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Freighters and high-sec.

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Ting Mei Gallente RD-XS24	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:30:00 - [1] Hello. I'm let say, a rookie player. I would like to know what is the risk for a frighter to travel alone only in highsec region ? Does this kind of ship will be easily target ? Ting.
Black Leather	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:32:00 - [2] By the time you are in a freighter, you will not be a rookie anymore
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:33:00 - [3] Originally by: Ting Mei Hello. I'm let say, a rookie player. I would like to know what is the risk for a frighter to travel alone only in highsec region ? Does this kind of ship will be easily target ? Ting. After the security changes? Risk to a freighter = 0. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Eran Laude Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:39:00 - [4] Freighters cost 1 bil right now, including the racial skillbook. Thus you will not be flying one as a rookie pilot Also, unless you have enough ISK to buy and sell an entire holds-worth of goods, minerals, ships or mods, etc., or you need it for corporate operations, or have an extensive fleet of ships and mods that need hauling regularly, then a freighter isn't going to be much use to you Anyway, post this-patch, you will likely be able to do very little wrong in a freighter, except transport a whole cargo-hold full of domination mods . Just get someone to web you [it makes you align helluva lot faster] and if necessary, a sizeable escort.
Shintai Gallente Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:39:00 - [5] Edited by: Shintai on 02/09/2008 16:39:43 Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Ting Mei Hello. I'm let say, a rookie player. I would like to know what is the risk for a frighter to travel alone only in highsec region ? Does this kind of ship will be easily target ? Ting. After the security changes? Risk to a freighter = 0. Couldnt be more wrong. Freighters will still be the exact same target. But the thorax vs indy or caracal vs badger on alt/trial accounts might quickly be gone. Ganking didnt die when krestels with cruise missiles dissapeared either...did it? -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:41:00 - [6] Originally by: Shintai Couldnt be more wrong. Freighters will still be the exact same target. But the thorax vs indy or caracal vs badger on alt/trial accounts might quickly be gone. Ganking didnt die when krestels with cruise missiles dissapeared either...did it? Run the numbers. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Clair Bear Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.09.02 16:50:00 - [7] Edited by: Clair Bear on 02/09/2008 16:50:27 Edited by: Clair Bear on 02/09/2008 16:49:54 -- agreeing with Ki An, not arguing. Originally by: Ki An Run the numbers. Approximately 20-24 t2 fitted battleships flown by nicely skilled pilots to gank a freighter in a .5. And if you tried to get 10 people together for a suicide gank you'd see how twice that many is an impossibility outside of a corp/alliance whose job it is to gank freighters. Those guys are pros, they aren't going to do it for lulz -- they'll look for juicy targets. Add to that the added grinding time apres gank and you're 99.9% safe unless you're hauling 6B+ afk.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:01:00 - [8] Originally by: Clair Bear Edited by: Clair Bear on 02/09/2008 16:50:27 Edited by: Clair Bear on 02/09/2008 16:49:54 -- agreeing with Ki An, not arguing. Originally by: Ki An Run the numbers. Approximately 20-24 t2 fitted battleships flown by nicely skilled pilots to gank a freighter in a .5. And if you tried to get 10 people together for a suicide gank you'd see how twice that many is an impossibility outside of a corp/alliance whose job it is to gank freighters. Those guys are pros, they aren't going to do it for lulz -- they'll look for juicy targets. Add to that the added grinding time apres gank and you're 99.9% safe unless you're hauling 6B+ afk. I.e. you need a serious gang too gank a freighter. Seem pretty right.
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:10:00 - [9] Originally by: Venkul Mul I.e. you need a serious gang too gank a freighter. Seem pretty right. And you also need to be seriously wealthy, as you can't make even little profit for it. That means that all freighters that aren't positively IDed as running logistics for 0.0 alliances are 100% safe. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Cyberman Mastermind	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:19:00 - [10] Edited by: Cyberman Mastermind on 02/09/2008 17:26:22 Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Venkul Mul I.e. you need a serious gang too gank a freighter. Seem pretty right. And you also need to be seriously wealthy, as you can't make even little profit for it. That means that all freighters that aren't positively IDed as running logistics for 0.0 alliances are 100% safe. I just checked the patch notes - insurance nerf is not (yet?) in. So you still can gank at little loss. Perhaps they will add it later on, but I suppose they're still thinking about it.

