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Best ship (DPS?) for L4 missions

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CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 03:59:00 - [1] I'm currently in a Dominix that can tank and complete any L4 mission. With Drones my DPS is 575. Note I'm using 250mm Dual railguns (not blasters). I was curious what the "best ship" for doing L4 missions was (i.e. what can blast through them the quickest) and what the DPS of the recommended ship (and outfitting) is. Thanks! --- CuddleMonkey!
NoNah	Posted - 2008.07.06 04:06:00 - [2] CNR and Golem, depends on the mission. For certain Serpentis and Gurista missions the Kronos can almost tie. For certain Blood and Sansha missions the Paladin, Apoc, Nightmare and Geddon can be even faster. If pimped out the Domi can do most missions even faster than the ones above. Supposedly the Mach can do certain Angel missions faster than the Golem, however I kind of doubt it. Parrots, commence! Postcount: 945694
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 04:14:00 - [3] What "tricked" out Domi setup are you thinking of? --- CuddleMonkey!
Ezekiel Sulastin Central Research Nexus	Posted - 2008.07.06 05:19:00 - [4] t2 sentries, sentry dmg rig, tracking links, and 350mm/425mm railguns with MFS. ---- WTB Armor Nerf Hardener II, 10^100 isk OBO
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 06:31:00 - [5] Do Sentries do the most damage? Also, are there non-sentry drone damage rigs, or just sentries? Is there a buildout for this "spec" on BattleClinic you can link? --- CuddleMonkey!
Slade Hoo Amarr	Posted - 2008.07.06 06:48:00 - [6] Edited by: Slade Hoo on 06/07/2008 06:52:37 navy apoc/paladin/nightmare while doing missions at an amarr agent whould be the fastest. 800 turret instant DPS without tracking problems or defender missile issues + drones. can hardly be beaten i think. are they the "best" ships? depends....you cannot maintain an afk tank while doing this dps with them. and they aren't very flexible...they are limited to em/thermal damage. so DPS drops e.g. at Angels or Guristas below the competition. at least its relatively cheap...no need for expensive faction/complex modules.
Helen coracao ardente The Requiem	Posted - 2008.07.06 08:00:00 - [7] Originally by: Slade Hoo Edited by: Slade Hoo on 06/07/2008 06:52:37 navy apoc/paladin/nightmare while doing missions at an amarr agent whould be the fastest. 800 turret instant DPS without tracking problems or defender missile issues + drones. can hardly be beaten i think. are they the "best" ships? depends....you cannot maintain an afk tank while doing this dps with them. and they aren't very flexible...they are limited to em/thermal damage. so DPS drops e.g. at Angels or Guristas below the competition. at least its relatively cheap...no need for expensive faction/complex modules. Nightmare can easily get 1000+ dps with good skills against Blood/Sansha.
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.07.06 08:10:00 - [8] Even a pimped domi can't match the cream of the crop Golem/Paladin/Nightmare for pure efficiency and gank. That doesn't mean the Dominix isn't a great mission ship, and there's still a ways you can go to improve on your 575 DPS.
Thetys Caldari Surfer des Sandwurms	Posted - 2008.07.06 09:18:00 - [9] i did a LOT of lvl 4 mission (~2k) with a CNR because the lack of other ships (in the past) to compete with a faction fitted CNR. when the nightmare got the marauder like changes i tried one and i love it. as some of the pre-posters said the nightmare is a realy good alternative to caldari missile boats like golem and cnr. tbh, i never tried a domi for lvl 4's but i think using drones for main dps is, in some situations, a lil bit stressy because of the micro management of the drones. cheapest ship of those 3 vessels (not taking domi into account) is the golem (it does not need faction items to tank entire stages) but still, if you want an easy-mode ship with moderate skill requirements go for a cnr, both, golem and nightmare need a lot of skill pts to be cool tah tah thetys ------
Bambi Existentialist Collective	Posted - 2008.07.06 10:34:00 - [10] I find the Golem finishes level 4 missions a bit faster than the Paladin, but the Paladin is more fun to fly imo. If you are running missions for ISK then a marauder is the way to go for the looting/salvage ability. EVE is dead, long live EVE!
