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TruthMachine
Justice to Scammers
   |
Posted - 2008.07.03 15:06:00 -
[1]
I am a former member of ka-tet, for reasons that will soon become obvious I am forced to convey this message to you via an alt.
A couple of weeks ago several TE-KA alliance (Ka-Tet's renter alliance) were scammed out of an unknown amount of isk, the official story goes as follows.
Jonny 101, a Cruel Intentions Diplomat reached agreement with Raven Kahn, then leader of Ka-tet to help their renters, now having to move from the drone regions due to RA aggression, get new space to ply their trades in.
However, about a week after this begins, Jonny 101 is revealed as a scammer and a general warning is issued not to deal with him, further debate on this incident is quelled and the incident is played down by the leadership.
However, given what I had already learned about KA-TET and especially Raven Kahn I decided to look in to it more closely.
First off, Raven Kahn brokered an agreement with what appears at first glance to be a respectable 0.0 diplomat, anyone with a clue will know this is wrong.
If you do a few eve-searches on the character "Jonny 101" you will soon discover that he is the alt of "Kublai" one of the most wanted players in eve, a KNOWN scammer and pirate, Kublai has proven connections to everything from contract scams for a few hundred million isk to a Hulk BPO theft, it took me ten minutes on eve-search, this establishes the following, if Raven Kahn was acting in good faith, he was at best a completely incompetent fool.
However, since the first TE-KA corporation was scammed and the last (known) case there were FIVE DAYS.
For five days Kublai was scamming one TE-KA corporation after the other using Raven Kahn as a voucher, he convinced people to pay up to a months rent up front (never below the billion) and offered to help move corporations assets to fountain, after having tooted his connection to Raven Kahn, who had told these CEO's to message jonny (jonny didn't actually contact anyone on his own, Raven Kahn was spamming mails etc for people to get in touch with him), some corporations contracted nearly EVERY asset they had to Kublai, yes that's right, his famous scammer main, and yet while te-ka corporations are now getting scammed left and right Raven Kahn does nothing, in fact a few days into the scam Raven Kahn begins advertising that Jonny/Kublai is selling high end moons in fountain for a few billion a pop, far less than market value.
This is another giant question mark, what kind of alliance SELLS their high end moons for a mere months income on them?
I'm not sure how much isk and assets are lost over this, I spoke to some who said their corporations lost 1-3 bill, not much in the grand scheme of things but these were small corporations populated mainly by new players just trying to catch a break in eve.
Funny enough this all happens just before Ka-Tet officially disbands and Raven Kahn leaves the alliance, nice timing for getting scammed eh Raven?
It is no secret to those in TE-KA or KA-TET that Raven Kahn and other alliance leaders have been leeching the alliance dry for some time, and with the alliance disbanding a great deal of assets seems to mysteriously have "vanished".
With leaders like these, who the hell is suprised the alliance died?
I am no longer in ka-tet, I don't want to get near Raven Kahn or any of the former leaders, this just once again goes to show that the big boys in eve abuse the small and enslave newbies in 0.0 it's disgusting.
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Dihania
Gallente
Mucho Dolor
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:12:00 -
[2]
roger 10.4
.
EVE: "The Hand-holding Age".
I need isk!Accepting donations.
Renting sig space.Taking various jobs. |
Sinc
Knights of Chaos
Chaos Incarnate.
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:13:00 -
[3]
welcome to eve 
---------------------------
.:Sinc:. |
Kyley
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:15:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Kyley on 03/07/2008 15:14:51
.
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General StarScream
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:15:00 -
[5]
Hey its your own falt, i told you this, when that idiot told everyone i was a corp scammer, wich i am not, and they kicked me out, and trapped my assets and wasted my time, for tottal bs, and blamed me for shit. i said i was gona destory you, and make you cry.
NOw HAHA BURN. Next time you mess with someone make sure it aint me.
Please resize signature to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Ju Vark
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:15:00 -
[6]
Humm, Strange that I don't remember any of that.
Ka-Tet failed because it was weak and we were rebuilding. Its just the Russians being the untrustworthy people they are got greedy and wanted the moons. It also sets them up with good staging grounds for attacking Mostly Harmless.
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Dominixa
Foundation
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:39:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Ju Vark
Humm, Strange that I don't remember any of that.
Ka-Tet failed because it was weak and we were rebuilding. Its just the Russians being the untrustworthy people they are got greedy and wanted the moons. It also sets them up with good staging grounds for attacking Mostly Harmless.
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
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Rick Rothsar
Ghosts of Ragnarok
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:41:00 -
[8]
thread delivers
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Ayeson
Bears Inc
Violent-Tendencies
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:44:00 -
[9]
where is THE INTERNET, this could get amusing...
Bears is Recruiting? |
Ju Vark
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Posted - 2008.07.03 15:50:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Dominixa
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Well they have failed to assist their current allies who were attack so I don't think there will be much of a reaction.
They will gladly call on the Northern coalition when their space is threatened though. (Anyone notice that?)
What you also have to remember is the Northern Coalition are surrounded from each side now. RA on the left, Goons in Center and XDeath and Solar on right.
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mazzilliu
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.03 16:18:00 -
[11]
check out this funny screenshot
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0807/temp.jpg
the second most incriminating thing about it is the color scheme, sweet jesus 
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Ripcha Headov
Redeye Inc.
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Posted - 2008.07.03 16:19:00 -
[12]
LOL. its always fun to hear about the exploits of the genius who is kublai/jonny 101 
Keep up the good work jonny!
o7 until i fly with you again under the banner of a-war 
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lost packet
Nightmare Inc.
CODE RED ALLIANCE
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Posted - 2008.07.03 16:22:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Ayeson
where is THE INTERNET, this could get amusing...
ssshhhhh... you'll wake them up.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.07.03 16:24:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Dominixa
Originally by: Ju Vark
Humm, Strange that I don't remember any of that.
