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That CableGuy	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:24:00 - [1] My mate gave me some ISK the other day and today when I logged into eve I noticed my wallet had been emptied and that I'd received an eve email from GM NOVA saying:- According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I donÆt understand this; nothing was exchanged for real currency! I donÆt get it, I quote "it says our logs show you received items in exchange for real currency" this is just not possible and never happened!, why is there a "give money" feature in the game if you cant use it? What should I do, I feel quite threatened.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:26:00 - [2] You should get yourself a cable and hang around somewhere else. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Benco97 Gallente The Star League	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:26:00 - [3] It must have been a considerable amount of isk to be honest. Are you new? you have to admit that a new character being given a large sum of cash in return for nothing is somewhat suspicious. Originally by: P'uck You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
Miki Fin Gallente Independant Union of Rangers	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:26:00 - [4] You should just quit.
Tippia Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:27:00 - [5] Edited by: Tippia on 29/08/2008 19:30:25 What to do? I would suggest giving your "mate" a swift kick to the groin for being an RMTer… If your "mate" happens to be you then the extra pain of dislodging your leg to get a good swing is just an added bonus. Also, in before GM smackdown…
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:28:00 - [6] Originally by: That CableGuy My mate gave me some ISK the other day and today when I logged into eve I noticed my wallet had been emptied and that I'd received an eve email from GM NOVA saying:- According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I donÆt understand this; nothing was exchanged for real currency! I donÆt get it, I quote "it says our logs show you received items in exchange for real currency" this is just not possible and never happened!, why is there a "give money" feature in the game if you cant use it? What should I do, I feel quite threatened. Small chance that CCP ****ed up. Most likely is that your friend there is a RMTer
Andrue Amarr	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:29:00 - [7] Originally by: That CableGuy My mate gave me some ISK the other day and today when I logged into eve I noticed my wallet had been emptied and that I'd received an eve email from GM NOVA saying:- According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I donÆt understand this; nothing was exchanged for real currency! I donÆt get it, I quote "it says our logs show you received items in exchange for real currency" this is just not possible and never happened!, why is there a "give money" feature in the game if you cant use it? What should I do, I feel quite threatened. Your 'friend' probably bought Isk using real-life money then gave you some of it. Unfortunately illegally obtained Isk has to be removed from the game regardless of who eventually gets it. It's the same in real life. If you receive stolen goods they will usually be taken off you and returned to their rightful owner regardless of whether you paid for them or not. Bottom line:Find a better friend or a different game. If you want more information your best bet is to contact the GMs. There is little to be gained from posting this incident to the forums. Probably you'll just get flamed and the thread locked. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.
Matalino Gallente Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:30:00 - [8] You should ask your mate about where he gets his ISK. ISK donations by themselves do not set off the ISK selling alarm bells, even if they are to new players or seemingly unassociated accounts. The GM's need to find something dirty first. Then they follow the ISK/item trail until they find where it ends. Then they nerf the accounts along the way.
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:33:00 - [9] Originally by: Miki Fin You should just quit. Confirmed. - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:34:00 - [10] Originally by: That CableGuy My mate gave me some ISK the other day Is by any chance your mate's name "xiutgcoyt" and you first met him one day earlier ? _ SHOPS \|\| Mission rewards revamp \|\| better nanofix
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:35:00 - [11] if you believe it was in error, petition it. if it WASNT in error, and you petition it, and the GMs have to go digging, then like as not theyll ban you, just for being a pillock if nothing else. ...in accordance with the prophecy
Rubra J. S. Bach In memoriam	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:35:00 - [12] How's this for a solution? Biomass yourself.
Soporo Caldari	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:38:00 - [13] If your innocent, then I'm sorry it happened and you should ask to escalate a petition. If your not, be carefull. The last two or three rmt'ers who came here complaining and lying got owned by a Dev. He stated clear cut reasons and went into at least some detail about the deal. Much to the lolz of everyone else, btw.
That CableGuy	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:42:00 - [14] Yeah I've only been playing for a few months, my friends a CEO of a corp and has been playing from the beginning she has been trying to get me hooked for years, the amount in question was a large amount but after reading the EULA none of us have violated anything. What is a RMTer? Someone selling isk on eBay or something like this? if so she is not a rmter and doesnt sell anything, I got better things to spend my hard earned cash on then virtual currency in a game.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:47:00 - [15] Considering GM Nova is a senior GM you are either screwed or making this just up. -------- Ideas for: Mining
That CableGuy	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:47:00 - [16] the only thing that I can think of is that when I recieved the isk I was bragging in the corp chat channel and winding some people up, but this was totally harmless and incent, I cant see how that could of resulted in this action.
