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Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:37:00 - [1] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 24/11/2008 00:39:04 Now that AFs (well, the Harpy, Ishkur, and Jaguar at least) are no longer comedy ships, I guess it's time to reveal the perfect Harpy setup: [Harpy, Harpy of Doom] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 1MN MicroWarpdrive II Medium Shield Extender II Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 200 Warp Disruptor II 75mm Gatling Rail II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge S 75mm Gatling Rail II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge S //HEATSINK// 75mm Gatling Rail II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge S 75mm Gatling Rail II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge S Hybrid Locus Coordinator I Hybrid Locus Coordinator I Flying it is simple, orbit larger targets at 17km, keep at range 17km vs. AB frigates to keep transversal down. Damage is a bit low, but just fine for frigate vs. frigate fights. Everything will run as long as you have cap charges, and you can fit enough of them to last longer than any realistic fight. Your matchups: T1 frigates: you kill them, but what did you expect? Other MWD AFs: difficult fight, but winnable. You have a passive tank, while most other AFs can't run a tank and MWD/point at the same time. This really comes down to player skill though. AB AFs: comedy fight. You're faster, so you can disengage at will, and just sit outside of their guns as long as you like. The worst that can happen is you fail to break their tank, and decide to give them a draw. Long-range interceptors: easily killed, but hard to catch. Any long-range interceptor that tries to engage you will be warping off in structure within seconds. Actually scoring the killmail is much harder, they can usually run away and get outside your guns/scram range before you get the final blow, but sometimes you'll get lucky. Overload your guns if you can. Short-range interceptors: very dangerous. The 7.5km point disables your MWD, and you can't track them in a close orbit. It may take a while, but they'll kill you. On the other hand, 7.5km interceptors are suicide for anything other than frigate 1v1s, so this is not all that much of a risk. EAFs: the Sentinel is a tough fight, but winnable if you've got good skills and time your cap boosts right. Other EAFs are gang-support, and easily ganked if you get a clear shot at them. Stealth bombers: comedy fight. They either sit at 150km and do nothing useful, or they come in close and you gank them. Even at up to 80km, they still can't break your tank before you close in and kill them. Destroyers: easy fight. Even good PvP destroyers are usually out-ganked and out-tanked by a decent margin, but most of them just suck. Cruisers/drones/etc: too much tank for the critical "gank and GTFO", but you can usually tank long enough for your gang's dps ships to score the kill. Laugh at light drones, out-run the rest. Now, then questions you might ask: Why no 7.5km point? Because as nice as the MWD-disabling effect is, slashing your range is just too high a price to pay for a primary tackler. Against a target that does not want to fight, it is MUCH harder to get a point on before they warp out. Back before the WCS nerf, where the 2x point was needed to ever get a kill, a good 50% of my targets would just warp out before I could get into range to scramble them. QR will not be any different. But I want an AB!! Too bad. Crippling your speed is not an option for a ship that needs to get in range ASAP and stay in a specific orbit. Also, it makes you an easy kill for anything but a battleship, and those have neuts + drones. And just to add insult to injury, to use it effectively, you need a 7.5km scram, which makes it a double nerf. Why 75mm rails, and not 125mm? Better tracking, same damage at 20km (thanks to rigs and extra damage mod), ability to fit MSE II. Why MSE II and not a booster? Active tanking sucks. Not only is the payoff point vs. a MSE II longer than an expected fight (~40-50 seconds), but you don't have the cap to run it. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:39:00 - [2] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 24/11/2008 00:39:22 {Reserved for future questions.} ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Khraunus Amarr Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:42:00 - [3] Nice, but how do you expect to be able to kill an arty thrasher before he melts your shield extender? Most importantly, how are you supposed to tell whether this is part of my post or my signature?
