| Pages: 1 2 :: [one page] |
|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Pithecanthropus
   |
Posted - 2008.12.12 20:38:00 -
[1]
 Originally by: CCP Wrangler
This matter will be brought up at a CSM and CCP meeting this upcoming weekend.
Post your questions and/or concerns to be debated over the weekend. Perhaps CCP and the CSM can look here for the player base's best interest.
---------------------------------
Pithecanthropus erectus, a name derived from Greek and Latin roots meaning upright ape-man. |
Solomon XI
Hoist The Colors.
Pirate Coalition
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 20:56:00 -
[2]
--/signed & fully supported.
One question to the OP: Does this topic actually belong here in the Assembly Hall?
***
Question to CCP: What does CCP plan to do about the economic backlash this has created?
Question to CCP: Obviously, alliances and whatnot have benefited from this exploit. What does CCP plan to do about the outposts, super-capitals, and POS's that have been funded by this exploit? How will the alliances be handled?
Question to CCP: How was this exploit not discovered sooner?
|
LaVista Vista
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 21:25:00 -
[3]
One of the things CCP asked us, going into the meeting, was to find a lot of questions which the community thinks are important.
Originally by: Solomon XI
--/signed & fully supported.
One question to the OP: Does this topic actually belong here in the Assembly Hall?
***
Question to CCP: What does CCP plan to do about the economic backlash this has created?
Question to CCP: Obviously, alliances and whatnot have benefited from this exploit. What does CCP plan to do about the outposts, super-capitals, and POS's that have been funded by this exploit? How will the alliances be handled?
Question to CCP: How was this exploit not discovered sooner?
And those 3 are the essence of what people wants to know by the looks of it. That and how long it has been going on, is what people seem to want to know.
|
Solomon XI
Hoist The Colors.
Pirate Coalition
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 21:40:00 -
[4]
Ooooh, a CSM. I like. =)
***
I have another question, then.
CCP reset the market histories for quite a few items because of this causing people to lose money via the market. How does CCP plan to compensate the innocent people they hurt by doing this?
|
ArmyOfMe
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 21:51:00 -
[5]
Here's a question i would love to know the answer to.
Why should we belive that ccp isnt hiding a lot of the ramifications this exploit has had on the game?
after all, who is really there to check if what ccp has said is the entire truth
Originally by: deadmaus
Because by the time we had calmed Plague down after he heard BoB were back in the vicinity it was too late to do anything |
Gone'Postal
Minmatar
Rage of Inferno
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 22:20:00 -
[6]
Why didn't there market man find this?
name and shame the lot of em tbh but doubt we will get that.
I don't think it would be that hard to see there was way to many items of beging made ingame there where was ways to make it.
|
Pithecanthropus
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 22:38:00 -
[7]
To CCP - What assurances do players have that their game play, their time, and their hard work and effort are among others in an equal playing field?
To CCP - If exploits to this extent are still out there, what changes are being done to see that these are caught and fixed promptly before they can cause great economic impact again?
---------------------------------
Pithecanthropus erectus, a name derived from Greek and Latin roots meaning upright ape-man. |
Anne Archer
|
Posted - 2008.12.12 23:52:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Anne Archer on 12/12/2008 23:51:46
What I really want to know is:
Did CCP really receive multiple petitions/bug reports on this over the years and not say anything until it came out on a third party forum?
This of itself will speak volumes for me.
I would like the truth to this question answered.
If anyone has an old record of their report please step forward for all!
|
Hyjinx McStagger
Elko Bail Bonds
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 00:56:00 -
[9]
Is it possible for non-CSM members to "attend" the meeting in a listen-only mode, or to hear a recording of the meeting?
As a least-prefeered alternative, will the minutes of the meeting be made available to the public at large?
Thanks!
It's a game, not a job! |
Hyjinx McStagger
Gallente
Elko Bail Bonds
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 01:00:00 -
[10]
Were the in-game characters/corps/alliances of any past/present CCP developers associated with the banned accounts?
Thanks!
It's a game, not a job! |
|
|
Hyjinx McStagger
Gallente
Elko Bail Bonds
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 01:04:00 -
[11]
Going forward - is there an "audit" type of system that CCP could put in place where the manufacture of items does not align to the resources available?
Getting something for nothing seems to be somtheing that should be easy to catch.
Thanks!
It's a game, not a job! |
Dasfry
Caldari
Demio's Corporation
101010 Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 01:24:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Gone'Postal
Why didn't there market man find this?
name and shame the lot of em tbh but doubt we will get that.
