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Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1520	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:01:00 - [1] - Quote Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
ElQuirko Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 564	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:03:00 - [2] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. It also means that long-range sniper fleets can jump 100km away from the jump point the second they see them aligning. If we distribute pictures of people, does that mean God can file copyright claims under SOPA?
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 233	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:04:00 - [3] - Quote Considering they already are nerfing hellcats I would not expect them to help snipers. Things are only impossible until they are not.
Mars Theran EVE Rogues EVE Rogues Alliance 126	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:05:00 - [4] - Quote Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Turn WiS into wIN! ..make all the characters Nude.
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1520	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:08:00 - [5] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. It also means that long-range sniper fleets can jump 100km away from the jump point the second they see them aligning. That was the first thing that came to mind for me as well, however wouldn't that just become a game of constant jumping? The long range fleet would barely have time to target and get off a single volley (maybe not even that) before they would be forced to jump again... unless there is a spool up or cool down time as well. Otherwise that still seems to put combat completely in favor of the short range fleet trying to pin them down, and doesn't seem very balanced or viable. Still, I know what you are saying... and there may simply be no details available yet to clarify the situation. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1520	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:10:00 - [6] - Quote Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
killorbekilled TBE Dare Bears 45	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:18:00 - [7] - Quote there will be a cool down period on the micro jump drive of course everything thing in eve has a draw back huh?
ElQuirko Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 565	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:19:00 - [8] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. Edit: Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of starship combat working like that in EVE. I'm hoping there is more to it than that. This is a better method of combat than the "BLOBBED, MO'FO" that we have now. Positioning should be implemented further - turning guns around to shoot behind should require an entire align of the ship, which should take much longer when in combat. If we distribute pictures of people, does that mean God can file copyright claims under SOPA?
Bienator II madmen of the skies 673	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:25:00 - [9] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. Edit: Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of starship combat working like that in EVE. I'm hoping there is more to it than that. This is a better method of combat than the "BLOBBED, MO'FO" that we have now. Positioning should be implemented further - turning guns around to shoot behind should require an entire align of the ship, which should take much longer when in combat. what you realy mean: implement a proper tracking formula. The current tracking formula does not take ship orientation into account which is the root of the problem. For example: a ship orbiting a static object has still to track as much as the static object would have to... which is wrong. Thats why close range ships need such an insane tracking bonus. a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked
Mars Theran EVE Rogues EVE Rogues Alliance 126	Posted - 2012.04.16 16:30:00 - [10] - Quote Bienator II wrote: ElQuirko wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. Edit: Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of starship combat working like that in EVE. I'm hoping there is more to it than that. This is a better method of combat than the "BLOBBED, MO'FO" that we have now. Positioning should be implemented further - turning guns around to shoot behind should require an entire align of the ship, which should take much longer when in combat. what you realy mean: implement a proper tracking formula. The current tracking formula does not take ship orientation into account which is the root of the problem. For example: a ship orbiting a static object has still to track as much as the static object would have to... which is wrong. Thats why close range ships need such an insane tracking bonus. Something I've always found odd too. It's a given that a ship being orbited at close range would have difficulty keeping up with its attacker, but that is not the same for the attacker as its position and orientation relative to the target remains the same for the most part. One of the flaws in EVE physics. Turn WiS into wIN! ..make all the characters Nude.
Bienator II madmen of the skies 673	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:06:00 - [11] - Quote exactly a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked
Nova Fox Novafox Shipyards 3796	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:11:00 - [12] - Quote There are deployable bubbles that prevents mjds. And you're right to belvie they're going to favor short ranged ships since naval variants of the modules include gallente and minmatar. Nova Fox Shipyards Inventory
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 6110	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:15:00 - [13] - Quote masternerdguy wrote: Considering they already are nerfing hellcats I would not expect them to help snipers. How are they doing that, exactly? I keep hearing it, but I never see anyone demonstrating it. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Valerie Tessel Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 102	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:16:00 - [14] - Quote Stealth Gallente buff... Eve is real, will be real.
