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Ed Gein
The Empire Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:05:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Ed Gein on 14/10/2008 05:05:43
Tonight I found myself fighting a Raven, Stabber, Stabber, Caracal, Sacriledge. I was in my Dominix of doom. I call it of doom, but really its of lameness. I took a big pile of lame, and smashed another pile of lame into it and this Dominix squirted out.
2 Large Armor Rep 2's
3 EANs
1 Damage Control
1 1600mm Plate
1 100mn MWD 2
1 Stasis Webifier 2
1 Warp Disrupter 2
2 Heavy Electrochem Injectors
6 Medium Neuts
This was my solution to the problem of PVP. I don't really like this ship. I prefer Minmatar. But anyone that has half a clue knows that with a proper setup and skills gallente bs's > minmatar bs's. Before all the Minmatar fanboi's castrate me, stop, that's not what this is about.
PVP rules to live by..
1) Plan on being out numbered, bring a durable tank.
2) Plan on being neutralized, bring a cap injector.
3) Plan on your opponent using their cap for something, bring a neutralizer. (or lets all fly drakes?)
4) Plan on some RNG jamming lameness, bring eccm backups
5) Plan on your opponent zooming around you at 5km/s 20ish km away from you, bring fast drones/heavy neutralizer
My Dominix was the crowning achievement in the lameness/counter lameness balance. Dual reps to tank the blob, duel injectors to out cap them, fast drones for the nano "friends" and plenty of neutralizers since they are better than guns. No room for ECCM but hey, 4 out of 5 ain't bad right?
So here I am sat, waiting to blobbed, in a battleship that I don't need gunnery, cap, or propulsion skills to be exceptionally effective (because lets face it, I won't be running anyone down in this slug).
Eventually a lone stabber enters local, and I patiently wait for him to find me in the belt (0.0). By now people are screaming warp to safe, cloak, WTF are you doing!!! Well sue me for wanting a fight. I started playing this game to pvp, and that's what I am going to do. The stabber eventually finds me, and MWD's up too me eagerly laughing to his gank squad on TS, I am sure. The scram comes, and local count raises by two. I am feeling pretty good, maybe it won't be a total blob. My medium drones make short work of the stabber just in time for the Sacri and Raven to arrive. I stupidly target the HAC first thinking there might be a chance it won't be nano'ed only to hear the faint soisoisoisoi of a roflcopter taking off somewhere in the distance. By the time I switch to the raven, I notice local has increased by 2 more and I sigh a little. In the comotion of targeting, switching primary, and watching local I forgot to turn off my cap injectors and wasted 2 charges on each, sigh. The Raven begins lighting me and the neut/tank war begins. I will win of course, because of the lameness of my setup. Raven begins to go down, and his friends join, another stabber and caracal, and I am start thinking I might pull it off. I will be able to tank the weak dps of the cruisers easily with dual reps, just need to get the raven down who is now trying to time injects with his shield booster.
Then it happens. "You are unable to target that blah blah blah". Sigh, ecm drones. And since jamming last 3 hours, the raven was back up to half shields by the time I got him retargeted. Okay, I think I can still win this, its going well, he is at 60% structure, this will be an epic win. JAMMED... god, again? honestly? Well I am getting low on cap, but if I can get through this cycle I might just..... out of cap charges, omg, if I wouldn't have wasted them earlier.... gosh, it would be nice if 45.1M skill points would help me out here with the whole cap thing, but it seems fair that one missed click should probably kill me.
In the end, I didn't survive the jam cycle, not sure how low the raven was, but I am sure it gave him a chuckle. I would say they went back to merrily ganking, but I know the raven had to go get more cap charges after one descent fight.
RNG's, cargos full of cap charges, nanos a must, blobs everywhere.
What have we become?
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What do you call the person that brings a gun to a knife fight?
The Winner. |
Tighty Whities
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:09:00 -
[2]
I got through the 5 rules to live by in pvp, but then BAM. Wall of text. Sorry man. 3/10 for a thread that had potential (maybe?).
Anyway, the Black ibis would have served you well in this scenario.
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Sopha Serpentia
Core Dynamics
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:11:00 -
[3]
Fat socially redundant wastes of space?
