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When does piracy become griefing?

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Nathan Harrow Caldari Murky Inc. Power Of 3	Posted - 2008.04.29 16:57:00 - [1] When does pirating, both low sec and high sec become griefing and land you with a ccp ban? Is there a "can and cant" list somewhere?
Minerva Vulcan Caldari The Nexus Foundation	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:03:00 - [2] Never.
prdelac Caldari 47R THE R0NIN	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:07:00 - [3] NEVER when you click undock you consent to pvp CCP will never ban a player for killing a player
Acies Invictus Neoteric War Syndicate Notoriety Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:28:00 - [4] Piracy - robbery committed without the consent of a sovereign nation. So essentially any PvP that leads to financial gains, outside of large alliances, is piracy. So piracy is EVE is not bannable. Unfortunately what you run into in EVE is cuties who like to can flip nubs in starting areas. This begins to creep into the realm of "griefing". EVE is not different than any other MMO, it has a significant quantity of e-thugs who use the internet to increase their sense of self-worth. _______________________________________________ Human beings didn't evolve brains in order to lie around on lakes. Killing's the first thing we learned. And a good thing we did, or we'd be dead.
Joe Starbreaker Starbreaker Spaceways	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:42:00 - [5] When you suck at it. ---------------- I'm looking for a good corp to join.
Joe Starbreaker Starbreaker Spaceways	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:42:00 - [6] Originally by: Joe Starbreaker When you suck at it. No, wait, I suck at piracy but I'm not a griefer... I don't think! ---------------- I'm looking for a good corp to join.
DubanFP Caldari Four Rings Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:47:00 - [7] Anything you can do in EVE, exploits aside, isn't considered griefing. Griefing is mostly reserved for what you do in chat. Like making death threats would be considered griefing and get you banned. But as of killing someone repeatedly they won't take action. Even if you do it to the point they leave the game "we've done that a few times before, see Crime & Punishment". _______________ ReiAyanami> We bring you tidings of AARRRRRRRRR
Kahrek Laume Gallente Atropos Asylum	Posted - 2008.04.29 17:57:00 - [8] When someone demonstrates stupendous stupidity coupled with a lack of common sense and resentment at being made to pay for such lack of common sense (I.E. OMG you popped my unfitted drake in lowsec omg omgomg!!!1!) Those people cause me grief, i weep and yearn to add some bleach to the genepool, other than most anything PVP related is fair game. Regards, Kahrek Laume.
VicturusTeSaluto Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.04.29 18:58:00 - [9] There is no such thing as "griefing," it is just a nonsensical, made up word; it is the invention of little fruits. The sole point of (multiplayer) gaming has always been to kill, kill, kill. If you do not like multiplayer gaming, there are lots of single player games. There is nothing more to it than that.
Zephyr Rengate Prophets Of a Damned Universe	Posted - 2008.04.29 19:07:00 - [10] griefing in eve? Originally by: Jenny Spitfire I habe no life.
Kehmor Caldari PAK	Posted - 2008.04.29 19:14:00 - [11] AFAIK constant ganking of noob ships in the starter systems will land you with a warning eventually? Also recycling alts for the purpose of suicide ganking is a bannable offence too as far as I'm aware. Apart from that all is fair game unless it is in violation of game mechanics. Violence isn't the answer, it is the question. The answer is yes.
