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Reol Renor Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.05.08 09:42:00 - [1] I'm mainly caldari specced but have lately trained some Gallente to get my hands on a Oneiros. Next on my list that will lead me to world domination is to train for a marauder. The thing is I'm not sure wich one i should train for. I have done a lot of missioning and ratting in a raven and i guess it's far superior to the mega if we just talk plain T1 versions. What worries me is the impact of defender missiles if you only have four missiles in the air as when you fly the Golem. The Kronos doesnt have to bother with that I guess but have to care about tracking and range. And that is a nightmare for any carebearing mission runner. Does anyone have experience in flying both ships or just one of them and can give me some advice? Or does someone know if CCP thought about the defender problem and perhaps doubled the HP of the Golems missiles to?
Wardeneo 2 Gallente	Posted - 2008.05.08 09:47:00 - [2] Edited by: Wardeneo 2 on 08/05/2008 09:47:52 Originally by: Reol Renor I'm mainly caldari specced but have lately trained some Gallente to get my hands on a Oneiros. Next on my list that will lead me to world domination is to train for a marauder. The thing is I'm not sure wich one i should train for. I have done a lot of missioning and ratting in a raven and i guess it's far superior to the mega if we just talk plain T1 versions. What worries me is the impact of defender missiles if you only have four missiles in the air as when you fly the Golem. The Kronos doesnt have to bother with that I guess but have to care about tracking and range. And that is a nightmare for any carebearing mission runner. Does anyone have experience in flying both ships or just one of them and can give me some advice? Or does someone know if CCP thought about the defender problem and perhaps doubled the HP of the Golems missiles to? /me sighs, so many threads like this so ill put it simple, golem golem golem adn golem, just beacause like most missle ships u can swap dmge type no need for tracking and no range 2 worry about (providing cruise are used) and golem can tank lvl 4's and can use its lows for nice dmge whilst having meds for nice tnak adn has a few utility slots in highs done :) wardeneo EDIT: this was ment 2 be posted by my main Wardeneo, stupid auto default char on forum settings is my alt /me bangs head Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr! (Or make Amarr the only race able to deal EM damage from turrets).
Ishina Fel Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2008.05.08 10:21:00 - [3] Worrying about defender missiles vs. less launchers is a mathematical fallacy. A Golem and a Raven both lose the exact same percentage of their dps to defender missiles. This is because NPC defender fire chance is a flat percentage chance for every missile fired at them, and not a 'x defeders per minute' fixed value.
DARTHxFREE Double Indemnity	Posted - 2008.05.08 10:45:00 - [4] Depends on agent really, I wouldn't use Kronos for mini/amar missions due to kin/therm dmg only. For Gurista agents thier pretty even, you run into tracking problems much less often as Torp Golem runs into torping frig/cruiser/range problems....can't compare a Cruise Golem to a Kronos. Golem usualy wins in the eyes of the people due to it's built in beginers difficulty setting. /join Cheeze & Whine Club
Qui Shon	Posted - 2008.05.08 12:07:00 - [5] Originally by: DARTHxFREE Golem usualy wins in the eyes of the people due to it's built in beginers difficulty setting. Beginners difficulty, heh. That sounds like another way to say that it just plain spanks the Kronos in majority of missions, and shouldn't be used in the few missions where the range isn't enough. Just like the Kronos shouldn't be used in missions where Kin/Therm is no good. Torps have range problems sure, but when in range, a torp Golem has quite an advantage in dps over the Kronos.
