insincere apology = fake apology.

One is done, both here and to the miner. Three is done. Two takes a post, and I should probably discuss it with the CSM before I mash butan.

I think Two Step would make a fine Chairman, though.

Quick someone check on the victim! Oh. Right.

This whole "scandal" is ******* stupid.

To those of both sides, I really don't think at this point you matter.

If the mackinaw pilot is squared, and the Mittani is squared with this, GG
Joke or severe, actions handled, I will say to those with so called morals "Eye for an eye leaves everyone blind." And those without, well karmas a *****, hence the revelations of your leader. Now get over yourselves.

Its not just about the victim, its about the next guy or the next 10 or more down the line that this can happen too whom may or may not be as well off to not commit suicide under harassment at the beck and call of a more powerful person.


You guys since the beginning have missed this point.

He really needs to step down at a bare minimum.

And example needs to be set here.

Let's be straight, and not over look some important facts.

You made the presentation prior to going to the panel. (your intentions at this point were clear)
You spoke @ the panel. (you acted on your intentions prior to the fanfest)
Your members backed what you said for several days here on the forums. (further showing that these intentions were/are shared by a larger group of associates)

Now you apologize. For yourself, for your associates, for who? To save face?




Just goes to show how sincere this apology really is.

Bigger people in the real world have apologized and resigned from real positions of power, for much much smaller things.
That being said, make the sacrifice to make it sincere. Integrity.

If you had not made it a part of your actual presentation, it could be ran off as a mistake, mis-speaking.
If your fellow members didn't stand behind what you said, and pander all over the EVE-O forums like monkeys, it could have again, been ran off as a mistake.


The fact is you made this an actual part of your presentation, then followed through with presenting it, as humor.
Then your members, friends, associates, supporters ran all over the EVE-O forums stating their support of your words, for this or that reason, further creating even more problems, divides and ultimately much deeper issues within the eve community.



Apologizing for bumping into someone. acceptable
Apologizing for spilling some water on someone on accident. acceptable
Apologizing for accidentally hurting someone. acceptable

Apologizing for deliberately trying to cause harm to someone utilizing a video game as your execution platform. Unacceptable.
Apologizing for egging others on to cause harm to another via a video game. Unacceptable.

It's called cyber bullying, and like it or not, it's not funny. Even if it's meant in jest.
Your words and actions do not just effect the individual you were targeting but an entire community of players. Cause & Effect.

Did you miss the part where the victim in question is a 30-something year old guy who doesn't remember the incident and doesn't really care? Post with your titan main you gigantic baby, your precious ship is still getting nerfed.

What?

Drinking and driving is an act that in itself is a crime. If no accident occurs and no one is harmed, it is still a crime.

Cyber Bullying is NOT a victimless crime. By it's definition it requires a victim being bullied to be a crime. In this case the person portrayed as the "victim" doesn't give a rats ass about the whole thing, thinks it's a big joke, and came out 10 bil ahead in the game.

Trying to convince someone that they are a victim when they, as a mature adult, firmly and honestly state that they were not victimized is the height of stupidity.

This got exactly what it warranted, and apology for a bad joke at the players expense (even though he wasn't aware of it).

Why haven't we heard anyone complaining about the horrible embarrassment suffered by those poor people who had their singing played during the panel? Oh how they must have died.

The Mittani is an online gaming character. I don't care what he
does in the EVE universe.

Alex Gianturco is a representive of The EVE online gaming community.
His face is the one people will see when they assess this community.
He should step down now.

Somebody could make a complaint to the police (I am in no way suggesting it) but there could be issues over who has jurisdiction. Iceland, America or the country the victim comes from.

Internet law is in it's infancy, and I think getting police involved is going way too far for this case.

The best part about this thread is all the people equating sticks and stones to a mortal sin when this game has always been about theft, subterfuge, murder, destruction, and all sorts of other wonderful terms that make the original event pale in comparison.

Just what game have all of you been playing all this time? Do you even have time to get anything done, or are you just filing petitions the whole time you're online?

To be surprised that someone does something against the grain is just.... well.... I can't think of a better word than stupid. I tried, I really did!

This wasn't in the sandbox, this was at a massive PR event organised by our game's developer. It's an embarassment to the EVE community, many of whom elected Mittens for reasons totally separate to his goon-ness.

Time for him to resign from the CSM, for the good of the game. What CCP do to the player as a meritable punishment for something this crass, I donno, but if he's banned, so be it.

You know, I've made my jabs at Mitanni, but I've been thinking. Maybe we should give the guy a little bit of a break. He's really only human, right? We humans sometimes screw up.

The grieving and trolling are part of the game, and CCP discloses in the EULA that it is. The minute you start playing on this game, you agree to all sorts of briefing and general asshattery. Deal with it. There are no laws that can do anything against CCP. I always find the ESRB sticker saying 'online interactions are not rated' as slightly humorous when applied to this whole scenario.

I understand what you mean, but what bothers me is the lack of information that we have received about this 'victim'. Other than the e-mail (which could of been forged) and his contact name, this all could of been an elaborate ruse, a stunt, in which Mittens wished to play out because, well let's be honest, they couldn't do another 'GSF history' session every single fanfest.

