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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Triksterism Gallente Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:06:00 - [901] Originally by: INF Wonderwoman Originally by: Juntar Solarwind Adapt and overcome. Get over it already and move on. Either pay to play or let your accounts lapse and don't come back. Pretty simple if you stop and think about it. Yes, just step aside and let the "government" do what they want... This is a player based game and we have the right to say whats good or not. If you get someone in office that wants to blow up all of Asia, do you say adapt and overcome,just get over it? .... stupid. That is something a lot of people don't realize. Who makes the game what it is? The players. Who should the company listen to when they want to improve things to keep people paying and playing? The players. I'm not one for just sitting back and "oh whatever, I'll just adapt! Hurf durf!" - Ghost Train & Snowflake
dabatman	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:06:00 - [902] -1 account that I paid for consistently up till now. I'm in college, I love the main on that account, but I'm not gonna make this a second job to keep that toon and this one running cause GTC's cost too damn much. Worst change ever, hell even worse than when WOW decided to make 2 years of work in the game not matter at all 20 minutes into the expansion. Way to go guys.
Erimisha Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:07:00 - [903] Originally by: Liranan Ghost training does cost CCP money because you pay for one month, set skill, disable account, log in three weeks later, change skill, disable account. A one month time card could last months this way and, I agree with CCP, it is not good for business. Uh, what you explain is NOT ghost training and it doesn't even work like that. A 1 month subscription lasts 30 consecutive days. Whether you cancel in day 1 or day 30 your time is up 30 days after the initial payment (credit card, GTC, etc). It is NOT like a prepaid cellphone where a prepaid block of 90 minutes lasts 90 minutes of "useage" regardless of 90 mins in 1 day or 1 minute for 90 days in a row which is what you described.
Haldane Fisher Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:07:00 - [904] Edited by: Haldane Fisher on 14/10/2008 05:09:03 Originally by: Exxonett Originally by: PsychoBones II Originally by: Exxonett I have the solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As per the laws and regulations of the u.s. any and all false advertisements are subject to fines imprisonment and or lawsuit. You come after my wallet I come after yours. This is not a threat it is a promise. A foreign country based corporation selling their product in this country does fall under this topic. Typical American solution. Sue everything. My intention is not to sue but to display the fact that they can be sued. If they fix their lies and stop trying to rob people this really isn't an issue then. However if they choose to continue on this chosen path there seem to be enough people to make it costly.I have never sued anyone as of this point and as have used it as a threat to get my point across. When you mention their wallets they listen to what you have to say just a little bit more. Read the EULA lately? You havent been sold anything other than the ability to log into a game being run on a server in england. Everything else is owned by CCP, you own nothing. They also reserver the right to change anything at any time. "Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though)."
Andrua Leprosorium	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:07:00 - [905] Originally by: Liranan Originally by: Triksterism Ghost training does cost CCP money because you pay for one month, set skill, disable account, log in three weeks later, change skill, disable account. A one month time card could last months this way and, I agree with CCP, it is not good for business. In the imaginary world where time card work like this, it would be true, yes. Unfortunately, subscription start ticking when you activate it, and while it will allow you to switch skills after 3 weeks, it will expire in one week after that, disabled account or not. And you need to pay an at least monthly fee to reactivate it. Which reactivation will start ticking for whatever period you've paid it, again, no matter disabled or not. The only way to use ghost training is to have a skill longer than your current subscription period expiration date. Which are not too many skills, by the way. Or I am missing something very big and important.
Oftherocks Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:08:00 - [906] Originally by: Zabaticus Wow the whining is awesome. If this is such a horrendous decision (I think it's great) then unsubscribe - right now - don't take it - go. Right now - do it - you don't have to take it - show them who's boss. We need the chaff removed so the wheat can grow anyway. I'll be polite and say Be Well but definitely not Well met. Zabaticus Do you want a job with Eve's marketing department? I think you'd fit in just perfectly.
Athena Nyx White Shadow Imperium Conviction.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:09:00 - [907] I recently cancled my account because I'm allmost homeless and I need the extra cash. I had planned on training BS5 before I left, but now I don't see the point of even logging in for the few days I have remaining. Meh, whatever. The only thing i'm worried about is this kind of thing eventually progressing to the point where inactive accounts are deleted after a few months. Hopefully that will never happen, but you never know. EVE is becoming more mainstream by the day which is part of the reason i've lost interest. Later gents.
Ishbuanium Black Skull Legion Veneratio Venator Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:09:00 - [908] Maybe we're looking at this from the wrong angle? Maybe this was a bug? If it was it would fit CCP's timeframe for fixing them
Liranan M'8'S Frontal Impact	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:09:00 - [909] Originally by: Triksterism No, you read it correctly, he did not. LOL speak of misunderstanding!! I r Idiot!1! Hi AVA!!!! Farjung is my God You people need to open your eyes and read threads before you mindlessly spam the New Thread link.