KnowUsByTheDead The Flying Nightmares 41	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:18:00 - [15] - Quote If I am not mistaken, wasn't it said that MJD would have a "cooldown" period, and that the module wouldn't even be able to be used in the event of a targeting lock? I could be thinking of something else that was brought up during FF, but I am pretty sure they said those things about the MJD's.
Abraxas666 Shockwave Innovations Stellar Economy Experts 1	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:26:00 - [16] - Quote When I was first told about the module by a friend familiar with null-sec combat he said that he thinks CCP is trying to make battleship fleets more viable as a result of the popularity of long-ranged nano drake/cane fleets. I don't have a lot of large fleet engagement experience but this seems like a plausible outcome. But yes the module will of course have some mechanic limiting it's frequent use, you're not going to be able to spam it. I think it's supposed to have a wind-up rather than a cool-down (you jump at the end of the module's cycle, not at the beginning), with a draw-back happening while it's winding up but I could be completely wrong.
Aiwha 101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda 308	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:28:00 - [17] - Quote Tippia wrote: masternerdguy wrote: Considering they already are nerfing hellcats I would not expect them to help snipers. How are they doing that, exactly? I keep hearing it, but I never see anyone demonstrating it. You keep hearing it from masternerdguy. Mineral prices doubled, therefore nobody will fly hellcats. Somebody forgot to give us null guys the memo however because we're still flyin' em. Regards, LCpl. Aiwha-á Senior Recruiter
Tobiaz Spacerats 199	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:37:00 - [18] - Quote I'd like those new jump drives better if it wasn't an arbitrary 100km you jump. Just make it spool up and the longer you let it run, the farther it will warp you with a minimum and a maximum between say, 50 and 150km. It would take a lot more skill to use then 'everyone blinks 100km'. http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif How about fixing image-linking on the forums, CCP? I want to see signatures!
Joe Skellington 13th Tribe of Kobol Expeditionary 53	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:49:00 - [19] - Quote Micro Jumpdrives? Please tell me this is a troll or a joke :( -á-á \|\__/\|-á -á/ @ @ \ -á-á -á( > -¦ < )-á -á`-+-+x-½-½-¦ -á-á / O \
JC Anderson Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 553	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:51:00 - [20] - Quote Keep in mind that there is also a mobile micro jump drive disruptor as well listed in the same build file as the micro jump drive. Joe Skellington wrote: Micro Jumpdrives? Please tell me this is a troll or a joke :( Not a joke.
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 238	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:52:00 - [21] - Quote Joe Skellington wrote: Micro Jumpdrives? Please tell me this is a troll or a joke :( Nope. I believe they even have to be spun up/spooled up. Things are only impossible until they are not.
JC Anderson Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 553	Posted - 2012.04.16 17:57:00 - [22] - Quote masternerdguy wrote: Joe Skellington wrote: Micro Jumpdrives? Please tell me this is a troll or a joke :( Nope. I believe they even have to be spun up/spooled up. Yeah check what I posted.. It lists a ramp up time.
Hayaishi Aperture Harmonics K162 75	Posted - 2012.04.16 19:13:00 - [23] - Quote What I don't understand is why everyone is so against close range fleet battles.... It's how they should be after-all...
Chandaris Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel 66	Posted - 2012.04.16 19:32:00 - [24] - Quote because people are risk averse and want an i-win button. the problem w/ sniper fleets is the only thing that counters them is another sniper fleet. Or scanning them down and warping to them, but any FC with half a brain can see that coming a mile away and avoid it.
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 240	Posted - 2012.04.16 19:32:00 - [25] - Quote Hayaishi wrote: What I don't understand is why everyone is so against close range fleet battles.... It's how they should be after-all... To be honest fighting at extreme close range in space is probably really unrealistic. Things are only impossible until they are not.