Now if it was true then yes, as you have stated, the upside to this would of been the intent to make his life miserable, I for one would understand that since I am, after all, a Goonie.

Now would I class what he stated as cyber-bullying? No, I wouldn't. In fact for what he said, it could of been a whole lot worse. He said a simple quip, a soundbyte, nothing more. When compared to far more 'elaborate' insults and quips, what he said was really not that bad. Short-sighted? Of course, though I doubt anyone would of expected this kind of backlash from what was said.

I think his apology is more than enough really, those that are asking for more is actually causing more harm than good.

Just 2 hours ago I got told to go die in a fire in a fight. Is this bullying?

also f y i there is no goddamn possibility of a wrongful death lawsuit

you're absolutely retarded goddamn

As someone who's hung out with Alex once or twice in the past - and as a W-space pilot with virtually nothing at stake in the spergtastic melodrama-saturated world of alliance politics - I think his response to his (colossal) mistake is genuine. When we play this game, whether we're explicit RPers or not, we're all playing roles. I'm a combat pilot who thrives on conflict and maybe a little in-game trolling from time to time, but that's because this is all just internet spaceships. Nothing is ever really at stake in Eve Online, so being an obnoxious jerk to strangers in New Eden amounts to nothing in real life. In real life, I'm just some guy with a job, a fiancee, and a desire to make the real world a better place.

I don't know Alex that well, but we got on fine the few times that we hung out. The fact that he let his in-game persona contaminate his actions in reality is seriously disappointing, and it was an awful thing to do, and it knocked him down several pegs in my eyes. But I at least know him well enough to know that he's not blowing smoke when he talks about resigning from the CSM and giving the miner in question all of his ISK. I have no doubt that he's actually horrified by his actions, and rightfully so. Of course, he's also bearing the consequences of having spent the past few years building up a cult of personality among the Goon bloc, and the knee-jerk responses jumping to his defense are making things worse, not better.

There's a part of me that personally resents this whole mess, because there's no game on earth like Eve Online, and I spend a lot of time and energy evangelizing this game. I want to see the sandbox MMO genre grow, and that will only happen as more people start to realize what's possible in games like Eve. But when this kind of thing happens, it just makes potential players more reluctant, and it paints Eve - and sandbox MMOs in general - as a hive of sociopathic maniacs whose sole purpose in life is to bring each other to suicidal ruin. It actually negatively impacts the genre, and I hate that this latest setback came from someone who's always spoken so highly of the player-driven sandbox.

I think resigning from the CSM is the best thing Alex can do to demonstrate that he actually feels sorry for screwing the pooch here. As for giving all his ISK to the Mac miner, I imagine that's something for the victim to decide.

TL;DR Alex was a jerk, but he's actually sorry; all this noise ain't helping.

You don't read. That's nice. Since you can't bother reading things you seem to want to argue about I'll repeat myself. I, personally, do not find his statements out of line to the extent that he has been accused of. Is it proper to incite another person to actual suicide? No. I agree with The Mittani on that point. However, you take that and run with it to your own ends. You keep trying to refocus this away from your own motivations for blowing this out of proportion. Don't worry sweetcakes, everyone with basic reading skills already knows that you have an axe to grind. You've already said as much yourself. This isn't about the person he made the joke about, its that you found something to get offended about and because you were offended by it he has to be punished. I hate to break it to you, but the world doesn't stop on a dime for things you want to get offended about.

What the fuck does this have to do with anything? He would have been on that stage had he been on the CSM 6 or not. He was there representing Goonswarm Federation, an alliance in the spaceship game Eve Online.

And since when does CCP demand that CSMs have certain qualities aside from being over 18 and willing to give out their real name?

Please, share with us your qualifications to make such statements regarding specifically the following

a) how much time you've spent on these forums
vs
b) how much time you have spent being educated by a competent authority regarding the actual profession of law


The only given is that you're a ******* windbag opportunist.

So you missed the part where it was the ALLIANCE presentations? Shocking that something missed your laser intellect and complete understanding of events. Since you think the panel was a CSM thing, let's just hammer a bit here, smash that bit in there... ahh! That's better, now reality suits your version of events!

This post is so painfully self-referential that I just have to help you see it.

By your logic, the act of sending people out to shoot internet spaceships is bad and a terrible idea because one of them might be suicidal and therefore, if they do commit suicide over you shooting their ship, you and everyone who imitated the idea of shooting those ships is responsible for that suicide. You live in a rather terrifying world where everything is everyone's fault huh?

Again, you're joining a lynch mob to turn a victim-less crime into some sort of world-ending event. Your compatriots have admitted as much. The only person who could have a right to complain about this as having been victimized by these events DOES NOT CARE. Not one iota. So, because they don't want to carry a pointless cross you take it up yourself and set about to crucify the person you don't like.

You pubbie alt corp posters need to step back from this ASAP. You are only making it a 1000 times worse then it had to be.

Goons complaining about the use of politics?

Pot, meet kettle.

Bolded the relevant part since you're not smart enough to figure it out on your own.

