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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Typecell
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Posted - 2009.01.28 16:07:00 -
[31]
also, exploration is extremely boring |
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.28 16:42:00 -
[32]
Waah waah the game doesn't play for me? That's what I got out of this thread. |
3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 18:23:00 -
[33]
WOW, so much hostility!
Guys, it's a game, nothing more. And I know that it may come as a shock to some of you, but IT'S NOT REAL! Because, when internet connection is down, you are no longer a mega pirate with few thousand goons at your disposal - you are your own boring and depressed self. EVE is a paid-for man-made tool. And as such, it should come with decent set of instructions.
Mean while, EVE is like a shiny new toaster, with some interesting undocumented features. It gives you an electric shock every time you try to use it. CCP's suggestion - get rubber gloves. It burns toast - learn the timing and yank it out before it turn to piece of chalk coal. There are instructions for that somewhere, not on the toaster, not in the box, but on the net, if you look hard enough. Plus there are community of veterans, people who learned the hard way and think that if they were dumb enough to go through all of that then everyone should.
The game is geared toward long-time players, someone with at least year of playing time. They are proven paying customers, they proved their loyalty or have no life (Thulsa Doom being a perfect example)
But me, I'm not hooked yet and with everyday I'm loosing my interest. Not a big deal globally speaking, but sacrificing NOOBs for veterans (or vice verso) speaks of lack of balance.
I play EVE not because I think it's the best, but due to lack of options. CCP isn't the best, they are the only ones on the market. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 18:30:00 -
[34]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO WOW, so much hostility!
You started it, so what do you expect? |
Kery Nysell
Caldari Nysell Incorporated
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Posted - 2009.01.28 18:37:00 -
[35]
I find it highly ironic that the OP is complaining about hostility while at the same time flinging insults at those willing to help him ...
Depressed selves, no-life addicts, those words are a sure way to NEVER find someone willing to answer your questions.
Personnaly, I was thinking about contacting you and sharing my notes with you, but now ... you can rot in your ignorance. |
3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 18:43:00 -
[36]
Edited by: 3AKOHHO on 28/01/2009 18:50:55
Originally by: Kery Nysell Personnaly, I was thinking about contacting you and sharing my notes with you, but now ... you can rot in your ignorance.
Isn't "Personally" spelled with 2 Ls? Talk about ignorance :)
But thanks for the thought. Glad to help you make up your mind. |
Pantheon Lea
Farmer Boyz
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Posted - 2009.01.28 18:47:00 -
[37]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO WOW, so much hostility!
You are right, the forums is often very hostile, so is the game. The key is not to trust anyone on any matter.
My advise to you is to find a corporation, or form a corporation, get to know a small group of people, and let them answer all your questions, they will also be able to help you on matters that you do not have the skills for right now. To me, this is what this game i all about.
Back in when EVE was first released there was a lot of helpfull people everywhere, you could trust most people you met, not anyone, but most of them. Today there is not much risk involved, as you know in advance that you can't trust anyone.
There is also a large ammount og players who simply play to make other peoples game a pain, they are allowed to, but the large numbers of them, makes everything kinda grey and booring to interact with them.
Get a small number of freinds, and enjoy EVE with them, there is no way to play EVE with random people you meet arround in the game, a shame yes, but it's true...
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3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:08:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Pantheon Lea There is also a large ammount og players who simply play to make other peoples game a pain...
Thanks you for that. This is my point exactly. What's the point of bringing down Titan for the sake of bringing it down. God knows how many morons united by a need of destroying other people's work and time. And thanks to CCP's approval, they think they own EVE. And everyone else is just target practice. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:13:00 -
[39]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO What's the point of bringing down Titan for the sake of bringing it down.
Why climb a mountain?
Maybe you just don't understand ≡v≡… |
Matroshka
Young Enterprise Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:22:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Matroshka on 28/01/2009 19:22:29 Part of the fun in EVE is that there isn't much instruction. Like a figuring out how to complete a puzzle.
How much fun would playing in a sandbox be if you had instructions? |
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3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:27:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Tippia Why climb a mountain?
Maybe you just don't understand ≡v≡à
I understand why climb a mountain. I understand why cross an ocean in a dinky little boat. I even understand why go against a bear one-on-one with nothing but a knife.
What I don't understand is why burn down Rome or library of Alexandria, why carve your initials on a five thousand year old structure.
I may not understand EVE, but respect, culture and civilized behavior I understand well. |
Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:48:00 -
[42]
Let me put it this way.