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:48:00 - [17] then you have nothing to hide. petition. wait. ???? profit ...in accordance with the prophecy
Xtreem Gallente Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:51:00 - [18] if u did not buy it, your bragging in corp prob made some annoyed and they petitioned you lol petition it, ask ythem to trace the isk to prove it was legit money and u will get it back
Gort Storm Guard Elite	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:54:00 - [19] If you play with the bull.... -- When in doubt, empty the magazine.
Lazuran Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:56:00 - [20] Originally by: That CableGuy According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I'd love to see those logs ... Amazing how their logs never show any bugs but can actually prove out of game transactions.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:58:00 - [21] Originally by: Gort If you play with the bull.... ...you get a sore bum nod My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
fairimear Gallente S.A.S Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:59:00 - [22] CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. If indeed this is the case and you can prove you have not purchased anything you will most probably get a. nothing out of it besides 1. alteration to the eula 2. you will get a out of court settlement. 3.You will win the case. And if you can prove that CCP has indeed made a claim they can't in fact substantiate and unfairly punished you for it. Then you will probably win damages including court costs. Now you have to take into account that such a case would be fairly land mark (altho there is president in the EU i am told) so it would be best to take it to a English court as if you fail you can eventually get to a EU court of appeal. You also would be facing the significant financial coffers of a major company with many lawyers. So i suggest you have deep pockets. IF you win or get a settlement you will open the flood gates against CCP as they (As we all know) can't actually prove isk purchase linked to a character. UNLESS ofc they are running a fake isk selling website and banning who ever buys from them. You may also put a nail in the COFFIN of EULA's that are already heavily criticized. I wish you luck in this endeavor and greatly await the outcome of such a case. Makeing your npc hunters SS.
That CableGuy	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:00:00 - [23] Ok then I'll petition and wait. thanks for your help
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:01:00 - [24] noone is gonna bite on that one fairimear. surely....... ...in accordance with the prophecy
Paramite Pies Minmatar Kasrkin Innovative Assembly	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:02:00 - [25] Petition. It's probably a misunderstanding. I give my own characters and some other players money all the time and have never gotten a warning like that. __________________ If you ask me, these people who think EVE is a PVP game need to stop playing EVE. and if you asked me again, I'd tell you that you need to stop complaining about being killed.
Ogul Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations United Front Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:06:00 - [26] I would like to see the real money transfer show up in CCP's logs... --- Don't put your trust in revolutions. They always come around again. That's why they're called revolutions. People die, and nothing changes.
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:07:00 - [27] Originally by: Matalino You should ask your mate about where he gets his ISK. ISK donations by themselves do not set off the ISK selling alarm bells, even if they are to new players or seemingly unassociated accounts. The GM's need to find something dirty first. Then they follow the ISK/item trail until they find where it ends. Then they nerf the accounts along the way. Buddy of mine made a fresh alt and gave it all his isk. He intended to use it as a wallet alt until it had trained the skills (Hulk) that he wanted it to train. This had the effect of making him spend less as he had to log it in to do it. I'm telling you this story to tell you another: The alt got banned for "Buying isk". He then had to go ten rounds with CCP over the fact that his name, credit card, and email were all the same on both accounts so he could prove that he didn't buy anything. After two weeks of what he referred to as ultimate BS, they unbanned the account. He gave his corp all his stuff and isk, and quit EVE. He also gave his main character away to the first person that was willing to pay the transfer fee. GM's can, and do, fumble the ball. If the isk is legit, petition it, and be willing to go to stupid lengths to prove it is legit. Good luck to you. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:14:00 - [28] Originally by: Ogul I would like to see the real money transfer show up in CCP's logs... Given a little bit of effort you can find a lot of the RMT types yourself (and i dont mean by buying isk yourself.) Also, its not a huge leap for a GM to check that his mate xzghyfl who gave him the money, recieved it from ghgfhjio, dhioha, higohioa, beagle crackle and xxghrrh and all use the same IP as used by www.muchbestcheapgoldevemyfriend.com ...in accordance with the prophecy