Well it would appear that the current suggestion of some Goons is that he "have his cake and eat it too" by stepping down from his CSM6 position, since technically CSM7 hasn't started yet. "That would actually be a pretty hilarious troll", they say. It's also apparently to "deal with nerds" like myself (they mentioned a post I had made bringing up the fact that he's offered to resign but has yet to do so).

There are far too many loopholes appearing for The Mittani to step through in order to keep his promise of resigning without actually resigning, and I would imagine he's aware of them. I predict that nothing is going to really change in regard to CSM7.

All this has happened before, it will happen again.

BoB was the example.

I dunno Rouge, someone actually dying seems a bit more clear cut to me.

Yknow the part where he actually died? Yeah that happened.

[quote=RougeOperator]

A man with an actual bullet in his head is nothing?

Also we know he ****** up (hint - You're a ******)

Calling what The Mittani did 'cyber-bullying' trivializes real cyber-bullying.

You are the scum of the internet.

LOL at the goons attempting to crap up their own CEO's apology thread like they do local in hopes that the thread is locked.

THANKS FOR RUINING FANFEST PUBBIES

Does this mean Goonswarm are carebears now?

This just in, supporting somebody's decision to appologize is "hyping them up." I swear, none of you posters can be over the age of 16.

This is why what the Chair of the CSM said is a problem. I don't like Goons, but this is right in line with what they do. But it is NOT what the CSM should stand for.

WTF? I now watched the video and this is NOTHING. We're talking about someone giving an IN-GAME NAME of another player during a GAMING CONVENTION. I initially thought that there were real names involved and the 'victim' might have been subjected to possible real-life harassment.

I was expecting some nasty stuff, but seriously, this is a joke.

Now, i am no goonfriend obviously. But wasn't it the Alliance panel (rather than a CSM event)? He was there as the CEO of the goons.

I still stand by my posts on the subject. I think the public apology was not a real requirement. Mostly because he doesn't owe you whining children anything in reference to this whole event.

Yay, I get to quote it for a third time. (Maybe eventually people will begin to actually read the apology instead of skimming and making assumptions)



See that? In case you don't understand the big words, inebriation means drunkenness. In the above quote which apparently nobody bothers to read, Mittens states that he accepts full responsibility despite the fact that he was extremely intoxicated. He's not using it as an excuse, in other words.

He didn't call for anyones death. He provided information to allow other people to provoke someone into killing themselves and told them to do so if they wished. That is bad enough but your twisting is pathetic.

I never was and never will be a Goonswarm fan.
I am pretty sure any Goon who reads the forums aswel as people I hang around with in EVE can testify to that.

However EVE would lose the ultimate badguy if they were to ban Alexander.

It's not asif there are other Goons who are even remotely capable of filling those shoes. And whom would you want to rage your anger at after The Mittani has been removed from the game?

There is nobody else in the game who invokes either ultimate adoration or loathing.
Next to that there are 10,058 accounts which voted for him. This is quit a large chunk of those who actually bothered to vote.
You can't just ignore that while sharpening your pitchforks and setting your torches ablaze.

The withhunt a lot of people are creating is not much different to what he did at teh Fanfest and you should be ashamed of it.

Everyone knows the guy is down, yet the only thing the people who don't like him are doing is kicking a man on the floor.
Do you really believe your morale code is so much better if you look at this behaviour from a distance?

On the other side we have the nay sayers. The ones who keep making it worse by badposting and trolling over an incident which wouldn't have been an incident it it was a marginal thing.

He himself accepts he made a real big mistake there, yet you can't wait to get onto the barricades and act like thugs and show howmuch bravoure you have while in the meantime the one you are suppossedly defending is doing the one thing he should do.
Remain out of the debate and talk with the CSM and CCP as how this should be handled.

Yes EVE is a harsh world indeed. On one side we have the lingering villains who just can't step away from a wrong because that's not their rep.
on the other hand we have the farmers, armed with pitch and feathers, ready to drive a villain out of town without due process.

This game isn't a spacegame with goodies from the future. This is more the Old Wild West where we all shoot (of our mouths) before thinking things through.

There is a larger part of the community detached from reality than most are willing or able to see or admit.

So my suggestion to ALL parties would be to stop posting about this thing and try to act like adults for the very first time in your EVE lives and wait to see what the grownups are going to do.

He is the Chairman of the CSM. Thus, in public, he is ALWAYS the CSM. That's the downside to being the head of an organization, you can't choose when to be a politician and when to be a Goon.

It's easy to tell others to step over their shadow while in the meantime refusing to step over your own.

And Jesus said, "Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone."

Your bashing and constant calling for his hanging is also considered socalled cyber-bullying.

My, my, what a threadnaught this turned out to be. You guys are really this upset about a game? Even a metagame at that, you should all know when to log out and go outside for a bit. I hear that the US is thawing out now, bloody seasonal changes and all.

I guess if ccp ban him for "calling for the harassment of a player until he kills himself if that is what you want to do" some will be happy, if they do not ban him then ccp is telling everyone it is OK to ask others to help you harass someone until they kill them self . seems simple to me

So in your mind, this isn't about a bad thing done by Mittani, but about hurting goons.
Wow.