Ka-Tet failed because it was weak and we were rebuilding. Its just the Russians being the untrustworthy people they are got greedy and wanted the moons. It also sets them up with good staging grounds for attacking Mostly Harmless.
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Calling it here: RZR will defend someone else's moons with FULL NNC MIGHT.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Fitz VonHeise
The New Order.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:06:00 -
[15]
I knew one day I would be able to add Kublai to my Thieves list below. 
Services I Provide:
Caldari Factional Standing Increase ò Alliance Creation ò The Thieves Of EvE ò My Links
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kublai
Caldari
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.07.03 17:11:00 -
[16]
Sigh, newbies.
I wasn't going to post anything this but, since it's out here I might as well give the story.
The profits aren't anywhere near post worthy, but if I do say so myself, the actual story behind it isn't too bad and sure gave a few of my friends a little smile, so gather round children, auntie Kublai has a story.
It all began one day when I was bored, I hadn't really done any gigs for a while so I thought to myself, let's try something new.
I pondered a bit and in the end I popped by caod and the alliance map and made a little list of what alliances were dying at the moment, KA-TET stuck out as the perfect mark, losing their space out of stupidity and greed is the perfect combiniation, the best place to find your sucker.
I contacted Raven Kahn as the OP says, I did the old charm thing one thing leads to another when I felt I had gotten some trust I weer things over to doing a little job together, and you're right, you would have to be a blithering idiot not to know i'm a scammer, in fact it was my profitable track record as a scammer that got him hooked in the first place (the hulk bpo story is a magnet to greedy idiots).
For a cut of the proceeds raven would play the poor innocent victim, getting played by a seemingly legitimate space holding diplomat.
With Raven's voucher it was pretty simple, he got people to contact me and supplied me with a list of names I could approach myself, the scam wasn't monumental or anything, I scammed a few corporations for a few billion isk each, at least one of them claimed they would have to disband, one month rent up front, i'll help haul your stuff etc using raven to calm their fears of getting scammed they were readily contracting their stuff and sending their isk my way.
I guess in total I took TE-KA for 6.5b, I have no doubt I could have taken more but...well to be honest i'm lazy and i'm not greedy, by the end it was becoming a full time job keeping Raven from being found out, and if people started talking about the scam in TE-KA/KA-TET according to the plan Raven would blow the whistle and we'd make it look like he was the hero of the day for stopping me, while I sendt 50% to an alt of his.
Now as you may have guessed, Raven never got his cut, I never intended to pay him jack.
If you're ready to sell out your own for so little you're of no future value to me, so theres no real need to treat you right is there.
I wasn't planning on outing you like this but, given the OP I might as well just tell you what really happened.
Speaking of the OP, welcome to eve, blizzard -> that way, see we have a food chain in this game, it's not about SP or age, it's about something you don't seem to get, enjoy the bottom of the food chain, you'll be staying there.
I don't for a second believe I had any impact on KA-TET's death, as I said I choose them because they were dying, and we all know alliance ceo's can get tempted to get sticky fingers around those times 
As for you General Starscream, in my opinion you're a loud mouth amature and you certainly had -nothing- to do with this scam, so stop mouthing off.
To summarize: I scammed some noobs for enough isk to keep me in ships for a little while forward, it was funny, ka-tet leadership are greedy and exploit their members and renters (wow, thats a shock for a two bit 0.0 alliance) and alt posters are wimps.
Enjoy the show and remember to invest in my upcoming IPO!
This has been a "League of Legitimate Nigerian Businessmen" press release, now with 10% more democracy!
Methods of Torture - Latrocinium |
kublai
Caldari
Art of War
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:11:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Fitz VonHeise
I knew one day I would be able to add Kublai to my Thieves list below.
Services I Provide:
Caldari Factional Standing Increase ò Alliance Creation ò The Thieves Of EvE ò My Links
Dude didn't I post in your thread -telling- you to add me when you made it?  damn efficient aren't we.
Methods of Torture - Latrocinium |
Viqtoria
Caldari
Groping Hand Social Club
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:15:00 -
[18]
i think the op is kublai's alt tbhtbhtbh
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Scatim Helicon
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:18:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Scatim Helicon on 03/07/2008 17:20:03
Originally by: Dominixa
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Any time now they're coming to save you.
Edit: Oh wait no they're not.
-----------
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kublai
Caldari
Art of War
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:19:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Originally by: Dominixa
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Any time now they're coming to save you.
I'm selling goon-repellant and invasion insurance btw, just hit me up in game.
Methods of Torture - Latrocinium |
Scatim Helicon
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:19:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Scatim Helicon on 03/07/2008 17:19:44
lol reply is not edit
-----------
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Bladen Kerst
Caldari
State Protectorate
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:35:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Bladen Kerst on 03/07/2008 17:35:57
o_O scammer who is a fame-whor*.
Now I have seen it all
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Fitz VonHeise
The New Order.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 17:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: kublai
Dude didn't I post in your thread -telling- you to add me when you made it? damn efficient aren't we.
Yes you did... but I couldn't find any real proof.
So... thanks!
(If anyone knows of her other alts please let me know)
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Spacer X
Xpress Yourself
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Posted - 2008.07.03 18:13:00 -
[24]
If you wish to speak with Jonny 101, goto Eve University's pub chat and you'll find him there talking himself up 23/7. Nice patron you allow in your chat eve uni.
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King Leopold
Congo Free State
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Posted - 2008.07.03 18:24:00 -
[25]
Brilliant...
can u help me get some more Minmatar slaves for my rubber plantation?
--
Read my Blog - Congo Free State
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Viqtoria
Caldari
Groping Hand Social Club
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 18:24:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Spacer X
If you wish to speak with Jonny 101, goto Eve University's pub chat and you'll find him there talking himself up 23/7. Nice patron you allow in your chat eve uni.
this is true. god knows why they spend all their time there threatening to have anyone who disagrees with them griefed from the game and being a general arse 
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Funkcikle
Gallente
MicroFunks
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 18:29:00 -
[27]
kublai Sir, u r made exclusivly of w1n
/me Doffs cap, " well played, well played indeed"
@ te-ka-ta-tit or whatever, you really only have urselves 2 blame here
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Princess Jodi
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.03 18:58:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Princess Jodi on 03/07/2008 19:12:24
Originally by: Ju Vark
Originally by: Dominixa
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Well they have failed to assist their current allies who were attack so I don't think there will be much of a reaction.
