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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 04:45:00 - [1] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 04:47:43 Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 04:45:21 Hey guys, first thing I am not related to the Uni. Im just a passerby who figured it out. Uni just decced themselves 18 times to make the price of war for Privateers 1 billion. But they did it very cheaply(less than 400m). The method is just ingenius and you can do this too. Oh and although it hasnt been confirmed, the Uni Diplomat says he consulted the Devs before. I also figure its a good opportunity to make ISK :P So 5m each for the secret. Msg me ingame :) The ppl who want to flame can do so. Im just trying to make some money :P
Jinx Barker GFB Scientific	Posted - 2008.05.25 04:47:00 - [2] Here I was ready for super dopper spezial sikrit and all I got was a lousy beg for ISK... Damn you - I want to hear spezial sikrit...
Flipout	Posted - 2008.05.25 04:49:00 - [3] I assume it would be Corp A in uni leaves uni, Uni dev's corp A, Corp A joins uni?
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 04:49:00 - [4] What can I say, I try :)
Dirk Magnum Spearhead Endeavors	Posted - 2008.05.25 04:51:00 - [5] I send back 10x olo
TheG2	Posted - 2008.05.25 05:15:00 - [6] So what you're admitting is that you're using the alliance hop exploit?
Woodwraith Prophets Of a Damned Universe	Posted - 2008.05.25 05:24:00 - [7] no, hes saying the dec'd the hell outta themselves with alt corps and what not, so when someone else came along to dec them, they had to pay out the nose.
Havohej The Defias Brotherhood DEFI4NT	Posted - 2008.05.25 06:06:00 - [8] Edited by: Havohej on 25/05/2008 06:06:41 Originally by: TheG2 So what you're admitting is that you're using the alliance hop exploit? The OP is talking about this thread which was posted a long time before this genius "passed by" and "figured it out." Eve-UNI claims to have confirmed with CCP staff that this isn't an exploit. What they've done is created a whole bunch of 1-man alt corps, wardec'd Ivy League, thus driving the price per week for PRVTR to maintain their wardec up to 1b. In response, PRVTR promises to keep up the wardec regardless of the cost, and now demands a ransom of 4b to call it off. Originally by: techzer0 I'm invincible until proven wrong
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 06:52:00 - [9] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 06:53:39 Originally by: Havohej The OP is talking about this thread which was posted a long time before this genius "passed by" and "figured it out." Eve-UNI claims to have confirmed with CCP staff that this isn't an exploit. What they've done is created a whole bunch of 1-man alt corps, wardec'd *Ivy League, thus driving the price per week for PRVTR to maintain their wardec up to 1b. In response, PRVTR promises to keep up the wardec regardless of the cost, and now demands a ransom of 4b to call it off. Why, Thank you for your comment, cos it seems you still havent figured it out. If the alt corps had decced Ivy League*, the price wouldve been 50m per war and then 50m added on top of that for every war on top progressively making the price around 10b as was pointed out. Now please try to read what I have written in bold and italic :)
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 07:20:00 - [10] Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 07:21:17 Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Why, Thank you for your comment, cos it seems you still havent figured it out. If the alt corps had decced *Ivy League*, the price wouldve been 50m per war and then 50m added on top of that for every war on top progressively making the price around 10b as was pointed out. Now please try to read what I have written in bold and italic :) Ivy League is basically using the "join-alliance" trick with their alt corps, and then setting the wars mutual. Disgusting exploit of game mechanics is what it is. It is also a pretty desperate tactic from someone claiming to be 'winning' the war. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting

Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 07:24:00 - [11] Originally by: TheG2 So what you're admitting is that you're using the alliance hop exploit? Hm, not sure why the OP would use an exploit or not. Whatever exploit I admit to have no knowledge of. But just as a reminder from the "Rules of conduct" for the forums from CCP: Quote: 13. Do not post about bugs and exploits. Bugs and exploits should be reported through the proper method by filing a report for our Quality Assurance department. I mean you're most probably just yet another forum Alt, still not sure if you want to risk this (same source): Quote: [...]If you are suspended from the message boards, your game account will be reviewed and you may be banned from the game, as well. Gawd, sometimes it's hard work being in a teaching Corp/Alliance...
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 07:37:00 - [12] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 07:41:00 Originally by: Ki An Ivy League is basically using the "join-alliance" trick with their alt corps, and then setting the wars mutual. Disgusting exploit of game mechanics is what it is. It is also a pretty desperate tactic from someone claiming to be 'winning' the war. Wrong Im afraid. The wars have not been set mutual. Have a look ingame. And "join-alliance" trick, whatever it is hasnt been used cos none of the alt corps have any alliance history. Now please try to read the bold and italic stuff that Ive written :) And Im not discussing any exploits. As of yet none of this has been declared an exploit, nor do I think it is one.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 07:40:00 - [13] Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 07:42:55 Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Wrong Im afraid. The wars have not been set mutual. Have a look ingame. And "join-alliance" trick, whatever it is hasnt been used cos none of the alt corps have any alliance history. Now please try to read the bold and italic stuff that Ive written :) And Im not discussing any exploits. As of yet none of this has been declared an exploit, nor do I think it is one. So the wars haven't been set mutual. From what I gather, IVY is pulling their alt corps into the alliance, inheriting the decs by their other alt corps. Mutual or not, the cost is extremely low as it's all inherited corp wars. Either way, it should be an exploit. The war dec system should not be used to make yourself virtually immune from war decs. To think otherwise is being extremely stupid. /Edit: If IVY has found another way to somehow get the price for deccing them up without pulling any corps into the alliance, it is an exploit. Now stop being a **** and either tell us your super sekrit or GTFO. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 08:05:00 - [14] Edited by: Dlardrageth on 25/05/2008 08:10:55 Originally by: Ki An [...] The war dec system should not be used to make yourself virtually immune from war decs. To think otherwise is being extremely stupid. /Edit: If IVY has found another way to somehow get the price for deccing them up without pulling any corps into the alliance, it is an exploit. Now stop being a **** and either tell us your super sekrit or GTFO. Nerdrage is nerdrage is nerdrage. c/d? Edit: Fullquote unnecessary
Ballistic CEO The Ballistic Corporation	Posted - 2008.05.25 08:20:00 - [15] ah at last a negative reaction from measures brought in to shut privateers down. reap/sow
Estel Arador AFK	Posted - 2008.05.25 08:59:00 - [16] Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Now please try to read what I have written in bold and italic :) Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Now please try to read the bold and italic stuff that Ive written :) Geez you're happy about the bold and italic stuff you've written. I commend you on your innovative use of the bold and italic tags. I love reading bold and italic stuff you've written. I also love reading that the bold and italic stuff you've written should be read. Could you say one more time that the bold and italic stuff you've written has to be read, perhaps in bold and italic? Skills Explained
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:06:00 - [17] Originally by: Dlardrageth Nerdrage is nerdrage is nerdrage. c/d? c failed meme is failed? c/d Exploited game mechanic is exploited? c/d Failing IVY is failing? c/d Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:17:00 - [18] please try to read the bold and italic stuff that Ive written :) lol man I love you ppl :P
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:28:00 - [19] Originally by: Galacio Prognatus please try to read the bold and italic stuff that Ive written :) lol man I love you ppl :P Please try to use proper punctuation and capitalization and we will want to read it. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:29:00 - [20] Originally by: Ki An failed meme is failed? c/d c - But... I didn't use any four-letter-word like "meme" in quoted post. so prolly just 50/50. Quote: Exploited game mechanic is exploited? c/d insert reference to first post in thread Sorry, buddy, I'm posting with my main so I'm not gonna risk the banhammer by even touching this. Quote: Failing IVY is failing? c/d Frankly... no clue. shrug I'm just a grunt responsible for killing Privateers... and doing... stuff. You might need a director or a botanist for that question. And CAOD is that way --->

Megan Maynard Out of Order	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:37:00 - [21] Originally by: Dlardrageth Edited by: Dlardrageth on 25/05/2008 08:10:55 Originally by: Ki An [...] The war dec system should not be used to make yourself virtually immune from war decs. To think otherwise is being extremely stupid. /Edit: If IVY has found another way to somehow get the price for deccing them up without pulling any corps into the alliance, it is an exploit. Now stop being a ** and either tell us your super sekrit or GTFO. Nerdrage is nerdrage is nerdrage. c/d? Edit: Fullquote unnecessary This coming from the guy with a sig that contains a man with long pink hair........ Or is that a chick? We may never know........ Miz Stelth Bomerz iz the **nit.
