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Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.05.21 10:59:00 - [91] Originally by: Ki Tarra WTF? Covert Op T1 Hull Gallente = E-war frigate Amarr = E-war frigate Minmatar = E-war frigate Caldari = Astrometrics frigate So instead of changing the one hull that is inconsistant, you introduce a new hull and change all the others? Further proof that Caldari are always right. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
Ho HsienKo Delictum 23216	Posted - 2008.05.21 11:18:00 - [92] Originally by: Thenoran How does this affect Invention? I would think that is Obvious?
Nikkan Synn	Posted - 2008.05.21 11:43:00 - [93] That new Helios model looks absolutely horrible I am so beyond ****ed there is just nothing else to say. I spent like a month training for this ship and was so happy they didnt make my covops frigate look like crap. Now they gonna change it to look like crap no doubt to force people to time-grind out cruiser V or something
OneSock Crown Industries	Posted - 2008.05.21 11:50:00 - [94] blurg ! fail ! The Helios was way cool !
Rhatar Khurin WE ARE ONE	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:03:00 - [95] Finally! a T2 Probe! my fave ship! _ EVE RELATED CONTENT
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:04:00 - [96] Last time I heard, you skilled up for a ship for it's abilities, not it's looks Also, why are you whining about the looks of a ship that will be in cloak 95% of it's miserable lifespan?
Nicholas Barker MASS Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:09:00 - [97] oh you ****s, make the nossing frigate the magnet model. ---
Iohan Sjet Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:31:00 - [98] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Last time I heard, you skilled up for a ship for it's abilities, not it's looks Also, why are you whining about the looks of a ship that will be in cloak 95% of it's miserable lifespan? I have to agree.. Does the hull still do the job? Will it keep your 30 Mil Isk Clone in it's pod and provide Intel for your gang / Fleet? If the answer is yes, then I don't see the problem? I did like the suggestion (Somewhere here) of a Frigate Command ship. That would be nice and allow the re-use of the old Co-Ops models. "Cibus tormenti conducendus"
Misanth The Graduates Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:31:00 - [99] Quite happy we finally got our last missing frig. As for the changes in looks.. well, we have our sexy mini-scorpion (Anathema) looking like a pile of POO, while the ugly Helios finally looks better. Seems the majority (at least of the vocal players) here think otherwise. Glad I can prove people got different taste. Not to mention it does make sense to follow the concept of using the t1 equivalent hull, just like it does in all other cases. Some may like it, others not, at the end of the day those who purely train for a ship because of the looks.. sorry but roflskates. Some of the most sexy Amarr ships are totally non-Amarrian and ruined. Damnation, Curse, Malediction, Heretic.. all awsome ships to use, but neither of them make use of what a true Amarr character would invest heavily in - gunnery. So at the end of the day we end up in ugly ships, because they're what we can use. People that solely train a skill to use a ship because of looks actually have it better - you usually know what you get and your changes are quite rare. Those of us that train for something we believe is what it is (gunnery for Amarr ships for example, just to have it changed later) is more likely to be screwed over. Consider yourself lucky those changes were minimal. I mean, you could've ended up in a rapier or moa-looking ship. Making people laugh to death in your metal frog-constructions..
Pure Revenge	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:35:00 - [100] Took some ingame fraps of some of the FW stuff EVE-ONLINE FW
Joe Umbra Legion	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:43:00 - [101] Originally by: Patch86 Amarr needed that missing frigate more than EVE needed a unique model faction ship. And the Magnate has always been the smart choice- essentially, the game's only faction-issue ship who's T1 version hadn't been released yet. This comes down to one thing only: Lazy Devs and Game designers rehashing stuff becuase they can't be bothered to design a new frig model. Excepect to see the Opux luxury yachts released as the 'new gallente faction warfare cruiser' soon. Pe0w
Nova Fox	Posted - 2008.05.21 12:52:00 - [102] the new faction cruisers are all based on the tech 1 logistics teir 1 cruisers except for the amarr which get a teir 2 cruiser instead (everyone else already has a navy teir 2 amarr only got a tier 1) New Ship Idea: Tender Supply Ship, The Logistics Sister
Ravreau	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:21:00 - [103] Hmmm. I like the Anathema as it currently is, although I suppose it'll make it easier for me to find the Anathema amongst the Sentinels in my hangar. Don't get me wrong, the new design is very pretty but it doesn't "feel" as sleek or sneaky as the old; it would however be awesomely "right" as the Purifier ... NOTE: I am well aware that there are logical/canonical reasons for changing the base hulls, but sometimes you've just got to let that emotional/aesthetic spark speak out.
