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Does target painter really take effect in LV4 missions?

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Terain Xeroza Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.06 03:42:00 - [1] I means how and how much it will influence the DPS. The following is my LV4 mission Navy Raven setup: [Raven Navy Issue, PVE] Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster Gist B-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Heat Dissipation Field [empty med slot] Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dark Blood Heavy Nosferatu Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I There is still an empty mid slot. Put on a target painter or another shield harder?
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2009.01.06 04:34:00 - [2] A target painter will help quite a bit, but a nice afterburner might speed up your mission completion times more. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
Tiirae The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2009.01.06 06:20:00 - [3] Target painters are extremely effective. But just telling you that doesn't really give you a feel for just how good they are. So test it out. Go do a mission, make sure the painter is turned off, then kill, say, 2 BS, 2 BC, 2 cruisers and 2 frigs. Don't use drones. Then do the same with the painter on. Open the logs directory and find the log for that series of kills. Strip out all the other crap and take a good look at: - The quality of the hits. With the painter on you should get more 'high quality' hits (well-aimed, wrecking' excellent, etc) - The damage done. Because the quality of hits is better, you do more damage. Now that you've seen how you can measure the difference try doing a whole mission without the painter, then get the same mission and do it with the painter. Other than that chance do the missions eactly the same way each time. Check the logs again. You should be able to identify each individual ship and how the numbers improved when the painter turns on. You will see how it is a huge boost for killing frigs but less so for BS. And you'll probably notice some other things as well. If you wanted to be really thorough you could do a run with 2 painters. Maybe try a run through with target painting drones. Spend a few of hours doing this, it's well worth it so you can say for sure that a painter is worth it. Just judging by the seat of your pants doesn't really work. going the extra mile and running tests like this is what separates the really knowledgeable players from the ordinary ones.
Durzel The Xenodus Initiative.	Posted - 2009.01.06 10:38:00 - [4] Originally by: Tiirae Target painters are extremely effective. But just telling you that doesn't really give you a feel for just how good they are. So test it out. Go do a mission, make sure the painter is turned off, then kill, say, 2 BS, 2 BC, 2 cruisers and 2 frigs. Don't use drones. Then do the same with the painter on. Open the logs directory and find the log for that series of kills. Strip out all the other crap and take a good look at: - The quality of the hits. With the painter on you should get more 'high quality' hits (well-aimed, wrecking' excellent, etc) - The damage done. Because the quality of hits is better, you do more damage. Now that you've seen how you can measure the difference try doing a whole mission without the painter, then get the same mission and do it with the painter. Other than that chance do the missions eactly the same way each time. Check the logs again. You should be able to identify each individual ship and how the numbers improved when the painter turns on. You will see how it is a huge boost for killing frigs but less so for BS. And you'll probably notice some other things as well. If you wanted to be really thorough you could do a run with 2 painters. Maybe try a run through with target painting drones. Spend a few of hours doing this, it's well worth it so you can say for sure that a painter is worth it. Just judging by the seat of your pants doesn't really work. going the extra mile and running tests like this is what separates the really knowledgeable players from the ordinary ones. Just to pick you up on a point... Firstly he's using missiles so "hit quality" doesn't apply (nor does "chance to hit"), the only change will be in damage done. Secondly - turret damage is not based off sig radius, the chance to get wreckings, excellents, etc are flat percentages of total number of hits (this has been proven in tracking guide threads in the past). By increasing sig radius you merely increase your chance to hit whatever you're painting which - depending on its size & your skills - could make all the difference between never hitting it, and hitting it nearly all the time. On the whole though your testing methodology is sound
Amarone Prime	Posted - 2009.01.06 11:36:00 - [5] Originally by: Terain Xeroza I means how and how much it will influence the DPS. The following is my LV4 mission Navy Raven setup: [Raven Navy Issue, PVE] Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster Gist B-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Heat Dissipation Field [empty med slot] Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dark Blood Heavy Nosferatu Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I There is still an empty mid slot. Put on a target painter or another shield harder? Target painters are extremely useful with missile boats after QR, on my Golem I see a big difference with TP on and off. Btw grats for the insanely expensive setup ROLF
Bob Ghias	Posted - 2009.01.06 11:52:00 - [6] ive just moved over to permashiled running my CNR but havent looked at moving to a target painter as i seem to have a decent enough damage rate as it is...might have a look at a target painter but i cant see that the difference would be so big that it would sway me
Terain Xeroza Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.06 11:55:00 - [7] Originally by: Amarone Prime Originally by: Terain Xeroza I means how and how much it will influence the DPS. The following is my LV4 mission Navy Raven setup: [Raven Navy Issue, PVE] Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster Gist B-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Heat Dissipation Field [empty med slot] Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dark Blood Heavy Nosferatu Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I There is still an empty mid slot. Put on a target painter or another shield harder? Target painters are extremely useful with missile boats after QR, on my Golem I see a big difference with TP on and off. Btw grats for the insanely expensive setup ROLF Come back to the EVE world again after almost two years leave. Things are really different. This setup was far away from "insanely expensive" at that age.
Leandro Salazar Better Dead Then Smeg	Posted - 2009.01.06 12:17:00 - [8] Originally by: Terain Xeroza Come back to the EVE world again after almost two years leave. Things are really different. This setup was far away from "insanely expensive" at that age. Well, the Gist Boosters have become crazy expensive due to reduced supply from lack of static plexes and increased demand/isk supply due to more and more GTC monkeys. Do what I did, sell the thing and replace it with a Pith large. 1 bil+ profit and the missions have been nerfed so much that a Pith B Large gets you through anything (well, it gets me though anything including EA5 anyway). Though I must say I ganktank and run Amarr missions, my setup might have problems with Guristas spamming 457 missiles per second at you from 150km, allthewhile merrily jamming you. And if you are reading this, you have arrived at the signature without noticing...
Zo5o Longcat is Long	Posted - 2009.01.06 12:28:00 - [9] Edited by: Zo5o on 06/01/2009 12:31:06 Quote: Come back to the EVE world again after almost two years leave. Things are really different. This setup was far away from "insanely expensive" at that age. I don't know if this was the case two years ago, but these days (although less so than before the concord changes) posting a setup like that could get you suicide ganked, e.g. a corp builds a bunch of BS's from blueprints, fits them cheap, then ganks you in hisec for your stuff, losing very little isk in the process due to insurance. Just a fair warning for you.
Ralitge boyter Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:58:00 - [10] Does a target painter help. Yes it does very handy to help your medium drones out in killing frigates and cruisers for battle ships don't bother. I quite often use a target painter on my drake during level 4 misions and it does help quite a bit. As for an afterburner like someone suggested before... it helps of course but with the reach of a Raven adding that is a little pointless in my opinion as the only times you would really benefit from it is when traveling to gates which you most likely will be dong from the very first second you jump in, with such a setup I doubt that there is any level 4 mission that you have to worry to much about incomming damage. ------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me.