Spurty Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:21:00 - [11] never ever AFK a freighter. Warp to 0 is your friend Man goes to the doc, with a strawberry growing out of his head. Doc says "I'll give you some cream to put on it."
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:26:00 - [12] Originally by: Cyberman Mastermind I just checked the patch notes - insurance nerf is not (yet?) in. So you still can gank at little loss. PERHAPS they will add it later on, but AFAIK they're still thinking about it. Otherwise they'd put it in right now, I'd say. No, they have made up their minds about it. The insurance thing is being implemented. There's no 'perhaps' about it. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Ryoji Tanakama Caldari Firestar Drive Yards	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:27:00 - [13] Originally by: Cyberman Mastermind Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Venkul Mul I.e. you need a serious gang too gank a freighter. Seem pretty right. And you also need to be seriously wealthy, as you can't make even little profit for it. That means that all freighters that aren't positively IDed as running logistics for 0.0 alliances are 100% safe. I just checked the patch notes - insurance nerf is not (yet?) in. So you still can gank at little loss. PERHAPS they will add it later on, but AFAIK they're still thinking about it. Otherwise they'd put it in right now, I'd say. Indeed. However the security hit has been beefed up, and security dodgers are banned, so this should dissuade the casual ganker - or at least they'll make sure the cargo is worth it first.
Cyberman Mastermind	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:28:00 - [14] Originally by: Ki An No, they have made up their minds about it. The insurance thing is being implemented. There's no 'perhaps' about it. Well, I reread the dev-blog(and edited my post). Still, I don't think they're really goint to implement it without judging how the current new mechanics work out first. Dev Blogs aren't cast in stone. Or shouldn't be.
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:32:00 - [15] Originally by: Cyberman Mastermind Well, I reread the dev-blog(and edited my post). Still, I don't think they're really goint to implement it without judging how the current new mechanics work out first. Dev Blogs aren't cast in stone. Or shouldn't be. Read the statements of CCP Greyscale in one of the other threads here on the forums. It's a certainty. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Spurty Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:32:00 - [16] Edited by: Spurty on 02/09/2008 17:34:04 cite:http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=577 "In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future. The CONCORD changes and Security penalty will be hitting TQ this fall, with Empyrean Age 1.1. " Correction, It doesn't look like its in this patch Man goes to the doc, with a strawberry growing out of his head. Doc says "I'll give you some cream to put on it."
Cytral	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:33:00 - [17] Your only exxception to being safe is if your in a faction militia
Cyberman Mastermind	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:37:00 - [18] Originally by: Ki An Read the statements of CCP Greyscale in one of the other threads here on the forums. It's a certainty. I did. While I'm not quite sure what he's trying to say, I don't think he wants to turn eve into a fluffy land. I'll wait and see what happens. Have to admit, though, the changes aren't really in a way that would affect or hurt me. (Well, unless eve really dies because of it.)
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:41:00 - [19] Edited by: Venkul Mul on 02/09/2008 17:41:14 Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Venkul Mul I.e. you need a serious gang too gank a freighter. Seem pretty right. And you also need to be seriously wealthy, as you can't make even little profit for it. That means that all freighters that aren't positively IDed as running logistics for 0.0 alliances are 100% safe. It is fun how one of the "nerf level 4 missions, they give isk without risk" is one of the great supporters of "suicide gank should be without risk and cost, we should get full insurance refunds". Coherency is not a strong trait in you. Edit: spelling.
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:43:00 - [20] Originally by: Venkul Mul It is fun how one of the "nerf level 4 missions, they give isk without risk" is one of the great supporters of "suicide gank should be without risk and cost, we should get full insurance refunds". Coherency is not a strong trait in you. Edit: spelling. What's fun is how you can consider "100% chance of losing your ship and 50% chance of making a profit from someone who has 100% chance of avoiding you all together" to be risk free. Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting

Spurty Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:46:00 - [21] Originally by: Venkul Mul It is fun how one of the "nerf level 4 missions, they give isk without risk" is one of the great supporters of "suicide gank should be without risk and cost, we should get full insurance refunds". Coherency is not a strong trait in you. Ah good detective work, I was working on that assumption. Trying not to derail however, I did run some locator agents on the people wanting L4s nerfed, interesting systems some of them live in. They need not worry about moving L4 mission running carebears to shoot in lowsec. They will have 'more important concerns' one day. Man goes to the doc, with a strawberry growing out of his head. Doc says "I'll give you some cream to put on it."
