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Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 20:49:00 - [1] Edited by: Faife on 08/10/2008 20:55:28 ignoring whether this is good or bad, this is what i think'll happen -: nano gangs are gone. nano-everything approach is gone. only ships in a speed gang will be those with speed bonuses in description -: small gang warfare will now require much more variation in composition and fitting to deal with more varied enemy setups. more paper rock scissors in fitting, more reliance on teams working together, less reliance on individual player skill -: AFs will be anti-t2 cruiser tacklers -: 'caldari' will no longer be a dirty word in pvp, they will start being DPS, unless the defender buff is real -: drake in particular looks to be boosted. it's now a cheap, un neutable, hard to mitigate damage platform for all ranges and speeds. it's own slow speed will be less of a factor -: hammerhead II will no longer be the end all / be all of drones. gangs organizing who brings what DPS drones and assigning separate drone targets aside from primaries will start happening. there will be great whining over bad drone AI. maybe programmable drones in our future? -: the idea of blaster boats wont work. the major non-niche battleships will be tank/gank at medium range or snipe (not included are ECM, NOS, and other special purpose fits) -: minmatar ships will now rely on pure DPS for kills vs speed. minmatar is gonna be a whole lot less popular -: the fact that scramblers shut down mwds will make gallente recons bpo owners happy. not as happy as they were, but happy. (reserving the right to add more as i see fit cause i'm like that)
Isil Rahsen Gallente IsilZheHa Enterprises	Posted - 2008.10.08 20:53:00 - [2] -Nano gangs gone -small gang warfare next to nonexistant -missles still win against everything -assault frigates slighty less cannon foddery -blasters become completely useless in all scenarios -minmatar get the nerf stick really hard this time
z0de Gallente The Bastards	Posted - 2008.10.08 20:55:00 - [3] Everyone will ragequit leaving me to conquer the universe.
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 20:58:00 - [4] Originally by: Isil Rahsen -small gang warfare next to nonexistant -missles still win against everything re missiles: depends what they do with defenders. if they do bring in "gang defense shield" defenders, a single ship will be able to shut down all incoming caldari dps. think of it like ECM backwards. re first: i dunno. it's not like big gangs couldn't go after small gangs with their own nanos. i'm not sure if it's going to change much, other than you'll have to be more creative and have better FCs that react to way more possibilities
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:03:00 - [5] - Cargohold Optimization Rigs will become affordable. - ECM whine will increase in volume as ECM becomes more widespread as the new FOTM - 0.0 will become saver for carebears as they no longer get jumped on by roaming gangs - Warp Scramblers will rise in price -------- Ideas for: Mining
Falaricae	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:04:00 - [6] Ignoring whether it is good or bad, I still would like to know what the final changes will actually be. There are already thousands of post regurgitating this stuff. Until the final changes come available, there really isn't anything left to say, that hasn't already been said.
Tippia Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:06:00 - [7] "Guerilla warfare" will go back to its real meaning: it will no longer be interpreted as a small force beating a larger force, but rather as a small force beating an even smaller force and getting away before the smaller force's blob-backup gets on the scene…
Saietor Blackgreen The First Foundation	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:07:00 - [8] Yet, nothing will become worse. It didnt get worse after WTZ, it didnt get worse after HP buff, it didnt get worse after EW changes, it didnt, it didnt. New game every 6 months - hooray to EVE! --- Redesign local/scanner feature - make the place huge, dark and scary again!
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:09:00 - [9] A prediction? Everyone will fit ABs and assume nano-fleets are dead. Then, a little while later, they'll run into a nano-gang and die. Something similar happened with the nos nerf. Everyone binned nos, and assumed nos ships were dead in the water. This happened to a such an extent that one poor unfortunate I blew up had never even seen a Curse before. He just couldn't understand why he couldn't hit my ship (TDs ftw), or where all his cap had gone. C. Originally by: Tarminic Your continued whining is somewhat diminished by your continued willingness to give your money to CCP.