Markus Reese Debitum Naturae ROMANIAN-LEGION 116	Posted - 2012.04.16 19:37:00 - [26] - Quote Good info on the data there. Looks like 30 second cycle to jump, 2 minute cooldown. 942 cap, so easy to not have enough and battleship only. Can be handy I think, won't be too overpowered since it is a fixed warp range. Want to avoid the microjump, stay at 120km/70km for long range. Edit: Says battleship class module, but if it doesn't work via mass/thrust like battleships, doesn't that mean it could also be used on capitals? That would be a nice usage.
Subdolus Venator State War Academy Caldari State 23	Posted - 2012.04.16 19:43:00 - [27] - Quote Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Awesome, if true. That would reward actual practice and clear tactical thinking. Human skill and reflexes > Button-mashing. EVE is EVE - Feaces will eventuate.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 153	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:00:00 - [28] - Quote I just can't think of a single reason why I'd use this module. Are my enemies supposed to sit there while I charge up and get into range of them? I am supposed to know exactly when people will warp on top of me and charge my micro jump exactly 30s in advance to get away? With a long cooldown and charge up time you are better off using good ol cloaky warp ins and warping out and then back in. Maybe CCP can provide a good example of the usage of this module in an upcoming dev blog?
Mars Theran EVE Rogues EVE Rogues Alliance 131	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:03:00 - [29] - Quote Subdolus Venator wrote: Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Awesome, if true. That would reward actual practice and clear tactical thinking. Human skill and reflexes > Button-mashing. While I agree with you in theory, EVE is about button mashing. More simplified games can be played that way, but having to wait n seconds for locking time and cycle turrets kind of makes the whole idea improbable. It being a Battleship class module and having a 2 minute cooldown is actually fair and appropriate I think, and might result in more Battleships being brought to fights given they will suddenly have an improved and more versatile role on the field. You might see a problem with Machariels becoming suddenly overpowered however and with Fleets in 0.0 which will suddenly be able to close range and avoid Drake missile spam by jumping past it. It will make things more interesting though. Turn WiS into wIN! ..make all the characters Nude.
leviticus ander CATO.nss 145	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:10:00 - [30] - Quote Vaal Erit wrote: I just can't think of a single reason why I'd use this module. Are my enemies supposed to sit there while I charge up and get into range of them? I am supposed to know exactly when people will warp on top of me and charge my micro jump exactly 30s in advance to get away? With a long cooldown and charge up time you are better off using good ol cloaky warp ins and warping out and then back in. Maybe CCP can provide a good example of the usage of this module in an upcoming dev blog? they were listing it as a GTFO button for ships and fleet comps that are fairly weak such as sniper fleets or indy ships.
Eternum Praetorian Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 616	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:11:00 - [31] - Quote This is not a module that will "encourage" more combat as CCP claimed they wanted to do in Inferno. It strikes me as another tool people will use to run away from/avoid a potential fight. The EVE Gateway Blog
Subdolus Venator State War Academy Caldari State 23	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:15:00 - [32] - Quote Mars Theran wrote: Subdolus Venator wrote: Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Awesome, if true. That would reward actual practice and clear tactical thinking. Human skill and reflexes > Button-mashing. While I agree with you in theory, EVE is about button mashing. More simplified games can be played that way, but having to wait n seconds for locking time and cycle turrets kind of makes the whole idea improbable. It being a Battleship class module and having a 2 minute cooldown is actually fair and appropriate I think, and might result in more Battleships being brought to fights given they will suddenly have an improved and more versatile role on the field. You might see a problem with Machariels becoming suddenly overpowered however and with Fleets in 0.0 which will suddenly be able to close range and avoid Drake missile spam by jumping past it. It will make things more interesting though. I can't see anything there that disagrees with my point - You're talking about using... Skill and clear tactical thinking. Sure, there will still be button mashing - Can't be avoided. But something that shakes up the battlefield, adds elements of unpredictablilty and increases tactical flexiblity is all good, in my mind. EVE is EVE - Feaces will eventuate.