They will gladly call on the Northern coalition when their space is threatened though. (Anyone notice that?)
What you also have to remember is the Northern Coalition are surrounded from each side now. RA on the left, Goons in Center and XDeath and Solar on right.
God...so much BS in only one post. Must be a new record. 
If you're referring to Smash and Roadkill as 'current allies' then you're sadly mistaken. They WOULD have been considered as allies if they helped in the South, but their perfomance was sporatic at best. They were 'friends' for quite some time, but 'current allies' is pushing way too far.
As far as 'being surrounded', well I guess you got that right. I guess our mistake was destroying Tri, Insurgency, Destiny and the other enemies we had and taking their space. Now there is nothing nearby that is hostile. Man, without you pointing it out I might have been led to believe that we achieved a great victory. Now that I see that taking another 3-4 regions was actually a trap.
Which leads me back to your first point: You seem to be implying that Goons and RA are going to attack the Northern Coalition. While certainly possible, it sure looks like the ones 'surrounded' are Bob, while those opposed to Bob now constitute 3/4 of the 0.0 map.
Edit: 'Friends', not 'Fiends'. lol...Freudian Slip? I donno.
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TornSoul
BIG
Libertas Fidelitas
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 19:03:00 -
[29]
Karma's a ***** huh Raven.
This post intended for a select audience.
They know who they are.
"Told you so"
BIG Lottery |
Pamangkin
Notneir Industry LLC
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 19:04:00 -
[30]
Originally by: mazzilliu
check out this funny screenshot
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0807/temp.jpg
the second most incriminating thing about it is the color scheme, sweet jesus
Is jonny 101 a girl? Just wondering.
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Severe Admin
Blind Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.03 19:25:00 -
[31]
prontifex, or THE INTERNET your needed in here guys 
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n00b alt3
THE INTERNET.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 19:44:00 -
[32]
Edited by: n00b alt3 on 03/07/2008 19:47:42
Originally by: Princess Jodi
Edited by: Princess Jodi on 03/07/2008 19:12:24
Originally by: Ju Vark
Originally by: Dominixa
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Well they have failed to assist their current allies who were attack so I don't think there will be much of a reaction.
They will gladly call on the Northern coalition when their space is threatened though. (Anyone notice that?)
What you also have to remember is the Northern Coalition are surrounded from each side now. RA on the left, Goons in Center and XDeath and Solar on right.
God...so much BS in only one post. Must be a new record.
If you're referring to Smash and Roadkill as 'current allies' then you're sadly mistaken. They WOULD have been considered as allies if they helped in the South, but their perfomance was sporatic at best. They were 'friends' for quite some time, but 'current allies' is pushing way too far.
As far as 'being surrounded', well I guess you got that right. I guess our mistake was destroying Tri, Insurgency, Destiny and the other enemies we had and taking their space. Now there is nothing nearby that is hostile. Man, without you pointing it out I might have been led to believe that we achieved a great victory. Now that I see that taking another 3-4 regions was actually a trap.
Which leads me back to your first point: You seem to be implying that Goons and RA are going to attack the Northern Coalition. While certainly possible, it sure looks like the ones 'surrounded' are Bob, while those opposed to Bob now constitute 3/4 of the 0.0 map.
Edit: 'Friends', not 'Fiends'. lol...Freudian Slip? I donno.
god forbid we come home to defend our and our allies space. I guess the right thing to do was let everyone just come in and take the place while we fought your war for you full time. Shit, you've been in a nc alliance for a handful of months and are on here talking shit.
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n00b alt3
THE INTERNET.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 19:45:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Severe Admin
prontifex, or THE INTERNET your needed in here guys
i've arrived and am at your service.
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dastommy79
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 19:58:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Princess Jodi
God...so much BS in only one post. Must be a new record.
If you're referring to Smash and Roadkill as 'current allies' then you're sadly mistaken. They WOULD have been considered as allies if they helped in the South, but their perfomance was sporatic at best. They were 'friends' for quite some time, but 'current allies' is pushing way too far.
As far as 'being surrounded', well I guess you got that right. I guess our mistake was destroying Tri, Insurgency, Destiny and the other enemies we had and taking their space. Now there is nothing nearby that is hostile. Man, without you pointing it out I might have been led to believe that we achieved a great victory. Now that I see that taking another 3-4 regions was actually a trap.
Which leads me back to your first point: You seem to be implying that Goons and RA are going to attack the Northern Coalition. While certainly possible, it sure looks like the ones 'surrounded' are Bob, while those opposed to Bob now constitute 3/4 of the 0.0 map.
Edit: 'Friends', not 'Fiends'. lol...Freudian Slip? I donno.
The NC is now pushed into a corner. Your pilots in Pure and IRON complain of RA's presence in Pure Blind. Solar Guys are postureing to take the whole of the drone regions. With them not being RA or RSF (lolz) they dont have to follow your treaties and naps. Goons have repeatedly stated they wish to shoot hydra,Pure and Mostly Harmless. There is no way militarily that the NC can fend off the eventual attack. You are out classed, out gunned and outnumbered. The moment that you fail to appease or fail to be needed by the RSF, you will be elimintated. The North has always been the weakest link in the Coalition and with no one wanting to contest bob, your allies are going to turn on you.
I really dont care though. Just gonna sit back and enjoy the lolz. Or for once you could do something for yourself and go on the offensive first while you still have a chance. We all know thats not gonna happen.
