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Is This Harassment?

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Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:05:00 - [31] Originally by: Jing Kai Edited by: Jing Kai on 24/04/2008 19:46:18 Because he was the one who was crying about it the others, as in other group other people in belts, not just him and they didn't cry about it, so i didn't continue to mess with them, i stole from everyone in that belt... he cried about me taking 25 ore out of his can that had like 10,000 ore in it so i bumped him twice and cried more so i attempted to kamikaze him... Here we have it. You made yourself an annoyance to several people, 'messing around with them'. While they might have not 'cried' on local about it, some most likely petitioned you. The GM was probably watching your activity when you got petitioned again and you got a prompt response to your activities. -------- Ideas for: Mining Clouds
Gentle Miner	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:06:00 - [32] ha+rass (h-rs, hrs) tr.v. ha+rassed, ha+rass+ing, ha+rass+es 1. To irritate or torment persistently. 2. To wear out; exhaust. 3. To impede and exhaust (an enemy) by repeated attacks or raids. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [French harasser, possibly from Old French harer, to set a dog on, from hare, interj. used to set a dog on, of Germanic origin.]
Gridwalker Amarr	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:28:00 - [33] The last time I was bumped was to get my hauler off a can so he could grab my ore. Perfectly timed and beautifully executed. It's all about intent, which is pretty difficult to judge. This guy didn't intend to harass me. He wanted my ore, and he took it in elegant fashion. If he swooped in and continued to bump me over and over, however, what option would I have? I can't attack him. And if I move belts and he follows me and continues? When does it become harassment vs. just playing the game? And that is probably the crux of the matter. Some GM handbook somewhere probably says "If the accused follows the accuser into another belt and continues with the behavior, it shall be considered harassment and a butt kicking is in order." Your downfall was likely when you followed him. Just my opinion. -Grid
Shogun Archer Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:32:00 - [34] check
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:33:00 - [35] Originally by: Gridwalker The last time I was bumped was to get my hauler off a can so he could grab my ore. Perfectly timed and beautifully executed. It's all about intent, which is pretty difficult to judge. This guy didn't intend to harass me. He wanted my ore, and he took it in elegant fashion. If he swooped in and continued to bump me over and over, however, what option would I have? I can't attack him. And if I move belts and he follows me and continues? When does it become harassment vs. just playing the game? And that is probably the crux of the matter. Some GM handbook somewhere probably says "If the accused follows the accuser into another belt and continues with the behavior, it shall be considered harassment and a butt kicking is in order." Your downfall was likely when you followed him. Just my opinion. -Grid Bumping you to take your stuff isn't harassment, its theft. Constantly bumping you might be considered harassment, depending on other circumstances. Continually bumping one person when others are around is likely to be considered. Bump several times, suicide, follow to another belt, continue... You will get a warning every time unless the GM can be shown you had cause to do it. The OP's failure is that he either didn't have cause, or he didn't make that clear. Basic rule of thumb: If you are singling out one person and constantly going after them regardless of what they do (move, dock and come back later, etc) then you are likely to get bit. Originally by: Audri Fisher On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear
Asuka Smith Gallente StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2008.04.24 20:51:00 - [36] I recommend playing however you want and if they threaten you elevate it to a senior GM... Also, say stuff like 'I am trying to run these guys out of system so my friend can mine in solitude in this system' or something... That right there is a legitimate reason. Much like real law you just gotta know how to play the game and you can do whatever you want.
Ulstan	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:09:00 - [37] Originally by: Siresa Talesi Repeated bumping is clearly defined as harassment. Specifically targetting one player for greifing-type behavior is also defined as harrassment. Messing with a new player? Harrassment. CCP has clearly stated their position on all these activities several times in the past. So to answer your question: yes. The OP's question has already been answered. Don't see why this thread is still continuing. Apparently OP is trying to redefine the word 'repeatedly'.
