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Attention Militias - It's YOUR responsibility

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Reaver One Sigillum Militum Xpisti	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:05:00 - [1] I'm a member of the Caldari Militia. My corporation has been wardec'd by two low-sec pirate corps, as have most of the Caldari Militia corrps of consequence. I myself am pretty well stuck in port (and have been for three days now) as I have no chance at all against three-year old players at 5:1 odds. Can't mission run to make any cash, and couldn't sell the loot even if I did because my hub (Jita) is camped to the gills by Gallente. I'm assuming that the Caldari Militia isn't the only one with these problems, and yeah, it sucks. I hear so many folks calling for CCP to do something about this, and about the Jita camps, so as a "victim" myself, let me be the first to say...stop whining and do something yourself. CCP has made an unforgiving game. That's what makes it worth playing. If they start tinkering with the rules so that the FW militias and militia corps have it easier, the game breaks. It is up to US to overcome these obstacles...not CCP. CCP gave us the tools to play with the big boys...cut our teeth in PvP and discover the larger world outside empire space. Now, the realities of low-sec and 0.0 are here, and we're running around like chickens with their heads cut off and whining in chat and on the forums. I don't have the answers...I'm a new player myself...but I know that there ARE answers. Off the top of my head I'd say that one viable option would be to merge all of the smaller militia corps into a single very large corporation, engaging the pirate corps at every opportunity and camping trading hubs ourselves. Another would be to make a system of smaller corporations...sharing them amongst each militia's corps, granting no member rights (to make rapid joining/leaving possible) and move members from one to another as they get dec'd. Not a very courageous option to be sure, but it'll cost the enemy more ISK than it's worth to keep up. I'm sure that there are other methods out there that I'm to green to be aware of. I've tried to establish intel channels, get in touch with various members of fellow militia corps and coordinate, establish some sort of dialogue in corp chat and on the various militia forums...and have been met with a pretty resounding silence. Maybe I don't have the personality or the seniority, that's cool, but SOMEONE better do something here. They succeed in scaring all the folks out of the FW corps, then the nervous system of all of the militias is gone, and Faction Warfare WILL fail. That may be the goal right there for all I know, and it'll be OUR fault if it happens. A noob joining Faction Warfare right now is going to see ships being blown out of fleets without any help from their buddies. He'll get podded the first time he tries to do business in a hub, and if he joins a militia corp he'll probably be hunted through high-sec. How long to you think he'll stay? How long do you think FW will last without new blood, and with the more experienced folks leaving? The pirates and the 0.0 alliances predicted that FW would fail in a spectacular fashion, and would do so under it's own "weight". Didn't happen. Instead, it's fun, and it's getting the noobs, bears and the grinders into the meat of the game, just like it was supposed to. Now the null-sec crowd is going to see to it that it DOES fail, no matter what. If it does, it's our fault.
Terror Rising Death Of Fallen Angels	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:29:00 - [2] Would Star Fraction be one of them?
Furb Killer Gallente USC Militia	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:30:00 - [3] You realise you can also sell loot outside jita?
Stab Wounds Caldari	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:35:00 - [4] a 0.0 entity as old as star fraction should know better
Basura Blanco	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:37:00 - [5] Edited by: Basura Blanco on 06/07/2008 20:44:29 Star Fraction would indeed be one of them. Actually admire these cats, as from what I've seen they run a pretty effective organization. Can't wait to pod one. As to being able to sell outside of Jita, sure I know that. I'm not worried about that on a personal basis, but I'm thinking of the long-term global effects of preventing a militia from entering it's own trading hub. And regarding the "Star Fraction should know better" comment...know better than what? They're playing the game as intended, breaking no rules. If their agenda is to destroy the Caldari Militia or Faction Warfare altogether, that's fine...it's their right to have any agenda they want. THat's what makes EvE so great. What I'm saying is that if it is OUR agenda to make sure that Faction Warfare succeeds, then we better get off the pot and do something. Cost the null-sec crews ISK, pod them, gank them, run them out of high-sec and we'll gain their respect. Beg CCP to change the rules to protect us from the big badd wolf and we're a joke. It's time for the militias to earn respect. We have zero credibility coming into this thing, as it should be, and deserve nothing we don't fight for and win ourselves.
Illwill Bill Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:38:00 - [6] Creds to OP for understanding what it's all about. ____________________ Honk if you think that I'm a n00b Lance fighter > Honk.