Daelin Blackleaf	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:10:00 - [910] I don't particularly care about ghost training, but I don't like the trend that is being continued here. Originally by: 'Dev Blog' Ghost Training was an unintended feature where unpaid accounts of EVE Online were able to continue training skills. While this allowed players to run multiple characters on a shoestring budget, in all effect, this was a bug. This is, in all effect, a blatant lie. With the decision to keep this documented feature on Tranquility when it was to be removed with the release of Dragon you confirmed, a second time, that this is a feature. Originally by: 'News' A long overdue and much needed change Overdue since when? Much needed how? Can you quantify this statement. Originally by: 'OP' This practice upsets the balance of the game How? I doubt it upsets the balance of the game nearly as much as those of us with multiple accounts do. This is the 30/90day GTC issue all over again, a perceived opportunity for greater profit getting in the way of honesty and respect for your community. Remove features, change payment options, but retain enough respect for your customers to either tell us the truth about the change or tell us nothing at all.

Gig Malchura Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:10:00 - [911] Originally by: Zabaticus Wow the whining is awesome. If this is such a horrendous decision (I think it's great) then unsubscribe - right now - don't take it - go. Right now - do it - you don't have to take it - show them who's boss. We need the chaff removed so the wheat can grow anyway. I'll be polite and say Be Well but definitely not Well met. Zabaticus At lease be man enough to post with your main. PS: Carrier 5 Finishing in less than a week on my primary account thanks to ghost training. Reason, tired of all this bullshit, decided to take a break and come back later. Might as well have some skill training.
Exxonett Caldari Invicta.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:10:00 - [912] Pyramid quoting is prohibited.Applebabe Also not an issue though I own nothing the cash I invest is very real and there are consequences for misleading to a person to get their cash. http://www.midnightsquadron.com/msbb/uploads/post-23-1152919992_thumb.jpg Sig Linked. Please resize your sig to within the 400*120 Pixel size limit, and enjoy some egg nog while you're at it. -ReverendM ([email protected])
Demitria Fernir Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:12:00 - [913] the fact that "ghost training" actually required reactivation to change skill, you have lost all ghost training accounts. good job CCP, enjoy you -x00 accounts. _______________________________________________ 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101 I will Conquer My Signature Somewhere in the future 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101
Triksterism Gallente Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:12:00 - [914] Originally by: Liranan Originally by: Triksterism No, you read it correctly, he did not. LOL speak of misunderstanding!! I r Idiot!1! Hi AVA!!!! What? The person I quoted read my post correctly. The other person he referred to did not. Perhaps I should have switched the comma for a period. - Ghost Train & Snowflake
Nobler Caldari Divine Power	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:13:00 - [915] I'm against this. I would have typed more, but it would have been trolling. Sorry to hear that CCP decided to do this, I wish CCP could fix something else.
James Marshalll Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:14:00 - [916] If you hadn't had talked up the fact you could train with your account inactive... I might believe you. If your GM crew didn't pull crap like giving back certain players lost ships in gridlocked fleet fights, while telling others you don't like no, I might believe you. If you hadn't banned the guy who blew the whistle on some of your gm's cheating, for "account sharing" because you had no real other recourse to stop the floodgates of bad press, I would believe you. If you hadn't taken money out of one of my alt accounts because I sold time cards to an isk farmer unknown to me at the time he was of course(before they outlawed reselling of GTC's of course) I might have believe you....(more so had the GM not told me that I should have known who I was selling to before I did it cough yes because I keep an active log of every CC scammer, and ISK farmer in eve....) Will I quit? Prolly not right now, but you can bet if I have to quit the game for monetary reasons, real life reasons, or work the fact I won't be coming back to a character who was at least semi keeping me on pace with my friends will be a LOT easier to walk away from. /shrug. Either way its a bs move and you guys know it, but you have your fanbois who think you can do no wrong, so they will you guys happy with whatever you shovel them. You won't miss those of us who do leave I am sure.