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 241	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:17:00 - [33] - Quote Eternum Praetorian wrote: This is not a module that will "encourage" more combat as CCP claimed they wanted to do in Inferno. It strikes me as another tool people will use to run away from/avoid a potential fight. I agree. This and the hellcat nerf are part of a larger conspiracy to dumb EVE down. Things are only impossible until they are not.
Subdolus Venator State War Academy Caldari State 23	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:18:00 - [34] - Quote Eternum Praetorian wrote: This is not a module that will "encourage" more combat as CCP claimed they wanted to do in Inferno. It strikes me as another tool people will use to run away from/avoid a potential fight. Recognizing that if it is used as a GTFO button, they'll be l;eaving all their sub-BS ships behind to die. So it's not exactly cost-free, in that scenario. EVE is EVE - Feaces will eventuate.
Eternum Praetorian Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 616	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:21:00 - [35] - Quote True enough I suppose. * Buys a nanopest Tempest. The EVE Gateway Blog
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 6122	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:25:00 - [36] - Quote masternerdguy wrote: I agree. This and the hellcat nerf are part of a larger conspiracy to dumb EVE down. Good thing that there is no hellcat nerf, then. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1522	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:36:00 - [37] - Quote I hadn't seen the data dump, and apparently missed the spool up and cool down discussion as well... although I had assumed this would have to be part of the mechanic. Did I miss it or do we know what range the MJD Interdictor Bubbles are going to have? That's going to be a huge factor, especially since it looks like the take a while to anchor... which makes them primarily a tool for the defenders to use (or as part of an area set up as a trap). Don't get me wrong, as I said I am very much for new tactical options on the battlefield... as long as they don't completely disenfranchise an existing tactic like a sniper fleet. Personally I prefer combat of any scale to be "in your face", but I'm more concerned with over all game balance discussions like this. I don't really consider a Drake fleet to be a true sniper fleet, in fact I'd like to see a mechanic that made the option to have extreme range fleets viable again (150km) yet still have a good counter. The more tactics (including attack range) available and effective, yet still easily counterable with the correct tactic by your opponent, the better. Edit: Also, am I seeing that MJD will also be affected by standard warp scram/bubbles? If so that opens up some interesting options. Namely put up a MJK Interdiction bubble around yourself (hopefully it has good range) while retaining the ability to simply warp out as normal... but a traditional bubble keeps a fleet pinned from not only warp but from Micro Jumps as well. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1116	Posted - 2012.04.16 20:46:00 - [38] - Quote Markus Reese wrote: Edit: Says battleship class module, but if it doesn't work via mass/thrust like battleships, doesn't that mean it could also be used on capitals? That would be a nice usage. There's already so many "strange" things in Eve I wouldn't be surprised of that one nor that mod being used by Battlecruisers/T3 ships...
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 587	Posted - 2012.04.16 21:07:00 - [39] - Quote I don't see what all the hubb-bub is about. At least with respect to lowsec piracy... we do that now. Hell even the null guys have bookmarks all around the gates and stations in their home systems (most anyway). Want to jump 100km? Warp to that bookmark at 170km away at a range of 70. This is already common practice. Take a look at ninja looters in Tama or the current back and forth going on between gatecampers/pirates/mission runners/bigger corps in Malia. Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦ GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1522	Posted - 2012.04.16 21:36:00 - [40] - Quote Gogela wrote: I don't see what all the hubb-bub is about. At least with respect to lowsec piracy... we do that now. Hell even the null guys have bookmarks all around the gates and stations in their home systems (most anyway). Want to jump 100km? Warp to that bookmark at 170km away at a range of 70. This is already common practice. Take a look at ninja looters in Tama or the current back and forth going on between gatecampers/pirates/mission runners/bigger corps in Malia. Very true, but the difference is that there would be no large "home turf advantage" due to thoroughly bookmarking the system you plan on operating in... both parties (if equipped with MJD's) would equally have that capability. Also, with bookmarks and ranged warping, you are restricted to the area's (in a linear fashion) you have bookmarked. With MJD's you can do a Micro Jump in any direction you happen to be facing. It does open up more tactical options for both sides, with the advantage still being (to a lesser degree than now) with the team with the most bookmarks. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Herping yourDerp Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 505	Posted - 2012.04.16 22:20:00 - [41] - Quote i dont see the issue, bubble the gate with a sniper fleet and kill everything but maybe t3s.