Quelque Chose New Eden Roller Disco Supply	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:40:00 - [22] This is some truly riveting drama. RIVETING I say! ___________________________________________
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 09:54:00 - [23] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 09:54:30 About to get more riveting. Check this out -- Originally by: Ki An Please try to use proper punctuation and capitalization and we will want to read it. You mean like this -- Originally by: Ki An failed meme is failed? c/d Or grammar like this... Originally by: Ki An Mutual or not, the cost is extremely low as it's all inherited corp wars. You get the point
Quelque Chose New Eden Roller Disco Supply	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:00:00 - [24] Bravo, sir, bravo! I will contact my agent forthwith. I can't promise anything as yet, but just between you and me I have some considerable confidence I can have Drama Mercs vs Noobschool made into a televised miniseries on the Oxygen! network, perhaps even starring Bruce Dern and Mariel Hemingway. I sense huge things in your future, my lads! ___________________________________________
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:10:00 - [25] Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 10:10:26 Originally by: Galacio Prognatus You mean like this -- Originally by: Ki An failed meme is failed? c/d Yes, like that. Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Or grammar like this... Originally by: Ki An Mutual or not, the cost is extremely low as it's all inherited corp wars. You get the point What's wrong with that one? Did I miss a comma or something? Seriously though, what do you want out of this thread? You've already proven that Eve University are desperate enough to get out of a war that they claim they are winning that they are willing to exploit any broken game mechanic. What other purpose did the thread have? I can't determine if you're an IVY alt failing miserably or a PRIV alt making IVY look bad. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:22:00 - [26] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 10:23:13 Oh that sentence implies that cost = all inherited corp wars because when you use "it" there, its referring to 'cost' which obviously makes the sentence grammatically incorrect. Originally by: Ki An I can't determine if you're an IVY alt failing miserably or a PRIV alt making IVY look bad. And thats exactly your problem(+ all the trolls on the forums). You seem to think there are only two teams. Lets hate one team. The End. There is no such thing as a third person. As for the thread, it started off as something to make ISK and now Im just posting in it for my entertainment. I dont take this seriously at all and I dont rack my brains up and I dont get aggravated unlike some people
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:39:00 - [27] Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 10:39:39 Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 10:23:13 Oh that sentence implies that cost = all inherited corp wars because when you use "it" there, its referring to 'cost' which obviously makes the sentence grammatically incorrect. Originally by: Ki An I can't determine if you're an IVY alt failing miserably or a PRIV alt making IVY look bad. And thats exactly your problem(+ all the trolls on the forums). You seem to think there are only two teams. Lets hate one team. The End. There is no such thing as a third person. As for the thread, it started off as something to make ISK and now Im just posting in it for my entertainment. I dont take this seriously at all and I dont rack my brains up and I dont get aggravated unlike some people You wanted to make isk out of this? How? They IVY guy who pulled this stunt has already explained how in another thread, and as far as I can tell, it was as I said it was. /Edit: You're claiming to be a third party? You're obviously biased towards IVY, so you're either an alt or a fanboi. My guess is alt. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:51:00 - [28] Originally by: Ki An You wanted to make isk out of this? How? They IVY guy who pulled this stunt has already explained how in another thread, and as far as I can tell, it was as I said it was. /Edit: You're claiming to be a third party? You're obviously biased towards IVY, so you're either an alt or a fanboi. My guess is alt. In the beginning when no-one had an idea, I was offering the secret for 5m :P Lame yeh but it seemed like a good idea at the time :) And why am I biased towards IVY? Oh I know; because I said the Uni made a fool of Privateers. But wait, that is the truth. Wow! OMG I have an opinion! I must be an alt. And ofcourse you're an alt of the Privateers cos youve been supporting them here and in the other thread. Now letting go of the taunting, I can say that overall I like the Uni. They teach noobs which is great. But there are somethings I dont approve of like this tactic and that they like to blob a lot.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 10:58:00 - [29] Originally by: Galacio Prognatus In the beginning when no-one had an idea, I was offering the secret for 5m :P Lame yeh but it seemed like a good idea at the time :) Fair enough. Originally by: Galacio Prognatus And why am I biased towards IVY? Oh I know; because I said the Uni made a fool of Privateers. But wait, that is the truth. Wow! OMG I have an opinion! I must be an alt. The Uni are making fools of the Privateers? I'd say they are making fools of CCP for allowing this mechanic to remain this long, and of themselves for actually thinking it's a clever thing to do. Originally by: Galacio Prognatus And ofcourse you're an alt of the Privateers cos youve been supporting them here and in the other thread. Obviously. Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Now letting go of the taunting, I can say that overall I like the Uni. They teach noobs which is great. But there are somethings I dont approve of like this tactic and that they like to blob a lot. I used to like them too. Now they have proven again and again that the only thing they teach noobs is how to blob. They are part of the problem that is haunting 0.0 with blobs everywhere. The graduates of the Uni only knows one thing, and they bring that with them to their next alliance in the perpetuating spiral of blobs. I wish the Uni would stick to teaching courses in game mechanics and leave the PvP teaching to actual PvP corps. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:04:00 - [30] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 11:04:31 Yeh agreed, just collaborate with Agony Unleashed or something, regarding PvP. That would turn out to be a real learning experience.

Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:19:00 - [31] Edited by: Dlardrageth on 25/05/2008 11:20:17 Originally by: Ki An [...] /Edit: You're claiming to be a third party? You're obviously biased towards IVY, so you're either an alt or a fanboi. My guess is alt. You are aware this very argument works both ways? Substitute "IVY" by "Privateers" and the shoe might fit you. Real no-brainer. And no, I was referring to you, not myself, as I'm - obviously - neither an IVY Alt nor a fanboi but just a plain member of "IVY". Quote: [...] I used to like them too. Now they have proven again and again that the only thing they teach noobs is how to blob. They are part of the problem that is haunting 0.0 with blobs everywhere. The graduates of the Uni only knows one thing, and they bring that with them to their next alliance in the perpetuating spiral of blobs. I wish the Uni would stick to teaching courses in game mechanics and leave the PvP teaching to actual PvP corps.[...] Ah, now we finally get to the point. Been griefed much? "Proven again and again" suggests strongly you have some first-hand experience. If by "the graduates of the Uni" you refer to a specific Corp, well BRUCE!=IVY. Although if you refer to all graduates of the Uni, each and every single one, that is a gross generalization which we don't really have to take seriously. And nice as it is that you want to give us credit for at least teaching (or even inventing?) "the blob", are you serious about "teaching courses in game mechanics"? On the one hand you do harangue Uni for the use of those very game mechanics, on the other hand you ask to teach exactly this? Now what? You cannot eat the cake and keep it at the same time, sorry. As far as "PvP teaching" goes, I think that makes up about 10-20% of the whole curriculum. Your obvious failure at getting the facts straight leaves the impression you have no real clue when you talk about IVY/EVE-University, sorry again. Personally I'd freely admit that for example Agony Unleashed or VETO or Sniggwaffe teach much more focused PvP than the Uni does. Matter of individual focus. All due respect to them. And no real problem in my book. Of course if for whatever obscure reason you wish that E-Uni will teach their members absolutely nothing about PvP... feel free to do that. But I personally don't see that happening. Edit: Some spelling
Stakhanov Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:23:00 - [32] Good thing trusting players elected an Exploit University member as CSM rep , heh.
Cunny	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:24:00 - [33] This thread is now about kittens.
