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So.. how much will T3 ships cost?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
xxxak Caldari O.W.N. Corp OWN Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.10 18:18:00 - [1] Anyone have a guess
Kailiao Tides Of War	Posted - 2009.03.10 18:25:00 - [2] Ships won't be expensive, it's the subsystems that will be :) you can't do anything with just the ship, untill you fit the subsystems on it. I hear wormholes are friggin tuff, and will be a venture to get the subsystems back to build. My guess on the ships are 20-50m Now the parts to fit onto the ships, lol. like 100-200 mill per maybe, for like 3-4 months, then they will come down, average like 350-400m to fit your new t3 ship.
Wannabehero Absolutely No Retreat	Posted - 2009.03.10 19:25:00 - [3] There is no way to tell until drop rates are known and efficiency in obtaining materials is known. Until then it can only be speculation. my guess is going to be somewhere in the mid-hundreds of millions, +/- hundreds of millions -- Don't harsh my mellow
Megan Maynard Minmatar Out of Order Tenth Legion	Posted - 2009.03.10 19:30:00 - [4] 100 BILLION dollars. MWHAHAHA Stop, hammer time.
Polcor Rodal Amarr	Posted - 2009.03.11 03:55:00 - [5] Originally by: Megan Maynard 100 BILLION dollars. MWHAHAHA for 100 bil, i want - a chameleon ship - can turn invisible without using a cloak, - Being able to transfer drones from cargohold to dronebay - auxilary solar panels to make cap regen faster - T2 resist bonus on armor AND structure - Black in colour (when not in chameloen mode) - Economical jumdrive -> Jumprange 25ly base range and a seperate fuel bay - Build-in Smartbomb with adjustable range (2,5 - 100 KM) - Build in warpscrambler that scrambles everything within 50km with 5 points - BC sized with agility and sig-radius of a minmatar inty - Being able to field 2-3 modified frigs as "oversized drones" (with bonus of course) Anything else ? :-) Pol Take care, bears.
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn	Posted - 2009.03.11 08:05:00 - [6] The latest estimations that I haven't checked against the TQ stats make the hull cost around 140M in gas components alone, and subsystems cost around 10-20M to make from gasses. This is with a very conservative income assumption for the gas miner (20M per hour, most will want more since WH Space is not exactly safe), salvage costs pulled out of my hat and no info whatsoever on invention cost, POS reaction cost, ship losses and anything else that needs to be taken into account. Unless you get a ship from a "what I mine is free" producer expect prices in the 200-500M range once the market has settled. But there are so many variables in the calculation that anything can happen. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Smokin Gunn	Posted - 2009.03.11 08:28:00 - [7] over 9000
ItradethereforIam	Posted - 2009.03.11 12:23:00 - [8] confirming that I will be flying the legion without subsystems
Shevar Minmatar Target Practice incorporated	Posted - 2009.03.11 12:23:00 - [9] Originally by: xxxak Anyone have a guess Early estimates are around 700 million to 1 billion when the price are settled. Initial prices will be higher... It will take ~3 days before the first ones theoretically can be produced on TQ. And no that won't change unless droprates/building reqs are changed significantly. --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
Shevar Minmatar Target Practice incorporated	Posted - 2009.03.11 13:22:00 - [10] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness Edited by: Pytria Le''Danness on 11/03/2009 08:18:08 The latest estimations that I haven't checked against the TQ stats make the hull cost around 140M in gas components alone, and subsystems cost around 10-20M to make from gasses. This is with a very conservative income assumption for the gas miner (20M per hour, most will want more since WH Space is not exactly safe), salvage costs pulled out of my hat and no info whatsoever on invention cost, POS reaction cost, ship losses and anything else that needs to be taken into account. Unless you get a ship from a "what I mine is free" producer expect prices in the 200-500M range once the market has settled. But there are so many variables in the calculation that anything can happen. Just for your information, I calculated these prices with salvage costing in the 20k to 500k range depending on drop frequency. Right now there are sell orders for 25M. At this price the hull would cost 14.582.016.786,92 ISK, subsystems around 1 billion. Your salvage cost estimate seems to be rather, errr, low. --- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs

MarieFrance Tessier	Posted - 2009.03.11 13:41:00 - [11] Originally by: Polcor Rodal Originally by: Megan Maynard 100 BILLION dollars. MWHAHAHA for 100 bil, i want - a chameleon ship - can turn invisible without using a cloak, - Being able to transfer drones from cargohold to dronebay - auxilary solar panels to make cap regen faster - T2 resist bonus on armor AND structure - Black in colour (when not in chameloen mode) - Economical jumdrive -> Jumprange 25ly base range and a seperate fuel bay - Build-in Smartbomb with adjustable range (2,5 - 100 KM) - Build in warpscrambler that scrambles everything within 50km with 5 points - BC sized with agility and sig-radius of a minmatar inty - Being able to field 2-3 modified frigs as "oversized drones" (with bonus of course) Just say fighter, fwiw. Also, most of what you are asking for is a few extra slots. I would settle for 16/16/16 for one hundred billion, no resists, ~100,000 PG, ~1200 CPU, few thousand m3 of drone bay, weak cap.