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1523	Posted - 2012.04.16 23:33:00 - [42] - Quote Herping yourDerp wrote: i dont see the issue, bubble the gate with a sniper fleet and kill everything but maybe t3s. I don't think that basic gate camps will be the primary use of MJD tactics. I have a feeling the area that will be most affected will be the realm of larger fleet engagements. I am just hoping that their implementation will be well thought out and add to the tactical choices available, not subtract from them. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Endeavour Starfleet 804	Posted - 2012.04.17 00:29:00 - [43] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. Edit: Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of starship combat working like that in EVE. I'm hoping there is more to it than that. You mean before we use Jump drive in combat we first have to have a long speech about our jump ability?
Richard Hammond II Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 176	Posted - 2012.04.17 00:51:00 - [44] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. wheres this coming from? there a dev blog Im missing O.o Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
MeestaPenni Deadman W0nderland The 99 Percent 209	Posted - 2012.04.17 01:43:00 - [45] - Quote Would you want to immediately engage in combat after burning that much cap? This seems to be a "get out of town" button. Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like? I am not Prencleeve Grothsmore.
Serene Repose Perkone Caldari State 597	Posted - 2012.04.17 05:16:00 - [46] - Quote Mars Theran wrote: Oh great.. blinky-blinky combats in our future. You'll have people teleporting all over the warzone chasing one another. No, no....don't forget your crutch - web/scram. And, you get to use a handicap parking spot. Smokestack lightnin' shinin' just like gold
Culmen Culmenation 21	Posted - 2012.04.17 06:35:00 - [47] - Quote MeestaPenni wrote: Would you want to immediately engage in combat after burning that much cap? This seems to be a "get out of town" button. Well you might if you were a Autocannon/Missile fit. As for it's use as a GTFO button. The spool up time is longer than most ship's align time. Any ship that escapes has blundered into a camp so inept that they probably would have missed him if he just warped to a safe. There is a fine line between a post and a signature.
JC Anderson Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 554	Posted - 2012.04.17 06:35:00 - [48] - Quote Richard Hammond II wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. wheres this coming from? there a dev blog Im missing O.o Data dump on 1st page of thread.
Dyner Midgard Protectorate 92	Posted - 2012.04.17 06:42:00 - [49] - Quote The sound effect the MJDs use had better be the "warp sound" used in Star Trek Movie (2009)...oh and the FX should be the same too. ....WHAT? I like Star Trek; **** off.
Facilitate Pellion Puns Inc 0	Posted - 2012.04.17 10:12:00 - [50] - Quote Dyner wrote: The sound effect the MJDs use had better be the "warp sound" used in Star Trek Movie (2009)...oh and the FX should be the same too. ....WHAT? I like Star Trek; **** off. Engage.
JC Anderson Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 556	Posted - 2012.04.17 12:46:00 - [51] - Quote This thread is awesome. I need more power! I'm giving it all she's got Captain!