Exploration is a source of income - it is a resource that is worth protecting.
Income Streams in EVE are the foundation and basis of all PVP
All the veteran explorers learned everything through trial and error - why should they give you a boost because you're too lazy to figure it out yourself. When Exploration was introduced, we had NOTHING. They gave us probes, a launcher, and said - there's stuff out there; it might not work, it will be buggy as hell, but go ahead and look for it; we dare you. |
el caido
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:48:00 -
[43]
Well, this thread derailed quickly. 3AKOHHO, I'll be happy to offer advice and answer any questions you have (to the best of my ability). Just send me an EVEmail or convo me if you see me online. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 19:56:00 -
[44]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO I may not understand EVE, but respect, culture and civilized behavior I understand well.
Well then… Welcome to ≡v≡ — a 100% PvP game where none of those matter beyond what they provide in the way of beating everyone else. |
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:04:00 -
[45]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO Edited by: 3AKOHHO on 28/01/2009 18:50:55
Originally by: Kery Nysell Personnaly, I was thinking about contacting you and sharing my notes with you, but now ... you can rot in your ignorance.
Isn't "Personally" spelled with 2 Ls? Talk about ignorance :)
But thanks for the thought. Glad to help you make up your mind.
Your punctuation could use some work.
Never try and pick a grammar or spelling fight, because nobody's perfect. |
Alana Mei
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:12:00 -
[46]
If you get podded in lowsec and you aren't lagging you are doing something wrong..theres no excuse other than lag for ever losing a pod outside of 0.0. |
Stu Pendisdick
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:17:00 -
[47]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO ..........respect, culture and civilized behavior ...........
You are correct. You DON'T understand EvE.
You want Barney's Purple Playground.
There is no "respect, culture and/or civilized behaviour" to be found here, and most of the populace prefers it that way.
Your stuff, I can haz?
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3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:26:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Tippia Welcome to ≡v≡ ù a 100% PvP game where none of those matter beyond what they provide in the way of beating everyone else.
Pretty much so. Then why pretend to be something else? "Install, subscribe and get your a$$ shot by those who've been here longer simply because they can". You want to balance things, make PvP amongs equals and let's see how that works out. Climbing a mountain is a challenge to something greater than yourself. Shooting a noob, well... figure it out.
el caido, Thanks for your offer.
As for the thread's topic, documentation must be in order, otherwise it all turns into one major clusterf... (which it already is). I want to know what I'm getting into, while so far I agreed to one thing yet presented something else. And I don't mind poking around, but everything must have it's limits.
As for the sandbox with instructions, it's more like playing with fire because damage is much greater than just sand in your eyes. Demoralization seems to be a variable CCP didn't take into account. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:31:00 -
[49]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO You want to balance things, make PvP amongs equals and let's see how that works out.
EVE is better balanced in this regard than pretty much every other game out there. You have the same chance and opportunity as everyone else to make your mark. Just go do it.
Quote: documentation must be in order, otherwise it all turns into one major clusterf... (which it already is)
The documentation is there. The reason you got burned was because you didn't read it before charging ahead.
Quote: Demoralization seems to be a variable CCP didn't take into account.
Except, of course, that the retention numbers for EVE players beyond their newbie days are very very high, and that they're currently changing the new-player experience. |
3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:43:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Tippia ... because you didn't read it before charging ahead.
Didn't find it. Because tools can be obtained easily - just pay; instructions to them seem to require different client all together - IE, Firefox or whatever suits you better.
"Buy a car" sounds easy enough. But can you drive it. NO! You need license, license plates, insurance, fuel, ets. How do I know all this. COMMON KNOWLEDGE. "Buy analyzer" sound easy enough. But can I use it. NO! Why??? No info IN THE GAME!!! |
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Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:47:00 -
[51]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO "Buy analyzer" sound easy enough. But can I use it. NO! Why??? No info IN THE GAME!!!
Then maybe you shouldn't have bought it until you figured out what it was for.
Have you plunked down the cash for a siege module yet? |
Matroshka
Young Enterprise Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:49:00 -
[52]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO "Buy analyzer" sound easy enough. But can I use it. NO! Why??? No info IN THE GAME!!!
Prerequisites tab in the item info menu. |
Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:50:00 -
[53]
You know, after 3.5 years I can go buy myself a 10k isk small blaster cannon. Doesn't mean I can use it either :) |
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.28 20:54:00 -
[54]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO Demoralization seems to be a variable CCP didn't take into account.