Name and shame doesn't work and has been tried on other online games.
***********
Dasfry, Director
Demio's Corporation
Military Tactics |
Omber Zombie
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 01:44:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Hyjinx McStagger
Is it possible for non-CSM members to "attend" the meeting in a listen-only mode, or to hear a recording of the meeting?
no, CSM has had to sign NDA's to cover the possibility that CCP devs/GM's may mention something that cannot be made public, having members of the general playerbase there would negate the point of the NDA.
Originally by: Hyjinx McStagger
As a least-prefered alternative, will the minutes of the meeting be made available to the public at large?
yes, but it may be a little moderated depending on where the conversations take us.
----------------------
My Blog |
Jareck Hunter
Academy of Decadence
Hereticus Aegis Communis
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 01:46:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Jareck Hunter on 13/12/2008 01:47:30
Edited by: Jareck Hunter on 13/12/2008 01:47:15
After the fail of Midas i wanna know if there will be another Industrie Addon, maybe with a Contract or a Log for Shares, maybe those fuelpellets and other things discussed.
We shouldn't forget everything else, cause of this Exploit thing.
-------------------------------------------------
Sorry for my bad english^^
Join public Channel "Decadence" or visit www.eve-decadence.de |
Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 02:08:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Omber Zombie
Originally by: Hyjinx McStagger
As a least-prefered alternative, will the minutes of the meeting be made available to the public at large?
yes, but it may be a little moderated depending on where the conversations take us.
Often in the past, these minutes from CCP & CSM meetings have been seriously delayed, I hope that CSM can impress upon the CCP reps, that attend the meeting, it behooves them to get those minutes out to the public ASAP, so negate the rabble rabble.
--
Chribba's LoveQuest 17:00hrs Dec. 20th (Prizes!!)
|
Jason Edwards
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 02:28:00 -
[16]
Obviously there's the t2 exploit thing.... How does T2 BPOS compare to invention now that the base items are going to be far more scarce and thusly the advantage of invention of high units decreasing cost... how does that fit in? Could be a significant issue.
1. How is Wreck flagging in pvp going? I kill someone outside jita 4-4 I'm not going to get anything that drops.
2. Freighter sized ship for moving loads of rigged ships?
3. Remote Sensor damps need some love.
4. low sec fix for concord? Something like this?
5. Pirate faction ships? Rogue drones dominix? Sisters epic cov-op ship; one capable of being essentially cloaked when it isnt.
6. High sec outposts?
7. Invention/drone implants?
8. Fix to wardecs... 2mil to essentially annoy people?
9. POS Fuel? In Features area they had the idea of creating Pos fuel to be streamlined into 3 items at most. Yes or no?
10. Fix for Stealth bombers?
11. Black ops? Sin needs more targetting range.
12. Gallente Navy Ogres, Amarr Navy Praetors?
13. Slightly shorter jumpclone time. Such that if you spend only a few hours a day online, you arent stuck.
14. EVE STOCK MARKET!
15. Suicide ganking and insurance.
16. Battle Recorder.
------------------------
To make a megathron from scratch, you must first invent the eve universe.
------------------------
Life sucks and then you get podded. |
Jason Edwards
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 02:35:00 -
[17]
17. Alluring Emanations; Level 4 mission that's easier to finish then any level 1 mission.
18. Mining misappropriate; Level 4 mission that amarr agents gives to go kill amarr ships. Not good?
------------------------
To make a megathron from scratch, you must first invent the eve universe.
------------------------
Life sucks and then you get podded. |
Bunyip
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 06:05:00 -
[18]
Hello all,
We'll raise these questions, but I'm not sure how many answers we'll get as it's so early in the investigation. Regardless, we'll try to get these things answered, as I can vouch for the rest of my CSM compatriots that this is first and foremost on our list of problems to get solved. The other stuff can wait for a different meeting if necessary.
"May all your hits be crits." - Knights of the Dinner Table. |
Miss Moonwych
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 08:00:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 13/12/2008 08:01:37
Regarding the exploit:
I think that CSM members should make a priority list (for themselves) of the things they think have to be addressed. And then not to leave the meeting(s) without either:
- CCP having clarified how and when they are going to reveal the demanded/requested information or
- being convinced themselves that its better that CCP doesn't reveal (some of) the information in order to convince us in turn.
