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Change to Covert Ops Cloak function Nerfed ? = Podded

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PhaseShiftx	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:28:00 - [1] Hrmmm maybe its just me but it seems that something has changed with the cov ops cloaks The wierd thing is it sometimes still fuctions as I remember it used to. Ok so Old Way Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak (which makes you near impossible to lock and you do the rest of your aligning while cloaked As it is now Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak "Msg you failed to cloak due to cooldown timer 6 seconds" WTF?!?!?! and you align while fully visible and get locked and podded the weird thing is if you click a bit after you warp but not too soon or too long then it works as it used to and you instacloak no delay. but the tolerance is like 0.1-0.2sec so is very easy to mess up Has anyone else found this ? Now I'm not gonna whine about it, it is what it is but if cov ops are meant to have a 5sec delay after decloaking from a jump then why does it still work sometimes if timed correctly. It should be either one or the other.
Mankirks Wife	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:31:00 - [2] I did a bit of running around in a covops frig after the patch - I didn't have this issue. Are you sure you just didn't accidentally double-click it?
PhaseShiftx	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:35:00 - [3] Nope def not double click and I can reproduce the effect and have used both left mouse click and F1 to activate
Seth Ruin Minmatar Ominous Corp Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:55:00 - [4] Originally by: PhaseShiftx maybe a high ping or lag issue ? Unfortunately, it seems so... In my experience, lag and desyncs can cause very odd behavior. I understand your frustration in that situation, however. I would say try waiting that fraction of a second longer necessary to ensure the module gets activated correctly. (Test it out on Sisi just to be sure. Free ships ftw )
PhaseShiftx	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:58:00 - [5] Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: PhaseShiftx maybe a high ping or lag issue ? Unfortunately, it seems so... In my experience, lag and desyncs can cause very odd behavior. I understand your frustration in that situation, however. I would say try waiting that fraction of a second longer necessary to ensure the module gets activated correctly. (Test it out on Sisi just to be sure. Free ships ftw ) Problem is if I wait too long I still get the msg but with 2-3sec cooldown remaning again enuogh to get podded on
Zora Gallente Concealed Intentions	Posted - 2008.11.15 06:58:00 - [6] Hmm, have to test this once I'm back in my covops, if there are any radical changes like that I would have assumed them to be in the patch notes.. that would be quite a bummer indeed. Hope you can figure out why you only seem to experience this effect when timed incorrectly.
Laechyd Eldgorn Caldari Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:03:00 - [7] Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: PhaseShiftx maybe a high ping or lag issue ? Unfortunately, it seems so... In my experience, lag and desyncs can cause very odd behavior. I understand your frustration in that situation, however. I would say try waiting that fraction of a second longer necessary to ensure the module gets activated correctly. (Test it out on Sisi just to be sure. Free ships ftw ) op should join ed and test it with us on tq
Zenior Minmatar Domination. Sc0rched Earth	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:12:00 - [8] The Covert Ops cloak is (stealth) nerfed. It now has a 30 second reactivation delaay. This does not affect Covert Ops cloaks that have been fitted before QR - they still have only 5 seconds delay.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:18:00 - [9] i've noticed it in my blockade runner, not in my cov-ops ship ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++
PhaseShiftx	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:19:00 - [10] Originally by: Pesky LaRue i've noticed it in my blockade runner, not in my cov-ops ship i should haven mention am also using a blockade runner
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:28:00 - [11] Originally by: PhaseShiftx Originally by: Pesky LaRue i've noticed it in my blockade runner, not in my cov-ops ship i should haven mention am also using a blockade runner then i believe that's not exactly a change to the cov-ops cloak as to how the bloackade runner works. stick it on a cov-ops ship and you'll probably see it's still working as normal on that. ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++
geomatica Infusion. G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.11.15 07:30:00 - [12] Originally by: Pesky LaRue i've noticed it in my blockade runner, not in my cov-ops ship This was mentioned immediately after the patch. It is an intended feature for BRs. Covops ships (IE Recons/Frigs) can cloak/uncloak/cloak with little or no wait timer because in their case the CovOps is treated as an "Aggressive" module, whereas the BRs utilize the same module for a "Defensive" purpose. Therefore, you have a 30 second timer. Work-around. Wait until your Gate-given Jump Cloak is almost up, then double-click and spam activate. You should still only appear a few seconds. Remember, you get 30 sec of gate cloak. Sig Coming Soon(TM)
McFly C0LDFIRE RUDE Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.15 08:08:00 - [13] kinda sucks tho, becuase if ur in a BR ur used to being chased... now u have to wait 30+ seconds at each gate before u can warp again. So it gives plenty of time for your pursuers to set up on the gate and try and decloak/bump/tackle/bubble u. Best workaround I can think of is hope for long warps and decloak while in warp before u hit the out gate. That way u can use the covops cloak immeadiatly in the next system. If someone is chasing u, they already know what u are in. No point in giving them a chance at every gate to catch u and your cargo.