Polcor Rodal Amarr	Posted - 2009.03.11 14:18:00 - [12] Edited by: Polcor Rodal on 11/03/2009 14:21:18 Originally by: MarieFrance Tessier Just say fighter, fwiw. Frigates. I want to fit my "fighters" and man them with enslaved, lobotomized macro-miners. Take care, bears.
Lukriss Caldari	Posted - 2009.03.11 15:35:00 - [13] Originally by: Smokin Gunn over 9000 In to confirm that price will be OVER NINE THOUSAND!
Jack Jombardo Amarr	Posted - 2009.03.11 15:35:00 - [14] Read my sig Originally by: CCP Nozh Where do tech 3 ships fit in?The goal has always been to have them considerably cheap, around the price of tech 2 cruisers.
VoiceInTheDesert Zebra Corp Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.03.11 15:46:00 - [15] Send me all your isk. I will tell you if you can afford it.
paddytehpyro Dark-Rising	Posted - 2009.03.11 15:59:00 - [16] According to the Devs (not the most relliable source I know :P), the subsystems will be cheaper than the hull so you can have a nice stash of them to mix and match for your situation. I hear about 100-300mil for the hull itself but for I while I expect to see them going for billions like the orcas did.
EagleDelta1	Posted - 2009.03.11 17:09:00 - [17] The T3 Cruisers better have ALOT of customization and not just be a way to make a cruiser that "seems" like your own creation, but is really no better than any other cruiser, cause if it's gonna cost between 500 mil - 1 bil, then I'm not even going to bother. I'll be able to fly better ships with better fits for cheaper. IMO, this is a problem EVE has - a lot of the "cool" and specialized(T2) ships, good or crappy, don't get used simply b/c they are too expensive to risk losing. Simply put, CCP, for ships to be useful, they can't cost more than what they're actually worth in USE. I won't buy a T3 cruiser for 500+ mil, I can get multiple t2 cruisers with better fits for cheaper.
Mr Ignitious R.E.C.O.N. Dara Cothrom	Posted - 2009.03.11 17:33:00 - [18] Originally by: EagleDelta1 The T3 Cruisers better have ALOT of customization and not just be a way to make a cruiser that "seems" like your own creation, but is really no better than any other cruiser, cause if it's gonna cost between 500 mil - 1 bil, then I'm not even going to bother. I'll be able to fly better ships with better fits for cheaper. IMO, this is a problem EVE has - a lot of the "cool" and specialized(T2) ships, good or crappy, don't get used simply b/c they are too expensive to risk losing. Simply put, CCP, for ships to be useful, they can't cost more than what they're actually worth in USE. I won't buy a T3 cruiser for 500+ mil, I can get multiple t2 cruisers with better fits for cheaper. The point of them isn't to be better than anything (except t1 in most cases) but to do multiple things at once, ie: hybrid of hac/recon or recon/hic or what have you. Expected result from CCP: T3 ships don't out perform the 2 ships they are imitating, but rather do the 2 jobs they mimic at approx 50-70% of the effectiveness of a dedicated T2 ship. I should say 2 jobs loosely, as you could get them to do 3 or so but you'd obviously sacrifice effectiveness of the roles etc. As long as a completely assembled T3 cruiser remains below 200m I think you will see them. I for one have resigned myself to giving the proteus at least one chance. Originally by: CCP Zulupark WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU?