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 17:47:00 - [22] Originally by: Spurty Trying not to derail however, I did run some locator agents on the people wanting L4s nerfed, interesting systems some of them live in. They need not worry about moving L4 mission running carebears to shoot in lowsec. They will have 'more important concerns' one day. What's interesting about it? Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Seeing EyeDog	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:14:00 - [23] Originally by: Ting Mei Hello. I'm let say, a rookie player. I would like to know what is the risk for a frighter to travel alone only in highsec region ? Does this kind of ship will be easily target ? Ting. after todays patch, it would take about 40 fully fit BS to take u down...no risk, maximum reward _____________________ Originally by: Locus Bey Intelligence isn't a prequisite for being a Goon, in fact its a deficit.
Malcanis RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:17:00 - [24] Originally by: Ting Mei Hello. I'm let say, a rookie player. I would like to know what is the risk for a frighter to travel alone only in highsec region ? Does this kind of ship will be easily target ? Ting. After today, a freighter with less than 5-8 billion ISK in cargo will not be ganked unless the owner has done something to cause someone wealthy enough to fund his grudges to have him ganked. In other words, your risk is essentially zero as long as you refrain from mouthing off in local. (And close to zero even if you do) CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:18:00 - [25] Originally by: Spurty Originally by: Venkul Mul It is fun how one of the "nerf level 4 missions, they give isk without risk" is one of the great supporters of "suicide gank should be without risk and cost, we should get full insurance refunds". Coherency is not a strong trait in you. Ah good detective work, I was working on that assumption. Trying not to derail however, I did run some locator agents on the people wanting L4s nerfed, interesting systems some of them live in. They need not worry about moving L4 mission running carebears to shoot in lowsec. They will have 'more important concerns' one day. Fascinating. Please elucidate. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Trader Jen	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:22:00 - [26] Originally by: Spurty Edited by: Spurty on 02/09/2008 17:34:04 cite:http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=577 "In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future. The CONCORD changes and Security penalty will be hitting TQ this fall, with Empyrean Age 1.1. " Correction, It doesn't look like its in this patch this patch is 1.1...is it not?
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:25:00 - [27] Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Venkul Mul It is fun how one of the "nerf level 4 missions, they give isk without risk" is one of the great supporters of "suicide gank should be without risk and cost, we should get full insurance refunds". Coherency is not a strong trait in you. Edit: spelling. What's fun is how you can consider "100% chance of losing your ship and 50% chance of making a profit from someone who has 100% chance of avoiding you all together" to be risk free. Ki, as usual you are a hypocrite. You lose the ship but get full insurance refund. That mean that at most you spend 4-8 millions to gank a ship. If you are so stupid that you chose a target that will no give that back is your problem. Gankin in high sec, as long a insurance is paid, is risk free as you don't risk any isk loss even if you do that half asleep.
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:34:00 - [28] Originally by: Venkul Mul Ki, as usual you are a hypocrite. You lose the ship but get full insurance refund. That mean that at most you spend 4-8 millions to gank a ship. If you are so stupid that you chose a target that will no give that back is your problem. Gankin in high sec, as long a insurance is paid, is risk free as you don't risk any isk loss even if you do that half asleep. Hypocrite you say, eh? How about the fact that risk vs reward was wrong, according to you, until insurance is removed, but now that it will be, risk for a freighter is 0?
Spurty Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:36:00 - [29] Originally by: Malcanis Fascinating. Please elucidate. positioning spies, no intel for you
Disteeler Primera Fundacion	Posted - 2008.09.02 18:40:00 - [30] Can you suicide gank a freighter in high sec, regardless insurance and other "nerf" policies? YES Only gankers with more than a pair of neurons will survive this, others will miserabily fail.



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