Gin Doom	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:14:00 - [917] Wow, many great comments, hats off to the many. So no more T2 BPO's for the newer players, damn that sucked. Now add in carrier 5 and all the support skills. Ok I can manage that while using my other acct. I mean gzz I paid for the damn skill and the time to activate the training. But wait, lets stop the latest bug like "ghost training". Can you least come up with a better excuse then a bug? Baiscly the better established you are in the game the better off you are. If I only had that T2 BPO and those skills allready trained, then I'd be pretty happy getting timecards for free. But wait I'm not that old and need to grind for iskies and while on another acct - hmm paid account i mean. 1+0 = 1, so where's the money loss to CCP? Please explain how this is gonna get you more people to play the game when in my opinion, its getting harder to. I guess the game is missing to many frig tacklers and this is the solution or the servers are just so poorly maintained its time to push out the not so obsessed players. Damn, I allready lost one of my best PvP corpmates to the timecode change now this. Everything that has a beginning, has an end. Fly safe no matter what your flying :)
Alexander Ronay Crushed Ambitions	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:14:00 - [918] Originally by: Triksterism Originally by: Liranan Originally by: Triksterism No, you read it correctly, he did not. LOL speak of misunderstanding!! I r Idiot!1! Hi AVA!!!! What? The person I quoted read my post correctly. The other person he referred to did not. Perhaps I should have switched the comma for a period. This whole quote structure is getting confusing. Perhaps I should spend more time on the forums
Velda Chulai	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:14:00 - [919] Edited by: Velda Chulai on 14/10/2008 05:14:46 Lets make up an example of how training might work: You gain 1500 points per hour, and you have a 1500 point skill. This means that, if I'm training a skill, it will be completed in an hour. The only thing that changes this is if I decide to stop training that skill. So I reach 750 points - at that point my character is credited with 750 points toward that skill. Now I start training Skill B, which is a 3000 point skill - two hours to train. I complete it, but once i hit 3000 points, the client polls teh server to confirm the "Stop training" action. The server replies with "Yep, you're training is complete." At no point were there any excessive database transactions made; everything simply worked and it was schedule based. The actual points are credited, but only when I directed the server to cease training. At this point, I decide to complete training on the original skill. With 750 points credited towards the skill and no changes to my learning skill, I can be as certain as teh server that my skill will finish in 30 minutes. Once again I go back to "training" with a pre-determined completion time on the server side. Are you now trying to explain to us that this is not how it worked? The answer to this will be interesting I'm sure.
Annaphera Minmatar Super Green Industries	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:16:00 - [920] Triksterism - judging by the responses in this thread, I'm reconsidering the wisdom of arguing the point here at all. Everyone, on both sides and myself included, seems to be seeing only what they want to see, and more or less has their opinion set in stone. Just for your edification, however, I'll say it again: 1) CCP actually admitted it's partly a cash flow issue. I don't think they were prepared for this level of backlash, else they might not have done it, but I for one am in favor of giving them more security in some pretty nasty financial times. They came out and admitted it, as many people said they should, and got very little of the promised (in the 50-page forum thread) understanding. 2) I'm shocked it was ever in the game at all to allow people freebies like that. I'm not shocked they want to close the loophole. While I'm saddened to see them move towards the industry standard, I'm not at all surprised or outraged. 3) No matter what people seem to think, there IS a balance issue involved. Newer players don't have 45-day skills to train, and so must maintain a sub or go without training. Only the very skilled characters gain any real benefit, making the "perk" that "anyone can use" a bit lop-sided. So, someone working on Dreadnought 5 gets to not pay for two months, while newer players must pay. I know there are a few things that newer characters can get, but the benefits are slight, as they will wind up with no isk at the end if they take a similar period off. To underline it, I watched people in a former corp do exactly that, while I changed skills every few days at most. 4) I do think CCP dropped the ball on the style of the announcement. However, at this point I find myself (childishly, I admit) unwilling to bend because some people are so flipping outraged that CCP DARES to change something that - despite protests to the contrary - was never used by CCP to sell the game, nor promised as a feature. I've also been called names for daring to hold a minority opinion, which always puts my back up. Now...I'm not taking part any longer, because nothing is really being accomplished here. No one is going to change their minds, and no one who needs to hear these sides is probably going to be able to plow through all this and keep sane. Good luck and sorry to see you go to all who are quitting...and everyone else, see you in game.

SkwisgaarSkwigelf C.R.M Productions	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:17:00 - [921] Originally by: Velda Chulai Edited by: Velda Chulai on 14/10/2008 05:14:46 Lets make up an example of how training might work: You gain 1500 points per hour, and you have a 1500 point skill. This means that, if I'm training a skill, it will be completed in an hour. The only thing that changes this is if I decide to stop training that skill. So I reach 750 points - at that point my character is credited with 750 points toward that skill. Now I start training Skill B, which is a 3000 point skill - two hours to train. I complete it, but once i hit 3000 points, the client polls teh server to confirm the "Stop training" action. The server replies with "Yep, you're training is complete." At no point were there any excessive database transactions made; everything simply worked and it was schedule based. The actual points are credited, but only when I directed the server to cease training. At this point, I decide to complete training on the original skill. With 750 points credited towards the skill and no changes to my learning skill, I can be as certain as teh server that my skill will finish in 30 minutes. Once again I go back to "training" with a pre-determined completion time on the server side. Are you now trying to explain to us that this is not how it worked? The answer to this will be interesting I'm sure. if by answer you mean complete silence.