Monkey Saturday Unknown Soldiers Soldiers Of New Eve	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:12:00 - [10] Basically this is a Caldari stealth buff then. Fear the Drakes. Thanks for the Maulus BPO nerf! :D
murder one Gallente Invincible Reason	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:12:00 - [11] Originally by: Saietor Blackgreen Yet, nothing will become worse. It didnt get worse after WTZ, it didnt get worse after HP buff, it didnt get worse after EW changes, it didnt, it didnt. New game every 6 months - hooray to EVE! Sure it did. WTZ reduced my targets of opportunity by 80%, made high sec ganking harder, etc. HP buff really hurt my blaster ships performance and made high sec ganking harder still. EW changes ruined my Arazu/Lachesis, made my Falcon a requirement every time I undock. All of those changes hurt my profitability as a player directly. I play the game less often now because it's more work to find fewer and fewer targets, and when I do find targets, it's harder and harder to catch them, and when I can catch them, it's more difficult to kill them. [07:13:55] doctorstupid2 > what do i train now? [07:14:05] Trista Rotnor > little boys to 2 Fleet Combat Ships
Fujiko MaXjolt Caldari Templar Republic TransWarp Ventures	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:14:00 - [12] Originally by: Faife Originally by: Isil Rahsen -small gang warfare next to nonexistant -missles still win against everything re missiles: depends what they do with defenders. if they do bring in "gang defense shield" defenders, a single ship will be able to shut down all incoming caldari dps. think of it like ECM backwards. re first: i dunno. it's not like big gangs couldn't go after small gangs with their own nanos. i'm not sure if it's going to change much, other than you'll have to be more creative and have better FCs that react to way more possibilities Bring on the Aegis class T2 cruisers with bonus to defender speed/flight-time/rof.... I likes it
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:18:00 - [13] Edited by: Armoured C on 08/10/2008 21:20:30 Originally by: Monkey Saturday Basically this is a Caldari stealth buff then. Fear the Drakes. it always a caldari stealth buff gallente get the nerf stick hard when certian droned ships ( bearing in mind this is the drone race) get hit rather hard and now the minmatards ( the speed race ) get the heavy stick aswell amarr always had the stick so hopefully if i did my maths right gallente => nerf minmatards => nerf amarr => lol caldari => overpowerred nerd rage machine means that caldari missile nerf is incomming =) edit: if it were my way only gallente ships should be able to use drones, minnies use speed equipment only, amarians only use cap warfare and TD and caldari keep being poor industrial workers in the depression over the massive CEO isk floods ( sorry reading to much eve novel) carebears are flying pinyatas
RedSplat	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:20:00 - [14] * More Blobs * Minnie ships get clobbered, fewer about as a result * Caldari Online * Blasterboats die off or become less popular, Gallente field more droneboats * AF's get a tiny boost but t1 Cruisers remain more effective and cheaper * AB's become more common * Small gang warfare a fossil * gatecamps harder to escape * ECM (jammers) becomes more commonplace * AC's still suck * Missiles are better; no Defender missiles wont stop this AT ALL- think what you sacrifice to fit defenders * CCP loses a larger portion of the playerbase than they ever have before following patch introduction * Couple months down the line we start seeing 'nerf missiles/ecm/caldari' threads with great regularity * I quit eve
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:22:00 - [15] Originally by: RedSplat * AC's still suck i can assure you i dont suck and who ever said i did is lying carebears are flying pinyatas
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:24:00 - [16] Originally by: Faife Originally by: Isil Rahsen -small gang warfare next to nonexistant -missles still win against everything re missiles: depends what they do with defenders. if they do bring in "gang defense shield" defenders, a single ship will be able to shut down all incoming caldari dps. think of it like ECM backwards. re first: i dunno. it's not like big gangs couldn't go after small gangs with their own nanos. i'm not sure if it's going to change much, other than you'll have to be more creative and have better FCs that react to way more possibilities Defenders are already capable of intercepting missiles fired to a different target than you. The problem is always the one that they will not auto fire, so they will do little in laggy situations or when the target is to near for the defender firing player tor eact.