Thuranni B and D	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:17:00 - [29] Edited by: Thuranni on 29/08/2008 20:18:04 Originally by: fairimear CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. If indeed this is the case and you can prove you have not purchased anything you will most probably get a. nothing out of it besides 1. alteration to the eula 2. you will get a out of court settlement. 3.You will win the case. And if you can prove that CCP has indeed made a claim they can't in fact substantiate and unfairly punished you for it. Then you will probably win damages including court costs. Now you have to take into account that such a case would be fairly land mark (altho there is president in the EU i am told) so it would be best to take it to a English court as if you fail you can eventually get to a EU court of appeal. You also would be facing the significant financial coffers of a major company with many lawyers. So i suggest you have deep pockets. IF you win or get a settlement you will open the flood gates against CCP as they (As we all know) can't actually prove isk purchase linked to a character. UNLESS ofc they are running a fake isk selling website and banning who ever buys from them. You may also put a nail in the COFFIN of EULA's that are already heavily criticized. I wish you luck in this endeavor and greatly await the outcome of such a case. What the **** is wrong with you? Hai guyz lets sue people over internet spaceship pretend money.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:18:00 - [30] If CCP were threatening you, they'd say "Wrangler and PrimX are coming over with a crate of bree" My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:30:00 - [31] Originally by: Sheriff Jones If CCP were threatening you, they'd say "Wrangler and PrimX are coming over with a crate of bree" lol, thats not a threat! thats the promise of a good night ...in accordance with the prophecy
Aalana D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:30:00 - [32] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Originally by: Gort If you play with the bull.... ...you get a sore bum nod Haha Confirmed, convo Volarius ingame he will send you a video link I'm sure.
Borini	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:35:00 - [33] oh gods the bree word fell. Just wait there will be 100 GM's comming into this thread verry soon. but good luck with your petition.
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:40:00 - [34] Originally by: Borini oh gods the bree word fell. Just wait there will be 100 GM's comming into this thread verry soon. but good luck with your petition. nah I think were safe for a bit, its friday night, theyll be busy actually partaking of the bree *he said it again! Stone him! ...in accordance with the prophecy
Major PewPew The Dark Horses	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:49:00 - [35] OP...your friends name, did it look anything like "alrzzwwzjkf" ? If so...then :welp:
Arkeladin	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:54:00 - [36] Originally by: fairimear CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. If indeed this is the case and you can prove you have not purchased anything you will most probably get a. nothing out of it besides 1. alteration to the eula 2. you will get a out of court settlement. 3.You will win the case. And if you can prove that CCP has indeed made a claim they can't in fact substantiate and unfairly punished you for it. Then you will probably win damages including court costs. Now you have to take into account that such a case would be fairly land mark (altho there is president in the EU i am told) so it would be best to take it to a English court as if you fail you can eventually get to a EU court of appeal. You also would be facing the significant financial coffers of a major company with many lawyers. So i suggest you have deep pockets. IF you win or get a settlement you will open the flood gates against CCP as they (As we all know) can't actually prove isk purchase linked to a character. UNLESS ofc they are running a fake isk selling website and banning who ever buys from them. You may also put a nail in the COFFIN of EULA's that are already heavily criticized. I wish you luck in this endeavor and greatly await the outcome of such a case. There is precedence (of a sort) inthe US too - in the case of Blizzard Activiusion vs. MDY Industries. If you're not familiar with the case, Blizzard took the makers of the "WoWGlider" bot to court - and won in summary judgment. Link to article discussing this: Discussion on Terra Nova about Blizzard vs. MDY Virtually Blind's take on the issue What that means is simple: EULAs now have precedent in the US courts of being a legally enforceable contract, subject to the same actions that any other contract has. So, under that precendent, if the OP is indeed telling the truth, there's legal recourse IF he can prove that the accusation is false, and the actions taken by CCP were in breach of their own EULA. If the opposite, then CCP has the same legal right. So, your supposition that EULAs are on "legally shaky ground" may need some reconsidering.