Sakura Nihil Stimulus	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:39:00 - [7] Originally by: Illwill Bill Creds to OP for understanding what it's all about. Seconded. Now that is the attitude a newbie needs to have to survive and enjoy EVE. Click me! You know you want to...
Kazuma Saruwatari	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:40:00 - [8] Conspiracy. 0.0 alliances wanting to cause as much ruckus as possible to ruin FW for everyone? Cant be! Seriously though, I was expecting goonalts to have ruined FW a month ago, or at least some other 0.0 group. You guys are getting soft out there... - Odd Pod Out, a blog of EVE Online
Stevens DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:49:00 - [9] Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari Conspiracy. 0.0 alliances wanting to cause as much ruckus as possible to ruin FW for everyone? Cant be! Seriously though, I was expecting goonalts to have ruined FW a month ago, or at least some other 0.0 group. You guys are getting soft out there... Were busy not winning fast enough
Kazuma Saruwatari	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:52:00 - [10] Edited by: Kazuma Saruwatari on 06/07/2008 20:52:30 Originally by: Stevens Were busy not winning fast enough FAILURE! TO THE <insert torture method and/or other uncomfortable terms here> WITH YOU! <edited to keep "politically correct"> - Odd Pod Out, a blog of EVE Online
Heartstone Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:54:00 - [11] Yes Star Fraction would indeed be one of those people who have decced Sigillum Militum Xpisti. As I can already see the way this thread is likely to head I will state that this will be my one and only post on the topic although I am more than happy to discuss any and all topic in game. From an out of character perspective I can see why people are someone irked that we interfere with the way they want to play the game. It is totally understandable to me that being attacked by a more powerful/experienced/whatever entity. It affect what you can do and how you can do it so it is bound to annoy. I think what has been failed to understand is that is exactly how everyone else in eve lives as well. As an organisation Star Fraction is limited in what it can do and how it can do it due to game mechanics and how others use them. In a similar way so is BoB, Goonswarm, Red Allaince and anyone other organisation large or small within Eve. So we all adapt to what we can do within the way Eve works as designed by CCP. From an in character perspective seriously what did you expect? Anarchists, Terrorists and Freedom Fighters. This was always going to be the way Star Fraction would initially interact with something like Territorial Militias. It is nice to see a younger character such as Reaver One understanding those principles of Eve and I for one both wish him well for the future and expect he will do well in this game as he seems to understand. I would persist in your effort to organise things more for the Militia if I were you. ---
Reaver One Sigillum Militum Xpisti	Posted - 2008.07.06 20:59:00 - [12] Edited by: Reaver One on 06/07/2008 21:00:58 Originally by: Heartstone I would persist in your effort to organise things more for the Militia if I were you. I fully intend to, and in fact one of my goals is to have your name on a kill mail in my bio...no offence . For the record, I have nothing personal against ANY large corporation that is engaging in these tactics. I am, in fact, sort of perversely glad that they have (finally) done this, as it may be the straw that gets the miitias off their keesters (to mix metaphors). The onus is on the militias to defend themselves, to expand, to thrive and to eventually move out into 0.0 space and carve the largest empire that the game as ever....but I digress.
Borg9	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:01:00 - [13] Edited by: Borg9 on 06/07/2008 21:01:38 Originally by: Stevens Were busy not winning fast enough [/quote I smell a nano whine
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:01:00 - [14] So much for Star Fraction being a 0.0 corp. Now reduced to war decs in empire space, grats all grats all. I personally think it is hilarious. I mean if you want to join in FW, then join in mf'ing FW. There are ways around the alliance issue if you actually understood game mechanics. Declaring war on some random militia corp is lame because it is like declaring war on alliance A's training/alt/industrial corp when you could just as easily declare war on both of them. I mean in this case the smaller, weaker corp is taking on all comers that join the opposite miltia but the big bad 0.0 alliance only picks on one, lolololol. -- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Frozen Fallout Gallente MicroFunks	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:06:00 - [15] Welcome to EvE I think you will be great here. One thing to know about EvE is if you want to see results you are going to need to start doing the organizing and communicating, which you seem to be doing ok on. On a side note I at first thought you where asking all of the Militias to join up wardec the pirates.
Kaianna Sela Duty.	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:17:00 - [16] Not sure what the problem is tbh. We got war dec'd by Atomic Battle Penguins ourselves for the same reason, who aren't exactly crap. They have got 1 or 2 kills on us, but we've still been operating normally in the meantime with 40ish kills during the same period. Dont keep operating from the same place all the time, dont blob, and fly smart. Think of it as a good way to get better and lose any dead weight in your corp.