murder one Gallente Invincible Reason	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:27:00 - [17] Quote: -: nano gangs are gone. nano-everything approach is gone. only ships in a speed gang will be those with speed bonuses in description This will be great. Tired of gangs composed of nothing but nano ships. Hopefully Vagabonds and Stabbers etc. will still be viable as heavy tacklers. Quote: -: small gang warfare will now require much more variation in composition and fitting to deal with more varied enemy setups. more paper rock scissors in fitting, more reliance on teams working together, less reliance on individual player skill Again, a good thing. Quote: -: AFs will be anti-t2 cruiser tacklers I think AFs will get ripped apart by missiles/heavy neut combos, but meh, we'll see. Quote: -: 'caldari' will no longer be a dirty word in pvp, they will start being DPS, unless the defender buff is real I don't see CCP ever fixing Defenders to the point of making them even remotely viable as a defense against missiles. Further more, what about all those ships out there with no launcher hardpoints? What then? Quote: -: the idea of blaster boats wont work. the major non-niche battleships will be tank/gank at medium range or snipe (not included are ECM, NOS, and other special purpose fits) I see all blaster ships except frigs (which are non players in PVP essentially) completely obsolete for any role what so ever. Even the Deimos and Astarte will be worthless, along with the Phobos for that matter. On top of all of this, killing targets at gates while solo/small gang will be extremely hard. 50% webs won't be able to slow down the target enough before they can MWD/AB back to the gate and jump out. Completed kills on gates will drop significantly. Targets will be divided into two groups: fast ships that can run back to the gate quickly and jump out before taking too much damage, and larger targets that can weather the DPS long enough to AB/MWD back to the gate and jump out. Slow BCs might have a problem, but those are usually ships like passive Drakes, so they'll probably make it back as well. This only hurts small gangs/solo play. Larger gangs will have enough ships to web/neut/scram targets and make the kill. Quote: -: minmatar ships will now rely on pure DPS for kills vs speed. minmatar is gonna be a whole lot less popular Minmatar ships will still be 100% relevant. They will still be the top of the pile as far as speed goes. They just won't be 100% invulnerable now. Even if the web nerf happens the Rapier/Huginn will still be very effective, the Vaga will still be the fastest cruiser in the game and the Minmatar interceptors and command ships will still be very viable. Minmatar BS will be affected very little, if at all. [07:13:55] doctorstupid2 > what do i train now? [07:14:05] Trista Rotnor > little boys to 2 Fleet Combat Ships
RedSplat	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:31:00 - [18] Edited by: RedSplat on 08/10/2008 21:33:44 Originally by: Armoured C Originally by: RedSplat * AC's still suck i can assure you i dont suck and who ever said i did is lying How is it you are a plural? p.s. That means you suck twice as hard
Marcus Aurelius Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:32:00 - [19] Originally by: Venkul Mul Defenders are already capable of intercepting missiles fired to a different target than you. wrong
clone 1 Laughing Leprechauns Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:38:00 - [20] Eve Online: The Raven Age -------------------------------------------------- The Angels Have the Phone Box
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:39:00 - [21] Originally by: murder one On top of all of this, killing targets at gates while solo/small gang will be extremely hard. 50% webs won't be able to slow down the target enough before they can MWD/AB back to the gate and jump out. Disagree here. If the target is fitted with a MWD you probably don't even need a web - just use a short range scram - he's going nowhere fast. If he's using an AB a web will have a similar effect; a much slower ship. Granted the AB ship has more chance of retreating to the gate than a MWD set up (its a more defensive ship). C. Originally by: Tarminic Your continued whining is somewhat diminished by your continued willingness to give your money to CCP.
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Fnck the blob.	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:40:00 - [22] Dear devs, Since you're so intent on breaking things please increase drop rates on salvage so that armor rigs dont cost as much as 10x more than shield rigs. Thus I will be able to fly my semi useless gallente blaster boats and at least break even. Thanks in advance p.s. web nerfs, whats wrong with you... its huginns/rapiers not webs that are a broken mechanic....
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:43:00 - [23] Originally by: murder one Quote: -: 'caldari' will no longer be a dirty word in pvp, they will start being DPS, unless the defender buff is real I don't see CCP ever fixing Defenders to the point of making them even remotely viable as a defense against missiles. Further more, what about all those ships out there with no launcher hardpoints? What then? [...] On top of all of this, killing targets at gates while solo/small gang will be extremely hard. 50% webs won't be able to slow down the target enough before they can MWD/AB back to the gate and jump out. Completed kills on gates will drop significantly. Targets will be divided into two groups: fast ships that can run back to the gate quickly and jump out before taking too much damage, and larger targets that can weather the DPS long enough to AB/MWD back to the gate and jump out. Slow BCs might have a problem, but those are usually ships like passive Drakes, so they'll probably make it back as well. my corp chat is currently very emo over the defender thing. the all-vaga-all-the-time pilots in particular since fitting defenders basically cuts their dps in order to make them viable. if they make defenders that intercept for your gang mates as well, then a single dedicated caracal/drake/cerberus could in theory provide missile defense for the gang. though i'm personally expecting the above to not work for lag reasons and instead we might see a mid module that functions as a defender to show up. Aegis System or something. re killing things on way back to gate: yeah, i think this is a solo piracy nerf. even with ships going not as fast, it'll be hard to stop a dedicated guy who's gunning back for that gate. it will require teamwork, but i'm not certain this is a bad thing and yeah, big ECM buff. reminds me of the days where we used to fill mids with ECM cause it was the win all be all. it might be coming up again.