Taua Roqa Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:29:00 - [34] I like to pick kittens up by the scruf of the neck so they go into that funny trance, then hold them to my face as they paddle their fluffy little paws against my joy-engorged cheek. I sometimes put their nose into my eye too, they are so cute. -------------------------------------------- [IMAGE REMOVED] Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. My I/Q Ration!!!11
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:29:00 - [35] Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 11:31:32 Originally by: Dlardrageth You are aware this very argument works both ways? Substitute "IVY" by "Privateers" and the shoe might fit you. Real no-brainer. hehe you said no-brain... Originally by: Dlardrageth Ah, now we finally get to the point. Been griefed much? "Proven again and again" suggests strongly you have some first-hand experience. If by "the graduates of the Uni" you refer to a specific Corp, well BRUCE!=IVY. Although if you refer to all graduates of the Uni, each and every single one, that is a gross generalization which we don't really have to take seriously. I am not talking about "The Graduates", but those who leave your alliance after "learning" from you. You obviously won't take me seriously, but for an entity with the positive community support that you guys had to sink as low as you have here is sad indeed. Originally by: Dlardrageth And nice as it is that you want to give us credit for at least teaching (or even inventing?) "the blob", are you serious about "teaching courses in game mechanics"? On the one hand you do harangue Uni for the use of those very game mechanics, on the other hand you ask to teach exactly this? Now what? You cannot eat the cake and keep it at the same time, sorry. Don't try to make yourself any more stupid than you already are. You might explode (true story). Originally by: Dlardrageth As far as "PvP teaching" goes, I think that makes up about 10-20% of the whole curriculum. Your obvious failure at getting the facts straight leaves the impression you have no real clue when you talk about IVY/EVE-University, sorry again. Personally I'd freely admit that for example Agony Unleashed or VETO or Sniggwaffe teach much more focused PvP than the Uni does. Matter of individual focus. All due respect to them. And no real problem in my book. Yes, any of those corps are much better at teaching PvP than you are. However, new players are told to apply to Eve University and learn about the game. Your failure to provide adequate PvP teaching leads to a state where the community should stop sending new players to you. I am just pointing this out. Originally by: Dlardrageth Of course if for whatever obscure reason you wish that E-Uni will teach their members absolutely nothing about PvP... feel free to do that. But I personally don't see that happening. I would say, try to teach your students something of value instead of sitting in blobs camping gates. Take them out in small gangs. Teach them the merits of solo pvp. Try to be a positive force for PvP in Eve. If you don't enjoy pvp, tell this to your students so that they might chose a different benefactor. The jist of the problem is that Eve University isn't all it's cranked up to be. It used to be a good way for newbies to learn the game, but now you teach blobbing and exploitation of game mechanics. I don't know what has changed, but the direction that Eve University has taken is grounds for lobbying for a stop of the community support to you. I realise you don't want to accept this, but that's the way I feel. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Gealbhan Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:33:00 - [36] "Concentrate all your fire on one target, when it is destroyed, move on to the next. That is how you secure victory". - Tactica Imperium.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:36:00 - [37] As I understand this (I am no expert on war dec fees) Eve Uni is using alt corps to artificially inflate the cost to war dec them, IE paying 500 M in war dec fees while it would cost a legitimate coorp/alliance 2-4 times that amount. You can call it a clever use of mechanics, but I call that an exploit. Just like the old privateers declaring war on everyone known alliance was deemed to be wrong, I call this to be far worse as the old privateers never tried to do something tricky in declaring war, they were just flat out too successful. I cannoy believe any self-respecting player would be involved in such cowardly acts by this Eve-University. Either fight, disband or gb2wow. Originally by: CCP Casqade Please refrain from making assumptions on game mechanics and then presenting them as facts before testing them yourself.
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:36:00 - [38] Actually, I find this rather ironic. Very ingenious EvE-Uni.
Karando Random Goods	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:43:00 - [39] You got it wrong, Ki An, they just don't enjoy "unfair" PvP. I guess when they do PvP, they train how to defend an imaginary alliance held region (respectively blob camping). Because as long you can say the noobships and haulers you shoot were about to enter your own space illicitly, you can justify your pew pew. As you already said, they are trained for regular alliance blobbing. Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Dlardrageth Personally I'd freely admit that for example Agony Unleashed or VETO or Sniggwaffe teach much more focused PvP than the Uni does. Yes, any of those corps are much better at teaching PvP than you are. I'd even guess there's nothing the Uni teaches better than a PvP academy. (Okay, Production/Invention maybe, but that's it)
Iuris Proeliator Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:50:00 - [40] Originally by: Ki An I would say, try to teach your students something of value instead of sitting in blobs camping gates. Take them out in small gangs. Teach them the merits of solo pvp. Try to be a positive force for PvP in Eve. If you don't enjoy pvp, tell this to your students so that they might chose a different benefactor. I would ask then... what's your solution? Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. What you're suggesting is that if two organizations clash, and one has a population of much higher SP characters, they should always win, because it's "not fair" to fight that with superior numbers. The issue is that, with EVE's skill system, that means that one side will ALWAYS be the victor, since higher SP means the ability to generate more cash which leads to the ability to use better implants (or more clones with implants. I currently fly PVP in a no implant JC because I can't afford the loss), which leads to faster skill point generation... It becomes an endless cycle where the fight results were pre-determined beforehand. Secondly... Let's assume, for a second, that you are correct. Again, we're going to enter the hypothetical situation that Uni teaches the "Blob". Now, even according to your OWN STATEMENTS... 0.0 is currently blob on blob... shouldn't that be what the Uni teaches then? The reality of the game? You think that blob versus blob exists in 0.0 because the Uni teaches it? No, it exists because of game mechanics. I can fully sympathize with you disliking that situation, but we do not determine game mechanics. The only ones who can change the Blob v Blob situation is CCP. IF, and again that's an IF, the Uni did teach blob warfare, and then CCP changed how 0.0 works, you'd see a change in how things are taught. They teach the realities of the game, not a hypothetical ideal of what the game "should be". I recall asking questions from and learning from a "Devilish Ledoux", I belive the name was. A pirate of some renown, as I recall. At the time, I was feeling somewhat anti-pirate (I had just gotten ganked for the first time and felt like an idiot). As such, I didn't believe that what pirates did was "right". But by listening to him, and learning, I eventually came to the realization that it's a part of the game I had to accept. Now, it doesn't bother me in the least. So, before you go knocking a Uni Education, you should be aware of the realities of it. People ARE taught small gang warfare. Questions about Solo PVP are not only answered, but they are taught with delight as some of our instructors LOVE solo PVP (And are good at it to boot!). But, when attacked, we go with what works, sizeable fleets ((Not blobs, fleets. A blob is an unorganized mass. There IS organization, trust me.) which attempt to counter the vastly higher skillpoint/gear imbalance. And I'm not whining about said SP/gear imbalance, but if we don't have a right to counter that imbalance, what should we do? Offer ourselves up for sacrifice without fighting back? Never.