No doubt these meetings will be the most important to date and we expect you not to walk out without a red face due to putting serious pressure on CCP to reveal as much information as needed.
M.M.
|
Dasfry
Demio's Corporation
101010 Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 08:08:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Dasfry on 13/12/2008 08:07:57
Originally by: Bunyip
Hello all,
We'll raise these questions, but I'm not sure how many answers we'll get as it's so early in the investigation. Regardless, we'll try to get these things answered, as I can vouch for the rest of my CSM compatriots that this is first and foremost on our list of problems to get solved. The other stuff can wait for a different meeting if necessary.
My main question is,
Will they make future exploits that appear or existing ones that are not yet known... be a priority in fixing as they'e found out about?
Can they do anything to encourage the user base that might be aware of existing exploits to come forth and tell CCP about the exploits they might be using without fear of being banned.
Example,
Alliance X is using a meathod to make a lot of isk and isn't sure if what they're doing is an exploit. Out of fear of both being banned and losing their source of income they keep it a secret.
Kind of the way profitable trade routes are kept hush hush, out of fear of losing said trade route to the masses.
 To summarize what I'm asking...
 What will CCP do to catch and handle more exploits.
What will CCP do to encourage players to admit the ones they know about?
***********
Dasfry, Director
Demio's Corporation
Military Tactics |
|
|
Issler Dainze
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 08:47:00 -
[21]
We have scheduled a CSM "Thunderdome" with CCP Sunday! Only the CSM will emerge alive!
Seriously, the CSM is engaged with CCP and my impression is that CCP is willing to be very open with the CSM. Remember, intimate details are not likely to emerge but I feel CCP will act in a way that shows they are committed to a fair Eve for all.
I feel that the transperancy everyone has called for will happen, the reaction of the CSM to this development has been impressive. All of the CSM sees the seriousness of the issues and seems committed to making CCP accountable.
In the mean time, know this is still the best game in the verse! Hang on, hang in and count on this being settled once and for always!
Issler
|
Timotheus Siberius
Federation Navy Shipyards
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 08:53:00 -
[22]
What T2 BPO's were removed from the game due to this incident?
*
See you in space! |
Mister Xerox
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 09:26:00 -
[23]
A) Fixes to make T2 Ammo worthwhile, or at least a lot more balanced against Faction which does the same thing, without nerfs?
B) Fixes to the war declaration system enabling amicable surrenders?
C) Fixes to the war declaration system that flags members of the declared corps so that jumping is not an immediate immunity flag?
D) Fixes to NPC corps to prompt players to move outward toward Player Corporations?
E) Not touching ECM, but making ECM countermeasures more feasable?
F) More streamlined exploration methods to remove some drudgery?
G) Streamlined POS logistics? Fuel Rods, multiple items anchoring/unanchoring simultaneously?
H) POS Material Bays that all modules within the shield can access (re: Assembly Arrays, Labs) to mitigate material shifting for every joblot.
|
Ivena Amethyst
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 11:46:00 -
[24]
--------
Is that an Itty V in your pocket or ar you just happy to see me? |
Belmarduk
M.A.R.S. Enterprises
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 13:01:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Belmarduk on 13/12/2008 13:01:04
Skill-Queue ?
Macroers ?
Insurance Payout when concorded (Best thing would be to get rid of insurance alltogether imho)
Mainchar:
|
jason hill
Caldari
Clan Shadow Wolf
Sylph Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 13:09:00 -
[26]
Edited by: jason hill on 13/12/2008 13:10:11
Originally by: Issler Dainze
We have scheduled a CSM "Thunderdome" with CCP Sunday! Only the CSM will emerge alive!
Seriously, the CSM is engaged with CCP and my impression is that CCP is willing to be very open with the CSM. Remember, intimate details are not likely to emerge but I feel CCP will act in a way that shows they are committed to a fair Eve for all.
I feel that the transperancy everyone has called for will happen, the reaction of the CSM to this development has been impressive. All of the CSM sees the seriousness of the issues and seems committed to making CCP accountable.
In the mean time, know this is still the best game in the verse! Hang on, hang in and count on this being settled once and for always!
Issler
The daft thing is though that I have unfortunatly heard all of this before ive been playing since 2003 and this is not the first time this has happend 
destroy everything you touch |
Zebba
Gallente
Northwind Research Agency
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 13:12:00 -
[27]
My question would be:
Will CCP apologize for their rushed way to remove ghost training without making sure everybody will know about this "fix" in time?
|
LaVista Vista
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 13:28:00 -
[28]
Please be aware that this meeting is ONLY about the recent exploit. We are not discussing anything other than that. We will be doing that in January.
|
Pliauga
Federal Defence Union
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 14:06:00 -
[29]
What is the projected effect on the economy.