Tai Paktu Mortis Incarnatus	Posted - 2008.04.29 19:38:00 - [12] There's really only a few ways to land a warning or ban by pirating. Like has been mentioned already, can baiting in starter systems will get you a warning, recycling suicide alts also gets a warning. Other than that, you can shoot to your hearts content. The majority of the "grief" comes from smack and cussing in local or whatever, that kind of thing is probably the easiest way to get warned. ______ http://eve-files.com/sig/TaiPaktu/sig3.PNG
Faife Noctiscion Twilight Trade Cartel	Posted - 2008.04.29 20:27:00 - [13] Edited by: Faife on 29/04/2008 20:27:23 extended high sec bumping is i think griefing too. EDIT: meaning not in my opinion but in past GM judgement calls
Aadi Grox Minmatar Mafia	Posted - 2008.04.29 20:32:00 - [14] Originally by: Faife Edited by: Faife on 29/04/2008 20:27:23 extended high sec bumping is i think griefing too. EDIT: meaning not in my opinion but in past GM judgement calls again, probably only the noob systems, bumping miners out of the belts is totally legitimate in high sec
Alowishus mUfFiN fAcToRy Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.04.29 20:36:00 - [15] Officially there is no such thing as griefing, as long as you're not exploiting. In reality griefing is in the eye of the beholder. For instance if you jump your unfitted BS into lowsec without a scout and get ganked you may feel grief. But then you have to ask yourself, did you get griefed or did you grief yourself? There are many ways to prevent grief in Eve, for instance not AFK hauling Titan BPOs in your Kestrel or jumping into lowsec in your Heavy Missile CNR. Unfortunately people just can't be bothered with their own safety, it's up to the "sociopathic 13-year-old basement dwelling virgins" to know better than to PvP in the PvP game. They should know better than to ruin the experience of those who don't want to PvP in the PvP game, after all CCP does force those people to play. Join The Muffin Factory
Seragon Caldari VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.04.29 20:54:00 - [16] Originally by: Aadi Grox Originally by: Faife Edited by: Faife on 29/04/2008 20:27:23 extended high sec bumping is i think griefing too. EDIT: meaning not in my opinion but in past GM judgement calls again, probably only the noob systems, bumping miners out of the belts is totally legitimate in high sec I had a corp mate warned for this. Something about harassing players with no intent to kill. I think that's a fair judgment call to make. So constantly bumping a freighter trying to align or locking a pod with a scram, setting approach, and then going afk for a day would seem to count.
Kruel Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.04.29 21:04:00 - [17] I always thought "griefing" was killing your teammates in a team game. Like if you have friends on Blue and wanted to be an ass, you'd switch to Red but continue blasting reds. There is no griefing in Eve. ----------------------------------- You're not a pirate unless your -10
Nicholas Barker MASS Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.04.29 21:09:00 - [18] when you invite'em on TS and make them do stupid stuff to live, or just to listen to them rage ---
Tai Paktu Mortis Incarnatus	Posted - 2008.04.29 21:23:00 - [19] I like bumping AFK mining haulers 100+ km off their belts in my Ishtar if I find them... /me reports self? ______ http://eve-files.com/sig/TaiPaktu/sig3.PNG
Avaricia The Accursed	Posted - 2008.04.29 22:22:00 - [20] i like to scramble people's pods, and then not pod them. just sit there; they don't leave until they self destruct or something more worthwhile presents itself. probably griefing, definitely amusing. reign of terror griefmatic
Wind Ictiva Delta Kappa Gamma	Posted - 2008.04.29 22:45:00 - [21] Originally by: DubanFP Anything you can do in EVE, exploits aside, isn't considered griefing. Griefing is mostly reserved for what you do in chat. Like making death threats would be considered griefing and get you banned. But as of killing someone repeatedly they won't take action. Even if you do it to the point they leave the game "we've done that a few times before, see Crime & Punishment". Originally by: Kehmor AFAIK constant ganking of noob ships in the starter systems will land you with a warning eventually? Also recycling alts for the purpose of suicide ganking is a bannable offence too as far as I'm aware. Apart from that all is fair game unless it is in violation of game mechanics. this killing someone repeatedly in eve isnt called griefing, its called playing eve Originally by: Admiral Love Hmm creating a thread like this is perhaps a little like sitting naked with bleeding balls in a pool of piranhas. I Won't do it again - most of you guys are pretty nasty.
Dav Varan	Posted - 2008.04.30 13:54:00 - [22] Can baiting / flipping in Starter systems will get you a warning / ban. Everything else is pretty much allowed afaik.
