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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Annaphera
Minmatar Super Green Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:34:00 -
[1171]
Originally by: Hayleine
Originally by: Catherine Frasier
Originally by: Morgon Borga You'd think they'd at least be smart enough to remove all references to the "bug" as an intended feature before posting this garbage.
For example?
the example you seek, is from the eve-online new player guide, > skills - paragraph #3 "Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though)." CCP's "bug" excuse is a pile of bovine excrement.
to Quote CCP "capsuleers who actively put their time and energy into working on their characters will no longer be unfairly affected by those few who have not."
So, is CCP Implying that MORE people complained about other people "Ghost training" than are currently complaining about NOT being able to do it? Not possible!
the possibility of me resurrecting that 3rd account I had, has been greatly diminished. -1
Dang, promised myself I wouldn't, but (to quote a song) it's like a train wreck...don't want to stare but you can't look away.
In response to the above...if you looked in the player guide a few years ago, there was a 'feature' listed that you had a chance to get a T2 BPO if you did research with R&D agents. Hmmm...don't seem to see that 'feature' any more, because CCP decided it was too overpowering, and ended the T2 'lottery'. Further, it WASN'T in the guide when the game came out - it was added later (T2 wasn't either); the guide, however, didn't state that (I've seen copied sections). So, I guess we can draw the conclusion that the Player Guide is just a list of all the things the game does right this moment, and doesn't comment on the origin and probable lifespan/destiny of any given function.
CCP is saying they didn't intend Ghost Training to exist, and a dev post talks about it being "discovered", so that is likely true. Thus, the idea that the 'bug' claim is a lie can't be backed up. No one has yet quoted an ad that tries to lure you in based on ghost training, so the whole "advertised feature" argument looks suspect. In short...while they may have been a bit abrupt, there is no way for anyone to flatly state they have lied without seeing only what they wish to. The blog did touch on financial concerns as a motivator for the change; you and I may choose to believe it was the biggest factor in the decision, but that's inconsequential. They have a legitimate right to do as they wish with regard to the rules of Eve, and they have shared some of their reasons. Some people are choosing to assign extra motives and then go into rages based on those conclusions, up to and including canceled accounts. Up to you...wish you the best, but I think you're getting bent out of shape over nothing. That's just my opinion, though.
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Catherine Frasier
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:34:00 -
[1172]
Originally by: Tunnas
Originally by: Catherine Frasier
Originally by: Stormwind Bloodfeather 1. You advertised this as an INTENDED FEATURE of the game... for years.
Got proof?
proof
Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).
For the 73357th time: Describing what happens is not the same thing as saying it was done that way on purpose. You put "INTENDED FEATURE" in caps and rightfully so, intent is the key question. Nowhere in the guide does it say "we planned it this way" rather than (like lots of other things in Eve) "it just worked out that way".
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Kryttos
Hard Corp Carbide and Diamonds Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:34:00 -
[1173]
Ill try and find the link
More good news for Americans: Icelandair just slashed fares to Iceland's capital, Reykjavik, from New York or Boston to $400 roundtrip, about what a one-way fare once cost. This fare is good for travel November 1 through March 31, 2009.
As an add-on in November only, Icelandair is offering a 3-night ôWinter Madnessö package at the Hilton Reykjavik Nordica, with daily breakfast, for only $149 per person double occupancy. This top-rated hotel typically goes for over $200 per night.
[email protected] |
Shalo Mil'Chaim
Minmatar Recycling and Recovery
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:34:00 -
[1174]
Originally by: Zey Nadar Edited by: Zey Nadar on 14/10/2008 07:32:13 People who try to exploit things have those things taken away from them sooner or later.
It wasn't an exploit for nearly 5 years. Try again.
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Arrs Grazznic
Poena Executive Solutions
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:36:00 -
[1175]
Quote: Ghost Training was an unintended feature
It's been posted above, but NO IT WASN'T! The knowledge base states:
Quote: Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive
In the 3 and a bit years I've been playing EVE I've never Ghost Trained, yet I do not feel short changed or "unfairly affected by those few who have".