ZaKma Body Count Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.15 08:18:00 - [14] Originally by: McFly kinda sucks tho, becuase if ur in a BR ur used to being chased... now u have to wait 30+ seconds at each gate before u can warp again. So it gives plenty of time for your pursuers to set up on the gate and try and decloak/bump/tackle/bubble u. Best workaround I can think of is hope for long warps and decloak while in warp before u hit the out gate. That way u can use the covops cloak immeadiatly in the next system. If someone is chasing u, they already know what u are in. No point in giving them a chance at every gate to catch u and your cargo. If someone is hunting you, you can still warp off to a planet or something and perhaps exit the system via some other gate or just sit there until the guy gets bored. It's really not feasible anymore to hunt these things now that we have CovOps cloaks on them. I know I wouldn't bother. And the BR also has faster warp speed than most ships (I think even inties?) so I doubt anything will catch you after 1 or 2 larger warp systems. ✖ Arachnophobia ✖
geomatica Infusion. G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.11.15 08:21:00 - [15] Faster than Crows/Ranis/etc. Raptor and it's equiv. ships have 13 au/sec warp, fastest in game. Sig Coming Soon(TM)
Misanth RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE	Posted - 2008.11.15 08:38:00 - [16] Originally by: McFly Edited by: McFly on 15/11/2008 08:22:35 kinda sucks tho, becuase if ur in a BR ur used to being chased... now u have to wait 30+ seconds at each gate before u can warp again. So it gives plenty of time for your pursuers to set up on the gate and try and decloak/bump/tackle/bubble u. Best workaround I can think of is hope for long warps and decloak while in warp before u hit the out gate. That way u can use the covops cloak immeadiatly in the next system. If someone is chasing u, they already know what u are in. No point in giving them a chance at every gate to catch u and your cargo. EDIT: Did some checking, found that a force recon pre patch with a 5 second covops cloak, I unfitted, and refitted it, while it was in my hangar it went to 30 seconds. When it was back on the ship it went back to 5 seconds. I haven't taken the chance on my covops so cant tell u there. But it seems that the BR is the only ship with out the time reduction role bonus. That, that, and that. 30sec on BR only, as that's how the module functions now. Recon/Cov ops has a stealthbonus so they go with the 5sec like they used to. Decloaking just when you're ending your warp helps alot, that's what I been doing, give a few sec on other side to load grid etc and you're perfectly fine to instarecloak.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.15 09:19:00 - [17] The cov-ops cloak has a 30 second re-activation delay, but only on the blockade runner. After you decloak to jump through, wait long enough for that cooldown to finish (should be ok, you'll be gate cloaked longer). After that your normal routine works just fine.