Atlas Fleet Admiral
Former SmashKill Coaliton Leader
Stop banning me please
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Dungar Loghoth
Caldari
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 20:06:00 -
[35]
Originally by: dastommy79
Just gonna sit back and enjoy the lolz. Or for once you could do something for yourself and go on the offensive first while you still have a chance. We all know thats not gonna happen.
Yep, just sit back in your station and watch it all unfold.
---
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n00b alt3
THE INTERNET.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 20:07:00 -
[36]
Originally by: dastommy79
Originally by: Princess Jodi
God...so much BS in only one post. Must be a new record.
If you're referring to Smash and Roadkill as 'current allies' then you're sadly mistaken. They WOULD have been considered as allies if they helped in the South, but their perfomance was sporatic at best. They were 'friends' for quite some time, but 'current allies' is pushing way too far.
As far as 'being surrounded', well I guess you got that right. I guess our mistake was destroying Tri, Insurgency, Destiny and the other enemies we had and taking their space. Now there is nothing nearby that is hostile. Man, without you pointing it out I might have been led to believe that we achieved a great victory. Now that I see that taking another 3-4 regions was actually a trap.
Which leads me back to your first point: You seem to be implying that Goons and RA are going to attack the Northern Coalition. While certainly possible, it sure looks like the ones 'surrounded' are Bob, while those opposed to Bob now constitute 3/4 of the 0.0 map.
Edit: 'Friends', not 'Fiends'. lol...Freudian Slip? I donno.
The NC is now pushed into a corner. Your pilots in Pure and IRON complain of RA's presence in Pure Blind. Solar Guys are postureing to take the whole of the drone regions. With them not being RA or RSF (lolz) they dont have to follow your treaties and naps. Goons have repeatedly stated they wish to shoot hydra,Pure and Mostly Harmless. There is no way militarily that the NC can fend off the eventual attack. You are out classed, out gunned and outnumbered. The moment that you fail to appease or fail to be needed by the RSF, you will be elimintated. The North has always been the weakest link in the Coalition and with no one wanting to contest bob, your allies are going to turn on you.
I really dont care though. Just gonna sit back and enjoy the lolz. Or for once you could do something for yourself and go on the offensive first while you still have a chance. We all know thats not gonna happen.
actually MAD PACT was the weakest link in the coalition (lol), then xdeathx/mactep's crew, then us, then the nc. The later three come last because they were too busy killing eachother to bother most of the time (or in xdeaths case, at all)
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n00b alt3
THE INTERNET.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 20:07:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
Originally by: dastommy79
Just gonna sit back and enjoy the lolz. Or for once you could do something for yourself and go on the offensive first while you still have a chance. We all know thats not gonna happen.
Yep, just sit back in your station and watch it all unfold.
we don't have stations, cause we are 3|1+3
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Ironnight
Caldari
x13
X13 Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 20:34:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Dominixa
Originally by: Ju Vark
Humm, Strange that I don't remember any of that.
Ka-Tet failed because it was weak and we were rebuilding. Its just the Russians being the untrustworthy people they are got greedy and wanted the moons. It also sets them up with good staging grounds for attacking Mostly Harmless.
I heard that attack was coming soon... Wonder how Razor and friends will respond.
Only on the forums, asking why they should care why RA attacks Mostly Harmless.
They're like 'oh shit son, its a trap ' *Doomsday* |
Oofig VanDoogan
Foundation
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 20:58:00 -
[39]
Princess Jodi:
a/s/l
----------------------------------------------
Full circle.
Sig nerfed due to is highly offensive content :( :( |
Master OlavPancrazio
Einherjar Rising
Cry Havoc.
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 21:08:00 -
[40]
I knew Kublai when he flew a little itty bitty crow.
Oh what days those were. Kublai now I'm poor, because I'm legit.
Gimme some isk friend! 
I wish I could say I taught you stuff, but nay I just helped you kill some crap in low-sec belts. Oh well..
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Idaeus
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 21:31:00 -
[41]
Originally by: dastommy79
Goons have repeatedly stated they wish to shoot hydra,Pure and Mostly Harmless.
We've also stated that we have no desire to screw around in Razor's backyard. In addition there is no desire to engage in POS warfare against Pure, Hydra or MH. There is no grudge there. They're just neutral, they get shot when we see them, just like we get shot when they see us.
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Torment
Caldari
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 21:50:00 -
[42]
Originally by: TornSoul
Karma's a ***** huh Raven.
This post intended for a select audience.
They know who they are.
"Told you so"
I think that select audience may have just took notice
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jpnwobigheadz
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 22:09:00 -
[43]
Edited by: jpnwobigheadz on 03/07/2008 22:16:08
well all im glad i jumped when i did :P
nice to see that some peeps will get there just desserts in the end
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Drakine
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
|
Posted - 2008.07.03 23:57:00 -
[44]
Originally by: jpnwobigheadz
Edited by: jpnwobigheadz on 03/07/2008 22:16:08
well all im glad i jumped when i did :P
nice to see that some peeps will get there just desserts in the end
we all know you stole mags isk. So you can't talk.
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the beyonder
|
Posted - 2008.07.04 01:48:00 -
[45]
well goon thinks i was katet CEO lol and they posted on their forums some pics of some family in north carolina lol totally wrong and the funniest part was the posting person looked like he was dragged out of the mountains of north carolina roflol i say all that to say hey cant believe anyone anywhere at anytime lol
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vall's assisstant
|
Posted - 2008.07.04 02:56:00 -
[46]
i have posted on these forums only once, but i am compelled to share what i heard and observed as all this has unfolded. i have only given 100% to ka-tet and te-ka as their diplo. i have not ever lied to the members of either alliance, as it is not may nature. i loved my people very much from the days trigger and folkodemon offered my corp opportunities in the wonderful free ratting and mining spaces and open markets of outer passage in february 2007 as a resident. when chib opened the doors again to join my corp to te-ka first to see if we acclamated, followed by our introduction into ka-tet, when we had a station ready to construct, my corp's loyalty continued to the end of ka-tet. the loyalty still is strong, as rampage eternal has always proved trustworthiest.