Tycho Na'Im	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:51:00 - [41] Edited by: Tycho Na''Im on 25/05/2008 11:56:03 it's time to move this thread to caod with the other insanity oh and Ivy, haven't you learned you can't reason with your enemies ? stay off the forums and fight harder, hooch will talk smack even if you beat him
Galacio Prognatus	Posted - 2008.05.25 11:55:00 - [42] Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 11:55:17 Originally by: Karando I'd even guess there's nothing the Uni teaches better than a PvP academy. (Okay, Production/Invention maybe, but that's it) You sir are an idiot and know nothing of this matter so shut the F up. The End. (And for the record I believe other corps teach better PvP)
Lucy'Lastic	Posted - 2008.05.25 12:21:00 - [43] Edited by: Lucy''Lastic on 25/05/2008 12:23:16 How lame for an entity the size of Eve Uni to do this. I used to reccomend to newbs thet they join Eve Uni. I suppose the Merc, Pirate and good old fashion 'griefing' corps everybody cries about can all do the same thing if they want. Nice to have a CSM member belonging to EU elected eh ? maybe he/she can push for more stuff like this to be allowed. Shame.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 12:43:00 - [44] Originally by: Iuris Proeliator I would ask then... what's your solution? Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. No, that is not the only cemented outcome. You can take the opportunity to teach tactics here. For instance, a five man gang of low skilled players that are highly organized and have good tactics will beat a 3 man gang of high skilled players that aren't organized and that has bad tactics. This is what newbies in Eve are struggling to understand, so that's what you should be teaching. Originally by: Iuris Proeliator What you're suggesting is that if two organizations clash, and one has a population of much higher SP characters, they should always win, because it's "not fair" to fight that with superior numbers. No, that's not what I am suggesting. The reality of your "tactics" is that you ONLY EVER use your superior numbers. Look at your war with TRAPS before the Privateers got involved. You met this small Pirate organization of not very high sp players with a massive blob. I know full well that this is how most people operate in Eve. I just don't like it and don't think it should be encouraged by endorsing you. Originally by: Iuris Proeliator The issue is that, with EVE's skill system, that means that one side will ALWAYS be the victor, since higher SP means the ability to generate more cash which leads to the ability to use better implants (or more clones with implants. I currently fly PVP in a no implant JC because I can't afford the loss), which leads to faster skill point generation... It becomes an endless cycle where the fight results were pre-determined beforehand. Not necessarily true, as I stated earlier. Originally by: Iuris Proeliator Let's assume, for a second, that you are correct. Again, we're going to enter the hypothetical situation that Uni teaches the "Blob". Now, even according to your OWN STATEMENTS... 0.0 is currently blob on blob... shouldn't that be what the Uni teaches then? The reality of the game? You think that blob versus blob exists in 0.0 because the Uni teaches it? No, it exists because of game mechanics. I can fully sympathize with you disliking that situation, but we do not determine game mechanics. The only ones who can change the Blob v Blob situation is CCP. IF, and again that's an IF, the Uni did teach blob warfare, and then CCP changed how 0.0 works, you'd see a change in how things are taught. They teach the realities of the game, not a hypothetical ideal of what the game "should be". I don't think this is a good defense, sir. Can't you see it's a vicious circle? Alliances in 0.0 blob. Eve Uni teaches blobs to new generations of players. Blob warfare gets worse. Eve Uni teaches more blobs. That said, this topic is not so much about blobbing as it is about you using a lame game mechanic to make yourselves virtually immune from anyone but the very richest. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 12:44:00 - [45] ORLY? What's next in the line? "E-Uni broke EVE!" "E-Uni are the new Goons!" "OMG HAXXploit!" or something similar perhaps? Man, this Tech-2 Drama bomb is totally IMBA... I call "nerf"...
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 12:57:00 - [46] Originally by: Dlardrageth ORLY? What's next in the line? "E-Uni broke EVE!" "E-Uni are the new Goons!" "OMG HAXXploit!" or something similar perhaps? Man, this Tech-2 Drama bomb is totally IMBA... I call "nerf"... You're a freshman, yes? Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Karando Random Goods	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:01:00 - [47] Edited by: Karando on 25/05/2008 13:01:10 Originally by: Galacio Prognatus Edited by: Galacio Prognatus on 25/05/2008 11:55:17 Originally by: Karando I'd even guess there's nothing the Uni teaches better than a PvP academy. (Okay, Production/Invention maybe, but that's it) You sir are an idiot and know nothing of this matter so shut the F up. The End. (And for the record I believe other corps teach better PvP) lol, yeah, you're right, thats why I said I guess. But it is very likely you learn how to play EVE in a non-academy corp as well. I actually know people who learned how to play without joining a corp. You don't need no bloody school system to get into a game. Oh, and next time, swear with your main.
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:12:00 - [48] Originally by: Ki An You're a freshman, yes? Not quite. I mean cannot be, lookie there: E-Uni exposed! And as noone would ever think that could not be true I cannot be one by definition. Or so... or whatever... And I'm not free to reveal my exact duties in the Uni apart from occasionally yelling at people in blobs and failing at shooting at poor solo WTs with my overpowered EW. Yeah. I think that could sum it up. Or not? scratches head Excuse me, I'm member of the Uni and thus a clueless nOOb... You might want to ask a director about me being freshman or not, though.
Karando Random Goods	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:13:00 - [49] Originally by: Iuris Proeliator Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. See, thats why you can't compete with PvP academies. Originally by: Iuris Proeliator 0.0 is currently blob on blob... shouldn't that be what the Uni teaches then? The reality of the game? No, because theres nothing to teach about blobbing. Originally by: Iuris Proeliator And I'm not whining about said SP/gear imbalance, but if we don't have a right to counter that imbalance, what should we do? In the unlikely case CCP revokes you the right to "counter that imbalance", you could exploit the game mechanics so it costs the attacking alliance 1bil/week to.. oh wait.
Jowen Datloran Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:19:00 - [50] What the heck is a CAOD post doing in General Forum? There might have been a point in the beginning but the OP edited his post and now it is just the usual corporation/alliance drivel and smack that nobody but themselves care about. If there is an issue here CCP will handle it. ---------------- Mr. Science & Trade Institute

X3k5 Brotherhood of the Phoenix Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:35:00 - [51] Edited by: X3k5 on 25/05/2008 13:43:01 There is a real misunderstanding here. I think a few members of the Uni itself dont know why they blob. Let me explain. Its not the SP/experience, not directly anyways because it can be overcome by tactics as it has been suggested. The real problem with EvE uni is what the players fly. Most EvE University players can ONLY fly a frigate and a cruiser at best. Now lets set the stage. 5 Uni players, minimum support skills in T1 cruisers against 3 T2 fitted HACs with players that have maxed/near maxed support skills with extensive small gang experience. Now show me the tactics that could overturn the outcome of this fight? If you come up with one, you've never been in a small HAC gang. I believe this to be the reason why the Uni blobs and they cant help themselves. This is going to be my only addition to this absurd thread which I believe should have been closed by now.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:41:00 - [52] Originally by: X3k5 Edited by: X3k5 on 25/05/2008 13:35:52 There is a real misunderstanding here. I think a few members of the Uni itself dont know why they blob. Let me explain. Its not the SP/experience, not directly anyways because it can be overcome by tactics as it has been suggested. The real problem with EvE uni is what the players fly. Most EvE University players can ONLY fly a frigate and a cruiser at best. Now lets set the stage. 5 Uni players, minimum support skills in T1 cruisers against 3 T2 fitted HACs with players that have maxed/near maxed support skills with extensive small gang experience. Now show me the tactics that could overturn the outcome of this fight? If you come up with one, you've never been in a small HAC gang. I believe this to be the reason why the Uni blobs and they cant help themselves. This is my going to be my only addition to this absurd thread which I believe should have been closed by now. If those five are in gank thoraxes of ruppies they can take down one of the HACs. They lose 5 ships worth 10 mil in total after insurance. The other guy loses a 100 mil uninsurable ship. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
X3k5 Brotherhood of the Phoenix Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.05.25 13:46:00 - [53] Edited by: X3k5 on 25/05/2008 13:46:24 Originally by: Ki An If those five are in gank thoraxes of ruppies they can take down one of the HACs. They lose 5 ships worth 10 mil in total after insurance. The other guy loses a 100 mil uninsurable ship. Nano HACs(which is the most common setup for HACs) can just MWD away and force the 5 to switch primary and this way take the cruisers down 1 by 1 while remaining untouched. And even MWD thoraxes cant catch HACs. As I said the 3 HAC players I am assuming to have extensive small gang experience so they would know such tactics. But my point was that everyone tries to play a war on their terms. The only way Uni can do so is by blobbing.
Righteous Deeds	Posted - 2008.05.25 14:53:00 - [54] Been in the Uni some time now. Been in a lot of very organized fleets. Never been in a blob. What do they look like?
Irdalth Delrar Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 15:55:00 - [55] Does it even matter to people that we do small gang/solo pvp? But who's gonna whine about small gangs/solo loses on the forums? Thus, its not on the forums, thus, it does not exist. Irdalth Delrar Instructor Eve University <IVY>
Lisento Slaven The Drekla Consortium	Posted - 2008.05.25 16:16:00 - [56] Originally by: Iuris Proeliator I would ask then... what's your solution? Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. If this is what you teach your "students" then my condolences go out to your pupils. They are getting an awful education in the mechanics of EVE and the possibilities that lower SP players actually have vs older players. Your statement motivates people that I've run into to not bother playing the game until they have x amount of SP. 5 vs 3 weighs heavily in favor of the 5, even more so if you know it's 5 vs 3 and you know what ships the 3 are in, regardless of SP. Teaching in absolutes is silly and you should take a step back to look at things in reality...not all 40+ mil SP players are actually any good at EVE =P --- Put in space whales!