:psyduck:

Have you actually watched the video or are you just resperging what you've been told?

Fellow admits his guilt, feels shame and regret, and tries to make amends (so the post goes, and whether or not he is sincere doesnt really matter). And yet half the posts of a 150 page thread are his alliance mates defending him?

Honestly if i'd made this sort of mistake and saw a bunch of my "constituents" making it worse (which you are), I'd ask them to stop. Thats just me though, and I'm the type of person that has enough common sense not to get hammered before a public speech broadcast.

there's no backpedaling little one. That was what "nothing veiled" means. I'm "ASKING" if it's ok to tell people in RL to go ahead and kill themselves than it must be ok to have it done face to face. Or do you think this behavior has no consequences so long as it's behind a computer screen?

What, you think that his constituents will be receptive of being shut out entirely? You don't think that banning him will cause more trouble for them NOW than some worthless gaming blogs giving them attention?

Get real, moron.

ambushed? lols Just say "go kill yourself" to someones face and be prepared for adult consequences. "IF" you're not willing to say something to someones face don't say it over the internet. And don't hide behind the "it's just a game" notion. One of my corpmates is from Sweden and he stated blatantly if he made a video and posted it on the internet urging people to contact his neighbor to urge him to commit suicide, it would be jail time. This was not "fun and games" like certain people here are trying to make it out to be.

Wow.

So, we've given up all pretense of actually discussing the topic at hand and degenerated to finger-pointing and name-calling, eh?

Keep shouting...if you're loud enough, someone will have to listen to you, right?

a drunk guy talking trash, threadnought at 11

Sweden isn't america, bro. Also, nice false equivalency bro~

The one taking this off-topic is the tough guy talking about how he'd take us all on IRL because he lifts and frequents bars because he's a BADASS like that

So is this why CCP ****** up the replay of the alliance panel?

I'm sorry, but this is demonstrably false. I've seen Americans drink beer in taxicabs in Freeport, Bahamas with no penalty...something that is illegal in the US. I've seen Americans use cannabis in Amsterdam. I've seen Americans patronize call girls in Thailand.

Not saying I side with your argument or against it, just that this statement is untrue.

I still don't see how this makes the laws of another country apply to Americans living in America.

you are absolutely beyond stupid


lets roleplay
LARP even

i'm in america, so are you.

"kill you are self", i say
"that's hurtful and wrong!", you say

Question Time: Where does Swedish Law become involved in this?

I've suddenly realized, to my complete horror, that I type entirely too slowly for this thread.

You're missing key info then bro. He didn't give out the guy's real name, just the in-game name of one of the guy's 23 characters.

i didn't know wis at the time he wrote that email so i'm not going to comment. He is not "emotionally unstable" now but he is dealing with ALOT of personal issues. Maybe at the time when he was closer to the end of his marriage he was more unstable I don't know...moreover it doesn't matter. This was never about how close wis is or was to actually committing suicide, it wouldn't matter if Wis had never mentioned being suicidal....how do you not fkcing get that?

No they are correct I was wrong he did NOT give out the guys real name. For that I am completely wrong.

It still does not justify what he did. Even the man himself has stated what he did was completely wrong yet these people seem to think it's still ok.

EVE, CCP and it's community are being torn to shreds in all the game websites. We are all officially sociopaths and scumbags.

No, what we think is that Mittani spoke to the guy, sent him 10 billion isk, and everything I've heard including The Wis's own words make it sound like it's a non-issue between them. Yet people who are completely uninvolved are frothing and raging on the forums about it and absolutely nothing The Mittani, me, or any goon can do will appease them, even though they weren't personally injured, so at this point we lose nothing and gain everything (entertainment) by mocking you idiots.

That would be called a joke when taken in context with the rest of what he had just said, so apparently it's okay to not only take the statement out of context it is now also okay to exaggerate what was said beyond all sense.

By all means point me to this part in the video you keep referring to where he says EMAIL THIS GUY AND TELL HIM TO KILL HIMSELF.

Oright

It doesn't exist.

You are an idiot.

Case closed.

Find him in game and gank him repeatedly.

That's the sane person's take on it. You other cockblights are ******* nuts.

What I don't understand is how does someone go from sympathetic when someone in goons commits suicide Alex treats it with human decency and even dedicating one of his Sins of a Solar Spymaster , but when it comes to someone not in goons/test he openly embrace the idea of players taking action to cause someone to commit suicide.

I wonder what would RoyofCA think of you right now. When he committed suicide did you tell goons ~deal with it~??

Yes, we do.

Most of the EVE gaming community actually cares deeply. The OTHER 290k accounts care. My guess is there is actually more players of EVE who care than there are those who do not.

Yes, this is, unfortunately, currently "business as usual" in EVE. But it should not be. Eight years ago it wasn't. Even five years ago it was usual for people to feel at least a bit silly if not ashamed if they clearly overstepped the lines and made other players seriously uncomfortable. It is just the Goonfleet and friends purposeful, deliberate destruction of the community and flaming / spamming / trolling everyone who cares into disgusted silence on the forums, that has changed our community standards from "it's just a game, I'm sorry it upsets you, I have nothing against you personally" to "lololololol it is just a game pubbie tears sweet bloobloobloo lol noob I love you crying."