the first thing i want to say about tornsoul is that he is nothing but an alliance divider, who knows so little cause he rarely logs on and never contributes to a single alliance ops (only the market for his corp's profit). he gave away our oasa region that we paid 30 billion for to cdi members of carpe universitas, who also coerced our former members to join them, without the consent of the members who paid for legion of death for oasa. no guilt felt for your removal from our alliance, as i was there as the alliance struggled like hell, while u would not give it up. i have cared alot for big members tho. at least we sold their station for 15 million and got half of our isk back from the sale of the station. no wonder u are disgruntled enough to post here.
there is no karma here or ka-tet would be perfectly defended by all the allies including legion of death, who want the finest members in the drone region to survive. it is a shame that we have minimal experience with scammers in k space, so we have had an innocent sheltered life there. it was a very nice existence, while it lasted. sorry we could not provide enough isk to saisfy all the greed of our former members or allies. we were conveniently allowed to develop an empire market in the drone region, with plans long ago made to take it afterwards (bottom line/common knowledge).
goonswarm thinks ethereal dawn appears innocent, they should know ka-tets and te-kas. they were the greatest and loyalest i have ever known. as far as raven kahn, one of the things i admire is his sensability to try to make some isk to survive. i know he was told there was space available for te-kas, who we did not want to leave displaced. we tried to give them intel we got on irc/ed space for rent in oasa, as well as space in fountain that jonny 101 offered, even tho there was no way to confirm or deny that space or a moon was available. the moment he knew a scam had happened, he told me to post a message in the te-ka ceo chat channel to stop any further losses. we could have left everyone to fend for themselves, but they really attached to us and us to them. i had very sincere, personal convoes with irc/ed about the care of my former te-kas. the members were even warned about those evemails we were not sure about from Contraktor on behalf of Mr. Raine from cdi/carpe universitas.
additionally, there were were no great assets to have mysteriously disappeared, nor any fantastic isk to be made from te-kas. the alliance had a holding corp, in which me and my ceo were members to view the corp wallet. the te-ka members made small payments that rarely made the wallet greater than 2 billion, which was used to buy a rorqual to try to get pos fuels to the region and purchase alliance posses for the cyno route to empire. if any futher info is needed convo me personally, cause i have chatlogs and know what unfolded the entire time.
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vall's assisstant
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Posted - 2008.07.04 02:57:00 -
[47]
<---beyonderLover alt
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Raven Kahn
Rampage Eternal
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Posted - 2008.07.04 03:17:00 -
[48]
The following is the only thing i hafe to say on this subject:
I had no idea this was a scam, if i had known i would not have sent good folks into a scam, that is not me. I try to be stright up and honset with folks, that is me. We were being removed by Solar wing, Solar fleet, and Legion of xxdeathxx, our "allies" were staying "neutral", we had renters that are good people that needed a home, and i thought jonny 101 was legit, i guess i was stupid on that respect. Bottom line is i had people that needed a home and I thought I was dong a good thing by trying to get them a home all together. The time to do that was rapidly dimminishing and they needed somthing fast. The finders fee yes I did ask for a finders fee which i never expected to get, I just expected my folks that needed a home to get one. As for the moon price hike, if i can make someone a little bit more on the moon they are more likley to take more of the corps into there alliance as renters, well that was my thinking at least. Looking back the sad thing is I unknowing assisted someone in scamming good people, which really sucks. I am not a scammer and I simply can not condone someone scamming folks, even in a game it is in very very poor taste. Think of me how you will, I know the truth and the people that know me also know the truth. I know many folks dont like me for various reasons probly because you had tried to screw me or ka-tet or te-ka and I called you on it. It was put out to Te-Ka at the time it was found to be a scam for them to not mess with him any more. Scammers have never been tollerated in RAM nor in any Ka-Tet or Te-Ka corps.
Best wishes and have fun,
Raven Kahn
Eve Time Cards
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CEWL
Minmatar
Rampage Eternal
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Posted - 2008.07.04 05:06:00 -
[49]
BUMP
Support for Raven
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kahtankah
THE INTERNET.
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Posted - 2008.07.04 05:25:00 -
[50]
Edited by: kahtankah on 04/07/2008 05:27:00
posting in a thread full of words i didnt read
EDIT: i mean holy snickers bar thats alot of words about an irrelevent alliance
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Prontifex
THE INTERNET.
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Posted - 2008.07.04 05:30:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Raven Kahn
wall of text
Raven Kahn
Incoherent babbling will surely clear your name.
As for your 'neutral' allies, for one you weren't worth keeping and two you told them you would take the same stance if they were attacked. Do you believe in karma? 
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Chib
Storm Guard Elite
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Posted - 2008.07.04 05:57:00 -
[52]
the fact scamming is still tolerated is the most unfortunate aspect of this game, if people want to play the "its a vocation in RL" card then they should take into account when scammers are caught they goto jail, or at least punished by the authorities, CCP should look into this issue more i feel especially when its being bragged about creating troll threads
Ka-tet never EVER accepted scamming of anykind within its borders, even when ppl were caught buying cheap items on market to re-sell they were pulled up, reprimanded and told to pay back the difference which everyone did ...because there was respect amongst its members,
sadly time passed and ppl got greedy, the alliance split time after time over various issues and it was always on a backfoot, not really having the russian knack for "profit" it struggled on,
now when finally katets on the mend, beginning to fully extract the resources from its home and once again begins to flex its muscles the inevitable happened
theres a pattern to this behaviour, anyone old enough to remember when RAT was the shoot who we want arm of RA, members would switch back and forth because any standings rat had never really lasted long. solar fleet is just same, ra splitting and following multiple agendas while protecting its reputation, "feigning" we arent ra anymore therefore loyalties no longer apply doesnt cut it with me since the leadership were essentially ra leadership friends should go with the people and not with the brand imo
anyways
there will always be "he said, she said" whenever an entity falls in eve that comes with it,
Katet was a good alliance loyalty at its core, and was once the power in the drone regions, it built the first OP in drone space and has cemented something into eve forever,
although i feel katet could of done more to defend its home, (maybe that was due to the mindset that the alliance was still "recovering" rather than "reborn" ) i hope it continues on without disbanding maybe even reclaim its former home one day
if it does i will be there
---------------------------------------------
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HotSeat
Black Omega Security
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.04 06:06:00 -
[53]
If you ask Shamis, he will likely give you kublai's station in fountian 
Sov 4 is nothing compared to the Power of the Grief !! |
Scagga Laebetrovo
Ammatar Free Corps
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Posted - 2008.07.04 06:43:00 -
[54]
You didn't waste time writing this! Change the names a little and use this as a template for the next 0.0. alliance to fall...dibs on publishing rights?