Scagga Laebetrovo Ammatar Free Corps	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:33:00 - [18] Originally by: PhaseShiftx Hrmmm maybe its just me but it seems that something has changed with the cov ops cloaks The wierd thing is it sometimes still fuctions as I remember it used to. Ok so Old Way Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak (which makes you near impossible to lock and you do the rest of your aligning while cloaked As it is now Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak "Msg you failed to cloak due to cooldown timer 6 seconds" WTF?!?!?! and you align while fully visible and get locked and podded the weird thing is if you click a bit after you warp but not too soon or too long then it works as it used to and you instacloak no delay. but the tolerance is like 0.1-0.2sec so is very easy to mess up Has anyone else found this ? Now I'm not gonna whine about it, it is what it is but if cov ops are meant to have a 5sec delay after decloaking from a jump then why does it still work sometimes if timed correctly. It should be either one or the other. I've found this, it's currently being petitioned. It cost me a blockade runner, 280 warp scramblers bought at 1-1.4m and a fully implanted clone... 1. I don't recall this being mentioned in the patch notes 2. It's a pointless mechanic and leaves BR's worse off imo. I had never lost a BR at a gate before. Scagga is running for the CSM, see his campaign thread to know of his standpoints!
Scagga Laebetrovo Ammatar Free Corps	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:34:00 - [19] Originally by: Meiyang Lee The cov-ops cloak has a 30 second re-activation delay, but only on the blockade runner. After you decloak to jump through, wait long enough for that cooldown to finish (should be ok, you'll be gate cloaked longer). After that your normal routine works just fine. There is no timer that tells you when your cooldown is over. In a game so often plagued with lag (particularly when entering camps), can you see how many times that will lead to over/under-waiting? Scagga is running for the CSM, see his campaign thread to know of his standpoints!
Bimjo Caldari Domination. Sc0rched Earth	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:37:00 - [20] Originally by: geomatica Remember, you get 30 sec of gate cloak. I could have sworn I got more than 30 seconds the other day
Waxau Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Scagga Laebetrovo Originally by: PhaseShiftx Hrmmm maybe its just me but it seems that something has changed with the cov ops cloaks The wierd thing is it sometimes still fuctions as I remember it used to. Ok so Old Way Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak (which makes you near impossible to lock and you do the rest of your aligning while cloaked As it is now Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak "Msg you failed to cloak due to cooldown timer 6 seconds" WTF?!?!?! and you align while fully visible and get locked and podded the weird thing is if you click a bit after you warp but not too soon or too long then it works as it used to and you instacloak no delay. but the tolerance is like 0.1-0.2sec so is very easy to mess up Has anyone else found this ? Now I'm not gonna whine about it, it is what it is but if cov ops are meant to have a 5sec delay after decloaking from a jump then why does it still work sometimes if timed correctly. It should be either one or the other. I've found this, it's currently being petitioned. It cost me a blockade runner, 280 warp scramblers bought at 1-1.4m and a fully implanted clone... 1. I don't recall this being mentioned in the patch notes 2. It's a pointless mechanic and leaves BR's worse off imo. I had never lost a BR at a gate before. Oh dear....and you're running for CSM? It isnt a pointless mechanic. It means these ships are NOT INVULNVERABLE! If you're being chased in lowsec by a pirate for example....he cannot catch you at all. But he CAN if the pilot is stupid. If you flew this ship without knowing how to use the cloak properly, then that isnt CCPs fault. Its yours. It wasnt mentioned in the patch notes, correct. Why? Because they shouldnt need to. The recloak time on Cov Ops is a bonus of theirs. It isnt on the Blockade Runners. If the bonus isnt listed, then its up to the player to realise that. Nothing was changed. No special 'change' was applied. The ship isnt bonused to the reactivation delay. Which means, you need a slight bit of common sense when flying the ship. And im glad people are getting caught out with it tbh. Gives me a bit of light at the end of the tunnel.
Waxau Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:39:00 - [22] Originally by: Bimjo Originally by: geomatica Remember, you get 30 sec of gate cloak. I could have sworn I got more than 30 seconds the other day Its 2 minutes, afaik.
