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CHANGE THE DAMN LVL 4 MISSSIONS

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Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 17:56:00 - [1] You know,these really need to be changed, I am tired of being a sitting target for asshats for over an hour, i mean they know what my tank is going to be, they know the best way to counter you. You are basicallly a duck in a barrell. Fix this, make the missions shorter, don't make have to fit 2x each specific hardner so there are GLARING gaps in my tank. CHANGE the Level 4's. You have to sit in them so long there is nothing for you salvage because of the fuktards following behind salvaging, you cant engage them as they loot your stuff, because they know your tank and will warp in several buddies to sit there and remote rep while the sit there and deal damage vs the weak spot in your tank/ You can't do them in low sec without being probed out in a matter of seconds. Sure if you pay big bucks(then what is the point of doint the mission) you can buy cover, but then you aren't making anything GIVE US SOMETHING DIFFERENT CCP. In all your creative genious I can't believe this is what you have left for us to make our isk through if we arne't part of same lame alliance, or lucky enough to find some poor sucker to scam. Mix up our level 4's give us ssomething different, don't make have to fit for 81%kin 81% therm, so someone can coome in and toast me due to huge gaps in my tank. /rant off' thankn you
Gnomes Rock	Posted - 2008.12.19 17:59:00 - [2] I agree, lvl 4s give way to much isk.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:01:00 - [3] Yeah, I agree, NPC rats could do with a buff. Give them omnitanks, variable damage types, drones and PC-level DPS, and let them remote-rep each other.
Arcon Telf Gallente Death of Virtue	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:02:00 - [4] I think carebears have had more than enough buffs recently. If anything, level 4 missions should be more challenging or pay less or occur in riskier space.
Slade Trillgon Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:02:00 - [5] Find anoither system to mission in. Suddenly Ninja and TEARS have claimed Dodixe and others of similar intentions have probably "claimed" the other mission hubs. There are different systems in high sec and different corps. Find them using EVE-agents.com Slade Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat! ≡v≡
Shogun Archer Gallente Brotherhood of Soban	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:06:00 - [6] Edited by: Shogun Archer on 19/12/2008 18:07:01 If I have a salvage "ninja" following me, I just warp out so he gets primaried. Problem solved. And by the way, complaining about lvl 4 missions is kinda like a beggar complaining when a guy only gives him a dollar.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:07:00 - [7] CCP is working on NPC AI. That will change misisons. Give it a rest already.
Lady Karma	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:08:00 - [8] Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki Mix up our level 4's give us ssomething different, don't make have to fit for 81%kin 81% therm, so someone can coome in and toast me due to huge gaps in my tank. /rant off' thankn you Why on earth would you need 81% resists? I run level 4's with an omni tank, around 65%, and rarely need to shield boost. At 50km hardly anything can hit you, they are far too easy imo. If you don't want to get scanned down in low sec, then don't go there. tl/dr you're doing it wrong
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:09:00 - [9] Its not the isk, its that i have no real means to defend my level four, people warp into them and start salvaging as soon as i take my first fire at the rats. People come in and steal all your loot, but you sure as hell can't engage, as they will have several remote rep ships fly in and rep them while you sit there and die due to the agro of the rats and whatever ship they are flying. It is very lopsided. in one hand CCP says, k there are a few ways to make isk in this game. 1. play stock market (effen dull) 2 put up pos for moon stuff (first thing you hear as your bubble going up, expect to be hotdropped..SOON..) Pos goes boom 3. Rat 0.0, spend most of the day avoid passerbys even though they may only be in a shuttle because of the sheer paranoia of operating out in nul suc. 4. rat low sec......Yeah..... 5 mine veldspar, because we all know that loot you salvage thieves are stealing and dumping on the market is dropping min prices. (same as the mission runners though mind you, this does need changed) 6. mine veldspar, because the market is so flip flopped, that this is the most valuable ore. 7. Scam someone, then live with the bad name for the rest of your eve carreer, or use an alt and metagame, everyone else does. 8. run level fours, where you won't get to loot, won't get to salvage unless you onw multiple accounts. You may get suicide ganked if someone catches you with your tank too low, or if you try to defend your missions you end up with 3-4 other ships coming in to remote rep the original aggressor. 9. Farmy Reashearch points on several accounts, because we all have 9 research toons going..; The big one is obviously going to be level 4s, good isk. Not the paranoia of whoever that is in local. You sure can't run fours in low sec unless you are running 2-3 toons so you can burn through them in a matter of minutes.