Ralf Kenichi	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:17:00 - [922] in for name fairness after the 15 October patch i can finally queue mi skill training for the fairness of that pay to play. after that date the will no excuse from part of ccp to get os one. the possible excuse pll going inactive and leave their skills in queue . like ccp don't like to lose money, wasting skill training time is also playing with or money ! i rely hop that their r taking this in consideration
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:19:00 - [923] Originally by: Liranan Originally by: Catherine Frasier That's pretty weak, even for a sycophant Right, like just calling me names is such a powerful argument. You are an idiotic fanboi. Shut up until you're ready to reveal who you actually are. I don't care whether you're in my corp, alliance, the GBC or whether you're a Goon, in MM, RZR or are a CCP employee. When you can stop being childish and hiding bhind some year old NPC character come back and post. Ahh, that's a much better argument! You don't like the character I post with! What an insightful way to address the content of the discussion. And, just FYI, having been war dec'ed in the past by mouth-breathing knuckle-walkers who use in-game force when their emorage surpasses their out-of-game capabilities and having no particular interest in subjecting my corp-mates to such sophomoric nonsense, I post with this alt. Mandatory posting in oog forums under the byline of an ig character is one of the dumbest things CCP has done, tbh.
Haldane Fisher Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:19:00 - [924] Originally by: Annaphera 1) CCP actually admitted it's partly a cash flow issue. I don't think they were prepared for this level of backlash They admitted that CCP is a business and all businesses are there to make profit. For public image, as all businesses have, they said that with the increased cashflow they can take better care of the game we all love so much.
Haldane Fisher Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:20:00 - [925] Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Liranan Originally by: Catherine Frasier That's pretty weak, even for a sycophant Right, like just calling me names is such a powerful argument. You are an idiotic fanboi. Shut up until you're ready to reveal who you actually are. I don't care whether you're in my corp, alliance, the GBC or whether you're a Goon, in MM, RZR or are a CCP employee. When you can stop being childish and hiding bhind some year old NPC character come back and post. Ahh, that's a much better argument! You don't like the character I post with! What an insightful way to address the content of the discussion. And, just FYI, having been war dec'ed in the past by mouth-breathing knuckle-walkers who use in-game force when their emorage surpasses their out-of-game capabilities and having no particular interest in subjecting my corp-mates to such sophomoric nonsense, I post with this alt. Mandatory posting in oog forums under the byline of an ig character is one of the dumbest things CCP has done, tbh. You don't like making people accountable for what they say in game or out?
ATARI BABY Lords Of Guile	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:20:00 - [926] Edited by: ATARI BABY on 14/10/2008 05:20:47 this size of LIE must live forever. LIE
Gig Malchura Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:21:00 - [927] Originally by: Annaphera 3) No matter what people seem to think, there IS a balance issue involved. Newer players don't have 45-day skills to train, and so must maintain a sub or go without training. Only the very skilled characters gain any real benefit, making the "perk" that "anyone can use" a bit lop-sided. So, someone working on Dreadnought 5 gets to not pay for two months, while newer players must pay. I know there are a few things that newer characters can get, but the benefits are slight, as they will wind up with no isk at the end if they take a similar period off. To underline it, I watched people in a former corp do exactly that, while I changed skills every few days at most. U forget, most of these older chars your refering to also had those days of short skills, and like most, subbed every time to get those done. Now once you get to that level, you will think to yourself, ghost training would have really been nice to have right now.
lceman Gallente Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:21:00 - [928] Edited by: lceman on 14/10/2008 05:24:13 lol thats the only thing i can say, how can you truly belive that the amount of close subscription is not the direct result of you changing the price and the gtc. Now this "ghost" training you socalled fancy called is nothing mere than people saying that you guys are pushing it to the limit, either listen og be sure that this avalanche is really gonna hit you guys hard. Second thing: power of 2, seriously when is the old fatefull gamers gonna reak any benefiets give people possiblety of grouping their accounts and get a discount pr account. my 2 cents. If what not is, what is ?.
Kate Mosh	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:21:00 - [929] I have 3 continuously active accounts. I don't ghost train but I believe getting rid of it is totally stupid. I'd list why I feel this way but every point leading to my position has been covered several times already. Dumb.
UnDeRBaLaNcE The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.14 05:22:00 - [930] Originally by: Divideby0 HAHAHAHHAAHHAHA... I really don't see the problem here. "So you no longer get something you are not paying for." I sense a whole lot of people are ****ed that they can no longer cheaply maintain their "capital alt" fleet. $15 is not that much money. Cable television costs at least 2-3x that in the US. In some places, that's three beers. Drink three less beers next month and you can keep your alt training. (hey, if you pay in advance, its cheaper.) I really doubt they will lose that many customers. Those customers will just stop paying so much to play. And if they DO leave, that just means more space for the rest of us. Can we have your stuff? Complete agree with your opinion



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