Personally I think Ghost Training is a good thing as it encourages players to return if they let their account lapse. When I decide to take a break from the game something that would make me consider returning is the knowledge a skill has finished training and I may be able to try something new in the game. Remove that ability and there is far less incentive to return.
While this is clearly intended to increase revenue I'm convinced you will lose out as a result of this. There will be fewer players returning after breaks and less people running alt accounts.
As this 'fix' will be implemented, are you going to go further with action against inactive accounts? If you are removing Ghost Training, I feel a number of other changes need to be made for accounts that lapse, for example:
Stop earning of RPCancellation of all market ordersCancellation of all manufacturing / research jobs (and freeing up the slot for use by other characters)Immediate expulsion from player corporations
If you are going to implement a change as proposed, you may as well go the whole hog.
On a positive note this will greatly reduce the price of GTCs!
Cheers, Arrs
Quote: Is it just me who says "what can I do in real life: drink beer; walk around; put on clothes; fly a spaceship firing at other spaceships" and then use that to choose what I do on the internet?
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ArmyOfMe
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:37:00 -
[1176]
Edited by: ArmyOfMe on 14/10/2008 07:37:30
Originally by: Tunnas *moderated for the safty of the children*
I see a ban coming in the near future
Originally by: deadmaus
Because by the time we had calmed Plague down after he heard BoB were back in the vicinity it was too late to do anything |
CliveMerric
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:37:00 -
[1177]
CCP please dont spit in our faces by announcing that one of the major selling points of the game is an 'unintended feature'. Its insulting....
im taking 2 of my accounts offline because you see fit to remove the 1 major reason i keep coming back to this game after i get bored for a while.
good job Clives BPC shop, Great deals!! |
Iota Belisarius
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:39:00 -
[1178]
Epic fail. This was the only reason I came back thanks to constant military deployments. --------------------- Your sig is inappropriate. Please read the forum rules before reposting. -Tirg Sig jacked and nerfed in one day, just my luck. |
12433412
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:39:00 -
[1179]
Oh my god, CCP gone completely stupid. I hate to use such words, but I fail to find any other. You'll be firing the one who came with this great idea soon as you will (finally) find out what you have done. Losing the trust of your customers may be the first thing. Milking more and more (more expensive gtc's, now this screw up) the existing player base instead of attracting new players is the way to hell. You are about to take the first decisive step. There is no more money to be had from the current players as they give you as much as they find fit. Given most of those 'ghost' accounts are alt accounts that let people explore other aspects of the game and given (now we get to the trust part) they were mostly created because ghost training was possible - this is vastly unfair changing of rules in the mid-game. A lot of effort and meney have been put into those accounts and nobody in their wildest dream imagined you would do such a .... over-night. I can understand you can have your financial troubles given the state of the Icelandic economy, but this is a nail to your coffin, honestly. Aggrevating your loyal customers, what an idea! Why did you not think of that before, you must have been blind, the best thing to do...
I though you guys knew better and actually had brains. A child can see farther than you. Sorry to say that.
Regards
124
_____________________________________________________ Beware of what you want, it might want you more! |
Maria Huana
Caldari 4th FLEET of REDARMY Red Army Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:41:00 -
[1180]
this will not reduce price of GTCs the price will grow if i`ll see 60d gtc for 600 mil next week - i will nit be surprised
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Catherine Frasier
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:42:00 -
[1181]
Originally by: Arrs Grazznic
Quote: Ghost Training was an unintended feature
It's been posted above, but NO IT WASN'T! The knowledge base states:
Quote: Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive
As Annaphera said: Quote: if you looked in the player guide a few years ago, there was a 'feature' listed that you had a chance to get a T2 BPO if you did research with R&D agents. Hmmm...don't seem to see that 'feature' any more, because CCP decided it was too overpowering, and ended the T2 'lottery'. Further, it WASN'T in the guide when the game came out - it was added later (T2 wasn't either); the guide, however, didn't state that (I've seen copied sections). So, I guess we can draw the conclusion that the Player Guide is just a list of all the things the game does right this moment, and doesn't comment on the origin and probable lifespan/destiny of any given function.