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Eomar Originally by: Borini oh gods the bree word fell. Just wait there will be 100 GM's comming into this thread verry soon. but good luck with your petition. nah I think were safe for a bit, its friday night, theyll be busy actually partaking of the bree he said it again! Stone him! Must...resist....urge...to....argh!!! GM Leader: Noo don't say that word! Eomar: What word? GM Leader: I cannot say, suffice to say, it is the one words that the GMs who say CCP can't hear!! Eomar: I just had a bree! GM Leader: Aaaah! E' said it again! AAAAA!!! Eomar: Look, we can't bloody well have a bree in peace if GM Leader: Aaaaah!!! Eomar: What, "if"? GM Leader: No, you couldn't get very far in the CCP if you didn't say "if"! Eomar: Well nevermind, hand me over another one. GM Leader: What, a bree? AAAAH! Now i said bree!! Oh no i said bree again!! AAAAH! That's a triple! My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.*
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:08:00 - [38] Quote: CCP does not guarantee that it will continue to offer access to the System or support the Game. CCP may, in its sole discretion, cease to provide any or all of the services offered in connection with EVE (including access to the System and any or all features or components of the Game), terminate the EULA, close all Accounts and cancel all of the rights granted to you under the EULA. Where is your god now? - DesuSigs
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:13:00 - [39] Originally by: Sheriff Jones GM Leader: Noo don't say that word! Eomar: What word? GM Leader: I cannot say, suffice to say, it is the one words that the GMs who say CCP can't hear!! Eomar: I just had a bree! GM Leader: Aaaah! E' said it again! AAAAA!!! Eomar: Look, we can't bloody well have a bree in peace if GM Leader: Aaaaah!!! Eomar: What, "if"? GM Leader: No, you couldn't get very far in the CCP if you didn't say "if"! Eomar: Well nevermind, hand me over another one. GM Leader: What, a bree? AAAAH! Now i said bree!! Oh no i said bree again!! AAAAH! That's a triple! ahh see you were thinking of this (4:30 ish) whereas i was thinking of this! both are more than applicable tho :D ...in accordance with the prophecy
Joey Meow MURAKAMI INDUSTRIES	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:21:00 - [40] Awwwww... the exclamation mark is upset, awwwwwww. 1) Post with your main. 2) GM's Investigate every major ISK transfer, so you did not get " some ISK" you must have gotten ALLOT of ISK. 3) They usually keep track of the ISK Sellers, and target the buyers 4) "Give Money" feature is to actually GIVE THE MONEY to other people, as I have done hundreds of times in very large amounts, and CCP never had an issue with me or the people to whom the ISK was transfered to - perhaps because I am not Buying/Selling ISK, don't know, it is a mystery to me. Give us ALL DETAILS, before anyone on this forums can render judgement: 1) When did you start the game/How long have you been playing? 2) How long has your friend (the one who "gave you some ISK" has been around? 3) How much exactly did your friend give you? 4) Have your friend come to this forums and confirm that he gave you the ISK. We can go from there... Oh... and here is the quote I usually get for my petitions: " Best of luck, we hope that you will quickly recover from your loss."
Dmian Gallente Starline Engineering Corporation	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:26:00 - [41] Edited by: Dmian on 29/08/2008 21:27:54 Originally by: That CableGuy Private rant only pertaining to the OP and the GM EVE Forum Rules, point 9: Quote: 9. Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned. You should edit your post, I think. ---- Eve Alpha - The font of Eve - Get it here
Uncle Mo Infusion. The Firm.	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:28:00 - [42] OP should just quit. Can I have your, well, the rest of your stuff?
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:31:00 - [43] Originally by: Uncle Mo OP should just quit. Can I have your, well, the rest of your stuff? wait, he got stuff given to him, and got nerfed now you wanna risk getting stuff FROM him?! dude... talk about livin life on the edge :D ...in accordance with the prophecy
Rubra J. S. Bach In memoriam	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:32:00 - [44] I'd love to see a GM comment on this and own the OP.
Feilamya Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:32:00 - [45] The OP is an RMTer and the story is obviously fake. The point is to disrupt CCP's actions against RMTers by causing the community to go RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE!! because some unknown innocent guy with a randomly generated name got his wallet inversed.