Warocia Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:43:00 - [24] I didn't listen blog, but they are planning nerf medium drones? Yes? If so what will happen curse and pilgrim Pilgrim is bad already:P
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:46:00 - [25] Originally by: Warocia I didn't listen blog, but they are planning nerf medium drones? Yes? If so what will happen curse and pilgrim Pilgrim is bad already:P they will be balanced in speed along with the slower ships.
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Fnck the blob.	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:48:00 - [26] Originally by: Warocia I didn't listen blog, but they are planning nerf medium drones? Yes? If so what will happen curse and pilgrim Pilgrim is bad already:P They havent thought about that at all, just as they dont think about anything else when making these changes, I dont think i've heard/seen anyone ever *****ing about how overpowered medium drones are but welp guess they needed the nerf bat, think of thorax/deimos pilots... wtf are they going to do now? run missions? blasters useless -check drones useless -check webs useless -check
Warocia Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:52:00 - [27] So instead buffing pilgrim? They are double nerfing curse so it will propably worse than pilgrim, well you can call that some level balance
Bohoba Caldari HolyKnights	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:53:00 - [28] Nano nerf won't happen,,, whiners win this one Missile buff won't happen whiners win this one AF's cool worth something now Drone nerf won't happen whiners win this one nerfing the minmatart ships humm bad move truly would be nice to see some of this happen but been playing eve to long not to know that when an uproar as the nano nerf crys happens well it means it won't happen so nothing changes nano***s will rule 0.0 battle ships will be obsolete and real cheap :) Gal... will keep there Uber blasterboats and sniper kings. and they will conquer all of empire with there Uber ships with a wreaking hit of 2000+ ok rant over :) have fun guys it's just a game
Farrqua Minmatar Turbo Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.08 21:54:00 - [29] Originally by: clone 1 Eve Online: The Raven Age Yea we already had that. It was Castor I think. Or at least pre-Exodus.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:08:00 - [30] Edited by: Venkul Mul on 08/10/2008 22:09:07 Originally by: Marcus Aurelius Originally by: Venkul Mul Defenders are already capable of intercepting missiles fired to a different target than you. wrong True, tested some time ago on Sisi. No idea when it was changed. A simple test you can do with a friend: drop a GSC get a friend with defender near it fire your missiles to the GSC your friend will try to intercept them Lo and behold; his defender fire and intercept your missiles.
Bai ZongTong Genos Occidere	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:17:00 - [31] Originally by: RedSplat * I quit eve your stuff? srsly guys! if you are leaving you should make sure ur internet spaceships dont sit and dust in hangers around the universe! leave them to me. ill make good use of them~ --- Bai ZongTong, responsible for all the lossmails in my corp.
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:18:00 - [32] Originally by: Venkul Mul True, tested some time ago on Sisi. No idea when it was changed. A simple test you can do with a friend: drop a GSC get a friend with defender near it fire your missiles to the GSC your friend will try to intercept them Lo and behold; his defender fire and intercept your missiles. does this happen even if you're defender launching friend is in your gang? or is it a "non-gang missile interception"?
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:21:00 - [33] Originally by: Bai ZongTong Originally by: RedSplat * I quit eve your stuff? srsly guys! if you are leaving you should make sure ur internet spaceships dont sit and dust in hangers around the universe! leave them to me. ill make good use of them~ hmm yea! clever and funny. I used to say stuff like this too until i trained 1 year + to absolutely specialize in the blasterthron and now to have it nerfed so badly. blah.
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:29:00 - [34] I am sad, because the AB Crusader I've been using for months to pwn hostiles left and right will now be even better after the speed nerf, but its biggest strength, the utter suprise factor, will be gone. ____ The Illusion of Freedom \| The Truth about Slavery
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:30:00 - [35] Originally by: Faife Originally by: Venkul Mul True, tested some time ago on Sisi. No idea when it was changed. A simple test you can do with a friend: drop a GSC get a friend with defender near it fire your missiles to the GSC your friend will try to intercept them Lo and behold; his defender fire and intercept your missiles. From what I recall we were in the same gang, but from different corporations. I was using one of my alts as the missile spammer. To test it he was firing only 1 missile from 50 Km so, I had all the time to switch character and fire the defender. In my test I was within 5 km from the container, but I think the limit is the distance from the firer, not from the target. Still this not make the defender more useful, you still need to fire them at a target ship firing missiles and while a missile is in flight. To make it useful it would need some kind of auto firing mechanism: when one of the targeted ship fire a missile the defender ship would fire a missile, or in alternative the defender firing ship should assign one or more defenders to target ships and then, when the enemy ship fire a missile the assigned defenders fire. Both way a noticeable change of how defenders work, essentially making them some kind of FOF weapon. does this happen even if you're defender launching friend is in your gang? or is it a "non-gang missile interception"?