HedleyLamarr	Posted - 2008.05.08 12:53:00 - [6] Edited by: HedleyLamarr on 08/05/2008 12:54:18 For fun my little corp runs L4's together to see how fast we can do them. Most of the time Its me with a Kronos, the wife in her Golem and a friend in a CNR. We all have 28 mil + SP with T2 weapons. The Kronos kills alot fast as you dont have to wait on the missles to get to the target. Alot of the time I can kil 2 BS in the same time they take to kill 1 of the same type. No the Golem is easier to tank but I dont have a problem with any missions I solo in the Kronos with a cheap faction setup ( until 100 mil isk on the tank). Also I have an alt with a golem so yes I do fly them both. -Hedley
Zo5o Gallente Longcat is Long	Posted - 2008.05.08 13:13:00 - [7] Pros for Rail Kronos: With 2 tracking comps and a optimal range rig, Kronos out dps's Golem beyond Golem's maximum range with T1/Faction torps (40km with t1 range extending rigs). It's also more effective against cruisers and frigs than torp Golem due to the tracking and web bonuses. ANYTHING, spider drones included, gets MELTED once it gets in web range. It has a slight DPS hole re: cruisers just outside of web range for me at the moment, but I've been able to 100% avoid this situation with proper tactics so far, and I think that hole might close up once I get Marauders 5 and Motion Prediction 5. Also, it can effectively kill out to its maximum targeting range of over 100km out, compared to approx 60km max range for torp Golem. Tank is more cap-stable. Pros for Torp Golem: Outdps's Kronos significantly vs. large ships when in range of t1/faction torps. Can kill all npc factions equally well due to ability to deal large amounts of any damage type. Outtanks Kronos, but this really isn't very important since Kronos has more than enough tank and DPS to get through any mission as is. So, I'd say the Kronos is probably better on missions that are A: Kin/Therm-friendly, and B: contain a lot of long-distance and/or small ships. On missions it's well-suited for, this ship is an absolute BEAST. Golem's better against everything else, and is by far the more versatile choice by virtue of its ability to switch damage types. So if you want one single ship to run all missions in, Golem's definitely the better choice. However, I think the Kronos is better on some select missions due to the reasons I gave above, not to mention the fact that the blaster Kronos is unparalleled on Damsel in Distress.
Jill Antaris Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.05.08 15:13:00 - [8] Edited by: Jill Antaris on 08/05/2008 15:17:54 Preaty mutch have to agree with my previous Poster. Kronos is a very nice Mission Ship. Hits everything in his Lock Range, deals good Damage and can use 3 Sentrys(for real one of his strogest Points, 100m¦ Dronebandwide would be a dream but well you can¦t have it all). With Antimatter and good Skills Kronos can do about 800-1000 DPS(depending on how agressive your Fitting/Factionamno use/easy the Mission is) up to 60km, a bit less up to it¦s maximum locking Range. Golem and Kronos have both pro¦s and con¦s and mostly the Mission/NPC Type will make the diffrence. Golem has the better tank, but this is not a big issue if you know how to run Missions. Both are good, so in the end it is mostly up if you prefere Missles for Missions or funny NPC slugfests. Ps.: I use a Kronos for Minmatar Missions(mostly Angels) and it does very well, yust stick with 2 Trackingscripts all the time and everything gets melted preaty good. ---------------------- Nerf Lasers! Thay need far to less CPU and Grid to Fit. Still using not enught Cap and do far to mutch Damage. O wait... they allready did... =(
Qui Shon	Posted - 2008.05.08 18:07:00 - [9] Originally by: Zo5o not to mention the fact that the blaster Kronos is unparalleled on Damsel in Distress. I do believe I have to give that a try someday.....yes I do.
Zo5o Gallente Longcat is Long	Posted - 2008.05.08 19:38:00 - [10] Edited by: Zo5o on 08/05/2008 19:45:45 Quote: I do believe I have to give that a try someday.....yes I do. I've never had more fun in a mission in my life man. You'll love it. Check your log after you run it too. Don't be surprised to see wrecking shots of over 3000. You'll need two ammos... antimatter for the bs's, and your long range ammo of choice to kill the cruisers orbiting at 15-17 km. Afterburner helps get in range of the BS's upon initial warpin. Pleasure Gardens usually trigger first reinforcements after only 3 salvos of antimatter. Sure cuts the time out of taking this structure (read: timesink) down. I also like to use a drone swarm (organized as such in drones window) of 2 ogres, 2 hammerheads, and a hobgoblin on this mission to get the absolute most dps out of that 75 bandwidth. When I first warp in and the npc's appear, I begin my approach towards the BS's while siccing the drones on a cruiser. Even without the drone support the BS's melt in SECONDS while my drones take out a couple cruisers.
Thorradin State War Academy	Posted - 2008.05.08 21:59:00 - [11] Originally by: Reol Renor What worries me is the impact of defender missiles if you only have four missiles in the air as when you fly the Golem. We need a MOTD that explains game mechanics of defender missiles, or one of those login tips.