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:29:00 - [104] Originally by: Joe Originally by: Patch86 Amarr needed that missing frigate more than EVE needed a unique model faction ship. And the Magnate has always been the smart choice- essentially, the game's only faction-issue ship who's T1 version hadn't been released yet. This comes down to one thing only: Lazy Devs and Game designers rehashing stuff becuase they can't be bothered to design a new frig model. Excepect to see the Opux luxury yachts released as the 'new gallente faction warfare cruiser' soon. Jeez, aren't you the happy guy in the bunch. Maybe you should cancel your subscription(s) for a few months, you know, penalize CCP with 15/30/45/60 USD a month.
Hanneshannes	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:30:00 - [105] Originally by: Jade Constantine Originally by: Jantje Smit -Align button! (no more double clicks mouse cheers) Thats a surprisingly beautiful change - now lets give it to fleet commander so he or she can align the fleet please That might be rather boring. The next thing is FCs being able to invite ppl into the fleet and control their ships, so all you have to do to take part in a fleet op is be online xD
Joe Umbra Legion	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:37:00 - [106] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Originally by: Joe Originally by: Patch86 Amarr needed that missing frigate more than EVE needed a unique model faction ship. And the Magnate has always been the smart choice- essentially, the game's only faction-issue ship who's T1 version hadn't been released yet. This comes down to one thing only: Lazy Devs and Game designers rehashing stuff becuase they can't be bothered to design a new frig model. Excepect to see the Opux luxury yachts released as the 'new gallente faction warfare cruiser' soon. Jeez, aren't you the happy guy in the bunch. Maybe you should cancel your subscription(s) for a few months, you know, penalize CCP with 15/30/45/60 USD a month. No I'm not happy. Instead of devs and model designers doing what their payed for they instead turn to a 'solution' they could have implimented 4 years ago. My cat has allready calcelled its 3 subscriptions to EON Pe0w
Siigari Kitawa The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:54:00 - [107] Siigari Kitawa on the Maulus to Imicus "helios" transformation: CCP, don't go changing models just because. You're not only taking away from the uniqueness of the Magnate but you're destroying the awesome that were the traditional models from their ships. WHY?! Don't do this CCP! This is totally wrong! I mean for heaven's sake this is just plain wrong! WHY?! CCP this isn't fair :( The Helios is an awesome ship. I DEMAND that if you're going to take an Imicus hull and make it into the Helios you maintain the Imicus' 15m3 dronebay and boost the Helios' dronebay to match. OR ELSE. >=\| GAHHHHH I am so ****ed off right now. www.siigarikitawa.com
Baron Erique Paxton Industries Paxton Federation	Posted - 2008.05.21 14:16:00 - [108] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I DEMAND that if you're going to take an Imicus hull and make it into the Helios you maintain the Imicus' 15m3 dronebay and boost the Helios' dronebay to match. Frankly, I don't care what the Helios looks like. The only time I see it is when I dock, which I only do to pick up more probes or sometimes log off. However, keeping the larger dronebay might come in handy on occasion...but I think keeping the Imicus' excellent cargobay would be even better. Think of all the exploration probes it could carry!
Melor Rend	Posted - 2008.05.21 14:26:00 - [109] Originally by: Jade Constantine Originally by: Jantje Smit -Align button! (no more double clicks mouse cheers) Thats a surprisingly beautiful change - now lets give it to fleet commander so he or she can align the fleet please I agree.