What are the steps taken to prevent economic turmoil and market panic if such would arise.
In short: You (CCP) have found Mr. exploit and killed him, what are you going to do with the corpse?
And on top of that: will there be any new mechanisms introduced to prevent this in the future? Fear of the banhammer is obviously a lousy preventive measure.
----------
DRONE love rulez!! 'mkay?!
. |
Miss Moonwych
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 14:33:00 -
[30]
When exactly will the meeting take place (server time)? And when do you expect to be able to give us an initial briefing about how it went?
|
|
|
LaVista Vista
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 14:46:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Miss Moonwych
When exactly will the meeting take place (server time)? And when do you expect to be able to give us an initial briefing about how it went?
The meeting is Sunday 1600 GMT. We have no idea when you will hear about the result of it. It's up to CCP really.
|
Plundaar
Gallente
Golden Orb Technology inc
|
Posted - 2008.12.13 16:32:00 -
[32]
Can we get a transcript of the questions and statements they are allowed to give us answers on?
|
Miss Moonwych
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 09:00:00 -
[33]
Here is a very simple question to ask CCP:
- When was the bug introduced?
The answer to that question will tell us a lot already about the scope of the exploitation and it shouldn't reveal any information about the exploit itself or the about the identity of the cheaters.
Regards,
M.M.
PS. Notice that CCP in their official statement hasn't addressed this crucial issue yet. They have said somebody petitioned a few days ago, but the availability/presence of the exploit/bug is not mentioned. People therefore get the impression this exploit is just a few days old. However if they didn't know about the bug then it was propably there from the beginning.
|
BlondieBC
Ardent Industrial
Arcane Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 09:18:00 -
[34]
Did CCP go back a month or so ago and check the POS's, to make sure they caught most of the exploiters? There are lots of rumors that someone was tipped off.
Will CCP take back the capitals and supercapitals built with these iskies? The amounts are so large, we know where the money went.
|
eliminator2
Gallente
Young Enterprise
Free Trade Zone.
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 10:10:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Solomon XI
--/signed & fully supported.
One question to the OP: Does this topic actually belong here in the Assembly Hall?
***
Question to CCP: What does CCP plan to do about the economic backlash this has created?
Question to CCP: Obviously, alliances and whatnot have benefited from this exploit. What does CCP plan to do about the outposts, super-capitals, and POS's that have been funded by this exploit? How will the alliances be handled?
Question to CCP: How was this exploit not discovered sooner?
hes pretty much asked my Questions :D 4 years for CCP to figure it out is it me or does this indicate A. CCP do not care about exploits that are petitioned unill its to late B. CCP just do not rad petitions untill 4 years later C. CCP are just stupid?
|
Haldane IV
Einstein's Dreams
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 11:36:00 -
[36]
1) How far is it possible to carry out an audit/investigation into the banned characters' ledgers to try to determine what the isk obtained from selling the free materials, was used for?
2) How far will such an audit/investigation actually be carried out?
That is to say, if the isk was passed on to confederates of the characters who actually used the exploit, can/will that be traced, along with any stuff (including T2BPOs, which I understand CCP take pains to keep track of?) that was purchased with it?
|
eliminator2
Gallente
Young Enterprise
Free Trade Zone.
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 12:17:00 -
[37]
all i wann no is
how does CCP think this will infulance the market atm it is steady and everyone is enjoying it the T2 mods/ships are at a nice price for sellers and buyers but the best named lasers are hell >_< anyway, after what they havedone with removing the exploit the market will either increase in price because a lack of mods/ships are built there for less people will buy stuff there for people will leave because everything is to expensive to keep going, or they will decrease because well no reason really but all depends on what CCP will do so which way do CCP think that the market will headin a increase which makes people leave or a decrease because well i dnt no :p ?
|
Kerfira
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 12:51:00 -
[38]
Quote:
Question to CCP: What does CCP plan to do about the economic backlash this has created?
TBH, this incident has created a short-term market instability with lots of speculation going on, but in the long term there isn't anything that can cause a lot of damage.
I don't really think there is any reason for CCP to bail out the EVE economy. It'll correct itself, especially now alchemy puts a ceiling on reaction prices.