tiller MAFIA	Posted - 2008.04.30 13:56:00 - [23] Originally by: Avaricia i like to scramble people's pods, and then not pod them. just sit there; they don't leave until they self destruct or something more worthwhile presents itself. probably griefing, definitely amusing. yes, having a 'pet pod' at your gatecamp makes the camp 100 * more cool imho
Havohej Minmatar The Defias Brotherhood	Posted - 2008.04.30 14:26:00 - [24] Originally by: Avaricia i like to scramble people's pods, and then not pod them. just sit there; they don't leave until they self destruct or something more worthwhile presents itself. probably griefing, definitely amusing. omg what a ** thing to do. I can't wait to do this myself. Originally by:** techzer0 I'm invincible until proven wrong
Avaricia The Accursed	Posted - 2008.04.30 22:21:00 - [25] Edited by: Avaricia on 30/04/2008 22:24:58 Originally by: Havohej Originally by: Avaricia i like to scramble people's pods, and then not pod them. just sit there; they don't leave until they self destruct or something more worthwhile presents itself. probably griefing, definitely amusing. omg what a **** thing to do. I can't wait to do this myself. longest i've held someone is 1 hour 20 minutes good way to pass time is to put one light drone and one armor rep drone on the pod, see which is stronger. reign of terror griefmatic
Lurana Lay	Posted - 2008.04.30 23:06:00 - [26] Edited by: Lurana Lay on 30/04/2008 23:06:51 It's ALL about intent. You can whack an Indy in Empire by suicide because you crave the iskies and be a pirate. You can whack that same Indy in Empire by suicide in the hopes that you make some n00b cry and quit the game and you are a griefer. You can dec an Empire rookie corp because they smacked you or because you have been contracted to do so, or want o drive them out of a specific system, etc and you are playing normally. You can dec a rookie corp and beat the crap out them with the intent to make someones life miserable and suffer and you are a griefer. In short: Intent to cause misery or suffering for it's own sake is griefing. Simple enough. Don't believe me, go look it up.
Mr Belevedere	Posted - 2008.05.01 00:27:00 - [27] Piracy becomes griefing when you start to drown in those sweet carebear tears
Lithalnas Amarr Headcrabs	Posted - 2008.05.01 00:48:00 - [28] The only killing you cant do is can baiting in starter systems, that can be bannable. ------------- fixed for greater eve content
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.05.01 01:12:00 - [29] Originally by: Avaricia longest i've held someone is 1 hour 20 minutes good way to pass time is to put one light drone and one armor rep drone on the pod, see which is stronger. Hahahah... Yeah, Can't say I've done that one, but I have just scrammed someone and used light drones to kill their ship... Slow and painful ------------ Originally by: CCP Mitnal It's great being a puppetmaster
Pegleg Punk Minmatar	Posted - 2008.05.01 04:39:00 - [30] Originally by: Nathan Harrow When does pirating, both low sec and high sec become griefing and land you with a ccp ban? Is there a "can and cant" list somewhere? Refrain from resorting to real life threats.
Corwain Gallente DIE WITH HONOUR	Posted - 2008.05.01 08:26:00 - [31] Recently a gang I was in scrammed a wolf in a belt. We then proceeded to just sit there and orbit him tanking him anytime he shot us. We got the idea to get a noob ship to kill him so we got the newest player in the corp to go get one. Course he couldn't do it since he couldn't tank the wolf and kept warping his pod away in a panic. We were trying to rep him with a Thanatos but obviously the cycle time was too long and we had no real logistic ship. Not to mention undocking in his new noobship and getting owned by the station guns. After awhile our thanatos started repping the wolf and put some warrior 2s on him, which was funny for abit. Finally the guy self destructed, so we scrammed his pod and waited for him to self destruct that. I think it was griefing but it was so fun. We kept trying to get him to be our friend but he wouldn't, just kept determinedly shifting his fire to each of us. -- Distortion\| Distortion 2 Preview
Dariah Stardweller	Posted - 2008.05.01 11:48:00 - [32] Originally by: Kehmor AFAIK constant ganking of noob ships in the starter systems will land you with a warning eventually? Also recycling alts for the purpose of suicide ganking is a bannable offence too as far as I'm aware. Recycling alts for suicide ganking? Eh?
D'Avore Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.05.01 13:38:00 - [33] Edited by: D''Avore on 01/05/2008 13:39:29 Creating a trial acount, training a few skills and suicide ganking with it. When the trial ends, repeate the process. <- bannable, probably because you'll never have any problems with the sec hit. If you subscribe it is ok.
Dariah Stardweller	Posted - 2008.05.01 13:56:00 - [34] Originally by: D'Avore Edited by: D''Avore on 01/05/2008 13:39:29 Creating a trial acount, training a few skills and suicide ganking with it. When the trial ends, repeate the process. <- bannable, probably because you'll never have any problems with the sec hit. If you subscribe it is ok. Aha, so if I would create chars for that purpose on a paid account it's do however you please?