Kerfira	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:30:00 - [36] Edited by: Kerfira on 08/10/2008 22:31:30 Even if defenders hit missiles aimed at other people, it still doesn't make them viable. What makes most sense? Using a high-slot to fire a missile that hurts an enemy or use it for potentially shooting down a random missile aimed at you or a fleet mate? In almost all cases, you're better off doing damage. The 'almost all' is a cover-my-ass statement... I can't really think of any cases where its not better to do damage.... Now, if we had dedicated defender launchers with a high RoF, that'd change somewhat. It'd change even more if it was more automatic than today. Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:33:00 - [37] Originally by: Kerfira Even if defenders hit missiles aimed at other people, it still doesn't make them viable. What makes most sense? Using a high-slot to fire a missile that hurts an enemy or use it for potentially shooting down a random missile aimed at you or a fleet mate? In almost all cases, you're better off doing damage. The 'almost all' is a cover-my-ass statement... I can't really think of any cases where its not better to do damage.... Now, if we had dedicated defender launchers with a high RoF, that'd change somewhat. It'd change even more if it was more automatic than today. alt-account drake spamming defenders to protect your entire gang might make sense.
Faife Noctiscion	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:35:00 - [38] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev I used to say stuff like this too until i trained 1 year + to absolutely specialize in the blasterthron and now to have it nerfed so badly. blah. mwd up to them, activate scram and web. they now cant mwd, but they can ab, and web cancels. so in worst case they're slowboating out of range while webbing you. fit a tracking enhancer and assuming your dps is ok you should be fine.
Feilamya Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:39:00 - [39] No more nano hac/recon kills with T1 cruisers
Esmenet	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:48:00 - [40] - Even more whine about ECM and cloaks until its gone. - Blob up in drakes and ravens and learn the skill of pressing f1-f8.
Allen Ramses Caldari Typo Corp	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:52:00 - [41] I do not know what the differences will be post nerf, but we will see much baseless whinage prior to it. ____________________ Pimped out Raven to run level 4 missions quickly: 210 Mil ISK. Realizing your 120 Mil ISK Drake gets the job done faster: Priceless.
murder one Gallente Invincible Reason	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:55:00 - [42] Originally by: Cailais Originally by: murder one On top of all of this, killing targets at gates while solo/small gang will be extremely hard. 50% webs won't be able to slow down the target enough before they can MWD/AB back to the gate and jump out. Disagree here. If the target is fitted with a MWD you probably don't even need a web - just use a short range scram - he's going nowhere fast. If he's using an AB a web will have a similar effect; a much slower ship. Granted the AB ship has more chance of retreating to the gate than a MWD set up (its a more defensive ship). C. I disagree with your disagreement. If you're in a large (10+) gatecamp, the target is dead regardless of the upcoming patch or not, but for solo and small gang (2-3) combat the target will get back to the gate if you don't double web it or put a 2 point scram on it (assuming it has a MWD and not an AB), and keep it tackled, and be able to tackle it in the first place (assuming you are in range to get a point on it, which is becoming very unlikely if you only have a 9km scram fit). When operating solo there are very very few ships out there that can tackle and either dual web or put a 24km point and a 9km double point and a web on the target and have a fast enough lock time to catch anything. And heaven forbid you try to do this in low sec and have to tank sentries. [07:13:55] doctorstupid2 > what do i train now? [07:14:05] Trista Rotnor > little boys to 2 Fleet Combat Ships
Dray Caldari The Priory	Posted - 2008.10.08 22:55:00 - [43] Lots of ideas on what may or may not happen, but I'm absolutely sure that the next win toy/tactic will attract a shit load of whining and get nerfed, and this cycle will continue until in the distant future we will be playing tic tac toe on a solar system back drop. Even then I'm sure the noughts will demand the crosses be nerfed because they look cooler or some such shit.
Calvin Roh	Posted - 2008.10.09 00:06:00 - [44] For all of you who are complaining bitterly about the proposed changes, let me remind you of the saying I got shoved in my face when I was a carebear making the change to a more well rounded combat pilot.. "Adapt or Die!" You took advantage of a niche opportunity that itself was an imposed loophole. Combat will still happen, ships will still blow up. Besides, you must be getting bored of always being "sooo l33t" when you **** noobs and carebears who are just learning their way. CCP has just handed you a new reason for living - a new challenge to overcome and master. Cheers!