San Matari Official forums |
MentaFox
The Chaotic Order
Void.
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Posted - 2008.07.04 09:19:00 -
[55]
n1 kublai
----------------------
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Thorton Araya
A.W.M
Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2008.07.04 11:23:00 -
[56]
It makes me sick to see beyonderLover argue about TornSoul and BIG. BeyonderLover you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. And then it is better to keep quiet...
Raven Kahn: Poor attempt to wash your hands clean. Epic fail. And now this is coming MASS's way. Poor Nuker.
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General Windypops
Skullduggery Inc
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Posted - 2008.07.04 11:27:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Raven Kahn
The following is the only thing i hafe to say on this subject:
I had no idea this was a scam, if i had known i would not have sent good folks into a scam, that is not me. I try to be stright up and honset with folks, that is me. We were being removed by Solar wing, Solar fleet, and Legion of xxdeathxx, our "allies" were staying "neutral", we had renters that are good people that needed a home, and i thought jonny 101 was legit, i guess i was stupid on that respect. Bottom line is i had people that needed a home and I thought I was dong a good thing by trying to get them a home all together. The time to do that was rapidly dimminishing and they needed somthing fast. The finders fee yes I did ask for a finders fee which i never expected to get, I just expected my folks that needed a home to get one. As for the moon price hike, if i can make someone a little bit more on the moon they are more likley to take more of the corps into there alliance as renters, well that was my thinking at least. Looking back the sad thing is I unknowing assisted someone in scamming good people, which really sucks. I am not a scammer and I simply can not condone someone scamming folks, even in a game it is in very very poor taste. Think of me how you will, I know the truth and the people that know me also know the truth. I know many folks dont like me for various reasons probly because you had tried to screw me or ka-tet or te-ka and I called you on it. It was put out to Te-Ka at the time it was found to be a scam for them to not mess with him any more. Scammers have never been tollerated in RAM nor in any Ka-Tet or Te-Ka corps.
Best wishes and have fun,
Raven Kahn
Whoah, man. You REALLY screwed up.
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MrBadidea
Spartan Industries
Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2008.07.04 11:49:00 -
[58]
Originally by: kublai
it was my profitable track record as a scammer that got him hooked in the first place (the hulk bpo story is a magnet to greedy idiots).
Scammer HIGH FIVE! o/
---
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kublai
Caldari
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.07.04 11:51:00 -
[59]
Originally by: MrBadidea
Originally by: kublai
it was my profitable track record as a scammer that got him hooked in the first place (the hulk bpo story is a magnet to greedy idiots).
Scammer HIGH FIVE! o/
\o
Methods of Torture - Latrocinium |
Catholic Priest
Caldari
A.W.M
Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2008.07.04 11:53:00 -
[60]
Raven Kahn is a liar and a thief. it's been spewing out on the forums for months now. stolen moons, stolen outposts, stolen Isk and anything else he soulc take he probably would. he was the main reason the last few old corps left ka-tet and he's the reason te-ka and lost thier stuff. it's a shame he took over the alliance. perhaps it would be in better condition at this point if it had been in someone elses. Have no doubt that raven's wallet is full and his stuff is safe.
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Caliburn
VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD
Sylph Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.04 12:48:00 -
[61]
When Ka-tet took over DMC's stations,VIV,ABH and CDI (maybe one or two others)moved there to defend the area and were promised control of at least two of the stations.
The corps in Oasa were given very little support from the rest of Ka-tet and were never given control of any stations.
After Raven took over Ka-tet the Oasa stations were controlled by Ka-tet Operations a 3 man corp made by an alt of Ravens (one of the stations was then called 'rich corp getting richer')
Strangely at this point the corps in Oasa decided to split from Ka-tet and form Carpe.
I suspect Ravens wallet is very fat indeed.
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Dkiler
Dkiller Delta Force Corp.
CORPVS DELICTI
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Posted - 2008.07.04 13:02:00 -
[62]
w00t raven a scammer 
well maybe u can pay me back my isk now raven
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Prof Patpending
Warp badgers with guns
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Posted - 2008.07.04 15:27:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Raven Kahn
The following is the only thing i hafe to say on this subject:
I had no idea this was a scam, if i had known i would not have sent good folks into a scam, that is not me. I try to be stright up and honset with folks, that is me. We were being removed by Solar wing, Solar fleet, and Legion of xxdeathxx, our "allies" were staying "neutral", we had renters that are good people that needed a home, and i thought jonny 101 was legit, i guess i was stupid on that respect. Bottom line is i had people that needed a home and I thought I was dong a good thing by trying to get them a home all together. The time to do that was rapidly dimminishing and they needed somthing fast. The finders fee yes I did ask for a finders fee which i never expected to get, I just expected my folks that needed a home to get one. As for the moon price hike, if i can make someone a little bit more on the moon they are more likley to take more of the corps into there alliance as renters, well that was my thinking at least. Looking back the sad thing is I unknowing assisted someone in scamming good people, which really sucks. I am not a scammer and I simply can not condone someone scamming folks, even in a game it is in very very poor taste. Think of me how you will, I know the truth and the people that know me also know the truth. I know many folks dont like me for various reasons probly because you had tried to screw me or ka-tet or te-ka and I called you on it. It was put out to Te-Ka at the time it was found to be a scam for them to not mess with him any more. Scammers have never been tollerated in RAM nor in any Ka-Tet or Te-Ka corps.
