hardware than WOW. Back then it was a 3.0P4, nowadays its a E8400. Like I said I had less lag back then and agree it was enjoyable.
I played EVE all the way thru the cap warfare game, my mainw as the first person accepted into the MC(actually just BDCI back then) who wasnt one of the RL inner circle of friends. I played though it all, from our fake contracts against CLS before we even worked with the Sharks all the way to our current situation with Tortuga. I agree, anythign cap/territory related is boring and sucks the life out of the game.
And yes, we could go on and on. I am doing the same as you in a sense. I dont really "play" EVE anymore. I play othergames and am just hoping one day either somethign new/fun(faction warfare) happens in EVE or they sort the servers out.
Either way, we on the same page. 
Syrup
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Zagum Darkfin
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.03.07 19:17:00 -
[72]
Guys, did you get the memo?? This is a TURN BASED SPACE TRADING SIMULATION GAME. Come on, where the hell do you get the idea that its about large scale PVP?? Some people.
..i.. |
Dirtee Girl
Omega Enterprises
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2008.03.07 20:08:00 -
[73]
Master of orion 4?
*
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Aaron Mirrorsaver
R.E.C.O.N.
Black-Out
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Posted - 2008.03.07 20:13:00 -
[74]
the problem is your computer can't handle the amount of people. its your frame rate causing the lag.
whats was your frame rate? Slide show? like 0.00001 frames per second? as in you see a slight movement every 5 seconds? Thats CPU hog, thats not network stuff.
Poor frames will then lead to high ping and massive lag, hence your 60 second module activation....
to those who say we're whining.... we play the game this way because we like the 0.0 stuff and politics etc...
they'd be lying if they didn't agree that everyone role plays at least 10%. or do you REALLY care about your pixellated empire and mothership in 0.0?
the 0.0 alliance game is an enjoyable one for more hardcore players who spend more time at eve...
Go Hard, or go Home.
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Prez21
coracao ardente
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 20:21:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Qarth
Get out of your blob. Problem solved.
You blobing Alliances are the reason lag is as bad as it is. Doesn't take rocket science to figure out that if you don't blob you don't get lag.
200-300 in system in a fleet fight. Yeah you got what you came for, Lag. Drop down to around 30 a side and you'll have more fun.
You signed up for blob warfare, live with it.
I love posts from idiots like this who know nothing about the game.
0.0 Is the most valuable space in game to control this you need poses, to destroy these you need lots of ships. CCP has made it that if you want to control 0.0 space you need lots of numbers is that too hard for an idiot like you to understand?
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Gort
Storm Guard Elite
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Posted - 2008.03.07 20:22:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Here's the truth of it.
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When in doubt, empty the magazine. |
Karash Amerius
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.03.07 20:27:00 -
[77]
Well TBH, it would be nice to see a different system taking (and holding) gameplay within Eve. Maybe with plantary warfare? I don't think there is any player alive that thinks POS warfare is "fun"...it is just a mandatory evil for taking and holding systems.
"Fighting Broke" - An Ex-Merc Blog |
Sha Dar
eXceed Inc.
eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 21:13:00 -
[78]
Exactly, and yet CCP in their "infinite wisdom" decided to expand on it rather than streamline/overhaul it with performance in mind.
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William Alex
Viscosity
Vanguard.
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Posted - 2008.03.07 21:15:00 -
[79]
Everyone is talking about promoting smaller gang warfare by nerfing gangs. Why not just buff smaller gang sizes and leave large gangs the way they are now?
Like if you're in a 1 squad gang your Command bonus is trippled
2 sqaud gang = doubled
3+ = normal
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Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp
INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.03.07 21:23:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Gort
Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad
Solution: GTFO of your blob. You know what you're in for when you sign up for a massive 0.0 alliance, and you lose the right to complain about lag at that point. I'm no programmer, but common sense tells me that if there was a quick fix to lag problems, CCP would have done it already. I just stick to small gangs and it's never a problem.
Here's the truth of it.
I agree, its absolutely rediculous for players to feel that an intended part of the game should be playable!
So what if Fords explode when people drive them, only 10% of the population drives them. Who cares if they like Fords, they know what they are getting into when they buy one....
You guys fail, horribly and epically. 
Originally by: CCP Oveur
...every forum whine feels like a baby pony is getting killed
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Sky Marshal
Aeden
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.03.07 21:41:00 -
[81]
Originally by: William Alex
2 sqaud gang = doubled
3+ = normal
Bad idea. An alliance can ask to create the appropriate number of squads to make a pseudo-fleet and take advantage of the bonus.
CCP know that it is more important to take care of the 90% empire players than the 0.0 ones. New graphics, Ambulation, etc... concerns only empire players, as a good fleet member will disable all things who can affect his client in a fleet battle, and will have better things to do than play ambulation.
I don't think CCP will launch his "supercomputer" this year, but will prefer create new features.
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16/20 Dragon : ½ Great Game +
14/20 Revelations : ½ Desyncs... +
11/20 Trinity : ½ BBSOD, Bugs, Desyncs, F*** Nerfs +
10/20 v1.1 : ½ [...] + EXP shield nerf +
CCP, you are tiring. |
Jorena
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Posted - 2008.03.07 23:24:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Surreptitious
Thats not how WOW works. I am routinely in fights much larger than the "100 cap" you reference. And not only do the animations and graphics render well and timely but there is literally no lag. I push a button in the middle of the crowd and within 1 second the action takes place. Why cant EVE do that or even come close. With EVE you push a button and maybe, maybe 1-2 minutes later it works.
I quit EVE not long after the L70 cap expansion came out. The primary new 'feature' was in not having any new 40-man instances. We fought through every 40-man, top Horde on our server, through excruciating lag and instance server crashes. Blizzard's answer in the end was to just not do that anymore because they simply couldn't handle 40 people on one server. (I quit, as did many, because while the 40-mans were laggy, they had improved greatly by then, and we wanted more 40-man instances. Blizzard effectively destroyed most large raiding guilds, including mine.)
Granted, the lag is a HUGE issue here. I've been in tons of fleet battles with hundreds of people in system. The problem is CCP can't fix it without making major changes to the way the server software is designed. My last understanding is while it was threaded, an individual system instance was still limited to using a single CPU. This needs to be fixed, which I don't think can be done using Python the way they do. They also need to be able to take advantage of newer networking technologies that use direct memory access, which is another huge change in the server software.
I don't see any of this ever getting fixed properly in EVE. All they can do is change game mechanics to reduce or eliminate all blob warfare.
Maybe if there is ever an EVE2 or a new MMO project they will write it correctly from the start.
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