TimMc Gallente Genos Occidere	Posted - 2008.05.01 14:46:00 - [35] Originally by: Nathan Harrow When does pirating, both low sec and high sec become griefing and land you with a ccp ban? Is there a "can and cant" list somewhere? I once raided someone mining a deadspace complex. Our 2 t1 cruisers vs his drake and a covetor he was swapping between. I killed the drake and stole the covetor. Thats piracy. It turned to greifing when I camped the can of gneiss, killed a hauler or his. Then we came back in our own hauler and stole it all.
sxndy Gallente	Posted - 2008.05.02 08:19:00 - [36] Pirates make a valuable contribution to the EVE economy; without their hard work, cunning and overall Yarring there would be less than a quarter of the current number of ships and modules needing built. This would have an effect on mission runners, (loot price would fall because noon want it), industrialists would have little demand for their products and miners would have noon to sell their stuffs to. You would think people would be grateful, but no, they try to imply that pirates are getting enjoyment from making them unhappy. Griefing is a crap word made up by people who would like to see all people treated equally; well in my book thatÆs socialism and you know where you can stick that! ;)
Navtiqes Noob Mercs	Posted - 2008.05.02 08:31:00 - [37] Originally by: sxndy Pirates make a valuable contribution to the EVE economy; without their hard work, cunning and overall Yarring there would be less than a quarter of the current number of ships and modules needing built. This would have an effect on mission runners, (loot price would fall because noon want it), industrialists would have little demand for their products and miners would have noon to sell their stuffs to. You would think people would be grateful, but no, they try to imply that pirates are getting enjoyment from making them unhappy. Griefing is a crap word made up by people who would like to see all people treated equally; well in my book thatÆs socialism and you know where you can stick that! ;) Well said. There is no grief in Eve. There's plenty of sorrow, but that's something entirely different. Without playerkills the game would die.
Dorisane	Posted - 2008.05.02 08:51:00 - [38] imho piracy is when you jump someone on a belt, and ransom them / blow them up, using your skills to earn a profit in low sec / 0.0, or prehaps solo gate ransoms and kills. and i'd say piracy isn't when you have 12 guys round a gate in low sec blowing up every ship from shuttles to hac's that jump in with no attempt to ransom, splitting the loot so thin that noone makes any profit, but you're safe in the knowledge that you're in no real danger. This group now employs a heavy dictor and webs like they were going out of fashion. the latter group give the now very rare former group a bad name. When i occassionally get blown up by the second type of so called "pirates" i just shrug it off, because the only person their kidding is themselves.
Kano Sekor Amarr The Marathon Unit	Posted - 2008.05.02 10:58:00 - [39] Originally by: sxndy Pirates make a valuable contribution to the EVE economy; without their hard work, cunning and overall Yarring there would be less than a quarter of the current number of ships and modules needing built. This would have an effect on mission runners, (loot price would fall because noon want it), industrialists would have little demand for their products and miners would have noon to sell their stuffs to. You would think people would be grateful, but no, they try to imply that pirates are getting enjoyment from making them unhappy. Griefing is a crap word made up by people who would like to see all people treated equally; well in my book thatÆs socialism and you know where you can stick that! ;) So all those corp/alliance wars that needs a constant supply of war material doesnt produce demand? We do however make a valuable contribution to the EvE economy , however it whould be more logic if the low sec asteroid belts were more lucrative to balance the risk/reward when we are providing a helluva risk and not giving any rewards.
Kano Sekor Amarr The Marathon Unit	Posted - 2008.05.02 11:00:00 - [40] Edited by: Kano Sekor on 02/05/2008 11:02:31 [Double post] Damn planck bubble
cyt0matrix Carebear Killers Inc. Anarchy.	Posted - 2008.05.02 11:27:00 - [41] Piracy turns into griefing when you start tackling/engaging targets and force them to listen to your britney spears karoke. Either ransom or kill em. Dont torture them with your songs.
Lavraen Minmatar Black Podding	Posted - 2008.05.02 11:35:00 - [42] Originally by: cyt0matrix Piracy turns into griefing when you start tackling/engaging targets and force them to listen to your britney spears karoke. Either ransom or kill em. Dont torture them with your songs. /agree Or you could warp scram them in front of a billboard that shows constant repeats of "animals do the funniest things" Granted it borders on torture and personally I'd rather lick my own bottom than be forced into watching it, but it fun watching their eyes bleed.
Lavraen Minmatar Black Podding	Posted - 2008.05.02 11:35:00 - [43] Originally by: cyt0matrix Piracy turns into griefing when you start tackling/engaging targets and force them to listen to your britney spears karoke. Either ransom or kill em. Dont torture them with your songs.

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