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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 20 post(s) |
Ulani Iaam
Red Ochre Mining and Exploration Fatal Ascension
0
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:30:00 -
[541] - Quote
Does this cap also reflect when someone uses drones to guard another player?
I don't think a drone guard tactic would be particularly valid in any way, but curious to know if a similar cap exists. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19174
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:32:00 -
[542] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:well no, he's not. you just told me he'd be controlling an entire cloud of drones. GǪwhich he is. Thus, Rise's comment about wanting to preserve drone managers is entirely correct.
You can twist it as much as you like, but it's still the case. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1711
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:33:00 -
[543] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:MeBiatch wrote:
dont use that term it ended last year with bs rebalance. as only tech I ships had tiers. so any pending changes cannot be construde as tiericide.
the term to use now is just ship rebalance.
thanks
Teircide will not be finished until all ships have seen it.
tell that to fozzie
CCP Fozzie wrote:We will touch every ship, and we will continue adjusting every ship over and over again.
Balancing isn't a project with an end. Tiericide was a specific subgoal within the balancing project that we finished last summer.
None of this is new information, we've said it before and we'll say it again.
tiericide was only for tech I ships. that does not mean all ships wont be rebalanced it just means its not under the guise of tiericide There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |
Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
16
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:33:00 -
[544] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Sheeana Harb wrote:Imouto Tan wrote:Sheeana Harb wrote:CCP Rise wrote:
Leave room for smaller scale assisting (there are several use-cases for assist that we wanted to preserve, such as incursion drone managers) ... ... ... ... it's not even that using more drone bunnies is an inconvenience. it's just that the original post makes no sense. he made special mention of not wanting to affect incursion runners, yet clearly contradicts that with a 50 drone limit.
Exactly why I made my original response. The change does affect incursions in a negative way (while devs stated they don't want that) and it needs to be pointed out. |
Borachon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
22
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:33:00 -
[545] - Quote
Theodoric Darkwind wrote:Ok now that you are nerfing drone assist are you going to nerf the reason for drone assist?
Nerf the hell out of Sensor Damps, its the only fair thing to do. Drone assist was the only defense against the CFCs **** You Fleet.
Currently the Celestis is soo overpowered it alone has killed off all doctrines that are not either drone assist, or unable to engage from outside of 200km. Under current mechanics one Celestis can completely shut down 2 of any ship that isn't immune to EWAR.
You nerfed ECM for less than what the Celestis is currently capable of.
If only there were a module which boosted lock range and or sensor strength. It'd be even better if CCP made one which could be scripted either way, and if there was a remote one which helped your sensor buddy even more strongly. |
Dave Stark
4330
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:34:00 -
[546] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:well no, he's not. you just told me he'd be controlling an entire cloud of drones. GǪwhich he is. Thus, Rise's comment about wanting to preserve drone managers is entirely correct. You can twist it as much as you like, but it's still the case.
erm, he isn't because 50 is 1/4 no 1/1 of the drone cloud. you can do maths, i know you can.
so his comment is completely incorrect.
i'm not twisting a thing. 50 =/= 200. fairly straight forward. |
Obunagawe
310
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:36:00 -
[547] - Quote
WTB Archon toon for transfer cost. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19174
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:38:00 -
[548] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:erm, he isn't because 50 is GǪan entire cloud. An entire cloud controlled by one person. So his comment is entirely correct.
Quote:i'm not twisting a thing. 50 =/= 200. You're twisting it by suggesting that by not being able to control every done in the field, drone managers are somehow removed from the game. This is hysterical and nonsensical hyperbole. Same goes for the claim that having to have two people look after the drones is somehow this huge negative impact.
One guy can still control an entire cloud. The impact is zero. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
16
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:40:00 -
[549] - Quote
Promiscuous Female wrote:i guess i don't understand the incursion whining
did you consider adapting your techniques to use four drone assists instead of one
it's not like it's a massive change, and being a drone assist requires you to give up at most two targets and one civilian railgun to trigger with
There is no incursiom whining, weight your words. And yes, having more drone buddies did cross my mind. However when the solution doesn't meet the initial goal(not affecting incursions), then it might not be the optimal one. |
Dave Stark
4330
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:42:00 -
[550] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:erm, he isn't because 50 is GǪan entire cloud. An entire cloud controlled by one person. So his comment is entirely correct. Quote:i'm not twisting a thing. 50 =/= 200. You're twisting it by suggesting that by not being able to control every done in the field, drone managers are somehow removed from the game. This is hysterical and nonsensical hyperbole. Same goes for the claim that having to have two people look after the drones is somehow this huge negative impact. One guy can still control an entire cloud. The impact is zero.