The Tzar Malicious Intentions	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:47:00 - [4] Nice setup, a small remote armour rep can be good for roaming AF gangs as a heat sink. __________________________________________ 'Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear intelligent until they speak' __________________________________________
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:53:00 - [5] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 24/11/2008 00:55:51 Originally by: Khraunus Nice, but how do you expect to be able to kill an arty thrasher before he melts your shield extender? Orbit at 20km, F1-F5. Arty Thrasher either can't hit that far (high-damage ammo), or can only do it by reducing his damage considerably (mid-damage ammo), or loses both all of his damage AND all of his tracking (T2 long range), which means your time-to-kill (EHP/DPS) is much faster. Overload the guns if you like. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2008.11.24 00:56:00 - [6] Decent. I perfer 150mm with void for very long range (assuming gang tackle), but being close for higher transversal is also nice.
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2008.11.24 01:12:00 - [7] Nice. Well, time to train shield skills I guess.
Prometheus Exenthal Genos Occidere	Posted - 2008.11.24 01:18:00 - [8] i hope people fly this. i could use some more killmails - FRIGANK\|FRIGANK 2
Letifer Deus A Astroid Belt Lotto Syndicate	Posted - 2008.11.24 04:24:00 - [9] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Decent. I perfer 150mm with void for very long range (assuming gang tackle), but being close for higher transversal is also nice. You prefer void in your 150mm rails eh? Nice... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.11.24 04:40:00 - [10] Edited by: BiggestT on 24/11/2008 04:42:15 That setup is a good one. Ive got a little variant that swaps a mfs for a standard launcher, the dps is around the same, but it lets you shoot em, which most ppl dont tamk up much. Its also good for alpha damage and shooting a drone/other hostile if they get to close and web you. Another setup, (more for lols) that gets over 240 dps is an ab-ing blaster setup. Its not excactly viable for the reasons merin eluded to, but it sure is fun for mucking around and melting faces hehe. 2 micro-core augmentation 1 MSE 1 AB 1 web 1 scram 4 light Neuts 1 nos edit: oh and two rigs: hybrid burst and aerator Its cap stable and is good for up close. It would beat merins setup at web range, but wld get pwned at long-point range, so its really a trade off. Merins variant is, imo, better as you rarely start 0m from your opponent and must ab towards them..which will take too long. EVE history Missiles post-nerf
BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.11.24 04:42:00 - [11] Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal i hope people fly this. i could use some more killmails The only way ull be killing this is if you have an ishkur or get close. But if u do indeed have drones for good dps, merin can simply control range and get away. It does however get pwned by amarr missile afs (name?) if they fit for range, due to a better tank. EVE history Missiles post-nerf
Letifer Deus A Astroid Belt Lotto Syndicate	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:00:00 - [12] Edited by: Letifer Deus on 24/11/2008 05:03:36 Originally by: BiggestT The only way ull be killing this is if you have an ishkur or get close. So what you're saying is all he has to do is fly a taranis or crusader . .. ... oh. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
Derek Sigres	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:01:00 - [13] Originally by: BiggestT Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal i hope people fly this. i could use some more killmails The only way ull be killing this is if you have an ishkur or get close. But if u do indeed have drones for good dps, merin can simply control range and get away. It does however get pwned by amarr missile afs (name?) if they fit for range, due to a better tank. The Vengeance can handily tank that damage almost indefinitely. The downside is of course the vengeance isn't going to kill the harpy either thanks to the simple fact that the Vengeance probably can't get close enough to hit the Harpy with rockets.