Roguehalo Caldari RH Ship Brokers	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:22:00 - [17] Originally by: Reaver One I'm a member of the Caldari Militia. My corporation has been wardec'd by two low-sec pirate corps, as have most of the Caldari Militia corrps of consequence. I myself am pretty well stuck in port (and have been for three days now) as I have no chance at all against three-year old players at 5:1 odds. Can't mission run to make any cash, and couldn't sell the loot even if I did because my hub (Jita) is camped to the gills by Gallente. I'm assuming that the Caldari Militia isn't the only one with these problems, and yeah, it sucks. I hear so many folks calling for CCP to do something about this, and about the Jita camps, so as a "victim" myself, let me be the first to say...stop whining and do something yourself. CCP has made an unforgiving game. That's what makes it worth playing. If they start tinkering with the rules so that the FW militias and militia corps have it easier, the game breaks. It is up to US to overcome these obstacles...not CCP. CCP gave us the tools to play with the big boys...cut our teeth in PvP and discover the larger world outside empire space. Now, the realities of low-sec and 0.0 are here, and we're running around like chickens with their heads cut off and whining in chat and on the forums. I don't have the answers...I'm a new player myself...but I know that there ARE answers. Off the top of my head I'd say that one viable option would be to merge all of the smaller militia corps into a single very large corporation, engaging the pirate corps at every opportunity and camping trading hubs ourselves. Another would be to make a system of smaller corporations...sharing them amongst each militia's corps, granting no member rights (to make rapid joining/leaving possible) and move members from one to another as they get dec'd. Not a very courageous option to be sure, but it'll cost the enemy more ISK than it's worth to keep up. I'm sure that there are other methods out there that I'm to green to be aware of. I've tried to establish intel channels, get in touch with various members of fellow militia corps and coordinate, establish some sort of dialogue in corp chat and on the various militia forums...and have been met with a pretty resounding silence. Maybe I don't have the personality or the seniority, that's cool, but SOMEONE better do something here. They succeed in scaring all the folks out of the FW corps, then the nervous system of all of the militias is gone, and Faction Warfare WILL fail. That may be the goal right there for all I know, and it'll be OUR fault if it happens. A noob joining Faction Warfare right now is going to see ships being blown out of fleets without any help from their buddies. He'll get podded the first time he tries to do business in a hub, and if he joins a militia corp he'll probably be hunted through high-sec. How long to you think he'll stay? How long do you think FW will last without new blood, and with the more experienced folks leaving? The pirates and the 0.0 alliances predicted that FW would fail in a spectacular fashion, and would do so under it's own "weight". Didn't happen. Instead, it's fun, and it's getting the noobs, bears and the grinders into the meat of the game, just like it was supposed to. Now the null-sec crowd is going to see to it that it DOES fail, no matter what. If it does, it's our fault. /me sighs
Oeth Minmatar House of Masters	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:24:00 - [18] "i can't make money"... Set at least 10 buy orders. When they come through, sell higher. WOW WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF TRADING IN JITA.
Siberys	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:29:00 - [19] You joined the n00b militia, so stop whining. Join anyone else and you have no such problems (Or maybe it's the fact that being only me and my alt plus a few friends alts being in the corp that keeps 'em off me)
The PitBoss Caldari Privateers	Posted - 2008.07.06 21:34:00 - [20] Adapt to the current rules ... or die ... Thanks, PB Siggys and Banners by: Kalen Vox
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Celestial Industrial Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:04:00 - [21] Originally by: Siberys You joined the n00b militia, so stop whining. Join anyone else and you have no such problems (Or maybe it's the fact that being only me and my alt plus a few friends alts being in the corp that keeps 'em off me) I love when people don't bother to read the OP. Also, I see a bright and bloody future for the OP. Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said Originally by: Chribba Go F'nog! You're a hero! Not a Zero! /me bows
Dihania Gallente Mucho Dolor	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:06:00 - [22] To 3 the posters above... you are null. honestly. next time bother to read and comprehend the topic at hand. To the OP, glad one understands how things work in eve, harsh but that is how it is. If you want results you must keep at organizing pilots and keep at making smaller entities work together towards a common goal. . EVE: "The Hand-holding Age". I need isk!Accepting donations. Renting sig space.Taking various jobs.