Zaran Darkstar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.05.09 00:42:00 - [12] Edited by: Zaran Darkstar on 09/05/2008 00:42:16 Kronos is better hands down if you know how to fit it and how to play it. Golem is better for all the rest that don't know the deeper secrets of Gunnery. But these kind of ships (marauders) are for fun mostly. I never had a problem to do a lvl4 mission using an Apocalypse with skills at lvl4 and named guns. I will go for paladin eventually (in my case) but not because i can't run missions anyway but because i like to try it. Now my alt can fly both Gallente and Caldari BSes with skilsl at lvl 4. Although i can do all lvl4 missions in a Drake with ease i find more fun to try them with Megathron or Dominix with that character. That other character of mine will go for Kronos cause it's simply the best Marauder out there very fun to fly (with better tanking ability than the Golem and more DPS-if you know the secrets of gunnery again) So bottom line is that the Golem is a better Marauder for people that don;t wantto bother with tracking issues while the Kronos is clearly better if you know how to use it properly. _______________________________ Join the biggest Minmatar Corp! www.BrutorTribe.com
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.05.09 01:41:00 - [13] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar Edited by: Zaran Darkstar on 09/05/2008 00:42:16 Kronos is better hands down if you know how to fit it and how to play it. Golem is better for all the rest that don't know the deeper secrets of Gunnery. But these kind of ships (marauders) are for fun mostly. I never had a problem to do a lvl4 mission using an Apocalypse with skills at lvl4 and named guns. I will go for paladin eventually (in my case) but not because i can't run missions anyway but because i like to try it. Now my alt can fly both Gallente and Caldari BSes with skilsl at lvl 4. Although i can do all lvl4 missions in a Drake with ease i find more fun to try them with Megathron or Dominix with that character. That other character of mine will go for Kronos cause it's simply the best Marauder out there very fun to fly (with better tanking ability than the Golem and more DPS-if you know the secrets of gunnery again) So bottom line is that the Golem is a better Marauder for people that don;t wantto bother with tracking issues while the Kronos is clearly better if you know how to use it properly.
Zaran Darkstar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.05.09 02:02:00 - [14] What? _______________________________ Join the biggest Minmatar Corp! www.BrutorTribe.com
Chomapuraku Caldari Templar Republic R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.05.09 03:57:00 - [15] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar c) is an ignorant d) is an idiot More clear now? yes, i'd hate to be an ignorant AND an idiot for not training up BS 5 in another race and a whole new suite of weapon skills i don't really have anything constructive to contribute to this thread, but i'd like to take this as an opportunity to ask CCP to clarify the mechanics of defender missiles by putting it on screen for ten minutes when you log on, making the reader read through, then type out a response indicating they understand. either that, or put an explanation of defender missile mechanics in the golem's description Originally by: Crimson11 Crimson11: What the hell happened? WarGod: Some breaking occurred, the Alt Key was involved, that's about all we know.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2008.05.09 06:39:00 - [16] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar Edited by: Zaran Darkstar on 09/05/2008 00:42:16 Kronos is better hands down if you know how to fit it and how to play it. Golem is better for all the rest that don't know the deeper secrets of Gunnery. But these kind of ships (marauders) are for fun mostly. I never had a problem to do a lvl4 mission using an Apocalypse with skills at lvl4 and named guns. I will go for paladin eventually (in my case) but not because i can't run missions anyway but because i like to try it. Now my alt can fly both Gallente and Caldari BSes with skilsl at lvl 4. Although i can do all lvl4 missions in a Drake with ease i find more fun to try them with Megathron or Dominix with that character. That other character of mine will go for Kronos cause it's simply the best Marauder out there very fun to fly (with better tanking ability than the Golem and more DPS-if you know the secrets of gunnery again) So bottom line is that the Golem is a better Marauder for people that don;t wantto bother with tracking issues while the Kronos is clearly better if you know how to use it properly. You shouldn't call people idiots if you think the marauders are for fun, mostly. Anyone who ever says you don't "need" something better, or they "have no problem" using something crappier, is really saying they don't get it, they can't fly it or they're...well, let's not spell out all the insults. I mean, Apoc, seriously, c'mon. The other guy doing them in an Arby, at least that's kind of cool. Apoc is just slow, though not as bad as the Drake of course. Missioning is a game of efficiency, and for overall missioning performance, nothing can beat the Golem/CNR. Kronos, Nightmare, they are awesome when applied to stuff they are good at, but mediocre outside their respective areas of expertise. Using the 'mare against rats with high EM resistance is just silly, as is using the Kronos against rats with heavy Kin/Therm resistance. Likewise using a torp golem against rats that spawn at 100km is daft, ahem, I mean inefficient. There are no "secrets of gunnery" that can make your blasters have adequate range outside of a select few missions, nor are there any "secrets of gunnery" that will bring your rail damage to the level of the torp ships when they are in range. I don't mind people claiming their ship is the best, but when you go around calling people ignorant or idiots, that's not so cool anymore. Especially as your opinions are not founded in (virtual) reality.