Demoralization because you can't figure out the game on your own? Who's fault is that? Some things must be researched by YOU. Nobody is here to hold your hand.
In EVE, YOU are responsible for figuring out how stuff works. If you're my enemy by the very nature of the game, why should I help you? That makes you harder to kill.
That's how competitive games work, man. You don't see football coaches swapping plays. |
3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 21:04:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Tippia Have you plunked down the cash for a siege module yet?
No, prerequisite has too many reds in it.
However, my analyzer tab is all green. Does it help? No, because for it to be useful I had to buy more equipment, train more skill that ARE NOT LISTED in the analyzer tab.
There are plenty of ruins in EVE high sectors, but none of them allow you to use analyzer on them. Then why write "ANALYZER to EXPLORE RUINS"?
When the obvious doesn't work, then I go looking for info, trying to understand what I did wrong. But I guess my fault is that I'm too naive to believe what's written. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 21:08:00 -
[56]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO
Originally by: Tippia Have you plunked down the cash for a siege module yet?
No, prerequisite has too many reds in it.
Wrong answer. You still haven't learned, apparently.
The correct answer is either "I don't know what it does" or "I don't have what's required to used it" (which is a completely separate thing from the skill prerequisites). |
3AKOHHO
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Posted - 2009.01.28 21:18:00 -
[57]
Edited by: 3AKOHHO on 28/01/2009 21:19:19
Originally by: Tippia The correct answer is either "I don't know what it does" or "I don't have what's required to used it" (which is a completely separate thing from the skill prerequisites).
Correct reply, wrong response. Whatever it need to WORK (not just sit in a slot) SHOULD be listed or at least linked in description.
Let's say you want to buy a cruiser. According to you logic, description for it should include cruiser skill, but shouldn't have any mention of Spaceship Command. That part you should figure out for yourself. And you should be able to train cruiser skill, but when it came to getting into a ship, just get an error message.
Inconsistency in policies. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.28 21:32:00 -
[58]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO Let's say you want to buy a cruiser. According to you logic, description for it should include cruiser skill, but shouldn't have any mention of Spaceship Command. That part you should figure out for yourself. And you should be able to train cruiser skill, but when it came to getting into a ship, just get an error message.
No. According to my logic, Spaceship Command would be listed since it's a prerequisite. However, medium guns and missiles and their respective upgrades, tanking mods, drones, propulsion mods, ewar mods, and logistics modules would not be listed, nor would the cap skills, the shield and armour skills, or the fitting and upgrade skills required to actually make any use of it.
Your problem is that you assume that "prerequisite" leads directly to "use". That is not the case for anything in the game. The prerequisites only tell you what is required to be able to use a piece of equipment in its right context. How to actually use it, and what the context for that use is, is a completely different matter. It is also almost univerally open to user cleverness, and in constant flux, so documenting it is pointless. |
Gartel Reiman
Civis Romanus Sum
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Posted - 2009.01.28 21:33:00 -
[59]
Originally by: 3AKOHHO As for the thread's topic, documentation must be in order, otherwise it all turns into one major clusterf... (which it already is). I want to know what I'm getting into, while so far I agreed to one thing yet presented something else. And I don't mind poking around, but everything must have it's limits.
Out of interest, how do you think every single other person in the game got by?
You probably have a point that things could be improved, but coming here and posting that things must be fixed as they are broken now and it's not your fault - is just not going to get you much sympathy when you address it to an audience who have all been faced with the same situation and overcame it. |
Des Jardin
Ad Astra Vexillum Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.28 22:17:00 -
[60]
3AKOHHO,
By now you have recognized that EVE is a complicated game. Part of that complication is because CCP has decided that figuring out what something does or how it works enhances the game experience for many pilots. For others, it is completely frustrating.
Fortunately, there are many generous pilots who devote significant time to explaining the many nuances of EVE to both newcomer and veteran alike.
I suggest that you first decide what general area interests you -- PvP, PvE, mining, salvaging, exploration. Then search the multiple threads and guides here on the EVE Forums that discuss those areas. Learn from them.
Sure, you will make mistakes ... everyone has items that they can't figure out why they bought them or train skills that are useless. It is all part of the EVE experience.
But EVE is not for everyone. I have friends who can't stand the EVE format. So be it. That just means that the game is not for them.
The choice in EVE is always yours.
Des Jardin
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