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Sylthi
Minmatar
Coreward Pan-Galactic
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Posted - 2008.04.18 09:10:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Sylthi on 18/04/2008 09:14:32
Smakz: I wasn't directing the SL comment to you specifically, so no offense there.  Besides, I looked over my sister's shoulder once while she was playing SL. I felt nausiated in the first 20 seconds..... I wouldn't wish that on anyone. 
But, I have to second what you already know. Yeah, having people take you under their wing that early in your career, you got LUCKY. Just because I have never trusted that many people, doesn't mean I have never been ripped off.
Example: Back when I first started playing the game, corp officers could not only LOOK in your personal hangars that were at stations where they had offices; they could put stuff in them and take stuff out too. My first 90 days in game was dutifully dedicated to a corp that recruited me, and a group of guys, whom I THOUGHT were my friends.
After those 90 days, and after they convinced me to invest most of my money in new shinny ships that I could barely fly, what do you think happened? Yep. One fine morning I logged in to find all of my stuff gone and having been kicked out of the corp. After 90 days of play, my net worth was a Rifter that my character was in (they couldn't take a ship I had equiped) and roughly 750k isk.
In retrospect, I truly do thank them rather than curse them. They taught me an invaulable lesson about Eve, and life in general, for that matter. One that I have never forgotten.
So yes, you got lucky. But, don't depend on it. Stay alert, and don't LET people screw you over. Be smart. Be paranoid. Be wealthy. Be Eve.
Cheers.
*
* |
Smakalicious
Caldari
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 09:12:00 -
[62]
 Originally by: Rod Blaine
It's because you're not in a corp.
Corporations are there to function as groups of people that can trust and help eachother. The corp tag is what assures you the guy in your gang can be trusted. There is no shortage of good player corporations in Eve you can join so as to have people to help out en be helped out by.
In short, get out of the NPC corp already.
Ok, I'll post with my main now à (posted with my alt 'cause I like Gallente b.o.o.b.s  )
I have spent my time almost entirely in Corporations, all in 0.0. Yes, the help was there à and I guess will always be. But it just seems, that the will to help vanishes, if your not blue or in the same corp.
All the best,
Smak
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Smakalicious
Caldari
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 09:30:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Sylthi
Example: Back when I first started playing the game, corp officers could not only LOOK in your personal hangars that were at stations where they had offices; they could put stuff in them and take stuff out too. My first 90 days in game was dutifully dedicated to a corp that recruited me, and a group of guys, whom I THOUGHT were my friends.
After those 90 days, and after they convinced me to invest most of my money in new shinny ships that I could barely fly, what do you think happened? Yep. One fine morning I logged in to find all of my stuff gone and having been kicked out of the corp. After 90 days of play, my net worth was a Rifter that my character was in (they could take a ship I had equiped) and roughly 750k isk.
In retrospect, I truly do thank them rather than curse them. They taught me an invaulable lesson about Eve, and life in general, for that matter. One that I have never forgotten.
So yes, you got lucky. But, don't depend on it. Stay alert, and don't LET people screw you over. Be smart. Be paranoid. Be wealthy. Be Eve.
Hi Sylthi,
sorry for that, bro. Glad, that this never happened to me.
(BTW: It still possible that CEOs or directors can take stuff from the personal hangars?? *paranoid*)
You see, perhaps I'm just that (oldfashioned) type guy, that keeps believing in the good of people, instead of being a bit more sceptical towards strangers. Dunno, but after reading the many responses so far, I will certainly change may way of looking at things ... at least a little.
Fly safe, my friend.
All the best,
Smak
PS: SecondLife à bad idea *shrugs*
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Join the ΞνΞ Places.com Link Competition and win a 90 day GTC |
Sylthi
Minmatar
Coreward Pan-Galactic
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 09:43:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Smakalicious
(BTW: It still possible that CEOs or directors can take stuff from the personal hangars?? *paranoid*)
Look in? Yes. Take from? No. Thank the gods. The "take from" got fixed back in late 2004, if memory serves. But, your paranoia is GOOD. You're learning. Let that feeling take root and grow.
Originally by: Smakalicious
You see, perhaps I'm just that (oldfashioned) type guy, that keeps believing in the good of people, instead of being a bit more sceptical towards strangers.