Eomar Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:34:00 - [46] Originally by: Feilamya The OP is an RMTer and the story is obviously fake. The point is to disrupt CCP's actions against RMTers by causing the community to go RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE!! because some unknown innocent guy with a randomly generated name got his wallet inversed. epic fail then. again. given every time someone posts this kind of story the generic response is lowgbtwgiefstuffplz ...in accordance with the prophecy
Quincunx Minmatar Subspace Anomaly	Posted - 2008.08.29 21:42:00 - [47] Edited by: Quincunx on 29/08/2008 21:43:00 Originally by: fairimear CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. Really, on what basis? The stuff you "own" in the game, aren't actually yours. It's all property of CCP, and they can do with it they want. Steal it, take it away from you and give it to someone else, or whatever they can think of. It's theirs. You cannot take them to court for that.
sneakybustard	Posted - 2008.08.29 22:10:00 - [48] so.. what is next? i cant give any money for my alt to do shopping in highsec cos it looks like he got money from nothing? wtf
Armoured C Gallente The Aztecs Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.08.29 22:16:00 - [49] almost as bad as me seening in a friednly chat a 1 day person who has a navy mega going what can i fit on it.... i petitioned it =) stop messing up ma economy =)
Thorradin State Protectorate	Posted - 2008.08.29 23:10:00 - [50] Edited by: Thorradin on 29/08/2008 23:10:19 He could post his full API key here and we could see who his friend is and then look them up in game if their friend isn't Mr. Face Smashes Keyboard.
Asestorian Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.08.29 23:21:00 - [51] Interestingly, the last few times someone posted a topic about their friend giving them ISK and then the GMs taking it away, the GMs publicly and without mercy showed the world how they definitely did buy ISK, and did so in great detail. In any case. If you are telling the truth and this is a mistake, your petition and perseverance should get you the right result. The GMs are of course suspicious of people petitioning about this subject because you can imagine how annoyed people might get spending real life money for ingame money and items, only to have those things taken away, thus losing both the real life money and the ISK/items. --- Quote: EVE is unfair by design.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.08.29 23:22:00 - [52] You can't sue them for taking ISK away from you, everything ingame is still their property and is shown in the UELA.
fairimear Gallente S.A.S Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2008.08.29 23:37:00 - [53] There is precedence (of a sort) inthe US too - in the case of Blizzard Activiusion vs. MDY Industries. If you're not familiar with the case, Blizzard took the makers of the "WoWGlider" bot to court - and won in summary judgment. Link to article discussing this: Discussion on Terra Nova about Blizzard vs. MDY Virtually Blind's take on the issue What that means is simple: EULAs now have precedent in the US courts of being a legally enforceable contract, subject to the same actions that any other contract has. So, under that precendent, if the OP is indeed telling the truth, there's legal recourse IF he can prove that the accusation is false, and the actions taken by CCP were in breach of their own EULA. If the opposite, then CCP has the same legal right. So, your supposition that EULAs are on "legally shaky ground" may need some reconsidering. This is true. But the case you point out is related to infringement of copy right and the use of a 3rd part application on Their software As such. And in this term the EULA's are actually fairly sound and legally tight. The obvious main flaw with EULA's are that as large as the company's are that own the software. There is almost no MMO available now where 95% of the subscribing population would not prefer ownership of what they have in game to be theres. This is causing a environment of endless support for this argument every time it comes up. Combine it with a massive increase in virtual purchases there are more and more restrictions likely on company's to protect customers who deal in Virtual purchases in future. This will have a knock on against MMOG owners as the EULA's are often the rights for these company's to be Laws upon to them self. As it was put to me "These company's who create universes seem to think their universes are outside the rules of reality and modern society when it comes to how they treat their customers". In the US its been stated in court that there is no current decision on the general viability of EULA's. However there is precedence that at least 1 type of EULA is invalid. And YES Eve's EULA does indeed fall into this category. They are called Click wrap EULA's. the type where it comes up after instillation and often after purchase. For a start these EULA's are often unreadable before you pay the company money for their product. More importantly now though it has been found that often these EULA's are altered (often drastically) without fair notification to a already payed or subscribing player base. Obviously a change to a contract invalidates it. And as this is bypassed with the click wrap system of the EULA appearing each load up in a fashion most mmo developers admit to knowing gets overlooked after the first "click" it is seen by many as a flawed method. Even more confounded by professional gamers and industry professionals having said "the fact many mmog's feature a jump to bottom on their EULA's seems to encourage this behavior" Many are now saying that in fact if this is what they are doing they should not expect anything but trouble. final a interesting point i was told a few weeks ago; this is being made worse by South Korea who have now opened addiction clinics for gamers. some in the US are now saying that developers are being deliberately naive when they know full well that their products will easily have people accepting EULA's via the skip click or scroll click because they are addicted to the product. This however is totally irrelevant here as the only thing brought up is a dubious at best claim that CCP are claiming proof of something they cant have. So as such it would be a case of false accusation Makeing your npc hunters SS.