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.05.25 16:22:00 - [57] - ivy self declares war to inflate price - devs said it's not an exploit - privateers said they will keep paying it what's the problem? sounds like all 3 parties are on the same page.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 16:32:00 - [58] Originally by: Faife - ivy self declares war to inflate price - devs said it's not an exploit - privateers said they will keep paying it what's the problem? sounds like all 3 parties are on the same page. The bolded part is the one thing we aren't clear on. One Eve Uni guy has apparently petitioned it and gotten an ok. I don't have to remind you the the creators of iMune did the same thing, right? My guess is that this will get fixed very soon, just like iMune. However, it won't be unless we make noise about it. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Doc Eldritch Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 19:05:00 - [59] Seems to me that there are two issues that are getting confused in this topic. 1.) The Privateer vs. EUNI war. 2.) Whether the tactic used by EUNI as described in the first few posts is an exploit or not. Let's not confuse them shall we? What's going on in the war between the Privateers and the UNI, who is winning or loosing, who is using which tactics, how long it will go on, etc etc does not really belong here. There's plenty of COAD threads on that subject already. Now about issue number 2 - again this can be split in 2 parts. 1.) Did the Uni use an exploit? 2.) Should this be an exploit in general? On part #1 that's a clear "No." - EUNI checked ahead of time whether this tactic was allowed and got confirmation. Whether you, personally, think that the Uni exploited is not really an issue here. It's within the game rules, the Uni got a go-ahead and acted. End of story. Part #2 - whether this kind of tactic should remain legitimate or whether its use could affect playing style in a negative way is certainly something that should be up for discussion. NOTE: All opinions expressed by me are my own and do not reflect the position of Eve University in general.
Sp4rt4nII70	Posted - 2008.05.25 19:11:00 - [60] It was my idea :D Well, at least I threw it onto the forum once

Havohej The Defias Brotherhood DEFI4NT	Posted - 2008.05.25 19:29:00 - [61] Originally by: Jowen Datloran What the heck is a CAOD post doing in General Forum? There might have been a point in the beginning but the OP edited his post and now it is just the usual corporation/alliance drivel and smack that nobody but themselves care about. If there is an issue here CCP will handle it. It was poasted here by some tool who was afraid to post with his main, but didn't want his thread to get cut and locked when he poasted it without a corp ticker on CAOD. Originally by: techzer0 I'm invincible until proven wrong
Taua Roqa Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.25 19:37:00 - [62] This thread is now about Atheism's role within Dictatorships. -------------------------------------------- [IMAGE REMOVED] Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. My I/Q Ration!!!11
Fofalus Garoun Investment Bank	Posted - 2008.05.25 19:46:00 - [63] Originally by: Vaal Erit As I understand this (I am no expert on war dec fees) Eve Uni is using alt corps to artificially inflate the cost to war dec them, IE paying 500 M in war dec fees while it would cost a legitimate coorp/alliance 2-4 times that amount. You can call it a clever use of mechanics, but I call that an exploit. Just like the old privateers declaring war on everyone known alliance was deemed to be wrong, I call this to be far worse as the old privateers never tried to do something tricky in declaring war, they were just flat out too successful. I cannoy believe any self-respecting player would be involved in such cowardly acts by this Eve-University. Either fight, disband or gb2wow. Thats the real humour about the ivy guys screaming back that privateers exploited. They did nothing that even resembled an exploit they just declared war on everyone. This is an exploit as they are using ;unintended game mechanics to gain an unfair advantage' the black and white definition of an exploit. I don't care if some IVY guy says he asked a GM that has never been the definitive case on wether or not it is an exploit.
Aphser	Posted - 2008.05.25 20:15:00 - [64] This thread is now about random Alts deciding what CCP has to deem an exploit/cheat/whatever and what not. And about cheezeburgerz...
Righteous Deeds	Posted - 2008.05.25 20:27:00 - [65] Is positioning alts in your target corp and then having them suicide faction BSs to jigger the killboard an exploit? Just curious.
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 21:38:00 - [66] Originally by: Doc Eldritch On part #1 that's a clear "No." - EUNI checked ahead of time whether this tactic was allowed and got confirmation. Whether you, personally, think that the Uni exploited is not really an issue here. It's within the game rules, the Uni got a go-ahead and acted. End of story. To be perfectly honest, I'd like to hear more about this "checking with CCP" business. As you know, iMune checked before time with CCP (a bughunter) and it later turned out that the initial ruling did not at all correspond with what the devs really thought about the issue. My guess is that the same applies here. Did you check this only with a bug hunter (as in the bug report reference), or did you petition it to a GM and get it escalated to get multiple rulings? If it is the latter, then CCP's got some 'splaining to do. If it's the former, you probably shouldn't prance about claiming you've checked with CCP. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Ki An Filiolus Of Bellum	Posted - 2008.05.25 21:38:00 - [67] Originally by: Righteous Deeds Is positioning alts in your target corp and then having them suicide faction BSs to jigger the killboard an exploit? Just curious. No, that's just stupid. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Asuri Kinnes Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 02:09:00 - [68] Edited by: Asuri Kinnes on 26/05/2008 02:21:28 Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Righteous Deeds Is positioning alts in your target corp and then having them suicide faction BSs to jigger the killboard an exploit? Just curious. No, that's just stupid. /begin rant Then please - Go check for "Captain Candor"........Then take the value of that single loss off the killboard stats... Having said that... Should Empire space be safe? Hell no. I don't think anyone believes that. I may be wrong, but I don't believe it myself. I think it would take a lot out of the game. It would make it "create a vacuume"... All I can say to the people that complain that the Uni teaches "Blob" warfare is this: "No, they don't." Blob warfare is how the UNI fights. It is NOT what they teach. They have several different PVP classes, but NONE teach "zomg! BLOB OR NOTHING!" The UNI fights that way to remove the "FUN" from the fight for the enemies... It is how we 1.5M SP, inexperienced n00bs win fights. /shrug. Its a game, and EWAR and superior numbers are legitimate tactics. When I've learned what I want to, at the rate I want to, I'll leave the UNI. Probably for Low-Sec or 0.0... Until then (and on my own schedule, not someone else's terms) I'm in the Uni.... It is possible that the tactic used and described in this thread is "an E" - however, as a n00b-let, I'm perfectly happy to see the Privateers spending a billion a week + losses (see capt candors loss) to fight the war... /shrug /rant off. Just so its clear? These are my opinions only, and don't necessarily reflect the views of the directorship of Eve-Uni. AK Honor is that which you do when no one else is looking.
Rhak Amharr Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.05.26 08:15:00 - [69] Edited by: Rhak Amharr on 26/05/2008 08:16:26 Originally by: Iuris Proeliator Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. I just have to quote it for the pure awesomeness. This is so hilarious, I don't even know where to start. Do you know anything about using tactics? Skill to know when not to engage? Or, well, if you don't care about being killed like me, knowing that you'll probably not warp out your ship while warping in? I have killed quite a few high SP players, and also been killed by lower SP players in what I see as a "fair fight" (so with even numbers), and although I admit it's - on AVERAGE - harder to do so than to kill players with equal or less skillpoints, your argument just makes me want to cry. Seriously, stop playing and go to 0.0. It's what you deserve tbh. I seriously thought eve university was a good institution, and I recommended it to all newbies I met. Now I know why none of them play anymore. Rhak
Cpt Branko Surge. NIght's Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.26 08:50:00 - [70] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/05/2008 08:51:07 Originally by: Iuris Proeliator I would ask then... what's your solution? Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. Which is precisely why the community should stop sending people E-UNI's way. What you've said reflects a total lack of knowledge about how PVP works in the slightest; if anything the odds are slated towards the 5 in the above case (interestingly enough; I was pirating full time at about 8M SP with a fair bit of soloing). Originally by: Iuris Proeliator The issue is that, with EVE's skill system, that means that one side will ALWAYS be the victor, since higher SP means the ability to generate more cash which leads to the ability to use better implants (or more clones with implants. I currently fly PVP in a no implant JC because I can't afford the loss), which leads to faster skill point generation... It becomes an endless cycle where the fight results were pre-determined beforehand. See, it's extremely suprising EvE uni doesn't teach the following things: (a) Higher SP players will always be higher SP players. (b) It only takes a certain amount of SP to be specialized in a ship where you cannot train any meaningful skills to improve your performance at which point you can fight with the best of them, SP-wise. (c) It takes even less SP to get to the level where fittings and tactics provide a solid fighting chance; which means, T2 guns/L4 to relevant skills. This is not hard to get at all. (d) Higher SP players don't always win, not even in matchups of same ships. (e) You can in 99% of cases, outside of 0.0, get your pod out. Basically, people, stop reffering people to bloody E-UNI. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint

Karii Ildarian Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 09:05:00 - [71] Originally by: Taua Roqa This thread is now about Atheism's role within Dictatorships. Don't you really mean the replacement of one God with another...