The difference should be obvious to anyone who has been here long enough.

And I for one think it's way beyond time we went back to the actual sportsmanship, instead of pretending that sportsmanship is about ridiculing those who are already upset about losing.

Copy sent to Maverick via evemail, as I suspect he is not reading the thread anymore.

Digging through my mains mails, I have 14 direct death threats to me, 6 direct death threats to me and my immediate family, and 9 vague threats of vengance. I presume these will all be banned too, if CCP ban Mittens?

Then your father must be a liberal.

Man, I'm sure glad your dad is relevant to this conversation!

Holy ****, that murder by proxie hyperbole again. Can you at least try to stay on the same planet as the rest of us?

So now everyone who makes a mistake, and then owns up to it afterwards, should be considered insane and evil?

Learn to read bro.

Mittani got CCP to change their path. Because of him, blasters got fixed along with many many other things.

What is this campain to drag mittanis name throught the mud in the media going to do for the game?

So, what you're saying here is that you don't know what you're talking about.

Noted.

In addition. Lets not forget that Alexander Gianturco played Nevil Chamberlain after the televised meeting between himself and CCP thousand dollar jeans. He returned to the player base with some vague promises and unsatisfactory words and said "there will be peace in our time."

The player base erupted in more rage and subs began to dip and because nobody was happy with Mittani's compromise (which in truth was rubbish.)

CCP only acted to save their game and begin Crucible because player unsubscription showed them a glimpse into the darkness if they ignored what they were being told by the player base.

Mittani would later ride that wave and attempt to take credit but those who were there remember he was very slow to take the cause and was reacting and following events rather than leading them.

I have serious mixed feelings about all of this. On one hand, I *HATE* goons, on the other, I think that Goons is a great part of EVE and a necessary force of evil. What was said was out of line, and I appreciate the apology given. However, I do not think that The Mittani should step down from the CSM. We all say things that we shouldn't. We have all messed up and it is in fact part of human nature. I truly hope that CCP finds a legal loophole that allows them to let this one go.


Vexx

Careful, your bias is showing.

... Of course it was. That's why Mittani was mocking him.

So fast? This story didn't break for days after the actual event. It doesn't matter how many times you lie about the timeline, it will not change.

Additionally, let's outlaw forks because some day someone might stab someone else in the eye with one.

Jesus, are you even listening to yourself?

I see you are ignoring the fact it was a joke, as was the rest of his speech.

A person is not responsible for the insane overreactions someone has over something said in jest.

So if I hang myself because of the poor quality of your posts, YOU are responsible.

I'll keep that in mind and let my insurance company know.

Who said he has acknowledged his mistake?

All I see is somebody who is famous for being a lying, scamming, pubbie hating bastard making a post on a forum.

OK.. I really do not know what to say. I am at a loss for words with all that is going on.

I guess I should say that this is not about someone alt in eve.
This is not about someone losing isks they worked for.
This is not about someone losing a machanaw in the game.
This is not something I started. I was really shocked to see the video monday night when I finaly had time.

This is all really about a person that is over joyed in making some one hurt as much as they can in real life not in game.
Going by his power point I have to say he thought about it long before getting drunk.
If thowing my name out there was something he planed to do or not that I can not say, and we will never know for sure.
But when reflect the way he talked about my mail. I am sure that was an option he was holding on to and tossing up becouse he was really enjoying tomenting someone.

I am sorry this is not the alt in the game that is talk but the person playing the alt.

There are allot of people out there that have real life problems, but they are warned when they join Eve. Whats said and done in the game doesn't bother me, its all part of Eve.

To me this **** got real and hurt full when I watched a video where a complete stranger urged other complete strangers to try make me kill myself.



The Wis

Notice that none of them said a thing. This only kicked off a few days later when Mitani won the chairmanship. Funny timing that.

No this is entirely the falt of the mob trying to get mitani booted out of the CSM however they can.

Keep twisting keep spinning.


No one buys it at this point.

Okay, so you are admitting that this is all about perception. In that case, please stop demanding that everyone adheres to your personal perception of what went on, and instead wait for those whose perception actually matters - namely, CCP - to come out and make a decision.

Are you saying he scammed The Mittani out of isk?

fofofo

You also hold double standards, you are a hypocrite and you make things up to try and make your point. When does your ban start?

In what Jurisdiction?

Well having now read his freak out session on EN24
http://www.evenews24.com/2012/03/28/leak-gsf-ceo-update-clutching-pearls-and-finger-wagging/

I have to say I was FAR too kind to this guy. He deserves the ban and everything he gets.
Spiteful footstamping he sounds like a child with its lollypop taken away.
I'm very disappointed that he made a public apology while secretly writing that vitreolic poison secretly to an audience of goons.
Good riddence to the guy.

The apology was fake, he is not humble. He only did it to be able to stay on the CSM and keep hold of his power.