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Dakess Athan
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:31:00 -
[4]
actually thought it was a good read. but the things he speaks of are so very true pvp. can't wait for the nano nerf, what will the n00bs do when they can't just run @ a whim.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente
Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:50:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Dakess Athan
actually thought it was a good read. but the things he speaks of are so very true pvp. can't wait for the nano nerf, what will the n00bs do when they can't just run @ a whim.
Falcons + ECM drones (lots of them) = get out of jail free card. I know, I do it all the time.
Bellum Eternus
[Vid] L E G E N D A R Y COLLECTION
Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
killerdawg
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Posted - 2008.10.14 05:53:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sopha Serpentia
Fat socially redundant wastes of space?
Yes you are.
Good read.
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XSarah
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Posted - 2008.10.14 06:00:00 -
[7]
Good read. Thanks for un-walloftexting it.
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Haywoode Jablome
The Templars Knights
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Posted - 2008.10.14 06:00:00 -
[8]
Indeed a good read... thnx
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2008.10.14 06:38:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Ed Gein
...
What, you don't have a Falcon alt on a second account yet? It's a must for soloing!
(yes, LOL).
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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Soporo
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.10.14 06:42:00 -
[10]
Quote:
I stupidly target the HAC first thinking there might be a chance it won't be nano'ed only to hear the faint soisoisoisoi of a roflcopter taking off somewhere in the distance.
Great read, I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
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Algey
The Littlest Hobos
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2008.10.14 06:44:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Ed Gein
...
What, you don't have a Falcon alt on a second account yet? It's a must for soloing!
(yes, LOL).
Bah, Falcons are so overpowered I have one on my main account, and use a crappy alt for the battleship. Why put a main in something you just click F1-F8 and ignore?
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Flash Bombardo
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.10.14 07:25:00 -
[12]
Good job there, love the irony.
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MenanceWhite
Amarr
Red Light Navy
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Posted - 2008.10.14 08:12:00 -
[13]
kill. the. drones.
---
Originally by: Torfi
There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses
Originally by: Oveur
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2008.10.14 08:18:00 -
[14]
How can you "plan" on someone elses fitting? 
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
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CCP Applebabe
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Posted - 2008.10.14 08:29:00 -
[15]
Moved to "Ships & Modules" channel.
Applebabe
Community Representative
CCP Games, EVE Online
Email / Netfang
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Firkragg
Blue Labs
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.10.14 08:52:00 -
[16]
so basically you sat in a belt and allowed yourself to be engaged with no intel on hostiles or any plan beyond "shoot at stuffs"
Also plate on active tanking setups aint that great especially since you have 2 heavy boosters so can pretty much garenttee your not gonna cap out in a hurry.
You should have fitted a smartbomb btw if you were that bothered by ecm drones.
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Plave Okice
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.10.14 08:59:00 -
[17]
Well I enjoyed reading it anyway
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Crellion
Art of War
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.10.14 09:11:00 -
[18]
I cant get ober a scout/tackler set up stabber dieing to medium drones... I mean WTF? Fire him...
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Jin Entres
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
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Posted - 2008.10.14 09:44:00 -
[19]
Good read </parrot>
Being a drone boat domi does have some resistance to ECM so I'll give you 4+/5 on your lameness scale.  Btw did you have any rigs? If you didn't, nano pumps might've made the difference there. Also, was the raven using torps or cruises?
More stories too pls. 
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Murkon Salesgirl
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.10.14 09:48:00 -
[20]
Cap warfare, say hi to Ed.
Ed, say hi to cap warfare. |
Tammarr
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Posted - 2008.10.14 10:10:00 -
[21]
You also forgot the most important rig when docking cap warfare, its called egress port maximizer and it rules if you want cheap rigs for a neutdomi =)
and please drop the plate -_-
second: fit a med cap booster instead of second large and make it a heavy neut in highs so you can hit nanos that are further out.
A friend does dbl hvy neuts domi, unleashes the webdrones, hits mwd, hits neuts, tell drones to engage, overheat web. The trick is to make the nano belive you lack a heavy neut before punching them apparently :S
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Saraah Leeown
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Posted - 2008.10.14 10:16:00 -
[22]
You forgot the number 1 rule of eve pvp.