Letifer Deus A Astroid Belt Lotto Syndicate	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:09:00 - [14] Originally by: Derek Sigres The Vengeance can handily tank that damage almost indefinitely. **** my ishkur can tank it. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:12:00 - [15] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 24/11/2008 05:11:49 Originally by: Derek Sigres The Vengeance can handily tank that damage almost indefinitely. The downside is of course the vengeance isn't going to kill the harpy either thanks to the simple fact that the Vengeance probably can't get close enough to hit the Harpy with rockets. This, pretty much. A max-skill Vengeance can probably fight you to a standstill, but it can't catch you to kill you. Not that I expect to see many max-skill Vengeances, as the ship is just complete trash in general. Originally by: Letifer Deus Originally by: Derek Sigres The Vengeance can handily tank that damage almost indefinitely. **** my ishkur can tank it. But can your Ishkur tank it permanently, with MWD/point running? This is the key point, several AF setups can tank it, but they can't ever catch it to kill it. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Letifer Deus A Astroid Belt Lotto Syndicate	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:32:00 - [16] Edited by: Letifer Deus on 24/11/2008 05:33:40 Originally by: Merin Ryskin But can your Ishkur tank it permanently, with MWD/point running? This is the key point, several AF setups can tank it, but they can't ever catch it to kill it. Yes, I should be able to tank it, with mwd and point as long as I have boosters. The current setup is ~4% slower than what I assume your speed is, but that leaves very little room for error on your part. It may require a mistake on your part or a well-timed overload on the MWD on my part, but it would not be impossible. Nor would it be hard to simply tank you until you are forced to leave due to drones. That and your 75 rail harpy would get torn to pieces by taranis/crusader. That said it is a very good harpy setup, and certainly the best all-arounder. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:38:00 - [17] Originally by: Letifer Deus Edited by: Letifer Deus on 24/11/2008 05:33:40 Originally by: Merin Ryskin But can your Ishkur tank it permanently, with MWD/point running? This is the key point, several AF setups can tank it, but they can't ever catch it to kill it. Yes, I should be able to tank it, with mwd and point as long as I have boosters. The current setup is ~4% slower than what I assume your speed is, but that leaves very little room for error on your part. It may require a mistake on your part or a well-timed overload on the MWD on my part, but it would not be impossible. Nor would it be hard to simply tank you until you are forced to leave due to drones. That and your 75 rail harpy would get torn to pieces by taranis/crusader. That said it is a very good harpy setup, and certainly the best all-arounder. Ah, fair enough. The Ishkur is one of the harder matchups (it IS the other best AF, of course), and it definitely comes down to skills. I've killed Ishkurs, and I've lost to Ishkurs (more often, been forced to run), so it can really go either way. The Taranis/Crusader, I'm not so sure about. The main problem is the setups that would give me the most trouble (close-range, 7.5km point) are terrible for general PvP, and I've got a really good matchup against the long-range setups that I'm more likely to encounter. If my MWD is still active, the interceptor dies very quickly. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:45:00 - [18] too much sig not enough dps, you will ether die quickly or not kill anything, harpy is ether good at long ass rnage support or in your face KABLAH dps, does not work inbetween
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:48:00 - [19] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 24/11/2008 05:48:35 Originally by: Arvald too much sig not enough dps, you will ether die quickly or not kill anything, harpy is ether good at long ass rnage support or in your face KABLAH dps, does not work inbetween Test results say otherwise. DPS is fine except over-tanked AFs that can't catch it, and sig is not a problem. If you're engaging a target where sig or low dps matters, you're tackling for a gang, and you have enough EHP to hold on while your dps ships get the kill. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Ask Unbeatable D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.11.24 05:58:00 - [20] Confirming that D00M. did indeed invent this ship.
Terianna Eri Amarr Scrutari	Posted - 2008.11.24 06:03:00 - [21] 0% EM resists not a problem? I guess you can warp away from a retribution and probably shoot down a crusader before it gets really bad, and not much else is likely to shoot EM at you... I guess you might run into EM standard missiles (from... uh... a hawk or vengeance, maybe?) but... Eh, on second thought, if I had a ship whose biggest threat was a frig shooting sabretooths, I'd probably be okay with that. It's not like they come up very often. Watch out for scorch zealots >_> __________________________________ Originally by: Arthur Frayn How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2008.11.24 06:23:00 - [22] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 24/11/2008 06:23:27 Confirming that Arvald's sig kicks ass. How did this "confirming" meme get started anyway?