Joe Skellington 13th Tribe of Kobol Expeditionary 54	Posted - 2012.04.17 13:28:00 - [52] - Quote Dyner wrote: The sound effect the MJDs use had better be the "warp sound" used in Star Trek Movie (2009)...oh and the FX should be the same too. ....WHAT? I like Star Trek; **** off. Spinning up the FTL, Adama. -á-á \|\__/\|-á -á/ @ @ \ -á-á -á( > -¦ < )-á -á`-+-+x-½-½-¦ -á-á / O \
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1524	Posted - 2012.04.17 13:32:00 - [53] - Quote Culmen wrote: MeestaPenni wrote: Would you want to immediately engage in combat after burning that much cap? This seems to be a "get out of town" button. Well you might if you were a Autocannon/Missile fit. As for it's use as a GTFO button. The spool up time is longer than most ship's align time. Any ship that escapes has blundered into a camp so inept that they probably would have missed him if he just warped to a safe. Well, I'm sure the cap use can be adjusted, but yeah... it seems like it's offensive use might be limited to passive/buffer tanking projectile/missile users currently. This would seem to limit it's use for say Blaster boats (which might benefit from it otherwise), although I suppose if they were using Cap Boosters, that "might" mitigate the cap hit to a degree. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Dyner Midgard Protectorate 95	Posted - 2012.04.18 01:17:00 - [54] - Quote Joe Skellington wrote: Dyner wrote: The sound effect the MJDs use had better be the "warp sound" used in Star Trek Movie (2009)...oh and the FX should be the same too. ....WHAT? I like Star Trek; **** off. Spinning up the FTL, Adama. Prepare for low-orbital jump!
Sigurd Sig Hansen Hedion University Amarr Empire 8	Posted - 2012.04.18 01:44:00 - [55] - Quote JC Anderson wrote: Keep in mind that there is also a mobile micro jump drive disruptor as well listed in the same build file as the micro jump drive. Joe Skellington wrote: Micro Jumpdrives? Please tell me this is a troll or a joke :( Not a joke. [+] Micro Jump Drive I [+\|n] medPower [+\|n] microJumpDrive [+\|n] online [+] capacitorNeed: 946.0 [+] capacity: 0 [+] cpu: 77.0 [+] disallowRepeatingActivation: 1.0 [+] duration: 30000.0 [+] gallenteNavyBonusMultiplier: 0 [+] heatAbsorbtionRateModifier: 0.04 [+] heatDamage: 8.2 [+] hp: 40.0 [+] mass: 0 [+] maxGroupActive: 1.0 [+] metaLevel: 0 [+] moduleReactivationDelay: 120000.0 [+] power: 1375.0 [+] republicFleetBonusMultiplier: 0 [+] requiredSkill1: 4385.0 [+] requiredSkill1Level: 1.0 [+] requiredThermoDynamicsSkill: 1.0 [+] signatureRadiusBonusPercent: 500.0 [+] techLevel: 1.0 [+] volume: 10.0 [+] warpScrambleStrength: -1.0 Long ramp up time, at end ship is jumped instantly 100 km directly forward. Ship maintains direction and velocity. Ship is affected by warp scramblers and warp disruption fields. Note: Battleship class module [+] Micro Jump Drive I Blueprint [+] capacity: 0 [+] mass: 0 [+] volume: 0.01 [+] Mobile Large Jump Disruptor I Blueprint [+] capacity: 0 [+] mass: 0 [+] volume: 0.01 [+] Micro Jump Drive Operation [+\|n] propulsionJammingSkillBoostDurationBonus [+\|n] skillEffect [+\|n] skillMJDdurationBonus [+] capacity: 0 [+] durationBonus: 5.0 [+] mass: 0 [+] primaryAttribute: 165.0 [+] requiredSkill1: 3449.0 [+] requiredSkill1Level: 4.0 [+] requiredSkill2: 3455.0 [+] requiredSkill2Level: 2.0 [+] secondaryAttribute: 167.0 [+] skillLevel: 0 [+] skillTimeConstant: 5.0 [+] volume: 0 [+] Mobile Large Jump Disruptor I [+\|n] anchorDrop [+\|n] anchorLift [+] anchoringDelay: 360000.0 [+] armorHP: 60000.0 [+] capacity: 0 [+] hp: 120000.0 [+] mass: 0 [+] metaLevel: 0 [+] requiredSkill1: 11584.0 [+] requiredSkill1Level: 3.0 [+] requiredSkill2: 3435.0 [+] requiredSkill2Level: 4.0 [+] requiredSkill3: 4385.0 [+] requiredSkill3Level: 3.0 [+] scanLadarStrength: 25.0 [+] shieldCapacity: 40000.0 [+] shieldRechargeRate: 1200000.0 [+] signatureRadius: 450.0 [+] techLevel: 1.0 [+] volume: 585.0 A Large deployable self powered unit that prevents micro jumping into its area of effect. um ok how about the computers explain it to the non computers then? I dont speak spreadsheet Dyner wrote: Joe Skellington wrote: Dyner wrote: The sound effect the MJDs use had better be the "warp sound" used in Star Trek Movie (2009)...oh and the FX should be the same too. ....WHAT? I like Star Trek; **** off. Spinning up the FTL, Adama. Prepare for low-orbital jump! when they jumped from inside the atmosphere while falling was cool Mining is the "Deadliest Catch" in this game
MeBiatch Republic University Minmatar Republic 294	Posted - 2012.04.18 02:51:00 - [56] - Quote they are for black ops ships... bam therse your bo boost mofoes now cry PLEX FOR PIZZA! TECH iii MINNING SHIPS!