Malcanis RuffRyders Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:39:00 - [23] Originally by: PhaseShiftx Edited by: PhaseShiftx on 15/11/2008 06:37:55 Edited by: PhaseShiftx on 15/11/2008 06:35:58 Nope def not double click and I can reproduce the effect and have used both left mouse click and F1 to activate the odd thing is if I get the timing right it dosen't happen maybe a high ping or lag issue ? you were in a blockade runner? try waiting 10 seconds and hold your jump cloak before warping
Scagga Laebetrovo Ammatar Free Corps	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:40:00 - [24] Edited by: Scagga Laebetrovo on 15/11/2008 11:45:13 Originally by: Waxau Oh dear....and you're running for CSM? It isnt a pointless mechanic. It means these ships are NOT INVULNVERABLE! It is a pointless mechanic imo. I found blockade runners fine without cov ops cloaks tbh. Edit: The change to the mechanics could make them easier to catch. Rather than stocking your lows with nanos, one is inclined to use warp core stabs. With as much lag as people can face in this game, there is a realistic risk of under/over-waiting, as there is no timer that allows you to be sure you're safe to align out and hit cloak without losing your post-jump cloak first. Second Edit: If you listen to the recordings from the Eve-uni debate (iirc) you'd see that I didn't think the cov ops cloak was necessary either. Scagga is running for the CSM, see his campaign thread to know of his standpoints!
Waxau Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:47:00 - [25] Originally by: Scagga Laebetrovo Edited by: Scagga Laebetrovo on 15/11/2008 11:43:40 Originally by: Waxau Oh dear....and you're running for CSM? It isnt a pointless mechanic. It means these ships are NOT INVULNVERABLE! It is a pointless mechanic imo. I found blockade runners fine without cov ops cloaks tbh. Edit: The change to the mechanics could make them easier to catch. Rather than stocking your lows with nanos, one is inclined to use warp core stabs. With as much lag as people can face in this game, there is a realistic risk of under/over-waiting, as there is no timer that allows you to be sure you're safe to align out without losing your post-jump cloak first. Second Edit: If you listen to the recordings from the Eve-uni debate (iirc) you'd see that I didn't think the cov ops cloak was necessary either. Thats the point though. If you KNOW how to fly the ship post-patch, you ARE invincible. 100%. Its (as per the norm with eve) the skill(and inexperience/stupidity) in eve that makes ships die. The cloaks have made blockade runners invincible to those who use it. Heck, ive run past a good 10 camps already in mine. the mechanic itself is actually quite ingenious of CCP. It gives carebears such as yourself the ability to haul with more ease. Boost for you. It also makes you invulnerable if you use it properly. Boost for you. It also has an 'anti-stupid' add-on. Boost for us. Without it, those ships would never get killed. As for 'they worked fine before cov ops cloaks...i agree. I was against the boost. Yet its come in. But its a case of adapting. And in this case, its the lack of adaption that gets me the kills :)
Scagga Laebetrovo Ammatar Free Corps	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:54:00 - [26] Edited by: Scagga Laebetrovo on 15/11/2008 11:55:02 Originally by: Waxau Thats the point though. If you KNOW how to fly the ship post-patch, you ARE invincible. 100%. Its (as per the norm with eve) the skill(and inexperience/stupidity) in eve that makes ships die. A point, one needs to be sure of how the mechanics work. However, you are aware that it is unprecidented for a cov ops cloak-fitted ship to have the 30 second reactivation delay? Do you think it is fair not to make any mention of this in patch notes? Quote: The cloaks have made blockade runners invincible to those who use it. Heck, ive run past a good 10 camps already in mine. I don't agree. If you jump into a big camp and need to wait out your cooldown time, there's a high chance of being decloaked - or worse, waiting too long. Quote: It gives carebears such as yourself the ability to haul with more ease I love how being a blockade runner pilot makes me a carebear in your book! Quote: As for 'they worked fine before cov ops cloaks...i agree. I was against the boost. Yet its come in. But its a case of adapting. And in this case, its the lack of adaption that gets me the kills :) Let me give you a comparison, i.e. Nobody is told that warp scramblers stop MWDs. Would you have had the same reaction? Scagga is running for the CSM, see his campaign thread to know of his standpoints!
