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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:05:00 -
[1]
In the nearly four years I've played this game, I have *never* made a post specifically addressing the development team and asking for a direct response. Until now.
The subject is blaster ships, in all forms. Clearly, I think that the upcoming changes will render them far less effective than they are currently on TQ (if not completely impotent), and from the volume of posts and large effort to gather supporting data by other players across the many sub-forums a large number of other players feel the same way.
I thought the whole purpose of SISI was to be able to test play balance before it goes live to TQ? You ask for feedback, we give it to you (30+ pages of it in a single thread even) and you seemingly ignore it?
I don't want to see changes that will ruin blaster ships go live on TQ, and then have to wait 6-12 months (best case) for it to be fixed.
Nano-ships were ruining combat and needed to be changed. There is literally *nothing* wrong with the current balance of blaster ships on TQ. Nobody was complaining about them. Everything is fine. If this is the case, then why do you think it is acceptable to change this balance and render an entire fighting style completely useless?
Some things I'd like to know:
1. How do you envision blaster ships being used in combat after the patch?
2. How do you suggest we blaster ship pilots fit our ships to be successful in solo and small gang PVP?
3. Explain why most other ships nearly equal the peak DPS of blaster ships while having four to five times the effective range?
4. What blaster ships were so horribly fast that they needed to be slowed down by over 40%?
5. Why break the flexiblity and functionality of ships like the Hyperion in order to compensate for problems that don't even need to exist in the first place?
30+ pages ago in my thread in the Game Design forum I predicted that the dev team would simply say 'they're not broke' and walk away from it. I'm very disappointed to see that I'm right.
Frankly I think I'm wasting my time making this post and probably any other post from here on out attempting to voice my concern about these and other changes to the game that I am so passionate about. I'll be very surprised if I get any sort of official response at all other than a thread lock.
I'm looking forward to being proved wrong.
Thanks in advance.
Bellum Eternus
Inveniam viam aut faciam.
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Khaeldon
Golden Clover Astrogeologists
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:08:00 -
[2]
Maybe we could add a couple KM's to the range?
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Smog890
Minmatar Knights Of the Black Sun
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:11:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Smog890 on 24/10/2008 06:12:17 Edited by: Smog890 on 24/10/2008 06:11:37 It will work, have faith in developers (well QA). As I work in QA if it dosent work right and I do not like it, I ***** until the devs fix. and as it looks CCP has good QA havent found any crazy bugs yet in EVE, each patch and update and new tuning stuff they have done has not once broke the game and made it crap or given the other faction the advantage. They will put the new stuff through the test cycle and tune and fix as they go so have faith it will be just fine
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:21:00 -
[4]
Quote: Maybe we could add a couple KM's to the range?
If I wanted that, I'd fly my Abaddon.
Quote: It will work, have faith in developers (well QA). As I work in QA if it dosent work right and I do not like it, I ***** until the devs fix.Twisted Evil and as it looks CCP has good QA havent found any crazy bugs yet in EVE, each patch and update and new tuning stuff they have done has not once broke the game and made it crap or given the other faction the advantage. They will put the new stuff through the test cycle and tune and fix as they go so have faith it will be just fine Wink
Um, what? What you just said makes absolutely zero sense.
This isn't a discussion about bugs. I don't care who's in QA, QA has nothing to do with game design, only fixing what is broken about the original design intent. No, I clearly don't have any faith in CCP's dev team to protect the viability of blaster ships post patch. No, I don't want to have to wait until after the changes hit TQ for them to understand something is wrong. |
Ialion Trajun
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:23:00 -
[5]
Blaster boat pilots are getting their just deserts and doesn't it taste sweet? yum yum tears. All that whining about nanos because they did not suit your approach to pvp (hit approach activate scram and web press F1-F8 activate tank and someone die)
As always with CCP be careful what you ask for, you all whined hard enough for nanos to be nerfed and you got what you wanted.
Moar Gheylantte tears kbyebyethx. |
NoLSolid
Gallente Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:27:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Ialion Trajun Blaster boat pilots are getting their just deserts and doesn't it taste sweet? yum yum tears. All that whining about nanos because they did not suit your approach to pvp (hit approach activate scram and web press F1-F8 activate tank and someone die)
As always with CCP be careful what you ask for, you all whined hard enough for nanos to be nerfed and you got what you wanted.
Moar Gheylantte tears kbyebyethx.
Yeah...your an idiot. ---
You and I are mortal but Rock and Roll will NEVER die!