Nova Fox Gallente Novafox Shipyards	Posted - 2008.10.09 02:36:00 - [45] you forgot increase in target painter effectiviness. Pre Order your Sisters of Eve ship today!!!
Alekanderu GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.10.09 02:43:00 - [46] Originally by: Bohoba Gal... will keep there Uber blasterboats and sniper kings. and they will conquer all of empire with there Uber ships with a wreaking hit of 2000+ what are you talking about, rokhs and apocs are MUCH better snipers than the mega, and blasterboats are hardly "uber"; sure, they do a ton of damage but they have to get very close to do it and they also have almost no hope of escaping if reinforcements show up
Christari Zuborov Amarr Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.10.09 02:54:00 - [47] Edited by: Christari Zuborov on 09/10/2008 02:55:27 My prediction is - Even more whines and crying about how people are getting killed because the experienced players will still kill n00bs left, right, and center, but even more effectively so because training will make more of a difference.
Kransthow THE INTERNET.	Posted - 2008.10.09 04:42:00 - [48] Originally by: Calvin Roh well rounded combat pilot.. And what would that be inb4 tank and gank
Jason Edwards	Posted - 2008.10.09 05:06:00 - [49] Quote: * CCP loses a larger portion of the playerbase than they ever have before following patch introduction wont happen right away. GTCs are 60 days now. You certainly will see many not showing up in server. Though I think many will come to pve or industrial. It's not hard to train an industrial and then shift around stuff for profit. Or whatever else is new in the upcoming expansion. Then see if pvp is even interesting anymore. If it turns out to be 500vs500 all the time. Nobody will care enough. Quote: * Couple months down the line we start seeing 'nerf missiles/ecm/caldari' threads with great regularity They already exist pretty well. The falcon/rook is absolutely nuts. The only reason caldari dont just up and leave now in fail warfare... ------------------------ "There was this bright flash of light - and now this egg shaped thing is on my screen - did I level up?"
Jason Edwards	Posted - 2008.10.09 05:10:00 - [50] Originally by: Faife alt-account drake spamming defenders to protect your entire gang might make sense. an alt-account falcon permajamming like a dozen people all the time makes more sense. ------------------------ "There was this bright flash of light - and now this egg shaped thing is on my screen - did I level up?"
voogru Gallente Massive Damage United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2008.10.09 06:29:00 - [51] I'm nerf proof. I have a high SP Gallente, Caldari, Minmatar & Amarr characters. So when uber nerfs come in that destroy one of my characters, I play the FOTM character. The nice thing is, you can do it with just two accounts. Buy already specced chars & transfer them to one of your accounts that has nerfed character. You can't train them all 24/7, but the flexibility of being nerf proof is worth it IMO. And it's easier then moaning and complaining on the forums. Will just chill out in my new collection of Ravens and ECM boats. Hate Farmers? Click Here
FlameGlow Legio Octae Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.09 06:50:00 - [52] Originally by: Jason Edwards Originally by: Faife alt-account drake spamming defenders to protect your entire gang might make sense. an alt-account falcon permajamming like a dozen people all the time makes more sense. WTB your falcon with 20 mids, heck, I'd but it even if it's only 12 _____________ I don't care what is nerfed, as long as it's not my "undock" button.
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.10.09 06:55:00 - [53] Originally by: Jason Edwards Quote: * CCP loses a larger portion of the playerbase than they ever have before following patch introduction wont happen right away. GTCs are 60 days now. You certainly will see many not showing up in server. Though I think many will come to pve or industrial. It's not hard to train an industrial and then shift around stuff for profit. Or whatever else is new in the upcoming expansion. Then see if pvp is even interesting anymore. If it turns out to be 500vs500 all the time. Nobody will care enough. Quote: * Couple months down the line we start seeing 'nerf missiles/ecm/caldari' threads with great regularity They already exist pretty well. The falcon/rook is absolutely nuts. The only reason caldari dont just up and leave now in fail warfare... I get tired of hearing this tbh. The Rook has some flexibility, but the Falcon has such little DPS it can't even commit suicide! People just get mad because it jams the tacklers and runs away. I got news for you, my arazu can damp the tacklers and run away as well. Can't tackle if you can only target at ten paces. The curse and pilgrim just neuts the tacklers and warps away. The rapier webs the tacklers and outruns it. SO QUIT WHINING! As far as every fleet having one well duh! Every fleet SHOULD have one, as well as some dampage and some TDage. It's part of having a balanced friggin fleet. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.