fairimear Gallente S.A.S Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2008.08.29 23:42:00 - [54] Originally by: Quincunx Edited by: Quincunx on 29/08/2008 21:43:00 Originally by: fairimear CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. Really, on what basis? The stuff you "own" in the game, aren't actually yours. It's all property of CCP, and they can do with it they want. Steal it, take it away from you and give it to someone else, or whatever they can think of. It's theirs. You cannot take them to court for that. And you can take some one to court for nearly anything. Especially in debate of ownership of something. As it happens you are hitting a good point though. You would get first told that indeed you have agreed to a contract that states this. However and this is why the EULA debate is key. You then have to first challenge the validity of the EULA. Ofc if you win most people would say the next step would be a almost unstoppable claim to rights of virtual ownership. Makeing your npc hunters SS.
Hieronimus Rex Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.08.30 00:08:00 - [55] OP - next time when you buy ISK...use a disposable alt on a demo account, use your bought ISK to buy some zyd in some backwater system. Fly out, jet the can and give it to your main, delete the alt, and sell the zyd with your main. Completely untraceable. Remember CCP's usual "oh our logs don't show anything?" Yeah...they won't show that either... I guess it's good for CCP that ISK buyers are not only lazy but also dumb. Originally by: Andrue Originally by: That CableGuy My mate gave me some ISK the other day and today when I logged into eve I noticed my wallet had been emptied and that I'd received an eve email from GM NOVA saying:- According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I donÆt understand this; nothing was exchanged for real currency! I donÆt get it, I quote "it says our logs show you received items in exchange for real currency" this is just not possible and never happened!, why is there a "give money" feature in the game if you cant use it? What should I do, I feel quite threatened. Your 'friend' probably bought Isk using real-life money then gave you some of it. Unfortunately illegally obtained Isk has to be removed from the game regardless of who eventually gets it. It's the same in real life. If you receive stolen goods they will usually be taken off you and returned to their rightful owner regardless of whether you paid for them or not. Haha, what a silly RL analogy. Last I checked, if you buy 10bil ISK and then buy 10 carriers from random people, your wallet gets set to -10bil and nothing happens to the carrier vendors. I guess in this case its slightly different since if the OP's statements are reliable (probably not) then he got ISK for nothing.
Malcanis Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.08.30 00:11:00 - [56] Originally by: fairimear CCP Has EVE's server in London (last i heard). CCP also has a office in Atlanta. Meaning if you so wish you can take CCP to court for such things. If indeed this is the case and you can prove you have not purchased anything you will most probably get a. nothing out of it besides 1. alteration to the eula 2. you will get a out of court settlement. 3.You will win the case. And if you can prove that CCP has indeed made a claim they can't in fact substantiate and unfairly punished you for it. Then you will probably win damages including court costs. Now you have to take into account that such a case would be fairly land mark (altho there is president in the EU i am told) so it would be best to take it to a English court as if you fail you can eventually get to a EU court of appeal. You also would be facing the significant financial coffers of a major company with many lawyers. So i suggest you have deep pockets. IF you win or get a settlement you will open the flood gates against CCP as they (As we all know) can't actually prove isk purchase linked to a character. UNLESS ofc they are running a fake isk selling website and banning who ever buys from them. You may also put a nail in the COFFIN of EULA's that are already heavily criticized. I wish you luck in this endeavor and greatly await the outcome of such a case. Completely wrong. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.08.30 00:15:00 - [57] Originally by: That CableGuy My mate gave me some ISK the other day and today when I logged into eve I noticed my wallet had been emptied and that I'd received an eve email from GM NOVA saying:- According to our logs show you have received in game items in exchange for real currency this is a Eula violation and such items have been removed and further violations of this may result in a ban. I donÆt understand this; nothing was exchanged for real currency! I donÆt get it, I quote "it says our logs show you received items in exchange for real currency" this is just not possible and never happened!, why is there a "give money" feature in the game if you cant use it? What should I do, I feel quite threatened. If you feel threatened, you can publish your API Key. That will not allow anyone to DO anything with your account, but it will allow anyone to LOOK at your wallet transactions. You can use it to prove your innocence. And if you are innocent, you'll get the support you're looking for. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.

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