T2 prices may go up a bit (most likely in the 10-20% range), but that is not actually a bad thing. I would in fact welcome higher T2 prices. Not because I produce them or their components, but because it'll mean:
a. More T1 named items will be used (ie. more variety)
b. More tears when people lose T2 ships/stuff
c. More satisfaction in killing T2 ships
d. More pride in flying T2
e. More profit for pirates (I'm not one btw.)
In short, higher T2 prices will insert more variety and emotions into EVE, both of which are to the benefit of the game.
So the sensible thing to do is to give the EVE market a few months to find a new equilibrium, and THEN decide whether there is any need for intervention.
Doing so now would be based on panic, not on facts (as nobody know exactly what will happen).
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
|
Vicious Merquise
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 13:26:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Kerfira
Quote:
Question to CCP: What does CCP plan to do about the economic backlash this has created?
TBH, this incident has created a short-term market instability with lots of speculation going on, but in the long term there isn't anything that can cause a lot of damage.
I don't really think there is any reason for CCP to bail out the EVE economy. It'll correct itself, especially now alchemy puts a ceiling on reaction prices.
T2 prices may go up a bit (most likely in the 10-20% range), but that is not actually a bad thing. I would in fact welcome higher T2 prices. Not because I produce them or their components, but because it'll mean:
a. More T1 named items will be used (ie. more variety)
b. More tears when people lose T2 ships/stuff
c. More satisfaction in killing T2 ships
d. More pride in flying T2
e. More profit for pirates (I'm not one btw.)
In short, higher T2 prices will insert more variety and emotions into EVE, both of which are to the benefit of the game.
So the sensible thing to do is to give the EVE market a few months to find a new equilibrium, and THEN decide whether there is any need for intervention.
Doing so now would be based on panic, not on facts (as nobody know exactly what will happen).
Indeed it well.  I also would like to note that over the period of time of this argument that has commenced as it is inevitable to prevent from this strange situation in a social group. CCP hurts no one they never intend too. I'm not hurt, what does that tell you? Your only hurting your self over this ridiculous argument over CCPs decision and less we not forget who is the final judge if not the jury made in their attempts to making eve a better world. :) There's and ours alike we share like carebears :P This must be a case where player empowerment takes over there heads. lol Silly Players 
|
Squirrrel
Gallente
Squirrrel Industries
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 19:26:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Squirrrel on 14/12/2008 19:26:27
Aside from the current questions posted about the duration, knock-on effects and why it was never spotted (If you work out the maximum amount of moon mineral that can be mined and then search the markets for how much was sold it would surely give you an indication that something was up?) - then what I'd very much like CCP to make public is:
1) How can we be sure the duration you inform the playerbase or the CSM is correct?
2) How can we be sure you have actually perma-banned 70 accounts?
I would never expect personal details, despite the fact it's against the EULA, however the characters themselves belong to CCP.
Therefore you CAN publish the character names of those that were banned, the corp/alliance names belong to you too - you can publish those also.
When people then do not see character x appear in the game again we will know something has probably been actually been done to the extent that you have publicised.
Saying that, I'm sure CCP will only tell the CSM what they want them to know, it's not like they can storm the CCP offices and confiscate equipment and look at logs etc.
I'm sure this is only going to have occured in a matter of a few days, and only 100 or so characters will have been using it, nothing to see here, the game you've been playing for 5 years has not really been totally skewed for the past 4 - the markets that we pride our game on is unaffected, as is the political landscape.
Seriously, 'EvE: The movie' would be nothing compared to 'CCP: The movie.'
Just a shame that Jim Henson isn't alive to direct it.
|
|
|
Nquyen Win
Sebiestor tribe
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 21:52:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Nquyen Win on 14/12/2008 21:54:35
1 I would like for CCP to give me all the items they confiscated.
|
Shakari Sween
freelancers inc
KenZoku
|
Posted - 2008.12.14 22:01:00 -
[42]
Name and shame would be best, of at least the corp names(alliances they were in too after all we can look them up if we have the corp names).
While most people will realise that it will take a bit of time to get all the info etc there are good reasons why people want to know everything about this incident. Things like how long has this exploit been around?(this is a cruicial question im sure ccp are really looking into) If it is indeed the 4 years or so that has been stated by some people(with no evidence) then the whole landscape of eve would have been different. While people have allready started speculating to what will happen with regards to t2 supply and demand, how much less will there really be? How much did the exploited materials really make up of the whole supply?
|
|
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 :: [one page] |