You didn't safespot and cloak
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Obyrith
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Posted - 2008.10.14 10:19:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Obyrith on 14/10/2008 10:19:25
Very nicely written and everything, but the only one exploiting stupidity in the mechanics is you. Large numbers of players are supposed to be able to beat a single player who lacks "gunnery, cap, or propulsion skills".
Speed is supposed to be effective, and will remain effective. Neuts are supposed to be effective. ECM is supposed to be effective. Your willingness to fit setups you yourself describe as lame is not supposed to give you a mechanical advantage over multiple opponents using a range of tactics.
6) Plan on playing a multi-player game. Bring friends.
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Gladiator Jonny
Omniscient Order
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.10.14 11:26:00 -
[24]
Ops name is awsome 
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Kazang
Gallente
Arbitrary Freedom
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Posted - 2008.10.14 12:04:00 -
[25]
Nice post all quite true to an extent but i dont see how you equate cap warfare to lameness. Ecm and blobs yeah i can see your angle, but cap warfare is not lame. This game has 3 types of fighting, damage based high dps ship setups, electronic warfare that attempts to control what the enemy can do and cap warfare that attempts to hamper the ability to rep and/or dps etc.
If you mark off ecm and cap warfare as lame, your only left with dps. Which would be lame and boring, a universe entirely filled with gank megas and torp ravens, woohoo so much for tactical variety.
Quote:
gosh, it would be nice if 45.1M skill points would help me out here with the whole cap thing, but it seems fair that one missed click should probably kill me.
And this made me lol, the fact that you have been playing longer than someone else should not be the only decider of the fight. Real skill as in player skill, the user, the guy/girl behind the keyboard should and does, at least to some extent, have an impact on how a fight will go. Not trying to insult you or anything but if you had been a more skilled player and not ****ed up with your clicking then you may have won the fight. This is a computer game after all and your manual dexterity does matter.
I hate RNG stuff aswell, it is the plague of every mmo. But in reality there is no really any other way around it, unless you add in a player skill element such as having to manually aim(for example) you ecm/guns/whatever, but obviously this wouldn't work because of the limitations of the internet.
Quote:
What have we become?
Its always been this way you were just enjoying yourself to much to notice but the after 45mil of sp its getting old 
I know how you feel but think of it this way, so what if nanos/ecm/missles/neuts/passivetanks (insert your whine of preference) are overpowered? Just do whatever you find fun, be it playing the fotm, or being the underdog or being the annoying git with the crowd control. It all comes around in the end, that is the beauty of RNG you wil win eventually, even if you do suck balls.
If not you can always go play wow 
Kazang
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TheAdj
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.10.14 14:47:00 -
[26]
Just one cap injector, ECCM is well worth it. Also swap a neut for a named smartbomb, it'll clear drones.
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TimMc
Gallente
The Motley Crew
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Posted - 2008.10.14 14:56:00 -
[27]
Originally by: TheAdj
Just one cap injector, ECCM is well worth it. Also swap a neut for a named smartbomb, it'll clear drones.
This. And I would have fitted at least 1 heavy neut. Nano***s hate them.
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Poast Warrior
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.10.14 15:07:00 -
[28]
That quote just has me in tears. Good Read.
Originally by: Ed Gein
I stupidly target the HAC first thinking there might be a chance it won't be nano'ed only to hear the faint soisoisoisoi of a roflcopter taking off somewhere in the distance.[/quote |
Zero Threat
Dirty Rotten Scoundrels
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Posted - 2008.10.14 15:13:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Tammarr
You also forgot the most important rig when docking cap warfare, its called egress port maximizer and it rules if you want cheap rigs for a neutdomi =)
and please drop the plate -_-
second: fit a med cap booster instead of second large and make it a heavy neut in highs so you can hit nanos that are further out.
A friend does dbl hvy neuts domi, unleashes the webdrones, hits mwd, hits neuts, tell drones to engage, overheat web. The trick is to make the nano belive you lack a heavy neut before punching them apparently :S
yeah they cost around 3-4 mil near Alentene and Alenia in Verge Vendor.
