You haven't played WoW or ToR have you? You can go the entire game on a PvE server without ever interacting with a person.

I dont know to be honest but would the statement below class as PvP


"Opening up on that Hulk knowing that it will be blown to pieces unless Concord arrives in time"

Thanks for your Imput

On the other hand having those dickless nincoomps claim to do the same as me (PvP) and thus implying they are of the same worth as me is rather insolent.

Blow them up.

Some people would have you believe that playing the market and competition for the same resoucre (ie. node/roid) is PvP,

.

Youre aware the Devs are some of those ppl yes?

The difference is that PvP was coined to mean a certain thing (as quoted earlier in an earlier post). So although other activities can be seen as being a form of player v's player it does not make them PvP.

Is suicide ganking real PVP?

Or the definition has evolved from when it was coined as the games became more complex than they were 30 years ago ...

In the end though, both players made choices before that engagement that led to the combat being initiated and over before the other player could respond. That still fits the definition of PvP even if you cut it as finely as you prefer to do.

Let's test those cases.

If two players are fighting on the market and one player wins the customer; the other player has been penalised through their lost income. There are no blows in the "combat" but they have fought and somebody lost.

If two players are approaching the same asteroid and one gets the minerals or most of the minerals; the other player has been penalised through their lost minerals and time. There are again, no blows in the "combat" but they have fought and somebody lost. Same applies when try to sell those minerals - there is market PvP involved there.

The same applies when using an Auction House in another MMO. If my listing gets bought out and yours sits there for seven days, I've won - you've lost. I beat you in that PvP engagement; unless of course you sell yours after 3 days for 10 times what mine sold for. Then you won that engagement

Same with running for that node of copper ore. If you grab it while I'm still running there; you won. I lost the resources and now need to find another resource. We've just competed as two players and one won and the other lost.

Focussing only on shooting stuff is too narrow a view.

Except if we look at it your way that means any MMO that has resources or a market is a PvP game without even needing to fire a shot.

I think you're exploiting the meaning of the definition.

You cannot count a missed gain as a loss in this case.

It can be considered pvp only if the loss is direct and tangible and a clear consequence of an hostile and deliberate act.

They come from the community that thinks this game should be 100% safe, aka hippies online.

The difference is that PvP was coined to mean a certain thing (as quoted earlier in an earlier post). So although other activities can be seen as being a form of player v's player it does not make them PvP.

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Player versus player, or PvP, is a type of multiplayer interactive conflict within a game between two or more live participants.[1] This is in contrast to games where players compete against computer controlled opponents, which is correspondingly referred to as player versus environment (PvE). The terms are most often used in games where both activities exist,[2] particularly MMORPGs, MUDs, and other role-playing video games.

Maybe once more players realise that EVE is PVP through and through we'll see less whine threads

Except EVE is not PvP through and through regardless of what some people would have you believe. But EVE is a PvP game as that is one of the main focuses of the game.

In an arena where the terms of the competition between players are defined through the accumulation of resources (Mining / Market) the losses are in custom. That is a real, direct and tangible loss. And a pretty clear consequence from other player actions in competing for the same market.

All of EVE, with the exception of ship spinning, involves competition between players. And even spinning has a counter so you can compare yourself against other players if you really wanted to be competitive.

Isk acquisition through mining or market speculation can be achieved without directly competing with anyone consciously or unconsciously.

but that is bit too wide-scoped a concept to be useful in this discussion

Sticking to what is philosophically and logically easier: gaking is legitimate pvp.

All of EVE, with the exception of ship spinning, involves competition between players. And even spinning has a counter so you can compare yourself against other players if you really wanted to be competitive.

EVElopedia - 'PvP activities are a major feature of EVE Online'.

I would agree with EVElopedia, as EVE has PvE elements as well.

PvE
(initial) Player vs EVE or Player vs Environment. Combat vs NPCs.

PvP
(initial) Player vs Player. Combat or competition vs other players.

Going by the EVElopedia glossary of terms then:



So the question then is; what happens when another player is engaged with the same NPCs? What happens when you refine the items you have looted or salvaged from the NPCs and sell them? Or use them to manufacture products and sell them?