X3k5 Brotherhood of the Phoenix Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.05.26 10:04:00 - [72] Edited by: X3k5 on 26/05/2008 10:03:56 All the people quoting Iuris Proeliator 's 5 vs 3 post, I dare you to read my post #51 and #53 in this thread, then lets see you ***** about that one. Read the full thread before posting. Trolls.
Taua Roqa Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 10:07:00 - [73] Originally by: Karii Ildarian Originally by: Taua Roqa This thread is now about Atheism's role within Dictatorships. Don't you really mean the replacement of one God with another... i am now moist. -------------------------------------------- [IMAGE REMOVED] Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. My I/Q Ration!!!11
Setana Manoro Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.26 10:44:00 - [74] Originally by: Iuris Proeliator Originally by: Ki An I would say, try to teach your students something of value instead of sitting in blobs camping gates. Take them out in small gangs. Teach them the merits of solo pvp. Try to be a positive force for PvP in Eve. If you don't enjoy pvp, tell this to your students so that they might chose a different benefactor. I would ask then... what's your solution? Should we take 5 players, one with maybe 40m SP and the rest with 10m SP and have them go head to head with 3 55m SP players? We know how that'll end. The 5 players would get absolutely slaughtered. What you're suggesting is that if two organizations clash, and one has a population of much higher SP characters, they should always win, because it's "not fair" to fight that with superior numbers. The issue is that, with EVE's skill system, that means that one side will ALWAYS be the victor, since higher SP means the ability to generate more cash which leads to the ability to use better implants (or more clones with implants. I currently fly PVP in a no implant JC because I can't afford the loss), which leads to faster skill point generation... It becomes an endless cycle where the fight results were pre-determined beforehand. Secondly... Let's assume, for a second, that you are correct. Again, we're going to enter the hypothetical situation that Uni teaches the "Blob". Now, even according to your OWN STATEMENTS... 0.0 is currently blob on blob... shouldn't that be what the Uni teaches then? The reality of the game? You think that blob versus blob exists in 0.0 because the Uni teaches it? No, it exists because of game mechanics. I can fully sympathize with you disliking that situation, but we do not determine game mechanics. The only ones who can change the Blob v Blob situation is CCP. IF, and again that's an IF, the Uni did teach blob warfare, and then CCP changed how 0.0 works, you'd see a change in how things are taught. They teach the realities of the game, not a hypothetical ideal of what the game "should be". I recall asking questions from and learning from a "Devilish Ledoux", I belive the name was. A pirate of some renown, as I recall. At the time, I was feeling somewhat anti-pirate (I had just gotten ganked for the first time and felt like an idiot). As such, I didn't believe that what pirates did was "right". But by listening to him, and learning, I eventually came to the realization that it's a part of the game I had to accept. Now, it doesn't bother me in the least. So, before you go knocking a Uni Education, you should be aware of the realities of it. People ARE taught small gang warfare. Questions about Solo PVP are not only answered, but they are taught with delight as some of our instructors LOVE solo PVP (And are good at it to boot!). But, when attacked, we go with what works, sizeable fleets ((Not blobs, fleets. A blob is an unorganized mass. There IS organization, trust me.) which attempt to counter the vastly higher skillpoint/gear imbalance. And I'm not whining about said SP/gear imbalance, but if we don't have a right to counter that imbalance, what should we do? Offer ourselves up for sacrifice without fighting back? Never. This is the problem, it's not about levels in EVE, it's about something else, that you don't teach anymore. In most cases, 5 players of over 10m sp will rip apart 3 players of more than 30m sp, depend on ships flown, fittings as such, but you can't tie SP to experience and smart fittings.
Setana Manoro Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.26 10:48:00 - [75] Originally by: X3k5 Edited by: X3k5 on 26/05/2008 10:03:56 All the people quoting Iuris Proeliator 's 5 vs 3 post, I dare you to read my post #51 and #53 in this thread, then lets see you ***** about that one. Read the full thread before posting. Trolls. All the ppl quoting that post have the right to quote, because it is beyond retarted and it is why EVE is the craptastic state it is. Everyone understands that what ships they fly and how well they do it is more important than SP, but at 10m SP you can fly the BS of your race and in the case of caldari - and they are mostly caldari, you can even have t2 launchers. Or, fly HACS if you he/she wants too.
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 11:19:00 - [76] Originally by: Setana Manoro [...]Everyone understands that what ships they fly and how well they do it is more important than SP, but at 10m SP you can fly the BS of your race and in the case of caldari - and they are mostly caldari, you can even have t2 launchers. Or, fly HACS if you he/she wants too. Yeah, because everybody in this whole game who has 10M SPs did focus solely those on PvP-related skills, right? I mean, who needs learning skills, or some to make some ISK or have fun in some other venue than mere low-level PvP?snicker Too bad 10M SPs in total prolly means half of them in not combat-related skills. Sure, still no point I guess, as tons of people fly HACs even with a mere 5M SPs... And prolly got the ISK to finance that by... miraculously appearing ISK in their wallet from immensely rich characters in EVE-O with no attachment to any out-of-game organizations, right...
Franga NQX Innovations	Posted - 2008.05.26 11:27:00 - [77] Should this be in the CAOD forums? I mean, the amount of flaming and indignant righteousness here is definitely of CAOD proportions. Also, moar dev-blogs. Originally by: Rachel Vend ... with 100% reliability in most cases ...
Cpt Branko Surge. NIght's Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.26 11:36:00 - [78] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/05/2008 11:37:00 Originally by: Dlardrageth Originally by: Setana Manoro [...]Everyone understands that what ships they fly and how well they do it is more important than SP, but at 10m SP you can fly the BS of your race and in the case of caldari - and they are mostly caldari, you can even have t2 launchers. Or, fly HACS if you he/she wants too. Yeah, because everybody in this whole game who has 10M SPs did focus solely those on PvP-related skills, right? I mean, who needs learning skills, or some to make some ISK or have fun in some other venue than mere low-level PvP?snicker Too bad 10M SPs in total prolly means half of them in not combat-related skills. Sure, still no point I guess, as tons of people fly HACs even with a mere 5M SPs... And prolly got the ISK to finance that by... miraculously appearing ISK in their wallet from immensely rich characters in EVE-O with no attachment to any out-of-game organizations, right... You're foaming at the mouth Guess what. If you've got 10M SP, most people who do missions and stuff will have 6-7M combat SP even if they did try mining or somesuch. Which translates to flying a BC decently well. I started pirating full time with less. Fact of the matter is, the 'omg, E-Uni can only fly frigs/cruisers' is a flat out lie. Saying 'oh, but our combat SP is low, we have learning skills' is just saying you suck at PvP. I mean, next you'll tell us you yourself have 3M SP even though you've been posting under the E-UNI banner for a while. What, you refuse to train skills out of solidarity with the noobs? Stop using the SP excuse. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Dlardrageth Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 11:50:00 - [79] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/05/2008 11:38:01 Originally by: Dlardrageth Originally by: Setana Manoro [...]Everyone understands that what ships they fly and how well they do it is more important than SP, but at 10m SP you can fly the BS of your race and in the case of caldari - and they are mostly caldari, you can even have t2 launchers. Or, fly HACS if you he/she wants too. Yeah, because everybody in this whole game who has 10M SPs did focus solely those on PvP-related skills, right? I mean, who needs learning skills, or some to make some ISK or have fun in some other venue than mere low-level PvP?snicker Too bad 10M SPs in total prolly means half of them in not combat-related skills. Sure, still no point I guess, as tons of people fly HACs even with a mere 5M SPs... And prolly got the ISK to finance that by... miraculously appearing ISK in their wallet from immensely rich characters in EVE-O with no attachment to any out-of-game organizations, right... You're foaming at the mouth Guess what. If you've got 10M SP, most people who do missions and stuff will have 6-7M combat SP even if they did try mining or somesuch. Which translates to flying a BC decently well. I started pirating full time with less. 1/10 You failed at reading what was quoted and referred to. Nice try, but referral was clearly to battleships and HACs. Try harder. Fail. Fact of the matter is, the 'omg, E-Uni can only fly frigs/cruisers' is a flat out lie. Saying 'oh, but our combat SP is low, we have learning skills' is just a excuse for sucking at PvP (particularly in light of the 5v3 statement). I mean, next you'll tell us you yourself have 3M SP even though you've been posting under the E-UNI banner for a while. What, you refuse to train skills out of solidarity with the noobs? 3/10 Nice trying to put some words into my mouth. Still not really satisfying as you missed the original point on the "5 vs. 3" example. As it originated in a "5 Tech-1 gank cruisers vs. 3 HACs" example. Utter fail. Stop using the SP excuse. I don't "use" the "SP excuse" whatever that is supposed to be. I just happen to know a bit more about what many of our Corp members have trained up and what not. It's not like the majority of us is flying around Tama and dabbling at pirating, you know? Amazing how many people seem to know exactly what Uni is teaching, to whom and in what manner. Less amazing they got those "facts" out of the "Gallente National Enquirer" obviously...
