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GUI - It needs some serious work for Shiva!

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spurious signal	Posted - 2004.07.07 12:59:00 - [61] People saying "40-60fps is enough" have, I think, entirely missed the point of JC's post... Sure, that's a nice framerate but the point is why does the interface require such a huge chunk of processing power? It's poor design - it looks great yeah but when you're pvping a snazzy-looking interface is pretty far down the list of desirable features in EVE whereas a high framerate is way up there at the top. How about a "lite" version of the interface? One without the nice lighting effects, transparency etc. A plain "advanced/simple" checkbox in options to switch between the two would be ideal. Or, like Josh said, just recode the interface so it doesn't end up using 30-50% of the processor time.
spurious signal	Posted - 2004.07.07 12:59:00 - [62] People saying "40-60fps is enough" have, I think, entirely missed the point of JC's post... Sure, that's a nice framerate but the point is why does the interface require such a huge chunk of processing power? It's poor design - it looks great yeah but when you're pvping a snazzy-looking interface is pretty far down the list of desirable features in EVE whereas a high framerate is way up there at the top. How about a "lite" version of the interface? One without the nice lighting effects, transparency etc. A plain "advanced/simple" checkbox in options to switch between the two would be ideal. Or, like Josh said, just recode the interface so it doesn't end up using 30-50% of the processor time.
Hardin	Posted - 2004.07.07 13:08:00 - [63] Had a battle in Teonosude system (about 4 jumps from Pator) last night... 10 ships on one side - 6 on the other... system had around another 10 neutrals... Battle started fine, drones were unleashed everything running smooth but gradually things began to slow - despite people losing ships or fleeing... At the end nearly everyone left at the gate - 7/8 ships crashed simultaneously. My EVE simply froze up. In order to shut it I had to do Ctrl/Alt/Del and even that was moving stupidly slowly. My whole computer had reached crawl speed. When EVE final shut down suddenly the speed returned to the computer. Was able to log back in to discover everyone else had gone down too... Luckily it had happened near the end of the fight rather than at the start...
Hardin	Posted - 2004.07.07 13:08:00 - [64] Had a battle in Teonosude system (about 4 jumps from Pator) last night... 10 ships on one side - 6 on the other... system had around another 10 neutrals... Battle started fine, drones were unleashed everything running smooth but gradually things began to slow - despite people losing ships or fleeing... At the end nearly everyone left at the gate - 7/8 ships crashed simultaneously. My EVE simply froze up. In order to shut it I had to do Ctrl/Alt/Del and even that was moving stupidly slowly. My whole computer had reached crawl speed. When EVE final shut down suddenly the speed returned to the computer. Was able to log back in to discover everyone else had gone down too... Luckily it had happened near the end of the fight rather than at the start...
Arud	Posted - 2004.07.07 13:27:00 - [65] Originally by: Hardin Had a battle in Teonosude system (about 4 jumps from Pator) last night... 10 ships on one side - 6 on the other... system had around another 10 neutrals... Battle started fine, drones were unleashed everything running smooth but gradually things began to slow - despite people losing ships or fleeing... At the end nearly everyone left at the gate - 7/8 ships crashed simultaneously. My EVE simply froze up. In order to shut it I had to do Ctrl/Alt/Del and even that was moving stupidly slowly. My whole computer had reached crawl speed. When EVE final shut down suddenly the speed returned to the computer. Was able to log back in to discover everyone else had gone down too... Luckily it had happened near the end of the fight rather than at the start... same with when you are taking over a station, you have to warp out and in again every once in a while because everything started to slow down
Arud	Posted - 2004.07.07 13:27:00 - [66] Originally by: Hardin Had a battle in Teonosude system (about 4 jumps from Pator) last night... 10 ships on one side - 6 on the other... system had around another 10 neutrals... Battle started fine, drones were unleashed everything running smooth but gradually things began to slow - despite people losing ships or fleeing... At the end nearly everyone left at the gate - 7/8 ships crashed simultaneously. My EVE simply froze up. In order to shut it I had to do Ctrl/Alt/Del and even that was moving stupidly slowly. My whole computer had reached crawl speed. When EVE final shut down suddenly the speed returned to the computer. Was able to log back in to discover everyone else had gone down too... Luckily it had happened near the end of the fight rather than at the start... same with when you are taking over a station, you have to warp out and in again every once in a while because everything started to slow down
Earthan	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:00:00 - [67] Agreed Joshua , we need badly options wich would switch off all this pretty effects of GUI and switch one something basic utilizing as low resources as possible. Its critical for bigger battles. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Earthan	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:00:00 - [68] Agreed Joshua , we need badly options wich would switch off all this pretty effects of GUI and switch one something basic utilizing as low resources as possible. Its critical for bigger battles. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