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Ialion Trajun
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:33:00 -
[7]
Originally by: NoLSolid
Originally by: Ialion Trajun Blaster boat pilots are getting their just deserts and doesn't it taste sweet? yum yum tears. All that whining about nanos because they did not suit your approach to pvp (hit approach activate scram and web press F1-F8 activate tank and someone die)
As always with CCP be careful what you ask for, you all whined hard enough for nanos to be nerfed and you got what you wanted.
Moar Gheylantte tears kbyebyethx.
Yeah...your an idiot.
C
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CEO Character
Morphed Dynamics
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:33:00 -
[8]
I approve. - - -
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zombeee
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:34:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Ialion Trajun Blaster boat pilots are getting their just deserts and doesn't it taste sweet? yum yum tears. All that whining about nanos because they did not suit your approach to pvp (hit approach activate scram and web press F1-F8 activate tank and someone die)
As always with CCP be careful what you ask for, you all whined hard enough for nanos to be nerfed and you got what you wanted.
Moar Gheylantte tears kbyebyethx.
1/10 you're trying too much
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:47:00 -
[10]
:( |
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Mezikk
Earned In Blood
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Posted - 2008.10.24 06:58:00 -
[11]
Hope I don't have to respec |
Erim Kaluk
Minmatar Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2008.10.24 07:21:00 -
[12]
It sounds like it's going full circle again.
Once upon a time snipers ruled, then blaster boats ruled, then they were replaced by sniping, then blaster boats were king again. Different patches introduce different gameplay. It's like they introduce a new game every so often.
I have to say though that close range fighting is alot more fun than long range.
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Tzar'rim
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Posted - 2008.10.24 07:39:00 -
[13]
1) every plays class x since x is very good 2) game is changed to where y is now FOTM 3) people train to y and thus will keep playing longer 4) ... 5) profit!
Happens in all MMO's, balance makes for bored people while changing FOTM now and then keeps them playing. I wish there were a patch where minnie BS would become GOOD/godly but hey I'll just try to work with the tools I'm given/chose for.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 07:48:00 -
[14]
Looks like all the attention that blasters should be getting are going towards the Caldari and their missiles.
T2 high damage ammo- Torps, heavy missiles etc., are all getting a very large damage increase over the current *FACTION* ammo. Not T1, the faction ammo. You know, the higher damage ammo that made T2 ammo obsolete?
Guess what the boost is? Almost 11%! When I did the math it ran out to something around 10.58% or something, but it was closer to 11% than 10%.
Any bets on whether or not T2 laser/hybrid/projectile high damage close range ammo is going to get buffed?
I think that CCP will leave all the T2 gun ammo right where it is, because missile launchers weren't overpowered enough as it is, so they have to buff the crap out of them some more. Oh well, at least my Drake will be hitting those BS for even more damage. GG CCP. |
Krystal Demishy
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Posted - 2008.10.24 08:06:00 -
[15]
I agree with every single word. I don't train for the FOTM, i'm specialized in gallente and blasters, but other races ships are way more effective: they got almost the same damage but a huge range too compared to blasters, and the ships bonuses too. Bad and sad.
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Strill
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Posted - 2008.10.24 08:07:00 -
[16]
So it looks like torp ships are gonna out-damage blaster ships flat-out then.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 08:17:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Strill So it looks like torp ships are gonna out-damage blaster ships flat-out then.
Oh sure, by a mile. I mean, you may have to use a TP in order to get the most out of it, but that's an easy accommodation, particularly for the Golem, which gets a bonus. The *really* cool thing is that TPs work great for helping the missile ships hit smaller targets. Webs are just terrible at helping large guns hit anything.
Expect to see rage torps hitting any MWDing BS for full damage (by a mile), and expect TPs to take care of the rest. |
Solomon XI
Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2008.10.24 08:45:00 -
[18]
@ Bellum Eternus:
You have a way with words that I do not. Everything you said, and asked, I agree with. When the Dev's started talking about Blasters during the live-dev-blog, I literally choked on my drink. They're *fine*. They might even be *better*. I just don't understand.
I have been following the 30+ page Blaster topic in the game-development forum and have been doing my own testing and I am very sad. The changes, in their present form on SiSi, completely ruin Blasters. I'm not just going with the 'flow' so to speak ... I can say this because I have personally tested them extensively.