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:11:00 - [10] Originally by: Lady Karma Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki Mix up our level 4's give us ssomething different, don't make have to fit for 81%kin 81% therm, so someone can coome in and toast me due to huge gaps in my tank. /rant off' thankn you Why on earth would you need 81% resists? I run level 4's with an omni tank, around 65%, and rarely need to shield boost. At 50km hardly anything can hit you, they are far too easy imo. If you don't want to get scanned down in low sec, then don't go there. tl/dr you're doing it wrong not everyone flies the overpowered mighty caldari raven.......
Wilma JugsJiggle	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:11:00 - [11] You get attacked in L4s? Weird, I've never seen a single soul in all my L4s.
Lady Karma	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:12:00 - [12] Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki not everyone flies the overpowered mighty caldari raven....... Its a maelstrom actually
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Wilma JugsJiggle You get attacked in L4s? Weird, I've never seen a single soul in all my L4s. lemme guess, 0.0 out there were your alliance defends while you grind away at missions all day.
Kerfira	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:13:00 - [14] I agree, level 4's needs to be changed a lot: 1. They need to have their income cut. They should at maximum be able to generate 1/3rd-1/4th the profit of 0.0 ratting. 2. They need to be tougher. Currently they're way too easy. 3. They need to be variable. You may get the title of a mission, but it should not be the set-piece it is today. Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Cinimrat Amarr Black Flame Industries	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:14:00 - [15] Military experts are calling this someone who is incapable of moving out of a major mission hub.
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:19:00 - [16] Edited by: Ikathis sihtaki on 19/12/2008 18:19:43 I just want it to go back to actually being a CHALLENGE (3 probes anyone) to find someone in a mission. It shouldn't be drop probe, hit scan, 30 seconds later i have you. would be better if, instead of tanking on the WHOLE AMARR/CALDARI navy, (gimmie a break) and leaving me sit in there for extended lengths of time if they made rats break lock, and target others in there, or reduce the amount of rats so we do'nt have sit there for hours on end. Don't drop the value of the bounties, CHANGE THE LOOT. Too much loot, why you think veldspar is most valuable mineral to mine. I remember making a good living, taking nocxium out of low sec. Now nocxium is the worst. REDESIGN LEVEL 4's, Make it realistic that i can defend them. Not balanced that i am tanking the whole amarr caldari fleet, while i am also tanking a remote repped ass hat. There really aren't many options for some folk to make isk, other then grinding missions (pvp sure doesn't pay worth a hell), Moon caretaking is a logistical nightmare, that you stand to lose big bucks on when somoene feels like bouncing around in their dread
Jhagiti Tyran Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki not everyone flies the overpowered mighty caldari raven....... Only a carebear would ever claim the Raven is OP.
Trotula Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:22:00 - [18] My char is over a year old and has been doing missions as main source of income, with a 8+ standing with 7 diff corporations. Only once have I had someone probe out my wrecks and attempt to loot them. It's obvious you picked a bad system to mission in, like Motsu or some other mission hub cesspool. There are other less popular and remote corps in highsec to mission for, that will put you away from the mission wreck stealers. But then that would require some effort on your part and from your post it's obvious that the last thing you can be expected to do in this game is put in some effort to find solutions to your problems.
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:23:00 - [19] Originally by: Jhagiti Tyran Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki not everyone flies the overpowered mighty caldari raven....... Only a carebear would ever claim the Raven is OP. vs NPC, yes, running missions, yes. PVP no, thank you i will use my domi, or my ishtar for that. But these missions, it is odd that i have no way to defend a mission that was given to me. The mission prior to the one i got ganked in, they stole my mission loot so i had no way to finish my mission. I have to defend my missions obviously, if they can steal my mission, which in turn causes me to lose my standing. REDESIGN MISSIONS. Make them a real skill to probe out again. Make the rats cycle targets, i don't care if they fire on my drones, i will stop using them, but give me an effen chance to complete my missions.
Flinx Evenstar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:25:00 - [20] Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki Edited by: Ikathis sihtaki on 19/12/2008 18:19:43 I just want it to go back to actually being a CHALLENGE (3 probes anyone) to find someone in a mission. It shouldn't be drop probe, hit scan, 30 seconds later i have you. It really isn't that easy. 30second scan times are only for snoops/fathoms and spooks. If you are in deadspace, these probes have a tiny tiny chance of hitting you. The ones used are Quests, they take ages to run, and have a very short range. If you are in a mission more than 4au from any celestial, it is now a lot harder to be probed. Set your scanner to 600mil km and untick use overview settings. If you see a probe pop up get rdy to bail or fight. You should always be aligned in a mission anyway, a station is a good warp out. I scan a fair bit, and maybe when you get caught you think it is easy, but it can take a very long time to get in range and get a result. ___
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:26:00 - [21] Yeah, CCP should just remove ownership from wrecks and jetcans. That way mission runners have no reason to belief they own the wrecks and looters won't start blinking red, inviting people to do stupid things. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Arana Tellen Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:27:00 - [22] Salvage as you go? --------------------------------- Oh noes! Originally by: CCP Greyscale moderated - mother abuse - Mitnal
Apoctasy Fluffy Muffins	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:27:00 - [23] DON'T DO YOUR MISSIONS IN A MISSION HUB That way, you more than likely will not get followed by these 'fuktards' ninja salvaging as you say.