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.05.09 08:35:00 - [17] Shh. He's leet with da guns Qui. Don't burst his bubble.
Pteranodon	Posted - 2008.05.09 15:57:00 - [18] Edited by: Pteranodon on 09/05/2008 15:57:17 My Kronos gets used as an uber salvaging ship. I use 3 tractors & salvagers & the speed of salvaging makes it a joy to use as a dedicated vacuum cleaner. Some people say why not use a catalyst to salvage-I have one too- but the difference really is that great that I would not want to change back to any other salvage ship.
Zaran Darkstar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.05.09 18:50:00 - [19] The only real reason people would prefer Golem to Kronos is that Golem needs no tracking. But for someone like me that knows the secrets of gunnery and has no tracking issues the Kronos is simply better. 450 damage vs 600 is kind of big difference. That's all. For history i do now about 520 damage with my apocalypse and when i ll go to tech 2 guns i ll be able to do around 750. How slow that seems? And about resistences well i melt Sanshas and Blood doing great against Mercenaries and Angels and doing ok (ok for me means equal to a Raven against Guristas) I mean i fly the raven myself with my alt and i have tried the Gallente BS as well. I fly Caldari /Gallente with the one character and Minmatar/Amarr with the other. I have seen in practice what each BS does and although all of them are valid choice the Apocalypse seems the most fun with the best ISK/Hour Ratio. Now Marauders are a different category , still i would prefer the Apocalypse to Golem and of course Vargur that is just plain useless. _______________________________ Join the biggest Minmatar Corp! www.BrutorTribe.com
AKULA UrQuan Caldari Druuge Crimson Corporation	Posted - 2008.05.09 19:28:00 - [20] Originally by: Zo5o not to mention the fact that the blaster Kronos is unparalleled on Damsel in Distress. Hummm...I just droped the 350mm rails on my mission running rokh and replaced with T2 ions in ETF. Looked at the numbers and thought about "Damsel in Distress". I'm going to try that. Thanks. Between Golem and Kronos. Kronos because of near 8M in gunnery skills for me.
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.05.09 19:44:00 - [21] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar The only real reason people would prefer Golem to Kronos is that Golem needs no tracking. But for someone like me that knows the secrets of gunnery and has no tracking issues the Kronos is simply better. 450 damage vs 600 is kind of big difference. That's all. For history i do now about 520 damage with my apocalypse and when i ll go to tech 2 guns i ll be able to do around 750. How slow that seems? And about resistences well i melt Sanshas and Blood doing great against Mercenaries and Angels and doing ok (ok for me means equal to a Raven against Guristas) I mean i fly the raven myself with my alt and i have tried the Gallente BS as well. I fly Caldari /Gallente with the one character and Minmatar/Amarr with the other. I have seen in practice what each BS does and although all of them are valid choice the Apocalypse seems the most fun with the best ISK/Hour Ratio. Now Marauders are a different category , still i would prefer the Apocalypse to Golem and of course Vargur that is just plain useless. Cruise raven on your alt != torp golem. Apoc > Golem?