Yeah CCP needs to ban him. He hasn't learned a thing and was clearly not sincere. And based on what his thugs have been doing even after his apology its obvious the apology was a sham.

Perhaps you didn't read CCP's dev blog completely. That's okay, when he's not on the ballot in CSM 8 I'll laugh again. You're right in that if he HAD resigned from the CSM like a man, he might have avoided the 30 day ban, and not effectively left the decision of whether to let him run in ANY future CSM election to CCP. That WAS a stupid move on his part, not manning up like that.

Apparently the full implications of this haven't sunk in with all the goons yet. But the surprising part is that I am surprised.

Please post evidence of your assertion that he tried to cling to power and or weasel his way out of this.

Lord save us from CSM members whose saving grace is being in alliances with enough members to push up their vote numbers. Well, I do know who next year I will not vote for

It's not about giving sympathy to someone who says he will commit suicide if his pixel ships are blown up. Yes, that person may or may not need professional help (let's let a real doctor decide that). It is about a person in a position of authority saying, intoxicated or otherwise, in a public televised event, "if you want to make the guy go kill himself, his name is The Wis, it's The Wis (spelled out)... He has his own corp. Find him.

"Will no-one rid me of this troublesome priest?" - words attributed to Henry II shortly before the murder of Thomas Becket, Archbishop of Canterbury by 4 knights who overheard the king and believed they were following a royal command

Sound familiar?

One thing that seems to have escaped the members of Goonswarm and others is that the Mittani's actions at FF could potentially bring a media storm CCP 's way where the game itself could suffer from being the subject of widespread media damnation.

Imagine what would happen if the mainstream media decides to run with this where cyber-bullying and harrassment over the internet is gaining more and more political involvement. Then look at the fact that 13+ year old children are allowed to be involved in the game and the potential is there for CCP being literally forced to change the game or lose their Teen rating if nothing else.

The elements that make EVE Online unique need to remain within the game and not spill over into internet broadcasted RL events or the potential is there for us all to eventually wear the consequences by having the game become a watered down shadow of what it once was.

Mittens gave CCP no choice but to take the action that they have and if he cares at all for the game then he should respect that.

Hello thread... How goes ye?

This is exactly why no goonswarm should be allowed to be csm ever again. This guy represents what goonswarm is about, being immature inconsiderate kids.

If another goonswarm gets into csm, I swear eve will drown.

I mean seriously, look at the post above mine; this guy is calling people "citizen" like they're better than others, biggotry.

This entire THREAD is of goonswarm putting down other people; what the hell. As if they hadnt been repremanded enough. Apparently not; I call for the executor corp of goonswarm to be banned for this.

It gets better though El, Test has wardeced the guy Mittani was making fun off. The CFC is actually trying to do what Mitt told them to.
If Mitt was really sorry for what he said, he wouldn't let Test go wardec the guy.

People will only hear what their agenda wants them to push.

He says his apology was genuine but he still wats to 'test the waters'. hmmz

I have to wonder how many of these npc alts are from darius... mittani did make a mistake, yes.. mittani did make an apology, yes... mittani is getting banned for a month, yes... should mittani leave the csm? No... this csm was actually making changes that improved the game. Dont let politics destroy our game play!!!

I don't think the full legal implications of what mittens did have fully sunk in yet..

There are currently individuals pending criminal charges in the United States over posting video of an individual kissing another man, that individual later committing suicide.

If The Wiz actually committed suicide because his mackinaws were pursued mercilessly by individuals intent on making him kill himself, jokingly or not, would mittens be facing criminal charges? The fact that he was joking does not matter, the fact that he was drunk is irrelevant. When someone is accused of ****, saying "I was drunk" is not a valid defense. The individuals charged with the suicide mentioned above made public apologies and said "We didn't intend for him to kill himself.

Now the real question is; is someone who would advocate, even jokingly (jokingly is a context to be taken by the individual watching the presentation, not the presenter), that people pursue a player to make himself commit suicide worthy of any place of leadership? Questions to ponder



Mittani, you are a disgusting individual. The fact that you would get a pleasure out of griefing someone to the point that they commit suicide, or the idea of someone committing suicide from griefing, is abhorrent. Completely disregarding that fact that you were drunk during the presentation, you put those slides together, including an individual speaking about deep depression and suicide, and presented them in a mocking fashion. Seriously think about what you would have done if that guy had committed suicide. In truth you probably never would have found out, since his subscription would have just ended, and the player would have left the game forever. The goons would have chalked it up as another victory "Ha, we ****** with him so bad he QUIT the game!!!" not knowing he actually quit his life

The individuals saying that there is nothing wrong with your posts need to take a serious step back and consider what their morals and values are. To quote many goons defending your comments, "This is a game", exactly, we're here to have fun, sometimes in a frustrating and infuriating way. Death IRL should never be brought into that mix



Now, lets get back to blowing up internet space ships.

Im going to be honest about this.

When he said he was going to step down on his twitter I thought. "OH he gets it" but then he tried to cling to his power desperately showing that he didnt actually care or reflect on what he did. Had he just stepped down from the CSM instead of trying to weasel his way out of it this would not have become the mess it became.

Thats when it became clear he had to go.