Kurull Skullsplitter Minmatar Citizens of E.A.R.T.H. E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2009.01.06 17:33:00 - [11] Hands down Target Painter if you train for it. Train it: Target Painting lvl 4 Signature Focusing lvl 5 Frequency Modulation lvl 5
Terain Xeroza Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.07 00:36:00 - [12] Originally by: Zo5o Edited by: Zo5o on 06/01/2009 12:31:06 I don't know if this was the case two years ago, but these days (although less so than before the concord changes) posting a setup like that could get you suicide ganked, e.g. a corp builds a bunch of BS's from blueprints, fits them cheap, then ganks you in hisec for your stuff, losing very little isk in the process due to insurance. Just a fair warning for you. Thank you for your warning. I didn't realize this matter. But there is nothing to do against this evil behaviour? Where is the Concord?
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.07 00:44:00 - [13] Originally by: Terain Xeroza But there is nothing to do against this evil behaviour? Where is the Concord? CONCORD will arrive after a short delay. The suicide gankers will simply tune their gank fleet to match what you can tank during that delay. Alternately they'll just hunt you down in mission space, start looting the wrecks you've left behind and do what they can into tricking you to shoot them. At that point, CONCORD will not intervene and they have a free ride to ~5B ISK worth of modules.
Terain Xeroza Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.07 01:43:00 - [14] Originally by: Mara Rinn CONCORD will arrive after a short delay. The suicide gankers will simply tune their gank fleet to match what you can tank during that delay. Alternately they'll just hunt you down in mission space, start looting the wrecks you've left behind and do what they can into tricking you to shoot them. At that point, CONCORD will not intervene and they have a free ride to ~5B ISK worth of modules. I just met such a guy looting my wrecks when I was in a mission. However, maybe he was disappointed that I didn't shoot him. Because I am a pure PVE player. I wonder whether CONCORD can protect such PVE players like me?
Tchelor	Posted - 2009.01.07 05:11:00 - [15] They'll protect you. They just won't protect your stuff. Actually, they won't really even protect you, they just increase the cost of killing you
Celidril	Posted - 2009.01.07 10:21:00 - [16] Originally by: Terain Xeroza But there is nothing to do against this evil behaviour? Where is the Concord? oooh the sarcasm!
Yoinx Caldari Black Elite	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:51:00 - [17] Edited by: Yoinx on 07/01/2009 15:51:22 Originally by: Terain Xeroza I means how and how much it will influence the DPS. The following is my LV4 mission Navy Raven setup: [Raven Navy Issue, PVE] Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster Gist B-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Ballistic Deflection Field Gist B-Type Heat Dissipation Field [empty med slot] Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dread Guristas Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Paradise Cruise Missile Dark Blood Heavy Nosferatu Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I There is still an empty mid slot. Put on a target painter or another shield harder? I use a dual painter setup on my cnr since QR. Helps a lot with cruisers and the scram frigs (hammerheads hit painted targets harder now as well). Probably shoulda posted your fit as t2 instead of all the faction... Now you're gonna have to watch for gankers, cuz that fit is ganktastic. edit on a side note. Empty midslot? Surely something will fit there for you.


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