My faith in CCP and QA are at an all time low. I am beginning to feel that they don't listen to their player-base, and don't really care about anything we have to say. I am considering not renewing my subscription at the end of the billing cycle. I'll probably stick around until patch day to see if anything is done ... but if an entire year of skill-training goes out the window ... I'm gone.
Sure ... I can cross-train into Amarr ... but that's Cruiser V for Amarr + Tech-II weapons for Amarr. That's a few months of training before I could be in a new command ship. You know ... I just don't understand why CCP are completely ignoring blasters. It's idiotic at best.
*** ~Solo Hoist The Colors. (CEO) Pirate Coalition (Yar?)
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eliminator2
Gallente Heretic Army Heretic Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.24 08:48:00 -
[19]
im speced in blaster ships as well iv trained all my skills for them and to hear there well fail ships after the patch just makes me wanna leave i cba to train for another race and spec it which takes 1-2 years and then they will probably be nerfed CCP are seeming more and more like they don't have a clue about the gameplay of thier game most people wanted a "nano" nerf not nerf everything that moves and nerf abit more just nano which CCP have no idea about they have been given player idea's which have been said to be way WAY WAY better than CCP's yet they ignore that 1 person came up with a batter idea than there whole team. i will doubt CCP will post in here as they are affraid of what we are saying is right and there not man enough to answer to it and face it and change it CCP you are loosing my interest indeed and i just started the game again because i had a long skill going that finnished but o wait i woun't have that any more either
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Solomon XI
Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:01:00 -
[20]
Originally by: eliminator2 im speced in blaster ships as well iv trained all my skills for them and to hear there well fail ships after the patch just makes me wanna leave i cba to train for another race and spec it which takes 1-2 years and then they will probably be nerfed CCP are seeming more and more like they don't have a clue about the gameplay of thier game most people wanted a "nano" nerf not nerf everything that moves and nerf abit more just nano which CCP have no idea about they have been given player idea's which have been said to be way WAY WAY better than CCP's yet they ignore that 1 person came up with a batter idea than there whole team. i will doubt CCP will post in here as they are affraid of what we are saying is right and there not man enough to answer to it and face it and change it CCP you are loosing my interest indeed and i just started the game again because i had a long skill going that finnished but o wait i woun't have that any more either
My eyes ... they bleed. |
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:31:00 -
[21]
30 pages? Nano-nerf thread had over 100, and look where we're at. ;) |
eliminator2
Gallente Heretic Army Heretic Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:43:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Solomon XI
Originally by: eliminator2 im speced in blaster ships as well iv trained all my skills for them and to hear there well fail ships after the patch just makes me wanna leave i cba to train for another race and spec it which takes 1-2 years and then they will probably be nerfed CCP are seeming more and more like they don't have a clue about the gameplay of thier game most people wanted a "nano" nerf not nerf everything that moves and nerf abit more just nano which CCP have no idea about they have been given player idea's which have been said to be way WAY WAY better than CCP's yet they ignore that 1 person came up with a batter idea than there whole team. i will doubt CCP will post in here as they are affraid of what we are saying is right and there not man enough to answer to it and face it and change it CCP you are loosing my interest indeed and i just started the game again because i had a long skill going that finnished but o wait i woun't have that any more either
My eyes ... they bleed.
lol i no ima not good with writing alot :p
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:48:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Tobias Sjodin 30 pages? Nano-nerf thread had over 100, and look where we're at. ;)
I can knock out another 70 pages before the patch goes live.. *easy*.
Bellum Eternus
Inveniam viam aut faciam.
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:53:00 -
[24]
Assembly hall topic
This topic is still in time for discussion before the CSM term is over, so please contribute and I'll see what I can get done. ---
Thanks for all that supported me. Let me know if there's anything I can do for you.
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eliminator2
Gallente Heretic Army Heretic Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.24 09:56:00 -
[25]
nice to see CSM taking interest but CCP moved this to ship and modules its DISCUSSION NOT ****IN SHIPS AND MODULES!!!!
Zulupark If people want to talk about speed changes, test them at Singularity, voice your opinions on forums and articulate them well.
he said that we have been doing it and we have been ignored all he has said in the dev blog is aload of bull**** |
Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.10.24 10:00:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Bellum Eternus on 24/10/2008 10:04:55
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah Assembly hall topic
This topic is still in time for discussion before the CSM term is over, so please contribute and I'll see what I can get done.
Much appreciated.