I'm pretty sure you don't know what pubbie means.

This entire situation is a witch hunt. It has been since day 1. Everyone who didnt vote for mittens got mad he won, and he mistakenly gave them a reason to complain. And what he did was big enough and public enough that they had enough leverage to cause a huge stink about it, and they did. Effectively conquering the CSM. It was actually a pretty tactful power play. Although I disagree with it, it was cunning. They are allowed to do this, because this is EVE.

Thus is the sandbox we all pay to be a part of. I'll be burning Jita with the best of them.

I know. So when are you guys going to leave the Mittani alone?

So you are saying you are justified in harassing someone because they are a public figure? You have a sick sense of morality, RougeOperator.

Oh ... and ... the world is bigger than the United States of America. So **** your Supreme Court.

Not at all funny. This is a real woman's life we are talking about and the fear that goes along with it. This kind of crap should not be joked about at all.

You are literally a sub-human piece of garbage IRL. Mittani apologized over and over for what he did truthfully and sincerely. He's received a 30-day ban in game and has been removed from the CSM. he KNOWS and UNDERSTANDS that what he did was wrong and has said that repeatedly.

Yet you appear to condone the action of someone saying they're going to go to his house and **** his wife (who is a very lovely woman, by the way!) right after his home address was posted. You make me ******* sick.

And you're literally lower than a sub-human piece of garbage for removing my posted statement - I do not condone or encourage that type of action.

Typical example of how you guys operate.

I wouldn't be surprised if this whole situation has been staged right from the start. Either way, you a*****s are well on your way to destroying this game, especially since the major news agencies around the world are sure to run this story.

So people has got to threaten Mittani, rape his wife, and shoot his dog in order to save this game? This isn't something we came up in order to save Mittani's reputation. No one even me would put up their wife as a bargaining chip in order to get on the pubbie's good will. People were banned over that threat and the posting of his personal information. I certainly would not put my own wife up as a bargaining chip because she is not a part of this game nor does she play this game at all.

Reported for what? Because I call you out on the fact you're defending the threats against his wife and going "Well if he didn't do this, then he wouldn't have gotten the threats so he deserves them!" I see it now pubbie. Mittani deserves an eye for an eye.

I'm fine with conspiracy theories and all that crap pertaining ONLY to Eve Online but the line stops when it starts involving external factors OUTSIDE of Eve Online. But these above posters seems oblivious to the fact that Mittani has already been punished for this and owned up to it but they don't care if external factors are being pulled into this situation.

Don't defend those people then.

You did. Two wrongs does not make a right.

There's no ******* conspiracy here.

Anyone who suggests that there is has no common sense, conscience, or even the ability to separate fiction from reality.

Mittens' wife is awesome. My wife and her got along swimmingly last summer during our bi-annual goonp while the rest of us nerds talked spaceships.

She does not play Eve Online. She downright hates the game. Good job on giving her more of a reason to hate it.


You people are sick. Quit trying to justify this, it's not even remotely the same.

No, it confirms that you are trying to justify that Mittani should have not done this otherwise he would have not gotten those threats against his wife.

You are literally the worst poster and person in real life now. I hope you never marry a woman.

Based on what? You were trying to justify the threat because you say Mittani deserved it when he slipped up and made a mistake which he paid clearly for.

[quote=RougeOperator][quote=Grant Wyberious]Seriously?
You cannot spin this however you want. Two wrongs does not make a right.

tbh, It's pretty obvious, at least to me, that rouge isn't trying to justify the RL threat mittani has gotten, though I can see how it could be potentially viewed that way. That being said, I'm pretty sure rouge had mentioned earlier in the threat that he was against it.

at this point you two are just arguing semantics tbh

No he is trying to spin troll something reprehensible.

Its beneath even goons to be trying to do what he is doing.

Thats why what he is doing is so messed up and ive asked for contact info for CCP legal.

Except that the consequences of this event made people think that they were justified extracting Mittani's personal information, plastering it everywhere, and then proceeding to threaten rape against his companion. The Wis was protected by anonymity and Mittani was not. Nonetheless, his reasoning is that if Mittani had not carried out his accidental slip up, then it wouldn't have happened. The line was crossed and it should have ended at Mittani alone when he got removed from the CSM7. But no, two wrongs has to make a right in order to teach Mittani his lesson starting with his wife. No lesson is completed without making a second wrong.

No. You're the one that tried to excuse this threat with that stupid statement of yours and you need to admit to the fact you were wrong that there was no justification for it whatsoever. Mittani deserved no lesson for it. The person who did it was wrong no matter what justification in the end.

It didn't matter if it was supposed to give him some perspective. Darius III for example accused Vile Rat of abandoning his CSM duties to Iceland for the emergency summit. The reason why Vile Rat didn't go? His son was sick and needed his full attention but INTERNET SPACE GAME takes priority over family. The people of this INTERNET SPACE GAME needs to fuckoff with people's personal life and stay out of it. NO LESSON SHOULD EVER BE NEEDED FOR THAT.

are you one of those guys that qqs ppl should listen to the interview? Cause I did and you could play a drinking game for the number of times he says he was drunk or it was a drunk ******* thing

He just locked himself out of possible lawsuit.
I mean imagine you are a judge and Mittns starts... Your honor my name is being dragged left and right and all of that because I was drunk! Then people use my rl name on the interwez (so do I FYI judge) and that is wrong!