Slade Hoo Amarr	Posted - 2008.07.06 11:24:00 - [11] Originally by: Helen Nightmare can easily get 1000+ dps with good skills against Blood/Sansha. My calculations used Pulse setup...i don't like beams...higher damage on battleships, but they really lack in tracking cruisers at 10-15km range...really rips down average dps in total for me
Kerfira University of Caille	Posted - 2008.07.06 11:36:00 - [12] For pure mission kill speed, nothing beats a CNR (well, except of.c. a State Issue Raven). However, if you loot/salvage your missions, a Golem will finish faster as it'll do a lot of the looting while doing the mission, and will gather most wrecks in a nice easy salvageable group. Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Viqtoria Caldari Groping Hand Social Club	Posted - 2008.07.06 12:53:00 - [13] officer fitted nightmare.
Kate Libby Caldari Cybergate Inc.	Posted - 2008.07.06 15:11:00 - [14] Originally by: Kerfira if you loot/salvage your missions, a Golem will finish faster as it'll do a lot of the looting while doing the mission, and will gather most wrecks in a nice easy salvageable group. like anyone wouldn't loot/salvage their mission wrecks? ---------------- Love and Kisses.
Michael Caldar DangerZone Inc.	Posted - 2008.07.06 15:49:00 - [15] You'd be surprised how many people don't - to each his own, I guess . From my experience it's a Golem. Huge cargo hold, nice DPS, twin 40km reaching tractors and a Salvager. Half the ammo use. If there was a coffee machine inside I'd moved in. IMHO it is the best all-round mission running ship by far. YMMV
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 16:26:00 - [16] So basically Caldari Missile Boats are where it's at then? Nightmare/CNR/Golem seems to be the consensus. I'm trained Gallente, so switching to Caldari will be a major switch... Any other Gallente solutions? --- CuddleMonkey!
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2008.07.06 19:49:00 - [17] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 06/07/2008 19:50:54 Originally by: CuddleMonkey So basically Caldari Missile Boats are where it's at then? Nightmare/CNR/Golem seems to be the consensus. I'm trained Gallente, so switching to Caldari will be a major switch... Any other Gallente solutions? Caldari ships are highly overrated due to their convenience and ease of use, they are by no means the be-all end-all mission ships everyone makes them out to be. They are pretty good at all the missions, but the best at none of them really. Fastest finishers are the laserboats due to their immense instant longrange dps. Drawback being that they only work well with Amarr agents. A pimped Domi should be able to do pretty damn well too though. Like for example these: For Guristas: Lows: Internal Force Field Array I Gallente Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer Gallente Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I Meds: Domination Shield Boost Amplifier Pith B-Type Large Shield Booster Dread Guristas Invulnerability Field Dread Guristas Ballistic Deflection Field Omnidirectional Tracking Link I Highs: Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Rigs: Drone Scope Chip I Sentry Damage Augmentor I Capacitor Control Circuit I Drones: 5 * Garde II for stuff within 45ish km 5 * Warden II for BS beyond 45ish km 5 * whatever works for you to kill close stuff Deals 928 dps with gardes, 800ish with Wardens, and tanks Guristas 350ish sustained/590ish peak. More than enough for any missions when you deal this kind of dps. Or this for Blood/Sansha: Lows: Dark Blood Reactor Control Unit Gallente Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer Gallente Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer Large Armor Repairer II Dark Blood Armor EM Hardener Dark Blood Armor EM Hardener Dark Blood Armor Thermic Hardener Meds: Gist C-Type 100MN Afterburner Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Omnidirectional Tracking Link I Highs: Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Gallente Navy 350mm Railgun,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Rigs: Drone Scope Chip I Sentry Damage Augmentor I Capacitor Control Circuit I Drones: 5 * Garde II 5 * Curator II 5 * whatever to kill close stuff Needs a 3% PG implant also. You just need to adjust your tanking style to your NPCs, shieldtanking the EM rats is impractical, while it is very viable against the kin rats. And of course these setups need your full attention on the game. And also if you finish missions at speeds these long range fits with 800+ dps provide, looting and salvaging actually reduces your isk/hour except maybe salvaging angels and looting Mercs/EoM/Faction Navy. And for those you best come back in a dedicated ship for it. Make suicide ganking more difficult!
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:07:00 - [18] Edited by: CuddleMonkey on 06/07/2008 21:11:42 Edited by: CuddleMonkey on 06/07/2008 21:09:45 I don't see how those builds would survive a L4 mission like WC (perhaps the second with hardeners), but where would you get the cap to run all those guns? And with the 1st outfit, there's no hardeners at all... Also, the Sentry Drones do very little damage above a T2 Ogre... so why use Sentries? Especially in a spawn/drone difficulty mission like WC? --- CuddleMonkey!
