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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.09 16:06:00 -
[1]
 Originally by: Fifth Horseman
Yeah, because god forbid that CCP ever be expected to supply anything they promised or implied, rather than keep pumping the server full of irrelevant nonsense like ambulation or to a lesser extent FW.
Uhmm CCP never promised or implied that they would *fix* Jita.
Nice try at a troll though.
If they worked only on "fixing" Jita, you would be right back here complaining that they aren't adding any new content or features.
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.09 16:20:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Many solutions for the Jita problem have been proposed. One is to simply make it possible to see market prices globally and not per region. That way more people will go the closest place with a good price and not simply assume that they will find everything at a good price in Jita (esp. when they see from far that Jita is too expensive).
This has to be in-game, eve-central.com is too cumbersome.
Yeah uhh no. The database load on that would be insane. You think lag is bad now? Hah.
Restricting market data by region restricts the return dataset to a manageble amount of rows. If you did that same query on a universe level ... man it would be lag tastic.
Sorry but that solution will *not* work.
Pro tip: Things are never "that simple". If they were ... CCP probably would have implemented it. 
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.09 16:26:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Tarminic
EDIT: Beaten by Kolwrath 
yeah but your explanation was better 
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.09 19:15:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Kolwrath on 09/06/2008 19:21:48
Originally by: Beltantis Torrence
I can only talk about what I can see (ie, the client side), along with some guesses at how they're running the backend. That disclaimer being said, Python is not a fast language. They're handling window management and object management in Python, which is ridiculously slow. Furthermore on Windows they're using CryptoAPI for encryption, which is pointless considering you can decompile the client if you wanted to get the secret key. Instead of having all that overhead they could just XOR the data against the username or a session token, which would be somewhere around 100x faster than what they're doing. Would be roughly as secure and they can reserve higher levels of encryption for the initial handshake. I also tend to think compression should be left for dial-up modems rather than the default option, as CPU resources are more limited than bandwidth in the general case - both server side and client side. This also avoids some overhead associated with interop between Python and ZLib/CryptoAPI, currently these libs are being marshaled to every time a network frame gets processed.
It's not a client side problem. Its a database backend problem. The lag in Jita is caused by the massive amounts of database transactions that occur there.
Oh and "roughly as secure" is hillariously bad. Sorry but "roughly" is not a word you can use when dealing with enterprise level applications and thier security.
Making tradoffs in security for the sake of performance is just asking for trouble, and well just a plain bad design decision.
(Remind me to never, ever, ever, hire you for a programming position)
Originally by: Beltantis Torrence
<snip>
To allow for better caching of market data, they should institute a lag of say 5 minutes between when you sell something at a specified price and it gets listed on the market. This would allow them to cache queries in memory and only have to repopulate those buffers at predetermined intervals. From what I can tell it handles that on demand right now, which means you're probably hitting disk every time you run a query.
How would a lag of 5 minutes solve anything? You would end up with huge database race conditions that you would have to deal with. Your just trying to force the data to cache. The market in Jita would get all messed up after this. Traders will no longer have a eye on the "pulse" of the market since everything would be 5 minutes behind. They wont be able to make good market price decisions due to the lag. They would just move to Perimieter and it will all start over. You are failing to see the human aspect of the problem.
I would like to reiterate: Jita is a database problem ... not client side.
You seem to be focusing on your strengths (python / etc) but you fail to realize that its the DB that is the issue. They have a RAMSAM for a reason ... to maximize the database IO. Even with that ... they still have these lags.
I see what you are trying to go for, but your suggestions, IMHO, would at most improve the client applications speed ... but nothing else. The client will still have to wait for data from the server, which in turn needs the information from the database.
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.09 22:01:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Kolwrath on 09/06/2008 22:05:17
Originally by: Beltantis Torrence
Maybe I should have dumbed it down more so you would understand what I'm saying. Next time I'll use a color based system.
Edited to be less insulting.
Wow you sure are a jerk. Shesh.
if I missed your point, well I missed your point.
You don't have to be a complete ass about it.
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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