Edit: link points to locked thread? |
eliminator2
Gallente Heretic Army Heretic Nation
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Posted - 2008.10.24 10:05:00 -
[27]
thank you CCP for moving it back here
btw bellum whats ur tracking on a mega cause my navy megathron has 0.0372109375 rad/sec for trackingspeed which doesnt hit nothin :p |
Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2008.10.24 10:20:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Ialion Trajun Blaster boat pilots are getting their just deserts and doesn't it taste sweet? yum yum tears. All that whining about nanos because they did not suit your approach to pvp (hit approach activate scram and web press F1-F8 activate tank and someone die)
As always with CCP be careful what you ask for, you all whined hard enough for nanos to be nerfed and you got what you wanted.
Moar Gheylantte tears kbyebyethx.
yes, blasterships are indeed the FOTM...
...if you're still living in 2005 that is. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Ayd
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Posted - 2008.10.24 10:23:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Ayd on 24/10/2008 10:24:06 i just have to comment, i think it is funny everyone calls this a nano-nerf... when in reality they are changing the aspect of speed and movement in the game completely, who cares if you think your blasters can't hit anymore? no one can move that fast anyhow. you just go from being solo killing in your "l33t" blasterthron to fleet killing with it. also i don't care what anyone says blasterthrons were the most OP thing in this game, no matter what you were you had three choices when goin 1v1 against a blasterthron; bring your own, run away, or bring more people... blasterthrons are the ship of choice, i think that anyone who claims (like someone in the other post about blasters getting nerfed) that a raven out DPS's them at longer range is either A: an idiot or B: lying. if it was true we would see more torp fitted ravens. i know i for one in a dual repping tempest with only 5mil SP can tank a torp raven with 2-3 dmg mods fitted, but if i tried that against a mega i would die in an instant, ravens just don't pump out 1k+ DPS or if they do the explosion radius is so big not all the dmg goes on the target because of the way missile mechanics are.
I am minmatar i nano a lot of things and you don't see anyone who lives and has devoted a ton of time and money into nanoing ships that do a fraction of your blaster DPS(they choose thier fights and you people with your blasters can't hit them that is why they are complained about, and i bet everyone complaining about blasters being nerfed are the ones who whined for nano nerf) are taking it in stride because they are adaptable enough to learn new things, because nanoing i guess just takes a smarter individual who can multitask and maintain stable cap even with the amount of power that a MWD sucks up and still be combat capable.
Just take this one to the nuts like everyone who is getting nerfed(looks at rapiers who are gonna be completely useless) and move to something that is getting a boost... like gallente recons, which are gonna be the tackler of choice in BS gangs.... being able to turn off MWD's and all that jazz from a much longer range.
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2008.10.24 10:24:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Grimpak on 24/10/2008 10:24:39
Originally by: Ayd i just have to comment, i think it is funny everyone calls this a nano-nerf... when in reality they are changing the aspect of speed and movement in the game completely, who cares if you think your blasters can't hit anymore? no one can move that fast anyhow. you just go from being solo killing in your "l33t" blasterthron to fleet killing with it. also i don't care what anyone says blasterthrons were the most OP thing in this game, no matter what you were you had three choices when goin 1v1 against a blasterthron; bring your own, run away, or bring more people... blasterthrons are the ship of choice, i think that anyone who claims (like someone in the other post about blasters getting nerfed) that a raven out DPS's them at longer range is either A: an idiot or B: lying. if it was true we would see more torp fitted ravens. i know i for one in a dual repping tempest with only 5mil SP can tank a torp raven with 2-3 dmg mods fitted, but if i tried that against a mega i would die in an instant, ravens just don't pump out 1k+ DPS or if they do the explosion radius is so big not all the dmg goes on the target because of the way missile mechanics are. i am minmatar i nano a lot of things and you don't see anyone who lives and has devoted a ton of time and money into nanoing ships that do a fraction of your blaster DPS(they choose thier fights and you people with your blasters can't hit them that is why they are complained about, and i bet everyone complaining about blasters being nerfed are the ones who whined for nano nerf) are taking it in stride because they are adaptable enough to learn new things, because nanoing i guess just takes a smarter individual who can multitask and maintain stable cap even with the amount of power that a MWD sucks up and still be combat capable. just take this one to the nuts like everyone who is getting nerfed(looks at rapiers who are gonna be completely useless) and move to something that is getting a boost... like gallente recons, which are gonna be the tackler of choice in BS gangs.... being able to turn off MWD's and all that jazz from a much longer range.
sorry, couldn't read the text wall
paragraphs please
edit: much better, thanks ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
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