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:20:00 - [19] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 06/07/2008 21:21:05 Originally by: CuddleMonkey Edited by: CuddleMonkey on 06/07/2008 21:09:45 I don't see how those builds would survive a L4 mission like WC (perhaps the second with hardeners), but where would you get the cap to run all those guns? And with the 1st outfit, there's no hardeners at all... Also, the Sentry Drones do very little damage above a T2 Ogre... so why use Sentries? Especially in a spawn/drone difficulty mission like WC? Try looking again, the first one does have hardeners... Hint: It is a shieldtank. Also, did you ever hear about ganktanking? The point is not to run the repper/booster all the time and have your buffer do most of the soaking while your superior damage reduces incoming dps so fast that you need to do only very little actual tanking. The only thing I am not taking into account is drone aggro bugs, which I guess might lead to your demise in WC or other missions susceptible to that stuff. But if those do not occur, no WC nor any other mission short of EA 5 that I do would kill either of these setups. In fact my Golem runs a shieldtank similar to the first fit and never has any trouble. And you use sentries because they instantly deliver their dps, while heavies use like half of theirs to travel time and thus are VERY inefficient. Oh and the PG comes from that Reactor control unit in the second fit, while the CPU for the first one comes from heavy use of faction modules. Make suicide ganking more difficult!
NoNah	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:46:00 - [20] If you're after running missions fast, Shieldtanks are way way way way better than armortanks. This is however also reflected in the prices of the higher end shield and armor gear. There is one relevant midslot module(AB) that makes your missions significantly faster, there are quite a few lowslot modules, and they may be used several times. Tanks are largely irrelevant. After a certain point, any more tank is useless, and the higher your damage is, the lower that point is. Reason caldari wins, is not only because they can master shield tanks somewhat easily, and select their damagetypes but because their damage in fact is in the very top of the scale. 1000 dps isn't unheard of for a mission ship. As for the pimped domi, I would normally agree that it's not the king of the hill, but I have been proven wrong time upon time. The domi can be shieldtanked and it can put out some increadible hurt. Yes, it's a nightmare to fit out and it's a gank waiting to happen, but.... Parrots, commence! Postcount: 697093
Zo5o Gallente Longcat is Long	Posted - 2008.07.06 23:22:00 - [21] Domi without drone link augmentors is fairly limited in many missions...
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.06 23:26:00 - [22] So I wonder what max DPS flying Gallente would be for missions. Right now I can do any L4 solo; I'm just trying to get more DPS. I could train to CNR in just a few days, but then I'd have to train missiles. I'm actually already well-trained in shield (I used to shield tank). Just trying to come up with the 'next step' for doing L4 missions quicker and more efficiently (i.e. same tanking ability, higher DPS, faster movement/kills). --- CuddleMonkey!
Zo5o Gallente Longcat is Long	Posted - 2008.07.07 00:30:00 - [23] Edited by: Zo5o on 07/07/2008 00:41:10 Quote: So I wonder what max DPS flying Gallente would be for missions. Against kin/therm-weak rats, Kronos. Pimped domi setups may be able to beat its dps in EFT by a slight margin, but certainly not true dps when you factor in Kronos's tracking bonus, web bonus, and added range. Especially the web bonus. Shield tanked domi loses most or all of its gun dps while attacking close-orbiting ships that would be slowed by 99% by a Kronos, absolutely melting under its guns. Domis without drone link augmentors lose true dps to travel time to get in range of many rats.