Captain Hakon Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 12:12:00 - [80] One thing which is continually forgotten is the fact that the majority of the Uni players are not PvP oriented. That is just the way it is. I did not start out to do PvP, I was getting into mining, but there is mostly only shooting going on so that is what influenced my Eve activity. Eve Uni does not exist to give other entities a good time with "good fights". The goal is to end wars ASAP while denying "fun" to whomever is the enemy of the week. This kind of victory is all that truly counts for us. You see, what compounds the (blobbing) issue is that a fleet can be a mixed bag of people interested in PvP, bored industrialists, miners, traders, etc. This entire dynamic is thrust into a situation where extreme teamwork would be ideal, but hardly gets to that level due to various levels of discipline and prior training. I have often heard our instructors mention that it is like trying to herd cats. I have seen the hilarity of students simply flying away from fleet, entirely unaware of their environment, or even that we were trying to do something together! Much yelling and sometimes shooting in the face is required to regain that attention! So please do take this into consideration before you judge us as some kind of PvP organization which we certainly are not. They most certainly do the best they can and have referred dedicated PvP students to advanced learning institutions such as Agony unleashed (I will be heading there in future) and even dedicated pirate groups! They also have specialized group training to cater to more dedicated students in various disciplines, whether that be PvP, mining, trading, etc. This is where they can get that valuable experience with small gang PvP in low sec and the like. The Uni are quite egalitarian and have also pulled in some excellent guest instructors. There are a great many people who have an opinion on the Uni and at the same time are very experienced players. You are the ones who could impact training at the Uni if you cared so much about the tactical acumen of the next generation of pod pilots. I would challenge you to do something beyond throwing mud from the sidelines and try to make a difference. Be an example, such as the excellent instructors who devote so much personal time to the Uni. Even though most instructors have other accounts/char's in large alliances here and there, they still find the time to pull away from their busy action to do what they can for the students even when times are tough at the Uni. So try out teaching, you might find you will like the idea of securing a future for the game in general instead of laming the noobs into a frustrated corner where they feel (before their time) that this game is not for them. I passed on this game four years ago thinking it was boring and the people here are simply pretentious, arrogant turd chewers...and I was right...about people who are ignorant. People who are very short sighted are missing the forrest for the tree's. Grief all noobs and the game which is your pleasure today will be your memory tomorrow. I am glad to have found such a helpful organization, they gave me the information I needed to truly realize that I quite enjoy the game. Now I can't think of a better thing to do than shoot a lamer has been right in the face. This post reflects my opinions alone and in no way reflects the views of my corporation and alliance "Tell the Spartans, stranger passing by, that here obedient to their laws we lie".

Taua Roqa Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 12:16:00 - [81] Originally by: Captain Hakon One thing which is continually forgotten is the fact that the majority of the Uni players are not PvP oriented. That is just the way it is. I did not start out to do PvP, I was getting into mining, but there is mostly only shooting going on so that is what influenced my Eve activity. Eve Uni does not exist to give other entities a good time with "good fights". The goal is to end wars ASAP while denying "fun" to whomever is the enemy of the week. This kind of victory is all that truly counts for us. You see, what compounds the (blobbing) issue is that a fleet can be a mixed bag of people interested in PvP, bored industrialists, miners, traders, etc. This entire dynamic is thrust into a situation where extreme teamwork would be ideal, but hardly gets to that level due to various levels of discipline and prior training. I have often heard our instructors mention that it is like trying to herd cats. I have seen the hilarity of students simply flying away from fleet, entirely unaware of their environment, or even that we were trying to do something together! Much yelling and sometimes shooting in the face is required to regain that attention! So please do take this into consideration before you judge us as some kind of PvP organization which we certainly are not. They most certainly do the best they can and have referred dedicated PvP students to advanced learning institutions such as Agony unleashed (I will be heading there in future) and even dedicated pirate groups! They also have specialized group training to cater to more dedicated students in various disciplines, whether that be PvP, mining, trading, etc. This is where they can get that valuable experience with small gang PvP in low sec and the like. The Uni are quite egalitarian and have also pulled in some excellent guest instructors. There are a great many people who have an opinion on the Uni and at the same time are very experienced players. You are the ones who could impact training at the Uni if you cared so much about the tactical acumen of the next generation of pod pilots. I would challenge you to do something beyond throwing mud from the sidelines and try to make a difference. Be an example, such as the excellent instructors who devote so much personal time to the Uni. Even though most instructors have other accounts/char's in large alliances here and there, they still find the time to pull away from their busy action to do what they can for the students even when times are tough at the Uni. So try out teaching, you might find you will like the idea of securing a future for the game in general instead of laming the noobs into a frustrated corner where they feel (before their time) that this game is not for them. I passed on this game four years ago thinking it was boring and the people here are simply pretentious, arrogant turd chewers...and I was right...about people who are ignorant. People who are very short sighted are missing the forrest for the tree's. Grief all noobs and the game which is your pleasure today will be your memory tomorrow. I am glad to have found such a helpful organization, they gave me the information I needed to truly realize that I quite enjoy the game. Now I can't think of a better thing to do than shoot a lamer has been right in the face. This post reflects my opinions alone and in no way reflects the views of my corporation and alliance actually your wrong. POTBS, for example, is a glowing example that griefing all the newbs leads to a glowing, active community and a game with a bright future. OH WAIT!!!!! -------------------------------------------- [IMAGE REMOVED] Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. My I/Q Ration!!!11
Kransthow Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.05.26 12:39:00 - [82] woa, I think I left the turning to the toilets a little late
Asuri Kinnes Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 15:07:00 - [83] Originally by: Ki An Edited by: Ki An on 25/05/2008 11:31:32 Yes, any of those corps are much better at teaching PvP than you are. However, new players are told to apply to Eve University and learn about the game. Your failure to provide adequate PvP teaching leads to a state where the community should stop sending new players to you. I am just pointing this out. I would say, try to teach your students something of value instead of sitting in blobs camping gates. Take them out in small gangs. Teach them the merits of solo pvp. Try to be a positive force for PvP in Eve. If you don't enjoy pvp, tell this to your students so that they might chose a different benefactor. The gist of the problem is that Eve University isn't all it's cranked up to be. It used to be a good way for newbies to learn the game, but now you teach blobbing and exploitation of game mechanics. I don't know what has changed, but the direction that Eve University has taken is grounds for lobbying for a stop of the community support to you. I realise you don't want to accept this, but that's the way I feel. Where to start? Uni does not teach "blob" tactics - it IS how they fight. They fight that way because there are about 20 people, from different time zones, with different specialties that are leading the Uni at any one time. Players who teach mining, production, research, exploration and pvp. So in actuality there are maybe 4 or 5 Directors/Instructors on, a few higher SP players and the VAST majority of the people on (during peacetime) are us n00bs. Noobs with less than 3 million sp. So what do we do? We grab our T1 Frigs/Dessies and Cruisers.... Secondly, rules within the UNI state that you don't fly what you can't replace, or fit properly. If your going to fly BC's in combat, you have to be able to replace them. So that effectively puts most of us in frigates, destroyers and cruisers. Maybe Iuris Proeliator's example of earlier wasn't a good one to use. How about 4 3M sp students, and an 8M sp "experienced" player leading... So - you have maybe 5 instructors / teachers doing PVP for the whole UNI. During peacetime we have anywhere up to 1000 new players in the Uni. We would need 80 to 100 "leaders" to take out gangs of 10... What the Uni does teach is Racial Ships/Fittings, and basic tactics/fleet discipline. /shrug Why people come here and blast us, without ever volunteering THEIR time to come grab 9 other people (with VERY little clue) and run them out to Low-Sec is beyond me... ALSO (and very related) is the fact that UNI does not just run out to Low-sec/no-sec and blast everyone they see. Because of the very real Meta-gaming problems - the Uni maintains an Open NAP/NRDS policy... Thirdly - I tried this game 2 years ago. Quit. Learning curve sucked. What people seem to forget (or ignore) is that Eve Uni IS those 20 or so people that teach THE BASICS, then turn people loose to do as they will. This results in more people actually playing the game... I don't understand why thats a bad thing. You say "teach something of value" - when obviously you mean "nothing besides small unit pvp"... Well, there is far more to the game than PvP. /shrug I'm not going to change anyones mind - especially someone who has such a chip on their shoulder.... Tell you what Ki An - why don't YOU create a "school", and run it for four years, and show us how its done? AK Honor is that which you do when no one else is looking.