Don't get me wrong. You're an optomist. I like optomists. They make great customers. *Opens display case of freshly minted T2 mods and ships for sale.*
Originally by: Smakalicious
Dunno, but after reading the many responses so far, I will certainly change may way of looking at things ... at least a little.
Glad to have been of help, if any..... 
Cheers.
*
* |
Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
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Posted - 2008.04.18 09:43:00 -
[65]
Knowing game mechanics is the best thing you can do.
If someone wants you to help them with a mission, do yourself a favour and make the gang yourself. If they suddenly don't want to do the mission anymore, they were trying to gank you.
If they ask you to invite their 'hauler alt', ask who it is and check any wars they're in.
If they're not at war - It's safe.
Them trusting you isn't important since they're the ones who approached you in the first place 
...
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Stakhanov
Metafarmers
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Posted - 2008.04.18 10:25:00 -
[66]
The people who yelled at you for being a scammer are just bitter jerks. This is to be expected in highsec , where a good part of warfare revolves around deception ; and they have next to zero risk smacking people whenever they feel like it (especially NPC corpers)
The lofty claimed countless victims , but that doesn't mean you can't cooperate with strangers safely (more or less) as long as the party offering / requesting assistance isn't creating the gang. In your case , it is very unlikely a highsec pirate would bother to trap your drake.
What really matters is to make trust irrelevant , or minimize its use. Less opportunities means less temptations. Aura says one important thing in the tutorial - most people are almost honest. It means they are reliable 90% of the time but might be swayed by huge gain (billions in corp wallet , T2 BPOs , faction stuff)
It is your responsibility to prevent their greedy side from showing. It is very rare to see a corpmate kill another for no reason , they'd rather forgo their own safety and sacrifice their ships to rescue each other - but when you dump piles of shiny stuff in plain sight , you can't expect everyone in corp to stoically ignore it.
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Insurgency
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Posted - 2008.04.18 10:39:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Stakhanov
The people who yelled at you for being a scammer are just bitter jerks. This is to be expected in highsec , where a good part of warfare revolves around deception ; and they have next to zero risk smacking people whenever they feel like it (especially NPC corpers)
The lofty claimed countless victims , but that doesn't mean you can't cooperate with strangers safely (more or less) as long as the party offering / requesting assistance isn't creating the gang. In your case , it is very unlikely a highsec pirate would bother to trap your drake.
What really matters is to make trust irrelevant , or minimize its use. Less opportunities means less temptations. Aura says one important thing in the tutorial - most people are almost honest. It means they are reliable 90% of the time but might be swayed by huge gain (billions in corp wallet , T2 BPOs , faction stuff)
It is your responsibility to prevent their greedy side from showing. It is very rare to see a corpmate kill another for no reason , they'd rather forgo their own safety and sacrifice their ships to rescue each other - but when you dump piles of shiny stuff in plain sight , you can't expect everyone in corp to stoically ignore it.
In other words: trust people, but don't trust them more than you need to. |
Drizit
Amarr
FREEDOM FIRST
Black Sun Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.18 11:20:00 -
[68]
It's a cold harsh fact that in Eve, you have to earn trust. Anyone who gives their trust blindly is a fool and will soon learn to be wary of others in the game.
After a couple of years in the game, you will soon learn that sometimes, you can't even trust yourself.
--
Freighters need a tank |
DORIAN GRACE
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Posted - 2008.04.18 11:22:00 -
[69]
Originally by: DORIAN GRACE
Trust comes down to individual relationships. Case in point, my goal is to earn everyone's trust in EVE. And to show how trustworthy I am anyone, and I mean anyone can send me 10 million isk and i will immediately return it. We will be friends forever, plenty of trust to go around..............
My offer still stand, address book filling up quickly though!
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Smakalicious
Caldari
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
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Posted - 2008.04.18 12:32:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Sylthi
But, your paranoia is GOOD. You're learning. Let that feeling take root and grow.
I believe it will take a little while, but I'm very confident, I will survive 
Quote:
Don't get me wrong. You're an optomist. I like optomists. They make great customers. *Opens display case of freshly minted T2 mods and ships for sale.*
Hehe, clever 
Seriously, it makes me feel good to be an optimist in this regard, but I'm aware that this may be hurting me someday in one way or the other.