Dibsi Dei Salamyhkaisten kilta	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:57:00 - [27] Originally by: PhaseShiftx Originally by: Pesky LaRue i've noticed it in my blockade runner, not in my cov-ops ship i should haven mention am also using a blockade runner Blockade runners don't have stealth bonuses to cloaking device reactivation delays like force recons and covops.
NightF0x Gallente Chicken Coup Raiders	Posted - 2008.11.15 11:59:00 - [28] Originally by: Scagga Laebetrovo Originally by: PhaseShiftx Hrmmm maybe its just me but it seems that something has changed with the cov ops cloaks The wierd thing is it sometimes still fuctions as I remember it used to. Ok so Old Way Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak (which makes you near impossible to lock and you do the rest of your aligning while cloaked As it is now Jump Next system loads Click to Warp to next gate Quickclick Cloak "Msg you failed to cloak due to cooldown timer 6 seconds" WTF?!?!?! and you align while fully visible and get locked and podded the weird thing is if you click a bit after you warp but not too soon or too long then it works as it used to and you instacloak no delay. but the tolerance is like 0.1-0.2sec so is very easy to mess up Has anyone else found this ? Now I'm not gonna whine about it, it is what it is but if cov ops are meant to have a 5sec delay after decloaking from a jump then why does it still work sometimes if timed correctly. It should be either one or the other. I've found this, it's currently being petitioned. It cost me a blockade runner, 280 warp scramblers bought at 1-1.4m and a fully implanted clone... 1. I don't recall this being mentioned in the patch notes 2. It's a pointless mechanic and leaves BR's worse off imo. I had never lost a BR at a gate before. That's weird because I swore that I read that in the patch notes but can't find it now. I don't think it specifically called out blockade runners, rather it called out the ship names because I used Eve-mon to look them up. Anyway I can't find it now so...meh ------------------------------------
Waxau Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2008.11.15 12:03:00 - [29] Originally by: Scagga Laebetrovo - It could have done with a mention, but it had no official reason to be listed, as nothing more was done, bar from adding the cov ops to the ship. As such, it isnt an issue on reinbursement. - You cannot be decloaked by something, when you're cloaked BY the gate after jump-in. You have two minutes of uninterrupted 'thinking time'. As such, you can quite easily wait the 30 seconds nessesary, and then warp/cloak. Dont for a second fall prey to the whole 'cooldown timer'. People survived without cooldown timers a week ago, so whining about it not having one is no way to go. - Piloting doesnt. I fly one on my alt. But whining about losing it to a gatecamp does make you one in my eyes. Yes. - People were told of the MWD/scrambler changes. If someone doesnt read patchnotes, and dies due to that fault...it isnt CCPs fault. Its the pilot who didnt read the patchnotes.
Bald Rikk The Legendary Fleet	Posted - 2008.11.15 12:09:00 - [30] Originally by: Scagga Laebetrovo I've found this, it's currently being petitioned. It cost me a blockade runner, 280 warp scramblers bought at 1-1.4m and a fully implanted clone... 1. I don't recall this being mentioned in the patch notes 2. It's a pointless mechanic and leaves BR's worse off imo. I had never lost a BR at a gate before. Fail. Had you looked at the module info you would see that the reactivation delay shows as 30 seconds Just because it doesn't get a mention it doesn't absolve you from learning how a new mechanic (Covops cloak on a BR) work. I can justifiably say fail too, as I nearly lost a BR earlier because I didn't do exactly what I just advised. I fail at mechanics checking and reading comprehension. ---------------------------------------------- Baldrikk CCP Navigator : - "Can I have your stuff", "stuff, can I haz it?" or any variation of these sayings is considered spam.

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