Letifer Deus A Astroid Belt Lotto Syndicate	Posted - 2008.11.24 06:29:00 - [23] Originally by: Merin Ryskin The Taranis/Crusader, I'm not so sure about. The main problem is the setups that would give me the most trouble (close-range, 7.5km point) are terrible for general PvP, and I've got a really good matchup against the long-range setups that I'm more likely to encounter. If my MWD is still active, the interceptor dies very quickly. shrugs I've flown a blaster ranis for years. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
Rudy Metallo Black Screen of Death HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2008.11.24 06:41:00 - [24] This setup would fail to any competent Jag, Thrasher, Ishkur, or Enyo, espeacially if they get the jump on you. Warp in > overload web/Scram > dead harpy. Good for ideal situations, **** for realistic ones. wut
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.11.24 06:57:00 - [25] Originally by: Rudy Metallo This setup would fail to any competent Jag That would be one of the "good" MWD AFs I admitted it's a close fight against. Quote: Thrasher Typical setup is an easy kill. Even a MWD Thrasher is slower by a solid margin, and can not control range. Quote: Ishkur Again, I already admitted this is a close fight that can go either way (assuming a proper MWD setup). Quote: Enyo Since when does an Enyo have the mids to do this? Quote: Good for ideal situations, **** for realistic ones. Correction: good for realistic situations. Yours are the ideal ones, were you planning to just magically teleport your slower, shorter-ranged ship into range of a ship that is always moving at 2km/s? You'll almost never get a warp-in that good on a frigate. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
Kadoes Khan	Posted - 2008.11.24 07:40:00 - [26] Hrmmm I like it. I still tend to prefer a point blank jag setup, this seems like it'd get the job done well. -=^=- "Someday the world will recognize the genius in my insanity."
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2008.11.24 07:47:00 - [27] [Harpy, Pure Win Blarpy] Basic Magnetic Field Stabilizer Basic Magnetic Field Stabilizer 1MN Afterburner II X5 Prototype I Engine Enervator Balmer Series Targeting Inhibitor I, Tracking Speed Disruption Warp Scrambler II Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Gremlin Rocket [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot]
techzer0 IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.11.24 09:21:00 - [28] Wouldn't a MWD/MSE Jaguar be able to rip it to pieces with a Scram and web? But I like where you're going with this Harpy... Gonna think about training my hybrid rigging skill up a little for this. ------------ Originally by: Nexus Kinnon I could outgay you even without my pink tutu. >.>
Baneful Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2008.11.24 09:41:00 - [29] Simple fact: anyone doing 100 DPS will kill you fast. Ishkur will eat you with drones and a point, and be able to tank you because Ishkur tanks Kintherm, Enyo will overtake you with superior speed and again, kintherm resists, Jaguar will close faster than an Enyo and rip your shields off with EMP, then deactivate your MWD with a scram, It's a reasonable setup. It's not bad, but there is no tank to speak of (just throwing a medium shield extender and then having no additional buffer whatsoever is going to get you killed really really fast, esp. considering sig bloom). Though 75mm Gatlings are indeed impressive with both tracking and ROF, but any ship with an active tank will power through your measly 120ish DPS. Also, bold and large text does not improve your ship in any way. Back to EFT and Sisi for you, where all your fighting goes on. ------------------ I Seem To Have Misplaced My Sig...
techzer0 IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.11.24 10:01:00 - [30] Yeah... the uber harpy killer Just had to do it... 173 dps and 3147m/s... heheh [Jaguar, Jag QR] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Medium Shield Extender II Warp Scrambler II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I 150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Gremlin Rocket Auxiliary Thrusters I Auxiliary Thrusters I ------------ Originally by: Nexus Kinnon I could outgay you even without my pink tutu. >.>

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