Quote:
Glad to have been of help, if any.....
Well, how's that Apple slogan: Think different. You, and many others in this thread, helped me to develop my personal opinion widened my view on many things. Thanks for that.
All the best,
Smak
---------------------------------------
Join the ΞνΞ Places.com Link Competition and win a 90 day GTC |
TheBlueMonkey
Gallente
BlueBlock
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 12:52:00 -
[71]
I get precisely the same thing when I offer salvage rights in local, the responce I get is somewhere between indignance and "IT'S TEH TRAPZ!!!".
Also, possibly worth noting, a chum recently found out that when he and I were in a fleet (not in the same corp) and he acidently fired a shot on me in the mission. Concord turned up rather promptly. |
Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 15:47:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Corwain
Originally by: Avon
Leave Rachen until last, dock, fit bcu's, kill Rachen.
Rachen tanks like 500dps. You'll need HAMs to kill him with a drake, and closing range will be a *****. Even then you'll be barely tipping his tank and he'll probly regen it all back when you reload. I've only been able to kill him with a pre-nerf/boost torp raven and a shieldtanked 350mm+Ogres domi. With like 700-800dps though he from the domi he went down in like 3-4mins though, so not too bad.
Killed him last night in a Drake with heavy launchers (CN Scourge), 3 light TII drones (misplaced the other 2), and 1 bcu.
3 Reloads. Total mission used less than 3000 missiles all together.
I can't understand why you struggle so much? Maybe you don't chase him until he turns around and closes distance? He dies real fast then. |
Billy Sastard
Amarr
Life. Universe. Everything.
Wrath.
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 15:49:00 -
[73]
I have not read all the replys to this, as I got to one line in the OP and had to respond:
Quote:
Are we at that point, that we can virtually trust no one in EVE?
This is stated like it is something new... Trust has always been the most valuable and scarce commodity in EVE, this is nothing new. |
Traidor Disloyal
Minmatar
NightCrew
|
Posted - 2008.04.18 17:27:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Stakhanov
It is very rare to see a corpmate kill another for no reason
I killed a corp mate once (his ship and pod). I got real tired of his "Your Mom" jokes. I felt real good after that.
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Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot |
Asuka Smith
Gallente
StarHunt
Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.04.18 17:35:00 -
[75]
Trust no one. Even corp members I have to get to know first.
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SiJira
|
Posted - 2008.04.19 16:15:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Smakz
Edited by: Smakz on 17/04/2008 15:03:48
edit: typos
Hi there,
yesterday I experienced something curious:
To get my standings up (to 8.0 for creating JCs) I was missioning Lvl4's in the Kaka-Laka ..ermà Kakakela area yesterday. One mission ("Vengeance") brought me two jumps away to Umokka, where the mission had to be completed.
I went through the first two stages easily with my Drake, and altho the BSs had a strongheaded tank, I managed to kill them using loads of Navy Scourges to bring 'em down. (Ya, I know àwill use my Raven and torps next time )
Anyways, in the last stage in which to kill "Rachen Mysina" (or however that dude is called), he just had a shield regen rate, that easily compensated my damage. I was totally stuck in this mission *looksathisraven*.
I didn't want to cancel the mission, so I naively asked in Local, as there were many pilots chitchating and smacking each other in a humorous way, if there's anyone who could help me out. Told them, that I wasn't doing enough damage, regen rate was too high, and that I needed help.
So, what happened next, really made me perplex à and actually a little sad:
Soon many of them where all over me in Local, telling me, that it was a trick, and that I was trying to scam people to get easy kills and stuff like that. I am aware of the fact, that if you are in a fleet, you can kill fleet members without Concord saving your a.s.s., but all I wanted was a helping hand.
After a couple of minutes of discussion, there was a fellow countryman, who helped me with his Rokh and later another pilot joined to help us in webbing Rachen, so I successfully finished the mission thanks to their help.
Are we at that point, that we can virtually trust no one in EVE?
Flame me à I know that it's a cold harsh world out there in space divided into "friends or foes", especially in 0.0, but this incident just made me think of my time, when I started playing EVE a little more than two years ago, and I felt lucky that I have had many supportive pilots helping me around the first time.