Best wishes and have fun,
Raven Kahn
Kahnnnnnnnnnn!!!! Wait am I doing this right?
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Dadekster
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Posted - 2008.07.04 17:28:00 -
[64]
Originally by: TornSoul
Karma's a ***** huh Raven.
This post intended for a select audience.
They know who they are.
"Told you so"
Priceless.
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Visa Valdore
The Horde
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Posted - 2008.07.04 19:06:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Visa Valdore on 04/07/2008 19:06:48
Originally by: Catholic Priest
Raven Kahn is a liar and a thief. it's been spewing out on the forums for months now. stolen moons, stolen outposts, stolen Isk and anything else he soulc take he probably would. he was the main reason the last few old corps left ka-tet and he's the reason te-ka and lost thier stuff. it's a shame he took over the alliance. perhaps it would be in better condition at this point if it had been in someone elses. Have no doubt that raven's wallet is full and his stuff is safe.
You're bitter because they whined for 4 months how you were quitting & wouldnt leave then Raven Kahn came in & told you, you had to days to get out LOL. AWM = Failure.
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Catholic Priest
Caldari
A.W.M
Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2008.07.04 19:55:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Visa Valdore
Edited by: Visa Valdore on 04/07/2008 19:06:48
Originally by: Catholic Priest
Raven Kahn is a liar and a thief. it's been spewing out on the forums for months now. stolen moons, stolen outposts, stolen Isk and anything else he soulc take he probably would. he was the main reason the last few old corps left ka-tet and he's the reason te-ka and lost thier stuff. it's a shame he took over the alliance. perhaps it would be in better condition at this point if it had been in someone elses. Have no doubt that raven's wallet is full and his stuff is safe.
You're bitter because they whined for 4 months how you were quitting & wouldnt leave then Raven Kahn came in & told you, you had to days to get out LOL. AWM = Failure.
Obviously your as clueless as the rest of Kahn's followers as we decided to leave and were out of the area within a few weeks. And Raven Kahn didn't come in and tell us to leave. He waited till we said we'll be out in 2 weeks and decided to get pretend tough and tell us we had 1 week till we were reset. Way to defend the person who ruined the alliance once and for all! not to mention stealing from everyone he could on the way down.
But stick by your hero there!
Maybe he'll throw you under the bus next.
Honestly, it could only be an improvement!
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Doomfarer
Minmatar
A.W.M
Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2008.07.05 00:56:00 -
[67]
Well well well..... RAven always struck me as a "shallow end of the gene pool" type. Glad to be have my perceptions reinforced. It's a real pity that members of Te-ka and Ka-tet got bilked like this. But it's just another tell tale of why so many people did a Leroy and got the hell out. 
The new owners will find the rats in the drone regions excellent for their capital ship programs. Regular resources are commonplace, but the rats give a huge return if you have the fortitude to keep ratting for endless hours, certainly enough for a for anyone seriously into building cap ships fast. The drone regions bullseye for this was painted on the wall 6-7 months ago.
Good luck to all that got shafted by raven and his/her (can never tell with the cross dressers in this game) 20 grit sandpaper condom. Raven - i hope Kublai really did shaft you over - he saw you coming a mile away..
Oh and Visa (really cool credit card name there stud - you a raven alt? wouldn't surprise me with a *bling* name like that) Raven could no more admit to being suckered by us leaving as he could admit to what's really happened with Kublai. If it smells like *it* and looks like *it*.. you gotta know it's full of *it*. Frankly he's as thick as *it* and twice as stupid...and smells as evil.
If you think something looks gross - you've never seen Poutine......... |
Shinma Apollo
Caldari
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.05 01:31:00 -
[68]
While I'm not big on scamming, does this mean you have enough isk to give me that mach now Kublai?
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dastommy79
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.05 05:01:00 -
[69]
Now when i offed to leave Oasa for 500mill, you should have payed me. Now look whats happened.
Atlas Fleet Admiral
Former SmashKill Coaliton Leader
Stop banning me please
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Rethyl
VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD
Sylph Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.05 12:52:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Rethyl on 05/07/2008 12:54:54
Edited by: Rethyl on 05/07/2008 12:52:35
Originally by: TornSoul
Karma's a ***** huh Raven.
This post intended for a select audience.
They know who they are.
"Told you so"
Indeed. We saw the writing on the wall when Raven threw out the existing Ka-Tet leadership council to assume control of the alliance (several months back). To all the corps who supported Raven in his original rise to power: you got what you had coming to you.
To the old corps of Ka-Tet -- AWM, BIG, KVEC, and T.dk among them: you did good for Ka-Tet while you were there. And you did well for yourselves to get out when you did, because Raven's "leadership" did nothing for the alliance.
"Ambitious usurper eventually falls victim to his own greed." Shock! This is a plot Shakespeare would have written, had Shakespeare known about internet spaceships. :)
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Septus Octavianus
Caldari
TEKNO
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Posted - 2008.07.05 17:31:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Septus Octavianus on 05/07/2008 17:31:46
Edited by: Septus Octavianus on 05/07/2008 17:31:24
Originally by: Rethyl
Edited by: Rethyl on 05/07/2008 12:54:54
Edited by: Rethyl on 05/07/2008 12:52:35
To the old corps of Ka-Tet -- AWM, BIG, KVEC, and T.dk among them: you did good for Ka-Tet while you were there. And you did well for yourselves to get out when you did, because Raven's "leadership" did nothing for the alliance.
Lets not forget the original 'Rampage Eternal' corp, not the sh*te thats left there now. The corp left now is a discrace to the name it flys under!