As I said Quote: Describing what happens is not the same thing as saying it was done that way on purpose. Nowhere in the guide does it say "we planned it this way" rather than (like lots of other things in Eve) "it just worked out that way".
All you're pointing out is that it was unintended, but once it was discovered it was documented.
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Annaphera
Minmatar Super Green Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:43:00 -
[1182]
Originally by: CliveMerric CCP please dont spit in our faces by announcing that one of the major selling points of the game is an 'unintended feature'. Its insulting....
im taking 2 of my accounts offline because you see fit to remove the 1 major reason i keep coming back to this game after i get bored for a while.
good job
"Major selling point of the game"??? People keep saying this, and I just can't get my head around it. I see LOTS of ads for Eve around the web, and no small number of MMO sites...could someone point out the one they see that has this listed as a "major selling point" that is written by CCP? There's a dev post floating around that talks about ghost training as being "discovered"...how does one discover something one created intentionally?
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freddy madball
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:43:00 -
[1183]
Originally by: Zabaticus I've been reading this blog with interest and have posted my agreement with the removal of this feature a couple of times. I am struck by the people that say they are the player base and CCP better listen to them. These couple of hundred that have posted and reposted are not the player base. They are whiners that are upset because they can't game "The Game" anymore. Tough - leave. The tens of thousands of players that don't use this gambit will be glad to see you go. They are the real "Player Base" that CCP is supporting.
Zabaticus
yes go visit an ice belt, or a asterid belt, or go to a popular missioning system and look at all the macroer's operating. then remind me about that " player base"
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Eran Laude
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:43:00 -
[1184]
After reading the first 20 or so pages of the thread, it seems to me that the ghost-training alt-sellers are whining that they can't exploit a game mechanic that for all intents and purposes shouldn't exist.
I also hope this encourages more main playing rather than alt metagaming.
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Tunnas
Amarr Delusions 0f Grandeur G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:43:00 -
[1185]
Originally by: ArmyOfMe Edited by: ArmyOfMe on 14/10/2008 07:37:30
Originally by: Tunnas *moderated for the safty of the children*
I see a ban coming in the near future
hehe that's aparrently what happens when you link some one elses signature and he gets mad...
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Derdre Esme
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:44:00 -
[1186]
I understand this move but as many other ppl said i think it's an half good idea as personnally i Ghost train a lot (4 account) and i then have on average 2 active account at a time, if CCP do so il will not pay 4 account continuously , then i bet in the next weeks we will see -lot of char selling -lot of character transfert for concentration i think CCP will loose money on this move even if i understand them
The 'half-way' solution i think would be to unallow ghost training on Skill that have a factor of 6 or more
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FireFoxx80
Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:44:00 -
[1187]
I cba to read through 49+38 pages, however...
Why not re-enable ghost training, but at a vastly reduced rate to standard training?
What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass! |
Tyby
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:45:00 -
[1188]
it is all becose "ghost training bug" is crashing ze super-uber stacklessI0 crap! so, in fact is our own fault that the nodes are crashing and the CCP is just thinking to the good of his players...lol to the ppl that are saying that will put eve in line with others MMO: i don't really know others MMO where ppl have 6-8 accounts... to CCP: you are walking on a thin ice, eve is a great game, but all those nerfs in the last time, new gtc stuff/prices, this, and the suposed incoming nerfs plus the world crysis may crack that ice, and we all will lose from it.
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Jac Straw
Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:46:00 -
[1189]
The only real whine I want about this is..