that's not twisting anything. they said they didn't want to negatively impact incursion runners. for that to be so they have to control 200 drones.
you can deny it all you want, that is the fact of the matter. |
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hydraSlav
Synergy Evolved
4
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:44:00 -
[551] - Quote
Just throwing this out there: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4192785#post4192785
Capped drone assist does not prevent multiple people in fleet controlling 50 drones each, nor does it remove drones from the field.
CCP states that too many drones on field is a problem. My linked proposal actually removes drones from the field. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19174
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:45:00 -
[552] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:that's not twisting anything. they said they didn't want to negatively impact incursion runners. GǪand having two controllers is such a minute impact that it's not even measurable. It'll take any competent incursioner all of two seconds to adapt. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Shadowschild
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
64
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:46:00 -
[553] - Quote
50 drones is reasonable & I agree that once the drones are assigned, we are basically doing fk all.. But the issue of bandwidth is what concerns me. Why is a domi limited to 125mb/s, but 50 people can assign their drones and suddenly im in control of 125x50 (6250mps) extra bandwidth? Just remove drone assist all together
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
13751
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:46:00 -
[554] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:erm, he isn't because 50 is GǪan entire cloud. An entire cloud controlled by one person. So his comment is entirely correct. Quote:i'm not twisting a thing. 50 =/= 200. You're twisting it by suggesting that by not being able to control every done in the field, drone managers are somehow removed from the game. This is hysterical and nonsensical hyperbole. Same goes for the claim that having to have two people look after the drones is somehow this huge negative impact. One guy can still control an entire cloud. The impact is zero. that's not twisting anything. they said they didn't want to negatively impact incursion runners. for that to be so they have to control 200 drones. you can deny it all you want, that is the fact of the matter.
Well I'm confident that the highly skilled, well organised, very motivated Incursions community will be able to adapt to this minor obstacle.
1 Kings 12:11
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Dave Stark
4330
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:47:00 -
[555] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:that's not twisting anything. they said they didn't want to negatively impact incursion runners. GǪand having two controllers is such a minute impact that it's not even measurable. It'll take any competent incursioner all of two seconds to adapt.
and that's still a negative impact. also, it's more than two but let's not let facts get in the way since you haven't so far.
hence the contradiction that needs addressing. |
Dave Stark
4330
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:48:00 -
[556] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Well I'm confident that the highly skilled, well organised, very motivated Incursions community will be able to adapt to this minor obstacle.
i agree.
that doesn't stop the original post of this thread, by rise, contradicting itself. does it? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19174
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:49:00 -
[557] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:and that's still a negative impact. No, it's zero impact.
Quote:hence the contradiction that needs addressing. It's addressed by the fact that it will have no impact.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
505
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:49:00 -
[558] - Quote
when will I be able to assign my railguns to the squad commander? |
Snow Axe
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1451
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:49:00 -
[559] - Quote
They're banking on this idea making drone assist fleets far less popular (hint: it's going to work, at least for subcaps), which would lead to less drones on the field naturally.
Of course, it may not work. That's the whole thing with iteration though - small step, if it works? great. If not? take another small step, repeat until the problem is either gone or small enough. "Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread[" |
Dave Stark
4330
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:50:00 -
[560] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:and that's still a negative impact. No, it's zero impact. Quote:hence the contradiction that needs addressing. It's addressed by the fact that it will have no impact.
that's incorrect, because you've just reduced the fleet's dps in order to create an extra drone bunny for people to assign drones to.
so it is a negative impact. |
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Zwo Zateki
Russian Allied Incursions
106
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:54:00 -
[561] - Quote
A very polite incursion community response:
**** you CCP -Ü-¦-+-¦-+ RAISA Shield: -¦-é-+-Ç-¦-¦-+-+-Å Sansha -¦-+-Å -¦-ü-¦-à -+ -¦-¦-¦-¦-+-¦-+! |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19174
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:54:00 -
[562] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:that's incorrect, because you've just reduced the fleet's dps in order to create an extra drone bunny for people to assign drones to. That's impact caused by your poor choice of fleet design GÇö choose better.