Ashlee Darksky	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:19:00 - [38] Originally by: Jing Kai Edited by: Jing Kai on 24/04/2008 18:21:35 Is it harassment to bump a guy in an asteroid belt twice, he complains about it and then try to kill him all in high security system? I ask because a Gm gave me a final warning for this, and i don't see how that is right being as open as eve is and i've never once saw anything that said bumping is harassment. If i bumped the guy 20 times i could understand how this would be harassment but bumping a guy twice, him crying over it in local and then I try and kamikaze him in my Tristan he lives (Epic Fail)so after 15 mins i come back in a vexor and chase him to his new belt (same system) thats the end, harassment? i thought normally when you try to kill someone they run, if chasing after them is harassment then something is seriously wrong. I figured all this was fine since we saw the jihad bombing of countless number of miners from Goonswarm and their reign of terror there, so how is this case truely any different? Because he cried about it, before i tried to kill, even though it was my intention from the moment i bumped him? To me this isn't the eve i thought i was playing, which i thought was opened ended can pretty much do anything you want except of course "You may encounter and converse with people who are rude, offensive, belligerent, and who may use indecent, obscene, and/or threatening or harassing language while playing the Game." (Eve EULA) I don't believe i did any of those things, i used no harsh words wasn't offensive other than trying to kill him, but i don't believe that fall under that, please any comments.. and yes i know im a real jerk.. but other than that is this truely that bad? Yup, sorry about this. I mean if you wanted to attack someone and take on the wrath on concord - fair play to you. Sadly the carebears are taking over EVE bit by bit Why the guy just didn't dock for a while, go to another system? Whilst your bumping twice was an accident, your attacks were not. Ok, so you screwed up in the heat of the moment and you got punished by concord and slapped by a GM. You've paid for your crime. What upsets me is people calling for a GM to do it for them, when a little common sense would previal. epic sigh
Nielas	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:28:00 - [39] Originally by: Ashlee Darksky Whilst your bumping twice was an accident, your attacks were not. The OP stated that the bumping was no accident and he did it on purpose to punish the other player for complaining on local that the OP was stealing his ore.
1717 Minmatar PROGENITOR CORPORATION	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:34:00 - [40] Quote: used no harsh words wasn't offensive other than trying to kill him You know, taken out of context that's kinda funny eve-online.com
Falcon Troy Caldari Awesome People Secret Corp	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:41:00 - [41] Edited by: Falcon Troy on 24/04/2008 21:42:40 If I consistently canflip a certain someone daily and not to steal the ore but just deny them ore, that is harassment? Last I checked it was EVE. This guy wasn't just bumping him all day but also stole ore, tried to suicide gank and cause general mayhem for this miner and the surrounding miners int he system. I fail to see the problem unless you want to make it against the rules to cause emotional trauma in EVE. People seem to miss the point that the OP stole ore from the guy which means he could have shot him down at any time to cease the griefing. He chose not to. _____________ Hai.
Ashlee Darksky	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:50:00 - [42] Originally by: Nielas Originally by: Ashlee Darksky Whilst your bumping twice was an accident, your attacks were not. The OP stated that the bumping was no accident and he did it on purpose to punish the other player for complaining on local that the OP was stealing his ore. One slight oversight... nevermind He got punished and lost two ships to concord. He did the crime, and the time
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:52:00 - [43] Originally by: Falcon Troy If I consistently canflip a certain someone daily and not to steal the ore but just deny them ore, that is harassment? Last I checked it was EVE. Depends on interpretation, but strictly it is petitionable since you are singling out one person, deriving no profit from it and interfering with their game play. At our discretion, players who are found to be consistently maliciously interfering with the game experience for others may receive a warning, temporary suspension or permanent banning of his account. Quote: This guy wasn't just bumping him all day but also stole ore, tried to suicide gank and cause general mayhem for this miner and the surrounding miners int he system. I fail to see the problem unless you want to make it against the rules to cause emotional trauma in EVE. Re-read, he concentrated on THIS ONE miner. Had he been doing it to all then no griefing As soon as he ignored other players and followed the person to another belt, the potential for harassment came into play as the other person did perform a reasonable attempt to avoid. Quote: People seem to miss the point that the OP stole ore from the guy which means he could have shot him down at any time to cease the griefing. He chose not to. lol, a miner who defends his ore? That is a dead miner... Originally by: Audri Fisher On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear
Falcon Troy Caldari Awesome People Secret Corp	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:55:00 - [44] I don't think we play the same game because if we did there would be a lot of mass bans. _____________ Hai.
Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:58:00 - [45] Well, here's a basic question: How else do you compete with NPC corp members without "harrassing" them somehow? It's the one thing about Eve that I really don't like. The NPC corp shelter from real competition. Only thing I dislike more than that is people trying to compete from the shelter of NPC corps. Can flippers, suicide gankers, what have you, doing it while safe from a war dec. Given that, I don't really give a crap what the OP thinks. Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Joe Starbreaker Starbreaker Spaceways	Posted - 2008.04.24 22:01:00 - [46] I'd say if you're picking on one guy deliberately for the sole purpose of annoying him, that's harassment. If you made an honest attempt to suicide him for the KM or the modules, that would be reasonable, or if you were attacking somebody who proved amenable to fighting and you stood a chance of getting a duel out of it, ok. But you were just trying to annoy one specific person who you knew wasn't going to take the bait... that's just being a brat.
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2008.04.24 22:02:00 - [47] Originally by: Falcon Troy I don't think we play the same game because if we did there would be a lot of mass bans. If more people petitioned, we would have clearer rules I would think. As it is no one (or at least very few) do. I've seen petitions for this behavior work, I've seen them fail. I've seen suicide losses reversed because the attacker followed the other player over 30 jumps away after they left a corp at war. And the attacker got warned. The rules are very vague, but the theory is simple: don't carry it too far against one individual. Originally by: Audri Fisher On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear

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