NoNah	Posted - 2008.07.07 01:27:00 - [24] Originally by: Zo5o Edited by: Zo5o on 07/07/2008 00:41:10 Quote: So I wonder what max DPS flying Gallente would be for missions. Against kin/therm-weak rats, Kronos. Pimped domi setups may be able to beat its dps in EFT by a slight margin, but certainly not true dps when you factor in Kronos's tracking bonus, web bonus, and added range. Especially the web bonus. Shield tanked domi loses most or all of its gun dps while attacking close-orbiting ships that would be slowed by 99% by a Kronos, absolutely melting under its guns. Domis without drone link augmentors lose true dps to travel time to get in range of many rats. The entire idea here would be that there pretty much are no close orbitting ships. Around 1k dps(just above with Garde, just below with Warden) all effective at 50-70km, half with a signature resolution of 125m and half with 400, 0.018 tracking on the guns, 0.036 on the Gardes. Example EFT figures of build I've both witnessed and read about. Someone made a huge thread of "this is how I did it, now buy the ship I used" about this particular kind of build and even included some clip of how it worked. For missions where close orbiting frigates are unavoidable there are simple solutions to it, 5 light drones while approaching next gate clears it rather easily with nearly no waste of time, a faction web lets gardes make short work of them. Kronos doesn't do very much damage, but it compensates for it by 3 utility highs, role bonuses and being somewhat cheap relative to it's speed. Parrots, commence! Postcount: 822100
Dvores	Posted - 2008.07.07 02:31:00 - [25] The domi is really nice for L4s, and it's definitely one of the best ships for L4s. I don't think that there's an absolute best though. Right now I'm flying in a hype that can tank 500-ish dps and deal 700ish out to 55km, my current goal is to upgrade to a kronos that tanks/does 600+/800+. I also have a Domi and a Drake that I use on occasion (bored, cross-trained) I'm assuming you're using faction gear, but if you aren't, go for it. That + complex gear can let you run stuff so much faster its just silly. Even small changes, such as a Shield Booster here and a few Cruise Launchers there, can boost your mission run time and/or your security by leaps and boundsMy ideal (20B isk) ship is a kronos with all centus x-type/officer gear which can run stuff stupidly fast and omni tank 2000+ dps... but if I had such a ship, I would never undock it b/c I'd fear getting scanned down and killed.
LetsDoThis	Posted - 2008.07.07 03:42:00 - [26] Optimal range rigged pulse Apoc, without a doubt. 90km with scorch, 31km with multifreq, ridiculous tracking, fully sustainable.
Hugh Ruka Exploratio et Industria Morispatia	Posted - 2008.07.07 05:55:00 - [27] hmm ... I have a standard t2 sentry Domi with named t1 350mm rails and t1 gardes ... I get around 600 dps ... With some tweaking I could break 700dps with better skills and t2 sentries ... I think the "best" L4 boat is the one that suits your play style. I did some L4 missions in a raven some time ago but I switched to the Domi for pure drone love ... best L4 ship is about personal preference ... --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed !
Ada Riklova	Posted - 2008.07.07 10:31:00 - [28] Originally by: Hugh Ruka hmm ... I have a standard t2 sentry Domi with named t1 350mm rails and t1 gardes ... I get around 600 dps ... With some tweaking I could break 700dps with better skills and t2 sentries ... I think the "best" L4 boat is the one that suits your play style. I did some L4 missions in a raven some time ago but I switched to the Domi for pure drone love ... best L4 ship is about personal preference ... I'm using a domi as well. Sentries seem to be a must however when doing Worlds Collide. Too much drone aggro there sadly On a side note... I have an alt that I'm thinking of using to add some extra DPS, currently she's got minnie CR and BS to lvl 5 (Battlecruisers / HACs are easily trained). What would be the best ship (and setup) to use? (Or should I go the easy way and train for a caracal / cerberus?
CuddleMonkey Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.07 18:37:00 - [29] A ton of great information here; thanks to everyone for participating! Looks like I need to get my sentry drone training up and that the Dominix is a "good" L4 mission runner. I can look at raising the DPS through better guns and drones and keep it at that. I can clear out all of WC (including Salvage) in roughly 3 hours (note I use my Dom to clear, Catalyst to salvage). I'd hope to get that time down to less than two hours... --- CuddleMonkey!
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2008.07.07 18:45:00 - [30] Originally by: CuddleMonkey A ton of great information here; thanks to everyone for participating! Looks like I need to get my sentry drone training up and that the Dominix is a "good" L4 mission runner. I can look at raising the DPS through better guns and drones and keep it at that. I can clear out all of WC (including Salvage) in roughly 3 hours (note I use my Dom to clear, Catalyst to salvage). I'd hope to get that time down to less than two hours... Eww Ok, I don't wanna shatter any illusions you might harbor, but I can clean out WC including salvaging the Angel BS (the only thing worth salvaging really) in 50 minutes or less... Taking three hours is very very bad, and two will still be very bad. Make suicide ganking more difficult!

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