Yakkha	Posted - 2008.05.09 20:04:00 - [22] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar Edited by: Zaran Darkstar on 09/05/2008 02:20:17 What? Hm you probably think my post is contradictional. But it is not. I ll say it blund now. Kronos is the best ship easy to fit good damage great defence. Golem is only better in case the player a) has just bought the character from e-bay b) is maintaining a character with good skills but rarely plays c) is an ignorant d) is an idiot More clear now? We think you are c) + d)
Zaran Darkstar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.05.09 20:57:00 - [23] Originally by: Boz Well Originally by: Zaran Darkstar The only real reason people would prefer Golem to Kronos is that Golem needs no tracking. But for someone like me that knows the secrets of gunnery and has no tracking issues the Kronos is simply better. 450 damage vs 600 is kind of big difference. That's all. For history i do now about 520 damage with my apocalypse and when i ll go to tech 2 guns i ll be able to do around 750. How slow that seems? And about resistences well i melt Sanshas and Blood doing great against Mercenaries and Angels and doing ok (ok for me means equal to a Raven against Guristas) I mean i fly the raven myself with my alt and i have tried the Gallente BS as well. I fly Caldari /Gallente with the one character and Minmatar/Amarr with the other. I have seen in practice what each BS does and although all of them are valid choice the Apocalypse seems the most fun with the best ISK/Hour Ratio. Now Marauders are a different category , still i would prefer the Apocalypse to Golem and of course Vargur that is just plain useless. Cruise raven on your alt != torp golem. Apoc > Golem? Yeah i bet that you that are an expert will do real fast these missions with the torp Golem having to get close to less than 40km (considering you will be using rigs that increase the range of torps from 30 to 40km) traveling at the hyper speed of 156 to kill the BSes and waiting then some hours for your torps to kill the smaller sinature ships. _______________________________ Join the biggest Minmatar Corp! www.BrutorTribe.com
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.09 21:37:00 - [24] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 09/05/2008 21:43:35 Originally by: Zaran Darkstar Originally by: Boz Well Originally by: Zaran Darkstar The only real reason people would prefer Golem to Kronos is that Golem needs no tracking. But for someone like me that knows the secrets of gunnery and has no tracking issues the Kronos is simply better. 450 damage vs 600 is kind of big difference. That's all. For history i do now about 520 damage with my apocalypse and when i ll go to tech 2 guns i ll be able to do around 750. How slow that seems? And about resistences well i melt Sanshas and Blood doing great against Mercenaries and Angels and doing ok (ok for me means equal to a Raven against Guristas) I mean i fly the raven myself with my alt and i have tried the Gallente BS as well. I fly Caldari /Gallente with the one character and Minmatar/Amarr with the other. I have seen in practice what each BS does and although all of them are valid choice the Apocalypse seems the most fun with the best ISK/Hour Ratio. Now Marauders are a different category , still i would prefer the Apocalypse to Golem and of course Vargur that is just plain useless. Cruise raven on your alt != torp golem. Apoc > Golem? Yeah i bet that you that are an expert will do real fast these missions with the torp Golem having to get close to less than 40km (considering you will be using rigs that increase the range of torps from 30 to 40km) traveling at the hyper speed of 156 to kill the BSes and waiting then some hours for your torps to kill the smaller sinature ships. So I guess you missed the introduction of Javelin torps? Also, if anything the Paladin is the best non-missile marauder, seeing how it clearly outdamages and outtracks the Kronos, and damage types are perfectly fine unless you are being silly and run the wrong racial agents. It is correct though that the new Apoc can do many Amarr missions better than the Golem, at least when Officer-pimped. Mainly due to the fact that the Golem has to restrict itself to T2 siege launchers.
000Hunter000 Gallente Missiles 'R' Us	Posted - 2008.05.09 22:12:00 - [25] I got a Golem sitting in my station but i still prefer to run me missions with me Nighthawk tbh. _______________________________________________________ CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!!