VJ Maverick Splinter Cell Alfa	Posted - 2009.03.11 18:53:00 - [19] Originally by: EagleDelta1 Simply put, CCP, for ships to be useful, they can't cost more than what they're actually worth in USE. CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! -------- [
LegendInMyOwnMind	Posted - 2009.03.11 19:02:00 - [20] Originally by: VJ Maverick CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! ECON 101 ftl on your own part you mean, CCP controls the rarity of the components that would go into making the ships, so in essence they control the price.

Traderboz	Posted - 2009.03.11 19:03:00 - [21] Originally by: VJ Maverick Originally by: EagleDelta1 Simply put, CCP, for ships to be useful, they can't cost more than what they're actually worth in USE. CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! While CCP doesn't "set" the market price, CCP certainly has influence over the price. CCP creates the BPO's and sets the materials and amount of materials required to build the item. If a ship requires 1 tritanium to build and the BPO costs 1 ISK, you can guess the market value will be low. Contrast that with a ship that requires reactions and sleeper salvage to build, and the price of that ship will be quite high. CCP doesn't set the exact price, but they indirectly set the price by creating the requirements to build the ship and making the required components more or less scarce.
Hanns Canadian Aerospace Defence Sector	Posted - 2009.03.11 19:08:00 - [22] Originally by: Polcor Rodal Originally by: Megan Maynard 100 BILLION dollars. MWHAHAHA for 100 bil, i want - a chameleon ship - can turn invisible without using a cloak, - Being able to transfer drones from cargohold to dronebay - auxilary solar panels to make cap regen faster - T2 resist bonus on armor AND structure - Black in colour (when not in chameloen mode) - Economical jumdrive -> Jumprange 25ly base range and a seperate fuel bay - Build-in Smartbomb with adjustable range (2,5 - 100 KM) - Build in warpscrambler that scrambles everything within 50km with 5 points - BC sized with agility and sig-radius of a minmatar inty - Being able to field 2-3 modified frigs as "oversized drones" (with bonus of course) Anything else ? :-) Pol A falcon that tanks and does 1000 DPS would be better than that Originally by: Tuxford a new retribution bonus +1 med slot per level
VJ Maverick Splinter Cell Alfa	Posted - 2009.03.11 19:18:00 - [23] Originally by: LegendInMyOwnMind Originally by: VJ Maverick CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! ECON 101 ftl on your own part you mean, CCP controls the rarity of the components that would go into making the ships, so in essence they control the price. Nope, ECON 101 definitely ftl on your own part. If you do some research, you will notice that the market price of most T2 items (and the popular ships in particular) is far greater than the cost of building them. The price is primarily driven by the demand, not by the rarity of the components. -------- [
Cpt Constantinus Celestial Janissaries	Posted - 2009.03.11 19:52:00 - [24] Originally by: VJ Maverick Originally by: LegendInMyOwnMind Originally by: VJ Maverick CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! ECON 101 ftl on your own part you mean, CCP controls the rarity of the components that would go into making the ships, so in essence they control the price. Nope, ECON 101 definitely ftl on your own part. If you do some research, you will notice that the market price of most T2 items (and the popular ships in particular) is far greater than the cost of building them. The price is primarily driven by the demand, not by the rarity of the components. Not exactly, invention itself is pretty expensive so unless you have a t2 bpo the price of actualy building a t2 ship is much higher than just the worth of it's minerals.