DeathBunny	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:09:00 - [69] I just did some testing on this the other day, having 0-100% transparency on the GUI doesn't do diddly squat. Opening more windows drops frame rate though and does it pretty quick most of the time. These are unstacked windows. Tabbed windows makes no noticble difference. Taken instation with games FPS counter 62fps with 1 window 50fps with 2 windows 43fps with 3 windows 35fps with 4 windows Taken outside station with games FPS counter 40fps with 1 window 36fps with 2 windows 33fps with 3 windows 31fps with 4 windows Now something seems a bit odd about this don't you think? You get steaper drops instation with less information on screen then you would in space. Odd huh. Memory usage was right around 130-200megs during the tests which was on Saturday when I played with it. Overclocking my video card helped a bit with the issue :). But people are correct 20fps is perfectly fine to run the game, I get sometimes around 10-15fps in belts on my higher end system which. 3.3ghz P4 (its overclocked), 1 gig of ram (dual channel), 9800pro 128mb (overclocked to XT speeds). Harddrive has no factor on speed for game tried that out between a 10k, 7.2k and a 5.4k harddrives. *Fear The Bunny*
DeathBunny	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:09:00 - [70] I just did some testing on this the other day, having 0-100% transparency on the GUI doesn't do diddly squat. Opening more windows drops frame rate though and does it pretty quick most of the time. These are unstacked windows. Tabbed windows makes no noticble difference. Taken instation with games FPS counter 62fps with 1 window 50fps with 2 windows 43fps with 3 windows 35fps with 4 windows Taken outside station with games FPS counter 40fps with 1 window 36fps with 2 windows 33fps with 3 windows 31fps with 4 windows Now something seems a bit odd about this don't you think? You get steaper drops instation with less information on screen then you would in space. Odd huh. Memory usage was right around 130-200megs during the tests which was on Saturday when I played with it. Overclocking my video card helped a bit with the issue :). But people are correct 20fps is perfectly fine to run the game, I get sometimes around 10-15fps in belts on my higher end system which. 3.3ghz P4 (its overclocked), 1 gig of ram (dual channel), 9800pro 128mb (overclocked to XT speeds). Harddrive has no factor on speed for game tried that out between a 10k, 7.2k and a 5.4k harddrives. *Fear The Bunny*
Cortex Reaver	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:18:00 - [71] Edited by: Cortex Reaver on 07/07/2004 14:21:03 Originally by: OrigimYes, but during big battles, the GUI isn't going to take any less resources.. therefore, instead of a nice 15 FPS during a fleet battle, you're going to have an unplayable 2-5 FPS.[/quote The choppiness when there's a lot of ships in one area has ZERO to do with the efficiency of the GUI or the graphics engine. It's the network and database load of relaying what X number of ships are doing to X number of game clients and keeping it all in jive with the database. If you wanna fix that, run a fiber pair from your house to where the server is co-located in London and convince CCP to plug your sorry a$$ in and have everyone you wanna have a fleet battle with do the same. Oh, and you're all gonna need your own exclusive server cluster. Maybe you'd be happier with Freelancer. -CR /* Cortex Reaver crtxreavr at trioptimum dot com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin, 1759 */
Cortex Reaver	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:18:00 - [72] Edited by: Cortex Reaver on 07/07/2004 14:21:03 Originally by: OrigimYes, but during big battles, the GUI isn't going to take any less resources.. therefore, instead of a nice 15 FPS during a fleet battle, you're going to have an unplayable 2-5 FPS.[/quote The choppiness when there's a lot of ships in one area has ZERO to do with the efficiency of the GUI or the graphics engine. It's the network and database load of relaying what X number of ships are doing to X number of game clients and keeping it all in jive with the database. If you wanna fix that, run a fiber pair from your house to where the server is co-located in London and convince CCP to plug your sorry a$$ in and have everyone you wanna have a fleet battle with do the same. Oh, and you're all gonna need your own exclusive server cluster. Maybe you'd be happier with Freelancer. -CR /* Cortex Reaver crtxreavr at trioptimum dot com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin, 1759 */
Earthan	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:28:00 - [73] Edited by: Earthan on 07/07/2004 14:30:32 Originally by: Cortex Reaver Edited by: Cortex Reaver on 07/07/2004 14:21:03 Originally by: OrigimYes, but during big battles, the GUI isn't going to take any less resources.. therefore, instead of a nice 15 FPS during a fleet battle, you're going to have an unplayable 2-5 FPS.[/quote The choppiness when there's a lot of ships in one area has ZERO to do with the efficiency of the GUI or the graphics engine. It's the network and database load of relaying what X number of ships are doing to X number of game clients and keeping it all in jive with the database. If you wanna fix that, run a fiber pair from your house to where the server is co-located in London and convince CCP to plug your sorry a$$ in and have everyone you wanna have a fleet battle with do the same. Oh, and you're all gonna need your own exclusive server cluster. Maybe you'd be happier with Freelancer. -CR not true ( at least in big part) and go back to your kindergarten with your flames. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Earthan	Posted - 2004.07.07 14:28:00 - [74] Edited by: Earthan on 07/07/2004 14:30:32 Originally by: Cortex Reaver Edited by: Cortex Reaver on 07/07/2004 14:21:03 Originally by: OrigimYes, but during big battles, the GUI isn't going to take any less resources.. therefore, instead of a nice 15 FPS during a fleet battle, you're going to have an unplayable 2-5 FPS.[/quote The choppiness when there's a lot of ships in one area has ZERO to do with the efficiency of the GUI or the graphics engine. It's the network and database load of relaying what X number of ships are doing to X number of game clients and keeping it all in jive with the database. If you wanna fix that, run a fiber pair from your house to where the server is co-located in London and convince CCP to plug your sorry a$$ in and have everyone you wanna have a fleet battle with do the same. Oh, and you're all gonna need your own exclusive server cluster. Maybe you'd be happier with Freelancer. -CR not true ( at least in big part) and go back to your kindergarten with your flames. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Wandarah	Posted - 2004.07.08 02:49:00 - [75] Eves requirements seem pretty low to me eh. Including that of the GUI...Certainly less than most other games I play. Infact, it's in the bottom 3, in terms of resource use. Could it be optimised? Probably. But it's already pretty good. Suspect people have ludicrous expectations. NZEA 4 Lyfe
Wandarah	Posted - 2004.07.08 02:49:00 - [76] Eves requirements seem pretty low to me eh. Including that of the GUI...Certainly less than most other games I play. Infact, it's in the bottom 3, in terms of resource use. Could it be optimised? Probably. But it's already pretty good. Suspect people have ludicrous expectations. NZEA 4 Lyfe
Kayosoni	Posted - 2004.07.08 03:56:00 - [77] Ok for those of you who are stupid idiot carebears, if you get 40 fps in normal space, you will get 5 or less fps in a normal fleet battle, 1 or 1 frame per minute in a larger fleet battle. Compare: http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/EveFSFPS.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Kills/Jovin_Ketils/1.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/C9N-CC/Mar-21-2004/2.jpg With Fraps: http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/U-QVWD/Jun-28-2004/1.jpg ----------------------------------- Currently Playing Lineage 2 - Erica Server
Kayosoni	Posted - 2004.07.08 03:56:00 - [78] Ok for those of you who are stupid idiot carebears, if you get 40 fps in normal space, you will get 5 or less fps in a normal fleet battle, 1 or 1 frame per minute in a larger fleet battle. Compare: http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/EveFSFPS.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Kills/Jovin_Ketils/1.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/C9N-CC/Mar-21-2004/2.jpg With Fraps: http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/U-QVWD/Jun-28-2004/1.jpg ----------------------------------- Currently Playing Lineage 2 - Erica Server
Wandarah	Posted - 2004.07.08 05:16:00 - [79] Well that doesnt show much, cheers! How about: A shot of a fleet battle with GUI on and FPS A shot of a fleet battle without GUI on, and FPS Most PC's are more than capable of rending plenty in the Eve universe. The decrease in performance shown here, has more to do with Lag. NZEA 4 Lyfe
Wandarah	Posted - 2004.07.08 05:16:00 - [80] Well that doesnt show much, cheers! How about: A shot of a fleet battle with GUI on and FPS A shot of a fleet battle without GUI on, and FPS Most PC's are more than capable of rending plenty in the Eve universe. The decrease in performance shown here, has more to do with Lag. NZEA 4 Lyfe
Kayosoni	Posted - 2004.07.08 06:42:00 - [81] k http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/HLW-HP/Jun-13-2004/7.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/HLW-HP/Jun-13-2004/1.jpg ----------------------------------- Currently Playing Lineage 2 - Erica Server
Kayosoni	Posted - 2004.07.08 06:42:00 - [82] k http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/HLW-HP/Jun-13-2004/7.jpg http://www.siegedom.com/Files/Eve/Battles/HLW-HP/Jun-13-2004/1.jpg ----------------------------------- Currently Playing Lineage 2 - Erica Server
Powerpuff Girl	Posted - 2004.07.08 09:36:00 - [83] My PC is a 1.4GHz AMD (1600+) with 1GB DDR-RAM on a (older) MSI mobo with a ATI 9600pro. FPS in Station FPS with full UI FPS with 'half' UI FPS without UI The UI eats way too much resources - I dont know how it is in big battles but I guess it must be much worse. (as you cant turn off the UI - how will you navigate/fight/whatever?) "Sig makes me sick"
Powerpuff Girl	Posted - 2004.07.08 09:36:00 - [84] My PC is a 1.4GHz AMD (1600+) with 1GB DDR-RAM on a (older) MSI mobo with a ATI 9600pro. FPS in Station FPS with full UI FPS with 'half' UI FPS without UI The UI eats way too much resources - I dont know how it is in big battles but I guess it must be much worse. (as you cant turn off the UI - how will you navigate/fight/whatever?) "Sig makes me sick"
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.07.08 17:52:00 - [85] No Dev comment? LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.07.08 17:52:00 - [86] No Dev comment? LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!

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