Delichon The First Foundation SOLAR FLEET	Posted - 2008.10.09 07:05:00 - [54] Cloacks would be the next nano. Small gang would not die - well, at least in our ally we do roams with ships that don't have 3xOverdrives + 2xPolys in their standart fit. People will adapt, whiners will whine, AFs will get boosted and I will get rich reselling Lachesises I bought before the nerf :) ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next. EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun
Murkon Salesgirl Amarr	Posted - 2008.10.09 07:22:00 - [55] Defenders will remain very un-usable for the primary reason that it only negates a tiny amount of the incoming dmg. It will also not work at close range as lag and the speed involve means missiles will hit you before your defender can do squat. Turret disruptors work because they totally negate the enemy's firepower. ECM works for the same reasons, except it works against everyone. Now, it will help minmatar ships since a lot of them have unbonused missile slots left over, they can fit 1 or 2 rocket launchers with defenders to boost their tank potential (or they could fit HAMS/Siege can get better dps..). But outside of this, not a very good option for other ships.
Raymond Sterns Utopian Research I.E.L. The ENTITY.	Posted - 2008.10.09 08:04:00 - [56] -People will cry -I will stick it in their po0pers -Will become rich by selling nano*** tears Not necessarily in that order. _
Doxs Roxs Free Collective Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2008.10.09 08:43:00 - [57] I dont know about you but from my perspective less speed means MUCH less fun. Going zoom is fun in itself. One of the major reasons for a nanogang is that you have to do maybe 30+ jumps to get a fight, like last night, I think I easely made over a 100 jumps... Now imagine if speed and agility is reduced by 50%, each jump will take much longer. Not to mention even heavier ships will probably be fotm meaning even less speed when moving across the map... This all boils down to even less pvp and when you finally start the pewpew, its all about ECM, missiles and remote repping... Basically, static and utterly booring combat. Yes, I can fly RR BS and I do it regularly when needed, but its nowhere near the fun I have in my rapier... In short, by reducing the speed of ships, even if they keep the relative speed the same, I think the game will be much less fun. Regards /Doxs After 9 months of being a "!" face, I now discover that Im butt ugly instead...
Confuzer Volition Cult The Volition Cult	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:00:00 - [58] My years of tranfering small amounts of real money to CCP employees has finally payed off. Beware eve galaxy, I - as caldari - will conquer all! ----------------- Destiny is not a matter of chance. It is a matter of choice. It's not a thing to be waited for - it is a thing to be achieved.
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:05:00 - [59] Originally by: Confuzer My years of tranfering small amounts of real money to CCP employees has finally payed off. Beware eve galaxy, I - as caldari - will conquer all! I was just gonna say Caldari will be sporting a lot of hardon epeens. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.
TZeer Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:35:00 - [60] Caldari missileships where never the big OMG overpowered DPS ship before rigs and implants got introduced. So what have suddenly changed? What makes them suddenly so overpowered? Why is it overpowered for a raven to deal mediocre cruisersized damage against a cruiser? Alot of cruisers outdamage the raven with ease... Even turret BS outdamage a cruise raven if flown properly...
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:42:00 - [61] Originally by: TZeer Caldari missileships where never the big OMG overpowered DPS ship before rigs and implants got introduced. So what have suddenly changed? What makes them suddenly so overpowered? Why is it overpowered for a raven to deal mediocre cruisersized damage against a cruiser? Alot of cruisers outdamage the raven with ease... Even turret BS outdamage a cruise raven if flown properly... To be fair, it isn't Caldari ships, it's one Caldari ship. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.
TZeer Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:47:00 - [62] Let me guess.... Raven? :P Well, tell me whats overpowered with it? Enlighten me....
Sarin Adler Caldari Dark Shadow Cartel	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:49:00 - [63] Drake probably. --- Alts, the root of all evil.
Sexiest Beast Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:51:00 - [64] id guess falcon
TZeer Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:54:00 - [65] hmm, raven, drake or falcon..... missile nerf brigade and falcon nerf squad is very close, but I think I`ll put my money on the falcon nerf squad
Theron Gyrow Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:55:00 - [66] Originally by: Sarin Adler Drake probably. No, Drake is just the best BC. Falcon and torp Raven are overpowered (although with Raven, it's more that torps are OP, the Raven hull is actually fine). -- Gradient forum
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.10.09 09:59:00 - [67] Originally by: Sarin Adler Drake probably. And you would be the winner! Though the torp raven do hurt a lot, Drake tanking ability with still doing moderate dps is just insane. Only thing that kept it out of pvp was it's lack of speed, which will no longer matter. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.