VJ Maverick Splinter Cell Alfa	Posted - 2009.03.11 20:02:00 - [25] Originally by: Cpt Constantinus Originally by: VJ Maverick Originally by: LegendInMyOwnMind Originally by: VJ Maverick CCP does not set the prices. The free market sets the prices. ECON 101 FTW! ECON 101 ftl on your own part you mean, CCP controls the rarity of the components that would go into making the ships, so in essence they control the price. Nope, ECON 101 definitely ftl on your own part. If you do some research, you will notice that the market price of most T2 items (and the popular ships in particular) is far greater than the cost of building them. The price is primarily driven by the demand, not by the rarity of the components. Not exactly, invention itself is pretty expensive so unless you have a t2 bpo the price of actualy building a t2 ship is much higher than just the worth of it's minerals. It doesn't matter that invention adds to the cost of building a ship. Even the all-inclusive costs are nowhere near the market prices. My TOTAL cost for building a Jaguar very rarely exceeds 8 million ISK and often is significantly lower. I price them at 20-25 million a piece and they sell like hotcakes. The point is that actual market price is far more dependent on supply and demand than on the relative scarcity of the components or the cost of research - meaning that the market has significantly more influence on the price of T2 ships than anything within CCP's control. Thus, CCP does not really control prices. The player driven market does. -------- [
EagleDelta1	Posted - 2009.03.11 22:00:00 - [26] Originally by: Mr Ignitious The point of them isn't to be better than anything (except t1 in most cases) but to do multiple things at once, ie: hybrid of hac/recon or recon/hic or what have you. Expected result from CCP: T3 ships don't out perform the 2 ships they are imitating, but rather do the 2 jobs they mimic at approx 50-70% of the effectiveness of a dedicated T2 ship. I should say 2 jobs loosely, as you could get them to do 3 or so but you'd obviously sacrifice effectiveness of the roles etc. As long as a completely assembled T3 cruiser remains below 200m I think you will see them. I for one have resigned myself to giving the proteus at least one chance. My point is, it's still going to be a cruiser, and dual role or not, NO cruiser is worth any where near the price of ANY capital ship, maybe a BS or a little higher, but not a capital ship(I'm including freighters and the Rorqual as well since they ARE caps).
Traderboz	Posted - 2009.03.11 23:50:00 - [27] The market sets the price, yes, but CCP INFLUENCES the prices by setting the materials. It's the supply CCP affects by setting the required material and their rarity. They are not the only people affecting supply (we're the other party who actually produce the items), but since we have to produce them according to CCP's set BPO's and with CCP's set items, it's naive to say CCP doesn't have influence over the end prices. Do you honestly believe the materials used to produce the item do not affect the market price? Most market prices stabilize just above the production cost (with perfect skills), with some even going below the production cost (showing that there are plenty of irrational actors in the EVE economy, who probably think ore is free if they mine it). Put another way, if it costs X to produce a widget and you're selling widgets for 1000X, then odds are other sellers will enter the market and start producing widgets and undercutting you. On the other hand, if it costs X to produce a widget and you're selling widgets for .5X, then you're (a noob and) probably not going to see much competition, as you're losing money for each widget you sell and no rational new supplier would enter that market. TL;DR, while CCP doesn't type in a "final" price for each item, they most certainly do influence where the market price ends up.
Liang Nuren No Salvation Blackguard Coalition	Posted - 2009.03.11 23:57:00 - [28] Originally by: Traderboz The market sets the price, yes, but CCP INFLUENCES the prices by setting the materials. It's the supply CCP affects by setting the required material and their rarity. They are not the only people affecting supply (we're the other party who actually produce the items), but since we have to produce them according to CCP's set BPO's and with CCP's set items, it's naive to say CCP doesn't have influence over the end prices. Do you honestly believe the materials used to produce the item do not affect the market price? Most market prices stabilize just above the production cost (with perfect skills), with some even going below the production cost (showing that there are plenty of irrational actors in the EVE economy, who probably think ore is free if they mine it). Put another way, if it costs X to produce a widget and you're selling widgets for 1000X, then odds are other sellers will enter the market and start producing widgets and undercutting you. On the other hand, if it costs X to produce a widget and you're selling widgets for .5X, then you're (a noob and) probably not going to see much competition, as you're losing money for each widget you sell and no rational new supplier would enter that market. TL;DR, while CCP doesn't type in a "final" price for each item, they most certainly do influence where the market price ends up. Nice post Boz. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Lord WarATron Amarr Shadow Reapers DAMAGE INC...	Posted - 2009.03.12 00:01:00 - [29] Edited by: Lord WarATron on 12/03/2009 00:01:41 Erm.... Just work out how long it takes to kill recipie mobs and skin them (salvage). Then add in all the time involved in the rest of the production chain, such as Gas harvesting etc. I think it was somthing like 10 hours for a t2 gas harvester per ship. Of course, fitting more harvesters helps, but you get the idea - people will charge for their time. Either way, in terms of manhours, its not going to be cheap. The first few Rokhs went for a billion+. The first drake went for over 500mil. I can expect high prices for the first few t3. -- Billion Isk Mission
Cygwin Gaad Caldari The Element Syndicate Black Mesa Project	Posted - 2009.03.12 02:13:00 - [30] Wait, what? gas? since when do ships need gas to build. i thought that was for boosters...



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