HellSpeed Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2008.05.21 14:55:00 - [110] Originally by: Jantje Smit Edited by: Jantje Smit on 20/05/2008 16:50:18 Originally by: Winterblink What the hell did they change the Helios model for? Pics? blah. The maulus model rocks Ugly New Helios What a (bad) joke.
Phyrr The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2008.05.21 15:11:00 - [111] I for one look forward to my new probe hulled cheetah. Join us in the Exploration channel. The odds on me being here are rather slim evolutionary speaking, yet in the infinite bounds of probability my being here is a certainty.
Lareon Denery Project Aquarion Valkyrie Deus Ex.	Posted - 2008.05.21 15:40:00 - [112] Originally by: Jantje Smit Model changes: Helios model changed from Maulus -> Imicus Ugly New Helios No, please. Wake me up, this is a nightmare Don't do it CCP, please t_t
Bish Ounen Omni-Core Freedom Fighters Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:14:00 - [113] I think alot of you who are whining about the helios changes are missing some VERY critical points. 1) Maulus hull drone bay = 5m3, 1 small drone Imicus hull drone bay = 15m3, 3 small drones, or one medium drone. 2) Maulus hull cargo hold = 175m3 Imicus hull cargo hold = 320m3 Amount of cargo capacity needed to hold the liquid ozone for a cyno jump = ~200m3 So, not only can the Imicus hold more drones (more defensive capability) but it has a larger cargo hold. This means there isn't any need to modify your fitting to include a cargo expander if you need to cyno in someone with your cov-ops. Just swap out to the cyno gen, and throw the LO into your hold. Done. So not only does this change satisfy RP needs and continuity needs (using astrometrics hulls for astrometrics ships) but it also makes the Gallente Cov-ops WAY more useful and able to defend itself. Overall the change is a net positive for the Gallente. Since we have had several of our key mechanics nerfed in recent patches, I welcome anything that improves our lot on the battlefield. Besides, I actually like the looks of the Imicus. It has that "Millennium Falcon" vibe. You know, the: "You came in that? You're braver than I thought." sort of thing going for it.
Letrange Chaosstorm Corporation Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:25:00 - [114] Well now this is amusing - a change where about half approve and about half scream murder. Well done on the balance part there CPP. I'm happy for this change. The only thing I'm going to be annoyed about is the fact that the stats and slots won't change at the same time as the model change. I'd love a cheetah with drones and a bigger cargo bay.... Although I can see that on could argue that all those extra slot spots came at the expense of the cargo and drone bays. (vigil to cheetah only got 1 extra slot spot, but the probe to the cheetah will get 4 new slot spots) So the Minmatar T1->T2 progression looks like this: Probe->Cheetah Vigil->Hyena Burst->... Breacher->Hound Slasher->Stiletto or Claw Rifter->Jaguar or Wolf So that got me thinking: We're missing exactly 3 Tech 2 evolutions per race now The burst has no T2, the Hurricane has no T2 and the Maelstrom has no T2 I'm going to assume that the other races are similar (now that the frigate inconsistencies have been fixed). The mining frigate T2 would need to be what? We'd probably need some form of high value, high risk, mining activity to justify a T2 mining frigate of some type. So unless there's a really big industrial update - not going to happen. The battle cruiser... Everyone realizes of course that in usual naval terminology the current battle cruisers are miss-named? The current battle cruisers should be called Heavy Cruisers (more armor but cruiser sized guns) and battle cruisers should be light armor and battleship weapons. This would lead to the logical conclusion that a logical progression for the tier 2 battle cruisers could be reduced tank but battleship weapons. Which would be interesting but unlikely to happen. The Tier 3 battleships.... hummmmm. No clue there. Fleet flagships of some sort. But people complain that the field of ships with command bonuses saturated. Another possibility would be some form of fleet logistics ships (something that wouldn't evaporate as quickly as support cruisers in the large fleet fights - not that I've seen this but from comments it happens).
london Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:28:00 - [115] Originally by: Bish Ounen I think alot of you who are whining about the helios changes are missing some VERY critical points. 1) Maulus hull drone bay = 5m3, 1 small drone Imicus hull drone bay = 15m3, 3 small drones, or one medium drone. 2) Maulus hull cargo hold = 175m3 Imicus hull cargo hold = 320m3 Amount of cargo capacity needed to hold the liquid ozone for a cyno jump = ~200m3 So, not only can the Imicus hold more drones (more defensive capability) but it has a larger cargo hold. This means there isn't any need to modify your fitting to include a cargo expander if you need to cyno in someone with your cov-ops. Just swap out to the cyno gen, and throw the LO into your hold. Done. So not only does this change satisfy RP needs and continuity needs (using astrometrics hulls for astrometrics ships) but it also makes the Gallente Cov-ops WAY more useful and able to defend itself. Overall the change is a net positive for the Gallente. Since we have had several of our key mechanics nerfed in recent patches, I welcome anything that improves our lot on the battlefield. Besides, I actually like the looks of the Imicus. It has that "Millennium Falcon" vibe. You know, the: "You came in that? You're braver than I thought." sort of thing going for it. That's assuming they stick with these cargo / drone bay stats. What's to stop them from only updating the model? london:
Bish Ounen Omni-Core Freedom Fighters Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:31:00 - [116] Originally by: Letrange So that got me thinking: We're missing exactly 3 Tech 2 evolutions per race now Gallente: Frigates: Navitas = no T2 Battlecruisers: Myrmidon = no T2 Battleships: Hyperion = no T2 Freighters: Obelisk = no T2 (since the Rorqual is actually an ORE design, I don't count it. Although you could say it is the T2 freighter for all races I suppose.) So, leaving freighters aside, you are correct. If you count in freighters, it's a whole different discussion.
Bish Ounen Omni-Core Freedom Fighters Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:34:00 - [117] Originally by: london That's assuming they stick with these cargo / drone bay stats. What's to stop them from only updating the model? That seems unlikely. Particularly if they are doing the update to, as they have said, fix the continuity and RP problem of having non-astrometrics hulls in astrometrics roles. I suspect that the stats will be properly updated to reflect the hull and drone bay differences between the hull models. It is a good question though. Can CCP give us an answer on that one?
Jantje Smit The Golden Goat	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:40:00 - [118] Originally by: Bronson Hughes Edited by: Bronson Hughes on 21/05/2008 17:39:56 Originally by: Bish Ounen Frigates: Navitas = no T2 Battlecruisers: Myrmidon = no T2 Battleships: Hyperion = no T2 Freighters: Obelisk = no T2 (since the Rorqual is actually an ORE design, I don't count it. Although you could say it is the T2 freighter for all races I suppose.) So, leaving freighters aside, you are correct. If you count in freighters, it's a whole different discussion. None of the playable races have a T2 mining frig, tier 2 battlecruiser, or tier 3 battleship, not just the Gallente. And there are T2 Freighters, they're called Jump Freighters. The Rorqual is not a T2 freighter, it is a T1 Capital Industrial Ship. Also, there are no T2 capital ships. EDIT: I am fully in favor of the changes being witnessed here. The Amarr not having a T1 astrometrics frigate has always bothered me and the Magnate model is just too cool to not be using. There is something to be said about keeping the Magnate a unique model, but I'd rather it be used than not. It's also always bothered me that CovOps frigs and the EA frigs have the same model, bar the Caldari. Jump Freighters. T2 Obelisk = Anshar.
Bish Ounen Omni-Core Freedom Fighters Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:42:00 - [119] Originally by: Jantje Smit ] Jump Freighters. T2 Obelisk = Anshar. Thanks. I fixed it.
Pr1ncess Alia Perkone	Posted - 2008.05.21 17:43:00 - [120] when do we get pics of the new kickass cruisers?

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