Zaran Darkstar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.05.09 22:23:00 - [26] Originally by: Leandro Salazar Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 09/05/2008 21:43:35 Originally by: Zaran Darkstar Originally by: Boz Well Originally by: Zaran Darkstar The only real reason people would prefer Golem to Kronos is that Golem needs no tracking. But for someone like me that knows the secrets of gunnery and has no tracking issues the Kronos is simply better. 450 damage vs 600 is kind of big difference. That's all. For history i do now about 520 damage with my apocalypse and when i ll go to tech 2 guns i ll be able to do around 750. How slow that seems? And about resistences well i melt Sanshas and Blood doing great against Mercenaries and Angels and doing ok (ok for me means equal to a Raven against Guristas) I mean i fly the raven myself with my alt and i have tried the Gallente BS as well. I fly Caldari /Gallente with the one character and Minmatar/Amarr with the other. I have seen in practice what each BS does and although all of them are valid choice the Apocalypse seems the most fun with the best ISK/Hour Ratio. Now Marauders are a different category , still i would prefer the Apocalypse to Golem and of course Vargur that is just plain useless. Cruise raven on your alt != torp golem. Apoc > Golem? Yeah i bet that you that are an expert will do real fast these missions with the torp Golem having to get close to less than 40km (considering you will be using rigs that increase the range of torps from 30 to 40km) traveling at the hyper speed of 156 to kill the BSes and waiting then some hours for your torps to kill the smaller sinature ships. So I guess you missed the introduction of Javelin torps? Also, if anything the Paladin is the best non-missile marauder, seeing how it clearly outdamages and outtracks the Kronos, and damage types are perfectly fine unless you are being silly and run the wrong racial agents. It is correct though that the new Apoc can do many Amarr missions better than the Golem, at least when Officer-pimped. Mainly due to the fact that the Golem has to restrict itself to T2 siege launchers. I haven't forgotten Javelins but they are a bit expencive and hard to find in large quantities. And of course Paladin is a great ship the one that i ll head to eventually with this character in distand future.(the other will go Kronos) It's just that Kronos is more stable in the sence that it has no problem in cap while tanking with dual LARII and still do good damage.For Paladin is not equaly possible to do that. And since the guy in this thread was wondering about Golem i thought as better idea to propose the Kronos since Caldari and Gallente share the same turret platform. But yeah for Amarr missions especialy the lasers kick arse and have less lag too. Once i had gone missioning at Motsu , the agent sent me at Salia where everything was happening 30seconds after i was giving the command! _______________________________ Join the biggest Minmatar Corp! www.BrutorTribe.com
Zo5o Gallente Longcat is Long	Posted - 2008.05.09 23:07:00 - [27] Quote: It's just that Kronos is more stable in the sence that it has no problem in cap while tanking with dual LARII There is absolutely zero reason to use dual LAR on a mission Kronos.
ankarii	Posted - 2008.05.10 00:15:00 - [28] There are a few things to consider between the two. First thing is: tank. Both have phenomenal tanks, however, the Golem wins out (in my opinion) for 3 reasons. A) Shield boost amplifiers B) Crystal implants C) Cap stability vs tank ability (A surprising balance on the golem) With 1x XL booster II 2x Boost amp II's 3x cap flux II's 1x CPR II and a full set of low grade crystals, you can easily boost well over 1700 shield/cycle indefinitely. With 4 mid slots left for hardeners, the equivalent of gaining 340 shield/sec on top of 80%+ resists(per mission requirements) the Golem is definitely NOT a bad choice if you like missile boats Considering many who are using these expensive ships go for faction tanks, lets say we are using a pith X-tank for its glorious 1 billion or so. 1x Pith XL x-type booster 2x pith x-type boost amps and crystals = 3100/cycle. And all the while still having 4 midslots leftover for resists. I'm not discounting the Kronos by any means. it is certainly a deadly ship. Although, for an armor tank, without a cap booster I find its cap disturbingly unstable for the dual-rep setup I prefer to use on my Paladin. Even with guns turned off the Kronos' cap doesn't last as long, which me being Amarr, is driven into my mind like a steel spike that low cap=death and a chamber of horrors. Another choice is to use a single Corpus x-type rep on the Kronos, and spend a chunk of change on it as well. At that point the cap stability is no longer a problem, and frees up a low slot to toss in a mag stab, throw on some aux Nano Pump I's and you now rep for over 2200/cycle. Undoubtedly there are some better setups out there, and some make a sick, sick Kronos, but the Paladin and the Golem win my favor as far as overall ability.
ankarii	Posted - 2008.05.10 00:19:00 - [29] Originally by: Zo5o There is absolutely zero reason to use dual LAR on a mission Kronos. I wanna see this tank some of the harder missions with 0 warpouts and 0 hull damage.
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.10 00:56:00 - [30] Originally by: Zaran Darkstar I haven't forgotten Javelins but they are a bit expencive and hard to find in large quantities. I bought roughly 750K Jav torps in Jita for 300 isk apiece awhile ago in hope of a price spike that never came (or did it finally come now that I don't bother checking anymore?) so no, they are neither expensive nor hard to find in large quantities unless something has changed recently. You want ME for the CSM! There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction

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