You should jail them all so I can continue doing what I condemn in others!

For a moment i thought he is smart but at that point I just went /facepalm

If you ask me... He lost it. He got a bit too much of his own medicine.
Silence is a virtue and every time he speaks he does nothing but damage at this point.

As a EVE player I say karma is a *****.
As a person, hope you get out of this crap unharmed and learn to be a man.

That's funny, because he has been humble (you know, because he has admitted he screwed up, over and over again) , and the only hat he has put on is 'the gaming media has misquoted most of what I said'. Which, incidently, has screwed CCP over a great deal more.

Your E-lawyer posting has probably done far worse.
Also, I note you aren't Autocannons Anonymous anymore :v

No, it isn't, (referring to it being CCP's fault because I feel dealing with this person I have to clarify everything.) and I will not deny that. But it has been dragged out much, much more than it should. Anyone, anyone who has had his real name dragged out would fight likewise.

I am not condoning the events that have made this happen, but i will condemn those that wish to make a media circus out of it above and beyond, only because it hurts CCP and the game we all play.

I can only assume that you've never been in a situation like this before, but heyo, for the best part neither have I.

And, well, he doesn't own us; my feeling on all this have been made well aware in this thread.

It went out of control to the degree in part because of a media circus.

Heh, would like to carry this on with you personally in private.

Its funny though, whats called cyberbullying everywhere else is called EVE to us

this thread is far more interesting if you hide post anyone with a Goon tag lol

I'm genuinely sorry for your loss then. I really hope you, and your family will be ok. I know damn well how much this can hurt those you love.

But as for the logic; welp, if I'm honest, you seem to be witch-hunting.

He's never said he was innocent; he messed up. And he did say that he was intending to resign as soon as he apologised? The witch-hunt angle is the whole internet-lawyer and more, And, well, if you're at all media savvy, you know that things can bandwagon!

Wow just wow this thread is now about AI programming.

I was posting in support of you and pointing out the irony that ONLY in the culture of EVE would this be acceptable to anyone

@Mittani:

I voted for you this year and I can honestly say I regret doing so. I never followed the CSM nor their activities until the whole protest over NEX and the massive Jita Protests. I saw something in the game I didn't like and looked to the CSM to protect the game we all love. They succeeded and I decided to start paying close attention to the CSM activities. I was impressed by the whole CSM and even you Mittani and that is why I voted for you. I didn't agree with you on everything but I knew you loved the game and wanted what was best for the game. And for me... that was enough.

However what you have done is shameful. It hurts the Eve Online community, hurts the CSM credibility, and embarrassed all of us as a collective whole. Publicly posting the name of a capsuleer pilot who obviously suffered from depression and stated he had suicidal thoughts... encouraging the community of Eve Online to eve-mail said capsuleer and encourage him to follow through... shows not only a total lack of respect for other people but also a total lack of class and character.

You have resigned from the Chairman position. That is not enough. As one of the capsuleers who voted for you... I want your complete resignation from the CSM effective immediately. You have posted a public apology to the community and have also apologized to the capsuleer in private. This is a good thing and is a small step towards making it right. I call upon you to take further actions:

• Donate 3+ Billion ISK to the capsuleer in question. Post proof of this donation.
• Donate 5+ Billion ISK to the Ivy League alliance. They train new capsuleers how to play in Eve Online. It's fitting that you support one of the most important entities in New Eden considering the circumstances. Post proof of this donation.

You're currently subject to a 30 day ban. Personally that is not enough. Cyber-bullying is a real problem now-a-days and what you did was pure cyber-bullying. There is a difference between an in-game persona and real life. You took a game and made it into real life. I am deeply ashamed of you, Mittani. You've lost my respect over this and the CSM has lost some of my respect as well. I hope that the CSM can move beyond this and that a situation like this never happens again.

PS: To the capsuleer in question... if you're suffering from depression and/or suicidal thoughts then please seek some help. Don't let this incident get to you. And report ANY jerk who sends you an encouragement eve-mail.

Respectfully,
Talia Nachtigall

Note: It's coming to my attention that you have already resigned from the CSM completely and if this is the case then good. Your forum name still shows CSM at this time and the last bit I read was that you had only resigned from the CSM Chairman position. Ignore this part if it does not apply.

Wrong.

Massively has nothing to do with CCP's standing policies or the actions of a player before the story is ever written. I'm not going to pretend to know CCP's motivations beyond their EULA/TOS. But, Mittens clearly violated it, apology not withstanding. That CCP waited until Massively reported the incident to ban Mittens has no direct correlation to their actions although, I'm sure it might have had an indirect influence but no more so than the outrage that exploded onto the forums.

Mitanni is lucky......LUCKY that he only got a 30d ban. Many others have experienced much less leniency in similar such instances in much less public venues and whom have much....MUCH less influence over so many other players. Think about that.