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 303	Posted - 2012.04.18 02:52:00 - [57] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: they are for black ops ships... bam therse your bo boost mofoes now cry Who's troll alt are you? Things are only impossible until they are not.
Markus Reese Debitum Naturae ROMANIAN-LEGION 121	Posted - 2012.04.18 03:19:00 - [58] - Quote Sigurd Sig Hansen wrote: um ok how about the computers explain it to the non computers then? I dont speak spreadsheet Essentially is says it has a 30 second spool up time, 120 second cooldown, cannot autorepeat is the main thing. Also, PG usage puts it as a battleship module. The part I find interesting is that I don't se anything prohibiting the possibility to use it as a capital ship module which would make logical sense. the ability to move capitals effectively is sorely needed. A microjump makes perfect sense if they can use it.
Ashrun Dir Love for You Forsaken.Empire 3	Posted - 2012.05.03 09:38:00 - [59] - Quote Bienator II wrote: ElQuirko wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Heh, yes. I had visions of a "Bleach" style of combat evolving.... with Star Ships using "Flash Step" constantly to get into position behind their opponent. Edit: Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of starship combat working like that in EVE. I'm hoping there is more to it than that. This is a better method of combat than the "BLOBBED, MO'FO" that we have now. Positioning should be implemented further - turning guns around to shoot behind should require an entire align of the ship, which should take much longer when in combat. what you realy mean: implement a proper tracking formula. The current tracking formula does not take ship orientation into account which is the root of the problem. For example: a ship orbiting a static object has still to track as much as the static object would have to... which is wrong. Thats why close range ships need such an insane tracking bonus. Maybe I misunderstood your comment. But, it sounds like the current tracking formula is correct. Both the stationary object and the ship orbiting the object need to have a high tracking speed. The object needs to have a high tracking speed because it is at rest being orbited by the fast ship it is intending to hit. The ship has a high angular velocity w.r.t. the object. The ship also needs to have a high tracking speed because it (the ship) is at rest in its own rest frame. i.e. the ship sees the object orbiting it at with a high angular velocity, and as such needs a high tracking speed to hit the object. Again, maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Akirei Scytale Test Alliance Please Ignore 1264	Posted - 2012.05.03 09:40:00 - [60] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Could someone shed some light on the proposed mechanics for Micro Jump Drives? My understanding is that it will allow "micro" jumps of 100km, although I could be very wrong on that. Specifically I am concerned about their effect on long range (sniper) combat, which is already nearly impossible in game due to current probing mechanics. Will it make it even easier to jump on top of a sniper fleet? I am fully in favor of new dimensions being added to combat, however the option to have a viable long range fleet needs to remain... so I'm a bit concerned. It also means that long-range sniper fleets can jump 100km away from the jump point the second they see them aligning. that puts them in actual warp range. doesn't help snipers nearly as much as blaster boats and other reach-challenged spacecraft. TEST Alliance BEST Alliance
Akirei Scytale Test Alliance Please Ignore 1264	Posted - 2012.05.03 09:42:00 - [61] - Quote Bienator II wrote: what you realy mean: implement a proper tracking formula. The current tracking formula does not take ship orientation into account which is the root of the problem. For example: a ship orbiting a static object has still to track as much as the static object would have to... which is wrong. Thats why close range ships need such an insane tracking bonus. Physics, bro. TEST Alliance BEST Alliance