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:12:00 - [23] Good post by OP. EVE isn't fair, and it is unforgiving to players who want to have it easy. We were all noobs at some point, and most of us who are still here stayed afloat by wits or firepower or both. You just have to find a working solution for your problem. There is always one. Also don't expect to have a long stretch of uninterrupted success. Some players find themselves in trouble and quit too easily. Everyone in EVE has their rainy days, no matter if it is a veteran or a newbie.
Esmenet Gallente	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:19:00 - [24] Reaver One you got the right idea, and you will do very well if you can get the militia to listen. Unfortunately I think your chances at succeeding with that is pretty low.
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:19:00 - [25] Good post Reaver One. My corp (Amarr) was also decced by a larger Alliance (Ushra Khan) and we simply did what any self respecting corp would do in such circumstances and flew into deep low sec. Wha..? Yup. In Empire space your War Targets have only got you to worry about. Nobody else will engage them - they have the advantage. But in Low Sec it's a totally different story. Now theyre running as much risk as you. Movement becomes more difficult, resupply is more problematic, there are other corps out there and theyre probably none to friendly. These factors apply as much to the corp deccing you as they do to yourselves. Use small, cheap, disposable ships that require the minimum of logistics to produce (a T1 Frigate BPO is what, 60k isk?). Lure their expensive ships on to the gate camps of others. Hide in plain sight of FW plexes (negating the value of any T2 ships that cant enter a T1 plex). There are a host of options - just alllow the environment to do your work for you. C. VITOC - Amarr Corp for Faction Warfare!
Patient 053537	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:21:00 - [26] To the OP, you know what you do, if you don't want to deal with the issues you are having, is just two easy steps. 1. Leave the Militia (even if its just for a little while) 2. Goto NPC corp 2a. If thats not good enough to be in NPC corp, create an alt corp. You can't blame the people who took advantage of the game mechanics first. If you want to organize something to stop it the "injustice", remove the whine part of your OP. Saying "Waah waahh, I can't sell my loot, I can't run missions" isn't a good way to start organizing something to counter them. Neither is, "You need to do something, I am suffering" Rawr Rawr
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2008.07.06 22:26:00 - [27] Originally by: Cailais Good post Reaver One. My corp (Amarr) was also decced by a larger Alliance (Ushra Khan) and we simply did what any self respecting corp would do in such circumstances and flew into deep low sec. Was just going to add something along these lines. If you check Star Fraction killboard you will notice they had very limited success in low security systems. Their current efficiency is based on high sec turkey shoot. I don't know if this applies to OP's corp since they might already be in deep low sec, but generally this is a good path to follow. As OP mentioned, cooperation is critical as well. But do not try to organize more pilots than you can handle. Organizing any militia is beyond hopeless task. Find corporations who are in similar situation and develop close ties. You will be surprised what you can do even against veteran pirates.
TekDragon	Posted - 2008.07.07 00:27:00 - [28] lol, wait, a 0.0 corp fled 0.0 into 1.0 space to war-dec younger players? HAHHAHAHA, who trounced them out of 0.0 in the first place?
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2008.07.07 02:39:00 - [29] Star Fraction is a roaming alliance. They do a lot of empire wars along with 0.0 campaigns.
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2008.07.07 03:38:00 - [30] Good post from the OP and wish that gentleman good luck with his eve experience. Couple of failposts from others in the thread though. Star Fraction was never a spaceholding 0.0 alliance (such things are anathema to our roleplay). We're a raiding guerrilla warfare alliance and the only reason we go to 0.0 is to shoot territorial dogs in the face. When that gets dull we shoot nationalists in the face. We'll shoot people in 0.0, in empire, in lowsec wherever. As pertaining the currently campaign of wardeccing Caldari FW corps its actually pretty straightforward - we are wardeccing ANY corp we see in decent numbers and ships in and around the Caldari FW blobs. We aren't wardeccing tiny corps nor those who are flying nothing but kestrels. We're trying to maintain 3 wardecs at once against significant targets in the Militia - ideally targets with a) numbers, b) some decent ships and c) that contain personalities known to lead FW gangs. Now admittedly the Caldari FW roster isn't great when it comes to single corps but hopefully that will change eventually and until that does I'd advise our 3 wardec target corps to look at working together to form fleets and bring the fight to us. All the best. CSM Manifesto 2008 \| Destroy Outposts!

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