Vincenzo Delloro Amarr Lux et Veritas	Posted - 2008.10.09 10:31:00 - [68] I'm so glad I rolled Amarr. I see people screaming "OMG NERF!" and my first reaction is "Oh no! CCP's removing all Therm damage from lasers and tripling cap usage!" Then I find out what's actually going on and I realise that I'm living in a nerf bubble. "Oh, fast ships and missile boats got the whack? Uh, that's sad. I guess."
Chaos Incarnate Faceless Logistics	Posted - 2008.10.09 10:32:00 - [69] From now: -Nozh will announce some missile rebalancing before the winter expansion. Forum nano-drama will reduce slightly, replaced by falcon/cloak complaints. Caldari players will howl and scream like the wretched whining of half a million WoW players. -Patch will go live -Nano-drama and missile-drama will spread across forums for a period of two weeks -Everyone will throw away their nanoships, and vagabonds will go up on firesale contracts in jita by the thousands -Adaptation will occur. Drama will be reduced, replaced by the occasional nostalgia thread "Hey, remember back in the day when the vagabond could go like 10km/s? Man, that was great" -Ships with cloaks will probably be the new FotM, but nanoships will still be around. Assault frigates will actually be seen in PvP. Some people might even fit afterburners. Universe will not implode. -I will get delicious cake.
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.10.09 10:50:00 - [70] Cloaky gangs are the new FOTM? Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Berious Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.10.09 11:03:00 - [71] - Speed at pressing F1-F8 the new decider in battle - People with programmable keyboards win Eve
Joachim Kato Zawa's Fan Club	Posted - 2008.10.09 11:20:00 - [72] I somehow think that devs responsible for the upcoming "improvement" are't really playing the game like a normal player does. This "improvemnet" is hugely retar.... I mean kinda strange. Not only nano pilots, but pilots that prefer to tank are getting dongslapped inna face. "Adjusting" game basing on snaked/officer fitted ceptors and hacs is kinda retar.... I mean weird.
ShadowMaiden Amarr Metal Machine	Posted - 2008.10.09 12:05:00 - [73] Warning: Side-effects of Expansions and Patches may include speculation, jumping to conclusions, over-analysis, misunderstandings, confusion, unwarranted assumptions, ten-page forum threads, baseless concerns, undue panic, virtual stampedes, threadnaughts, premature account cancellations, and hoarding of materials and isk. I wish I was a 3ft Doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes
Iguana Orange	Posted - 2008.10.09 16:01:00 - [74] You are a bunch of whiners, did you ever stop to consider that mayybe minie arnt going to recieve as much mass increase as the rest making them still speed tankable?
Mithos Victus Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.09 16:22:00 - [75] Arguing from the perspective of what is fun or not is usually futile at best. That being said, arguing from the perspective of what is widely accepted by the majority of the player base can lend itself to greater credence. However, to get a true demographic sampling would be next to impossible, and in the end, CCP writes the code for this game, and they will do what they think is best, even if people start coming out of the woodwork with all sorts of overblown and irrational fear and loathing. All this for really little reason other than they are so invested in the game that any change to aspects of the game they cherish as somehow beneficial to them cannot possibly garner even greater benefits as the risk is too high and it's unpossible (Yes I know, not a word, think about it) to make the game better. The game is only as entertaining as the players who play it and what they make out of it. And letting the nano era run free and rampant for the remainder of the game's lifespan while PvP slowly stagnates and grows tedious and dull is probably not a recipe for success. MMOs should not just fizzle out and fade away, IMO, they should either go out with a bang or with a thud. And like any good rock star, they are here to put on a show, not be laid up in a retirement home waiting for the inevitable, afraid to walk outside, for fear of discovering the world has changed and left them behind. That being said, if things pan out in some ways that people fear, I will be thankful that I trained my other account up to making good use out of the Raven.
Malena Panic Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.10.09 16:48:00 - [76] Originally by: Cailais If the target is fitted with a MWD you probably don't even need a web - just use a short range scram - he's going nowhere fast. Wow, talk about theorycraft. You won't get a lock until the second MWD pulse, by which time the target will already be at the gate, or close enough to tank for the scant few seconds it will take for him to jump. ...
doofydoo	Posted - 2008.10.09 17:00:00 - [77] Edited by: doofydoo on 09/10/2008 17:00:23 LOL @ all the whinage in the forums. just think: people may have to start fitting tanks for something other than missions people may have to finish a fight they start rather than just speeding away at stupid speeds if they realise they cant win Roaming gangs may have to be thought out rather than just "bring something fast" yeh, this is definately going to kill eve, the sky is falling........... (not aimed at anyone in particular, just at the general posting on the forums today)

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