Akirei Scytale Test Alliance Please Ignore 1264	Posted - 2012.05.03 09:49:00 - [62] - Quote Sigurd Sig Hansen wrote: um ok how about the computers explain it to the non computers then? I dont speak spreadsheet are you kidding? that's how all information in EVE is presented. or are you too dumb to read freaking item info tabs? TEST Alliance BEST Alliance
Francisco Bizzaro 80	Posted - 2012.05.03 09:58:00 - [63] - Quote Ashrun Dir wrote: Bienator II wrote: what you realy mean: implement a proper tracking formula. The current tracking formula does not take ship orientation into account which is the root of the problem. For example: a ship orbiting a static object has still to track as much as the static object would have to... which is wrong. Thats why close range ships need such an insane tracking bonus. Maybe I misunderstood your comment. But, it sounds like the current tracking formula is correct. Both the stationary object and the ship orbiting the object need to have a high tracking speed. The object needs to have a high tracking speed because it is at rest being orbited by the fast ship it is intending to hit. The ship has a high angular velocity w.r.t. the object. The ship also needs to have a high tracking speed because it (the ship) is at rest in its own rest frame. i.e. the ship sees the object orbiting it at with a high angular velocity, and as such needs a high tracking speed to hit the object. This would be the case if the orbiting ship always kept the same orientation. But the ship actually turns as it orbits (it always keeps the same side facing the static object). Effectively the tracking speed of the turret should get a bonus from the moving ship's ability to re-orient itself. But the to-hit formulas are just hacks anyway. "tracking speed" is a word that is a attached to a number, but probably shouldn't be interpreted too literally in terms of real-world concepts of "tracking" or "speed".
Akirei Scytale Test Alliance Please Ignore 1266	Posted - 2012.05.03 10:04:00 - [64] - Quote Francisco Bizzaro wrote: This would be the case if the orbiting ship always kept the same orientation. But the ship actually turns as it orbits (it always keeps the same side facing the static object). Effectively the tracking speed of the turret should get a bonus from the moving ship's ability to re-orient itself. But the to-hit formulas are just hacks anyway. "tracking speed" is a word that is a attached to a number, but probably shouldn't be interpreted too literally in terms of real-world concepts of "tracking" or "speed". Only when the target is stationary. TEST Alliance BEST Alliance
Francisco Bizzaro 80	Posted - 2012.05.03 10:12:00 - [65] - Quote Akirei Scytale wrote: Francisco Bizzaro wrote: This would be the case if the orbiting ship always kept the same orientation. But the ship actually turns as it orbits (it always keeps the same side facing the static object). Effectively the tracking speed of the turret should get a bonus from the moving ship's ability to re-orient itself. But the to-hit formulas are just hacks anyway. "tracking speed" is a word that is a attached to a number, but probably shouldn't be interpreted too literally in terms of real-world concepts of "tracking" or "speed". Only when the target is stationary. Sure, that was the original example quoted. But in general moving (or rotating) ships should have a bonus to tracking speed whenever they are also turning in the direction of the target.
Anabaric Kadavr Black Guard Shadow Cartel 4	Posted - 2012.05.17 15:05:00 - [66] - Quote Francisco Bizzaro wrote: But in general moving (or rotating) ships should have a bonus to tracking speed whenever they are also turning in the direction of the target. Should do, but then you'd open up a can of worms with passive allignment. Site: http://pvp101.net Blog: http://imsdemons.pvp101.net-á Lowsec Ebil Piwate.

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