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kryptteacher
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Posted - 2008.07.05 18:34:00 -
[72]
Edited by: kryptteacher on 05/07/2008 18:35:28
this is glorius
johnny 101 = eve jack sparrow, "today will be the day that you almost... *trips, falls*"
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Alexi Kalashnikov
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.05 22:15:00 -
[73]
Originally by: kryptteacher
Edited by: kryptteacher on 05/07/2008 18:35:28
this is glorius
johnny 101 = eve jack sparrow, "today will be the day that you almost... *trips, falls*"
Except, you know, he wasn't caught and got away with it right? Roll another alt, start again :)
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Etsu
Abh Empire
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.07.06 07:48:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Caliburn
When Ka-tet took over DMC's stations,VIV,ABH and CDI (maybe one or two others)moved there to defend the area and were promised control of at least two of the stations.
The corps in Oasa were given very little support from the rest of Ka-tet and were never given control of any stations.
After Raven took over Ka-tet the Oasa stations were controlled by Ka-tet Operations a 3 man corp made by an alt of Ravens (one of the stations was then called 'rich corp getting richer')
Strangely at this point the corps in Oasa decided to split from Ka-tet and form Carpe.
I suspect Ravens wallet is very fat indeed.
ABH never had any intention of taking OASA from ka-tet, and infact had a major role in the movement that put raven in control of ka-tet. At the time this was a choice that all the oasa corps had agreed on based on the lack of support and communications from current ka-tet leadership (mostly AWM) However shortly after Raven took power, some very shadey business started to go down in oasa, directly impacting each corps ability to secure the region in Ka-Tets name. (all corps sent to oasa were taken in from te-ka and bled for ISK to hold it)
Raven ordered a near-director from CDI corp to offline a raremoon POS and transfer its control to the new holding corp without contacting any of the cmd from any of the oasa corps. Reasons for this were given but it was found unacceptable by all corporations in OASA, Instead of this situation being resolved reasonably (in the eyes of all corps concerned about underhanded business such as this), Raven decided to boot CDI instead.
It was at this moment that ABH openly regretted helping Raven take power in katet and shortly after that CDI decided they would form a new alliance and try to hold oasa. We took a week to consider the options and decided that with the amount of time and investment all our corps put into oasa and lack of faith in current leadership, we would remain in oasa untill removed by force - as carpe...
Our final attempt to help Katet save itself (being that multiple corps leaving in a short time was taking its toll) was to put Tornsoul back in power as the movement was shifting to that- Final votes were made days before leaving and BIG became exec corp for alliance.
We all asked TS to do his best and said our goodbyes.
TS attempted to reform a council, it eventually failed and raven retook power, which by then nobody in carpe cared as we were all busy with our own goals.
ABH declined any options of control of any outposts everytime we went to oasa, yet we are the only corp still living here from back then >.<
As for where most of the money went from both regions, clearly it did not go to rebuilding katet or carpe in anyway. |
Caliburn
VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD
Sylph Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.06 09:15:00 -
[75]
None of the corps who went to Oasa had any intention of leaving Ka-tet afaik.
In the end it was Ravens greed that split Ka-tet
Did not say anything about the moon as I only heard rumors.
There were always plenty of good people in Ka-tet trying to make things work and its a great shame it is now no more.
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Mag's
MASS
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Posted - 2008.07.06 11:24:00 -
[76]
I'm still unsure about who had my 5 Billion, although I have my ideas.
Just wanted to point that out.
Mag's
Originally by: Avernus
One of these days, the realization that MASS is no longer significant will catch up with you. |
Mr Funkadelic
Tenacious Danes
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.07.06 16:27:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Caliburn
(one of the stations was then called 'rich corp getting richer')
HAHAHAHA, we had alot of fun when we took the station and named it that before giving it to ka-tet
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dutchterror
Caldari
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.07.06 17:25:00 -
[78]
I1m not gonna waste to much time on this,i was in one of the scammed corps,we had just joined te-ka to finally have a slice of 0.0 and finally me a decent income,when the reds started invading,all hopes and dreams gone ,frustration all over.
Then mister kublai came along with what seemed to be the solution to our problems ...we should have known better,miracles dont exist.
total loss 1,4 billion isk and all corp assets (we kept the bpo`s hehe).
we learned that no-one can be trusted anymore these days .
jonny you wont be forgotten and you will get whatscoming to you.
greetings dutchterror former dir xsc-whitetigers
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psirus
MASS
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Posted - 2008.08.21 11:23:00 -
[79]
Personally I do not condone this, Sorry its taken so long I wont see them in the alliance ! Sorry I didn't see this sooner I have not been playing.
To quote a dear freind "Being screwed over by people you considered friends, is not easily forgotten.". |
Neesa Corrinne
Dark Destiny Inc.
Send More Paramedics
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Posted - 2008.08.21 11:54:00 -
[80]
Originally by: dutchterror
I1m not gonna waste to much time on this,i was in one of the scammed corps,we had just joined te-ka to finally have a slice of 0.0 and finally me a decent income,when the reds started invading,all hopes and dreams gone ,frustration all over.
Then mister kublai came along with what seemed to be the solution to our problems ...we should have known better,miracles dont exist.
total loss 1,4 billion isk and all corp assets (we kept the bpo`s hehe).
we learned that no-one can be trusted anymore these days .
jonny you wont be forgotten and you will get whatscoming to you.
greetings dutchterror former dir xsc-whitetigers
That's the beauty of EVE... he won't ever get what's coming to him. Even if he doesn't simply recycle that alt and make a new one for future scams, then he'll at least be extremely wary of anyone trying to scam him in return.
If you need to place blame in this scenario, I would point squarely at yourself (what kind of moron hands their entire corp assets over to anyone they don't know IRL??) or at Khan (Greedy executive decides to buy into alliance scam while it's falling apart).
If there's anyone in this scenario you need to "get back at", it's Khan.
This thread is the only good thing to come out of CAOD in about a year... full of entertainment. |
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CCP Navigator
C C P
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Posted - 2008.08.21 15:28:00 -
[81]
Locked.
Alt corp OP.
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