Cpt Branko Surge. NIght's Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.26 15:29:00 - [84] Originally by: Asuri Kinnes Tell you what Ki An - why don't YOU create a "school", and run it for four years, and show us how its done? By metagaming, of course. As you say, 'E-UNI' doesn't just go out to low-sec/whatever to blast everyone, but they do like to lag out systems when their organized fleets do roll through low-sec. And there's wrecks left afterwards. So At any rate, with 1000 players and all that, I really don't see the need to metagame in the manner you apparently are. E-UNI seems less and less like a university and more and more like just another high-sec alliance. When I started playing, everyone did refer nubbins to E-UNI; I don't think I could do that anymore with a clear conscience really. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cpt Branko Surge. NIght's Dawn	Posted - 2008.05.26 15:40:00 - [85] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/05/2008 15:40:10 Originally by: Dlardrageth Originally by: Cpt Branko You're foaming at the mouth Guess what. If you've got 10M SP, most people who do missions and stuff will have 6-7M combat SP even if they did try mining or somesuch. Which translates to flying a BC decently well. I started pirating full time with less. 1/10 You failed at reading what was quoted and referred to. Nice try, but referral was clearly to battleships and HACs. Try harder. Fail. (a) You fail to read. (b) When I say that at 10M SP even with a substantial amount of non-combat skills trained you can fly a BC well, it's precisely what I mean. Everyone worth their salt will tell you that a BC fleet with a advantage in numbers can fight people in HACs/BS (in fact, your Tier 2 BC will preety much kill your non-nano HACs outright and have a shot at catching nano-HACs and killing them). When you have a number of players which can fly BCs competently, you have a number of players which can fight with the best of them. The only thing holding people back is lack of self-confidence and hands-on experience (which is why people are always advised to start small to get the ropes before jumping in the more expensive ships). Hell, you have people killing HACs in cruisers There's nothing terrifying about facing HACs and battleships (which are more worrisome tbh, I don't understand the fascination with HACs). I fully understand that you want to provide your opponents with a boring experience trying to fight you, which is a valid tactic (although not very good from a learning perspective but oh well), but metagaming to deter wardecs is sinking very low really. I mean, you could as well teach your students to logoffski, but you can't really expect people to like it, or to have any respect left for E-UNI. It's not banned. Why not start? Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
TheG2	Posted - 2008.05.26 15:54:00 - [86] 10mil SP? Thats perfect for Ewar, those HAC's wouldn't even be able to lock.
X3k5 Brotherhood of the Phoenix Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.05.26 16:55:00 - [87] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/05/2008 15:40:10 (b) When I say that at 10M SP even with a substantial amount of non-combat skills trained you can fly a BC well, it's precisely what I mean. Everyone worth their salt will tell you that a BC fleet with a advantage in numbers can fight people in HACs/BS (in fact, your Tier 2 BC will preety much kill your non-nano HACs outright and have a shot at catching nano-HACs and killing them). When you have a number of players which can fly BCs competently, you have a number of players which can fight with the best of them. The only thing holding people back is lack of self-confidence and hands-on experience (which is why people are always advised to start small to get the ropes before jumping in the more expensive ships). Hell, you have people killing HACs in cruisers There's nothing terrifying about facing HACs and battleships (which are more worrisome tbh, I don't understand the fascination with HACs). I fully understand that you want to provide your opponents with a boring experience trying to fight you, which is a valid tactic (although not very good from a learning perspective but oh well), but metagaming to deter wardecs is sinking very low really. I mean, you could as well teach your students to logoffski, but you can't really expect people to like it, or to have any respect left for E-UNI. It's not banned. Why not start? I think you misunderstand Mr Branko. The problem isnt SP. Hell, even 3M SP players can fly BS if they trained in the right direction. The problem is ISK. 3M players arent advanced in the game enough to make that kinda ISK. A month to 3 months old chars cannot afford to lose a BS or even a BC and replace it. Therefore they cant afford to fly them in war. And the uni itself doesnt have the kind of resources to put everyone in BCs. So they just let them fly what they can afford to lose and replace. If they had anyother choice, I would be acting the same way you are as I imagine its boring for both parties and games are supposed to be fun. But that's all they can do to fight wars on their terms, blob.
Esmenet	Posted - 2008.05.26 18:14:00 - [88] You should rename this thread to something like: "Uni makes a fool of themselves and ruins the last remains of their reputation".
The RedPlague Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.05.26 18:19:00 - [89] Originally by: Esmenet You should rename this thread to something like: "Uni makes a fool of themselves and ruins the last remains of their reputation". FINALLY some intelligence on this thread ....
Irdalth Delrar Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 18:26:00 - [90] I should know better then to post, however... A lot of people have ideas, whether good or bad, I will not judge, on how the Uni should teach. I'm sure the directors would welcome anyone who wants to give their time to teach classes to contact them about doing so. I think people see one side of the Uni and judge based on it, but I could be wrong. Instead, please do come out and show us, rather then ranting on a forum, on how it should be done. Irdalth Delrar Instructor Eve University <IVY>

Kelduum Revaan Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.05.26 18:46:00 - [91] sigh It's nice to see that people read things properly, and gather all the information available, so they can make accurate comments. To reiterate, for those of you who don't have the full information: I took this action myself, with no prior knowledge by the other directors of members. This is not E-UNI or Ivy League, this is me, and only me, Kelduum Revaan, messing with the Privateers in a way I find amusing. This is not Eve University. This is not Ivy League. It is me, however I would appreciate it if you could reserve judgement until you know the full facts. Furthermore, I am currently not and have not been, the diplomatic director for over three weeks. Please see my employment history in-game for details and confirmation. I would suggest any discussion regarding this is kept somewhat on topic, or left until later - I'm sure there will be a decision from CCP and/or the GMs regarding this soon, and this is obviously a heated topic. Finally, to all E-UNI personnel: No more posting now - you all have more important things to do! -- Kelduum Revaan Not The Diplomatic Director Eve University <IVY> _____

CCP Mitnal C C P	Posted - 2008.05.26 18:53:00 - [92] Locked This is a duplicate thread to the one in CAOD. Please keep religious references out of threads where they don't belong. Please note that a bug hunter (BH) is not part of CCP but ISD, a volunteer service overseen by CCP staff. The only official ruling on something like this will come from a lead GM. Mitnal Community Representative CCP Games, EVE Online Email / Netfang



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