Remove ghost sell/buy orders and Research points
Without this the game is unbalanced
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles Zzz
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:46:00 -
[1190]
I'm surprised that CCP chose to wait until this particular moment to fix this problem. Ghost training was removed from Serenity, the Chinese server, years ago. --- DIY copying in Liekuri 20:1 mineral compression Eve Online folding@home team |
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Arrs Grazznic
Poena Executive Solutions
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:47:00 -
[1191]
Originally by: Catherine Frasier As I said Quote: Describing what happens is not the same thing as saying it was done that way on purpose. Nowhere in the guide does it say "we planned it this way" rather than (like lots of other things in Eve) "it just worked out that way".
All you're pointing out is that it was unintended, but once it was discovered it was documented.
So where does it say that this was unintended?
Cheers, Arrs
Quote: Is it just me who says "what can I do in real life: drink beer; walk around; put on clothes; fly a spaceship firing at other spaceships" and then use that to choose what I do on the internet?
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Eniy Oh
Gallente United Systems Navy Unitary Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:48:00 -
[1192]
Edited by: Eniy Oh on 14/10/2008 07:49:39 Seeing this response (...) it's no wonder CCP waited 5 years to ban ghost training.
EVE is not freeware. And that a feature/bug/whatever been around for a long time doesn't mean you're entitled to it forever.
IMHO CCP has the right to change whatever they want to this game. If this results in people who don't even pay for all their accounts canceling their hardly ever paid subscriptions, do you really thing this is going to affect CCP much? --- The one whose ship names don't pass the sanity test while the rest of him is rather sane |
Annaphera
Minmatar Super Green Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:48:00 -
[1193]
Originally by: Jac Straw The only real whine I want about this is..
Remove ghost sell/buy orders and Research points
Without this the game is unbalanced
I tend to agree.
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Chris Tao
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:49:00 -
[1194]
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=896550
"Please keep discussions on the subject of Ghost training to this thread please."
Oh and CCP thanx for the 2 day warning. I will now magically remove 70$ from my ass ;)
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Annaphera
Minmatar Super Green Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:50:00 -
[1195]
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro I'm surprised that CCP chose to wait until this particular moment to fix this problem. Ghost training was removed from Serenity, the Chinese server, years ago.
To everyone who is saying that this was an intended feature...what does the above tell you?
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Honeyz
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:50:00 -
[1196]
Well, personally I know a few people who have already cancelled or will cancel their 1 or more of their accounts because of this (including me). And now I just found out that another friend has completely quit Eve and cancelled all accounts. And yes, it's too late to have all his stuff. Thanks CCP!
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EnslaverOfMinmatar
Yarsk Hunters DeaDSpace Coalition
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:51:00 -
[1197]
proof that ghost-training IS A BUG
Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill tr |
Kerdrak
3B Legio IX Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:51:00 -
[1198]
The CCP criteria about the duality "bug <-> feature" is funny. ________________________________________
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Aioa
Planetary Assault Systems
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:52:00 -
[1199]
C'mon now guys - dry your eyes, pick up your toys and think hard about this.
It always surprised me that this loophole existed in the fiirst place, and that they let it happen for as long as they did. If you ran a business, and found a considerable amount of your customers were getting your service free of charge, you'd put a stop to it, right?
Maybe if you'd all been a little more subtle about exploiting it - instead of abusing it horribly by changing skill on 5 accounts then unsubcribing them all - you would have been able to get away with it for longer?
I don't want your stuff, but I would like you all to grow the hell up. --
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Stormwind Bloodfeather
Minmatar Sogdian Traders Inc
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:53:00 -
[1200]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Stormwind Bloodfeather
I create, run, edit, and modify MySQL databases daily,[...] and writing a PROPER database to handle the code.
Although I sympathize with your cause, this is where your post falls apart ...
Nice try. If you had even the slightest clue what I do then you might have the chance to open your flap and make comments, but as you don't, you should do yourself a favor and be quiet. While my Business isn't large, I do a lot of work to make it run. This includes creating, editing and running MySQL databases to keep my php based sites going for myself, and my few customers. Enjoy eating some Crow.
Stormwind
In EVE, your only friend is your ship and it's weapons. All others are the enemy! |
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