Just wanted to share a few of my thoughts with you.
Thanks for reading!!
All the best,
Smak
the broken mechanics of fleeting will not be fixed because ccp claims they show the harsh nature of eve
its really just a condoned exploit because we all know about the trick where you dont get a warning if someone joins the fleet after you did
Trashed sig, Shark was here |
Smakalicious
Caldari
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
|
Posted - 2008.04.23 12:51:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Asuka Smith
Trust no one. Even corp members I have to get to know first.
Ok folks, we've spoken about trust in general long enough and many have made their points clear.
Now, what is the worst betrayal of trust you have experienced in EVE?
(I must admit, that I've never been scammed before and all corps I've been with treated me well.)
All the best,
Smak
---------------------------------------
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Father Dibbles
Self Aggrandisement Society
|
Posted - 2008.04.23 13:49:00 -
[78]
Never trust anyone but yourself, or people you actually know and trust in real life. Even then that is no given, but at least you have the opportunity to break their legs, bury them, then dig the body back up and make love to shame.
(dig up your body-yagain, and make love to shammmmmmmmeee)
1 mill isk to the person that can name the song!
May god save me, if it is right that he should do so...
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Garia666
Amarr
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E
White Core
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Posted - 2008.04.23 13:56:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Garia666 on 23/04/2008 13:57:00
hehe over the years you make a special friend once in a while.. i have several people i would trust my titan with.. ( if i had one )
so yes its rare.. but you will find allot of people still out there :)
Thing is eve can be a very harsh game once in a while ;)
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Jowen Datloran
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2008.04.23 13:58:00 -
[80]
I would have helped you. I would have joined fleet, entered warp and left the fleet again before coming out of warp. No sweat.
----------------
Mr. Science & Trade Institute |
Smakalicious
Caldari
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
|
Posted - 2008.04.23 14:29:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Jowen Datloran
I would have helped you. I would have joined fleet, entered warp and left the fleet again before coming out of warp. No sweat.
Yeah, nice idea! As someone said, if you know how the game works (game mechanics) it can make life a little easier.
All the best,
Smak
---------------------------------------
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Radcjk
Caldari
Dark Star LTD
Atrocitas
|
Posted - 2008.04.23 15:31:00 -
[82]
I don't even trust my corpmate and number 1 wingman in eve, and he's my real life brother.
Every one else is just screwed. |
Heknai
Gallente
COLD-Wing
The Fourth District
|
Posted - 2008.04.23 17:02:00 -
[83]
Hell I trust people and even give noobs isk - i've been burned before and probably will in the future, but if you take a chance you might just make a really good friend or ally. Even though I hunt pirates, I've helped a few out here and there with intel and have since become good friends (as well as you can across the intarweb) or at the least, they don't shoot me. Imho and depending on your potential loss, it can be worth it.
-hek
--In times of strife and desperation, heroes are made of ordinary men... |
Wasted Mind
Gallente
Syntech Research and Development
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Posted - 2008.04.23 17:16:00 -
[84]
Edited by: Wasted Mind on 23/04/2008 17:17:32
Sadly, Yes we are at that point. Even if your in a player corp you aren't going to find any outside help on missions from most people. The freedom EvE brings to an MMO also comes at a cost, you will learn to never random group again. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow ect but at some point you will join a random lvl 4 group and get killed upon doing so. This is the way EvE works and why most new comers are not able to find a group at all (also why eve doesnt have alot of new players stay imo). All i can say is get used to it and join a player corp. A player corp often runs lvl 4 and 5 missions together so any help you need on one of your own is just a hollar away. Trusting people you do not know in this game will lead to your ship going pop at some point so most simply do not do it.
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5pinDizzy
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Posted - 2008.04.25 12:37:00 -
[85]
If by trust you mean someone I could trust to give say, 5 billion isk (assuming I had it) then expect them to give it me back without a doubt, that makes possibly one person.
Apart from that, their are a lot people you trust to a degree, but it takes a long time and lots of interaction to totally trust someone ingame you dont know IRL, and even then you should have your doubts.
For one thing, your CEO should be someone you should be able to just about Totally Trust.
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