Meg Griffin	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:29:00 - [24] The OP is clearly playing on a different server from the rest of us because I have never EVER had anyone ninja loot/salvage my missions. EVER. AND I do a LOT of missions. I'm sure these things happen but nowhere near the epidemic proportions that the OP is suggesting.
Becq Starforged Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:29:00 - [25] The way this problem needs to be solved is to treat salvaging the same way as taking from a can. It should not involve sec status loss, and should not cause CONCORDing, but it should involve recognizing that mission-runners deserve every bit as much right to defend their loot as miners have of defending rocks they've broken up. Then leave it to the mission-runner to decide how best to handle the situation. Note, by the way, that this same change should be general enough to apply to PvP, as well. Specifically, wrecks should be considered 'jointly owned' by the former pilot of the wreck (assuming it's a player) and the pilot(s) who made the wreck a wreck; anyone else should get thief-flagged to those people. This creates the proper balance in the risk vs. reward equation for ninja looters. -- Becq Starforged Ushra'Khan The Flame of Freedom Burns On!
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:32:00 - [26] Originally by: Flinx Evenstar Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki Edited by: Ikathis sihtaki on 19/12/2008 18:19:43 I just want it to go back to actually being a CHALLENGE (3 probes anyone) to find someone in a mission. It shouldn't be drop probe, hit scan, 30 seconds later i have you. It really isn't that easy. 30second scan times are only for snoops/fathoms and spooks. If you are in deadspace, these probes have a tiny tiny chance of hitting you. The ones used are Quests, they take ages to run, and have a very short range. If you are in a mission more than 4au from any celestial, it is now a lot harder to be probed. Set your scanner to 600mil km and untick use overview settings. If you see a probe pop up get rdy to bail or fight. You should always be aligned in a mission anyway, a station is a good warp out. I scan a fair bit, and maybe when you get caught you think it is easy, but it can take a very long time to get in range and get a result. Blasters don't give much room to align with when the rats are wanting to kite you at 30 kms.. Webby drones are used to slow my targets so i can approach, there is no aligning with blasters. I know the process of scanning, when they probe you at as quick are as you are hitting the warp button on the first gate, yeah there are some very good scanners out there.
Eason Carn	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:32:00 - [27] For the OP, here is a guide for how to ninja salvage mission runners wrecks. When you learn how they find you and figure out how to avoid them, the forums will be a better place with the lack of stupid posts whining about mission wreck stealers. Ninja Salvage Guide
Ikathis sihtaki	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:33:00 - [28] Originally by: Becq Starforged The way this problem needs to be solved is to treat salvaging the same way as taking from a can. It should not involve sec status loss, and should not cause CONCORDing, but it should involve recognizing that mission-runners deserve every bit as much right to defend their loot as miners have of defending rocks they've broken up. Then leave it to the mission-runner to decide how best to handle the situation. Note, by the way, that this same change should be general enough to apply to PvP, as well. Specifically, wrecks should be considered 'jointly owned' by the former pilot of the wreck (assuming it's a player) and the pilot(s) who made the wreck a wreck; anyone else should get thief-flagged to those people. This creates the proper balance in the risk vs. reward equation for ninja looters. This is also a problem in FW, getting followed by neutrals who salvage and steal the spoils of war, while you still are engaging the enemy fleet.
Aylara v'Char Martial Artisans	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:34:00 - [29] I thought the whole point of the higher-level missions was that you'd need more than one person to tackle them. Get a friend, you have instant backup and aren't such an easy target. Missions should be harder :p
Flinx Evenstar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.12.19 18:35:00 - [30] Originally by: Ikathis sihtaki Blasters don't give much room to align with when the rats are wanting to kite you at 30 kms.. Well there is your problem sir. You don't want to be using close range weapons in level 4's. You can mitigate so much damage just by getting a bit of range, staying aligned and picking them off as they approach you with zero transversal. Try rails. ___

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