Quote:so it is a negative impact. Not from this change no. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
13752
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:56:00 -
[563] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Malcanis wrote:Well I'm confident that the highly skilled, well organised, very motivated Incursions community will be able to adapt to this minor obstacle. i agree. that doesn't stop the original post of this thread, by rise, contradicting itself. does it?
Well no solution is 100.00% perfect mate, that's the nature of compromises. We did our best to cause the minimum damage to gameplay modes that weren't a problem. In this case the damage is pretty trivial. I doubt anyone on the CSM or at CCP is going to lose much sleep over the hideous torment inflicted by this change on the helpless innocent incursions community.
1 Kings 12:11
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Dave Stark
4330
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Posted - 2014.02.06 21:56:00 -
[564] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:that's incorrect, because you've just reduced the fleet's dps in order to create an extra drone bunny for people to assign drones to. That's impact caused by your poor choice of fleet design GÇö choose better. Quote:so it is a negative impact. Not from this change no.
so there's more hassle as people are managing drones instead of assigning them to a drone bunny, that's still a negative impact.
tippia, usually i like your posts but you're being systematically wrong and an early morning at work means i can't spend all night here correcting you.
good night. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
13752
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 21:57:00 -
[565] - Quote
Zwo Zateki wrote:A very polite incursion community response:
**** you CCP
CSM response: Adapt.
1 Kings 12:11
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Zwo Zateki
Russian Allied Incursions
106
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 22:02:00 -
[566] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Zwo Zateki wrote:A very polite incursion community response:
**** you CCP CSM response: Adapt. Response to CSM:
Before you say "adapt" try running incursions at least once in a while. We couldn't care less about how nullsec FCs command their slaves. -Ü-¦-+-¦-+ RAISA Shield: -¦-é-+-Ç-¦-¦-+-+-Å Sansha -¦-+-Å -¦-ü-¦-à -+ -¦-¦-¦-¦-+-¦-+! |
Ragnen Delent
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
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Posted - 2014.02.06 22:02:00 -
[567] - Quote
Or you incursion runners could, you know, not run a single dedicated ship to manage drones. This whole semantic arguement is ridiculous and does nothing but make Incursion runners look like whiny babies that can't handle changing tactics. Heaven forbid acommon ship used by incursion runners get changed too.
There was never going to be an agreed upon value for maximum drone control. The rationalization of 50 creates a compromise that satisfys a number of parties without making the change pointless. It minimizes damage to incursion runners bottom line as much as a change like this could. |
Zwo Zateki
Russian Allied Incursions
106
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 22:05:00 -
[568] - Quote
Ragnen Delent wrote:Or you incursion runners could, you know, not run a single dedicated ship to manage drones. This whole semantic arguement is ridiculous and does nothing but make Incursion runners look like whiny babies that can't handle changing tactics. Heaven forbid acommon ship used by incursion runners get changed too.
There was never going to be an agreed upon value for maximum drone control. The rationalization of 50 creates a compromise that satisfys a number of parties without making the change pointless. It minimizes damage to incursion runners bottom line as much as a change like this could. And there's still no valid rationale for these changes from highsec POV. Again, we don't care how your big alliance bosses amass isk for RMT. -Ü-¦-+-¦-+ RAISA Shield: -¦-é-+-Ç-¦-¦-+-+-Å Sansha -¦-+-Å -¦-ü-¦-à -+ -¦-¦-¦-¦-+-¦-+! |
Emperor Solaris
The Red Sun Industry
11
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 22:05:00 -
[569] - Quote
to reduce server load from drones i this that it should be as the following: when a player assist 5 drones to his friend then these 5 drones should sue the same trajectory and firing parameter as the host drones. this is just a rough idea but would kill 99% server load from the drones if it doable this way and once they are close enough to each other juts merge them? instead of the server having to calculate 10 drones path that are all one over each others he should only calculate 1 path for these 10 drones?
note: i know jack **** about coding but i do have a good common sense |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
506
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 22:05:00 -
[570] - Quote
Zwo Zateki wrote:A very polite incursion community response:
**** you CCP
you should be pleased that they aren't fixing it completely. |
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