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Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.10.14 15:18:00 -
[30]
Originally by: CCP Applebabe
Moved to "Ships & Modules" channel.
a) wtf does this have to do with ships and modules
b) please start disabling your blue bars. it gives all of us false hope to see a dev post only to find out "oh wait no, it's just applebabe moving shit around"
@ OP: no heavy neut?
__________________________________
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
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Ed Gein
The Empire Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.14 16:48:00 -
[31]
Glad people like the story, thought I would answer a few questions.
Starters, I am in the middle of Syndicate atm and I am too lazy to get stuff from empire, and right now there are zero rigs on the market in syndicate in my area.
As for large neuts, yeah it would be nice, and I would rather have them, but it would sacrifice tanking. And for them to be effective at stopping nano ships, you really need two because any descent self respecting nano pilot will see their cap cut in half (one large neut) they will quickly make for the nearest exit.
As for smartbomb(s). Yeah, they have their place, but they can be a little hairy to use when your primary damage is drones as well. It goes back to setup and market availability as well. My current setup is cheap and fits perfectly.
And the armor plate, yeah ideally I should be able to tank most damage with dual reps, but an additional 5k armor creates a nice extra, 0 cap buffer, and I do have slaves (wasn't on that clone for this fight) which makes it work even better.
Lastly, ECCM, yeah this again would be nice, but I could still get unlucky and get jammed making it a liability where the second injector can never be thwarted unless I run out of cap charges. Also, one ECCM isn't going to stop an ECM ship from jamming me reliably well, it would basically just be there to hinder ECM drones.
I don't mind the RNG on jamming that much, but I just think the duration of jams are too long, especially on larger ships which have a slow relock time. Also, the single multispec lameness was nerfed because of how petty it was and how it could change the dynamic of the fight just on pure luck, but for some reason its okay to have a very similiar mechanic on ecm drones.
I know this is an MMO, and I could bring friends, but at the same time, does that mean no one should even attempt to solo PVP anymore? I wouldn't even mind cruising around in a frig or cepter, but with the HP boost to ships year(s) ago, you can't even hope to kill an undergeared t1 cruiser unless the pilot is a moron. Perhaps the nerf to webs that is being thrown around will help frig combat some in the future.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you call the person that brings a gun to a knife fight?
The Winner. |
s1n5
Sad Panda Inc.
Veni Vidi Vici
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Posted - 2008.10.14 17:05:00 -
[32]
I am the stabber in the op.
You forgot you had a rapier with you btw.
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Vathar
The Wings of Maak
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Posted - 2008.10.14 17:37:00 -
[33]
Wow, what surprised me the most in this story is that you got ambushed in 0.0 by a gang consisting of 3 tech1 cruisers + other stuff.
I left 0.0 a while a ago to pledge my guns to the minmatar cause, but over the few years that I spent there, I think I could count the number of T1 sub-BC shit I've seen with my fingers and toes.
Has 0.0 changed that much?
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SigmaPi
Sad Panda Inc.
Veni Vidi Vici
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Posted - 2008.10.14 18:24:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Vathar
Wow, what surprised me the most in this story is that you got ambushed in 0.0 by a gang consisting of 3 tech1 cruisers + other stuff.
I left 0.0 a while a ago to pledge my guns to the minmatar cause, but over the few years that I spent there, I think I could count the number of T1 sub-BC shit I've seen with my fingers and toes.
Has 0.0 changed that much?
nope, we just suck that much - sorry to disapoint.
I want to offer a GF to the op, it was quite fun.
SigmaPi
CEO, Sad Panda Inc.
V3 Alliance
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Gorefacer
Caldari
Resurrection
Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.10.14 21:22:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Ed Gain
PVP rules to live by..
1) Plan on being out numbered, bring a durable tank.
2) Plan on being neutralized, bring a cap injector.
3) Plan on your opponent using their cap for something, bring a neutralizer. (or lets all fly drakes?)
4) Plan on some RNG jamming lameness, bring eccm backups
5) Plan on your opponent zooming around you at 5km/s 20ish km away from you, bring fast drones/heavy neutralizer
The PVP rules I usually live by..
1) Fit maximum gank first then best buffer tank you can fit after that
2) Bring Falcons and Rapiers with you
"You can't reason someone out of a belief they haven't reasoned themselves into" - Prometheus |
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